The 2017-18 Ashes

[K-Zazu]

South Africa vs India series just started on Sky. Should be a cracker. 13 wickets on the first day

[Mibbes Aye]

I don't think there was a run there, but Crane didn't have the experience to tell Anderson 'no'. He just might have got home if he had gone for it without hesitation, but Anderson's been around long enough to know better, IMO. Too harsh? The damage was done farther up the order - too many senior/'proper' batsmen not delivering runs.

I'm not impressed by Bairstow's decision to go in ahead of the nightwatchman. Someone had obviously decided a nightwatchman was required, and had told Crane to pad up and be ready to go in. Bairstow unilaterally decides to overrule this - why?

England need an early breakthrough tomorrow or this could (will?) get away from them. Very impressed with Curran.

I think you're right about Crane, it takes a lot of chutzpah to assert yourself in a situation like that. And yes, too many in the upper order playing themselves in then failing, but credit to the Australian pace trio and indeed Tim Paine.

Re the nightwatchman, it looked crazy. The TV coverage showed both of them set to go. It's really difficult to understand why Crane didn't walk out. I know when Steve Waugh was the Aussie skipper he went through a phase of not playing a nightwatchman but that was at the very height of Australian dominance and it was pretty much a psychological tool to remind the opposition that they were playing a side who were supremely confident in their own abilities.

Pleased for Tom Curran. If he can bowl reasonably well tonight/tomorrow then he will go to NZ and likely feature in the summer and conceivably could be around for many years to come. It's nice to see young players showing their worth.

[Mibbes Aye]

South Africa vs India series just started on Sky. Should be a cracker. 13 wickets on the first day

Just been watching the highlights from Cape Town and it looks like a great match. I really like Quinton de Kock, he is a very exciting and very gifted batsman and he played some lovely shots in the SAF first innings.

Good to see Dale Steyn back too, he's had a terrible time with injury.

2018 is shaping up to be a great year for Test cricket. India are in South Africa before going to England and then seeing the year out in Australia. The Australians will visit South Africa as well. England face New Zealand away, then Pakistan and India at home. Chuck in what should be a fascinating Sri Lankan tour in Bangladesh, plus Pakistan playing Ireland and the job's a good 'un.

[lord bunberry]

I really enjoy watching Smith bat. It’s such an unorthodox style, but so effective. I wonder what coaches said to him as a youngster.

[lord bunberry]

Just listening to the commentary there and they’re saying that England don’t have a full time spin coach. In the modern game that’s criminal.

[lord bunberry]

Love the pink in this test match. Such a great cause.

[Mibbes Aye]

I really enjoy watching Smith bat. It’s such an unorthodox style, but so effective. I wonder what coaches said to him as a youngster.

I think he adapted his style later on in his career.

It certainly has worked.

[Mibbes Aye]

Love the pink in this test match. Such a great cause.

:agree:

Glenn and the folk behind him have made it an institution. Like you say, great cause and it's undoubtedly raised awareness, albeit for tragic reasons.

[Mibbes Aye]

Steady start by Australia. Smith is a joy to watch at bat, as Lord Bunberry pointed out.

Khawaja isn't a cricketer I like but he's done well and worked for his century.

Australia just need to pile on the runs, regardless of individual scores, and ask questions of England in their third innings.

[lord bunberry]

I think he adapted his style later on in his career.

It certainly has worked.

I think you’re correct there. He came into the team as a spin bowler.

[Mibbes Aye]

I think you’re correct there. He came into the team as a spin bowler.

You're right, he did. I vaguely remember his debut.

Fast forward and suddenly he's one of the top four batsmen in the world and then the top batsman in the world.

It's sort of why I love cricket. It doesn't make sense like football does, but makes sense like cricket does.

And cricket sense is complicated and subtle and would take an age to explain to someone new to the game but by God, it's wondrous and beautiful! :greengrin

I love football but I feel sorry for people who don't love cricket.

[Mibbes Aye]

At the risk of tempting fate, good, patient batting by Khawaja and Smith.

[Mibbes Aye]

And that's a lovely shot by Khawaja for four. Great timing and a great dispatch.

[Mibbes Aye]

........waits for Smith to get his century.......

.......waits for Smith to get his double century.......

[Mibbes Aye]

Cracking catch of his own bowling by Moeen!...

That's got to do wonders for his confidence.

[Mibbes Aye]

........waits for Smith to get his century.......

.......waits for Smith to get his double century.......

Got that one a bit wrong :greengrin

[--------]

Cracking catch of his own bowling by Moeen!...

That's got to do wonders for his confidence.


Terrific delivery, terrific catch. :aok:

Crane very unlucky - bang-on lbw, no ball by a whisker.

[Mibbes Aye]

Terrific delivery, terrific catch. :aok:

Crane very unlucky - bang-on lbw, no ball by a whisker.

:agree:

The beauty of cricket - it's so nuanced and subtle.

[Mibbes Aye]

Good third day for Australia, no doubt about that. Credit to England, they didn't give up and worked hard but couldn't make a breakthrough (or when they did they were no-balled :greengrin).

There's something nice about the Marsh brothers making a hundred stand together - I think that's their first at Test level.

I like Mitchell Marsh a lot. His figures are that of a jobbing all-rounder, though his batting average will be better as a consequence of this innings, but he just seems to have a natural pleasure in finding himself on the pitch and playing the game.

Day four prediction - Australia to see off the impending new ball, then swashbuckle with the bat and either get out or set up a declaration, probably a few overs before tea or halfway through the evening session.

[Mibbes Aye]

Watched the highlights of the second day at Newlands, South Africa vs India earlier. I think it's fair to say it's an entertaining game. As with the first day, we saw both sides bat.

For South Africa, Quinton de Kock showed well with the gloves, to add to his undoubted talent with the bat. Kagiso Rabada is a very exciting young bowler and I look forward to watching his career develop.

For India it was a great knock by Hardik Pandya. He is very, very early on in his Test career, to the extent that he's not even played in India yet at Test level (tour of Sri Lanka and now South Africa) but he is averaging just under 60 with the bat and under 24 with the ball. I'll be astonished if he has those figures by the end of 2018 but he's certainly one to watch. I've got tickets for days 2 and 3 of the Edgbaston Test this summer so hopefully will see him in the flesh.

Really sorry that Dale Steyn has been ruled out for the series, he's only just back from a bad injury.

[Mibbes Aye]

Nice to see Shaun Marsh get his ton, alongside his brother. You could tell it meant a lot to both of them.

England not taking the new ball yet, it's a bit of a gamble. Literally as I typed that sentence they decided to take it!!

Not sure about the decision, there is a lot of spin in the pitch but when you have your two leading wicket-takers of all time in the side then you want to give them every advantage.

I think this pitch offers so much to the Aussie quicks and Lyon. Hard to see how the series doesn't end 0-4.

Broad will be chasing his 400th wicket soon. It's an outstanding achievement should he make it.

[Mibbes Aye]

Confused by England's approach.

They take the new ball and then give it to Moeen and Crane?

Why hasn't Broad bowled yet?

[Mibbes Aye]

Confused by England's approach.

They take the new ball and then give it to Moeen and Crane?

Why hasn't Broad bowled yet?

Goes for nine off the over when he gets his start. I guess that's why he hasn't been bowling.

[Mibbes Aye]

Goes for nine off the over when he gets his start. I guess that's why he hasn't been bowling.

And another nine of his next over. Expensive stuff from Broad.

[Mibbes Aye]

And Mitchell Marsh reaches his century. Lovely stuff. Seemingly only the third pair of brothers to achieve it in the same match and both previous were Australian.

[Mibbes Aye]

Cracking delivery by Tom Curran to take Marsh's wicket.

I really like the look of this young bowler and I suspect he may have a long and fruitful career for England.

[Mibbes Aye]

Australia edge the lead to over two hundred. Got to imagine they will push on and try and get to the psychological barrier of three hundred and then declare.

[lord bunberry]

I know there’s not many of us contributing to this thread, but if we were to do a johnyboy type this is how it feels thread, how would you summarise the series?
I was expecting a series win for Australia, but I thought England would have put up more of a fight. The biggest disappointment has been the flat pitches, but I suppose that’s what the Aussie team wanted.

[Mibbes Aye]

I know there’s not many of us contributing to this thread, but if we were to do a johnyboy type this is how it feels thread, how would you summarise the series?
I was expecting a series win for Australia, but I thought England would have put up more of a fight. The biggest disappointment has been the flat pitches, but I suppose that’s what the Aussie team wanted.

The elephant in the room is the absence of Stokes. Having said that I think it's always been a case of how much do Australia win by, regardless of whether Stokes was available. Also, James Pattinson would have been in the frame for Australia had he not been injured. That raises the question of whether they went with an awesomely aggressive pace quartet or whether they stuck with three. Going with three quicks and picking Pattinson means choosing to drop one of the others and I'd hate to make that decision

England haven't been able to take twenty wickets in a match yet, and that's what you need to do to win a Test match. All three of the Australian top seamers and their spinner are in double figures. And that's what you need to win Test matches.

Batting-wise, Steve Smith has had the kind of series that you talk about for years to come. Shaun Marsh has done more than anybody from the England camp and utterly justified his recall, good selection. Warner, Mitchell Marsh, Khawaja and Paine have all contributed at key times. Typically for Australia, they've also been able to rely on their bowlers to produce runs and Pat Cummins leads the way there. If he can stay fit then they've got a cracker of a player there.

Bowling-wise, as said, Starc, Cummins and Hazlewood have all delivered and impressed at different times. Nathan Lyon has seen out what is almost certainly the best calendar year of his career, in fact up there with the best of all time and deserves a lot more praise than I think he is getting.

For England, at bat the new guys have probably slightly exceeded expectations and the old guard have let them down. Malan has had a good tour and shown he can bat. He will move up the order and if Root continues to hide from three then I can see Malan slotting in there. Stoneman looks resilient and I think he will keep his place for the NZ tour and then the summer. My problem is that Cook won't be around much longer, so where is the succession planning? Stoneman, as decent as he is, isn't anywhere near Cook's level and England have no idea who would partner him. Vince has shown he is good at the things he is good at (mainly the cover drive), but that's all. He might make the NZ tour but he's not the future for England.

