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NAE NOOKIE
14-02-2018, 12:16 PM
What do folk think, will attendances for Scotland games get bigger?

I know for a fact that if Scotland games were played at Murrayfield I would go to far more of them. I don't know how true it is, but its sort of perceived that Scotland tends to attract more physical support from other parts of Scotland than it does from the Glasgow area with supporters of the Ugly sisters showing far less enthusiasm for the national team than they do their club sides.

They aren't alone in that if threads on the subject on here are anything to go by, but I still think that fans of the east coast and central belt clubs like Motherwell for example are far more likely to go to Scotland matches per head of support than the uglies.

Even though the trip to Edinburgh from Aberdeen or Dundee isn't much different than it is to Glasgow from those cities, do folk think that psychologically because Edinburgh is on the east coast far more folk from Aberdeen, Dundee, Perth and the Fife towns would go to Scotland games .... I'm absolutely certain far more folk from the Borders would.

The big question is will fans actually based in that hotbed of football fervour Glasgow who do go to Scotland games and who are used to jumping on a local bus or the 'shoogle' to go the few miles to Hampden be as enthusiastic if they actually have to make the same effort east coast fans have had to for all these decades?

WeeRussell
14-02-2018, 12:23 PM
I predict there will be a few people along shortly to tell you it won't make any difference to them as they have absolutely no interest in the national team and would close the curtains if they were playing in their garden :greengrin

In answer to the OP though, nope... I am already keen to go to Scotland matches (competitive ones) in Glasgow, and this won't change in either direction should they switch to Murrayfield.

Still not in favour though.

Sammy7nil
14-02-2018, 12:28 PM
If the team are winning and we play in a bigger stadium then yes - if they are not winning then crowds wont increase.

Ozyhibby
14-02-2018, 12:29 PM
I would def be going if they are at Murrayfield along with my wife and two boys but there may be a Glasgow family who stop going to cancel us out. The important advantage Murrayfield has over Hampden is access to transport. Haymarket being just along the road will allow fans from all over Scotland to get home reasonably sharply after games. That is a big deal if you have work or the kids have school in the morning.


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Kato
14-02-2018, 12:30 PM
I hope they don't move to Murrayfield as Hearts will take the rent given they built and own it.

JeMeSouviens
14-02-2018, 12:32 PM
Games that would sell out will obv get bigger crowds but I’m not sure that matches that would get 30k at Hampden would get any more at Murrayfield.

I heard Michael Stewart on the radio recently suggesting they rebuild Hampden as a decent 35k seater and use it and Murrayfield depending on demand. Good idea if there was any money around.

TAHibby
14-02-2018, 12:39 PM
I've got a feeling the Edinburgh rugger crowd that regularly attend murrayfield for their games would be tempted to also attend for national football matches. Though I've no idea what that crossover is like at the moment

HibeeMassive
14-02-2018, 12:44 PM
As much as I moan about Hampden, I'd definitely miss our bus trips to Semis and Finals. :flag:

Might entice me back along to Scotland games, as I've lost interest in going since the matches started being at all times of the week though. I'm not too fussed in all honesty, but I do hope if we stay at Hampden that they invest some cash in upgrading it.

CropleyWasGod
14-02-2018, 12:46 PM
I've got a feeling the Edinburgh rugger crowd that regularly attend murrayfield for their games would be tempted to also attend for national football matches. Though I've no idea what that crossover is like at the moment

I'd say that it would be more likely on the grounds of proximity. On the flip side, west-based football fans might be less inclined to make the trip.

Ozyhibby
14-02-2018, 12:47 PM
I've got a feeling the Edinburgh rugger crowd that regularly attend murrayfield for their games would be tempted to also attend for national football matches. Though I've no idea what that crossover is like at the moment

Part of murrayfields pitch to the SFA was that they have an in house marketing team which is one of the best going and they felt strongly they could sell out every Scotland game. Considering the crowds they get for rugby, which is basically crap, I’m inclined to believe them.


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Nameless
14-02-2018, 12:53 PM
I'd attend Scotland matches if they were hosted in Edinburgh. Getting to and from Hampden for a Fri night match is an massive ball ache.

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greenlad
14-02-2018, 01:01 PM
More to the point, will there be a "Hibs end" and a "Hearts end"

Ozyhibby
14-02-2018, 01:02 PM
More to the point, will there be a "Hibs end" and a "Hearts end"

Just a Hibs end. We don’t want racism at the new national stadium. [emoji6]


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stantonhibby
14-02-2018, 01:06 PM
More to the point, will there be a "Hibs end" and a "Hearts end"

Just a 'Hibs end'. You have to get to semis and finals regularly before you get your own end.

