Fans Rep Surgery - Sat 15th July at Hibs Club (NOT THIS WEEKEND)

[traceyhibs]

This coming Saturday before the game against Montrose myself and Frank will be holding a fans surgery in the Hibs Supporters Club at Sunnyside from 12.30-13.30.

We will be upstairs in the Pat Stanton lounge.

If you can't make it along but have anything you like to discuss, please contact us.

Email:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk

tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk

We look forward to seeing you



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[Onceinawhile]

Good idea 🖒

[The Modfather]

This coming Saturday before the game against Montrose myself and Frank will be holding a fans surgery in the Hibs Supporters Club at Sunnyside from 12.30-13.30.

We will be upstairs in the Pat Stanton lounge.

If you can't make it along but have anything you like to discuss, please contact us.

Email:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk

tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk

We look forward to seeing you



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Good stuff.

Have the club or either yourself or Frank spoken about the recent developments with Rangers or any plans for any comms? Would like to hear something official, especially in light of the thread and poll on here last week. Also particularly interested in Petrie's thoughts given his involvement in the SFA.

Thanks

[traceyhibs]

Good stuff.

Have the club or either yourself or Frank spoken about the recent developments with Rangers or any plans for any comms? Would like to hear something official, especially in light of the thread and poll on here last week. Also particularly interested in Petrie's thoughts given his involvement in the SFA.

Thanks

Frank and I will be raising the concerns in relation to the tax case at the next board meeting on 31st July




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[Real Emerald]

I unfortunately can't make the game or the meeting on Saturday but I would have wanted an update on what's going on with the BTG bar replacement that was promised. This meeting at Sunnyside is probably a consequence of the great facilities we had at Easter Road Football Stadium now being unavailable for the use of football supporters!

[Pretty Boy]

I'm away for a long weekend so missing the game.

Can we please have stones like the East and West offered for the FF stand?

[traceyhibs]

I unfortunately can't make the game or the meeting on Saturday but I would have wanted an update on what's going on with the BTG bar replacement that was promised. This meeting at Sunnyside is probably a consequence of the great facilities we had at Easter Road Football Stadium now being unavailable for the use of football supporters!

We are hoping to have an update soon. We are close to a temp solution but will let everyone know as soon as we have something concrete to tell you.


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[traceyhibs]

I'm away for a long weekend so missing the game.

Can we please have stones like the East and West offered for the FF stand?

I will pass this on [emoji4]


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[Real Emerald]

We are hoping to have an update soon. We are close to a temp solution but will let everyone know as soon as we have something concrete to tell you.


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Brilliant thanks 👍

[andyf5]

This coming Saturday before the game against Montrose myself and Frank will be holding a fans surgery in the Hibs Supporters Club at Sunnyside from 12.30-13.30.

We will be upstairs in the Pat Stanton lounge.

If you can't make it along but have anything you like to discuss, please contact us.

Email:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk

tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk

We look forward to seeing you



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can't make it but have emailed you

[The Modfather]

Frank and I will be raising the concerns in relation to the tax case at the next board meeting on 31st July

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Hi Tracy, hope the fans rep surgery went well 😀

Can I add another point/question for the next board meeting? Given Celtic have just been fined for sectarian singing by UEFA. Could you ask Hibs thoughts on this. Probably more relevant for Rod, given he is on the SFA, but why can UEFA punish sectarianism but the SFA appear to simply turn a blind eye to it. Probably as relevant a time as ever with our trip to Ibrox coming up with the cup final and Neil Lennon our manager.

Cheers.

[DarlingtonHibee]

Hi Tracy, hope the fans rep surgery went well 😀

Can I add another point/question for the next board meeting? Given Celtic have just been fined for sectarian singing by UEFA. Could you ask Hibs thoughts on this. Probably more relevant for Rod, given he is on the SFA, but why can UEFA punish sectarianism but the SFA appear to simply turn a blind eye to it. Probably as relevant a time as ever with our trip to Ibrox coming up with the cup final and Neil Lennon our manager.

Cheers.

This...