With the experienced guys, Root has probably tried to do too much as captain and that's affected his batting. Converting his 50s into 100s now seems to be a psychological issue. Cook, meanwhile, struggled to find his touch and it became an issue in itself. Bairstow was batting far too low down the order, especially when it became clear Stokes wouldn't play and when it became clear that Moeen wasn't able to find form.

Bowling-wise, Anderson has put in a tremendous shift and he deserves enormous credit. He's had to make up for Broad and Moeen and he's done so. He's at the tailend of his career yet he's bowling like he's at the outset. Overton looked good prior to his injury. I like Woakes but he's had a difficult time.

Regarding the spinners, England are paying for not properly replacing Graeme Swann. I really like Moeen but he's been cruelly exposed as a bowler here. Mason Crane has a great attitude but is very, very raw.

On the plus side for England, I really like Tom Curran. I hope he gets his chance and is allowed to grow as a player. Critically, I think Root and Bairstow need to move up the order. Root to three, with Malan to four, and then maybe swapping once Malan has had a bit of experience higher up the order. Bairstow needs to go to five, be playing alongside higher-order players. That frees up a space either for Foakes or for Livingstone, Clarke or Lawrence.

[Mibbes Aye]

Great innings by Shaun Marsh. Should be a great cameo from the Australian tailenders to pile on a few before Steve Smith calls them in.

[Mibbes Aye]

Great innings by Shaun Marsh. Should be a great cameo from the Australian tailenders to pile on a few before Steve Smith calls them in.

Poor loss of his wicket by Stoneman.

Is it wrong to have a sweepstake on when England lose?

[Mibbes Aye]

Bowled Gazza!

What a delivery.

Hats off to Cook, twelve thousand runs is an achievement.

[Mibbes Aye]

Play underway in Sydney. Moeen in for Root, but the skipper is in the ground. Hopefully he is able to participate later, after his hospitalisation.

Interesting comments by Paul Farbrace, the England assistant coach. He's certainly not left anything unsaid, but is almost certainly spot-on. I suspect it reflects the fact that a very good England team of ten or so years ago have dissipated while a weak Australian team over the last decade have managed to start to sort themselves out. Australia still need a lot of work to get back to their position of international dominance but a decent Aussie side will always trump anything less than a very good English side, on Australian soil.

This is a decent Aussie side, who need to work out three or four batting positions. This is an England side that's good but not very good and have to work out three or four batting positions and maybe a decision or two in the bowling department.

[Mibbes Aye]

And Lyon snags Moeen plumb, for what I think is the seventh time?

Outstanding series for Lyon, Moeen's misery continues.

Lots of credit to Root, making his way out to the crease. Physically and mentally, it's a big ask.

[Mibbes Aye]

Sorry for the gap, great delivery by Cummins to take Broad's wicket.

For me, Pat Cummins is the man of the series. He's played it through and over-ridden his injury concerns, bowled at 90mph-plus and taken key wickets, while putting in handy runs several times.

Anyone else want to nominate their man of the series?

[Mibbes Aye]

Another good wicket by Cummins.

He's taken big wickets but he's also tidied up the lower order.

Really looking forward to the Aussies touring South Africa. The pitches will suit both bowling attacks. Hopefully Dale Steyn recovers quickly, that would make for some series, in terms of fast bowling line-ups.

[Mibbes Aye]

Lovely couple of balls played by Tom Curran, three in fact if you include how he ducked the bouncer.

Nice batting, fair bowling.

[Mibbes Aye]

That was a great over between Curran and Cummins and exemplifies what Test cricket is about.

[Mibbes Aye]

Cracking drive to the boundary, showing great footwork by Curran. Really like him.

[Mibbes Aye]

And that's that!

Some great cricket. England played well at times but never really looked like winning the series, though at times they challenged for matches.

Australia just did it, whenever they were asked - two innings victories and a ten-wicket result tell their own story.

[Mibbes Aye]

Been some cracking posts on this thread, it's made it a pleasure to read.

Thanks for all the contributions :agree:

[HibernianJK]

Don’t think you can argue with Smith as MOTS. Historic level of class and consistency. England totally outclassed.

[stantonhibby]

Sorry for the gap, great delivery by Cummins to take Broad's wicket.

For me, Pat Cummins is the man of the series. He's played it through and over-ridden his injury concerns, bowled at 90mph-plus and taken key wickets, while putting in handy runs several times.

Anyone else want to nominate their man of the series?

Has to be Smith......and then either Cummins or Lyon.

For England, Malan then Anderson.

[--------]

Devil's Advocate time.

One thing that does concern me is the way everyone on the England bus seems determined to talk things up.

"Not a disaster."

"We played well, but lost it at crucial moments."

"We prepared as well as we possibly could have."

"We all worked really hard in the nets - don't see what we could have done differently."

"England's unity a huge positive."

And so on ....

4-0 (and a draw that was down to the pitch rather than any residual gutsiness on England's part) looks pretty much like a disaster to me.

I REALLY don't think Douglas Jardine, Brian Close, or Ray Illingworth would have been happy with that sort of return.

And before anyone gets the wrong idea, I'm not blaming Joe Root; he's an exemplary professional and a thoroughly decent man.

In my opinion he was badly let down by his vice-captain long before the tour began; too many senior players have come nowhere near the form that should have been expected of them; and the 'Avenue' night-club must be ever so grateful for the free publicity Bairstow (old enough to know better) and Duckett (supposedly there or thereabouts for selection to the senior team and also old enough to know better, especially after Bairstow's tour de force) gave them.

There must be questions about the coaching. Moeen was out the same way to the same bowler almost every time he went in. Vince gets in, and then out. Over and over again. Cook seemed to be in a daze for the first three matches. Isn't that the sort of thing coaches are supposed to deal with? Maybe I'm not seeing something others are seeing, but the team looked half-cooked at the Gabba - they competed for two innings then collapsed like an ill-done souffle. And then it got worse in Adelaide. And worse in Perth. And at the MCG. And then at the SCG. Apart from Melbourne, these matches weren't close-run affairs - they were tankings.

I think that anyone who missed this tour for whatever reason did themselves a favour. The senior players need to give themselves a good shake, waken up and give their captain proper support. The selectors and coaches need to waken up and pick and prepare a competitive side, with an eye on Australia coming to England in what - 18 months' time? because Smith gave them fair warning - he wants to keep the urn by winning in England, and my guess would be that everything between now and then will only really matter to the Aussies in terms of how it assists them in achieving that end. And believe it or not, I really would like to see England beating them next time around. But frankly, I don't see it happening.

[--------]

In cricket stats may not be everything, but they matter a hell of a lot.

Bradman - 0.06 short of the ton - do you think he cared? Sure he did. He never got over it. :devil:

So here are the stats.

The England batting/bowling averages for the series. :tsk tsk:

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/averages/batting_bowling_by_team.html?id=11645;team=1;type= series (http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/averages/batting_bowling_by_team.html?id=11645;team=1;type= series)

The Australia batting/bowling averages for the series. :not worth

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/averages/batting_bowling_by_team.html?id=11645;team=2;type= series

:hmmm:

I rest my case, m'Lud. :bitchy:

[--------]

I'll calm down now. I've had my rant. :greengrin

[Mibbes Aye]

I'll calm down now. I've had my rant. :greengrin

:greengrin

Your stats point is critical IMO.

Only four Australians took wickets. But it was their top four and they all took twenty or more, with three of them averaging in the mid-twenties for runs. Lyon averaged just over 29 but bowled more overs than anyone else in the series.

Seven Australian batsmen averaged over forty, two averaged over 100. The Marsh brothers scored more centuries than the whole England team, despite being seen as iffy selections. Bancroft was the only one who needs to improve his figures and he has the benefit of being the new boy.

England's bowling was abysmal. Anderson is the only one who walks away with any credit. What's worse is the only others who averaged under forty were Overton, who went out injured after a brief cameo, and Root, a jobbing spinner (though ironically, his list of wickets is pretty impressive). For Curran and Crane it was chastening but they have time on their side - their figures remind me of Shane Warne's debut. Broad, Woakes and Ali all failed.

At bat, Root did okay but has now made the lack of conversion of 50s to 100s the sole talking point about his game. Malan did well, Cook is only in the 40s because of his unbeaten knock. Bairstow ever so slightly under-performed and Curran offered enough to make him look like a valuable lower-order batsman. Vince and Stoneman failed and although Vince outscored Stoneman both in total runs and individual scores, I think he's more vulnerable simply because England don't have opening options.

I completely agree with the sentiment of the first of your three posts. This was an absolute shambles for England. In 2019 they will have to hope they can crank a little bit more from a James Anderson who will be in his late thirties. They only bowled 55 wicket-taking deliveries and one-third of those were Jimmy's. They also have to sort out a batting order where they need to identify not just three or four batsmen but also shake up the order.

For Australia, their bowling unit looks set, which is what you need to win matches. Hazlewood in particular will relish English conditions and they have James Pattinson to come back. If Cummins maintains his form with the bat then it opens the door to them playing four quicks plus Lyon, while still having seven batsmen averaging forty-plus. That would be a fiercesome attack.

Still some questions for Australia with their batting line-up. For me only Smith and Warner are genuinely nailed-on places. They've got a tour of South Africa, limited overs games in England and hosting India this calendar year, so it should establish just what the team will look like when they visit England in 2019.

[hibee62]

Devil's Advocate time.

One thing that does concern me is the way everyone on the England bus seems determined to talk things up.

"Not a disaster."

"We played well, but lost it at crucial moments."

"We prepared as well as we possibly could have."

"We all worked really hard in the nets - don't see what we could have done differently."

"England's unity a huge positive."

And so on ....

4-0 (and a draw that was down to the pitch rather than any residual gutsiness on England's part) looks pretty much like a disaster to me.

I REALLY don't think Douglas Jardine, Brian Close, or Ray Illingworth would have been happy with that sort of return.

