Winter break

[Diclonius]

Yet another reason why it was a farce to reintroduce it in the first place. You never actually know WHEN Winter is going to happen in this country and playing 1000000000 midweek fixtures after the break when it's STILL WINTER is ridiculous.

[Mikey09]

If it was sensibly done it would be beneficial to clubs. However there is absolutely nowt sensible about the structure of this break.! We cram games in over the Christmas period, have a 3 week break and then play 5 games in 13 days?!!! It's counter productive. You end up with players injured through fatigue, mentally drained through playing huge games in such a short time.

Either have the break and come back into a more sensible schedule or don't have it and continue with a game a week. It's utterly baffling.

[J-C]

A good argument to have our season the same as the Scandinavian countries, March/April - November.

[LaMotta]

The weather has been ideal for Football in December and January.

Tomorrow is March, and we will be knee deep in snow.

If anything, the beast from the east confirms how stupid an idea "summer" football (March-Nov) is.

[J-C]

The weather has been ideal for Football in December and January.

Tomorrow is March, and we will be knee deep in snow.

If anything, the beast from the east confirms how stupid an idea "summer" football (March-Nov) is.


Most of the Scandinavian countries don't start till late March, early April when the worst of the weather is gone, January/February is notorious for bad weather.

[lucky]

The winter break was introduced to give players a mid season break more than the weather conditions

[Ozyhibby]

It certainly helped us this season. No complaints from me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sir David Gray]

A good argument to have our season the same as the Scandinavian countries, March/April - November.

Under our current season schedule of mid July-mid May, if you wanted to have a "summer" season, it would have to run from around March-January or something along those lines so I don't see the point in changing anything.

The only way around that would be to change the scheduling of the season and have more games packed into less months or have less games overall but if we were to have exactly the same length of season that we have just now then we're going to have to play during winter, regardless of when the season starts and ends.

[Alan62]

Scotland doesn't need a winter break. Run the season start of August to end of May. If games get cancelled when there actually is snow or other bad weather (anytime from November to early April) then there's plenty time to reschedule games. This year's hectic schedules either side of the break were a complete farce.

[jodjam]

The winter break was introduced to give players a mid season break more than the weather conditions

Correct and I’m all for the break

[Famous Fiver]

I remember an Intertoto Cup Tie in July played in atrocious conditions. I am sure if it had been a local fixture it would have been called off.

Extended summer break anyone?

[Pretty Boy]

The winter break was introduced to give players a mid season break more than the weather conditions

The problem was we crammed a whole load of games into the 2 weeks before and 2 weeks after to make room for the break. Was it 3 games in 7 days then 5 in 13 we played or something almost as ridiculous?

[heretoday]

Footballers don't deserve a break. They have a long summer break. Take them to the zoo if they want a day out. Or the cinema.

[J-C]

The problem was we crammed a whole load of games into the 2 weeks before and 2 weeks after to make room for the break. Was it 3 games in 7 days then 5 in 13 we played or something almost as ridiculous?


:agree: Yeo and how many injuries did we pick up due to too many games in a short space.

[lamtarra]

I would rather go to Easter Rd to watch games through the summer when the weather is at its best. For me it’s not a question of games being postponed etc. but rather having to spectate when the weather is miserable, freezing or both. Whilst recognising that pleasant weather in Scotland isn’t guaranteed at any time of the year I’d rather take my chance with summer spectating and a winter close season. Also Scottish football wouldn’t be competing with the English tv offering for part of the year so that might increase revenue/prominence.

[leither17]

I remember an Intertoto Cup Tie in July played in atrocious conditions. I am sure if it had been a local fixture it would have been called off.

Extended summer break anyone?

Was lovely warm rain though

[Nevi_SOL]

If we were going to have a summer league season ticket sales would be over the Christmas period aswell

[Haymaker]

I would rather go to Easter Rd to watch games through the summer when the weather is at its best. For me it’s not a question of games being postponed etc. but rather having to spectate when the weather is miserable, freezing or both. Whilst recognising that pleasant weather in Scotland isn’t guaranteed at any time of the year I’d rather take my chance with summer spectating and a winter close season. Also Scottish football wouldn’t be competing with the English tv offering for part of the year so that might increase revenue/prominence.