[Danderhall Hibs]

Hi Tracy, hope the fans rep surgery went well 😀

Can I add another point/question for the next board meeting? Given Celtic have just been fined for sectarian singing by UEFA. Could you ask Hibs thoughts on this. Probably more relevant for Rod, given he is on the SFA, but why can UEFA punish sectarianism but the SFA appear to simply turn a blind eye to it. Probably as relevant a time as ever with our trip to Ibrox coming up with the cup final and Neil Lennon our manager.

Cheers.

Is the reason for this not due to "strict liability" which all clubs have voted on? Basically means that a club in Scotland can't be disciplined for their fans behaviour.

[marinello59]

Is the reason for this not due to "strict liability" which all clubs have voted on? Basically means that a club in Scotland can't be disciplined for their fans behaviour.

If we had strict liability then Hibs would have been hammered even more for the cup final pitch invasion and the refugee song would also have seen us punished. We need to be careful what we wish for.

[blackpoolhibs]

If we had strict liability then Hibs would have been hammered even more for the cup final pitch invasion and the refugee song would also have seen us punished. We need to be careful what we wish for.

Don't agree with that view, it smacks of just letting folk away with doing what they want.

If we are serious about cutting out sectarianism and poor behaviour, we all need to stand up and make changes or take the punishment.

Until such times as clubs are properly punished, these things will carry on indefinitely.

[green&left]

Hi Tracy, hope the fans rep surgery went well 😀

Can I add another point/question for the next board meeting? Given Celtic have just been fined for sectarian singing by UEFA. Could you ask Hibs thoughts on this. Probably more relevant for Rod, given he is on the SFA, but why can UEFA punish sectarianism but the SFA appear to simply turn a blind eye to it. Probably as relevant a time as ever with our trip to Ibrox coming up with the cup final and Neil Lennon our manager.

Cheers.

They havn't been charged for sectarian singing. They've been charged for an "illicit banner".


The SFA and SPFL couldn't run a bath so thank **** there's no strict liability up here.

[cabbageandribs1875]

why should our football clubs be expected to take any stance against sectarianism in our stadiums when our governments allow sectarian marches to take place on our streets :dunno:

[Siralbertkidd]

They havn't been charged for sectarian singing. They've been charged for an "illicit banner".


The SFA and SPFL couldn't run a bath so thank **** there's no strict liability up here. yes they have, singing and banner both charged.

[marinello59]

Don't agree with that view, it smacks of just letting folk away with doing what they want.

If we are serious about cutting out sectarianism and poor behaviour, we all need to stand up and make changes or take the punishment.

Until such times as clubs are properly punished, these things will carry on indefinitely.

It's not a case of letting people away with what they want. It's more a case of not trusting the Scottish Football authorities in the role of judge and jury when it comes to punishing clubs for any behaviour they deem offensive. Would you trust them?

[green&left]

yes they have, singing and banner both charged.

When? The 3 charges announced yesterday are for illicit banner, having a sponsor on the bibs and stairways being blocked.

[Siralbertkidd]

When? The 3 charges announced yesterday are for illicit banner, having a sponsor on the bibs and stairways being blocked.

Apologies, you are correct. the bit i read (my own fault for reading the DR) was "Cops confirmed a probe will be made into a "small section" of fans of both teams after supporters were heard singing anti-sectarian songs".

[Geo_1875]

Apologies, you are correct. the bit i read (my own fault for reading the DR) was "Cops confirmed a probe will be made into a "small section" of fans of both teams after supporters were heard singing anti-sectarian songs".

What would they be?

[Siralbertkidd]

What would they be?

Indeed. Maybe they upset the DR by not following their rules!

[bigwheel]

What would they be?


Oh, they are well known around the old firm these days...it's a joy fest.. :greengrin:greengrin Some of the numbers are:

We love the Queen and the Pope too..

You are ra People

King Billy and the Pope - Simply the equal best...

[blackpoolhibs]

It's not a case of letting people away with what they want. It's more a case of not trusting the Scottish Football authorities in the role of judge and jury when it comes to punishing clubs for any behaviour they deem offensive. Would you trust them?

We need to get away from that argument, we really do. Sectarianism and bad behaviour is just that, and step out of line and you should be punished accordingly.