BroxburnHibee
14-02-2018, 01:06 PM
They won't choose Murrayfield

Nicho87
14-02-2018, 01:31 PM
To many nostalgic bores will not allow this to happen

NAE NOOKIE
14-02-2018, 01:41 PM
They won't choose Murrayfield

As it is I think you are right. IMO Murrayfield is simply being used as a bargaining chip by the SFA ... they know that if its to remain viable Hampden cant afford to lose Scotland games or the Scottish cup semis and final and with the credible threat of an alternative option to put on the table they should have Queens Park's baws in a vice .... you would think even the SFA couldn't screw up a hand where they hold all the aces .... but if anybody can its them.

Whatever happens the upshot of this should be a partnership between the SFA and Queens Park, not just a landlord and tenant arrangement and both parties should work together to utterly transform the stadium .... as things stand both parties should be ashamed of the way we have been left trailing in the dust of England, Wales and the Republic of Ireland when it comes to our so called 'national stadium'

zitelli62
14-02-2018, 02:14 PM
Do the good people of Edinburgh really want a rangers celtic cup final here let them keep there bigoted songs and thoughts where they belong.

Crazyhorse
14-02-2018, 02:17 PM
More to the point, will there be a "Hibs end" and a "Hearts end"

Hearts will give up their end to Sevco...

BroxburnHibee
14-02-2018, 02:22 PM
As it is I think you are right. IMO Murrayfield is simply being used as a bargaining chip by the SFA ... they know that if its to remain viable Hampden cant afford to lose Scotland games or the Scottish cup semis and final and with the credible threat of an alternative option to put on the table they should have Queens Park's baws in a vice .... you would think even the SFA couldn't screw up a hand where they hold all the aces .... but if anybody can its them.

Whatever happens the upshot of this should be a partnership between the SFA and Queens Park, not just a landlord and tenant arrangement and both parties should work together to utterly transform the stadium .... as things stand both parties should be ashamed of the way we have been left trailing in the dust of England, Wales and the Republic of Ireland when it comes to our so called 'national stadium'

Yep basically that's it but Glasgow City Council won't want the loss to their economy either and the SFA know it.

Hampden needs rebuilt but they want others to help pay for it.

I've said it before - it's a shakedown.

Keith_M
14-02-2018, 02:49 PM
I think there was a survey a few years back among Scotland supporters that attend home games, that the highest represented club support was Rangers. The second highest was Celtc, but significantly smaller.

However, the percentages of fans supporting either of those clubs was lower than that of a similar survey in the 70s.


Take from that what you will.

Clerie Green
14-02-2018, 03:02 PM
I predict there will be a few people along shortly to tell you it won't make any difference to them as they have absolutely no interest in the national team and would close the curtains if they were playing in their garden :greengrin

In answer to the OP though, nope... I am already keen to go to Scotland matches (competitive ones) in Glasgow, and this won't change in either direction should they switch to Murrayfield.

Still not in favour though.


it won’t make any difference to me , I have absolutely no interest in the national team and would close my cell door if they were in the exercise yard . :na na:

SirDavidsNapper
14-02-2018, 06:35 PM
What do folk think, will attendances for Scotland games get bigger?

I know for a fact that if Scotland games were played at Murrayfield I would go to far more of them. I don't know how true it is, but its sort of perceived that Scotland tends to attract more physical support from other parts of Scotland than it does from the Glasgow area with supporters of the Ugly sisters showing far less enthusiasm for the national team than they do their club sides.

They aren't alone in that if threads on the subject on here are anything to go by, but I still think that fans of the east coast and central belt clubs like Motherwell for example are far more likely to go to Scotland matches per head of support than the uglies.

Even though the trip to Edinburgh from Aberdeen or Dundee isn't much different than it is to Glasgow from those cities, do folk think that psychologically because Edinburgh is on the east coast far more folk from Aberdeen, Dundee, Perth and the Fife towns would go to Scotland games .... I'm absolutely certain far more folk from the Borders would.

The big question is will fans actually based in that hotbed of football fervour Glasgow who do go to Scotland games and who are used to jumping on a local bus or the 'shoogle' to go the few miles to Hampden be as enthusiastic if they actually have to make the same effort east coast fans have had to for all these decades?

Yes. Easier to get to for fans from the north which make up a huge chunk of the tartan army

CLASS OF 72 -73
14-02-2018, 08:18 PM
Scotland must be the only country in Europe where the capital is not the city of choice for the national football stadium.

North America and Australia are obvious exceptions elsewhere.

vuefrom1875
14-02-2018, 09:56 PM
What do folk think, will attendances for Scotland games get bigger?

I know for a fact that if Scotland games were played at Murrayfield I would go to far more of them. I don't know how true it is, but its sort of perceived that Scotland tends to attract more physical support from other parts of Scotland than it does from the Glasgow area with supporters of the Ugly sisters showing far less enthusiasm for the national team than they do their club sides.

They aren't alone in that if threads on the subject on here are anything to go by, but I still think that fans of the east coast and central belt clubs like Motherwell for example are far more likely to go to Scotland matches per head of support than the uglies.

