8 reasons why England will win the World Cup (NHC)

[Dan Sarf]

England beat Nigeria.
The other teams won’t have noticed how Nigeria nullified England’s 3 at the back formation.
Their manager is a bit awkward just like Sir Alf.
England invented football.
Real Madrid won the European Cup this year – just like in 1966.
The Premier League is the best league in the world.
England has the best fans in the world.
The UK media is increasingly confident England will skoosh it.


Did I miss any?

[Real Emerald]

England beat Nigeria.
The other teams won’t have noticed how Nigeria nullified England’s 3 at the back formation.
Their manager is a bit awkward just like Sir Alf.
England invented football.
Real Madrid won the European Cup this year – just like in 1966.
The Premier League is the best league in the world.
England has the best fans in the world.
The UK media is increasingly confident England will skoosh it.


Did I miss any?

The bigger they build them up the better. It will be all tears and snotters when it goes pear shaped and will be a thing to behold. Having said that they’ve got a no bad team this time and another reasonably easy draw. 🙄

[Spike Mandela]

It’s the most open World cup in a long time. I don’t feel there is an out and out favourite albeit the bookies have it as the Germans.

For me if any of the top 12 or so teams arrive at the tournament and hit form I think they can win it.

[Brightside]

England have a great chance tbh

[calumhibee1]

The bigger they build them up the better. It will be all tears and snotters when it goes pear shaped and will be a thing to behold. Having said that they’ve got a no bad team this time and another reasonably easy draw. 🙄

A no bad team? This is the worst England squad in my lifetime IMO.

[Hibbyradge]

The bigger they build them up the better. It will be all tears and snotters when it goes pear shaped and will be a thing to behold. Having said that they’ve got a no bad team this time and another reasonably easy draw. 🙄

No-one is building England up.

Apart, perhaps, from bitter Scottish football fans.

Most people think they'll qualify from their group, as do I, but that's about it.

[Real Emerald]

A no bad team? This is the worst England squad in my lifetime IMO.

I disagree but really really hope you’re right and I’m wrong. 🤞

[Caversham Green]

Their goalkeeper is the best in the world - whoever he is.
They have two of the best midfielders in the world - whoever they are.
They have the best striker in the world - tbf Harry Kane is quite good.
Nigeria could only score once against that rock-solid defence.

[Betty Boop]

No-one is building England up.

Apart, perhaps, from bitter Scottish football fans.

Most people think they'll qualify from their group, as do I, but that's about it.
Couldn't agree more. Don't get all the anti English sentiment on here, all a bit cringeworthy.

[Real Emerald]

Couldn't agree more. Don't get all the anti English sentiment on here, all a bit cringeworthy.

I’ve nothing against the English, my wife is English. It’s having to listen to Lawro, Ian Wright, Glen Hoddle etc. that gets on my nerves.

[Hibbyradge]

I’ve nothing against the English, my wife is English. It’s having to listen to Lawro, Ian Wright, Glen Hoddle etc. that gets on my nerves.

Why do you listen to them if you don't like them? I don't.

[Pretty Boy]

I think the media build up has been pretty muted this time around. You have to expect a certain level of excitement and expectation, I daresay it's the same in Portugal, Belgium, Argentina et al. I thought the game last night was discussed pretty honestly on ITV, England were very good in the 1st half but didn't deal with Nigeria matching them up in the 2nd and struggled a bit.

It's probably because I can't really get excited about international football that I can't get into the whole rivalry with England. Maybe it harks back to the days of the old Home Internationals when we played regularly.

[Just Jimmy]

No-one is building England up.

Apart, perhaps, from bitter Scottish football fans.

Most people think they'll qualify from their group, as do I, but that's about it.agree. no one down here thinks they'll win it. they hope to just no get embarrassed again.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[LustForLeith]

I think they’ll struggle to win their group...

[HibbyAndy]

The best England midfielder is left at home while Jordan Henderson gets a game , Unbelievable

[Stranraer]

personally I don't think the English Premier League is the best in the world. Spain and Germany's leagues are better IMO.

[Hibbyradge]

personally I don't think the English Premier League is the best in the world. Spain and Germany's leagues are better IMO.

What draws you to that conclusion?

[Col2]

Dyer and Henderson midfield says it all. Defensive square passing and low score matches.

I think this is one of the poorest squads I can remember. Who are the world clas stars? Kane is a goal scorer but not in top 5 of truly exciting strikers in the world, maybe not even top 10. Ali can be hot and cold.

Defense is average and goalie suspect.

They will get through group along with Belgium but will be out soon after IMO.

[Hibbyradge]

Dyer and Henderson midfield says it all. Defensive square passing and low score matches.

I think this is one of the poorest squads I can remember. Who are the world clas stars? Kane is a goal scorer but not in top 5 of truly exciting strikers in the world, maybe not even top 10. Ali can be hot and cold.

Defense is average and goalie suspect.

They will get through group along with Belgium but will be out soon after IMO.

Fans understandably hope for more, but that's what everyone realistically expects.

[CorrieHibs]

personally I don't think the English Premier League is the best in the world. Spain and Germany's leagues are better IMO.

The English league is competitive (although City ran away with it this season) and has a lot of close matches. But, I think the Spanish is strongest with some very strong teams i.e Barcelona, Atlético and Real.

The leagues dominance in Europe proves that.

[NAE NOOKIE]

There isn't a stand out team in the competition, for all Belgium have been bummed up I cant help thinking the whole wont match up to the sum of the parts.
England have a decent chance in that scenario, or at least they should have, but they seem to be stuck in a footballing groundhog day where they skoosh their way through every qualifying campaign and then make an absolute dugs dinner of the tournament ... on paper they should stroll through their group, certainly for 2nd spot ... but after that who knows. If they are true to form they will be lucky to make the semi finals.

[Lago]

England have a great chance tbh

I agree, some good young players in the England team, should do well hopefully.

[timewilltell]

The bigger they build them up the better. It will be all tears and snotters when it goes pear shaped and will be a thing to behold. Having said that they’ve got a no bad team this time and another reasonably easy draw. 🙄

why will it be a ‘thing to behold’ exactly?

[1van Sprou7e]

Dyer and Henderson midfield says it all. Defensive square passing and low score matches.

I think this is one of the poorest squads I can remember. Who are the world clas stars? Kane is a goal scorer but not in top 5 of truly exciting strikers in the world, maybe not even top 10. Ali can be hot and cold.

Defense is average and goalie suspect.

They will get through group along with Belgium but will be out soon after IMO.

Kane is easily as top 5 striker, and so much more than just a goalscorer

[1van Sprou7e]

What draws you to that conclusion?

Something like 9 out of the last 10 European trophies were won by Spanish teams

[AltheHibby]

I’ve nothing against the English, my wife is English. It’s having to listen to Lawro, Ian Wright, Glen Hoddle etc. that gets on my nerves.

Same feeling here. They constantly prattle on about "winning" penalties and "taking one for the team", both of which are cheating and against the spirit of sport. And that's before they make the ill-informed comments.

And don't get me started on how they turned on Peter Shilton, Britain's greatest ever goalkeeper, before they realised that Maradona had used his hand for that goal.

Rant over. That feels better.🤗

[Killiehibbie]

Something like 7 out of the last 8 European trophies were won by Spanish teams
I think I heard them saying it was 13 out of the last 18

[BullsCloseHibs]

Let them get on with it (yet again)

It's always a chuckle watching the long build up and inevitable failure of this nation.

[Hibbyradge]

Something like 9 out of the last 10 European trophies were won by Spanish teams

Do you have 2 usernames? :wink:

[Hibbyradge]

Let them get on with it (yet again)

It's always a chuckle watching the long build up and inevitable failure of this nation.

I wish we were in that position.

[Lago]

As soon as I read that famous phrase " I've nothing against the English" I see a little green man sitting on many a shoulder.

[Green_one]

Did I miss any?

My list would (in support of them NOT doing well)

1. Their manager lacks ability, record and experience
2. They are one of the poorest England sides ever and the lack of caps is frightening
3. They got murdered in the Euros.
4. Their recent record in the WC shows they lack the ability, management and psychology for that stage
5. There are several better teams, with good WC history and current form - Brazil, Germany, France, Spain , Argntina and even Belgium. No-one will be easy

Kane apart, they are a pretty average bunch, pulled from a very small pool of players. Even their keepers are now average. Better England sides have failed miserably.

Positives

1. Kane
2. They have a high seeding in a fairly poor group.

I fully expect the media though to build them up for a fall, as is their pattern. Bad news sells as well as good.

[BegbieHSC]

Germany will win. England will get pumped out by a team like Iceland again 😂😂😂😂😂

[Stranraer]

My list would (in support of them NOT doing well)

1. Their manager lacks ability, record and experience
2. They are one of the poorest England sides ever and the lack of caps is frightening
3. They got murdered in the Euros.
4. Their recent record in the WC shows they lack the ability, management and psychology for that stage
5. There are several better teams, with good WC history and current form - Brazil, Germany, France, Spain , Argntina and even Belgium. No-one will be easy

Kane apart, they are a pretty average bunch, pulled from a very small pool of players. Even their keepers are now average. Better England sides have failed miserably.

Positives

1. Kane
2. They have a high seeding in a fairly poor group.

I fully expect the media though to build them up for a fall, as is their pattern. Bad news sells as well as good.

Pretty much in agreement with this. Like usual they have a relatively easy group but they won't get far in the knockout stages.

[Golden Bear]

No-one is building England up.

Apart, perhaps, from bitter Scottish football fans.

Most people think they'll qualify from their group, as do I, but that's about it.

:agree:

Although I hope they go further ----------------- for the first time in my life I may add.

[Keith_M]

One of their players is a real Gangsta, with a tattoo of a gun on his leg.

[Keith_M]

As soon as I read that famous phrase " I've nothing against the English" I see a little green man sitting on many a shoulder.


A leprechaun?


:dunno:

[bingo70]

England have a great chance tbh

On their day England are capable of beating anyone, I just don’t think there’s any chance of them doing that 3 or 4 games in a row against decent teams.

FWIW I find this England team a lot more bearable than England teams in the past, there isn’t really anybody I dislike.

I’ll always support whoever England are playing as to me rivalry in football is what it’s all about, I don’t really care that much though now which I can only assume is a sign of getting old and boring, in years gone by I was a much more passionate ABE supporter.

Once we get independence I may even go as far as wishing them well but that’s a different debate altogether 😉

[BoomtownHibees]

I think they will finish runners-up in their group, beat Colombia in the next round then get beat by Brazil.

Think it works out like that if it all goes to plan

[bingo70]

I think they will finish runners-up in their group, beat Colombia in the next round then get beat by Brazil.

Think it works out like that if it all goes to plan

I did a telegraph wall chart predictor that had them being runner up in their group, beating poland in the last 16 and then losing to Germany in the quarters.

[BoomtownHibees]

I did a telegraph wall chart predictor that had them being runner up in their group, beating poland in the last 16 and then losing to Germany in the quarters.

Similar path I think although I had Colombia to win their group with Poland runner-up but you’re right, it would be Germany, not Brazil

[bingo70]

Similar path I think although I had Colombia to win their group with Poland runner-up

Yeah I get the Colombia or Poland discrepancy but not sure how it could be either Brazil or Germany? Would that not mean one of them not winning their group or playing each other in the last 16?

Don’t think they can bet Brazil in the last 16 if they don’t win their group. Every chance I’m wrong with that though.

[BoomtownHibees]

Yeah I get the Colombia or Poland discrepancy but not sure how it could be either Brazil or Germany? Would that not mean one of them not winning their group or playing each other in the last 16?

