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View Full Version : The Road Less Travelled - Recalling The Williamson Era...



Viva_Palmeiras
28-07-2017, 06:10 PM
Listening to KTs interview and recalling a preseason game against Craigroyston where he coached O'Connor well and Whitty scored a peach of a freekick - did we ever hear Bobbys view of his time at the club? Lest we forget he took them to a final - Livi doped up with players they couldn't afford...

matty_f
28-07-2017, 07:10 PM
I've never really heard him speak of his time at Hibs. He had a tough gig here but didn't really do himself any favours getting the support onside with him.

lord bunberry
28-07-2017, 07:19 PM
Listening to KTs interview and recalling a preseason game against Craigroyston where he coached O'Connor well and Whitty scored a peach of a freekick - did we ever hear Bobbys view of his time at the club? Lest we forget he took them to a final - Livi doped up with players they couldn't afford...
He wasn't brilliant, but he had to reduce the wage bill and had a much harder job than his predecessor.
He's far from the worst manager we've ever had.

Jonnyboy
28-07-2017, 07:19 PM
I did an interview with Bobby, some years ago, for Hibs.net. Might not have survived the passage of time :wink:

He was actually very good in the interview, open and honest and clearly aware of how big a club he was in charge of. He also put the "entertainment" quote to bed when he told me what he'd actually said as opposed to what he was reported as having said

Viva_Palmeiras
28-07-2017, 07:21 PM
I've never really heard him speak of his time at Hibs. He had a tough gig here but didn't really do himself any favours getting the support onside with him.

Wonder if he and the Tangoman ever formed a union - two peas in a pod ;)

Mon Dieu4
28-07-2017, 07:24 PM
In my all my years of watching Hibs and having a season ticket for 20 odd years the Williamson era is the one I remember least about, every now and then a player will get mentioned that I have absolutely no recollection of, same with certain goals or things that happened, not sure if I just wiped them from memory out of sheer boredom or not

I can remember every other managers tenure easy enough

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
28-07-2017, 07:26 PM
His time was dull and uninspiring, but we were massively reducing our spending at the time, so it could be argued that dull but safely midtable was what we needed at that time.

Still... he tried to swap riordan and Whittaker for bobby mann **shudders**

Viva_Palmeiras
28-07-2017, 07:28 PM
He wasn't brilliant, but he had to reduce the wage bill and had a much harder job than his predecessor.
He's far from the worst manager we've ever had.

It was hearing from KT and witnessing the 121 he was giving Garry through that game in particular with Whitty being urged to get forward maybe there was a story left untold... although he did have KT upfront that game going be the report (my memory faded that out)

We tend to go along with the golden generation falling into place through circumstances and talent brought to the fore by Mogga and with Collins reaping the rewards but what of Bobby's contribution?

jacomo
28-07-2017, 07:29 PM
Listening to KTs interview and recalling a preseason game against Craigroyston where he coached O'Connor well and Whitty scored a peach of a freekick - did we ever hear Bobbys view of his time at the club? Lest we forget he took them to a final - Livi doped up with players they couldn't afford...


He has talked about his time at Hibs. It's no big secret.

Not surprisingly he thinks he did a pretty good job. Saw it as a clear step up from Killie but came into a situation where urgent and pretty drastic cost cutting was required.

He did ok. Pretty dour stuff on the park but of course our money problems meant we relied on the kids. And those kids did very well.

Jim44
28-07-2017, 07:33 PM
I did an interview with Bobby, some years ago, for Hibs.net. Might not have survived the passage of time :wink:

He was actually very good in the interview, open and honest and clearly aware of how big a club he was in charge of. He also put the "entertainment" quote to bed when he told me what he'd actually said as opposed to what he was reported as having said

........... which was?

Jonnyboy
28-07-2017, 07:37 PM
........... which was?