And before anyone gets the wrong idea, I'm not blaming Joe Root; he's an exemplary professional and a thoroughly decent man.

In my opinion he was badly let down by his vice-captain long before the tour began; too many senior players have come nowhere near the form that should have been expected of them; and the 'Avenue' night-club must be ever so grateful for the free publicity Bairstow (old enough to know better) and Duckett (supposedly there or thereabouts for selection to the senior team and also old enough to know better, especially after Bairstow's tour de force) gave them.

There must be questions about the coaching. Moeen was out the same way to the same bowler almost every time he went in. Vince gets in, and then out. Over and over again. Cook seemed to be in a daze for the first three matches. Isn't that the sort of thing coaches are supposed to deal with? Maybe I'm not seeing something others are seeing, but the team looked half-cooked at the Gabba - they competed for two innings then collapsed like an ill-done souffle. And then it got worse in Adelaide. And worse in Perth. And at the MCG. And then at the SCG. Apart from Melbourne, these matches weren't close-run affairs - they were tankings.

I think that anyone who missed this tour for whatever reason did themselves a favour. The senior players need to give themselves a good shake, waken up and give their captain proper support. The selectors and coaches need to waken up and pick and prepare a competitive side, with an eye on Australia coming to England in what - 18 months' time? because Smith gave them fair warning - he wants to keep the urn by winning in England, and my guess would be that everything between now and then will only really matter to the Aussies in terms of how it assists them in achieving that end. And believe it or not, I really would like to see England beating them next time around. But frankly, I don't see it happening.

It’s been a fairly consistent story across test cricket recently that no one wins away from home, there’s no stand out team as in the days of the great Aussie or West Indies teams.

If we think of it that way and treat the last ashes and this as a 2-legged home/away series, Australia are 6-3 winners which is probably a better reflection than 4-0 of the two teams’ abilities. I also think boycott is right, however, when he says the Aussies are a lot closer to winning in England than England are to winning in Australia. 2019 could be interesting, not least because it will be the end for broad/Anderson/Cook if it doesn’t come before then!

[Mibbes Aye]

It’s been a fairly consistent story across test cricket recently that no one wins away from home, there’s no stand out team as in the days of the great Aussie or West Indies teams.

If we think of it that way and treat the last ashes and this as a 2-legged home/away series, Australia are 6-3 winners which is probably a better reflection than 4-0 of the two teams’ abilities. I also think boycott is right, however, when he says the Aussies are a lot closer to winning in England than England are to winning in Australia. 2019 could be interesting, not least because it will be the end for broad/Anderson/Cook if it doesn’t come before then!

Of the three of them, Broad actually looks closest to being done. Anderson was able to bring his game and while Cook struggled, he pulled it out for at least one innings in a big way. Broad had a horrendous series.

I think there's an important decision for England. A conservative choice would be to hope all three can play a part in 2019. They certainly won't be there for the next tour in 2021. The other option is to tackle the challenge of replacing them. No small decision - their best opener and their two leading seamers.

To an extent I think they find themselves in the situation Australia did just a few years ago - players like Warne, McGrath, Gilchrist, Hayden and Langer all retiring within a short space of time.

Stoneman hasn't entirely convinced, so England are really looking at finding two openers and two opening seamers. That's a big ask, as they do have emerging talent but it is very much in the middle order.

[Mibbes Aye]

It’s been a fairly consistent story across test cricket recently that no one wins away from home, there’s no stand out team as in the days of the great Aussie or West Indies teams.

If we think of it that way and treat the last ashes and this as a 2-legged home/away series, Australia are 6-3 winners which is probably a better reflection than 4-0 of the two teams’ abilities. I also think boycott is right, however, when he says the Aussies are a lot closer to winning in England than England are to winning in Australia. 2019 could be interesting, not least because it will be the end for broad/Anderson/Cook if it doesn’t come before then!

That's generally true and no surprise but over the last five years we've seen Pakistan, India and New Zealand win in the West Indies; South Africa and Australia win in New Zealand; England and Australia win in South Africa; India, Pakistan, South Africa and Australia win in Sri Lanka; Sri Lanka win in England; England win in India and South Africa win in England and Australia

[--------]

I've calmed down - honest.

But just a thought.

Who's the batting coach? Mark Ramprakash.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, and I'm sure he does his best. He is, after all a former England Test batsman - IIRC batting 3 or 4, maybe 5?

BUT - STATS.

He played in 52 Tests, scoring 2350 runs at an average of 27.32.

In all those Tests he scored 2 centuries and 12 half-centuries; top score 154.

Do I detect a pattern? A coach moulding players in his own image?




And I'm still not impressed by Trevor Bayliss.

Though Paul Farbrace seems to have a much more realistic view of the situation.

[Mibbes Aye]

I've calmed down - honest.

But just a thought.

Who's the batting coach? Mark Ramprakash.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, and I'm sure he does his best. He is, after all a former England Test batsman - IIRC batting 3 or 4, maybe 5?

BUT - STATS.

He played in 52 Tests, scoring 2350 runs at an average of 27.32.

In all those Tests he scored 2 centuries and 12 half-centuries; top score 154.

Do I detect a pattern? A coach moulding players in his own image?




And I'm still not impressed by Trevor Bayliss.

Though Paul Farbrace seems to have a much more realistic view of the situation.

'Ramps' is indeed the coach. Fine first-class player but an eternal failure at Test level.

[--------]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42617727

Looks like we're stuck with Bayliss. :no way:


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42607644

Lot of sense here from Aggers. Totally agree about the Bairstow business, and about the home-and-away split in form.

It'll be interesting to see what happens in NZ.

[Mibbes Aye]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42617727

Looks like we're stuck with Bayliss. :no way:


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42607644

Lot of sense here from Aggers. Totally agree about the Bairstow business, and about the home-and-away split in form.

It'll be interesting to see what happens in NZ.

NZ should be slightly more favourable wickets but England will still have to face a very passionate team and in Kane Williamson, one of the top batsmen in the world, who is yet to make a big score this season. Sounds like it is scripted already.

Interesting where England go from here. I remember them in the eighties and nineties, where they dropped several players every game and it simply didn't work. Nevertheless Toby Roland-Jones would appear to be an obvious choice when fit. Craig Overton did just enough to justify a run, when fit.

It's the batting where the most change is needed. I would be wanting and expecting England to go back to Haseeb Hameed, which would justify a transition from Cook to Stoneman, as the senior opener. If Root won't move to three (which is an abdication of responsibility IMO) then we are looking at Malan moving up, quite the promotion.

Bairstow needs to bat higher, at five IMO. If he can't do that and keep wicket then I would bring in Foakes at eight, with the gloves, behind Bairstow, Stokes and Ali. That's a deep tail.

England simply don't have bowling pace and with the nature of the home schedule they don't really need to. I've heard good things about George Garton and Jofra Archer but both are still a way away from the Test side.

That being the case they need to play to their strengths, which at the moment is a very deep batting order. They need to try and sustain that while bleeding in a new attack. Roland-Jones, if fit, can replace either Broad or Anderson. Overton has been keen but it's doubtful whether he has the capability of being one of the two senior seamers. And there's a gap in the spinning department that Mason Crane may or may notfill.

For all the talk about the Australian quicks, their spinner still took 20+ wickets and dominated a predominantly left-sided England batting line-up. Moeen is a batsman who can deliver a bit of spin. They need to find a spinner who justifies selection on his bowling abilities alone.

[--------]

NZ should be slightly more favourable wickets but England will still have to face a very passionate team and in Kane Williamson, one of the top batsmen in the world, who is yet to make a big score this season. Sounds like it is scripted already.

Interesting where England go from here. I remember them in the eighties and nineties, where they dropped several players every game and it simply didn't work. Nevertheless Toby Roland-Jones would appear to be an obvious choice when fit. Craig Overton did just enough to justify a run, when fit.

It's the batting where the most change is needed. I would be wanting and expecting England to go back to Haseeb Hameed, which would justify a transition from Cook to Stoneman, as the senior opener. If Root won't move to three (which is an abdication of responsibility IMO) then we are looking at Malan moving up, quite the promotion.

Bairstow needs to bat higher, at five IMO. If he can't do that and keep wicket then I would bring in Foakes at eight, with the gloves, behind Bairstow, Stokes and Ali. That's a deep tail.

England simply don't have bowling pace and with the nature of the home schedule they don't really need to. I've heard good things about George Garton and Jofra Archer but both are still a way away from the Test side.

That being the case they need to play to their strengths, which at the moment is a very deep batting order. They need to try and sustain that while bleeding in a new attack. Roland-Jones, if fit, can replace either Broad or Anderson. Overton has been keen but it's doubtful whether he has the capability of being one of the two senior seamers. And there's a gap in the spinning department that Mason Crane may or may notfill.

For all the talk about the Australian quicks, their spinner still took 20+ wickets and dominated a predominantly left-sided England batting line-up. Moeen is a batsman who can deliver a bit of spin. They need to find a spinner who justifies selection on his bowling abilities alone.


I would agree with almost all of this.

Reasonable stability in selection while looking to find and/or develop the players they don't yet have - genuinely fast bowlers and spinners of quality to justify their selection on the basis of their bowling alone (they've had them in the past).

And batsmen who can make 25-30 (they've got plenty of those) and then go on to make 50 and then 100.

Not a lot to ask!

[Mibbes Aye]

I would agree with almost all of this.

Reasonable stability in selection while looking to find and/or develop the players they don't yet have - genuinely fast bowlers and spinners of quality to justify their selection on the basis of their bowling alone (they've had them in the past).

And batsmen who can make 25-30 (they've got plenty of those) and then go on to make 50 and then 100.

Not a lot to ask!

Stoneman, Hameed, Malan, Root, Bairstow, Clarke, Stokes, Ali, Overton, Roland-Jones, Garton is a top-of-the-head option for 2019 that allows for Broad, Cook and Anderson dropping out. If any of those three are still fit and equipped to play then all the better for England. If Bairstow can't wear the gloves and bat at five then he can drop to six, seven or eight, or Foakes comes in for Clarke. Clarke is interchangeable with Livingstone or Lawrence at this stage, I've no idea which of them might manage at Test level but they are the leading young contenders.