Even though the trip to Edinburgh from Aberdeen or Dundee isn't much different than it is to Glasgow from those cities, do folk think that psychologically because Edinburgh is on the east coast far more folk from Aberdeen, Dundee, Perth and the Fife towns would go to Scotland games .... I'm absolutely certain far more folk from the Borders would.

The big question is will fans actually based in that hotbed of football fervour Glasgow who do go to Scotland games and who are used to jumping on a local bus or the 'shoogle' to go the few miles to Hampden be as enthusiastic if they actually have to make the same effort east coast fans have had to for all these decades?

No danger they'll move from weggieland.

Phil MaGlass
15-02-2018, 05:14 PM
I was at the Scotland v France game on Sun, whit a weekend, M,field is really quick to get into, you can use any gates on the outside perimeter and you just stroll round all the pie and hamburger stands then up tae yir seat, its well organised, funny thing is folk are told to use any gate but then end up going and standing in massive queues, which I found amusing, I walked tae the gate and was in within about 5 seconds. Brilliant, then up for a couple of beers.

overdrive
15-02-2018, 05:32 PM
I was at the Scotland v France game on Sun, whit a weekend, M,field is really quick to get into, you can use any gates on the outside perimeter and you just stroll round all the pie and hamburger stands then up tae yir seat, its well organised, funny thing is folk are told to use any gate but then end up going and standing in massive queues, which I found amusing, I walked tae the gate and was in within about 5 seconds. Brilliant, then up for a couple of beers.

That won't happen at the football though. There will be segregation in place.

Pretty Boy
15-02-2018, 05:36 PM
I'm not a huge fan of Murrayfield. It gets an easy ride from football fans for not being Hampden. The biggest issue that it won't solve is fans being miles from the pitch. The try areas at Murrayfield are huge and even a football pitch at it's maximum dimensions will leave a lot of space, you also have that bizarre running track on the main stand side. The sight lines aren't great either, particularly in the lower tier. There's always talk about plenty pubs etc around the area but there's an element of snobbery with a fair few hotels and pubs closing their doors to football fans on derby day but welcoming the rugby 'high jinks'. Would that change if football at Murrayfield became a regular thing?

It's a better stadium than Hampden but I wouldn't be that enthused about watching football there tbh.

McD
15-02-2018, 09:04 PM
I’d be more likely to go, proximity, ease of getting there and back, and that I generally hate Glasgow so don’t like to put any money into the place, and hampden is a dump of a stadium.


I do wonder what could be done for segregation at Murrayfield though, it’s not built to separate 2 sets of fans, could easily see rangers-Celtic or Hibs-Hearts fan clashes. Arriving/leaving in separate direction isn’t too difficult to arrange, but in the stadium area it would be hard to maintain separation.

Speedy
15-02-2018, 09:32 PM
I'd attend Scotland matches if they were hosted in Edinburgh. Getting to and from Hampden for a Fri night match is an massive ball ache.

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Me too. Hampden is a pain in the arse to get to for all the stupid times they have Scotland games.

That said, I will miss the bus trip through for Hibs games.

Phil MaGlass
16-02-2018, 04:14 PM
I'm not a huge fan of Murrayfield. It gets an easy ride from football fans for not being Hampden. The biggest issue that it won't solve is fans being miles from the pitch. The try areas at Murrayfield are huge and even a football pitch at it's maximum dimensions will leave a lot of space, you also have that bizarre running track on the main stand side. The sight lines aren't great either, particularly in the lower tier. There's always talk about plenty pubs etc around the area but there's an element of snobbery with a fair few hotels and pubs closing their doors to football fans on derby day but welcoming the rugby 'high jinks'. Would that change if football at Murrayfield became a regular thing?

It's a better stadium than Hampden but I wouldn't be that enthused about watching football there tbh.

plenty boozers in Edinburgh before going to M,field, Haymarket packed wae pubs.
Transport is excellent and yi can walk tae the ground easy fae Haymarket. Murrayfield wins hands down every time for me.

overdrive
16-02-2018, 05:29 PM
I would be interested to see what they do with segregation on the tram and at Haymarket. I think with the tram at the Hearts - The Thes game they had one set of fans use Balgreen instead of Murrayfield IIRC (I suppose not too dissimilar to how they use Mount Florida and Kings Park at Hamdump).

patch1875
16-02-2018, 06:07 PM
Hope not I live close to Murrayfield.

Wasn’t a pleasant experience when they played there rugby fans are generally well behaved around the ground.

Ozyhibby
21-02-2018, 10:33 PM
https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/scotland/scottish-fa-approach-queen-s-park-in-shock-bid-to-buy-hampden-1-4694184


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ancient hibee
21-02-2018, 10:56 PM
What a waste of money.

NAE NOOKIE
21-02-2018, 11:21 PM
What a waste of money.

Renting the place at £800,000 a year is a waste of money. Under the ownership of Queens Park the stadium has stumbled along from one botched revamp to another, leaving us with a stadium lagging miles behind what it should be by now.