The reporter was telling Bobby that the Hibs fans were unhappy with the style of football they were watching. An irked Bobby replied "If they want guaranteed entertainment, they should go to the pictures" The reporter removed "guaranteed" from the story and the rest, as they say, is history.

jacomo
28-07-2017, 07:44 PM
The reporter was telling Bobby that the Hibs fans were unhappy with the style of football they were watching. An irked Bobby replied "If they want guaranteed entertainment, they should go to the pictures" The reporter removed "guaranteed" from the story and the rest, as they say, is history.


Fine.

But the reason it stuck is because we were pretty poor to watch.

Still, he did ok. And remember the League cup sf when Frank de Boer missed a penalty? Huns were seething!

Speedway
28-07-2017, 07:45 PM
Bobby gave us a vital 'new manager bounce' at a time when we really needed it.

He demonstrated in 3 matches that Sauzee hadn't got a clue what he was doing.

However, matches lasted 180 minutes when he was in charge and I was delighted to see him 'invited' to join Argyle by Rod.

Jonnyboy
28-07-2017, 07:52 PM
Fine.

But the reason it stuck is because we were pretty poor to watch.

Still, he did ok. And remember the League cup sf when Frank de Boer missed a penalty? Huns were seething!

We were. It was painful at times but oh how I enjoyed that win over Oldco at Hampden :greengrin The penalty shootout is on YouTube and even the fact that TB is co-commentating doesn't spoil the enjoyment I get out of watching it :greengrin

Jonnyboy
28-07-2017, 07:53 PM
Bobby gave us a vital 'new manager bounce' at a time when we really needed it.

He demonstrated in 3 matches that Sauzee hadn't got a clue what he was doing.

However, matches lasted 180 minutes when he was in charge and I was delighted to see him 'invited' to join Argyle by Rod.

:agree: I think we all were

Iggy Pope
28-07-2017, 07:55 PM
Bobby gave us a vital 'new manager bounce' at a time when we really needed it.

He demonstrated in 3 matches that Sauzee hadn't got a clue what he was doing.

However, matches lasted 180 minutes when he was in charge and I was delighted to see him 'invited' to join Argyle by Rod.

Me too. If I recall his first game was a thumping of St Johnstone at ER. ESSENTIAL that we won the game. I knocked back hospitality at StJames Park same day to attend. Bergkamp scored the finest goal I've ever seen on the telly.

brianmc
28-07-2017, 07:59 PM
The Blobby era sucked the life from me like no other manager before or since.
Despite having a season ticket it got so bad I'd end up looking for excuses to avoid going to games (not the cinema though!).
Things were so grim at one point that on the odd occasion we ground out a win the football on show (entertainment factor?) was so bad that it still had me going home scunnered!
Dark days indeed. And like a previous poster pointed out ones that have largely been deleted from my memory.

Speedway
28-07-2017, 08:14 PM
The Blobby era sucked the life from me like no other manager before or since.
Despite having a season ticket it got so bad I'd end up looking for excuses to avoid going to games (not the cinema though!).
Things were so grim at one point that on the odd occasion we ground out a win the football on show (entertainment factor?) was so bad that it still had me going home scunnered!
Dark days indeed. And like a previous poster pointed out ones that have largely been deleted from my memory.

Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

hfc rd
28-07-2017, 08:17 PM
That Livingston cup final defeat is the only thing I remember during his reign 😔😒. Dull and uninspiring.

Was he not at one point trying to sign some random average player from Inverness and even offered Whittaker & Riordan as part of the deal? Thank f*** that never went through!

Kaiser1962
28-07-2017, 08:22 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

Bertie Auld.........

Auckland Hibs
28-07-2017, 08:23 PM
Fine.

But the reason it stuck is because we were pretty poor to watch.

Still, he did ok. And remember the League cup sf when Frank de Boer missed a penalty? Huns were seething!

I have a fantastic photograph on my wall with the team celebrating on the half way line when we win the game - one of my favourite memories, watched it in Ealing West London in a bar full of Celtic fans & I didn't have to buy a drink the whole night.

SirDavidsNapper
28-07-2017, 08:25 PM
Williamson era was tough but he did sew the seeds for Mowbrays reign. The golden generation were forced on him.

tamig
28-07-2017, 08:27 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

There were plenty good times under Miller too. The McAllister, Wright, Jackson, O'Neill team were a joy to watch.