That would be the "summer season" that starts in February and ends in December?

[lamtarra]

That would be the "summer season" that starts in February and ends in December?

Clearly the football season doesn’t only cover the 3 months of summer. Lets assume there is a 2 month break I would rather have that some time in the winter.

[LaMotta]

That would be the "summer season" that starts in February and ends in December?

Exactly! Our biggest crowds over the past 5 years have been in December, January and February.

Total myth that we would also suddenly get a better TV deal in the summer months.

[Haymaker]

Clearly the football season doesn’t only cover the 3 months of summer. Lets assume there is a 2 month break I would rather have that some time in the winter.

You'd still have to play in October, November and December which would be an awful time to end the season. The pitches wouldn't recover in time (or at all) for a March start.

[jgl07]

The winter break was introduced to give players a mid season break more than the weather conditions

No it was introduced to allow Celtic and Sevco to play friendly matches out east.

The idea that the season in Scotland could run from March to November is totally ludicrous.

At the moment it runs from early Mid-July to the end of May. So that’s June and half of July with no matches. How the hell is ten and a half months of football going to fit into eight months?

That doesn’t take account of the need to shut down for a month every second year for the World Cup and European Championship.

Totally delusional.

[lamtarra]

Exactly! Our biggest crowds over the past 5 years have been in December, January and February.

Total myth that we would also suddenly get a better TV deal in the summer months.

A better tv deal is a secondary consideration for me in any event but if you know it’s a myth fair enough. Difficult to see how you can compare average crowds in the months you refer to with summer football months that haven’t been tried. In any event my post was personal to my viewing experience although again I recognise that gates are important. I don’t see gates being hugely down in the summer months but of course I am speculating about that.

[LaMotta]

A better tv deal is a secondary consideration for me in any event but if you know it’s a myth fair enough. Difficult to see how you can compare average crowds in the months you refer to with summer football months that haven’t been tried. In any event my post was personal to my viewing experience although again I recognise that gates are important. I don’t see gates being hugely down in the summer months but of course I am speculating about that.



The only month that hasnt been tried in my lifetime is June! Crowds in the league cup in July last year were pathetic (yes I know its the league cup, but if summer was such a draw youd think theyd be better).

On the Tv deal, I think we'd end up with a worse deal if we moved to summer football. Look at the Irish league. Where can you see that on the telly these days?

[lamtarra]

The only month that hasnt been tried in my lifetime is June! Crowds in the league cup in July last year were pathetic (yes I know its the league cup, but if summer was such a draw youd think theyd be better).

On the Tv deal, I think we'd end up with a worse deal if we moved to summer football. Look at the Irish league. Where can you see that on the telly these days?

Yeah the league cup games didn’t even benefit from cup top up season tickets attending this year. I reckon a big league game would get roughly the same but that’s a guess obviously.

Surely we’re in a league that’s still a bigger draw than the Irish League?

[Ryan69]

A March till November league would probably be very good for Scottish football.

I mean not many leagues to compete with for a football fix come summer!

More countries would probably buy the rights for that reason alone...

[Haymaker]

A March till November league would probably be very good for Scottish football.

I mean not many leagues to compete with for a football fix come summer!

More countries would probably buy the rights for that reason alone...

I don't see many countries buying rights for a summer Scottish football league that would breach a gap of 6-8 weeks every other year.

I grew up in England, the closest market to sell it, the vast majority of football fans wouldn't watch it, they have other interests in the summer along with a pretty deeply held poor opinion about Scottish football that would worsen if we switched to summer.

Would the Spanish buy it? The French? The Chinese?

I'm all for improving the Scottish game but summer football is not the answer.

[HibernianJK]

The festive period wouldn’t be the same without football IMO. Fixture list needs restructuring so that the winter break isn’t necessary.

[Sir David Gray]

A March till November league would probably be very good for Scottish football.

I mean not many leagues to compete with for a football fix come summer!

More countries would probably buy the rights for that reason alone...

At the moment the league season runs from the beginning of August to the middle of May. If the season was to start in March, it would need to end in December, unless you were to pack more games into a shorter period of time.

Under the current structure you would also have the League Cup group games starting in February.

[LaMotta]

A March till November league would probably be very good for Scottish football.