The thought of the SFA running the place it has to be said doesn't exactly fill me with confidence either .... but they do have Rod Petrie on board and if anybody knows how to run an infrastructure project its him :greengrin

The only thing I would say is if they are going to revamp the east and west stands, please please don't just chuck up a couple of stand alone items ... as a national stadium the whole thing should retain a bowl style appearance like the Millennium stadium or Wembley .... what we don't want is just a larger version of Easter Road or Tynecastle.

Eyrie
21-02-2018, 11:44 PM
Renting the place at £800,000 a year is a waste of money. Under the ownership of Queens Park the stadium has stumbled along from one botched revamp to another, leaving us with a stadium lagging miles behind what it should be by now.

The thought of the SFA running the place it has to be said doesn't exactly fill me with confidence either .... but they do have Rod Petrie on board and if anybody knows how to run an infrastructure project its him :greengrin

The only thing I would say is if they are going to revamp the east and west stands, please please don't just chuck up a couple of stand alone items ... as a national stadium the whole thing should retain a bowl style appearance like the Millennium stadium or Wembley .... what we don't want is just a larger version of Easter Road or Tynecastle.

There is nothing wrong with the former and nothing right with the latter.

Winston Ingram
22-02-2018, 06:42 AM
For travel links alone, attendances will get better. Getting back to Edinburgh for a night game is horrendous.

Impossible to get transport back to Queen Street so you end up having to walk 4 miles. If you do end up walking, you’ll likely miss the last train.

JimBHibees
22-02-2018, 07:06 AM
Murrayfield is the clear winner so obviously it will stay at Hampden. Compared to other even smaller countries than Scotland Hampden isnt fit for purpoise wither as a stadium or for the appalling transport links.

Nevi_SOL
22-02-2018, 07:20 AM
This all reeks of the sfa trying too drive down the price of Murrayfield IMO

vuefrom1875
22-02-2018, 07:40 AM
What a waste of money.

Sfa will never leave weggieland. Living in the past.Ar$eholes.

JimBHibees
22-02-2018, 07:41 AM
This all reeks of the sfa trying too drive down the price of Murrayfield IMO

I would say the opposite trying to drive down the price of Hampden as IMO they have no intention of leaving Hampden.

GreenCastle
22-02-2018, 07:44 AM
Where would the SFA get the money to buy Hampden ?

They can’t even afford video technology in the game !!

Surely Queen’s Park will get more ££ from selling the stadium to a housing company and moving to lesser Hampden which has plenty space to redevelop further.

I see this going two ways..

SFA are really trying to buy it and they are more of a joke than I could have imagined buying something that needs extensive work.

Or they are using this to say we explored options and couldn’t buy so moving away.

The fact the SFA don’t own their own office space anywhere sums up the way the game is run in this country.

SirDavidsNapper
22-02-2018, 07:50 AM
More nonsense from the SFA

we are hibs
22-02-2018, 08:02 AM
I don't know why people are surprised the GFA want to remain in Glasgow. I doubt Murrayfield was ever a serious option they were considering.

chrisski33
22-02-2018, 08:19 AM
I hope they don't move to Murrayfield as Hearts will take the rent given they built and own it.

Wrong. The SRU own it.

johnbc70
22-02-2018, 08:21 AM
Would the findings of their review or study that led to this decision be publicly available to review, as fans we should at least get to see why this decision is in the best interests of the game. If it's not published then it certainly should be.

blackpoolhibs
22-02-2018, 08:30 AM
Wrong. The SRU own it.



:faf:

calumhibee1
22-02-2018, 08:57 AM
Wrong. The SRU own it.

:greengrin

Just Alf
22-02-2018, 09:02 AM
Wrong. The SRU own it.

Like me, I'm guessing you're not a morning person either?! :greengrin

Since90+2
22-02-2018, 09:07 AM
The SFA would never move out of Glasgow. This whole considering Murrayfield angle has been a complete cherade from the start.

Kato
22-02-2018, 09:20 AM
:faf:

No way did I expect a bite on that.

SirDavidsNapper
22-02-2018, 09:24 AM
No way did I expect a bite on that.

Just admit when you're wrong and move on 😉

Kato
22-02-2018, 09:27 AM
Just admit when you're wrong and move on 😉

Fair cop.

JimBHibees
22-02-2018, 10:10 AM
No way did I expect a bite on that.

Surely it isnt serious. :greengrin

Aim Here
22-02-2018, 11:03 AM
The Record is reporting that the endgame wasn't just to knock down the rent, but to coerce Queen's Park into selling Hampden outright for not a lot of money. For an asset that's got a book value of about £30 million or so, and which is raking in upwards of £800k revenue per year from one customer alone, buying it outright for £2 million almost qualifies as theft.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/sfa-plan-buy-hampden-deal-12067172

JimBHibees
22-02-2018, 11:07 AM
The Record is reporting that the endgame wasn't just to knock down the rent, but to coerce Queen's Park into selling Hampden outright for not a lot of money. For an asset that's got a book value of about £30 million or so, and which is raking in upwards of £800k revenue per year from one customer alone, buying it outright for £2 million almost qualifies as theft.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/sfa-plan-buy-hampden-deal-12067172

Why would they sell for that amount when you would assume the large area could be sold to developers for a pretty penny given its a half decent residential location.