MartinfaePorty
28-07-2017, 08:28 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...How many times did I go to Ibrox and we never had a shot never mind a decent chance? Brian Hamilton at left back and McGinlay at right back rather than bleed a youngster, even though he set the team up expecting to get beat.

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Speedway
28-07-2017, 08:38 PM
There were plenty good times under Miller too. The McAllister, Wright, Jackson, O'Neill team were a joy to watch.

And they were condensed into a 6 and 12 month period amongst a decade of dirge.

The Modfather
28-07-2017, 08:39 PM
I wonder what period was tougher to watch, Williamson or Fenlon. Probably Fenlon for me as at least we had youngsters breaking through during Williamson.

Glad that the early signs are we will be a lot better to watch this season as last was tough to watch a lot of the time.

DCI Gene Hunt
28-07-2017, 08:40 PM
I didn't mind Williamson so much, he did a decent job. Not the most inspiring but we needed stability at the time and he gave us that. Still can't believe we lost to that pile of schyte Livi! I was there and remember it with disbelief and horror equally.

The Mixu/Yogi/Calderwood era was pretty poor, however nothing beats Duff Jimmy, dreadful football, dreadful sightings (Duffy's Duffers) and dreadful results, was only in primary school at the time but still remember how crap Hibs were during his disastrous reign that saw us drop to the 1st Div. The man to this day remains a total bellend!

Nameless
28-07-2017, 08:41 PM
The reverse ball to Dobbie, who smashes home the equaliser, "bring on Capucho", DeBoer hitting the post, huns greetin, 500 miles on the tannoy. Bobby was a disaster, but that semi was phenomenal!

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BroxburnHibee
28-07-2017, 08:45 PM
Calderwood was worse than Blobby.

Just Jimmy
28-07-2017, 08:50 PM
2003 quarter v celtic. brebner scored a pen and thomo smashed home the winner after Baillie marshalled Larsson and sutton out the game. headline the next day was "king kevs a bobby dazzler"

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silverhibee
28-07-2017, 08:55 PM
His time was dull and uninspiring, but we were massively reducing our spending at the time, so it could be argued that dull but safely midtable was what we needed at that time.

Still... he tried to swap riordan and Whittaker for bobby mann **shudders**


A myth.

calumhibee1
28-07-2017, 08:58 PM
Calderwood was worse than Blobby.

I actually totally forgot he ever managed us. Whenever I think of our recent managers I always remember Fenlon, Butcher, Mixu etc. But never him.

lord bunberry
28-07-2017, 09:01 PM
It was hearing from KT and witnessing the 121 he was giving Garry through that game in particular with Whitty being urged to get forward maybe there was a story left untold... although he did have KT upfront that game going be the report (my memory faded that out)

We tend to go along with the golden generation falling into place through circumstances and talent brought to the fore by Mogga and with Collins reaping the rewards but what of Bobby's contribution?
I don't think his contribution should be underestimated, but I don't think he should be seen as some sort of forward thinker either. He brought through players from the youth team because he had to.
we all know that necessity is the mother of invention. I personally don't hold any grudge towards him and I wish him all the best.

silverhibee
28-07-2017, 09:40 PM
I've never really heard him speak of his time at Hibs. He had a tough gig here but didn't really do himself any favours getting the support onside with him.

Found this.