Don’t think they can bet Brazil in the last 16 if they don’t win their group. Every chance I’m wrong with that though.

Too slow with my edit!!!

Aye I had Brazil’s group as Group F and Germany as Group E but it’s the other way around meaning it would be Germany

[Unseen work]

For the first time in a while I actually think England could do not bad.

The team have a lot more chemistry and get on better unlike the days of Gerrard Ferdinand etc where they openly said that they would rarely socialise and you would just tend to sit with your club team mates.

They have players who are willing to go in behind and there movement off the ball is incredible, added to that they’ve blistering pace and one of the best strikers in the world.

Previously I think they’ve played too many similar players who are exceptional individually but not as a team as they all like the ball to get the ball to feet and play World Cup passes. Now I feel it’s a lot more short sharp passing at a high tempo.

Guys like Sterling, Lingard, Rashford, Ali and Vardy could prove crucial for them.

The main weakness is clearly the defence and if the going gets tough which it inevitably will.

[Hi Heid Yin]

[QUOTE=Stranraer;5422188]personally I don't think the English Premier League is the best in the world. Spain and Germany's leagues are better IMO.[/QUOTE

The EPL is arguably the most competitive in the world. It is said to have more quality in-depth - thus making it the most difficult to win.
So, I guess it then becomes the best. The obscene amount of money flowing into the EPL flows there for good reason.

[bingo70]

You would think English teams would win the Europa league more often if there was so much depth in the league.

There’s some very very good teams in the premiership but unfortunately for England there’s very few English players in these teams and I’m far from convinced teams at the bottom of the league are any good, I think most would probably lose to their equivalent team in the Spanish league.

Anyway it’s a bit of a moot point as it’s all relative, For me the Scottish league is the best in the world but only because it’s the only one I’ve got a genuine interest in, I suspect a lot of English fans who say the premiership is the best in the world follow a similar logic.

[emerald green]

No-one is building England up.

Certainly nothing like the extent that the Scotland team was built up in the lead up to Argentina 1978. Now that was cringeworthy. Many people were saying that Scotland were going to win the World Cup. Easy. :rolleyes:

As far as England is concerned, they probably wont win it either, but at least they qualified.

[Ryan69]

Certainly nothing like the extent that the Scotland team was built up in the lead up to Argentina 1978. Now that was cringeworthy. Many people were saying that Scotland were going to win the World Cup. Easy. :rolleyes:

As far as England is concerned, they probably wont win it either, but at least they qualified.

When you look at the group's England usually have to qualify from...It's no surprise they qualify.

[chrisski33]

Although born in England ive been brought up in Scotland since age of 2 i do not want England to win it and that doesnt make me anti English so dunno where folk saying its anti english not wanting them to win are getting this from. Its banter. I hope they get through the group stages but dont want them to win the cup

[superfurryhibby]

Couldn't agree more. Don't get all the anti English sentiment on here, all a bit cringeworthy.

Except there isn’t any anti English sentiment is there? There is sporting rivalry, so let’s not compare ABE with anti anything other than a desire to enjoy the England football team’s failure.

Any attempt to suggest that friendly, but partisan sporting prejudices are anymore than exactly that, that’s cringeworthy.

[Hibbyradge]

When you look at the group's England usually have to qualify from...It's no surprise they qualify.

Agreed.

They're better than most teams in Europe.

[bubblesmorrison]

Couldn't agree more. Don't get all the anti English sentiment on here, all a bit cringeworthy.

Watch braveheart or listen to any game at the world cup and count how long it takes then to mention 1966.

I also presume you would like to see Hearts to wellthis year?

[jacomo]

Agreed.

They're better than most teams in Europe.


:agree:

One of England’s problems is that they rarely face any serious tests before pitching up for a tournament.

No question that uefa have gamed the system in favour of the richest. We face the same issue at club level.

Southgate seems like nobody’s fool and they’ve got strength in depth. But I reckon on a QF knock out.

[monktonharp]

Couldn't agree more. Don't get all the anti English sentiment on here, all a bit cringeworthy.I have nothing against the english apart from the obvious fact that the closer we get to the start of the world football cup, the more the English media ramp up their team's chances and thereby their pressure. I also dislike the south of England attidude generally about the rest of these parts of "great Britain" if we can call it for a few seconds. I have a general dislike of the way our country "Scotland"is being changed bit by bit being englasised and the way that our local languages are being dismantled in that we are gradually forgetting Scots phrases and words. wee thing, I suppose but it does irk me. Probably, the real thing that more than irks me, in fact annoys me greatly is that south of england money comes up here and virtually buys places like the Isle o' Skye and other iconic parts of our country because they can afford it but most of our own people cant. this in turn , stops local Sots families being able to get a foot on the ladder for first homes. not trying to turn this into a political debate but those are my thoughts.! ready for an argument about the political side of things anytime btw.

[monktonharp]

Certainly nothing like the extent that the Scotland team was built up in the lead up to Argentina 1978. Now that was cringeworthy. Many people were saying that Scotland were going to win the World Cup. Easy. :rolleyes:

As far as England is concerned, they probably wont win it either, but at least they qualified.I think the then Manger, Ally Mc Leod was the person that said we could win this. cant remember many others, other than the red rags slappin' a ******' sombrero oan his heid and taking snaps of it, telling us we will win it.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Except there isn’t any anti English sentiment is there? There is sporting rivalry, so let’s not compare ABE with anti anything other than a desire to enjoy the England football team’s failure.

Any attempt to suggest that friendly, but partisan sporting prejudices are anymore than exactly that, that’s cringeworthy.

Well said, ABE .

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

England have a great chance tbh

Apart from the reasons already given in the op what makes you think that?

[.Sean.]

Who cares if they win it. Embarrassing how bitter some people are.

1. It’s no the 1300’s and we don’t live in Braveheart times

2. International football is total ***** anyway

[superfurryhibby]

Who cares if they win it. Embarrassing how bitter some people are.

1. It’s no the 1300’s and we don’t live in Braveheart times

2. International football is total ***** anyway

1. You obviously haven’t heard of the concept of sporting rivalry?

2. It isn’t rubbish, otherwise why would top players bother?

It’s such a lazy analogy, the Braveheart rubbish and linking ABE to some nationalist agenda.

Imagine getting all worked up about Hearts and the Hun losing in a humiliating manner eh, we Hibees should of course in your book be cheering on our local friendly rivals?

[WeeRussell]

1. You obviously haven’t heard of the concept of sporting rivalry?

2. It isn’t rubbish, otherwise why would top players bother?

It’s such a lazy analogy, the Braveheart rubbish and linking ABE to some nationalist agenda.

Imagine getting all worked up about Hearts and the Hun losing in a humiliating manner eh, we Hibees should of course in your book be cheering on our local friendly rivals?

Spot on. The irony of using the word “embarrassing” and then writing off people’s interest in international football becuase it’s “total s**t”.

Not to mention rambling about braveheart for no reason.

[Hibbyradge]

Watch braveheart or listen to any game at the world cup and count how long it takes then to mention 1966.

I also presume you would like to see Hearts to wellthis year?

Watch Bravehheart? : faf:

So what if they mention 1966?

When they do, it's usually bemoaning the fact that they've failed to win it since.

I think 1902 might have been mentioned a few times when Hibs played in the Scottish Cup.

[Hibbyradge]

Spot on. The irony of using the word “embarrassing” and then writing off people’s interest in international football becuase it’s “total s**t”.

Not to mention rambling about braveheart for no reason.

Bravehheart was used as a reason to want England to lose.

[Hibbyradge]

1. You obviously haven’t heard of the concept of sporting rivalry?



Is it rivalry, though?

Rivalry is a 2 way thing. Most English people want Scotland to do well unless it's against their team. Some others don't really care. Only a small minority actively want us to fail and that's usually because of how they perceive our feelings towards them.

I've lived south of the border for about 7 years in total and I've worked extensively throughout England.

I've never heard anyone say that they hoped Scotland would lose, never mind get hammered or embarrassed etc.

Personally, I don't think I could bring myself to actively support them, but I'm not jumping on the childish ABE bandwagon.

[WeeRussell]

Bravehheart was used as a reason to want England to lose.

I see that in your quoted post above. Also laughable. But presumably only in that one post.

1902 was indeed mentioned a lot during our Scottish cup matches. It's formed part of our great sporting rivalry with Hearts over many years, and led to the greatest weekend in many of our lives.

Nothing wrong with that. Just like there's nothing wrong with wanting your international rivals to lose.

England fans generally don't like to see Scotland/Wales/Ireland win either.. .just ask Scouse :greengrin

Just like Holland and Germany want each other beat. Scandinavian rivalries. Brazil and Argentina. etc etc

We're not some exception that makes us racist, William Wallace wannabees.

[WeeRussell]

Is it rivalry, though?

Rivalry is a 2 way thing. Most English people want Scotland to do well unless it's against their team. Some others don't really care. Only a small minority actively want us to fail and that's usually because of how they perceive our feelings towards them.

I've lived south of the border for about 7 years in total and I've worked extensively throughout England.

I've never heard anyone say that they hoped Scotland would lose, never mind get hammered or embarrassed etc.

Personally, I don't think I could bring myself to actively support them, but I'm not jumping on the childish ABE bandwagon.

I'm somewhere near where you are in that I don't get as fussed about them as a lot of my friends/family. I still want them to lose whenever they play (like Hearts) but it doesn't really bother me if and when they win.

I've been confident over the last ten years, including this one, that they won't go close to winning it. Enjoying them getting knocked out prematurely as our biggest rivals is about all we have seeing as we're never there ourselves :greengrin

[Hibbyradge]

I see that in your quoted post above. Also laughable. But presumably only in that one post.



Yes, but that's why others have mentioned it.




England fans generally don't like to see Scotland/Wales/Ireland win either.. .just ask Scouse :greengrin



That's definitely not the case. Most English people want the home nations to succeed. Much in the same way as most Scots are happy to see Wales, Norn Iron and the Republic do well.

Of course there are some people who have their own reasons for wanting them to lose, but the vast majority would prefer them to win.

[WeeRussell]

Yes, but that's why others have mentioned it.



That's definitely not the case. Most English people want the home nations to succeed. Much in the same way as most Scots are happy to see Wales, Norn Iron and the Republic do well.

Of course there are some people who have their own reasons for wanting them to lose, but the vast majority would prefer them to win.

I disagree. Granted if you've lived down there you've more experience. And I'm sure there will be less relevance for them as we rarely win anyway haha... a bit like when a club is doing well, you're more concerned about seeing them beat. The songs and chants of their travelling fans would suggest otherwise though. Although 'English people' and the active English support are two different things.

When you say "happy to do well"... the majority of the Tartan Army have no leanings to wanting Wales or the Irish do well. Albeit they may not be actively wanting them to lose.

"Home nations" means nothing to me, other than a rugby term. (appreciate that's just me).

Regardless of how much they do or don't like us (in football terms)... it's still not childish for any Scottish fan to not want England to win their matches.

[Stranraer]

I disagree. Granted if you've lived down there you've more experience. And I'm sure there will be less relevance for them as we rarely win anyway haha... a bit like when a club is doing well, you're more concerned about seeing them beat. The songs and chants of their travelling fans would suggest otherwise though. Although 'English people' and the active English support are two different things.

When you say "happy to do well"... the majority of the Tartan Army have no leanings to wanting Wales or the Irish do well. Albeit they may not be actively wanting them to lose.

"Home nations" means nothing to me, other than a rugby term. (appreciate that's just me).