Aim Here
22-02-2018, 11:16 AM
Why would they sell for that amount when you would assume the large area could be sold to developers for a pretty penny given its a half decent residential location.

Well one reason would be that the SFA also has a big say in the footballing future of Queen's Park so it has added coercion pressure; but yes, I'm sure that the QP board are considering selling Hampden on to developers as a site for much needed student accommodation as a counterthreat, if nothing more.

Tornadoes70
22-02-2018, 02:21 PM
The high level criticism from both sides of the Glasgow divide allied with the launch of a joint bid in an effort to maintain the West of Scotland power-base and recent threats of disbanding the sfa being aimed at McRae and our Rod tells me that Murrayfield was the definite front-runner until they intervened with other options now being carefully looked at. Never underestimate the underlying behind the scenes high level power games and politicking to prevent real change. Hampden whether its rented or owned out-right now appears the only likely outcome.








mon the cabbage!!!

jgl07
22-02-2018, 02:50 PM
I would be interested to see what they do with segregation on the tram and at Haymarket. I think with the tram at the Hearts - The Thes game they had one set of fans use Balgreen instead of Murrayfield IIRC (I suppose not too dissimilar to how they use Mount Florida and Kings Park at Hamdump).

It's a bit pointless as they would end up on the same tram.

Trains from Mount Florida and Kings Park are on different lines.

speedy_gonzales
22-02-2018, 03:00 PM
It's a bit pointless as they would end up on the same tram.

Trains from Mount Florida and Kings Park are on different lines.
Depending on who we're talking about, they could tram one set of fans West to Edinburgh Park for fans heading West or Central, another tram heads East for the other set of West fans or those going north. There are already trains that go to Glasgow on different lines so segregation shouldn't be an issue.

ancient hibee
22-02-2018, 03:58 PM
Renting the place at £800,000 a year is a waste of money. Under the ownership of Queens Park the stadium has stumbled along from one botched revamp to another, leaving us with a stadium lagging miles behind what it should be by now.

The thought of the SFA running the place it has to be said doesn't exactly fill me with confidence either .... but they do have Rod Petrie on board and if anybody knows how to run an infrastructure project its him :greengrin

The only thing I would say is if they are going to revamp the east and west stands, please please don't just chuck up a couple of stand alone items ... as a national stadium the whole thing should retain a bowl style appearance like the Millennium stadium or Wembley .... what we don't want is just a larger version of Easter Road or Tynecastle.
Except that out of the £800K about half goes on various maintenance projects which will continue even if the SFA bought it (not that they have the money).I wonder if Lawell is in the background here sewing seeds to encourage the use of the biggest ground in Glasgow.

Since90+2
22-02-2018, 04:12 PM
One thing Lawwell aint is daft so he will realise it will never be accepted that Celtic Park is used solely for the cup finals and internationals unless in some kind of agreement to also host games at Ibrox.

They will be staying at Hampden. I dont think they ever seriously considered anything else.

Renfrew_Hibby
22-02-2018, 04:43 PM
I think we all knew they were staying at Hampden. How they came to that decision I could not care.
However its now recognised that the stadium is not fit for purpose.
For me, the two ends need demolished and rebuilt without the curves. The pitch also needs lowered to allow maybe at least 6 or 7 additional rows of seating to be added to the north and south, raising capacity and pulling everything closer to the pitch.
Just how on earth will this be funded?

Sauzee16
22-02-2018, 05:04 PM
Great news they are staying there. Just when I've started liking the place and the memories

Keith_M
22-02-2018, 08:24 PM
I don't believe they ever intended to do anything other than stay where they are and look for the cheapest option, i.e Hampden as it currently is, with no improvements.

JimBHibees
23-02-2018, 01:38 PM
I don't believe they ever intended to do anything other than stay where they are and look for the cheapest option, i.e Hampden as it currently is, with no improvements.

Agree the usual totally transparent sham of considering other options.

Ozyhibby
26-02-2018, 08:48 AM
I know it’s Keith Jackson but even for him this is a dreadful article.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/murrayfield-magical-magnificent-spoil-letting-12087952


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One Day
26-02-2018, 08:53 AM
I don't believe they ever intended to do anything other than stay where they are and look for the cheapest option, i.e Hampden as it currently is, with no improvements.