He didn’t manage to catch any coverage of last weekend’s Scottish Cup final, which featured one of his former clubs, Hibernian, against Celtic. Ah, Hibs. Mention of his name to a supporter of the Easter Road side, and it was once guaranteed to produce a groan. The thing is, his reign has begun to look better and better with the passing years. Wins over Rangers and Celtic on the way to a League Cup final, players such as Kevin Thomson, Scott Brown and Steven Whittaker making a breakthrough. It has (whisper it) got a lot worse since. Not that you need be shy about pointing this out down a crackly line to Uganda. “What disappointed me was that in January of the year we played in the League Cup final [which Hibs lost 2-0 to Livingston], I went to the board and said: ‘look, we can swap a central defender for a midfield player, because we are going to be short in midfield’,” he says. Williamson wanted to bring in Steven Thomson, then at Peterborough United. “Kevin Thomson was picking up a few injuries, and a few others were picking up injuries, and I said we should do this, because we would be struggling in midfield towards the end of the season,” he adds. “But I could not get it sanctioned.” Something else that couldn’t be sanctioned was a swap deal involving Derek Riordan and Bobby Mann, though this, as well as being a blessing, is a bit of a myth it turns out. “Donald Park [at Inverness] wanted Riordan, and I thought we needed a Bobby Mann-type centre half,” he says. “But the board never sanctioned it. It was not the case that I wanted to get rid of Derek Riordan. “They [Inverness] wanted Riordan, and I said to Donald, ‘speak to the board’. It was probably just an excuse to get off the phone to him.”

Read more at: http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/bobby-williamson-on-his-time-with-uganda-1-2951530

:aok:

brianmc
28-07-2017, 09:51 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

First season ticket was in 88/89 so yeah I saw most of it.

You have to remember back then that boring, negative type football was very common-especially away from home. (It was still the era of 2 points for a win and 1 point for a draw).
Any game at ER against the likes of Motherwell or Dundee Utd was guaranteed to include the visitors back 4(5) passing it between themselves, before knocking it back for the goalie to pick up just to waste time and try to pick up a point...

The football world had moved on a decade+ later by Blobby's time - though you'd be hard pushed to tell if you'd seen the way he set his teams up!

Kato
28-07-2017, 09:52 PM
A myth.

The other myth being he made his "if you want entertainment go to the cinema" quote whilst at Hibs, the quote was attributed to him whilst he was Killie manager after we played them at ER.

Is It On....
28-07-2017, 09:53 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

I said that once before and it wasn't popular. Eye bleeding "zonal football" with very few young players introduced (Collins being an exception) despite being in charge for 10 years. He had a massive opinion of himself, largely due to the League Cup win, and I remember being elated when he left.

givescotlandfreedom
28-07-2017, 10:05 PM
Williamson's tenure was grim with a few exceptions. The vital win against St Johnstone to keep us away from relegation in his first game, the league cup campaign which saw us beat Montrose 9-0 and both the old firm and beating Hearts with 10 men with O'connor's late goal. That 4-4 derby and a 3-0 defeat to Dundee in a rearranged game stick in my craw from Bobby's time.

CraigHibee
28-07-2017, 10:15 PM
Calderwood was worse than Blobby.

Hands down, calderwood was completely out his depth

Andy74
28-07-2017, 10:19 PM
The other myth being he made his "if you want entertainment go to the cinema" quote whilst at Hibs, the quote was attributed to him whilst he was Killie manager after we played them at ER.

What I was going to say. That quote was made when he was Kilmarnock manager.

saltandsauce
28-07-2017, 10:22 PM
I didn't mind Williamson so much, he did a decent job. Not the most inspiring but we needed stability at the time and he gave us that. Still can't believe we lost to that pile of schyte Livi! I was there and remember it with disbelief and horror equally.

The Mixu/Yogi/Calderwood era was pretty poor, however nothing beats Duff Jimmy, dreadful football, dreadful sightings (Duffy's Duffers) and dreadful results, was only in primary school at the time but still remember how crap Hibs were during his disastrous reign that saw us drop to the 1st Div. The man to this day remains a total bellend!

Don't think we beat livi at all that season so came as mo great shock

lord bunberry
28-07-2017, 10:39 PM
Don't think we beat livi at all that season so came as mo great shock
Very much like the situation with Clyde in the Scottish cup in the 50s. We were overwhelmingly expected to win, but form suggested otherwise.

Kato
28-07-2017, 10:45 PM
What I was going to say. That quote was made when he was Kilmarnock manager.

So many people including journalist think this comes from when he was at Hibs. Here's mention of the quote whilst he was still at Rugby Park.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/goal-prince-of-wales-1-1359181

jacomo
28-07-2017, 10:54 PM
Calderwood was worse than Blobby.


