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Hibbyradge
19-11-2017, 02:58 PM
I always understood that many/most loan deals are agreed on the understanding that the loanees are guaranteed game time.

Is that correct?

MWHIBBIES
19-11-2017, 03:09 PM
As I said in another thread its the only reason Barker is playing ahead of McGeouch and Slivka. Pretty concerned if Lennon actually think he adds more than either of those 2.

HoboHarry
19-11-2017, 03:20 PM
I always understood that many/most loan deals are agreed on the understanding that the loanees are guaranteed game time.

Is that correct?

No.

Viva_Palmeiras
19-11-2017, 04:10 PM
Shirley it’s a no - or on a case by case basis.

If it’s a yes then Pinau (and iirc JonnyLeith?) were hard done by

Iggy Pope
19-11-2017, 04:13 PM
Shirley it’s a no - or on a case by case basis.

If it’s a yes then Pinau (and iirc JonnyLeith?) were hard done by

Agreed. The wee fellah from Chelsea the year before last also left without much of a sniff.
There's been plenty came and gone. Feel a .Net myth approaching.

Scouse Hibee
19-11-2017, 04:13 PM
No not guaranteed.

Mon Dieu4
19-11-2017, 04:33 PM
I read an article before that said that there can be clauses inserted in the deals that means you have to pay more of the players wage if a loan player doesn't start a game

LNHibs
19-11-2017, 05:11 PM
As I said in another thread its the only reason Barker is playing ahead of McGeouch and Slivka. Pretty concerned if Lennon actually think he adds more than either of those 2.

I’d say the reason Barker is playing is due to he fact he was a major part in the god performances of late rather than it being due to an agreement. McGeouch nor Slivka are left wingers

Iggy Pope
19-11-2017, 05:33 PM
I’d say the reason Barker is playing is due to he fact he was a major part in the god performances of late rather than it being due to an agreement. McGeouch nor Slivka are left wingers

I mean, he's done all right like......:greengrin

MWHIBBIES
19-11-2017, 05:47 PM
I’d say the reason Barker is playing is due to he fact he was a major part in the god performances of late rather than it being due to an agreement. McGeouch nor Slivka are left wingersHas he? Played pretty well against Hearts sure, done nothing against Motherwell other than miss a sitter. Very poor at Killie. Subbed at half time vs Dundee. He was not a major part of 3 of those 4 wins.


Stokes on the left, 3 in the middle.

thebakerboy
19-11-2017, 08:14 PM
I cannot under any circumstances think that Neil Lennon would agree to anybody but him picking the players that will be playing at any given time. I think if the club had made an agreement like that he would no longer be our manager.

I'm_cabbaged
19-11-2017, 08:20 PM
Think it could help in getting players in the future?

Hibbyradge
19-11-2017, 09:03 PM
When Hibs lend players out for development, I expect them to get games to develop.

1van Sprou7e
19-11-2017, 10:47 PM
As I said in another thread its the only reason Barker is playing ahead of McGeouch and Slivka. Pretty concerned if Lennon actually think he adds more than either of those 2.

Stupid comment

For one, Barker is a completely different player compared to these 2

Also if you read Lennon's interviews he definitely understands how good McGeouch is and how important he is for us

I think he plays Barker mostly for tactical reasons as it allows us to have 2 natural wingers and stretch the opposition's defence

Thecat23
19-11-2017, 10:50 PM
I always understood that many/most loan deals are agreed on the understanding that the loanees are guaranteed game time.

Is that correct?

No, not one player in this team is guaranteed to play. It’s a myth!

Forza Fred
19-11-2017, 11:19 PM
Players go on loan to get more games, but obviously there are no guarantees.

There is obviously though, the view of the parent club about which teams do and don't give what they may see as adequate game time...or future loans just won't happen between the clubs.

I long for the day when 'loan' players at Hibs are a rarity, and we can afford to sign the players we want on contract.

TBF we manage it pretty well at the moment, but the Fenlon days are still in my mind....

lord bunberry
19-11-2017, 11:21 PM
Barker plays because he’s a good player.

matty_f
19-11-2017, 11:56 PM
Barker plays because he’s a good player.