I mean not many leagues to compete with for a football fix come summer!

More countries would probably buy the rights for that reason alone...

Who would buy the rights though!? How many people from other countries would be lapping up a Scottish football fix this summer when there is a world cup on?! Naebody!

[Sir David Gray]

Who would buy the rights though!? How many people from other countries would be lapping up a Scottish football fix this summer when there is a world cup on?! Naebody!

Trying to promote the changing of when our league season starts and ends on the basis that more people will buy the TV rights to Scottish football just because no other league would be playing at that time of year probably isn't the best way to try and sell Scottish football.

[Haymaker]

Trying to promote the changing of when our league season starts and ends on the basis that more people will buy the TV rights to Scottish football just because no other league would be playing at that time of year probably isn't the best way to try and sell Scottish football.

Correct.

[lamtarra]

Trying to promote the changing of when our league season starts and ends on the basis that more people will buy the TV rights to Scottish football just because no other league would be playing at that time of year probably isn't the best way to try and sell Scottish football.

Yes that’s why, for me, it’s a secondary nonetheless relevant issue. The opportunity to watch a match when the weather is statistically most clement is the main attraction for me.

[Big_Franck]

This thread is full of the same old arguments against summer football. I've never heard anyone suggest that summer football would cure all of our problems, yet we always get people picking one issue with it as the reason not to change. Summer football is not without its issues but would it be better than the current set up of playing right throughout the winter in scotland? Absolutely.

[Haymaker]

This thread is full of the same old arguments against summer football. I've never heard anyone suggest that summer football would cure all of our problems, yet we always get people picking one issue with it as the reason not to change. Summer football is not without its issues but would it be better than the current set up of playing right throughout the winter in scotland? Absolutely.

How would it be better?

[Sir David Gray]

This thread is full of the same old arguments against summer football. I've never heard anyone suggest that summer football would cure all of our problems, yet we always get people picking one issue with it as the reason not to change. Summer football is not without its issues but would it be better than the current set up of playing right throughout the winter in scotland? Absolutely.

I'm not so sure it would be. You criticise people who hold the opposite point of view to yourself because apparently nobody has put forward any fresh arguments against summer football but then you don't offer any actual reasons for why you think summer football would be better apart from saying that it "absolutely" would be better than the current set up.

[One Day]

Trying to promote the changing of when our league season starts and ends on the basis that more people will buy the TV rights to Scottish football just because no other league would be playing at that time of year probably isn't the best way to try and sell Scottish football.

That's true.

[hibsbollah]

Too much of this debate is around televised top flight football, and how summer football would or wouldn't work for scheduling or logistical reasons.

It makes more sense to examine it for schools and boys club level, when players are learning technical skills and benefit most from lack of call-offs and improved playing surfaces.

[Eyrie]

How would it be better?

One reason? The weather wouldn't be as bad as it is just now. And if we did have heavy snow in March then there would be the rest of the year to catch up.

[Big_Franck]

How would it be better?

Two main reasons for me. It would mean that on average the playing surfaces would be better and more conducive to actually playing football. It would also mean that on average it was a better experience for supporters both in the stadium and fans (both home and away fans) travelling to and from the game.

This is similar to the Hampden debate for me. The main reason to stick with the current set up seems to be tradition.

If we had never played football in this country before and were due to start our first league season in 2018, when would we have our season? Anyone that suggested that we don't play in the summer, but should instead play this outdoor sport in the coldest, harshest months of the year would need their head looked at IMO.

[Big_Franck]

I'm not so sure it would be. You criticise people who hold the opposite point of view to yourself because apparently nobody has put forward any fresh arguments against summer football but then you don't offer any actual reasons for why you think summer football would be better apart from saying that it "absolutely" would be better than the current set up.

I don't. But it does baffle me when people suggest we shouldn't change because the alternative isn't perfect. The only question should be is it better than the current set up? And to me summer football clearly is.

Also, the World Cup/Euros being in the summer isn't a major obstacle to Scottish summer football. You're lucky if half a dozen Scottish based players ever play in these tournaments anyway.

[Sir David Gray]

I don't. But it does baffle me when people suggest we shouldn't change because the alternative isn't perfect. The only question should be is it better than the current set up? And to me summer football clearly is.