Neither do I. SFA always go for cheap and nasty

PatHead
26-02-2018, 09:37 AM
I know it’s Keith Jackson but even for him this is a dreadful article.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/murrayfield-magical-magnificent-spoil-letting-12087952


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So basically they cannot move the national stadium as Celtic and Sevco fans cannot be trusted. 21st century Scotland eh.

cabbageandribs1875
26-02-2018, 09:44 AM
I know it’s Keith Jackson but even for him this is a dreadful article.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/murrayfield-magical-magnificent-spoil-letting-12087952


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as much as i detest keith jackshun the article is spot on, imo....except the last part about using parkhead and castle greyskull

Ozyhibby
26-02-2018, 10:10 AM
as much as i detest keith jackshun the article is spot on, imo....except the last part about using parkhead and castle greyskull

The only negative he comes up with about Murrayfield is the distance of the stands from the pitch which exists at Hampden anyway and the stands at Murrayfield are steeper so you have a much better view.
I’m pretty sure we can cope with Sevco/Celtic games in Edinburgh. And every other game there can be coped with a lot better than Hampden manages.


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BroxburnHibee
26-02-2018, 10:24 AM
I know it’s Keith Jackson but even for him this is a dreadful article.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/murrayfield-magical-magnificent-spoil-letting-12087952


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Not having a go but just a general point.

I really wish folk would copy and paste stories from that rag rather than posting links.

Beefster
26-02-2018, 10:26 AM
Not having a go but just a general point.

I really wish folk would copy and paste stories from that rag rather than posting links.

Have you ever attempted to copy and paste from one of those ‘adverts and pop ups everywhere’ websites? It’s generally not worth the grief. Even trying to navigate through them is enough to put you in a rage.

offshorehibby
26-02-2018, 10:33 AM
Murrayfield is magical and magnificent so why spoil it by letting football fans in?
Let's start with a confession. Ladies and gentlemen, I have visited the dark side.
A strange, parallel universe where men fumble around with their own oddly shaped balls and occasionally celebrate this achievement by hitching up their Barbour jackets and ramming snooker cues where the sun don’t shine in the name of high jinks. Or so the story goes
Anyway, the awkward truth of the matter is I rather liked it. In fact, it was impossible to be a Scotsman inside Murrayfield on Saturday evening and not be completely seduced by the magic of it all. What an epic sporting occasion. What an absolute joy to behold.
What a magnificent, immaculate arena these rugger boys have built for themselves. What a team Gregor Townsend is gracing it with.
And what on earth are they thinking about by inviting Scottish football in to spoil it all? Have they thought for a second about the levels of mayhem and unruly chaos they are about to unleash on Edinburgh’s polite society?
As reconnaissance missions go, this historic, heroic Calcutta Cup triumph could not possibly have showcased the home of our national egg chasers any more perfectly. And it’s little wonder they pride themselves on it.
The huge, 67,500 capacity Murrayfield makes Hampden look exactly what it is. A rusty, inferior relic from a bygone age which has been tarted up on the cheap and which has taken its paying customers for granted ever since.
Should they follow through on their proposal to take the nation’s proper game across the M8 and decant it in the east, the SFA will be giving football fans the equivalent of a free upgrade to a suit in the Balmoral from a single room in the Gorbals Premier Inn. But the uncomfortable truth is it will never feel quite like home and not just because it doesn’t belong to them.
This place is built for housing rugby matches and the dimensions of its huge, pristine playing surface cannot simply be scaled down to make it work for football.
Yes, there is more than enough room to accommodate some proper pitch markings but that in itself points to the fundamental problem. It’s too damn big.
The distance between the action and the stands at both ends of the ground made Murrayfield feel like a temporary, needs must arrangement when it has been hired out by both Celtic and Hearts. Yes, the idea might sound great in theory but the reality is that football struggles to fit in here.
And not just because they sell everything from venison burgers to fajitas and prosecco in the vans around the ground without a pie and Bovril in sight.
It’s not that football fans don’t deserve to be spoilt by this splendour either. In fact, the perennially thirsty Tartan Army would doubtless relish the facilities on offer in and around the ground as well as the attention to detail afforded to them by their would be hosts at the SRU.
The purpose built fan village, for example, which is set up right outside the front door and which opens itself up for thousands of Starmer-Smiths more than two hours before kick-off, would be right up their street assuming that is, that the licensing laws would not discriminate against them merely for following the wrong sport. Which is far from guaranteed given the second class status afforded to them.
But then again, this is a reputation which has been earned over the years. And it’s that stubbornly roguish element among football’s followers which would make this proposed move across the country a logistical minefield.
The majority of Scottish football supporters may well be responsible, perfectly civilised folk but there are thousands of others among them who have great difficulty behaving like decent human beings, especially when they find themselves part of a mob and surrounded by kindred spirits.
How could this lot be trusted not to grind the country’s major rail artery between Glasgow and the capital to a stand-still if or when Celtic meet Rangers there in a cup final or semi? There’s the potential here for running skirmishes to stretch simultaneously all the way from Queen Street Station to the Haymarket and how on earth are Police Scotland’s resources meant to cope with such a scenario?
The cops may have got policing this rivalry down to a fine art over the years but that’s because it’s been confined to the city’s own streets and stadia. Years of practice has led to long established protocol when these fans are being shepherded into Celtic Park, Ibrox and Hampden.
By rolling it across the country it would present them with an entirely new and very probably impossible set of circumstances.
When 15,000 Rangers fans made the trip earlier this season to watch their team beat Hearts, a great many of them were ferried across the M8 on a fleet of buses which were laid on for them by the SRU. It went like clockwork apparently which is all very well.
But if almost 70,000 rival fans from both sides of the Clyde are swarming into town from all angles, what chance would the authorities have of maintaining public order? They can hardly stop people getting onto trains nor can they segregate the motorways or the Harthill services.
There are civil liberties and human rights for that sort of thing.
And then there’s the sense and sensibilities of the good people of the Capital city and the residents of its leafy west end who may never before have witnessed such sights.
What exactly would they make of this unfolding mayhem as they peer out from the behind the bay windows of their town houses?



