Financial position

[eastcoasthibby]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

[Hibs90]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

Premiership prize money. TV money etc

[SeanWilson]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

there are many factors, the main one being another operational year in the champ with a prem budget, coupled with lack of rangers league games (which must have been worth more than the loss to us in gates?... i'd be extremely surprised if we dont post profit in our next set of acounts, after a year back in the top flight, higher ST sales, another couple of cup runs and of course our 2nd place finish :greengrin

[Col2]

Our crowds are up by another 20% - should equate to net £750k increase

Premiership prize money and tv money - should equate to c£1.5m.

We will have higher salary costs but should also get higher income from
Advertising and sponsorship.

[Mathias Jack]

I'm not too worried about this to be honest; wait til next year when we've had a full season in the Prem along with the prize and TV money that goes with it. Obviously the season ticket cash and gate receipts from the 1 July 2017 too.

[SRHibs]

I saw someone mention that the fee for JC in the accounts was ~£500k. Shocker if true.

[scoopyboy]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

I had heard the club were looking to break even so it comes as a wee bit of an unpleasant surprise.

Like others I am confident we will post better figures next season.

[scoopyboy]

I saw someone mention that the fee for JC in the accounts was ~£500k. Shocker if true.

Yes but no one knows if that is just a part payment.

A question for the AGM without doubt.

Not sure if legally bound to tell shareholders at an AGM if asked.

[Arch Stanton]

I seem to remember a load of fans who thought that no effort/money should be spared to avoid the unthinkable 3rd term in the championship.

Anyway, we could still learn a thing or two from Super Ally about arriving in the SPL with a whacking loss.

[BSEJVT]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

The loss was substantially more than that, that is the loss after player trading

Make no mistake another year in the Championship would have been a very bad and long term damaging thing for the club

Thankfully the 3 seasons we spent there haven't done the financial damage they could have but whether that was down to dumb luck with the various cup runs and the presence of the yams in year 1 and Rangers in years 1 & 2 I will leave you to decide.

That's why a strong and growing HSL are critical for us and that there is something that follows on from it when HSL meets its objectives.

[stonewaller1875]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??Remember this was during the Championship season, bigger away crowds and increased season ticket sales this season will improve our financial position come the next AGM

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[Northernhibee]

I believe last year was the first without the parachute payment but we also got a new manager in and Lennon won't be cheap. We didn't have that many huge games last season for crowds either.

Think this year is more likely to be a success what with Premiership TV money, bumper crowds etc.

[Col2]

Just think IF Ha Ha Hearts had seen out that game when 2-0 up with 10 to play at home in a tournament with ‘special relationship’......

- crowds would have been half they are
- derby record would been poor
- our greatest moment wouldn’t have happened
- we wouldn’t have Neil Lennon and all the players we had
- we might have ended up with Cathro

Thanks yam losers

[Sammy7nil]

The loss was substantially more than that, that is the loss after player trading

Make no mistake another year in the Championship would have been a very bad and long term damaging thing for the club

Thankfully the 3 seasons we spent there haven't done the financial damage they could have but whether that was down to dumb luck with the various cup runs and the presence of the yams in year 1 and Rangers in years 1 & 2 I will leave you to decide.

That's why a strong and growing HSL are critical for us and that there is something that follows on from it when HSL meets its objectives.

Do you think we need a strong and growing HSL ? :greengrin:greengrin:greengrin:thumbsup: I am sure someone else may have mentioned that once before.:greengrin

[WhileTheChief..]

Lennon, Stokes, Ambrose, Whittaker will all be on far higher wages than their predecessors.

The problem we face is how to increase turnover. Other than gate receipts which have a natural limit to them, we need to start getting more in from sponsors and corporate deals etc.

Instead of firms like Celia’s Cafe advertising pitch side we need to be getting National or International brands involved. There’s plenty based in Edinburgh that we could be approaching and the profile of the club is far higher now that Lennon is here. I hope we make the most of it.

Hearts supposedly raked in 2m+ from Europe on the back of a gubbing from a part time team. If we can get Europe and face a decent side from Germany or similar then we should also get a decent whack.

We’ll also get something on the back of Celtic in Europe that we’ve missed out on the last two years.