Getting back to Bairstow I'm sure Gilchrist batted at seven, maybe six sometimes, and he opened in the one-dayers, so there's no excuse for Bairstow not moving up the order. The limited but dedicated audience for this thread will be well-used to me bemoaning Root's failing to move up the order, Malan might save him the bother, but Root should assume some responsibility as captain and slot into three.

That would mean around two-thirds of the team being inexperienced or indeed debutants but you've got to start somewhere. For the newbies, Hameed and Malan look to be long-term solutions. Garton, and to an extent Foakes or Clarke are a gamble but if successful would offer a lot of years. Overton is similarly young but looks like a jobbing third or fourth seamer, who has the advantage of being able to throw the bat about a bit. Mason Crane looked promising but has yet to prove himself.

In fairness, Australia have to settle on a team as well - they look to have a bowling unit for at least the next five years but at bat only Warner and Smith are stick-ons with perhaps Mitchell Marsh as an all-rounder. They need to nail down their order and as per England perhaps need to push Smith up to three..

[Mibbes Aye]

There's been some talk about the disadvantage faced by the away team in Test cricket.

I read this BBC article (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42590656) earlier which gets into the detail of it all and was, I thought, quite interesting.

One of the key points for me is the nature of the touring schedule. Teams don't seem to have the patient and slow build-up away from home that they used to. England faced a CA XI twice and Western Australia in a two-dayer. That's not adequate preparation. The only Test players or contenders they faced were Tim Paine in one game and Nathan Coulter-Nile in another.

Yet despite that lack of preparation for the red-ball game, England won't be back home until April. I think it all reflects the pressures of trying to cram in the three forms of the game. There's a bigger market for a couple of T20 blasts than there is for a four-dayer in Canberra against the Chairman's XI. Unfortunately it's those four-dayers against a competitive select that allow touring teams to get up to speed for the Test series.

[stantonhibby]

Curran dropped from the squad for NZ which seems a bit harsh. Stokes is in the squad.

[Mibbes Aye]

Curran dropped from the squad for NZ which seems a bit harsh. Stokes is in the squad.

I think it's harsh too but with Anderson, Broad, Woakes, Overton and Wood all in then he wouldn't get a game. I think England are making that commonplace mistake of re-fighting their last battle, Wood could have done a job in Australia if fit. NZ pitches aren't quite the same.

I think it would have been a vote of confidence in Curran and a nod to the future to include him. Glad to see Livingstone included though.

Also curious to see who Australia take to South Africa. The temptation will be to stick with the same but there's room for tweaking in the upper order.

[Mibbes Aye]

Entertaining first ODI between the two sides, Australia did decently in the first innings but England have a deep batting order in 50-over cricket that critically can be very fast-paced.

It does raise the 'what if' question around the keepers' gloves in the Test side. It looks like Buttler has long given up on a red-ball career and Bairstow is probably the better keeper - they are roughly the same age but with different career trajectories and Bairstow's stats are possibly slightly better, though it's open to interpretation.

Were Buttler to come in and Bairstow to be persuaded to pass the gloves then it allows the intriguing option of Jonny being asked to open (as he does in ODIs), as an explosive 'take the game to the opposition' player in the manner of David Warner. Can't see it happening though, and Ben Stokes being charged probably makes it even less likely. With the scenario I outlined there was the potential for Stokes to bat at five with one of the new youngsters, Buttler, Ali and Woakes all to follow, which gives England real depth but also quick-scoring depth (on home soil at least) in their batting.

Looking forward to the rest of the ODI series.

On another continent, I've been enjoying the play between South Africa and India too. The Second Test is nicely poised with India needing the win to stay alive. Interestingly, given the talk earlier in the thread about 'home' pitches, Morne Morkel came out and said Centurion was playing more like an Indian pitch and it's fair to say he wasn't exaggerating - I think unusually high humidity has made the difference. Some really talented players on display in this series and the outcome will set up the Australian tour nicely, whichever way it ends up.

[HibernianJK]

People say that touring countries are at a disadvantage when abroad due to pitches etc. Surely it is up to the touring countries to adapt their squad to best suit the conditions then. Now whether ya believe Mark Wood was fit for England or not (seems like he was having gone 10 good overs in first ODI) England needed to include 1/2 real pace bowlers who get some bounce out of the pitch. They’re insistence on sticking with the old guard doesn’t help anyone.

[Mibbes Aye]

People say that touring countries are at a disadvantage when abroad due to pitches etc. Surely it is up to the touring countries to adapt their squad to best suit the conditions then. Now whether ya believe Mark Wood was fit for England or not (seems like he was having gone 10 good overs in first ODI) England needed to include 1/2 real pace bowlers who get some bounce out of the pitch. They’re insistence on sticking with the old guard doesn’t help anyone.

There's an argument that England just aren't producing Test bowlers who can deliver real pace. It's not that it's impossible - Steve Harmison was considered one of the fastest in the world a few years ago and he had Simon Jones and occasionally Flintoff reaching 90+mph.

One reason put forward is the proliferation of the shorter game - English summers are now built around the popular and profitable T20 and 50-over games, with the County Championship games pushed to the start and the end of the season. The County Championship should be the breeding ground for Test players but playing games at the start and end generally means softer pitches which reward the kind of persistent seam bowling that has made Anderson and Broad so successful.

All in all it seems to reflect a very conservative outlook, that must be a conscious decision by the National Cricket Performance Centre, wherby overseas opportunities are sacrificed to maximise home chances.

[Mibbes Aye]

Entertaining end to the SAF-India Test with the South Africans securing the series.

I was sorry to see Dale Steyn miss out through injury but Lungi Ndidi came in on debut and produced a pretty accomplished six-for. SAF have a fiercesome pace attack and the series against Australia is a mouth-watering prospect.

Philander and Morkel still have a few years in them, you would imagine, and then you have Kabiso Rabada and Ndidi, who are in their early twenties and look like they might easily transition into being the senior attack pair, allowing the next couple of quicks to come through.

Some really good fielding by the South Africans to wrap up the game also.

[Mibbes Aye]

England really did well in the second ODI - such strength in their batting order, which allows them to play with a certain abandon. It bodes well for next year's World Cup.

Woakes delivered what I'd hoped for in the Test series - reliable, economical bowling and a flourish with the bat. Bairstow and Hales put together a fine stand to set the foundation for victory, and Root will have taken a lot of pleasure from his performance in both innings.

For Australia, obviously Hazlewood, Cummins and Paine all missing - I liked the look of Alex Carey who debuted with the gloves. He is a late starter - I understand he was playing top-flight Aussie Rules until four or so years ago. Early days yet, but he might be a long-term solution behind the stumps for Australia. Likewise Jhye Richardson looked tidy with his two wickets, but he's barely played any first-class cricket yet, so there's a fair way to go.

Quite the turnaround for England - after being trounced in the Test series, they go into the weekend looking to win the ODI series with two matches to spare!

[ACLeith]

England really did well in the second ODI - such strength in their batting order, which allows them to play with a certain abandon. It bodes well for next year's World Cup.

Woakes delivered what I'd hoped for in the Test series - reliable, economical bowling and a flourish with the bat. Bairstow and Hales put together a fine stand to set the foundation for victory, and Root will have taken a lot of pleasure from his performance in both innings.

For Australia, obviously Hazlewood, Cummins and Paine all missing - I liked the look of Alex Carey who debuted with the gloves. He is a late starter - I understand he was playing top-flight Aussie Rules until four or so years ago. Early days yet, but he might be a long-term solution behind the stumps for Australia. Likewise Jhye Richardson looked tidy with his two wickets, but he's barely played any first-class cricket yet, so there's a fair way to go.

Quite the turnaround for England - after being trounced in the Test series, they go into the weekend looking to win the ODI series with two matches to spare!
I've enjoyed your comments and analysis over the series, what do you see are the main factors in the difference in performance between the 2 codes?

[HibernianJK]

England seem to have a really good settled one day side. Stokes will
Come back in but apart from that it seems a very settled 11. They have so many options with the bat and ball.

[Mibbes Aye]

I've enjoyed your comments and analysis over the series, what do you see are the main factors in the difference in performance between the 2 codes?

Thanks for that! If you mean the difference between how England perform, my opinion is that it's indicative of two different mindsets, one radical, one conservative.

At the last World Cup in 2015, England went out at the group stage in ignominious circumstances - thumped by Australia, New Zealand and Sri Lanka, and beaten by Bangladesh. It was pretty much rock-bottom for them and in the aftermath they decided to go for a complete overhaul of the one-day set-up. They revamped the contracts system to ensure players were better-paid and brought in a coach who had been successful in the limited-overs format (I won't mention him by name as it will get Doddie wound up!).

I think there were two other things that were more important yet, however. Firstly they changed the overall schedule to prioritise 50-over and T20 in the middle of summer. This pushed County cricket to either end of the season. More of that later. They also, crucially, encouraged players to participate in foreign leagues, especially the IPL. This allowed English players to play in a fiercely competitive environment, alongside the best T20 players in the world.

As a consequence English players and batsmen especially have developed their game and that's led to an almost embarrassment of riches in the batting order. Critically they all seem imbued with a very attacking spirit which means that they are taking the game to the opposition from the start and aren't reliant on one or two players, as there are runs all the way down into the bowling unit. The one-day side also have far more variety in the bowling. They can call on a couple of genuinely pace bowlers, a left-arm quick, and both an off-spinner and a leg-spinner.

It's this strength that means they don't rely on Ben Stokes the way the Test side does, among other things. His absence doesn't necessitate a rethink of team selection - in a Test match you don't know with any certainty how long you will be batting and bowling for, so having someone who can multi-task well like Stokes is vital. In limited-overs you know you will bat and bowl for x overs and decide the balance of the team based on your strength and the opposition, there's far fewer variables. Essentially, the utility of an all-rounder isn't quite as important (though Stokes' talent with bat and ball and his sheer aggression means that he would still be a stick-on for selection IMO).