If our fans misbehave during a match, or anyone starts singing about the pope or the queen or Catholics or Protestants in disparaging terms, we need to man up and accept its wrong.

Our fans should be pulling them up if they misbehave, self-police I suppose. We had sectarianism in the 60s and 70s EVERY week following Hibs, we've managed to virtually wipe it out.

Nobody would complain if the same thing was happening in Glasgow.

I know away from the ground, these things might go on more often than we'd like, but we as football fans can do something about this inside a ground where 99% of non old firm fans go to see football and don't want that bile anywhere near it.

Being frightened of what might happen is what they want, it's why the authorities are running scared of them, it's up to the fans to push this through, it's up to us to say enough is enough.

Ignoring it is just as bad, we can't keep on living in that cesspit.

[marinello59]

We need to get away from that argument, we really do. Sectarianism and bad behaviour is just that, and step out of line and you should be punished accordingly.

If our fans misbehave during a match, or anyone starts singing about the pope or the queen or Catholics or Protestants in disparaging terms, we need to man up and accept its wrong.

Our fans should be pulling them up if they misbehave, self-police I suppose. We had sectarianism in the 60s and 70s EVERY week following Hibs, we've managed to virtually wipe it out.

Nobody would complain if the same thing was happening in Glasgow.

I know away from the ground, these things might go on more often than we'd like, but we as football fans can do something about this inside a ground where 99% of non old firm fans go to see football and don't want that bile anywhere near it.

Being frightened of what might happen is what they want, it's why the authorities are running scared of them, it's up to the fans to push this through, it's up to us to say enough is enough.

Ignoring it is just as bad, we can't keep on living in that cesspit.

You have ignored my question. Would you trust the Scottish football authorities to act as judge and jury as well as deciding what constitutes offensive behaviour. That's what strict liability will mean.
Given all you have said there how many people did you challenge for singing the refugee song?

[blackpoolhibs]

You have ignored my question. Would you trust the Scottish football authorities to act as judge and jury as well as deciding what constitutes offensive behaviour. That's what strict liability will mean.
Given all you have said there how many people did you challenge for singing the refugee song?

Didn't ignore it 59, I just said its something that has to happen whether we trust them or not. And as for challenging anyone singing the refugee song, I never challenged anyone, but if we were to have strict liability. I'd certainly challenge anyone who was singing that or any song that was against what we should be striving for.

We need to stop being afraid of what might happen and strive for a better and non sectarian/bigotted game, and that includes racism or even sexism now.

[marinello59]

Didn't ignore it 59, I just said its something that has to happen whether we trust them or not. And as for challenging anyone singing the refugee song, I never challenged anyone, but if we were to have strict liability. I'd certainly challenge anyone who was singing that or any song that was against what we should be striving for.

We need to stop being afraid of what might happen and strive for a better and non sectarian/bigotted game, and that includes racism or even sexism now.

I'm not disagreeing about where we need to go, just how we get there. I don't see strict liability as the answer, it's like a teacher putting a whole class in detention because one kid misbehaved.

[greenlex]

I'm not disagreeing about where we need to go, just how we get there. I don't see strict liability as the answer, it's like a teacher putting a whole class in detention because one kid misbehaved.
If there was one dick in class keeping everyone back would he not get sorted out by the majority? Eventually.

[blackpoolhibs]

I'm not disagreeing about where we need to go, just how we get there. I don't see strict liability as the answer, it's like a teacher putting a whole class in detention because one kid misbehaved.


If there was one dick in class keeping everyone back would he not get sorted out by the majority? Eventually.


:agree:

[Johnny Clash]

This coming Saturday before the game against Montrose myself and Frank will be holding a fans surgery in the Hibs Supporters Club at Sunnyside from 12.30-13.30.

We will be upstairs in the Pat Stanton lounge.

If you can't make it along but have anything you like to discuss, please contact us.

Email:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk

tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk

We look forward to seeing you

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In order to enhance communication between our supporters reps and supporters , is there any chance of a surgery before the Motherwell game? A clear explanation as to the reasons and thinking behind the recent unanimous vote re the EBT issue would be much appreciated and may give us a greater understanding.