[Smartie]

Just think IF Ha Ha Hearts had seen out that game when 2-0 up with 10 to play at home in a tournament with ‘special relationship’......

- crowds would have been half they are
- derby record would been poor
- our greatest moment wouldn’t have happened
- we wouldn’t have Neil Lennon and all the players we had
- we might have ended up with Cathro

Thanks yam losers

Great points, a proper sobering thought.

This post should be quoted the next time someone has a meltdown at Lewis for making a mistake or Stokesy for playing a bit below par.

[Smartie]

Lennon, Stokes, Ambrose, Whittaker will all be on far higher wages than their predecessors.

The problem we face is how to increase turnover. Other than gate receipts which have a natural limit to them, we need to start getting more in from sponsors and corporate deals etc.

Instead of firms like Celia’s Cafe advertising pitch side we need to be getting National or International brands involved. There’s plenty based in Edinburgh that we could be approaching and the profile of the club is far higher now that Lennon is here. I hope we make the most of it.

Hearts supposedly raked in 2m+ from Europe on the back of a gubbing from a part time team. If we can get Europe and face a decent side from Germany or similar then we should also get a decent whack.

We’ll also get something on the back of Celtic in Europe that we’ve missed out on the last two years.

Before we work on increasing turnover should we not work on maintaining current levels?

As it stands, this year's accounts should be substantially healthier, no?

If we need to increase, then I think we'd have a problem, as short of putting in a sustained title challenge or serious European run, I don't really see where we have to go.

[NAE NOOKIE]

To be honest given the revenue streams cut off to us in the period covered by the accounts we did pretty well to have such a small loss. I would be much more concerned if these accounts covered a period in the premier league. Next years accounts will be much more of a barometer of how the club is faring financially /being run.

[Sir David Gray]

I saw someone mention that the fee for JC in the accounts was ~£500k. Shocker if true.

This has been mentioned several times since he left. There really should be some sort of clarity from the club regarding this as £500k for one of your most prized assets really doesn't seem like good business to me, especially when he still had 3 years left on his contract.

There surely has to be more to it than that.

[WhileTheChief..]

I think i maybe underestimated the real cost of being out of the top league. Things were going well, we won the cup, brought in Lennon and signed some decent players. There wasn’t much focus from the fans on money matters and the club stated that they would continue to pay top flight wages to try and get us promotion.

Clearly if if we kept paying the same wages we were going to be much worse off. These accounts just bring home how damaging the last few years have been financially. I’m pleasantly surprised that the losses weren’t greater.

Next years accounts will show a substantial increase in turnover.

[Onceinawhile]

Lennon, Stokes, Ambrose, Whittaker will all be on far higher wages than their predecessors.


Neil lennon's wage will be included in these accounts as they cover our third year in the championship.

[The_Horde]

Our crowds are up by another 20% - should equate to net £750k increase

Premiership prize money and tv money - should equate to c£1.5m.

We will have higher salary costs but should also get higher income from
Advertising and sponsorship.

Add in the probable upcoming sale of Mcginn and we'll see a massive profit in the next accounts.

[CropleyWasGod]

Lennon, Stokes, Ambrose, Whittaker will all be on far higher wages than their predecessors.

The problem we face is how to increase turnover. Other than gate receipts which have a natural limit to them, we need to start getting more in from sponsors and corporate deals etc.

Instead of firms like Celia’s Cafe advertising pitch side we need to be getting National or International brands involved. There’s plenty based in Edinburgh that we could be approaching and the profile of the club is far higher now that Lennon is here. I hope we make the most of it.

Hearts supposedly raked in 2m+ from Europe on the back of a gubbing from a part time team. If we can get Europe and face a decent side from Germany or similar then we should also get a decent whack.

We’ll also get something on the back of Celtic in Europe that we’ve missed out on the last two years.Hearts didn't get 2m from Europe. That's down to ambiguity in their accounts and misreading on here.

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[Nakedmanoncrack]

This has been mentioned several times since he left. There really should be some sort of clarity from the club regarding this as £500k for one of your most prized assets really doesn't seem like good business to me, especially when he still had 3 years left on his contract.

There surely has to be more to it than that.