It's not even a contest.

Bobby was dull but at least competent. As others have said he dug us out of a wee hole when he came in .

Calderwood was bewildering. Truly an imposter.

snooky
28-07-2017, 11:08 PM
:agree: I think we all were

Re. 2004 SLC semi-final. I loved this celebration photo on the halfway line.

18977

WhileTheChief..
28-07-2017, 11:29 PM
Were you around for the Lexo era?

Because if you want grim...

The McCluskey / Souness game is one of my fav games I've ever been to at ER.

Also remember being amazed that we had Steve Archibald with us for a season.

It wasn't all bad.

Jamesie
28-07-2017, 11:31 PM
As I mentioned on another thread recently, getting chased around Edinburgh Academy playing fields by Williamson for having the audacity to take a photograph of a triallist kind of summed him up for me - bit of a control freak and could be a bit of a wideo in press conferences.

My lasting memory of him is this clip - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by59HSSGOlE - of Tam McManus's absolute screamer of a volley to put us ahead at Ibrox. Bobby is absolutely raging in that clip from about 0:23 onwards - you'd almost think Tam had scored an OG rather than a goal for the team Bobby is managing at the time. The look on Tam's face at 0:29 / 0:30 is priceless! :greengrin

blackpoolhibs
28-07-2017, 11:38 PM
Blobbys time was grim, and when you realise how we were managed after he left, with a manager with imagination and personality, you quickly understand we'd done the usual, and brought in one of the usual nomarks from within the Scottish game who really knew **** all.

No offence to blobby, but we are now beyond those types of appointments, we now go after quality that will enhance us, not managers who will stave off relegation and be safety first men.

Jamesie
28-07-2017, 11:44 PM
Interesting read to see our managerial stats presented in % wins - Stubbs and Lennon the first two to consistently break past 50% (albeit in the Championship) since the 1960s:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Hibernian_F.C._managers

Liberal Hibby
29-07-2017, 12:31 AM
Bertie Auld.........

Quite.

Ronniekirk
29-07-2017, 04:46 AM
I did an interview with Bobby, some years ago, for Hibs.net. Might not have survived the passage of time :wink:

He was actually very good in the interview, open and honest and clearly aware of how big a club he was in charge of. He also put the "entertainment" quote to bed when he told me what he'd actually said as opposed to what he was reported as having said

But what was his favourite Film Johnny boy The Magnificent Seven ?


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3pm
29-07-2017, 06:08 AM
When the cost cutting started did he not get told he wasn't allowed to sign anyone? In the end, we did end up with Matyus. There might have been someone else - Craig James maybe?

Steve-O
29-07-2017, 06:12 AM
I recall having a season ticket but not even going to a couple of matches towards the end of one of the seasons. Sat in the house a 10 minute drive away instead! That's how bad it got...

Viva_Palmeiras
29-07-2017, 06:26 AM
A myth.

Did we ever hear what Deeks made of Bobby and how he brought the likes of him on?

i guess that's my point not that whether he was forced to play youngsters anyway or whether we played attractive football. I think that ufortunately the Miller era (particularly the end - Bannon and Wilkins!), Bobby, Calderwood, Fenlon saw many fall out of love with Hibs the drip drip effect over what seemed like a generation saw a decent number lost to the club and we can't underestimate the impact of that. Thankfully we seem to be on a completely different trajectory. No my pondering is the impact he had on the kids in their introduction into the team.

He rarely if ever gets a mention yet there's a some would say "thinker" and student of the game in KT and he gives a nod to Bobby. Wonder how the others of the golden generation and the likes of Dobbie (another I'd like to hear reflect on his time here) found him?

flash
29-07-2017, 06:47 AM
The reverse ball to Dobbie, who smashes home the equaliser, "bring on Capucho", DeBoer hitting the post, huns greetin, 500 miles on the tannoy. Bobby was a disaster, but that semi was phenomenal!

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Ones called Ronald
Ones called Frank
One misses penalties
The other ones a w...
To the tune of Nice one Cyril one of my favourite ever songs.