Regardless of how much they do or don't like us (in football terms)... it's still not childish for any Scottish fan to not want England to win their matches.

:agree: I'm half English and I consider not wanting them to win a bit of fun / banter. I don't hate the English, just don't want the football team to do well.

[Beefster]

Mrs Beefster is English so, technically, Mini-Beefster is half English. I still like watching the English national team in various sports taking a pumping.

[One Day Soon]

I like to see us beat them at anything we can, just seeing it all as pretty healthy sporting rivalry.

If they are playing anyone else I'm generally happy to see them succeed - unless it's another home nation in which case I'm pretty agnostic.

Nothing wrong with wanting to compete with our only land neighbours. I just think it seems much more bitter and chip on shoulder cringe when it becomes ABE. At that point it's not about us beating them, it's about wishing them ill. That does seem bitter.

[WeeRussell]

I like to see us beat them at anything we can, just seeing it all as pretty healthy sporting rivalry.

If they are playing anyone else I'm generally happy to see them succeed - unless it's another home nation in which case I'm pretty agnostic.

Nothing wrong with wanting to compete with our only land neighbours. I just think it seems much more bitter and chip on shoulder cringe when it becomes ABE. At that point it's not about us beating them, it's about wishing them ill. That does seem bitter.

So it's a bitter sporting rivalry then :greengrin

Surely no more bitter than wanting Hearts to get beat in almost every game they play in, as our rivals?

[Hibbyradge]

So it's a bitter sporting rivalry then :greengrin

Surely no more bitter than wanting Hearts to get beat in almost every game they play in, as our rivals?

It's not a real rivalry, though. I'ts pretty much one way.

English fans either don't care if we win or lose, or actively want us to win, unless we're playing them.

Generally, Scotland fans want England to lose every game in every sport, even cricket, and you're not going to tell me that's about rivalry too, are you?

[WeeRussell]

It's not a real rivalry, though. I'ts pretty much one way.

English fans either don't care if we win or lose, or actively want us to win, unless we're playing them.

Generally, Scotland fans want England to lose every game in every sport, even cricket, and you're not going to tell me that's about rivalry too, are you?

Ok, I won't. What is it then... are all Scottish sports fans, who don't support England, racists?

A lot of my favourite sportsmen, musicians, friends and family are all English. I enjoy going to a few of their cities, more than many of our places. I can't think for a second that I've got any prejudice towards someone for being English.

I still prefer them to get beat at football though.

[weecounty hibby]

It's not a real rivalry, though. I'ts pretty much one way.

English fans either don't care if we win or lose, or actively want us to win, unless we're playing them.

Generally, Scotland fans want England to lose every game in every sport, even cricket, and you're not going to tell me that's about rivalry too, are you?
I always want them to win at cricket. I want them to lose at every other sport though, and the heavier the defeat the better. Next folk will be on telling us that wanting Hearts to lose is about religious bigotry and not sporting rivalry. Total bull, as is the notion that Scottish folk wanting England beat is racist

[Geo_1875]

I don't care about English sportsmen and don't care about their results.

What I do "hate" is the media and pundits prior to and during any major tournament going overboard about their chances.

I genuinely believe that no other nation, possibly with the exception of the Aussies, behave in this way over sport.

I think every pundit at BBC and ITV are trained using old tapes of Emlyn Hughes.

[superfurryhibby]

Is it rivalry, though?

Rivalry is a 2 way thing. Most English people want Scotland to do well unless it's against their team. Some others don't really care. Only a small minority actively want us to fail and that's usually because of how they perceive our feelings towards them.

I've lived south of the border for about 7 years in total and I've worked extensively throughout England.

I've never heard anyone say that they hoped Scotland would lose, never mind get hammered or embarrassed etc.

Personally, I don't think I could bring myself to actively support them, but I'm not jumping on the childish ABE bandwagon.

Yes, it is rivalry.

For me it’s irrelevant what England fans think of the Scottish team. I still want England’s football team (and rugby) team to lose every match.

I’m in no way anti-English, but I find a bit childish bitterness makes for a decent world cup, especially when Scotland are never involved.

[emerald green]

When you look at the group's England usually have to qualify from...It's no surprise they qualify.

That's because they are usually highly seeded due to their past results. Since Scotland last qualified for the World Cup finals (20 years ago) our seedings and rankings have gone down the tubes, thereby making it increasingly difficult for Scotland to qualify sadly.

[Baader]

No-one here thinks they'll win it though...

[Wee Effen Bee]

Yes commentators/journos/pundits do my head in but, I prefer England to do quite well as it helps retain my interest in the competition. I would rather watch England v Uraguay than say, Poland v Uraguay. Just because I am more familiar with the players. Not sure if the squad is as good as the Brazilians , Argentinians, Spanish, or Germans though.

[blackpoolhibs]

Every English football fan i speak to tells me in no uncertain terms just how mickey mouse football in Scotland is.

Christ even a german told me this last week in the pub watching the Gareth Bale show against the scousers.

Forgive me laughing when they get pumped, but i await that inevitable pumping each and every tournament they play in.

I dont give a toss about any other sport they play, but when its football i want them pumped as quickly as possible.

[Unseen work]

I’m just not the biggest fan of English football and imo it’s not the best league in the world to some people’s disbeleif.

Competitive? Man City won the league by a country mile. Our league was far more competitive this season.

Hibs 5-5 Rangers = Poor football/ability and an awful league
Tottenham 5-4 Leceister = Best league in the world entertaining football

Fwiw there’s not many English players I dislike at the moment and actually quite like most them as players, for me it’s the media/journalists and their over inflated confidence about how amazing they are.

I’d love them to get pumped by Spain/Germany

[Haymaker]

Every English football fan i speak to tells me in no uncertain terms just how mickey mouse football in Scotland is.

Christ even a german told me this last week in the pub watching the Gareth Bale show against the scousers.

Forgive me laughing when they get pumped, but i await that inevitable pumping each and every tournament they play in.

I dont give a toss about any other sport they play, but when its football i want them pumped as quickly as possible.

:agree: I grew up in England and regularly encountered English supporters hoping Scotland lose.

In fact my mates whatsapp me every time we do.

[Dashing Bob S]

Every English football fan i speak to tells me in no uncertain terms just how mickey mouse football in Scotland is.

Christ even a german told me this last week in the pub watching the Gareth Bale show against the scousers.

Forgive me laughing when they get pumped, but i await that inevitable pumping each and every tournament they play in.

I dont give a toss about any other sport they play, but when its football i want them pumped as quickly as possible.

Always prefer them to get done in the QF’s - gives the fans and media time to get even more deluded with hope. They get so deranged it becomes as if they, rather than Hearts, won two World Wars.

[blackpoolhibs]

Always prefer them to get done in the QF’s - gives the fans and media time to get even more deluded with hope. They get so deranged it becomes as if they, rather than Hearts, won two World Wars.


The Iceland defeat in the Euros was a new high for me, the amount of seethe and anger was off the scale down here, much better than a defeat from Germany or Brazil.

And it sparked off a multitude of juvenile gags. :greengrin

[Hibrandenburg]

It’s the most open World cup in a long time. I don’t feel there is an out and out favourite albeit the bookies have it as the Germans.

For me if any of the top 12 or so teams arrive at the tournament and hit form I think they can win it.

The Germans looked really poor in their test match against Austria. I just hope they can up their game.

[patlowe]

England will get through the group easily enough and then it's about the draw. Looking at their squad, they are not exactly brimming with star players but they have good athleticism and pace. Quarter finals for me.

[BoomtownHibees]

England will get through the group easily enough and then it's about the draw. Looking at their squad, they are not exactly brimming with star players but they have good athleticism and pace. Quarter finals for me.

There is no “draw” as such. They will more than likely play Poland or Colombia, depending on who wins the group and if England win theirs.

The path I have them on is finishing runner-up, playing Colombia (I think they will win their group), beat them and then knocked out by Germany

[patlowe]

There is no “draw” as such. They will more than likely play Poland or Colombia, depending on who wins the group and if England win theirs.

The path I have them on is finishing runner-up, playing Colombia (I think they will win their group), beat them and then knocked out by Germany

I just mean the permutations around who finishes 1st and 2nd in the groups have a huge impact on chances of progression in later rounds. It's difficult to predict how far any country will go as a result.

[Michael]

If England win their group they'll probably get Brazil in the quarters. England would be lucky to keep it down to 2-0 to be honest.

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

I want England to lose every game of football they play. I've also heard them signing songs about the scots not being at tournaments or how **** we are and I've also seen them jump on any social media post relating to Scottish football and our clubs so to suggest they wish us well or have no thoughts about us is, imo laughable

Maybe some "don't mind" us winning or qualifying because its been so long but sure as **** once were there, they'll want us hammered.

Or maybe it's similar, not to our relationship with Hearts, but instead the OF over the years? I've wanted them pumped from everyone (bar hearts or when it benefits us like the SCF)

[heretoday]

I don't think I want them to win it because if they did the airwaves would be full of nothing else for years, just like the last time!
They've got a good bunch of young players and seem to be quite realistic about their chances,which is refreshing.

[Hibbyradge]

I always want them to win at cricket. I want them to lose at every other sport though, and the heavier the defeat the better. Next folk will be on telling us that wanting Hearts to lose is about religious bigotry and not sporting rivalry. Total bull, as is the notion that Scottish folk wanting England beat is racist

That's my point.

Hearts are our direct football rivals. They have the same regard for us as we have for them.

The same can not be said for England.

I'm not saying all Scotland fans are racist, but I've heard the words " I hate the effing English" loads of times.

I don't mind how you define it, but for many Scots, their attitude towards England is about more than just sporting rivalry.

I don't suppose we'll ever agree on this point so I'll leave it there.

[superfurryhibby]

That's my point.

Hearts are our direct football rivals. They have the same regard for us as we have for them.

The same can not be said for England.

I'm not saying all Scotland fans are racist, but I've heard the words " I hate the effing English" loads of times.

I don't mind how you define it, but for many Scots, their attitude towards England is about more than just sporting rivalry.

I don't suppose we'll ever agree on this point so I'll leave it there.

Very poorly made arguement You’re all over the place now.

You imply that fans who are A.B.E is about more than sporting rivalry, despite almost everybody on here giving a reasonable account of why they take this stance.

Probably best you leave it there before you dig a deeper hole for yourself. The last line about many Scots and their attitudes is pretty contemptable really.

[Hibbyradge]

Very poorly made arguement You’re all over the place now.

You imply that fans who are A.B.E is about more than sporting rivalry, despite almost everybody on here giving a reasonable account of why they take this stance.

Probably best you leave it there before you dig a deeper hole for yourself. The last line about many Scots and their attitudes is pretty contemptable really.

That was not what I said, nor was it what I implied.

Thanks for the advice, but I already said I was leaving it there.

[One Day Soon]

I just don't understand what fuels the need to see England do badly when they aren't competing with us?

The Hearts comparison just doesn't stack up. We're in competition with them - and in the same city - but Scotland are rarely in competition with England.

I feel that the ABE approach serves as a bit of a comfort blanket for our own appalling World Cup record. It's almost as though as long as England do badly then it makes it more acceptable that we are crap.

[WeeRussell]

I just don't understand what fuels the need to see England do badly when they aren't competing with us?

The Hearts comparison just doesn't stack up. We're in competition with them - and in the same city - but Scotland are rarely in competition with England.

I feel that the ABE approach serves as a bit of a comfort blanket for our own appalling World Cup record. It's almost as though as long as England do badly then it makes it more acceptable that we are crap.