I don't recall the SRU laying on buses and can't see why they would.

Bristolhibby
26-02-2018, 10:45 AM
The SFA would never move out of Glasgow. This whole considering Murrayfield angle has been a complete cherade from the start.

And Queens Park know that.

No point having options if you aren’t prepared to use them.

J

speedy_gonzales
26-02-2018, 12:35 PM
re Jackson's piece and the logistics of Old Firm travel, I've mentioned before but there's more than one railway line between the East & West.
One set of fans arrive at Edinburgh Park and tram it to Murrayfield, the other walks from Haymarket, the 2 tribes would never meet.

How does a significant %age of their followers manage their weekly sojourn across the Irish sea without high profile conflated most matches?

jgl07
26-02-2018, 02:38 PM
Depending on who we're talking about, they could tram one set of fans West to Edinburgh Park for fans heading West or Central, another tram heads East for the other set of West fans or those going north. There are already trains that go to Glasgow on different lines so segregation shouldn't be an issue.

Good point.

If it was Celtic v Sevco, for example, one lot could be directed to travel via Falkirk (stating at Haymarket) and the others via Airdrie-Bathgate (stating at Edinburgh Park). If Aberdeen or a Dundee club were involved, they could be directed to get the tram to Edinburgh Gateway.

Joe6-2
26-02-2018, 02:53 PM
I hope they don't move to Murrayfield as Hearts will take the rent given they built and own it.

Oh no, I didn’t know it was rusting!

GreenCastle
26-02-2018, 02:53 PM
The SFA would never move out of Glasgow. This whole considering Murrayfield angle has been a complete cherade from the start.

The SFA now have offices at Oriam...but still majority at Hampden

norhfc
26-02-2018, 02:54 PM
There is no way they will leave hampden and no hope in hell they will leave Glasgow.
Hampden will get a lick of paint or some other minor improvement.

Andy.1875
26-02-2018, 03:01 PM
Good point.

If it was Celtic v Sevco, for example, one lot could be directed to travel via Falkirk (stating at Haymarket) and the others via Airdrie-Bathgate (stating at Edinburgh Park). If Aberdeen or a Dundee club were involved, they could be directed to get the tram to Edinburgh Gateway.

All this talk about segregation is great, but it's assuming the fans want to come straight to the match then go straight home afterwards. good mn would probably want to be in Edinburgh before and after the game for some entertainment.

hibee62
26-02-2018, 03:26 PM
All this talk about segregation is great, but it's assuming the fans want to come straight to the match then go straight home afterwards. good mn would probably want to be in Edinburgh before and after the game for some entertainment.

I don’t know how old firm games normally work, but at every other game I’ve been to fans mingle pre-game. It is possible to segregate at the west end though and send some past Haymarket and some round the back.

Post game people Would just have to make do, one set of fans always has a long way to walk to get to where they want to be.

speedy_gonzales
26-02-2018, 03:27 PM
All this talk about segregation is great, but it's assuming the fans want to come straight to the match then go straight home afterwards. good mn would probably want to be in Edinburgh before and after the game for some entertainment.
I'm assuming fans already do this in Glasgow without incident?
Whenever I've headed to Hampden I like to get in and out as quickly as possible but I have been known on occasion to pop in to a cricket or bowling club when organised by the fine peeps here on Hibs.net.
For those that want to take in the sights & hostelries of this fine city I can't see there being that much of a difference from when fans attend Hampden, it should be borne in mind that finals aren't exclusive to Celtic & Rangers, other teams will be allowed so I'd be disappointed in the authorities if the driver behind any decision making process was how to keep those teams apart,,,,

JimBHibees
26-02-2018, 04:04 PM
I'm assuming fans already do this in Glasgow without incident?
Whenever I've headed to Hampden I like to get in and out as quickly as possible but I have been known on occasion to pop in to a cricket or bowling club when organised by the fine peeps here on Hibs.net.
For those that want to take in the sights & hostelries of this fine city I can't see there being that much of a difference from when fans attend Hampden, it should be borne in mind that finals aren't exclusive to Celtic & Rangers, other teams will be allowed so I'd be disappointed in the authorities if the driver behind any decision making process was how to keep those teams apart,,,,

One thing about the OF playing in Edinburgh would be that we would be more likely to hear about the trouble that IMO goes largely unreported when they play in Glasgow.