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
29-07-2017, 07:42 AM
I wonder what period was tougher to watch, Williamson or Fenlon. Probably Fenlon for me as at least we had youngsters breaking through during Williamson.

Glad that the early signs are we will be a lot better to watch this season as last was tough to watch a lot of the time.

Its all about context though. Williamson was following a successful period, and so relative to that, his fitba was worse.

Fenlon took over from Calderwood - quite simply the single worst hibs manager in history. Therefore Fenlon's was better relative to Calderwood. Also had some great moments.under Frnlon, mostly down to Griffiths admittedly.

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
29-07-2017, 07:45 AM
A myth.

If you know differently, fair enough. I just heard that from John Robertson on radio Scotland, who was the manager at the time, i think.

SirDavidsNapper
29-07-2017, 07:52 AM
His tenure resulted in the worst, most gutted feeling I've ever had at a game (and there's been a few). 2-0 loss to Livingston in LCF. Still gets to me yet.

Iain G
29-07-2017, 07:58 AM
When the cost cutting started did he not get told he wasn't allowed to sign anyone? In the end, we did end up with Matyus. There might have been someone else - Craig James maybe?

Zambernardi? Was that Williamson?

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
29-07-2017, 08:00 AM
His tenure resulted in the worst, most gutted feeling I've ever had at a game (and there's been a few). 2-0 loss to Livingston in LCF. Still gets to me yet.

To me that final was a classic, we expect to win because we sre the bigger club scenario.

A hibs support swelled by part timers who came along expecting, demanding even a victory for them to celebrate. Despite livi being the better team at the time, and if memory serves actually in administration at the time of the final.

There were about 8,000 of us at the semi, which is still one of my favourite all time hibs matches. Then 40,000 odd turned up for final, were quiet as church mice and diluted the atmosphere.

Wr must have suffered more than most as a result of financial doping in scottish fitba come to think of it.

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
29-07-2017, 08:03 AM
His tenure resulted in the worst, most gutted feeling I've ever had at a game (and there's been a few). 2-0 loss to Livingston in LCF. Still gets to me yet.

The 4-4 game too. That was awful.

Just watched it on youtube - zambernardi sold both those goals, one by trying to ise his foot to clear instead of his head, and one by supidly diving in on the byeline. Clown.

Firestarter
29-07-2017, 08:28 AM
He was always on a hiding to nothing being a hun and replacing LeGod. I thought it was a disaster area when he was in charge and Derek Townsley was the main goal threat. That semi for us that where there was utter pandemonium though! Sure Ricksen assaulted Deeks too! Fenlon and Calderwoods and ultimately butcher was miles worse though.

The Modfather
29-07-2017, 08:39 AM
Its all about context though. Williamson was following a successful period, and so relative to that, his fitba was worse.

Fenlon took over from Calderwood - quite simply the single worst hibs manager in history. Therefore Fenlon's was better relative to Calderwood. Also had some great moments.under Frnlon, mostly down to Griffiths admittedly.

Context is maybe relevant in hindsight, but I didn't sit there under Williamson bored out my mind thinking, this is grim but was always going to be tough to follow the Mcleish years. I was aware we were cutting costs at the time of course, but there was zero excitement during most 90 minutes not the results.

Similarly, I didn't sit there under Fenlon saying, at least it's not as bad as Calderwood. I stopped going under Fenlon as wanted to enjoy my Saturday afternoons again. Youthful enthusiasm is probably what carried me through during Williamson.

Jones28
29-07-2017, 09:07 AM
I was lucky in that we lived abroad at the time and missed the Blobby era out entirely.

By all accounts the football was dreadful BUT he did play a big part in the development of one of the most exciting Hibs teams in many a lifetime. Maybe not through choice but he was still there.

We returned home and bought 3 season tickets for tony mowbrays first season in charge, we got lucky there.

heretoday
29-07-2017, 09:45 AM
Didn't he take over from Idi Amin as boss of Uganda's national squad?

I heard he's requested that the word "Livingston" be erased from the language.