How does it not? So when we are knocked out before Hearts in the Scottish Cup (doesn't happen often I know).. you're happy or indifferent towards them going on and winning their remaining games in it? Or when we were in the championship, you weren't wanting them to lose their premier league games?

"In the same city" as in closest in proximity... just like England are to Scotland.

We don't like Hearts as a club because they are our rivals... simple as that.

Of course it stacks up. People are just looking to find holes in people enjoying the auld enemy rivalry stance, for some strange reason. As for the 'comfort blanket' argument, I don't think even you really believe that. There isn't any result, England or otherwise that will lessen the regret that Scotland have failed to qualify for yet another tournament, and the poor quality of our team just now. It doesn't mean we have to cheer England on to prove it though.

[One Day Soon]

How does it not? So when we are knocked out before Hearts in the Scottish Cup (doesn't happen often I know).. you're happy or indifferent towards them going on and winning their remaining games in it? Or when we were in the championship, you weren't wanting them to lose their premier league games?

Precisely my point. We're practically never in the same competitions as England either at finals or in qualifying stages. There is no competition.

"In the same city" as in closest in proximity... just like England are to Scotland.

We're as close to Northern Ireland and Ireland as we are to most of England.

We don't like Hearts as a club because they are our rivals... simple as that.

England aren't our rivals. They're just one set of neighbours.

Of course it stacks up. People are just looking to find holes in people enjoying the auld enemy rivalry stance, for some strange reason. As for the 'comfort blanket' argument, I don't think even you really believe that. There isn't any result, England or otherwise that will lessen the regret that Scotland have failed to qualify for yet another tournament, and the poor quality of our team just now. It doesn't mean we have to cheer England on to prove it though.

I get the rivalry of wanting to beat England when we play them. I don't get the wanting them to lose to everyone, at almost everything. I absolutely do think the comfort blanket thing is real, 'we failed, again, so let's get vicarious pleasure from England failing as a substitute thrill'.

There's quite a big difference between cheering England on and wanting them to lose to everyone.

Anyway each to his or her own. I've bigger disliked fish to fry in Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay and Iran.

[WeeRussell]

I get the rivalry of wanting to beat England when we play them. I don't get the wanting them to lose to everyone, at almost everything. I absolutely do think the comfort blanket thing is real, 'we failed, again, so let's get vicarious pleasure from England failing as a substitute thrill'.

There's quite a big difference between cheering England on and wanting them to lose to everyone.

Anyway each to his or her own. I've bigger disliked fish to fry in Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay and Iran.


Exactly :aok: All free to support or 'support against' whoever we want. We've plenty options... that's the beauty of not qualifying :greengrin

[One Day Soon]

Exactly :aok: All free to support or 'support against' whoever we want. We've plenty options... that's the beauty of not qualifying :greengrin

'the beauty of not qualifying'. That's actually quite funny. I just don't know who I most don't want to win.

[WeeRussell]

'the beauty of not qualifying'. That's actually quite funny. I just don't know who I most don't want to win.


I thought we'd all agreed that's England, without exception :greengrin

[One Day Soon]

I thought we'd all agreed that's England, without exception :greengrin

If be 'we' you mean you then you're correct. :greengrin

[JeMeSouviens]

I get the rivalry of wanting to beat England when we play them. I don't get the wanting them to lose to everyone, at almost everything. I absolutely do think the comfort blanket thing is real, 'we failed, again, so let's get vicarious pleasure from England failing as a substitute thrill'.

There's quite a big difference between cheering England on and wanting them to lose to everyone.

Anyway each to his or her own. I've bigger disliked fish to fry in Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay and Iran.

Soft on Korea now, eh? :wink:

[One Day Soon]

Soft on Korea now, eh? :wink:

Absolutely not, I just didn't want to lob the full Godfather christening day list in to the post. You can chalk up Saudi Arabia and Germany too (though Germany is a bit love/hate for me). And Ecuador - that's where the corrupt ref came from.

Oh it's all going to be one giant enjoyable bag of seethe for me. Can't wait.

[Barman Stanton]

Of course England are our rivals! They are our closest nation, we previously fought them for centuries, and used to play them every year. Just because we are now brutal as a national team and never qualify doesn’t mean we can’t still have a rival. The fact they see Germany and Argentina as more of a rival matters little as well. Are we now not allowed to have a rival because we are poor?

[CockneyRebel]

'the beauty of not qualifying'. That's actually quite funny. I just don't know who I most don't want to win.

As Butcher said "the beauty of not qualifying is that it takes away the fear of getting knocked out"

[givescotlandfreedom]

I hear the Costa Rica goalkeeper is a 'Spic ba***rr' every time he touches the ball. Their fans remind me of the Huns.

[Glory Lurker]

There’s nothing like condescension and thinly-veiled accusations of racism to make a man want to move from “meh” to “ABE”, but I won’t. If England do well, that’s fine. I’m not overly fussed. If folk want them to get hammered every game, that’s fine. If folk want them to win the thing that’s fine, too. Weird, but fine. But neither should be taking moral high ground against the other over their reasons for doing so.

[Ryan69]

That's because they are usually highly seeded due to their past results. Since Scotland last qualified for the World Cup finals (20 years ago) our seedings and rankings have gone down the tubes, thereby making it increasingly difficult for Scotland to qualify sadly.

Its no wonder were so low though...with the groups we generally get.

Remember that year we got the 2 precious finalists in our group(France and Italy),and just to make it all the better Ukraine(who had ended up 3rd in world cup)

Whats so wrong with throwing all the names in a hat...and see what happens.

[BILLYHIBS]

Not holding my breath on this one. Got my popcorn ready for the fall out. Great entertainment cabaret before the serious stuff starts in the SPFL.

[Hibbyradge]

Its no wonder were so low though...with the groups we generally get.

Remember that year we got the 2 precious finalists in our group(France and Italy),and just to make it all the better Ukraine(who had ended up 3rd in world cup)

Whats so wrong with throwing all the names in a hat...and see what happens.

Because the organisers, the sponsors and the viewing public want the best teams at the finals. Understandably so.

That's why there's seeding.

We get difficult groups because we're in with the second bottom seeds.

[Dan Sarf]

No-one is building England up.

Apart, perhaps, from bitter Scottish football fans.

"THE Sun today salutes our small army of brave Three Lions fans in Russia — and calls on supporters at home to roar the team to glory.
A wonder goal from Marcus Rashford and a fine team performance helped England to a 2-0 warm-up win over Costa Rica in Leeds.
As our boys prepared to fly out to their St Petersburg base last night, a buzz of belief was finally building in pubs and sitting rooms.
England captain Harry Kane, 24, led the call to arms with a rousing battle cry. Asked why he was heading for Russia, he said: “To win the World Cup — simple as that.
“We’re all winners in this squad, that’s how we’ve got to where we are. We all want to win trophies. So why not this one?”
Spurs fan Richard Carson, 36, of Teddington, South West London, said: “With players like Rashford, Kane and Raheem Sterling we can shock the world and stick it to Vladimir Putin in his own backyard.”


:greengrin

[Smartie]

I just hope that WHEN they get knocked out they get knocked out fair and square, like that time when Diego Maradona scored a cracking header against them.

[Bristolhibby]

ABE for me. I live in England, my wife’s English and my kids are half English.

Don’t be fooled. They love when we lose. Then come out with that scantimonious pish “oh I’d support Scotland if it was just Scotland at the World Cup”. Bull ****!

Hope they get tonked at every turn, nothing wrong with wanting your closest rivals to fail.

Sadly they have a stupidly easy group. (Spain v Portugal anyone?) Also the group that their top two will face in the last 16 is crap as well.

However if they get to the quarters, I believe it will be the good ole Germans or Brazil to send England home.

1/4ers are about right for England. Good, but nowhere good enough.

J

[CockneyRebel]

"THE Sun today salutes our small army of brave Three Lions fans in Russia — and calls on supporters at home to roar the team to glory.
A wonder goal from Marcus Rashford and a fine team performance helped England to a 2-0 warm-up win over Costa Rica in Leeds.
As our boys prepared to fly out to their St Petersburg base last night, a buzz of belief was finally building in pubs and sitting rooms.
England captain Harry Kane, 24, led the call to arms with a rousing battle cry. Asked why he was heading for Russia, he said: “To win the World Cup — simple as that.
“We’re all winners in this squad, that’s how we’ve got to where we are. We all want to win trophies. So why not this one?”
Spurs fan Richard Carson, 36, of Teddington, South West London, said: “With players like Rashford, Kane and Raheem Sterling we can shock the world and stick it to Vladimir Putin in his own backyard.”


:greengrin


To make your point you quote the Sun?

[CockneyRebel]

"THE Sun today salutes our small army of brave Three Lions fans in Russia — and calls on supporters at home to roar the team to glory.
A wonder goal from Marcus Rashford and a fine team performance helped England to a 2-0 warm-up win over Costa Rica in Leeds.
As our boys prepared to fly out to their St Petersburg base last night, a buzz of belief was finally building in pubs and sitting rooms.
England captain Harry Kane, 24, led the call to arms with a rousing battle cry. Asked why he was heading for Russia, he said: “To win the World Cup — simple as that.
“We’re all winners in this squad, that’s how we’ve got to where we are. We all want to win trophies. So why not this one?”

:greengrin

What do you expect Kane to say?

[Dan Sarf]

To make your point you quote the Sun?


Yep.

[Dan Sarf]

What do you expect Kane to say?

What you'd HOPE for is a little humility from the captain of a team that hasn't won anything since 1966. Cautious optimism perhaps, tempered by a little modesty. That would go a long way to stop most other nations thinking of England and their fans as red-faced, arrogant, entitled, self deluders.

But, of course, fuelled by the jingoistic guff that comes from the Sun etc., they'll get swept up in the usual national delusion that they are better than everyone else and the World Cup is in the bag.

And then they'll come home empty handed as usual.

[CockneyRebel]

What you'd HOPE for is a little humility from the captain of a team that hasn't won anything since 1966. Cautious optimism perhaps, tempered by a little modesty. That would go a long way to stop most other nations thinking of England and their fans as red-faced, arrogant, entitled, self deluders.

But, of course, fuelled by the jingoistic guff that comes from the Sun etc., they'll get swept up in the usual national delusion that they are better than everyone else and the World Cup is in the bag.

And then they'll come home empty handed as usual.

You think the Sun has quoted Kane word for word with everything in context? Just quoting them destroys your credibilty but it's probably only there, or similar places, you could find any quotes to your taste.

[Dan Sarf]

You think the Sun has quoted Kane word for word with everything in context? Just quoting them destroys your credibilty but it's probably only there, or similar places, you could find any quotes to your taste.


You're right - the Sun "journalists" probably made up Kane's quote in order to support their agenda which is, as ever build them up then knock them down. That way, their "readers" can have the pleasure of anticipating certain victory... and then rage at the team, the players, the manager, the tactics, the crooked refs, the cheating foreign teams, etc. etc.

That was my point.

If you look up, you may see it whizzing past above your head.

[Radium]

Spain v Tunisia on FreeSports channel 95. Still 0-0 but Spain poor at the back so far. Think Tunisia are England’s first opponents


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Pete]

I think England will do well in this World Cup.

The best players in the world now ply their trade in the English top flight and the boys in the English team are on a par with them.

Marcus Rashford, Dele Alli and Jon Stones will shine.

The Premiership is a multinational playground now and victory for them wouldn’t just be a result for England.

[Wee Effen Bee]

[QUOTE=Pete;5427243]I think England will do well in this World Cup.