Is It On....
26-02-2018, 08:03 PM
No way did I expect a bite on that.

It's obvious that the forward looking team didn't buy it in the 1950s as wasn't it big enough to host their 400,000 fans!!

Kato
26-02-2018, 08:15 PM
It's obvious that the forward looking team didn't buy it in the 1950s as wasn't it big enough to host their 400,000 fans!!

Didn't the Corporation offer it to them for zilch?

Kavinho
26-02-2018, 08:26 PM
Having spoken to a local (to Murrayfield) retailer, he was dreading having thousands of unwashed 'fans' staggering past on the way to the ground.
The hearts/sevco game was enough to sicken his mind from the thought of any potential profits from the extra footfall passing his door.

Billy Whizz
26-02-2018, 08:33 PM
Having spoken to a local (to Murrayfield) retailer, he was dreading having thousands of unwashed 'fans' staggering past on the way to the ground.
The hearts/sevco game was enough to sicken his mind from the thought of any potential profits from the extra footfall passing his door.

Forgot you can drink on the streets in Edinburgh but not Glasgow!
Imagine 67,000 of that lot drinking on the streets of Edinburgh before a game, carnage

Kavinho
26-02-2018, 08:44 PM
Forgot you can drink on the streets in Edinburgh but not Glasgow!
Imagine 67,000 of that lot drinking on the streets of Edinburgh before a game, carnage

A lot of P'sh draining into the water o Leith

Ozyhibby
26-02-2018, 09:15 PM
Having spoken to a local (to Murrayfield) retailer, he was dreading having thousands of unwashed 'fans' staggering past on the way to the ground.
The hearts/sevco game was enough to sicken his mind from the thought of any potential profits from the extra footfall passing his door.

There are plenty local business would love to have the national football stadium in Edinburgh. It would boost the Edinburgh economy by millions of pounds a year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

overdrive
26-02-2018, 09:26 PM
Forgot you can drink on the streets in Edinburgh but not Glasgow!
Imagine 67,000 of that lot drinking on the streets of Edinburgh before a game, carnage

Not now Police Glasgow are in charge. I think there technically was an Edinburgh bye-law banning it before that was just usually ignored but since the police merger they are enforcing it more strictly (along with the brothels that L&BP also turned a blind eye to).

You’ll usually see the police forcing people to pour cans down the drain before big matches (or confiscate it and take a swig themselves as I witnessed before the Hearts home game).

Mr White
26-02-2018, 09:29 PM
re Jackson's piece and the logistics of Old Firm travel, I've mentioned before but there's more than one railway line between the East & West.
One set of fans arrive at Edinburgh Park and tram it to Murrayfield, the other walks from Haymarket, the 2 tribes would never meet.

How does a significant %age of their followers manage their weekly sojourn across the Irish sea without high profile conflated most matches?

One lot's buses sail from Larne and the other from Belfast when they're playing on the same day I believe. There have been major issues in the past but P&O and Stena are well organised at keeping them apart nowadays. It's decent business for them too, so much so that they'll hold the boat's departure for up to 45 minutes if supporter's buses are delayed on the way down to Cairnryan after a match.

eastterrace
26-02-2018, 09:35 PM
Not now Police Glasgow are in charge. I think there technically was an Edinburgh bye-law banning it before that was just usually ignored but since the police merger they are enforcing it more strictly (along with the brothels that L&BP also turned a blind eye to).

You’ll usually see the police forcing people to pour cans down the drain before big matches (or confiscate it and take a swig themselves as I witnessed before the Hearts home game).

Get yourselves up abbey hill before Celtic or sevco game and they are all standing about drinking , also bothwell street. Police don’t bother as they can keep tabs on them


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Aim Here
26-02-2018, 09:39 PM
Not now Police Glasgow are in charge. I think there technically was an Edinburgh bye-law banning it before that was just usually ignored but since the police merger they are enforcing it more strictly (along with the brothels that L&BP also turned a blind eye to).

You’ll usually see the police forcing people to pour cans down the drain before big matches (or confiscate it and take a swig themselves as I witnessed before the Hearts home game).

Don't you mean Police Scotland?

It's not necessarily a bylaw. Edinburgh does allow public drinking as long as you stop when a polis asks you to - but the law throughout Scotland is that it's an offence to take alcohol to or from a football match.

Scouse Hibee
26-02-2018, 09:54 PM
Don't you mean Police Scotland?

It's not necessarily a bylaw. Edinburgh does allow public drinking as long as you stop when a polis asks you to - but the law throughout Scotland is that it's an offence to take alcohol to or from a football match.

No he means Police Glasgow.😉

vuefrom1875
26-02-2018, 10:11 PM
No he means Police Glasgow.😉

Or even police weggie 😀