Switching to the Test side, there doesn't seem to be the same desire to seek a radical solution to their woes. The English Test side are essentially two different beasts - a home side who are dominant (think they're unbeaten in eight series now and have won the majority) but unable to compete away - they've only one one away series of the last eight, and in five of those series they failed to win a single match!

One could be forgiven for making the assumption that the ECB have decided to settle for this outcome, in order to pursue success in limited-over cricket. To some extent it's hard to blame them as the game is being inexorably drawn in that direction, but by the same token, England are only hastening that process by their actions.

Coming back to the change to the schedule, this reinforces the difference between home and away performance. Pushing County cricket to the start and end of the season means that bowlers are learning their craft in the longer version of the game in conditions which don't suit out-and-out pace but do reward the kind of nagging seam bowling that has propelled Jimmy Anderson into the top ten all-time wicket-takers. It makes it harder for England to produce bowlers with the skill and thinking to bowl as genuine quicks over a five-day match.

Sorry for the length of answer, I do think the way the two codes are evolving is fascinating though. I really enjoy the razzmatazz of the T20 game and there's a lot to be said for the 50-over game and how sides pace themselves and change gears. Neither format will ever come close to the majesty of a good Test match for me though. There's a thread on another forum about "Things you don't 'get'" and someone posted 'Cricket' and a few posters replied explaining why they did love it and emphasising that it's just a very different experience to something timebound in the manner of football or rugby. Perhaps that's true of T20 and ODI too - it might be 22 players with some stumps, bats and ball but it can't really be understood or experienced in the same way as Test cricket?

[Mibbes Aye]

Interesting start to the third ODI with England finding it difficult to unleash their batting attack on a slow pitch, while Australia have the big guns back in their seam attack. Which leaves it all at 95-3 approaching the twentieth over.

I’ve opted for TMS tonight/this morning, rather than watching on BT. I’m glad because it’s been a pleasure to listen to the commentary of the great Jim Maxwell, the sonorous and ever-so-knowledgable Australian commentator who usually helms ABC in his homeland but is doing a bit of coverage for the Beeb.

I’ve also been impressed with Phil Tufnell. He seems to strike the right balance on TMS -makes sure he describes the delivery and can talk about the dynamics of the match and bring in his own experience and knowledge, yet still capable of a fanciful digression between balls, in the spirit of those who held the mic before him. I think he might become a fixture.

[Mibbes Aye]

And Root falls, Australia aren’t wanting to lose this series today!

Big psychological blow for England though Jos Buttler, the new batsman, is more than capable of turning a game around.

[Mibbes Aye]

And England lose a wicket just as they were hoping to accelerate. Morgan falls to make it 172-5 and their likely end score drops accordingly.

[Mibbes Aye]

Good wicket for Marsh to snap Moeen. Poor guy hasn’t had his troubles to seek on this tour. Hopefully he finds his form as he’s a very exciting player when he’s on his game and his bowling was picking up in the last two ODIs.

[Mibbes Aye]

What a fantastic partnership between Buttler and Woakes to see out the innings!

With two overs to go it was advantage Australia, but the two aforementioned went for it, piled on the runs and reached a century and a half-century respectively, while giving England a winnable score to defend.

Said it before, I’m relally pleased for Woakes. My natural sympathy is with Australia but that would never get in the way of appreciating good cricket or a good turn by a particular player. Woakes had a chastening Ashes but has batted well in the ODIs and hopefully he finds his length and line when he bowls.

[HibernianJK]

Smith given out but looks like it’s hit the deck for me. Under review.

[Mibbes Aye]

Great win for England to take the series, they deserve congratulations. In bowling I thought Wood was good and Woakes performed well, though his figures might not say as much, but given his performance with the bat then he's had a really great game.

For Australia, Finch was big again and showed why he's a prize catch in the IPL auction. I thought Stoinis did well also. Thinking about the World Cup next year, England don't need to do much and Australia have to figure out what their best XI is, and critically whether Glenn Maxwell will be part of that.

Going back to the game, I think Steve Smith was right to voice his concern about the 'soft signal'. It doesn't sit easy with me either.

Still, big boost for England after the Ashes collapse and they will fancy themselves for the whitewash.

[hibby6270]

One for the future.
Watch out for Lloyd Pope. Aussie leg spinner.
Watching the U19 World Cup QF earlier - AUS v ENG.
Eng bowled Aus out for 127 in 34 overs. Easy chase you would think.
Enter Mr Pope. Skittled England. 98 all out. Pope took 8 for 35.
Some performance, even at that level!!

[Mibbes Aye]

One for the future.
Watch out for Lloyd Pope. Aussie leg spinner.
Watching the U19 World Cup QF earlier - AUS v ENG.
Eng bowled Aus out for 127 in 34 overs. Easy chase you would think.
Enter Mr Pope. Skittled England. 98 all out. Pope took 8 for 35.
Some performance, even at that level!!

Good shout.

I’ve recorded the highlights, looking forward to watching them now.

[Mibbes Aye]

Great two sessions in the first day of the Third Test between South Africa and India.

India having to bat their socks off to stay in the game, with a fiercesome five-pronged South African seam attack that's generating lots of swing. Ngidi is the pick of the bunch so far, in only his second Test. Looks like he's got a big future. Final session just beginning, will be interesting to see what's left of India by the close of play.

[Mibbes Aye]

And that's that, SAF bowl India all out for 187. Pujara put on a stoic stand for his 50 from 179 balls but the pressure the South Africans were able to exert was relentless - five seamers, all bowling well and generating swing. Just no respite for the Indians though their quicks will fancy they can get something from this pitch.

[Mibbes Aye]

Tasty pitch still, with the Indians snatching a wicket and SAF sending in the nightwatchman to see the day out. You can tell there's something in the surface when you hear the commentator talk about four slips :greengrin

[Mibbes Aye]

One for the future.
Watch out for Lloyd Pope. Aussie leg spinner.
Watching the U19 World Cup QF earlier - AUS v ENG.
Eng bowled Aus out for 127 in 34 overs. Easy chase you would think.
Enter Mr Pope. Skittled England. 98 all out. Pope took 8 for 35.
Some performance, even at that level!!

Just watched the highlights

I thought Dillon Pennington, for England, looked handy with the ball, one for the future. He's with Worcs who have a decent record of blooding in young talent to County cricket, maybe most especially the very exciting Joe Clarke. Similarly Tom Banton looked like he might be something special with the bat - he also keeps wicket so we might yet have another contender to allow Bairstow to move up the order in the Test side.

What a brilliant recovery by Australia though, or rather by the ginger-maned Lloyd Pope. England simply couldn't play him. Credit too, to Sangha, fielding in the slips - three great catches of Pope's bowling.

[Mibbes Aye]

Quite a game in Adelaide! In the end Australia got home relatively comfortably though I thought England did well to steady the ship after an abysmal start and probably caused a few Aussie palpitations when it was their turn to bowl.

Woakes definitely the star of the show for England, but I thought Tom Curran made the most of his chance, at the expense of Liam Plunkett.

For Australia, the game highlighted the damage that two forensic and fast bowlers can do, with Hazlewood bowling exquisitely and Cummins producing his best bowling figures yet in ODIs.

I'm watching the India-SAF match at the moment on a Wanderers pitch that is still offering plenty to the fast bowlers well into day three. That makes for a salivating contest when the two sides meet, with their top-class pace attacks.

[Tobias Funke]

In regards to the SA v Ind game, its really scary just how good a pace attack SA have. They have the sadly forever injured Steyn (legend) on the sidelines but have some phenomenal talent on display. Philander and Rabada have brilliant averages, M Morkel on his day can be unplayable and the new kid on the block Ngidi looks like he has a bright future. All the talk recently has been of Starc, Hazelwood and Cummings but in my opinion they are nowhere close to the SA attack. Australia do have a far better spinner in Lyon though. The up and coming test series in SA will be interesting viewing.

[Mibbes Aye]

In regards to the SA v Ind game, its really scary just how good a pace attack SA have. They have the sadly forever injured Steyn (legend) on the sidelines but have some phenomenal talent on display. Philander and Rabada have brilliant averages, M Morkel on his day can be unplayable and the new kid on the block Ngidi looks like he has a bright future. All the talk recently has been of Starc, Hazelwood and Cummings but in my opinion they are nowhere close to the SA attack. Australia do have a far better spinner in Lyon though. The up and coming test series in SA will be interesting viewing.

Fair comment. The SAF quicks have looked frightening, especially on a borderline dangerous pitch like this but even on the unusually sticky Centurion.

I think you can also throw in Phelukwayo, another youngster who is being used sparingly this Test but still snagged Pujara and Pandya in the first innings. There's a bit of potential there.

For Australia, it will be interesting to see if James Pattinson will be fit in time. He would have been in the Ashes squad prior to his injury and it's curious as to whether he would have got in the XI ahead of one of the others. Cummins probably benefitted the most from his absence and certainly made the most of it. Pattinson is more than capable of bowling in the 90s, and that would give the Australians a genuinely strong four-pronged pace attack.

Lyon had a fantastic 2017 and I would agree, is better than anyone the South Africans can put forward. He's only got a handful of games across two tours there though and it's where he averages worst. Plus the South Africans don't have left-handers to the same extent as England. Only Dean Elgar and Quintin De Kock, and I think Elgar's fielding might be calling his place into question :greengrin

[patch1875]

Watch cricket from time to time but not very knowledgable I see Ben Stokes has gone for 1.4m in the IPL who is it payed too?

[Mibbes Aye]

Watch cricket from time to time but not very knowledgable I see Ben Stokes has gone for 1.4m in the IPL who is it payed too?

It depends. The starting point is that it all goes to the player but it is based on them being available for all the games and often they will miss games due to international commitments, in which case it will be reduced on a pro rata basis. I think some of the national governing boards may also charge a relatively small percentage for allowing the player to play outwith their central contract, but I’m not sure how consistent that is across the various countries. Also, I think it may be slightly different yet again for Indian players as I believe the BCCI has its own approach to player contracts.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

What a catch one handed on the boundary rope by Jordan to take NZ's third wicket, what a fielder that man is.