The best players in the world now ply their...
thought I would stop you there Pete and mention: Messi, Ronaldinho, Neymar, Lewandowski, Immobile, Neuer Suarez, Bale, Iniesta etc. etc. It’s a myth that all the best players play in England. How many of these players could walk into any English-based team? Most I would say.

[Haymaker]

I think England will do well in this World Cup.

The best players in the world now ply their trade in the English top flight and the boys in the English team are on a par with them.



Do they?

[superfurryhibby]

I think England will do well in this World Cup.

The best players in the world now ply their trade in the English top flight and the boys in the English team are on a par with them.

Marcus Rashford, Dele Alli and Jon Stones will shine.

The Premiership is a multinational playground now and victory for them wouldn’t just be a result for England.

When you’re at the wind-up it’s better to include some kind of emoji to show this, otherwise you’re just coming across as an attention seeking fandan.

[CockneyRebel]

You're right - the Sun "journalists" probably made up Kane's quote in order to support their agenda which is, as ever build them up then knock them down. That way, their "readers" can have the pleasure of anticipating certain victory... and then rage at the team, the players, the manager, the tactics, the crooked refs, the cheating foreign teams, etc. etc.

That was my point.

If you look up, you may see it whizzing past above your head.


Nothing whizzed over my head except a post that made no sense, made no point and still doesn't.

[Keith_M]

I wonder how the Russian football fans will react to seeing black players on the pitch, or even worse, black people in the crowd.

One England player (Danny Rose, I think) has already told his family not to travel, as he's so worried about them receiving racist abuse.

[Pete]

Do they?

I think in general they do. Money talks and there is so much strength in depth in the English top flight.

[superfurryhibby]

I think in general they do. Money talks and there is so much strength in depth in the English top flight.

I thought you were at it:aok:

The players you named are decent EPL players but none of them have huge european or international pedigrees.

The relative failure of English teams in European competition probably debunks your strength in depth argument, does it not? Facts are facts and if you look at a table of european trophies, say over the past 20 years you have an accurate picture of whose money speaks loudest.

[Pete]

thought I would stop you there Pete and mention: Messi, Ronaldinho, Neymar, Lewandowski, Immobile, Neuer Suarez, Bale, Iniesta etc. etc. It’s a myth that all the best players play in England. How many of these players could walk into any English-based team? Most I would say.

No myth my friend. If you consider the league as a whole, I think the English one is probably the strongest. Clubs like Stoke and West Brom have squads that are packed with international quality players and even clubs of that standing hoover up top talent from other leagues.

I know England have failed in the past but I think it’s different this time. They look good when they press and against the better teams they’ll need to take stock, defend well and counter attack. With players like Vardy, Rashford and Sterling in the squad the can certainly do that.

[Hibee87]

Because the organisers, the sponsors and the viewing public want the best teams at the finals. Understandably so.

That's why there's seeding.

We get difficult groups because we're in with the second bottom seeds.

I dont as the 'viewing public' i think all compititions would be far more entertaining if, as was said, all names in a hat and pulled out at random.

[Pete]

I thought you were at it:aok:

The players you named are decent EPL players but none of them have huge european or international pedigrees.

The relative failure of English teams in European competition probably debunks your strength in depth argument, does it not? Facts are facts and if you look at a table of european trophies, say over the past 20 years you have an accurate picture of whose money speaks loudest.

Good point but I think the strength of the top Spanish teams has something to do with that. I’m reluctant to look at recent European club matches as the The make up of most English teams is truly global.

Should be interesting anyway.

[Stranraer]

I dont as the 'viewing public' i think all compititions would be far more entertaining if, as was said, all names in a hat and pulled out at random.

Agree with this 100%. The current system favors the big teams and gives the smaller countries little chance.

[Hibbyradge]

Agree with this 100%. The current system favors the big teams and gives the smaller countries little chance.

Seeding happens in just about every sport.

Hibs are seeded in the league cup and in the first rounds of the Europa Cup.

Of course it favours the better teams, but the smaller nations have virtually no chance anyway.

I'm looking forward to Spain v Portugal on Friday. The tournament would be devalued if those teams had been knocked out in the qualifying groups.

I probably won't even watch Morocco v Iran in the earlier game.

[Deansy]

No myth my friend. If you consider the league as a whole, I think the English one is probably the strongest. Clubs like Stoke and West Brom have squads that are packed with international quality players and even clubs of that standing hoover up top talent from other leagues.

I know England have failed in the past but I think it’s different this time. They look good when they press and against the better teams they’ll need to take stock, defend well and counter attack. With players like Vardy, Rashford and Sterling in the squad the can certainly do that.

When these players play for their clubs, their game is helped immensely by the high-standards of their foreign team-mates - totally different when they're playing for England.

[Green&White]

This thread might aswell say 'why hibs will win the world cup' because there is as much chance

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[CockneyRebel]

[QUOTE=Green&White;5427474]This thread might aswell say 'why hibs will win the world cup' because there is as much chance


You can't win it if you're not in it. There are not many surprise WC winners it must be said but all teams have a chance. It would take enormous amounts of luck and outrageous fortune for a bottom seeded team to win but it could happen sometime.

[Pete]

When these players play for their clubs, their game is helped immensely by the high-standards of their foreign team-mates - totally different when they're playing for England.

I would disagree. If you look at the England squad, the vast majority of them are key players in teams that compete regularly in the champions league.

I don’t think the ability of the individual players has ever been a problem, it’s the fact that when they get together they somehow manage to become less than the sum of their parts. If they get it together and play to their strengths then they could go far.

[WeeRussell]

I would disagree. If you look at the England squad, the vast majority of them are key players in teams that compete regularly in the champions league.

I don’t think the ability of the individual players has ever been a problem, it’s the fact that when they get together they somehow manage to become less than the sum of their parts. If they get it together and play to their strengths then they could go far.

Rashford, Sterling, and Vardy aren’t in the same league as the best in the world.

Quite literally :)

[660]

I’m eagerly awaiting thousands of England fans going to Russia to sing about German bombers and their hatred for immigrants only to get the **** kicked out of them by Russians. Then for Saudi Arabia to skelp them out in the last 16 while they sing about vindaloo.

[heretoday]

I just hope that WHEN they get knocked out they get knocked out fair and square, like that time when Diego Maradona scored a cracking header against them.

The VAR will ensure that doesn't happen again, unfortunately!

England will get tanked by Belgium.

[Keith_M]

I’m eagerly awaiting thousands of England fans going to Russia to sing about German bombers and their hatred for immigrants only to get the **** kicked out of them by Russians. Then for Saudi Arabia to skelp them out in the last 16 while they sing about vindaloo.


They should be in good company, then.



As an aside, I think you'll find the majority of England Supporters that attend the finals will be decent, law-abiding, respectable people that would never sink that low.

I admit that I don't actually like them (especially Scousers), but we shouldn't let our prejudices get in the way of reason :wink:

[WeeRussell]

Do those who find it "embarrassing" and "cringey" that Scottish people support against England in their football matches apply the same feeling as to what (seems like) the whole of England feel towards the German team?

It's been fairly evident in the BBC/ITV studios and across social media... and is about to double :greengrin

No issue with it myself... that's football rivalry, just interested as to how people view this when it's the exact same thing (only Germans are less annoying :greengrin)

And it's definitely not just because a strong contender is now out... although there will be that feeling for any team who fancies their chances.

[Smartie]

Do those who find it "embarrassing" and "cringey" that Scottish people support against England in their football matches apply the same feeling as to what (seems like) the whole of England feel towards the German team?

It's been fairly evident in the BBC/ITV studios and across social media... and is about to double :greengrin

No issue with it myself... that's football rivalry, just interested as to how people view this when it's the exact same thing (only Germans are less annoying :greengrin)

And it's definitely not just because a strong contender is now out... although there will be that feeling for any team who fancies their chances.

I actually think they've been quite measured in the aftermath of this result.

[WeeRussell]

I actually think they've been quite measured in the aftermath of this result.

I'm still in work so haven't seen... but give it time :greengrin

[speedy_gonzales]

I actually think they've been quite measured in the aftermath of this result.

They were until the last 2 minutes of the BBC coverage there,,,Lineker/Shearer/Jenas cheesing at the outcome,,,"Mein Gott & Auf Wiedersehesen!".

[JimBHibees]

They were until the last 2 minutes of the BBC coverage there,,,Lineker/Shearer/Jenas cheesing at the outcome,,,"Mein Gott & Auf Wiedersehesen!".

Yep no need IMO.

[Since90+2]

England have looked good but you have to consider they were playing Tunisia and Panama. The Belgium game will be like a training game , with both teams possibly preferring to finish second , so their first real challenge will come in the knockout stages. Not sure if that's a good thing or not.

[Dan Sarf]

20922

I started this thread in anticipation of a laugh at the usual xenophobic World Cup hysteria from the English media. Which hasn't happened. So fair play to them.

And then I read this dignified letter in last weekend's Sunday Times.

:blushie:

[Scorrie]

20922

I started this thread in anticipation of a laugh at the usual xenophobic World Cup hysteria from the English media. Which hasn't happened. So fair play to them.

And then I read this dignified letter in last weekend's Sunday Times.

:blushie:

A dignified letter indeed but in football terms England is a foreign team so why this constant question about supporting them? I’m just not bothered and if they win it playing decent football then fair play. As for the media - don’t read it or have the volume up. Anyway the most important game this month is Hibs v Lithgae Rose on Saturday!

[superfurryhibby]

Do those who find it "embarrassing" and "cringey" that Scottish people support against England in their football matches apply the same feeling as to what (seems like) the whole of England feel towards the German team?

It's been fairly evident in the BBC/ITV studios and across social media... and is about to double :greengrin

No issue with it myself... that's football rivalry, just interested as to how people view this when it's the exact same thing (only Germans are less annoying :greengrin)

And it's definitely not just because a strong contender is now out... although there will be that feeling for any team who fancies their chances.

Therein lies the paradox. I wonder what the underlying theme is with England. V Germany. Is it that some Englanders attach history to a sporting fixture or is it about the sporting competition between them?

My view is that the former takes precedence, particularly since the Germans really only rose to footballing prominence in the 1960’s. However, surely accusations of underlying racist and uber nationalist sentiment is taking things too far? Or do our resident wince merchants only apply that logic when it comes to Scottish fans?

[WeeRussell]

Therein lies the paradox. I wonder what the underlying theme is with England. V Germany. Is it that some Englanders attach history to a sporting fixture or is it about the sporting competition between them?

My view is that the former takes precedence, particularly since the Germans really only rose to footballing prominence in the 1960’s. However, surely accusations of underlying racist and uber nationalist sentiment is taking things too far? Or do our resident wince merchants only apply that logic when it comes to Scottish fans?

:aok: :wink:

[JeMeSouviens]

Therein lies the paradox. I wonder what the underlying theme is with England. V Germany. Is it that some Englanders attach history to a sporting fixture or is it about the sporting competition between them?

My view is that the former takes precedence, particularly since the Germans really only rose to footballing prominence in the 1960’s. However, surely accusations of underlying racist and uber nationalist sentiment is taking things too far? Or do our resident wince merchants only apply that logic when it comes to Scottish fans?

Absolutely. It's just normal sporting bantz that anybody anywhere would indulge in except when Scots are involved. Then it becomes small minded bitterness. :rolleyes:

[One Day Soon]

Absolutely. It's just normal sporting bantz that anybody anywhere would indulge in except when Scots are involved. Then it becomes small minded bitterness. :rolleyes:

Some of it is clearly banter and some of it is clearly bitterness.