Also, the World Cup/Euros being in the summer isn't a major obstacle to Scottish summer football. You're lucky if half a dozen Scottish based players ever play in these tournaments anyway.

That's a not a very positive outlook.

Surely if the aim of summer football is to improve the overall standard of our game then one of the direct consequences of that is that Scotland will hopefully get better at football and playing in major tournaments will become a regular occurrence again.

What would we do then?

[Big_Franck]

That's a not a very positive outlook.

Surely if the aim of summer football is to improve the overall standard of our game then one of the direct consequences of that is that Scotland will hopefully get better at football and playing in major tournaments will become a regular occurrence again.

What would we do then?

It's the reality, unfortunately. I'm a big Scotland fan that goes to a lot of our home games, but I can't see us qualifying anytime soon.

If we do qualify for a tournament again in 2032 then we can surely do whatever the Scandinavian countries do. It'd probably involve bringing the season forward a month, or extending it by a month. Either way, having to do that once every 20 years is hardly a major obstacle.

[lamtarra]

Yeah the main attraction for me is utilising the best of the weather for the best possible experience at the ground primarily for climatic and pitch conditions. I’ll go and watch Hibs in the harshest of weather because that’s when the games are scheduled at the moment but I’d rather being doing it when the days are at their kindest.

As for the World Cup/Euros clubs the league could adjust in the same way as the upcoming winter World Cup in 2022. In fact now I think of it 2022 might be the ideal opportunity to see what league games in the current close season might be like.

[Sir David Gray]

It's the reality, unfortunately. I'm a big Scotland fan that goes to a lot of our home games, but I can't see us qualifying anytime soon.

If we do qualify for a tournament again in 2032 then we can surely do whatever the Scandinavian countries do. It'd probably involve bringing the season forward a month, or extending it by a month. Either way, having to do that once every 20 years is hardly a major obstacle.

If one of the reasons of changing our season is to improve the fortunes of Scottish football and drive up standards, I would like to think we would qualify for a major tournament more than once every 20 years.

We managed it in the 70s, 80s and 90s when we qualified for 8 major tournaments in 24 years between 1974 and 1998 so why can't we aim for that again?

[jgl07]

One reason? The weather wouldn't be as bad as it is just now. And if we did have heavy snow in March then there would be the rest of the year to catch up.

If Scotland played a Summer season it would have to start in March at the latest even if it ran through to December.

We are currently in March.

[lamtarra]

If Scotland played a Summer season it would have to start in March at the latest even if it ran through to December.

We are currently in March.

Wanting to utilise the best days climate wise in the summer obviously doesn’t mean that all bad weather can be avoided. In Scotland that panacea is not possible for obvious reasons. However, playing during the current close season and having a new close season some time in winter minimises the number of miserable days and maximises the number of pleasant days (statistically).

[Haymaker]

Two main reasons for me. It would mean that on average the playing surfaces would be better and more conducive to actually playing football. It would also mean that on average it was a better experience for supporters both in the stadium and fans (both home and away fans) travelling to and from the game.

We would have to play February to December meaning the pitches would get torn up at the end of the season yet be very difficult to get ready for the start of the season without big investment in the uv lights.

We'd still have to travel to games in October, November, December, February, March so the experience for the fan would be the same except for what? 8 game in June/July?

[lamtarra]

We would have to play February to December meaning the pitches would get torn up at the end of the season yet be very difficult to get ready for the start of the season without big investment in the uv lights.

We'd still have to travel to games in October, November, December, February, March so the experience for the fan would be the same except for what? 8 game in June/July?

The close season this year is one day shy of eight weeks. I assume by your question you are accepting that the fan experience would be enhanced. That 2 month hiatus would/could cover more than 8 games but even if it was 8 games as you suggest I’d prefer them in the period referred to for the reasons already articulated.

[jgl07]

We would have to play February to December meaning the pitches would get torn up at the end of the season yet be very difficult to get ready for the start of the season without big investment in the uv lights.

We'd still have to travel to games in October, November, December, February, March so the experience for the fan would be the same except for what? 8 game in June/July?

Apart from when there was a World Cup or European Championship on! Live football being beamed on free to air television for a month or more two years out of four. Many matches would have to be cancelled and those that went ahead would have poor attendances.