:agree: bit confused at some of the stick he gets on here. I'd have him starting most weeks.

silverhibee
20-11-2017, 12:31 AM
:agree: bit confused at some of the stick he gets on here. I'd have him starting most weeks.

If he wasn't performing well then Lennon wouldn't be starting him, he is obviously impressing in training and doing enough to show the manager that he is worth a start in the team.

Ringothedog
21-11-2017, 06:59 AM
When Hibs lend players out for development, I expect them to get games to develop.

But they don’t always play and our our loan roundup on the official site pretty much confirms this

Brooster
21-11-2017, 07:33 AM
No, not one player in this team is guaranteed to play. It’s a myth!

But we pay Man City more if he doesnt play.

Hibbyradge
21-11-2017, 08:02 AM
But we pay Man City more if he doesnt play.

I didn't know that.

Hibbyradge
21-11-2017, 08:05 AM
But they don’t always play and our our loan roundup on the official site pretty much confirms this

I wouldn't expect that loan players would be contracted to play every game, but I did think that a minimum number of appearances or starts could be stipulated in the temporary contract.

jacomo
21-11-2017, 08:11 AM
I'm sure Hibs try to seek assurances that our loanees will play.

I'm sure clubs that loan players to us do the same. But we'd be crazy to offer guarantees - just like it would be crazy to guarantee any player a starting place.

B.H.F.C
21-11-2017, 08:42 AM
:agree: bit confused at some of the stick he gets on here. I'd have him starting most weeks.

I can understand it. He does a few good things then has a tendency to disappear from games. We're not really getting enough/any end product from him IMO.

Hibbyradge
21-11-2017, 08:55 AM
I can understand it. He does a few good things then has a tendency to disappear from games. We're not really getting enough/any end product from him IMO.

I agree. Boyle is far more productive.

GreenCastle
21-11-2017, 09:02 AM
I read an article before that said that there can be clauses inserted in the deals that means you have to pay more of the players wage if a loan player doesn't start a game

Some of the top English teams (City / Chelsea etc) loan lots of players out and they often put into the loan agreement that the player must feature in X amount of games of compensation will be due at the end of the loan as that player could be playing elsewhere and developing.

Regarding Barker - who knows..

For me he has been playing well and giving opposition something diff rent to worry about - especially him one side and Boyle the other.

What tends to happen is that since he’s still young and developing he can drift out of games. But I felt against Motherwell away he finished strong. Boyle has developed so much in last few seasons and I know Barker will also - he has talent and often goes past people like they aren’t there.

Saturday we had the issue of nearly too many attackers on the pitch getting in each other’s way and crowding the space as Stokes and Murray both played together.

Firestarter
21-11-2017, 09:07 AM
When Hibs lend players out for development, I expect them to get games to develop.

They players are our future though. Teams like City have shed loads of players out on loan about 6 at NAC Breda last year and 1 or 2 will ever make it. Lennon is showing belief in a young talent we may get on permanent should it work out well and he develops into a player I think he can. He's inconsistent but games help that.

.Sean.
21-11-2017, 10:12 AM
Agreed. The wee fellah from Chelsea the year before last also left without much of a sniff.
There's been plenty came and gone. Feel a .Net myth approaching.
Who was the guy from Chelsea? Minds gone blank

franck sauzee
21-11-2017, 10:29 AM
Who was the guy from Chelsea? Minds gone blank

Islam Feruz. Easy to forget him as he was one of the worst players I've ever seen pull on the green and white. How he ended up at Chelsea for so long is beyond me

Brightside
21-11-2017, 11:15 AM
I always understood that many/most loan deals are agreed on the understanding that the loanees are guaranteed game time.

Is that correct?

No - we have players out on loan that sit on the bench most weeks. No one is guaranteed a game.

Brightside
21-11-2017, 11:16 AM
Has he? Played pretty well against Hearts sure, done nothing against Motherwell other than miss a sitter. Very poor at Killie. Subbed at half time vs Dundee. He was not a major part of 3 of those 4 wins.