[Springbank]

:aok: :wink:

I wonder if Austrian television take their lead from BBC Scotland [sic] and, instead of asking ruling politicians about the performance of the economy or the health service (which are both performing better in the small neighbour country rather than the larger neighbour country) they instead ask them "ARE YOU SUPPORTING GERMANY IN THE WORLD CUP"?

Or if Uruguayan TV will badger their first minister if they would support Argentina in a world cup game the same way Sarah Smith and the rest of the BBC crew treat Scotland?

Or if New Zealand TV cut away from the First Minister parading her new baby and asked her "yeah but ARE YOU SUPPORTING AUSTRALIA IN THE WORLD CUP" [the inference being it would be unpatriotic to choose not to]?

Now, I know loads of people born in England who are really embarrassed by the BBC, the Tory Party, the British State and Establishment. Most of those admirable people [since Brexit] now say "Scotland, get out while you still can...and can you take me with you"...

So this next comment does not apply to the decent people of that ancient kingdom. But it sure as hell applies to the people who run the place & who influence the national collective attitudes down there...and it is this: I suspect it is only England (and Putin's Russia) that has this weird cultish obsession with insisting the neighbours all assimilate, fall into line, wave a wee flag (that will not be your flag, but, rather, must be the big neighbour next door's flag) and be good little people. No-one else and nowhere else seems to expect this of their neighbours, far less do this to their neighbours.

Time for Scotland to leave England to its own neurosis.

[KeithTheHibby]

Couldn't care less if they win it or not. Whoever wins it deserves it mind you, it's a long competition and really need to play well each game.

The media have been going over the top a bit however if the players and management are oblivious to it then it shouldn't affect them.They haven't really played anyone yet so tonight will be a decent test for them.

[Hibbyradge]

I wonder if Austrian television take their lead from BBC Scotland [sic] and, instead of asking ruling politicians about the performance of the economy or the health service (which are both performing better in the small neighbour country rather than the larger neighbour country) they instead ask them "ARE YOU SUPPORTING GERMANY IN THE WORLD CUP"?

Or if Uruguayan TV will badger their first minister if they would support Argentina in a world cup game the same way Sarah Smith and the rest of the BBC crew treat Scotland?

Or if New Zealand TV cut away from the First Minister parading her new baby and asked her "yeah but ARE YOU SUPPORTING AUSTRALIA IN THE WORLD CUP" [the inference being it would be unpatriotic to choose not to]?

Now, I know loads of people born in England who are really embarrassed by the BBC, the Tory Party, the British State and Establishment. Most of those admirable people [since Brexit] now say "Scotland, get out while you still can...and can you take me with you"...

So this next comment does not apply to the decent people of that ancient kingdom. But it sure as hell applies to the people who run the place & who influence the national collective attitudes down there...and it is this: I suspect it is only England (and Putin's Russia) that has this weird cultish obsession with insisting the neighbours all assimilate, fall into line, wave a wee flag (that will not be your flag, but, rather, must be the big neighbour next door's flag) and be good little people. No-one else and nowhere else seems to expect this of their neighbours, far less do this to their neighbours.

Time for Scotland to leave England to its own neurosis.

You make a valid point, but those are all entirely separate countries. Millions of people see the UK as a single identity and the majority of English people are happy to see Scotland, Wales and NI do well so they don't understand why we don't feel the same towards them. I know that doesn't apply to everyone, but in my experience, it's by far the majority.

Just saying, "It's because of the media" doesn't make it any more understandable, and let's face it, it's not the media at all. They can be hugely annoying, no doubt about that, but if Lawrenson etc weren't on our screens, would more Scots really want England to win?

Of course there's the football rivalry aspect, but for many people in England, Scotland aren't their rivals so they see it as a one way thing unless we're playing each other.

It's more complicated than that. Just reading the posts on this forum is confirmation enough.

Edit: Just to add, Wales and NI are separate countries from Scotland too, but most Scots are happy to see them do well.

[WeeRussell]

You make a valid point, but those are all entirely separate countries. Millions of people see the UK as a single identity and the majority of English people are happy to see Scotland, Wales and NI do well so they don't understand why we don't feel the same towards them. I know that doesn't apply to everyone, but in my experience, it's by far the majority.

Just saying, "It's because of the media" doesn't make it any more understandable, and let's face it, it's not the media at all. They can be hugely annoying, no doubt about that, but if Lawrenson etc weren't on our screens, would more Scots really want England to win?

Of course there's the football rivalry aspect, but for many people in England, Scotland aren't their rivals so they see it as a one way thing unless we're playing each other.

It's more complicated than that. Just reading the posts on this forum is confirmation enough.

Edit: Just to add, Wales and NI are separate countries from Scotland too, but most Scots are happy to see them do well.

I think Scotland have played England more than Germany have in the last few years. So again, how is it different to England rejoicing in the Germans being out?

I don't think many people claim they would support England if it weren't for the media. Some say they don't mind the players/the team particularly, but it's the media that really annoys them. Fair enough.

Wales and Ireland (all parts) want England beat at everything too... by the way. And Australia, NZ etc etc


And again... still not buying your notion that England is happy to see Scotland do well, or that they don't see as as sporting rivals. And for those that do... it doesn't mean we have to jump onboard, abandon tradition, and cheer them back!

All good fun. I don't see the issue any more than any other rivalries that get out of hand because of the odd idiot.

[Paisley Hibby]

I'm in Madrid at the moment. The headlines after the England v Panama game were all about Panama scoring their first ever goal in the world cup. Media coverage is all about Spain, any other country with a Real Madrid player and any Latin American countries. Nobody is much interested in or cares about England. I like it here very much 😂

[CockneyRebel]

I wonder if Austrian television take their lead from BBC Scotland [sic] and, instead of asking ruling politicians about the performance of the economy or the health service (which are both performing better in the small neighbour country rather than the larger neighbour country) they instead ask them "ARE YOU SUPPORTING GERMANY IN THE WORLD CUP"?

Or if Uruguayan TV will badger their first minister if they would support Argentina in a world cup game the same way Sarah Smith and the rest of the BBC crew treat Scotland?

Or if New Zealand TV cut away from the First Minister parading her new baby and asked her "yeah but ARE YOU SUPPORTING AUSTRALIA IN THE WORLD CUP" [the inference being it would be unpatriotic to choose not to]?

Now, I know loads of people born in England who are really embarrassed by the BBC, the Tory Party, the British State and Establishment. Most of those admirable people [since Brexit] now say "Scotland, get out while you still can...and can you take me with you"...

So this next comment does not apply to the decent people of that ancient kingdom. But it sure as hell applies to the people who run the place & who influence the national collective attitudes down there...and it is this: I suspect it is only England (and Putin's Russia) that has this weird cultish obsession with insisting the neighbours all assimilate, fall into line, wave a wee flag (that will not be your flag, but, rather, must be the big neighbour next door's flag) and be good little people. No-one else and nowhere else seems to expect this of their neighbours, far less do this to their neighbours.




Time for Scotland to leave England to its own neurosis.







Think you've got enough for all of us!

[CockneyRebel]

I think Scotland have played England more than Germany have in the last few years. So again, how is it different to England rejoicing in the Germans being out?

I don't think many people claim they would support England if it weren't for the media. Some say they don't mind the players/the team particularly, but it's the media that really annoys them. Fair enough.

Wales and Ireland (all parts) want England beat at everything too... by the way. And Australia, NZ etc etc


And again... still not buying your notion that England is happy to see Scotland do well, or that they don't see as as sporting rivals. And for those that do... it doesn't mean we have to jump onboard, abandon tradition, and cheer them back!

All good fun. I don't see the issue any more than any other rivalries that get out of hand because of the odd idiot.





You obviously don't know many English folk. I have worked all over the UK and found that the majority support all the home countries except when England play them. It may not fit your agenda but thems the facts.

[One Day Soon]

I wonder if Austrian television take their lead from BBC Scotland [sic] and, instead of asking ruling politicians about the performance of the economy or the health service (which are both performing better in the small neighbour country rather than the larger neighbour country) they instead ask them "ARE YOU SUPPORTING GERMANY IN THE WORLD CUP"?

Or if Uruguayan TV will badger their first minister if they would support Argentina in a world cup game the same way Sarah Smith and the rest of the BBC crew treat Scotland?

Or if New Zealand TV cut away from the First Minister parading her new baby and asked her "yeah but ARE YOU SUPPORTING AUSTRALIA IN THE WORLD CUP" [the inference being it would be unpatriotic to choose not to]?

Now, I know loads of people born in England who are really embarrassed by the BBC, the Tory Party, the British State and Establishment. Most of those admirable people [since Brexit] now say "Scotland, get out while you still can...and can you take me with you"...

So this next comment does not apply to the decent people of that ancient kingdom. But it sure as hell applies to the people who run the place & who influence the national collective attitudes down there...and it is this: I suspect it is only England (and Putin's Russia) that has this weird cultish obsession with insisting the neighbours all assimilate, fall into line, wave a wee flag (that will not be your flag, but, rather, must be the big neighbour next door's flag) and be good little people. No-one else and nowhere else seems to expect this of their neighbours, far less do this to their neighbours.

Time for Scotland to leave England to its own neurosis.


Interesting paper tiger. :rolleyes:

[Hibbyradge]

I'm in Madrid at the moment. The headlines after the England v Panama game were all about Panama scoring their first ever goal in the world cup. Media coverage is all about Spain, any other country with a Real Madrid player and any Latin American countries. Nobody is much interested in or cares about England. I like it here very much 😂

Funny, the coverage in England is all about England.

No one here is very much interested in Spain.

Amazing, eh?

[Hibbyradge]

I think Scotland have played England more than Germany have in the last few years. So again, how is it different to England rejoicing in the Germans being out?

I don't think many people claim they would support England if it weren't for the media. Some say they don't mind the players/the team particularly, but it's the media that really annoys them. Fair enough.

Wales and Ireland (all parts) want England beat at everything too... by the way. And Australia, NZ etc etc


And again... still not buying your notion that England is happy to see Scotland do well, or that they don't see as as sporting rivals. And for those that do... it doesn't mean we have to jump onboard, abandon tradition, and cheer them back!

All good fun. I don't see the issue any more than any other rivalries that get out of hand because of the odd idiot.

I was trying to explain why journalists ask if we're supporting England, nothing else.

There was no suggestion that anyone should support England. I'm not, but I won't be distraught if they do.

However, it's definitely true that the majority of English people want the other home countries to do well, in the same way as we're happy for Wales and NI to succeed.

All my relatives are English as are pretty much all my friends and acquaintances down here.

I can assure you that they always want Scotland to win their games, apart from against them.

Why would I make that up?

[givescotlandfreedom]

I'm in Madrid at the moment. The headlines after the England v Panama game were all about Panama scoring their first ever goal in the world cup. Media coverage is all about Spain, any other country with a Real Madrid player and any Latin American countries. Nobody is much interested in or cares about England. I like it here very much 😂

If you see any Jambos tell them to get to the gents in the Irish pub and update their 'since 1902' sticker. It doesn't seem to have the desired effect now :D

[superfurryhibby]

You make a valid point, but those are all entirely separate countries. Millions of people see the UK as a single identity and the majority of English people are happy to see Scotland, Wales and NI do well so they don't understand why we don't feel the same towards them. I know that doesn't apply to everyone, but in my experience, it's by far the majority.

Just saying, "It's because of the media" doesn't make it any more understandable, and let's face it, it's not the media at all. They can be hugely annoying, no doubt about that, but if Lawrenson etc weren't on our screens, would more Scots really want England to win?