That is before you factor in those who go on holiday over this period and would not buy a season ticket as a consequence.

Thank goodness those who run the game have more sense than to fall for this stupid idea.

Even Russia have abandoned a Summer season. Who else runs with it apart from the League of Ireland? I can think of Sweden, Norway, Iceland and Finland. Maybe the Baltic States and the Faroes?

[PatHead]

Does anyone know how attendances have changed since Rugby League moved to summer or how much the tv deal is worth?

[lamtarra]

Apart from when there was a World Cup or European Championship on! Live football being beamed on free to air television for a month or more two years out of four. Many matches would have to be cancelled and those that went ahead would have poor attendances.

That is before you factor in those who go on holiday over this period and would not buy a season ticket as a consequence.

Thank goodness those who run the game have more sense than to fall for this stupid idea.

Even Russia have abandoned a Summer season. Who else runs with it apart from the League of Ireland? I can think of Sweden, Norway, Iceland and Finland. Maybe the Baltic States and the Faroes?

From a cursory glance at that font of all knowledge Wikipedia it looks like South American countries may do summer football but not sure if it’s ever cold and miserable in any parts of Brazil, for example so different considearations may apply. Most of the countries you mention that have adopted it are on roughly similar latitudes to us and I think Ukraine may also have a break. Pretty sure the Russians have a long winter break still.... they were going on about it when Zenit played Celtic. It’s been a while since I’ve encountered anyone who holds those who run our game in such high esteem.

[ian cruise]

I remember an Intertoto Cup Tie in July played in atrocious conditions. I am sure if it had been a local fixture it would have been called off.

Extended summer break anyone?

Elfsborg?

[Smartie]

Our teams would do much better in Europe.

That would make us feel a lot better about ourselves.

Competing on a level playing field with nations of a similar climate would help us.

The 2 things I think we need to change most in Scotland are to get more kids playing more regularly, and to have more of our top players playing regularly in Europe.

Summer football delivers on both these fronts. I'm open to the idea, if not completely sold. The main argument against it is that winters would be especially pish without football.

[Sir David Gray]

From a cursory glance at that font of all knowledge Wikipedia it looks like South American countries may do summer football but not sure if it’s ever cold and miserable in any parts of Brazil, for example so different considearations may apply. Most of the countries you mention that have adopted it are on roughly similar latitudes to us and I think Ukraine may also have a break. Pretty sure the Russians have a long winter break still.... they were going on about it when Zenit played Celtic. It’s been a while since I’ve encountered anyone who holds those who run our game in such high esteem.

Brazil's football season runs from May to December which, due to Brazil being almost entirely in the southern hemisphere, means that their off-season is during their summer months.

[Clarence]

Most of the Scandinavian countries don't start till late March, early April when the worst of the weather is gone, January/February is notorious for bad weather.

I think this would help reinvigorate Scottish football. Let the players play on decent surfaces and in temperatures that are more likely to encourage new fans to attend.

[ancient hibee]

Does anyone know how attendances have changed since Rugby League moved to summer or how much the tv deal is worth?
People used to have an interest in Rugby League which was often on the TV of course,do they now?Don’t think so.Their teams were well known,couldn’t even tell you who the leading teams are now.Maybe this has been caused by the change from a winter sport .Don’t know if you had an interest but if so the fact that you have to ask the question gives you the answer.

[Haymaker]

I think this would help reinvigorate Scottish football. Let the players play on decent surfaces and in temperatures that are more likely to encourage new fans to attend.

The off season being over Jan/Feb would mean we would have to invest heavily on hybrid pitches and lighting rigs to help the grass grow and repair the surface. The fact that we'd start and end the season at a time when the grass doesn't grow. Not 100% sold that it would improve surfaces more than they are already.

[PatHead]

People used to have an interest in Rugby League which was often on the TV of course,do they now?Don’t think so.Their teams were well known,couldn’t even tell you who the leading teams are now.Maybe this has been caused by the change from a winter sport .Don’t know if you had an interest but if so the fact that you have to ask the question gives you the answer.

I don't have an interest and have never really followed it. Just wondered if clubs had benefited from the change to summer football. It was the only real comparison I could think of.