Shades of the John Collins situation back in 2007?

[G B Young]

There's a lot of speculation flying around about what prompted Lennon's outburst and subsequent absence, but if we leave that to one side I can't help but be reminded of the way the player revolt under John Collins came at a time when the club seemed to be very much on the up and proved to be a catalyst for a long period of decline.

Until then, JC had seemed an ideal successor to Mowbray. His philosophy seemed sound, he dumped Hearts out the League Cup in only his second game in charge and went on to lift the trophy. However, what could have been an even more memorable season turned sour once it became clear the players were unhappy with the manager and we ended up making a feeble Scottish Cup semi-final exit to Dunfermline. Collins stayed on until the next season but despite a decent first quarter things fell apart very quickly.

With Parker taking the press conference today I was also reminded of the weird post-revolt press conference when Tommy Craig was muttering the answers to Collins while pretending to eat a pear!

Very different circumstances but a reminder that just when you think things are on the up and up you get hit by a curve ball.

Here's hoping the Lennon situation is resolved in a positive way and he continues to drive us forward with the style we've now become accustomed to under his management.

[Peevemor]

Nonsense! It was an apple.

[Sas_The_Hibby]

Nonsense! It was an apple.

And so the fruit wars begin.......

[Golden Bear]

There's a lot of speculation flying around about what prompted Lennon's outburst and subsequent absence, but if we leave that to one side I can't help but be reminded of the way the player revolt under John Collins came at a time when the club seemed to be very much on the up and proved to be a catalyst for a long period of decline.

Until then, JC had seemed an ideal successor to Mowbray. His philosophy seemed sound, he dumped Hearts out the League Cup in only his second game in charge and went on to lift the trophy. However, what could have been an even more memorable season turned sour once it became clear the players were unhappy with the manager and we ended up making a feeble Scottish Cup semi-final exit to Dunfermline. Collins stayed on until the next season but despite a decent first quarter things fell apart very quickly.

With Parker taking the press conference today I was also reminded of the weird post-revolt press conference when Tommy Craig was muttering the answers to Collins while pretending to eat a pear!

Very different circumstances but a reminder that just when you think things are on the up and up you get hit by a curve ball.

Here's hoping the Lennon situation is resolved in a positive way and he continues to drive us forward with the style we've now become accustomed to under his management.

:agree:


I made much the same analogy on the PM Board.

[Billy Whizz]

:agree:


I made much the same analogy on the PM Board.

I’m interested to watch the Bartley interview, just to see what he actually said, and how he said it. Will give us an sort of indication, if there’s any player unrest behind the scenes

[BILLYHIBS]

There's a lot of speculation flying around about what prompted Lennon's outburst and subsequent absence, but if we leave that to one side I can't help but be reminded of the way the player revolt under John Collins came at a time when the club seemed to be very much on the up and proved to be a catalyst for a long period of decline.

Until then, JC had seemed an ideal successor to Mowbray. His philosophy seemed sound, he dumped Hearts out the League Cup in only his second game in charge and went on to lift the trophy. However, what could have been an even more memorable season turned sour once it became clear the players were unhappy with the manager and we ended up making a feeble Scottish Cup semi-final exit to Dunfermline. Collins stayed on until the next season but despite a decent first quarter things fell apart very quickly.

With Parker taking the press conference today I was also reminded of the weird post-revolt press conference when Tommy Craig was muttering the answers to Collins while pretending to eat a pear!

Very different circumstances but a reminder that just when you think things are on the up and up you get hit by a curve ball.

Here's hoping the Lennon situation is resolved in a positive way and he continues to drive us forward with the style we've now become accustomed to under his management.
Eh?

[NAE NOOKIE]

Yup ... the comparison was made elsewhere. Very different though, Collins knew he had no budget and wasn't going to get one. He was also in AFAIK his first ever management job and instead of looking on it as a challenge on the back of which would prove he could make a silk purse out of a sows ear leading to being headhunted by bigger and richer clubs, possibly even his beloved Celtic, he chucked it in at the first sign of bother. I have little or no time for Collins as a manager League cup win or not.

Neil Lennon has shown he can manage at a high level, though he has yet to prove he can build a team on a budget like ours which will be competitive over a league season. He has shown signs of it with his signing of Ambrose and the loans of Allan, McLaren, Barker and Kamberi. But, too many loan players is a short term fix and as we are about to discover leads to a big rebuilding job in the close season when they all go home and as is inevitable at a club like Hibs you also begin to lose your best signed performers.

This is almost a watershed moment for Neil Lennon's career. At Celtic he had a budget that dwarfed almost everybody else's, but gained respect with some decent European performances. At Bolton he was in charge of a basket case club with no chance of it being saved no matter who the manager was. Now he is in charge of a stable club with a competitive budget, good facilities and good crowds .... now is his chance to show he can make a dent with an average budget and build his own team capable of doing that.

I sincerely hope he rises to the challenge and doesn't do a Collins :aok:

[Peevemor]

The main difference is that Lennon's a decent manager.

[jacomo]

:agree:


I made much the same analogy on the PM Board.



G B Young wins because his post is public.

But you both lose because I don’t think the situations are similar really.

The ‘apple’ presser was months before JC departed. And we have a much better structure around the manager these days.

[Sioux]

:agree:


I made much the same analogy on the PM Board.

Oh good for you.

[G B Young]

G B Young wins because his post is public.

But you both lose because I don’t think the situations are similar really.

The ‘apple’ presser was months before JC departed. And we have a much better structure around the manager these days.