Of course there's the football rivalry aspect, but for many people in England, Scotland aren't their rivals so they see it as a one way thing unless we're playing each other.

It's more complicated than that. Just reading the posts on this forum is confirmation enough.

Edit: Just to add, Wales and NI are separate countries from Scotland too, but most Scots are happy to see them do well.


Single UK identity, lol.

Majority of English people....patronising guff.

Most of what you write is made up of assumptions that suit your own slightly tiresome agenda.

Most of what people who are ABE say on here has been genuinely explained in terms of sporting rivalry.

[Hibbyradge]

Single UK identity, lol.

Majority of English people....patronising guff.

Most of what you write is made up of assumptions that suit your own slightly tiresome agenda.

Most of what people who are ABE say on here has been genuinely explained in terms of sporting rivalry.

What's my agenda, tiresome or otherwise?

Why is it patronising to talk about the majority of English people wanting the other home nations to do well?

I wasn't discussing ABE.

[JeMeSouviens]

What's my agenda, tiresome or otherwise?

Why is it patronising to talk about the majority of English people wanting the other home nations to do well?

I wasn't discussing ABE.

Because they do it in the same way as Celtc fans do about Hibs.

[Hibbyradge]

Because they do it in the same way as Celtc fans do about Hibs.

I thought the guy was saying that I was being patronising.

I genuinely want Wales and NI to do well. I'm not being patronising.

[One Day Soon]

Single UK identity, lol.

Majority of English people....patronising guff.

Most of what you write is made up of assumptions that suit your own slightly tiresome agenda.

Most of what people who are ABE say on here has been genuinely explained in terms of sporting rivalry.


Much more like a shared identity than a single one. Or perhaps multiple identities is a better descriptor. Or multiple AND shared. :greengrin

[One Day Soon]

Because they do it in the same way as Celtc fans do about Hibs.

In my experience that is just not true JMS.

[Hibbyradge]

Much more like a shared identity than a single one. Or perhaps multiple identities is a better descriptor. Or multiple AND shared. :greengrin

Yes, shared would have been a better word.

We're all British, that sort of thing.

I don't fully share that view, but understanding it helps answer the question about journalists asking who we're going to support.

[Just Jimmy]

I was trying to explain why journalists ask if we're supporting England, nothing else.

There was no suggestion that anyone should support England. I'm not, but I won't be distraught if they do.

However, it's definitely true that the majority of English people want the other home countries to do well, in the same way as we're happy for Wales and NI to succeed.

All my relatives are English as are pretty much all my friends and acquaintances down here.

I can assure you that they always want Scotland to win their games, apart from against them.

Why would I make that up?It also lines up with my experiences in Manchester. In football and in rugby they only want us beat when it's them playing us or it directly impacts them.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[One Day Soon]

Yes, shared would have been a better word.

We're all British, that sort of thing.

I don't fully share that view, but understanding it helps answer the question about journalists asking who we're going to support.


Journalists ask question like those for the same reason they ask most other questions - to try to elicit a response that will make news, not cast light on things. ********s that are best ignored.

[JeMeSouviens]

Much more like a shared identity than a single one. Or perhaps multiple identities is a better descriptor. Or multiple AND shared. :greengrin

It used to be the case for almost all English people that English & British were practically synonymous. Much less so now, arguably since devolution and certainly since the indyref, but it still holds for a large number of them.

[One Day Soon]

It used to be the case for almost all English people that English & British were practically synonymous. Much less so now, arguably since devolution and certainly since the indyref, but it still holds for a large number of them.

Clearly Scots are equally 'fluid' in their nationality assignment: being able to feel variously Scottish, British and European.

[WhileTheChief..]

It used to be the case for almost all English people that English & British were practically synonymous. Much less so now, arguably since devolution and certainly since the indyref, but it still holds for a large number of them.

Eh? Where you getting that from?

Sorry but that’s just crap.

[JeMeSouviens]

Clearly Scots are equally 'fluid' in their nationality assignment: being able to feel variously Scottish, British and European.

Yeah but the overlaps are different. If anything we're more fluid I think.

There aren't any Scots who would interchangeably use either "Scottish/Scotland" or "British/Britain" in the same sentence meaning the same thing. Some English people do with "British/Britain" and "English/England".

[JeMeSouviens]

Eh? Where you getting that from?

Sorry but that’s just crap.

I work within the UK part of a multinational with offices in England and Scotland. When travelling with colleagues outside the UK, I notice the differences between Scots and English people in how they refer to back home when talking to non-UK people.

[WhileTheChief..]

In fairness you’ve gone from “almost all” to “some” which is probably more accurate!

[Hibbyradge]

In fairness you’ve gone from “almost all” to “some” which is probably more accurate!

It's impossible to be accurate about the proportion, but it does seem an extremely common thing.

I've found myself saying"you mean the UK" on numerous occasions.

[JeMeSouviens]

In fairness you’ve gone from “almost all” to “some” which is probably more accurate!

I think it used to be much more prevalent than it is now.

[Hibbyradge]

Journalists ask question like those for the same reason they ask most other questions - to try to elicit a response that will make news, not cast light on things. ********s that are best ignored.

Again, that's true.

I suppose I mean it helps explain why people in England would think that Scots would support England.

[weecounty hibby]

I want Wales, NI, Republic of Ireland and England to get beat when they play. It's all down to them being our closest rivals for me. Nothing against any Welsh, Irish N and S, or English folk but that's how I see it. Same as domestic football happy to see hearts celtic, Huns Aberdeen beat any day of the week as they are our biggest rivals.

[Paisley Hibby]

Funny, the coverage in England is all about England.

No one here is very much interested in Spain.

Amazing, eh?

I think the word for that is whoosh 😂

[Hibbyradge]

I think the word for that is whoosh 😂

I certainly missed the joke.

[WeeRussell]

I was trying to explain why journalists ask if we're supporting England, nothing else.

There was no suggestion that anyone should support England. I'm not, but I won't be distraught if they do.

However, it's definitely true that the majority of English people want the other home countries to do well, in the same way as we're happy for Wales and NI to succeed.

All my relatives are English as are pretty much all my friends and acquaintances down here.

I can assure you that they always want Scotland to win their games, apart from against them.

Why would I make that up?

I’m not accusing you of making it up. I just don’t think your acquaintances speak for the overall English support. Many of my friends and family are English.. some of them don’t really care either way.. I don’t recall any of them actively wanting Scotland to do well. By the same token.. they don’t speak for the English support either.

As I’ve said before. Attending international games and being in the same places as travelling English support tells me they don’t “want us to do well”.

Again though, even if every one of them wanted Scotland to win their next game, there is no necessity to return the favour.

Apologies re your first line.. I hadn’t picked up the journalist chat from previous pages.

[WeeRussell]

You obviously don't know many English folk. I have worked all over the UK and found that the majority support all the home countries except when England play them. It may not fit your agenda but thems the facts.

I obviously do know a great number of English people, as I’ve stated above. All the patronising posts in the world won’t change that.

My “agenda” being not really giving a ***k who supports which other countries at the World Cup but taking issue with people having a go at those that do want to support against their rivals. Thems the facts.

I love how so many people who have “worked across the uk” are in this almighty position to give you “facts” regarding the population and their sporting persuasions. Brilliant.

[Hibbyradge]

I’m not accusing you of making it up. I just don’t think your acquaintances speak for the overall English support. Many of my friends and family are English.. some of them don’t really care either way.. I don’t recall any of them actively wanting Scotland to do well. By the same token.. they don’t speak for the English support either.

As I’ve said before. Attending international games and being in the same places as travelling English support tells me they don’t “want us to do well”.

Again though, even if every one of them wanted Scotland to win their next game, there is no necessity to return the favour.

Apologies re your first line.. I hadn’t picked up the journalist chat from previous pages.

I'm not talking about the England travelling supporters.

Collectively, they care only for England and that's fair enough.

I'm taking about the English generally.

[WeeRussell]

I'm not talking about the England travelling supporters.

Collectively, they care only for England and that's fair enough.

I'm taking about the English generally.

Fair enough - you reckon the majority of the England (football supporting) population would support Scotland in a football match not involving England.

More than happy to agree to disagree. Especially as there’s no real point to our debate than something to do while falling asleep :)

[Hibbyradge]

Fair enough - you reckon the majority of the England population would support Scotland in a football match not involving England.

More than happy to agree to disagree. Especially as there’s no real point to our debate than something to do while falling asleep :)

😁

That is indeed my assertion and I agree that it's something to do.

Night night 👍

[PatHead]

Personally I couldn’t give a friar’s tuck about how Wales or Northern Ireland get on. I find it funny that I am meant to support England in this World Cup. To me that is like saying I should support Hearts when they play because they are from Edinburgh. Personally the main reason I get ABE is the way They set themselves up for a fall- see all the comments about we now have an easy run to the semifinals. I go on holiday next week and will be delighted not to hear them until after the tournament is over.

[Phil MaGlass]

Living in Holland a lot of my mates are English and most, if not all, support Scotland when we play, and they know I support anyone that plays against them. Dont know why it doesnt bother them to be honest, mibbe because they think its more a pity support?

[heretoday]

England won't win the World Cup. They might be in with a shout for the euros next time if they keep the nucleus of the squad together.

[Phil MaGlass]

I think (as much as it hurts to say) they have a good chance of winning the WC, good fast team with goal scoring players throughout the team, they have been good to watch(washes mooth oot wae soap and water).

[PatHead]

Living in Holland a lot of my mates are English and most, if not all, support Scotland when we play, and they know I support anyone that plays against them. Dont know why it doesnt bother them to be honest, mibbe because they think its more a pity support?

It would probably change if we actually got near to winning something. 😀

[Scouse Hibee]

Funny, the coverage in England is all about England.

No one here is very much interested in Spain.

Amazing, eh?

😂

[Scouse Hibee]

I obviously do know a great number of English people, as I’ve stated above. All the patronising posts in the world won’t change that.

My “agenda” being not really giving a ***k who supports which other countries at the World Cup but taking issue with people having a go at those that do want to support against their rivals. Thems the facts.

I love how so many people who have “worked across the uk” are in this almighty position to give you “facts” regarding the population and their sporting persuasions. Brilliant.

My experience of living in England is exactly that we wanted any of the home nations to do well. Was genuinely shocked when I realised it wasn't the same here. Now that I live here, I just accept the auld rivalry but don't understand the bitterness from some.

[ED Hibee]

My experience of living in England is exactly that we wanted any of the home nations to do well. Was genuinely shocked when I realised it wasn't the same here. Now that I live here, I just accept the auld rivalry but don't understand the bitterness from some.

I think that may have been the case back in the day. Having lived in England for last 13 years most see Scotland largely as an irrelevance with a minority wanting us to lose (altho I am based in London and recognise it may be different further north). I think why people in Scotland want ABE is that we never qualify these days so all the coverage we get is through the prism of England and it’s over the top media.

Seeing the English reaction to Germany going out (front page mocking verging on xenophobia in all of the tabloids) made me think how bad it would have been if the English hadn’t qualified for twenty years, had to watch all their football with Germans commentating and with references to German World Cup victories in every match whether they were playing or not.

Given that what Scots have to put up with it’s not too surprising that there is bitterness with some and I also think that most Scots are quite restrained given the circumstances!

[CockneyRebel]

Therein lies the paradox. I wonder what the underlying theme is with England. V Germany. Is it that some Englanders attach history to a sporting fixture or is it about the sporting competition between them?