There are certainly questions to answer- I would assume an arrangement was reached with Jason to stay & assist us to be promoted- in return he could go for a cut price.

[jgl07]

The first two seasons down, Hibs had parachute payments. In the first season there were two home games each against Hearts and the Rangers not to mention a cup semi-final and a playoff against the Rangers. The second season also had two home Sevco matches, playoff matches against Raith and Falkirk plus two cup final appearances and lucrative matches en route against Aberdeen, Dundee United (x2) and Hearts (x2).

Last season Hibs had no parachute payments, no playoff matches, exited the Challange Cup and the League Cup early on but did have a decent cup run to the semifinals with two matches against the Hearts on the way.

This season Hibs have the Premiership TV revenue, have already had a run to the League Cup semifinal with a match against Celtic. The cup run will start with a match against the Hearts. Hibs seem set for the top six which means two home matches against Celtic and Sevco. We are assured of two home matches against the Hearts before the split.

The home crowds at Easter Road are the best for more years than I care to remember. It was 17,000 plus against St Johnstone. I can recall Hibs getting 2,500 against the Saints in the early 1990s and even in a relatively successful season failing to get anywhere near 5,000 in two home matches.

Hibs next two home matches are Celtic and Sevco and both are heading for sell-outs.

Financial problems for Hibs are a fantasy dreamed up by our mutant friends across the City.

[WhileTheChief..]

^^^:top marks

[Sir David Gray]

The first two seasons down, Hibs had parachute payments. In the first season there were two home games each against Hearts and the Rangers not to mention a cup semi-final and a playoff against the Rangers. The second season also had two home Sevco matches, playoff matches against Raith and Falkirk plus two cup final appearances and lucrative matches en route against Aberdeen, Dundee United (x2) and Hearts (x2).

Last season Hibs had no parachute payments, no playoff matches, exited the Challange Cup and the League Cup early on but did have a decent cup run to the semifinals with two matches against the Hearts on the way.

This season Hibs have the Premiership TV revenue, have already had a run to the League Cup semifinal with a match against Celtic. The cup run will start with a match against the Hearts. Hibs seem set for the top six which means two home matches against Celtic and Sevco. We are assured of two home matches against the Hearts before the split.

The home crowds at Easter Road are the best for more years than I care to remember. It was 17,000 plus against St Johnstone. I can recall Hibs getting 2,500 against the Saints in the early 1990s and even in a relatively successful season failing to get anywhere near 5,000 in two home matches.

Hibs next two home matches are Celtic and Sevco and both are heading for sell-outs.

Financial problems for Hibs are a fantasy dreamed up by our mutant friends across the City.

We also had Europa League money coming in last season for the 2 legs v Brondby and the prize money that would have generated.

[lapsedhibee]

Hearts supposedly raked in 2m+ from Europe on the back of a gubbing from a part time team. If we can get Europe and face a decent side from Germany or similar then we should also get a decent whack.

Someone with a modicum of intelligence on cannaseeforthepolisbox.co.uk has explained as follows:

"Hearts £2.578m income recorded as "UEFA solidarity and prize money" was not just Hearts Europa League income. It refers to three different things, Europa League income, the Solidarity payment and prize money from SPFL, and domestic competitions."

[Waxy]

Not worried in the slightest. We speculated to accumulate last season and it worked.

[CropleyWasGod]

Someone with a modicum of intelligence on cannaseeforthepolisbox.co.uk has explained as follows:

"Hearts £2.578m income recorded as "UEFA solidarity and prize money" was not just Hearts Europa League income. It refers to three different things, Europa League income, the Solidarity payment and prize money from SPFL, and domestic competitions."Shame their proof reader didn't have the same number of modicums. [emoji41]

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[jacomo]

I suppose we can cope with the loss but thank God the latest 'adventure' is over.

[Topographic Hibby]

I suppose we can cope with the loss but thank God the latest 'adventure' is over.
Contrast our "adventure" with Caley's position. Some very scary numbers indeed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42103204

[Pretty Boy]

Our cash at bank figure is probably more relevant than the loss. Given we only had one cup run, no Rangers or Hearts league games, recruited a new manager and had no parachute payment I think the figures read pretty well. Also worth remembering we have no long term external debt and associated interest that goes with that and have no essential infastructure work that we are required to finance.