Smartie
29-07-2017, 10:00 AM
When time elapses you tend to put on the rose-tinted glasses and airbrush a lot of the rubbish from memory.

I'm sure some of the football was poor, but we've played a lot of poor football in my time watching Hibs

Williamson had a tough gig - get rid of the high earners, blood the youngsters and keep us competitive at a time when some horrific financial doping is going on amongst our rivals.

Against that backdrop we could well have been relegated but from memory that was never a threat under Williamson, although we didn't ever really threaten a particularly high finish either.

The run to the cup final was superb and that semi against Rangers was one of my favourite games as a Hibs fan.

When we assess how good or bad various Hibs managers are, I often like to look at what they inherited, the legacy they left and any mitigating circumstances that there might have been during their time with us. On this basis Williamson inherited an awful situation, had to shift a lot of high earners, always kept us in the top league and left Mowbray a brilliant (whilst not perfect) platform upon which to work.

Applying the same criteria to everyone from Duffy through to Stubbs will probably give you an idea of what I think of each and every Hibs manager.

In many ways I view Williamson as a bit of an unsung hero.

When he retires I think he can look back on the number of caps and medals that young players who played under him at Hibs won and be proud of any role he played in their development.

The football often WAS a bit s***e though.

jacomo
29-07-2017, 10:17 AM
When the cost cutting started did he not get told he wasn't allowed to sign anyone? In the end, we did end up with Matyus. There might have been someone else - Craig James maybe?


He definitely was under pressure to slash the playing budget.

There were things like not playing O'Neil because we didn't want to pay his appearance fees. The club was £18m in debt, TV deal had collapsed, in danger of leaving ER. Tough times.

Bobby coped pretty well with this and did bring in players as more expensive ones left. Caldwell, for example.

tamig
29-07-2017, 10:29 AM
The McCluskey / Souness game is one of my fav games I've ever been to at ER.

Also remember being amazed that we had Steve Archibald with us for a season.

It wasn't all bad.
John Blackley was in charge for the Souness game.

Just Jimmy
29-07-2017, 10:30 AM
He definitely was under pressure to slash the playing budget.

There were things like not playing O'Neil because we didn't want to pay his appearance fees. The club was £18m in debt, TV deal had collapsed, in danger of leaving ER. Tough times.

Bobby coped pretty well with this and did bring in players as more expensive ones left. Caldwell, for example.sauzee signed caldwell on loan first i think.

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matty_f
29-07-2017, 10:32 AM
Ones called Ronald
Ones called Frank
One misses penalties
The other ones a w...
To the tune of Nice one Cyril one of my favourite ever songs.
Still gets an airing anytime I see one of them on the tv. :greengrin

wpj
29-07-2017, 10:34 AM
Bobby gave us a vital 'new manager bounce' at a time when we really needed it.

He demonstrated in 3 matches that Sauzee hadn't got a clue what he was doing.

However, matches lasted 180 minutes when he was in charge and I was delighted to see him 'invited' to join Argyle by Rod.

I was in Devon visiting family when it happened. Bizarre seeing clips of Hibs on the local news. Remember not being too bothered about it though. We've had a long strange trip since then though

SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
29-07-2017, 11:34 AM
Context is maybe relevant in hindsight, but I didn't sit there under Williamson bored out my mind thinking, this is grim but was always going to be tough to follow the Mcleish years. I was aware we were cutting costs at the time of course, but there was zero excitement during most 90 minutes not the results.

Similarly, I didn't sit there under Fenlon saying, at least it's not as bad as Calderwood. I stopped going under Fenlon as wanted to enjoy my Saturday afternoons again. Youthful enthusiasm is probably what carried me through during Williamson.

Totally appreciate that mate - but i took the point of this thread to look back with hindsight. At the time it was awful, admittedly.

Viva_Palmeiras
29-07-2017, 11:37 AM
Totally appreciate that mate - but i took the point of this thread to look back with hindsight. At the time it was awful, admittedly.

Yup to reflect a wee bit given more info and perspective.

