Total Football - a distant memory

[theonlywayisup]

What has happened to Dutch Football - three times runners up in the world cup and once winners of the European Championships - are now about to miss their second major championship in a row.

Total Football is a tactical theory of football in which any outfield player can take over the role of any other player in a team. It was made famous by the Dutch national football team in the 1974 FIFA World Cup. It was great to watch!

The great players, Cruyff (that turn), Berkamp, van Basten (that goal against Russia), Ruud Gullit, Frank Rijkaard, Clarence Seedorf, van Nistelrooy, van der Sar, van Persie, Neeskens, Edgar Davids, Patrick Kluivert, Frank De Boer and his brother, van Bronckhorst, Wesley Sneijder, Ronald Koeman, Willy and Rene van de Kerkhof, Robben, Overmars etc etc.

What has happened to Dutch Football? When will we see their likes again?

[hibsbollah]

Simon Kuper was talking about it on the Totally Football podcast. His case is that Dutch coaches stopped 'thinking' in the way they used to, lost the cerebral element to their play, and each successive coach is part of an old boys network of ex players that are stuck in the last millennium and don't understand modern football.

[Gmack7]

What has happened to Dutch Football - three times runners up in the world cup and once winners of the European Championships - are now about to miss their second major championship in a row.

Total Football is a tactical theory of football in which any outfield player can take over the role of any other player in a team. It was made famous by the Dutch national football team in the 1974 FIFA World Cup. It was great to watch!

The great players, Cruyff (that turn), Berkamp, van Basten (that goal against Russia), Ruud Gullit, Frank Rijkaard, Clarence Seedorf, van Nistelrooy, van der Sar, van Persie, Neeskens, Edgar Davids, Patrick Kluivert, Frank De Boer and his brother, van Bronckhorst, Wesley Sneijder, Ronald Koeman, Willy and Rene van de Kerkhof, Robben, Overmars etc etc.

What has happened to Dutch Football? When will we see their likes again?
a great question and a tremendous list of great players. surely Edwin De Graff shoul be in for van bronckhorst

[jacomo]

Simon Kuper was talking about it on the Totally Football podcast. His case is that Dutch coaches stopped 'thinking' in the way they used to, lost the cerebral element to their play, and each successive coach is part of an old boys network of ex players that are stuck in the last millennium and don't understand modern football.


Being what? The high press presumably?

It's weird because with decent players (and Dutch do still produce decent players) you would have thought they could tweak the trad 4-3-3 quite easily.

But it's all from the van Gaal school - too ponderous, not quick enough.

[Baader]

Sad to see. Holland have given so much to football over decades. A world power in the sport - achieved in the right manner, philosophy and with real artistry too. For the population they have that's an incredible achievement.

Looking at their squad they do not have the same pedigree of players coming through as they did over the past 4 decades. Robben is still far and away their best player at 33. Hopefully just a generational thing but the way they produced players probably suggests otherwise.

Much as I would love to see them win a World Cup it was sad witnessing them deploying Germany 1974 tactics in the 2010 Final agaimst Spain. Something the Dutch still resent. Probably the only way they were likely to stop them mind you. Any World Cup will be poorer without them. Argentina too, as they could miss out.

[hibsbollah]

Being what? The high press presumably?

It's weird because with decent players (and Dutch do still produce decent players) you would have thought they could tweak the trad 4-3-3 quite easily.

But it's all from the van Gaal school - too ponderous, not quick enough.

The two things are the high press and the fast counter. He also mentioned lack of fitness. And as baader said, the final ignominy is the fact that the last and only team playing 'Dutch' football were the Germans!

[Pete]

It’s as if Holland and Belgium have gradually traded places over the last eight years.

[Deansy]

I've lived in the constant hope that 'Total Football' will be re-discovered - too much to ask for that it involves Hibs/Scotland I suppose ..................

[GreenOnions]

I hope they will come back again. It's not the first time they've gone from a superb team to non-qualifiers. After two WC finals in 74 and 78 they failed to qualify for WC in 82 and 86. It's difficult with a small population to keep the conveyor belt going.

[660]

Total football was a gimmick. Deserve all they get for their hammer throwing march to a tournament final which they lost (again).

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Sad to see. Holland have given so much to football over decades. A world power in the sport - achieved in the right manner, philosophy and with real artistry too. For the population they have that's an incredible achievement.

Looking at their squad they do not have the same pedigree of players coming through as they did over the past 4 decades. Robben is still far and away their best player at 33. Hopefully just a generational thing but the way they produced players probably suggests otherwise.

Much as I would love to see them win a World Cup it was sad witnessing them deploying Germany 1974 tactics in the 2010 Final agaimst Spain. Something the Dutch still resent. Probably the only way they were likely to stop them mind you. Any World Cup will be poorer without them. Argentina too, as they could miss out.

There wasnae much artistry on show in their hammer throwing effort to beat Spain in The WCF - should've read all of your post before answering :-)

[Baader]

Total football was a gimmick. Deserve all they get for their hammer throwing march to a tournament final which they lost (again).

It really wasn't. Total football was Holland in the 70s and Rinus Michels and Ernst Happel. Defenders that could comfortably play up front and strikers who could slot in at fullback. It wasn't Holland in 2010.

[snooky]

That 74 Dutch side played the best team football I've ever seen and probably ever will see. Like all good things in life, once a good thing is discovered the spoilers inevitably find a way to destroy it either by tactics or other methods.
Alas, this happens in all walks of life.

[Northernhibee]

Ian Cathro stole it.