[SirDavidsNapper]

Have to admit I am only putting this out there, having seen the basic financial statement of a 277 k loss and just wondering if anyone else is a bit surprised and disappointed at this position.
From what might well be a naive position, I thought that don't he back of a Scottish cup win, significant increase in ST's, also a decent additional number of walkups to home games, a decent Scottish cup run again, increased merchandise (well strip tops) sales, a squad that was pretty static last season in terms of signings, etc ...would have thought all of those things would have outweighed the outgoings ..if not what will it take to make a profit and have cash to spend ??

We'll see a substantial profit this time next year

[Mikey]

We'll see a substantial profit this time next year

Hopefully not. Any extra money should be spent on players and their wages.

[The Spaceman]

Not bothered.

Our stadium is complete, we own our training ground, we are back in the big time and Season Tickets are at a record high. 3 years in the Championship was always going to take its toll, but absolutely worth it financially to get back where we belong. We are on an upwards trajectory which will be properly reflected in next year's accounts :thumbsup:

[SRHibs]

This has been mentioned several times since he left. There really should be some sort of clarity from the club regarding this as £500k for one of your most prized assets really doesn't seem like good business to me, especially when he still had 3 years left on his contract.

There surely has to be more to it than that.
It was rumoured then dismissed, even when Breadman explicitly said it was much less than 1 million. There was also a poster back in June who said he had heard from his dad that it was only half a million. Pretty sure he was called a yam.

As you say, absurdly low. I would expect us to have a significant sell-on clause though.

[CropleyWasGod]

It was rumoured then dismissed, even when Breadman explicitly said it was much less than 1 million. There was also a poster back in June who said he had heard from his dad that it was only half a million. Pretty sure he was called a yam.

As you say, absurdly low. I would expect us to have a significant sell-on clause though.We don't know whether the assumed 500k was the first instalment of the fee. Fees aren't usually paid in a lump sum these days.

"We paid less than a million" was probably correct. What is not clear is "...but we still have a further £x to pay...".

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[Pagan Hibernia]

That's why a strong and growing HSL are critical for us and that there is something that follows on from it when HSL meets its objectives.

I’m broadly supportive of HSL and their aims but if they are to be “strong and growing” they need to seriously get their act together. The website is poor and outdated, communication not great. All in all not very inspiring or imaginative in terms of drawing people in. Surprised to hear they have as much as 11% of shares if I’m honest

[Pagan Hibernia]

I’m broadly supportive of HSL and their aims but if they are to be “strong and growing” they need to seriously get their act together. The website is poor and outdated, communication not great. All in all not very inspiring or imaginative in terms of drawing people in. Surprised to hear they have as much as 11% of shares if I’m honest


Wrong thread, just seen the other one!

[mjhibby]

Contrast our "adventure" with Caley's position. Some very scary numbers indeed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42103204

As I said before to lose less than a million in three years in the championship is way better than we could have hoped for. Plus of course the brilliant crowds this season means will be very much in the black this season. Hopefully a couple of new faces in January and we can kick on again in the league.

[mjhibby]

Once again it highlights what a fine job stubbs did as although we didn't get promoted the cup win has been worth millions in goodwill and season ticket sales.

[Ozyhibby]

Once again it highlights what a fine job stubbs did as although we didn't get promoted the cup win has been worth millions in goodwill and season ticket sales.

That is very much true. The cup win has given the club a bigger boost than I could have imagined. I remember thinking the week before the Falkirk play off that I would rather get promoted than win the cup because of the financial implications of staying down. I totally misjudged the feel good factor that would come from winning the cup.


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[GordonHFC]

This has been mentioned several times since he left. There really should be some sort of clarity from the club regarding this as £500k for one of your most prized assets really doesn't seem like good business to me, especially when he still had 3 years left on his contract.

There surely has to be more to it than that.

I had heard that there was an initial fee involved. Along with this was a set figure per goal he scored up to a maximum amount. I cannot remember what the figure per goal or the maximum amount was. Then again I might have been told a load of mince but it did come from within the club.