Stokes on the left, 3 in the middle.

Barker plays coz Lennon wants him to play.

MWHIBBIES
21-11-2017, 01:58 PM
Barker plays coz Lennon wants him to play.Hopefully not for long if he continues offering nothing.

jdships
21-11-2017, 02:20 PM
Shirley it’s a no - or on a case by case basis.

If it’s a yes then Pinau (and iirc JonnyLeith?) were hard done by

that is exactly as i understand it from a few years back

nonshinyfinish
22-11-2017, 09:25 AM
In Football Manager when you agree a loan contract it includes whether they'll be a regular starter, rotation player etc, but it's not binding. That said, you can call the other manager up and bollock them if your player's not getting enough games.

Football Manager > reality.

JimBHibees
22-11-2017, 12:53 PM
:agree: bit confused at some of the stick he gets on here. I'd have him starting most weeks.

Totally agree he is a totally different option to what we have and actually thought he should have stayed on against Saints. He was one of our better players in the first half of that game.

Scouse Hibee
22-11-2017, 09:26 PM
In Football Manager when you agree a loan contract it includes whether they'll be a regular starter, rotation player etc, but it's not binding. That said, you can call the other manager up and bollock them if your player's not getting enough games.

Football Manager > reality.

Comparing a computer game to real life is bizarre to say the least.

nonshinyfinish
23-11-2017, 07:23 PM
Comparing a computer game to real life is bizarre to say the least.

Why so serious?

Scouse Hibee
23-11-2017, 07:24 PM
Why so serious?

Aye okay I agree fair point, carry on.

SRHibs
24-11-2017, 09:34 AM
Totally agree he is a totally different option to what we have and actually thought he should have stayed on against Saints. He was one of our better players in the first half of that game.

Yeah, I think he looks threatening on the ball. Stevenson does not seem at all comfortable playing with him though. There’s almost a pause anytime we play up the left because Stevenson wants him to make a run and Barker wants the ball at his feet 99% of the time.

lord bunberry
25-11-2017, 10:36 PM
Barker was unplayable at times today, that’s why he starts games.

MWHIBBIES
25-11-2017, 10:57 PM
Barker was unplayable at times today, that’s why he starts games.Was he? Made a great run for the goal and 1/2 of his usual good runs that have a poor cross at the end of them. Otherwise he still absolutely refused to every run in behind his fullback when our midfield have the ball, went missing for large parts, offered very little movement and off the ball runs when he was central.

Slivka was on for 10 minutes and was far more involved.

B.H.F.C
25-11-2017, 10:58 PM
Barker was unplayable at times today, that’s why he starts games.

Great play for the goal. Did his usual disappearing act second half.

lord bunberry
25-11-2017, 11:19 PM
Was he? Made a great run for the goal and 1/2 of his usual good runs that have a poor cross at the end of them. Otherwise he still absolutely refused to every run in behind his fullback when our midfield have the ball, went missing for large parts, offered very little movement and off the ball runs when he was central.

Slivka was on for 10 minutes and was far more involved.
Slivka didn’t create a goal through a piece of individual magic, Barker did. I think his crossing would be better if he had a few more players to aim at. Our midfield is painfully slow at getting forward in central areas.

lord bunberry
25-11-2017, 11:23 PM
Great play for the goal. Did his usual disappearing act second half.
That’s unfair on the lad. He’s made an important contribution to our season so far.

MWHIBBIES
25-11-2017, 11:37 PM
Slivka didn’t create a goal through a piece of individual magic, Barker did. I think his crossing would be better if he had a few more players to aim at. Our midfield is painfully slow at getting forward in central areas.

Come on man, he done well for the goal I'm not questioning that. Otherwise he didn't exist.

lord bunberry
26-11-2017, 12:24 AM
Come on man, he done well for the goal I'm not questioning that. Otherwise he didn't exist.
I thought he was brilliant today. He’s so fast that the rest of the team don’t catch up with him. If ran wide he might have more of a chance, but he’s very direct.