I agree. Different circumstances and a much better structure at the club these days, but the point I was trying to make was that there's an element of similarity in that both managers were perceived as 'big time' appointments based on their playing careers and in Lennon's case the fact he'd been Celtic boss. Some of the early football played under Collins (the cup win over Hearts and a 6-1 away win at Motherwell in particular spring to mind as well as a great cup final performance v Killie) had me believing we were really going places and I was left very disillusioned with the way things eventually panned out. I hope it turns out that Lennon stays with us for years to come and leads us to ever greater success, but as I said it's remarkable how quickly things can turn just when you think they can't get much better.

[Ilovehibs]

I’m interested to watch the Bartley interview, just to see what he actually said, and how he said it. Will give us an sort of indication, if there’s any player unrest behind the scenes

Available to watch now through Hibs twitter. Very interesting. Marv more than making his point while remaining professional and focussed on the good of the club.

[overdrive]

Available to watch now through Hibs twitter. Very interesting. Marv more than making his point while remaining professional and focussed on the good of the club.

Linked to the topic of this thread, the bit where he’s continually questioned about Lennon’s whereabouts reminded me of the Scott Brown “Uh dunno” interview about the Collins revolt. “We’ve not seen him since Wednesday” repeated several times over.

[Delboy4]

Available to watch now through Hibs twitter. Very interesting. Marv more than making his point while remaining professional and focussed on the good of the club.

Listening to big Marv, I think that he must be the strongest man in the squad so decided to take the press head on. He could be on the way out as he was quite short with the questions asked. He shouldn’t have said as much as he did about not seeing the gaffer since the game.
He said all the players are backing each other. You see Paul Hanlons reaction to Lennon when he was substituted, he wasn’t happy with what the gaffer shouted at him!
The players DID NOT PLAY on Wednesday, the question I have to ask, did something happen BEFORE the game?

The reason behind my question - not one player had PASS marks. Their mind seemed to be somewhere else!!

From a team playing sublime football to not being able to find a pass, something is wrong!

[TelaStella]

Things went to the **** with J Collins because we sold Brown, Whittaker, Thomson, Sproule and Killan, cashed it all in while hardly reinvesting any of it in the team and got rid of Michael Stewart ( very intelligent player). We then replaced them all with Brian Kerr, Gathuessi, Alan O’Brien and Morais yet unbelievably still managed to stay unbeaten for the first spell of the season and go top of the league thanks to a win at Ibrox. We’ve all heard the talk about Collins and that’s between him and the then squad but it’s harsh to call the man a poor manager.


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[Greenworld]

Things went to the **** with J Collins because we sold Brown, Whittaker, Thomson, Sproule and Killan, cashed it all in while hardly reinvesting any of it in the team and got rid of Michael Stewart ( very intelligent player). We then replaced them all with Brian Kerr, Gathuessi, Alan O’Brien and Morais yet unbelievably still managed to stay unbeaten for the first spell of the season and go top of the league thanks to a win at Ibrox. We’ve all heard the talk about Collins and that’s between him and the then squad but it’s harsh to call the man a poor manager.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkRemember the club were in huge debt back then the money went to paying debt and building the training complex.

We are a different beast now transfer fees coming in will go into the budget for players so In theory Neil lennon could have the biggest budget in years.

Huge average crowds ...more money
Transfer cash ...more money
League position finish ...a lot more money

Hibs are in a good place financially and LD has already stated that all funds will be going towards the football side of the club rather than infrastructure

It's not all doom and gloom

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[BILLYHIBS]

2007 was a team rebelling against a poor man Manager. 2018 was a very good and rightly frustrated Manager rebelling against a poor and very disappointing inept team performance.Simple As.I fail to see the similiarties between the two scenarios. Lenny has gone on record as saying he does not know what his budget is for next season as we are still on this season. According to his side kick Gary Parker he is staying and it was all heat of the moment which iunder the circumstances taking into account the importance of the game the poor result and disappointing team selection in my opinion is understandable. Let’s just draw a line under it and move on.

As a wee side issue I felt his behaviour on the night was a bit weird . When interviewed before the game he seemed to imply that he could pick any selection and team formation from this group of players to beat the Hearts. I felt showing an arrogance and disrespect for Hearts.When interviewed directly after the game he did not seem to appreciate that barring a miracle we had finished fourth.

GGTTH

:nlgwa

[Jim44]

2007 was a team rebelling against a poor man Manager. 2018 was a very good and rightly frustrated Manager rebelling against a poor and very disappointing inept team performance.Simple As.I fail to see the similiarties between the two scenarios. Lenny has gone on record as saying he does not know what his budget is for next season as we are still on this season. According to his side kick Gary Parker he is staying and it was all heat of the moment which iunder the circumstances taking into account the importance of the game the poor result and disappointing team selection in my opinion is understandable. Let’s just draw a line under it and move on.

As a wee side issue I felt his behaviour on the night was a bit weird . When interviewed before the game he seemed to imply that he could pick any selection and team formation from this group of players to beat the Hearts. I felt showing an arrogance and disrespect for Hearts.When interviewed directly after the game he did not seem to appreciate that barring a miracle we had finished fourth.

GGTTH

:nlgwa

He also said that he didn’t even know the budget for this season. Some folk here might give perfectly logical reasons for him to say that, but to me it rang of discontent with the management.

[jacomo]

He also said that he didn’t even know the budget for this season. Some folk here might give perfectly logical reasons for him to say that, but to me it rang of discontent with the management.


He’s also contradicting himself. He’s said repeatedly that he has been backed by the board and they’ve done a great job.