[lord bunberry]

What a catch one handed on the boundary rope by Jordan to take NZ's third wicket, what a fielder that man is.
I love the tension of 20/20 cricket, but compared to test match cricket, it’s like a different game. Some of the shots the batsmen play are unrecognisable to the longer game. I can understand why some of the purists don’t like it. I really enjoy it.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

You're not wrong, England need to develop a plan b in some of these games, just sending everyone in to attack at every opportunity doesn't always work, good to watch when it does though.

[Mibbes Aye]

I read today that Adil Rashid is giving up red-ball cricket with Yorkshire to focus solely on limited-overs. He's only 29. There seem to be speculation that Willey and Plunkett may follow suit which would appear to dramatically impact on YCCC's bowling strategy for Championship games.

Whether this is another blow to the longer game or whether it allows a new wave of bowlers who wish to specialise in the longer game to flourish will remain to be seen.

[lord bunberry]

I read today that Adil Rashid is giving up red-ball cricket with Yorkshire to focus solely on limited-overs. He's only 29. There seem to be speculation that Willey and Plunkett may follow suit which would appear to dramatically impact on YCCC's bowling strategy for Championship games.

Whether this is another blow to the longer game or whether it allows a new wave of bowlers who wish to specialise in the longer game to flourish will remain to be seen.
I wonder how much things like the IPL and the big bash have on these decisions. England are starting a similar series soon as well I believe. The money in the IPL is life changing for these guys.

[Mibbes Aye]

I wonder how much things like the IPL and the big bash have on these decisions. England are starting a similar series soon as well I believe. The money in the IPL is life changing for these guys.

I think that's undoubtedly a contributing factor. Centrally-contracted players for England aren't on bad salaries and sponsorship and media deals all add on, but the value of a two-month contract in one of the T20 leagues can boost earnings exponentially.

Interestingly, Rashid knew he wasn't getting an IPL or Pakistani Super League contract. I think someone said previously, might have been you, that essentially Tests and limited-overs are two different sports now. Yes, it's 11v11 with bats, stumps and a ball, but the strategy, tactics and decision-making are so far removed from each other that it becomes pointless to compare.

To an extent that's becoming true about the difference between ODI and T20 now as well. It's no surprise that players are starting to opt for white ball only, just on those grounds, let alone for financial reasons, as trying to successfully adapt your play to three different approaches on a month-to-month or week-to-week basis must be supremely challenging.

There was a humorous article earlier today, in F365, that suggested football should emulate cricket with its Test - ODI - T20 approach of different degrees of instant thrills. The suggestion was football could have football, as we know it - futsal or fives - and what we used to call 'World Cup Willie', but also goes by the name of 'cuppies' or 'Wembley Doubles'. Someone goes in goal and then everyone else, either singly or in pairs has to try and score. Once you score you're in the next round. Last one (or two) standing gets eliminated, then you do it again and again until you have a victor.

If you had that featuring a player or a pair from say every Premiership or EPL team, then it could be quite entertaining. Sort of Brian Jacks' Superstars meets T20 but with a football and a set of goals.

[lord bunberry]

I think that's undoubtedly a contributing factor. Centrally-contracted players for England aren't on bad salaries and sponsorship and media deals all add on, but the value of a two-month contract in one of the T20 leagues can boost earnings exponentially.

Interestingly, Rashid knew he wasn't getting an IPL or Pakistani Super League contract. I think someone said previously, might have been you, that essentially Tests and limited-overs are two different sports now. Yes, it's 11v11 with bats, stumps and a ball, but the strategy, tactics and decision-making are so far removed from each other that it becomes pointless to compare.

To an extent that's becoming true about the difference between ODI and T20 now as well. It's no surprise that players are starting to opt for white ball only, just on those grounds, let alone for financial reasons, as trying to successfully adapt your play to three different approaches on a month-to-month or week-to-week basis must be supremely challenging.

There was a humorous article earlier today, in F365, that suggested football should emulate cricket with its Test - ODI - T20 approach of different degrees of instant thrills. The suggestion was football could have football, as we know it - futsal or fives - and what we used to call 'World Cup Willie', but also goes by the name of 'cuppies' or 'Wembley Doubles'. Someone goes in goal and then everyone else, either singly or in pairs has to try and score. Once you score you're in the next round. Last one (or two) standing gets eliminated, then you do it again and again until you have a victor.

If you had that featuring a player or a pair from say every Premiership or EPL team, then it could be quite entertaining. Sort of Brian Jacks' Superstars meets T20 but with a football and a set of goals.
Well it’s a theory :greengrin
In all seriousness I would really hope that the money generated from these T20 leagues would be invested into giving test players the financial security so that they don’t feel the need to look at the 20/20 leagues as a way of securing their financial security.

[Mibbes Aye]

The hotly-anticipated Test series between South Africa and Australia started a few days ago. I’m on holiday and haven’t been able to see any footage, just relying on news reports but it’s going to be an Australian victory barring a miracle that would go down in Test history - Australia need one wicket to win with a full day’s play tomorrow and SAF trailing by well over a hundred runs, on a pitch that started deteriorating from the outset, by the sounds of it.

Performance-wise, SAF seem to be emulating the Australian team of a couple of years ago, with collapses in both their innings and a lack of significant partnerships.

Australia seem to have addressed that issue, all their specialist batsmen bar Khawaja finding runs, but importantly also forming partnerships to some degree. In addition, the bowling quartet seem to guarantee 40-50 runs as a minimum, and often more, which makes for a critical contribution.

Bowling-wise, they seem to have found a great combo, with the aggression of Cummins and Starc, the precision of Hazlewood and the patience of Lyon. I suspect SAF will respond positively to defeat however and the Second Test should be a belter.

[lord bunberry]

The hotly-anticipated Test series between South Africa and Australia started a few days ago. I’m on holiday and haven’t been able to see any footage, just relying on news reports but it’s going to be an Australian victory barring a miracle that would go down in Test history - Australia need one wicket to win with a full day’s play tomorrow and SAF trailing by well over a hundred runs, on a pitch that started deteriorating from the outset, by the sounds of it.

Performance-wise, SAF seem to be emulating the Australian team of a couple of years ago, with collapses in both their innings and a lack of significant partnerships.

Australia seem to have addressed that issue, all their specialist batsmen bar Khawaja finding runs, but importantly also forming partnerships to some degree. In addition, the bowling quartet seem to guarantee 40-50 runs as a minimum, and often more, which makes for a critical contribution.

Bowling-wise, they seem to have found a great combo, with the aggression of Cummins and Starc, the precision of Hazlewood and the patience of Lyon. I suspect SAF will respond positively to defeat however and the Second Test should be a belter.
South Africa are bowling beautifully right now in the second test. Australia are 117/3, but I can see a few more wickets falling before the days out.

[Mibbes Aye]

South Africa are bowling beautifully right now in the second test. Australia are 117/3, but I can see a few more wickets falling before the days out.

Australia made a good start, survived that tricky opening spell with a bit of moisture in the pitch and then started to put on the runs.

All credit to the South African attack though and what an absolutely exciting young pace pair are Rabada and Ngidi - eight between them at comfortably under 20 a wicket.

Philander deserves praise too, he bowled exceptionally tightly, giving away precious few runs and snagging the first two wickets.

It's a pitch that looks like it may offer something to the Australian bowlers tomorrow. They have already contributed though - their 35 runs will have played a big part should this match go in Australia's favour.

[Mibbes Aye]

Cracking day's play on the second day of the 3rd Test at Cape Town.

I missed the first day's play but caught the highlights of the second, and where to start?

Dean Elgar makes a bit of history for himself, Morne Morkel reaches 300 wickets, and Australia fire up a tail end response again - though it was all Nathan Lyon, with the support of Tim Paine.

The best bit was the battle between Rabada and Warner - the former the shockingly fast and aggressive young bowler, the latter the more-seasoned but equally aggressive opening bat.

Rabada got battered for runs initially but eventually ripped out Warner's off stump. Classic cameo of the battle between two world-class players - one with the ball, one with the bat.

[lord bunberry]

Cracking day's play on the second day of the 3rd Test at Cape Town.

I missed the first day's play but caught the highlights of the second, and where to start?

Dean Elgar makes a bit of history for himself, Morne Morkel reaches 300 wickets, and Australia fire up a tail end response again - though it was all Nathan Lyon, with the support of Tim Paine.

The best bit was the battle between Rabada and Warner - the former the shockingly fast and aggressive young bowler, the latter the more-seasoned but equally aggressive opening bat.

Rabada got battered for runs initially but eventually ripped out Warner's off stump. Classic cameo of the battle between two world-class players - one with the ball, one with the bat.
I’ve also only seen the highlights, but it’s refreshing to see the South African bowlers bowling with real pace. I don’t know about you, but I think if they could do that on the road, we’re looking at the number one test side in the world right now.

[Mibbes Aye]

I’ve also only seen the highlights, but it’s refreshing to see the South African bowlers bowling with real pace. I don’t know about you, but I think if they could do that on the road, we’re looking at the number one test side in the world right now.

I don't know what the reserves are like but they have two brilliant young talents in Ngidi and Rabada. The trick may be in ensuring they stay fit as they are so young and will be asked to do so much!

Backing that up, Morkel and Philander - you couldn't ask for much more, though they are obviously a bit older. Nevertheless that's a pace quartet for at least two or three years.

Batting-wise, there's strength there. I have real hopes for Quinton De Kock, the keeper/batsman - he started his career with a flourish, it's maybe settled down a bit now but he's at the age where he can push on and become a key player over the next decade for SAF.

I think you're right about touring - there will be some broadly comparable surfaces in Australia and the Winidies but not always. And there will be very different surfaces in the sub-continent and in England.

It's the beauty of Test cricket, it's always fluctuating. The matches in the next twelve months (basically until the conclusion of the Indian tour in Australia) might tell us something. Or just raise more questions :greengrin

[lord bunberry]

I don't know what the reserves are like but they have two brilliant young talents in Ngidi and Rabada. The trick may be in ensuring they stay fit as they are so young and will be asked to do so much!