Purple & Green
29-07-2017, 11:59 AM
What I was going to say. That quote was made when he was Kilmarnock manager.

The 1-1 game when Libbra scored.

Ayrshire Hibee
29-07-2017, 12:09 PM
The McCluskey / Souness game is one of my fav games I've ever been to at ER.

Also remember being amazed that we had Steve Archibald with us for a season.

It wasn't all bad.

John Blackley was manager when Souness came to town on 9.8.86

KeithTheHibby
29-07-2017, 12:13 PM
Hands down, calderwood was completely out his depth

I disagree. Guys like Jim Duffy and Pat Fenlon were out of their depth. Calderwood just wasn't interested in being in Scotland.

KeithTheHibby
29-07-2017, 12:17 PM
When the cost cutting started did he not get told he wasn't allowed to sign anyone? In the end, we did end up with Matyus. There might have been someone else - Craig James maybe?

Not sure that is correct however guys like John O'Neill suffered big time under him. A mainstay under McLeish and Sauzee however his appearances after that were next to nothing. Rumour had it he was on 3k per week and 3k per game which at the time could be perfectly plausible as he was a top signing along with Sauzee and Latapy.

KeithTheHibby
29-07-2017, 12:23 PM
When time elapses you tend to put on the rose-tinted glasses and airbrush a lot of the rubbish from memory.

I'm sure some of the football was poor, but we've played a lot of poor football in my time watching Hibs

Williamson had a tough gig - get rid of the high earners, blood the youngsters and keep us competitive at a time when some horrific financial doping is going on amongst our rivals.

Against that backdrop we could well have been relegated but from memory that was never a threat under Williamson, although we didn't ever really threaten a particularly high finish either.

The run to the cup final was superb and that semi against Rangers was one of my favourite games as a Hibs fan.

When we assess how good or bad various Hibs managers are, I often like to look at what they inherited, the legacy they left and any mitigating circumstances that there might have been during their time with us. On this basis Williamson inherited an awful situation, had to shift a lot of high earners, always kept us in the top league and left Mowbray a brilliant (whilst not perfect) platform upon which to work.

Applying the same criteria to everyone from Duffy through to Stubbs will probably give you an idea of what I think of each and every Hibs manager.

In many ways I view Williamson as a bit of an unsung hero.

When he retires I think he can look back on the number of caps and medals that young players who played under him at Hibs won and be proud of any role he played in their development.

The football often WAS a bit s***e though.


Yeah I am with you. You have to look at the big picture with managers. Bearing this in mind I have to say that Butcher has been the biggest **** to manage Hibs in my time. What an opportunity for him yet he made a right james hunt of it. Even to this day I have yet to hear or read any article whereby he has apologised to the fans for the mistakes he made. Arrogant useless fud.

jacomo
29-07-2017, 12:25 PM
sauzee signed caldwell on loan first i think.

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Did he? The details are a bit hazy.

Bobby definitely renewed the loan agreement at least once - Caldwell was initially on a short term arrangement and never seemed that enthusiastic about staying with us.

KWJ
29-07-2017, 12:39 PM
http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11678/2229737/hibs-sign-caldwell

Sauzee signing Caldwell. Must admit I thought he came a good bit later.

Williamson came in - steadied the ship, kept us up and then with a heap of meaningless games he unleashed Scott Brown on the SPL while Riordan, O'Connor had already been well introduced.

Purple & Green
29-07-2017, 01:40 PM
Did he? The details are a bit hazy.

Bobby definitely renewed the loan agreement at least once - Caldwell was initially on a short term arrangement and never seemed that enthusiastic about staying with us.

My recollection is that blobby brought him in the following season on loan but he was at Coventry? Between his First two hibs spells.

Caldwell was outstanding from his first game under sauzee.

Just Jimmy
29-07-2017, 02:03 PM
he signed under sauzee on a short loan ib 2002. he then went on loan again until 2004 where he signed short term until the end of the season when his newcastle contract ran out. he went on trial with vitesse arnam in holland and then eventually signed a 2 year deal at hibs.

he was 2004's Stokes.

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