My view is that the former takes precedence, particularly since the Germans really only rose to footballing prominence in the 1960’s. However, surely accusations of underlying racist and uber nationalist sentiment is taking things too far? Or do our resident wince merchants only apply that logic when it comes to Scottish fans?



This would take a whole book to analyse in depth but in a nutshell -
I was born in London in 1946 and grew up surrounded by friends and family who had fought in the war and had lost close pals or relatives so not surprising that there was anti-German feelings. My childhood amongst the bomb sites in London was also influenced by food rationing. I know a lot of this was replicated in Germany but I can only comment on my own experiences here and how it affected me and my pals.
All the comic book heroes (those from from the armed forces) were still fighting the "Hun", the "Bosch" and the Nazis so these anti-German feelings were nurtured to an extent.
It plodded along and faded into the background for many years until two things happened around the same time. The Germans began early morning commando raids to secure the sunbeds before the other holiday makers had woken up and then the bounders began playing some good football and apart from one incident in the mid sixties they became our footballing nemesis.

Obviously the war is long over and apart from the sunbeds it is now mainly a football rivalry. It is different from Hibs/Hearts because we recognise that the German teams have evolved and improved over the years to become favourites in any competition they enter on a National level' The club sides that have been successful are fewer than you would expect so there is not much animosity towards them. Personally I feel that most of the current feeling is down to frustration that they have been so good for so many years and we haven't. Also they are an easy, lazy target for the more obnoxious Engerland followers (Dambusters theme, 2 world wars etc and the Lenny airplane impressions) to latch onto and make them feel a little better about their own team's shortcomings.

I don't mind the football rivalry but hope that is all it will be eventually.

Sorry - rather a big nutshell.

[CockneyRebel]

I think that may have been the case back in the day. Having lived in England for last 13 years most see Scotland largely as an irrelevance with a minority wanting us to lose (altho I am based in London and recognise it may be different further north). I think why people in Scotland want ABE is that we never qualify these days so all the coverage we get is through the prism of England and it’s over the top media.

Seeing the English reaction to Germany going out (front page mocking verging on xenophobia in all of the tabloids) made me think how bad it would have been if the English hadn’t qualified for twenty years, had to watch all their football with Germans commentating and with references to German World Cup victories in every match whether they were playing or not.

Given that what Scots have to put up with it’s not too surprising that there is bitterness with some and I also think that most Scots are quite restrained given the circumstances!

Why just say English when you are quoting the English media and why are you so influenced by the media when you must know they only represent themselves?

[FilipinoHibs]

I’m not accusing you of making it up. I just don’t think your acquaintances speak for the overall English support. Many of my friends and family are English.. some of them don’t really care either way.. I don’t recall any of them actively wanting Scotland to do well. By the same token.. they don’t speak for the English support either.

As I’ve said before. Attending international games and being in the same places as travelling English support tells me they don’t “want us to do well”.

Again though, even if every one of them wanted Scotland to win their next game, there is no necessity to return the favour.

Apologies re your first line.. I hadn’t picked up the journalist chat from previous pages.

Yes worked. in London for 7 years with a load of East Enders and they all supported Scitland unless playing England. They knew we did not retrun the favour which made me fell quite embarrassed. Went to game in Euros 96 game with big bunch of them 12 English and 3 Scots. A great day out starting wuth fry up in East End. We all ended legless in Soho club. By this time the three of us were very sad and morose. Our English friends bought bottles of champagne and put Saltire flags in the bottles and came and Hugged us saying we know how you feel saying it been a great game that turned on the famous penalty. I still want England to loose every game!

[Scouse Hibee]

I think that may have been the case back in the day. Having lived in England for last 13 years most see Scotland largely as an irrelevance with a minority wanting us to lose (altho I am based in London and recognise it may be different further north). I think why people in Scotland want ABE is that we never qualify these days so all the coverage we get is through the prism of England and it’s over the top media.

Seeing the English reaction to Germany going out (front page mocking verging on xenophobia in all of the tabloids) made me think how bad it would have been if the English hadn’t qualified for twenty years, had to watch all their football with Germans commentating and with references to German World Cup victories in every match whether they were playing or not.

Given that what Scots have to put up with it’s not too surprising that there is bitterness with some and I also think that most Scots are quite restrained given the circumstances!


My experience is of Liverpool I can't vouch for the London dafties. :greengrin

On that note I will actually be in Liverpool for the Colombia game, not a moaning jock in sight I hope :wink:

[ED Hibee]

It wasn’t just the media. It was all over Twitter and many of my English in laws were taking great delight in Germany going out. And for the large part it was good natured banter and understanble given the rivalry which you explain so well above.

I agree with you re the media and I do largely ignore it but Scotland and the other home nations are the only countries in the world which has to watch all World Cup matches through the prism of another nations media and was suggesting that perhaps that explains why some become bitter.

I’m not too bitter about and will be happy for my family includIng my two boys who both support England if they are successful. Although will certainly engage in a bit of banter when they inevitably go out on penalties at some point in the knock out rounds 😀

[ED Hibee]

My experience is of Liverpool I can't vouch for the London dafties. :greengrin

On that note I will actually be in Liverpool for the Colombia game, not a moaning jock in sight I hope :wink:




Folk definitely get more reasonable the further north you go. Which is why my fellow Highland Hibees are definitely the most reasonable around. :greengrin

Enjoy the match in Liverpool although i’m sure Liverpool has more than its fair share of Scots who’ll come out of the woodwork should it all go wrong for England.

[superfurryhibby]

This would take a whole book to analyse in depth but in a nutshell -
I was born in London in 1946 and grew up surrounded by friends and family who had fought in the war and had lost close pals or relatives so not surprising that there was anti-German feelings. My childhood amongst the bomb sites in London was also influenced by food rationing. I know a lot of this was replicated in Germany but I can only comment on my own experiences here and how it affected me and my pals.
All the comic book heroes (those from from the armed forces) were still fighting the "Hun", the "Bosch" and the Nazis so these anti-German feelings were nurtured to an extent.
It plodded along and faded into the background for many years until two things happened around the same time. The Germans began early morning commando raids to secure the sunbeds before the other holiday makers had woken up and then the bounders began playing some good football and apart from one incident in the mid sixties they became our footballing nemesis.

Obviously the war is long over and apart from the sunbeds it is now mainly a football rivalry. It is different from Hibs/Hearts because we recognise that the German teams have evolved and improved over the years to become favourites in any competition they enter on a National level' The club sides that have been successful are fewer than you would expect so there is not much animosity towards them. Personally I feel that most of the current feeling is down to frustration that they have been so good for so many years and we haven't. Also they are an easy, lazy target for the more obnoxious Engerland followers (Dambusters theme, 2 world wars etc and the Lenny airplane impressions) to latch onto and make them feel a little better about their own team's shortcomings.

I don't mind the football rivalry but hope that is all it will be eventually.

Sorry - rather a big nutshell.

Good post.

[JimBHibees]

This would take a whole book to analyse in depth but in a nutshell -
I was born in London in 1946 and grew up surrounded by friends and family who had fought in the war and had lost close pals or relatives so not surprising that there was anti-German feelings. My childhood amongst the bomb sites in London was also influenced by food rationing. I know a lot of this was replicated in Germany but I can only comment on my own experiences here and how it affected me and my pals.
All the comic book heroes (those from from the armed forces) were still fighting the "Hun", the "Bosch" and the Nazis so these anti-German feelings were nurtured to an extent.
It plodded along and faded into the background for many years until two things happened around the same time. The Germans began early morning commando raids to secure the sunbeds before the other holiday makers had woken up and then the bounders began playing some good football and apart from one incident in the mid sixties they became our footballing nemesis.

Obviously the war is long over and apart from the sunbeds it is now mainly a football rivalry. It is different from Hibs/Hearts because we recognise that the German teams have evolved and improved over the years to become favourites in any competition they enter on a National level' The club sides that have been successful are fewer than you would expect so there is not much animosity towards them. Personally I feel that most of the current feeling is down to frustration that they have been so good for so many years and we haven't. Also they are an easy, lazy target for the more obnoxious Engerland followers (Dambusters theme, 2 world wars etc and the Lenny airplane impressions) to latch onto and make them feel a little better about their own team's shortcomings.

I don't mind the football rivalry but hope that is all it will be eventually.

Sorry - rather a big nutshell.

Same for Scottish people just got slightly longer memories. :greengrin

[AltheHibby]

My experience of living in England is exactly that we wanted any of the home nations to do well. Was genuinely shocked when I realised it wasn't the same here. Now that I live here, I just accept the auld rivalry but don't understand the bitterness from some.

I don't want to take this down a political route, but simply make a personal observation.

When I was younger and lived in Hampshire I only ever saw friendly rivalry and wind ups. (which I considered myself as winning because I could point out that Hibs were the first champions of the world 😁).

Since the referendum kicked off in 2012 I have often been asked why Scots hate England and have seen a little less friendliness. And this hasn't been helped by the nonsense about Andy Murray.

Having said all that, because the Argies still go on about the Falklands, where friends of mine had served, I was delighted to see them lose yesterday.

[Chic Murray]

This would take a whole book to analyse in depth but in a nutshell -
I was born in London in 1946 and grew up surrounded by friends and family who had fought in the war and had lost close pals or relatives so not surprising that there was anti-German feelings. My childhood amongst the bomb sites in London was also influenced by food rationing. I know a lot of this was replicated in Germany but I can only comment on my own experiences here and how it affected me and my pals.
All the comic book heroes (those from from the armed forces) were still fighting the "Hun", the "Bosch" and the Nazis so these anti-German feelings were nurtured to an extent.
It plodded along and faded into the background for many years until two things happened around the same time. The Germans began early morning commando raids to secure the sunbeds before the other holiday makers had woken up and then the bounders began playing some good football and apart from one incident in the mid sixties they became our footballing nemesis.

Obviously the war is long over and apart from the sunbeds it is now mainly a football rivalry. It is different from Hibs/Hearts because we recognise that the German teams have evolved and improved over the years to become favourites in any competition they enter on a National level' The club sides that have been successful are fewer than you would expect so there is not much animosity towards them. Personally I feel that most of the current feeling is down to frustration that they have been so good for so many years and we haven't. Also they are an easy, lazy target for the more obnoxious Engerland followers (Dambusters theme, 2 world wars etc and the Lenny airplane impressions) to latch onto and make them feel a little better about their own team's shortcomings.

I don't mind the football rivalry but hope that is all it will be eventually.

Sorry - rather a big nutshell.

I think that's a common thread for the post war generation, and pops up time and again in popular culture, whether it's Alf Garnett, the music of the Who, or Pink Floyd, or comedians. My generation (born early sixties) also picked up on it through osmosis, and also things like DC Thomson comics.

Football wise, the 1966 and 1974 World Cup finals were definitely replays of that. The one at Wembley even featured support from our Soviet Allies.

Because I wasn't directly affected by the war, it was probably easier to grow out of it, but kids born from 1935 to 1945, were exposed to the genuine fear of the war, and heavy propaganda from our side.

As for England, I've neve gotten over Flodden.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Fwiw had to take a look at this when I went out with an English girl around Euro 96.
Banter can cross the line.
Anyway the way I broke it down was this (remember per-devolution / Scottish Parliament)

Politics mixed with nationhood
- there are folk in NE England etc that detested / Suffered Maggie too.

A nation represented by eedgits
- Jimmy Hill and Chris Evans (esp 96) mouthpiece disliked by the English too

121 the English are fine in the main
- so as my then girlfriend asked "who do you _know_ that's English that you actually hate"?

So a mix of politics and media representation that do the Engs no favours.

So do I support them in the WC? No :)