Backing that up, Morkel and Philander - you couldn't ask for much more, though they are obviously a bit older. Nevertheless that's a pace quartet for at least two or three years.

Batting-wise, there's strength there. I have real hopes for Quinton De Kock, the keeper/batsman - he started his career with a flourish, it's maybe settled down a bit now but he's at the age where he can push on and become a key player over the next decade for SAF.

I think you're right about touring - there will be some broadly comparable surfaces in Australia and the Winidies but not always. And there will be very different surfaces in the sub-continent and in England.

It's the beauty of Test cricket, it's always fluctuating. The matches in the next twelve months (basically until the conclusion of the Indian tour in Australia) might tell us something. Or just raise more questions :greengrin

Undoubtedly it will raise more questions, but the fact that no one side is currently able to dominate leaves a team like South Africa in a strong position. While everyone concentrates on England, Australia and India the South Africans are creeping up on the rails. What always impresses me about a truly strong South African team is that there technically speaking isn’t really true South African conditions. Every other test side can rely on that advantage.

[lord bunberry]

Australia could be in real trouble with these ball tampering admissions. Fair play to Smith for not hanging Bancroft out to dry, but he’s basically admitted to cheating from the senior players.

[Tobias Funke]

Australia could be in real trouble with these ball tampering admissions. Fair play to Smith for not hanging Bancroft out to dry, but he’s basically admitted to cheating from the senior players.

I wouldn’t give Smith any credit whatsoever. The fact they used the newest player in the team to carry out the act speaks volumes in regards to how cowardly Smith and Warner have been here. Disgraceful situation and Stuart Broad has rightly questioned how often they got reverse swing going during the Ashes in conditions that you wouldn’t normally expect the ball to move as such.

[lord bunberry]

I wouldn’t give Smith any credit whatsoever. The fact they used the newest player in the team to carry out the act speaks volumes in regards to how cowardly Smith and Warner have been here. Disgraceful situation and Stuart Broad has rightly questioned how often they got reverse swing going during the Ashes in conditions that you wouldn’t normally expect the ball to move as such.
I agree, I was just saying that he could easily have let Bancroft take the rap. I think that Smith and whoever else was involved should be banned for a long time.

[Tobias Funke]

I agree, I was just saying that he could easily have let Bancroft take the rap. I think that Smith and whoever else was involved should be banned for a long time.

Yeah, Smiths reputation is in tatters, as is Cricket Australias.

[lord bunberry]

Yeah, Smiths reputation is in tatters, as is Cricket Australias.
12 month ban apparently.

[Hiber-nation]

Lehman not guilty....well if it's true then his players were taking the pish.

[hibsbollah]

I don't know much about cricket but the ex umpire they interviewed seemed to make the valid point that the Pakistan players got life and ten year bans for betting to make themselves rich in that Salman Butt case, while the Australians get a much more lenient punishment for cheating in order to affect the outcome of a match.

[Mibbes Aye]

I don't know much about cricket but the ex umpire they interviewed seemed to make the valid point that the Pakistan players got life and ten year bans for betting to make themselves rich in that Salman Butt case, while the Australians get a much more lenient punishment for cheating in order to affect the outcome of a match.

In the ICC Code of Conduct, ball tampering is only a level 2 offence. There are far greater sanctions for other offences. Whether that’s right or wrong is another debate. In part it maybe reflects that there are a variety of means to try and alter the ball. I think shining is the only legal one. Over the years players of all nations have tried a variety of illegal methods from using the zip on their trouser pockets to stitching sandpaper inside their pockets to keeping dirt in there, anything to try and rough up one side and conjure up the mystical reverse swing. Wiser captains might even put a spinner on with the instruction to offer up a couple of sixes - the wear and tear on the ball hitting a concrete stand from distance and height will be greater than the trousers shenanigans of Bancroft.

[marinello59]

Smith’s press conference was painful to watch to say the least.

[lord bunberry]

Smith’s press conference was painful to watch to say the least.
Very painful.
https://twitter.com/cricketaus/status/979278001576624128?s=21

[BroxburnHibee]

Smith’s press conference was painful to watch to say the least.

It was yes but was he sorry for doing it or for getting caught :devil:

Personally I think this kind of thing is going on all the time.

[Hibee87]

Dont know much about cricket, and dont know what this guy done that made it have a 'massive' impact on the game but it seems the fallout from it is massive, sponsors pulling out the lot.
What I was thinking when I heard it was, is it any different to a footballer diving for a penalty? Yes they may get few match ban after the incident ,and a small fine, but its never as big a furore as this. Could you see a sponsor stop sponsoring Ronaldo if he was caught diving, which is in all intents and purposes, cheating.

[heretoday]

Dont know much about cricket, and dont know what this guy done that made it have a 'massive' impact on the game but it seems the fallout from it is massive, sponsors pulling out the lot.
What I was thinking when I heard it was, is it any different to a footballer diving for a penalty? Yes they may get few match ban after the incident ,and a small fine, but its never as big a furore as this. Could you see a sponsor stop sponsoring Ronaldo if he was caught diving, which is in all intents and purposes, cheating.

You're right! For serious followers of cricket, though, this is a bad show altogether.

I've not taken much interest in the game since it came off the cooncil telly, but I seem to remember Mike Atherton doing something suspicious in his trouser pocket in a test. I think he got away with it without a furore like this.

Donald Bradman must be birlin' in his grave - not just at the outright cheating but one of the Australians was actually crying on the television. Extraordinary way to carry on!

[lord bunberry]

Time for Cook to retire now I think. Out for 2, he was all over the place.

[lord bunberry]

It’s good to see a match played down under on a proper cricket ground with a proper wicket. These drop in wickets are something I’ve never taken to.

[lord bunberry]

England bowling beautifully here. NZ 17/4.

[lord bunberry]

Just watched the Warner press conference. Not nice to watch.

[Mibbes Aye]

Ed Smith, the new England Test selector announces his first side tomorrow to face Pakistan. I can't make those Tests but I will be at Edgbaston for a couple of days for the Test against India, and I will get a chance to see Pakistan when they come to the Grange for their one-dayer against Scotland.

Bowling-wise it looks fairly predictable. Anderson and Broad, and no shortage of third or fourth seamers. There are a couple of youngsters in contention, which makes sense in terms of succession planning, but obviously represents risk.

Batting-wise there are decisions to be made. Assuming Cook stays, then the question is who he opens with. Stoneman hasn't really built on his opportunity and the question is whether it's time to bring back Keaton Jennings. There's also question marks over Vince and Malan - Vince has done himself no harm with a double century in the County Championshio but essentially he remains the same player - comes in, looks good playing a cover drive and gets out.

Fundamentally for England it feels like they have to look at Jonny Bairstow. I think it's clear that he doesn't want to bat higher up the order, but like Joe Root I think the selectors have to simply tell them that's what's happening. Root at three and Bairstow at five, or even four. They are the two strongest English batsmen and batting lower down the order isn't helping their team.

I know Bairstow wants to keep the gloves but for the greater good of England they can push him up into a gamechanger in the middle order and bring in Ben Foakes, who can keep but also averages forty-plus with the bat in first-class cricket.

[Mibbes Aye]

Ed Smith, the new England Test selector announces his first side tomorrow to face Pakistan. I can't make those Tests but I will be at Edgbaston for a couple of days for the Test against India, and I will get a chance to see Pakistan when they come to the Grange for their one-dayer against Scotland.

Bowling-wise it looks fairly predictable. Anderson and Broad, and no shortage of third or fourth seamers. There are a couple of youngsters in contention, which makes sense in terms of succession planning, but obviously represents risk.

Batting-wise there are decisions to be made. Assuming Cook stays, then the question is who he opens with. Stoneman hasn't really built on his opportunity and the question is whether it's time to bring back Keaton Jennings. There's also question marks over Vince and Malan - Vince has done himself no harm with a double century in the County Championshio but essentially he remains the same player - comes in, looks good playing a cover drive and gets out.

Fundamentally for England it feels like they have to look at Jonny Bairstow. I think it's clear that he doesn't want to bat higher up the order, but like Joe Root I think the selectors have to simply tell them that's what's happening. Root at three and Bairstow at five, or even four. They are the two strongest English batsmen and batting lower down the order isn't helping their team.

I know Bairstow wants to keep the gloves but for the greater good of England they can push him up into a gamechanger in the middle order and bring in Ben Foakes, who can keep but also averages forty-plus with the bat in first-class cricket.

Well, well, well.......I didn't expect that.

Credit to the England set-up for pushing Root up to three and Bairstow to five, it's long overdue. I didn't expect Buttler to come in, feel a bit sorry for Foakes, but if Bairstow is keeping the gloves then Buttler can just concentrate on providing the fireworks at seven. With Stokes back in the side England suddenly have a lot of firepower in the middle order.

Stoneman has been given another chance but I hope Haseeb Hameed and Jennings are being seen as the long-term options to open the batting, Vince, as suspected, is dropped because ultimately he is a limited cricketer.

I've not seen anything of Dom Bess so am looking forward to that - it's funny how often someone can come in as a consequence of another player's injury and end up taking the place permanently.

[lord bunberry]

Well, well, well.......I didn't expect that.

Credit to the England set-up for pushing Root up to three and Bairstow to five, it's long overdue. I didn't expect Buttler to come in, feel a bit sorry for Foakes, but if Bairstow is keeping the gloves then Buttler can just concentrate on providing the fireworks at seven. With Stokes back in the side England suddenly have a lot of firepower in the middle order.

Stoneman has been given another chance but I hope Haseeb Hameed and Jennings are being seen as the long-term options to open the batting, Vince, as suspected, is dropped because ultimately he is a limited cricketer.

I've not seen anything of Dom Bess so am looking forward to that - it's funny how often someone can come in as a consequence of another player's injury and end up taking the place permanently.
One of the problems England have is that basing selection on international form means that they’re relying on performances that were achieved in completely different conditions that they will be playing in this summer. I’ve watched so many interviews where the form in the winter has been suggested as being the decisive factor. I just watched one with Vince who was understandably down about missing out. There needs to be more young players sent around the various cricketing nations in order to learn the conditions and be able to adapt to them. If the current trend of home countries winning test matches continues it will lead to a situation where paying fans will become less interested.