[MWHIBBIES]

Total football was a gimmick. Deserve all they get for their hammer throwing march to a tournament final which they lost (again).

Holland only played like that in the final, they played some good stuff otherwise.

[660]

It really wasn't. Total football was Holland in the 70s and Rinus Michels and Ernst Happel. Defenders that could comfortably play up front and strikers who could slot in at fullback. It wasn't Holland in 2010.

Yeah great - didn’t work then or now.

[jacomo]

Total football was a gimmick. Deserve all they get for their hammer throwing march to a tournament final which they lost (again).


You're talking rubbish.

One of the most widely recognised developments in football tactics, highly influential and much imitated.

It has nothing to do with Holland's extreme cynicism in more recent years.

[Ryan69]

Ajax failed to get into Champions league also did they not?

[SirDavidsNapper]

Been saying this for ages. Dutch football is on its knees. Their domestic teams are struggling badly too. They Just don't seem to be producing the players they used to. Scarily similar to Scotland's decline.

[where'stheslope]

The Dutch have been losing their young players to foreign clubs for years now, and the continuity of young players playing together is being lost.

The Germans however seem to keep their young stars and the National side seems to be progressing because of this, its the same with England but hopefully not progressing as well!!!

[Baader]

It really wasn't. Total football was Holland in the 70s and Rinus Michels and Ernst Happel. Defenders that could comfortably play up front and strikers who could slot in at fullback. It wasn't Holland in 2010.


Yeah great - didn’t work then or now.

Ajax won three consecutive European Cups playing that system! Wouldn't say Holland reaching two consecutive World Cup finals is exactly a failure..

[Iggy Pope]

That 74 Dutch side played the best team football I've ever seen and probably ever will see. Like all good things in life, once a good thing is discovered the spoilers inevitably find a way to destroy it either by tactics or other methods.
Alas, this happens in all walks of life.

Agreed. Munich 74 was the first WC that my 11 year old brain absorbed and at the centre of it all were the magical Dutch. It was a campaign that was wildly received in Scotland for obvious reasons (and very probably the first of those 'glorious failures' after getting edged out of the group qualifiers courtesy of the lack of a 3rd goal against bloody Zaire). It's easy for today's hipsters to scoff, but to my mind, modern football was created that summer, for better or worse. The Munchen 74 sticker book by Panini started it!

[Iggy Pope]

Ajax won three consecutive European Cups playing that system! Wouldn't say Holland reaching two consecutive World Cup finals is exactly a failure..

Again, agreed. Ajax and their brilliance also opened my eyes to the Panathanaikos side who were apparently copying the Hibs kit.
Within a couple of years the core of that Ajax side would be laying the foundations for the Barcelona side of today. That's pretty much fact.

[hibsbollah]

Again, agreed. Ajax and their brilliance also opened my eyes to the Panathanaikos side who were apparently copying the Hibs kit.
Within a couple of years the core of that Ajax side would be laying the foundations for the Barcelona side of today. That's pretty much fact.

Added to the fact that the barca side of today wouldn't be playing 433 at all without the Dutch side of the 70s!

[Firestarter]

Ajax failed to get into Champions league also did they not?

They aren't top dogs in holland just now. Their Scandinavian policy doesn't help matters either.

[Iggy Pope]

Added to the fact that the barca side of today wouldn't be playing 433 at all without the Dutch side of the 70s!

Also, fact.:greengrin

[Hibby Bairn]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hfqTy2bJzmU

[yonder1875]

They aren't top dogs in holland just now. Their Scandinavian policy doesn't help matters either.

What's the policy?

[hibsbollah]

Holland 1-0 up after 15 mins. Robben pen. Is it on?

[Scouse Hibee]

Total football was a gimmick. Deserve all they get for their hammer throwing march to a tournament final which they lost (again).

Clueless.

[Waxy]

Holland more likely over achieved for the last few decades. Now they’re heading to more realistic times for the size of country. Like us.

[hibsbollah]

Holland more likely over achieved for the last few decades. Now they’re heading to more realistic times for the size of country. Like us.

They are also statistically the biggest and tallest nation on earth. Just waiting for Strachan to use that as evidence that he's not talking baws about genetics :dunno:

[Firestarter]

Holland more likely over achieved for the last few decades. Now they’re heading to more realistic times for the size of country. Like us.

For countries such as ours and Holland you can't have a great darts player and a good football team. They will just have to learn to get on with it for the time being.

[Not In The Know]

Its all down to genetics.

[Haymaker]

They are also statistically the biggest and tallest nation on earth. Just waiting for Strachan to use that as evidence that he's not talking baws about genetics :dunno:

Are they?

[hibsbollah]

Are they?

Yep. Giants, the lot of them. :greengrin

[Phil MaGlass]

Holland more likely over achieved for the last few decades. Now they’re heading to more realistic times for the size of country. Like us.

They never over achieved, they had a brand of football that nobody could touch, their whole sytem from grassroots up was second to none, their training centres are also second to none, they were masters of the game.There was no over achieving in it.

unless I"m missing a whoosh moment?

[MWHIBBIES]

Holland are hardly entering the dark ages, still have players at top clubs around europe, just lacked a competent manager for their national team.

[hibsbollah]

Holland are hardly entering the dark ages, still have players at top clubs around europe, just lacked a competent manager for their national team.

You think? Their best player is Robben and he's 33.

[Smartie]

You think? Their best player is Robben and he's 33.

There seems to be a dearth of top class defenders in the world right now, but there can't be many better than Virgil van Dyk?

They certainly don't have the depth of squad they once had, or that other countries (such as Belgium) currently have.