[Mibbes Aye]

One of the problems England have is that basing selection on international form means that they’re relying on performances that were achieved in completely different conditions that they will be playing in this summer. I’ve watched so many interviews where the form in the winter has been suggested as being the decisive factor. I just watched one with Vince who was understandably down about missing out. There needs to be more young players sent around the various cricketing nations in order to learn the conditions and be able to adapt to them. If the current trend of home countries winning test matches continues it will lead to a situation where paying fans will become less interested.

I think you're right and it's a global problem. For example, Indian cricketers need to learn how to play in the West Indies or in Perth and Brisbane.

I think I heard a proposal that there shouldn't be a toss at the start and away teams just got the choice. That might make a difference.

[lord bunberry]

I think you're right and it's a global problem. For example, Indian cricketers need to learn how to play in the West Indies or in Perth and Brisbane.

I think I heard a proposal that there shouldn't be a toss at the start and away teams just got the choice. That might make a difference.
I quite like that idea. I would also like to see some of the younger players sent around the other major cricketing nations in an exchange scheme to play first class cricket.

[Mibbes Aye]

I quite like that idea. I would also like to see some of the younger players sent around the other major cricketing nations in an exchange scheme to play first class cricket.

I think that such a scheme would or could be massively influential in developing Test cricket.

It needs the buy-in at Board level. India is probably the critical part. They have the biggest audiences, they are one of the nations that has its own playing conditions and they can make or break the future of Test cricket.

[lord bunberry]

I think that such a scheme would or could be massively influential in developing Test cricket.

It needs the buy-in at Board level. India is probably the critical part. They have the biggest audiences, they are one of the nations that has its own playing conditions and they can make or break the future of Test cricket.
I agree about India. I would also say that India are almost certainly doing the most of the major cricketing nations to promote the game in all its formats. As you say they have the biggest audiences and they don’t have the concerns that the longer format of the game is in decline. Cricket is booming over there in all formats. They do seem like a nation who above all else wants the game to succeed, and I think they would be open to a player exchange. What an experience it would be for a young cricketer to go there for a year and experience the Indian game.

[Off the bar]

England 12-1 stoneman going early, bit muggy in London today not sure I would have batted first. Got tickets for tomorrow so looking forward to seeing Pakistan bat!

[JeMeSouviens]

Root gone with a David-Gower-esque waft outside off stump. :rolleyes:

Cook survives very close lbw review. England wobbling big time at 58/3.

[lord bunberry]

Cook gets his 56th 50.

[JeMeSouviens]

England collapse - 184 all out.

[Off the bar]

Pretty easy for Pakistan this morning, only question is how many wickets they'll have in hand when they go by England.

[Mibbes Aye]

Bess and Buttler putting on a nice little stand. Pakistan aren't in any bother but they will want to break that partnership sooner rather than later.

Amir's delivery to bowl Bairstow, just clipping off stump, is as fine a delivery as we will likely see all summer.

[Mibbes Aye]

If there is any team in any sport who deserve the title of 'mercurial' more so than the Pakistan cricket team I would be amazed.

I didn't think England were that bad in the First Test and I don't think they have been that great in this Test, but they have just done what they do and won the match.

Hopefully Jennings gets a decent run in the side to bed in. It will be interesting to see what happens with Bess - he's got decent figures in the second innings but Jack Leach, whom he replaced, should be fit for some of the India series.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Fine turn around from the 1st test, bowling, batting and fielding much improved. I hope England have found one in Bess, full of promise.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

England 38-3 after bowling The Aussies out for 214.

[Mibbes Aye]

Fine turn around from the 1st test, bowling, batting and fielding much improved. I hope England have found one in Bess, full of promise.

I like Bess and I hope he gets a decent run to establish himself. I know there was a bit of good fortune in how he got his debut, but that’s professional sport for you.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Root and Morgan appear to have steadied the ship, now 132-3.

[JeMeSouviens]

Wowsers! Just checking the latest Eng v Aus ODI - England 128/0 off 16.5 overs. Bairstow and Roy got their 50s in 39 and 41 balls respectively.

[JeMeSouviens]

200 up in 24 overs!

Roy run out, Hales on and smashing it about as well.

[JeMeSouviens]

300 up in 33 overs.

ODI record of 444 in serious danger. We could see the first ever 500 here.

[marinello59]

400 up with seven overs to go.

[JeMeSouviens]

Eoin Morgan's 50 in 21 balls!

419/3, 6 overs to go.

[Off the bar]

Eoin Morgan's 50 in 21 balls!

419/3, 6 overs to go.


Unbelievable hitting, from the BBC feed 'Eoin Morgan only had eight off his first nine balls. He hit 42 off his next 12'

42 off 12???

[JeMeSouviens]

Unbelievable hitting, from the BBC feed 'Eoin Morgan only had eight off his first nine balls. He hit 42 off his next 12'

42 off 12???

Amazing!

436/3, 5 overs left. Record will go this over I think.

[Off the bar]

and there goes the record, still 4 overs to go....

[JeMeSouviens]

New record 481/6 :not worth

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Watched the highlights show last night without knowing the score, some tremendous hitting on display, England's spinners bowled quite nicely too. A tremendous day of sport (WC, Royal Ascot, Murray @ Queens and the cricket).

[Mibbes Aye]

Watched the highlights show last night without knowing the score, some tremendous hitting on display, England's spinners bowled quite nicely too. A tremendous day of sport (WC, Royal Ascot, Murray @ Queens and the cricket).

Going to Old Trafford on Sunday for game 5. When the tickets were bought I thought it could be a critical match, at this rate it could be England homing in on a series whitewash!

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Going to Old Trafford on Sunday for game 5. When the tickets were bought I thought it could be a critical match, at this rate it could be England homing in on a series whitewash!

Its going to be a strange w-end, hope they get beat in the rugby on Sat, hope they win the cricket on Sun and hope the hat wearers beat them in Russia! :-)

[Mibbes Aye]

Its going to be a strange w-end, hope they get beat in the rugby on Sat, hope they win the cricket on Sun and hope the hat wearers beat them in Russia! :-)

:greengrin

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Another fine batting display from England, comfortably chasing down 310 to achieve their 2nd highest ODI run chase.

[Mibbes Aye]

Scorcher of a day in Manchester, Australia batting first, motoring on nicely on 57 after six overs, no loss.

[JeMeSouviens]

Scorcher of a day in Manchester, Australia batting first, motoring on nicely on 57 after six overs, no loss.

97/3 now. Quite jealous! Enjoy.

[Mibbes Aye]

97-4 now. Moeen with three, could be a quick game!

[Mibbes Aye]

97/3 now. Quite jealous! Enjoy.

Have to admit it’s braw. A day at the cricket when it’s sunny is as good as it gets.

[JeMeSouviens]

Have to admit it’s braw. A day at the cricket when it’s sunny is as good as it gets.

Heading for a tight finish. Have you been in on the beachball shenanigans?

[Mibbes Aye]

Heading for a tight finish. Have you been in on the beachball shenanigans?

:greengrin

No, but when I was at Headingley last summer we were bang in the middle of the roistiness.

Made a conscious decision this time to avoid it. It’s fun but it can tip over - we had a bunch of scouse lads next to us who were throwing the TMS earpieces at the police and stewards. Safe to say they didn’t last long.

[Mibbes Aye]

Left the cricket, now in the pub for the second half of Japan-Senegal.

SkyGo not working, less than happy but half-pished so I can deal with it :greengrin

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Could be a few more pumpings on the cards if England continue to play so badly against the Indian spinners as they did last night.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Better batting against the spinners helps England tie the series.

[Mibbes Aye]

Could be a few more pumpings on the cards if England continue to play so badly against the Indian spinners as they did last night.


Better batting against the spinners helps England tie the series.

I think England might be in trouble in the Tests.

They responded to the spin but all it takes is Kuldeep to alter his delivery and they are back to square one.

Perhaps more importantly, India have a genuine all-round pace attack, with options as back-up and a fair bit of strength at bat.

[Mibbes Aye]

Great performance by India to win the game and clinch the T20 series.

England didn't do badly but India just showed their class in the closing stages. I think they scored 35 runs in the eighteenth and nineteenth overs to ease themselves through.

Rohit Sharma excelled with a century from 56 balls, more than ably supported to victory by Hardik Pandya with 33 from 14 deliveries. He's a very exciting young talent.

I'm going to the first Test at Edgbaston for a couple of days at the start of August and can't wait. This Indian side are very exciting with bat and ball.

Plaudits to Chris Jordan for England - two very good catches, one off his own bowling and he had relatively tidy bowling figures too.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

England all over the place v spin once again.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Much better from England today although the 2nd half of the Indian innings was a bit of a head scratcher to say the least, I wonder what that was all about?

[Mibbes Aye]

Much better from England today although the 2nd half of the Indian innings was a bit of a head scratcher to say the least, I wonder what that was all about?

Felt like England managed to put the burners on towards the end of their innings, whereas India failed - Pandya and Yadav falling quickly and Dhoni just not sparkling.

For the Tests I'm still finding it hard to see past the tourists though. They've got a different range of strengths in the pace attack and have spin. They will probably find joy in English conditions in a way that SAF, Windies or Australians find a bit more tricky. They also have batting, not least of all one of , if not the best batsman in the world.

England have still quite to resolve their line-up, especially with batting, though restoring Jennings and moving Root to three and Bairstow to five is a necessary step. Still a couple of issues to resolve and also around the bowling - Anderson and Broad have been titans and no doubt England will look for yet another summer from them but their time is limited. The alternatives and the complements are up for grabs - both Currans have impressed with their enthusiasm though neither fits the bill as an innings-changer in the way that Anderson and Broad do. And then the spinners - Moeen's star has dipped but he bowls and bats significantly better at home than he does abroad and he also averages against India overall better than his career averages.

Should be a good series.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I keep saying it on here but, what a technically magnificent player Root is, two centuries in a row as England clinch the series.