[traceyhibs]

In order to enhance communication between our supporters reps and supporters , is there any chance of a surgery before the Motherwell game? A clear explanation as to the reasons and thinking behind the recent unanimous vote re the EBT issue would be much appreciated and may give us a greater understanding.

We don't think this is going to be possible. This isn't us avoiding anyone. We will be holding the Working Together Meeting on Monday 25th September at 6.30pm in the West Stand.

Alternatively quite happy to speak with you before the game


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[CMurdoch]

We don't think this is going to be possible. This isn't us avoiding anyone. We will be holding the Working Together Meeting on Monday 25th September at 6.30pm in the West Stand.

Alternatively quite happy to speak with you before the game


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Don't do it.
Run Tracey Run!!!

[Johnny Clash]

We don't think this is going to be possible. This isn't us avoiding anyone. We will be holding the Working Together Meeting on Monday 25th September at 6.30pm in the West Stand.

Alternatively quite happy to speak with you before the game


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Thanks for that - unfortunately I'll be working in London on 25th.
I can email you my questions Tracey. Just thought an open surgery would give supporters a chance to get a greater understanding on the thinking behind this.

[Hibbyradge]

Thanks for that - unfortunately I'll be working in London on 25th.
I can email you my questions Tracey. Just thought an open surgery would give supporters a chance to get a greater opportunity to lynch you.

ftfy :wink:

[Ozyhibby]

We don't think this is going to be possible. This isn't us avoiding anyone. We will be holding the Working Together Meeting on Monday 25th September at 6.30pm in the West Stand.

Alternatively quite happy to speak with you before the game


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Great, looking forward to it.


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[Firestarter]

Do you need a ticket or notify branch chairman?

[Johnny Clash]

ftfy :wink:


FFS - thought I'd done a mental typo there!!!

... also had to google ftfy !!

[oldbutdim]

FFS - thought I'd done a mental typo there!!!

... also had to google ftfy !!

Funnily enough I had to as well.

Bloody teenagers.

[Hibbyradge]

Funnily enough I had to as well.

Bloody teenagers.

😊

[Peevemor]

Funnily enough I had to as well.

Bloody teenagers.Me too and what a let down. With all those Fs I was hoping for something rude.

[Carheenlea]

Do you need a ticket or notify branch chairman?

The Working Together group is open to anyone who fancies going along (I think).

[Is It On....]

This coming Saturday before the game against Montrose myself and Frank will be holding a fans surgery in the Hibs Supporters Club at Sunnyside from 12.30-13.30.

We will be upstairs in the Pat Stanton lounge.

If you can't make it along but have anything you like to discuss, please contact us.

Email:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk

tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk

We look forward to seeing you



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I think it could be a very long hour so good luck!

[Is It On....]

Don't do it.
Run Tracey Run!!!

In "Run Lola Run", there was a different ending each time.

[500miles]

If there was one dick in class keeping everyone back would he not get sorted out by the majority? Eventually.

I was in that class, the rest of us hated the teacher for it made his life unbearable, and the head of department took over.

[blackpoolhibs]

Why the Hibs club Tracey, its members only is it not?

[traceyhibs]

Why the Hibs club Tracey, its members only is it not?

This is an old thread so it's confusing people. There isn't a fans reps Surgery on Saturday at the Hibs Club


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[Carheenlea]

If we don't beat Montrose I'll not be back.

[blackpoolhibs]

This is an old thread so it's confusing people. There isn't a fans reps Surgery on Saturday at the Hibs Club


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When and where is it Tracey?

[traceyhibs]

When and where is it Tracey?

The next time will be the Working Together Meeting on 25th September at 6.30pm via the West Stand reception


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[blackpoolhibs]

The next time will be the Working Together Meeting on 25th September at 6.30pm via the West Stand reception


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Do you not think there should be a chance for folk to air their views at a weekend, when most folk are off and have more of a chance to get to the ground, maybe like a matchday?

Not everyone can make an obscure monday night, but if there is a game on, they will be going to Easter Road?

[Danderhall Hibs]

Do you not think there should be a chance for folk to air their views at a weekend, when most folk are off and have more of a chance to get to the ground, maybe like a matchday?

Not everyone can make an obscure monday night, but if there is a game on, they will be going to Easter Road?

:agree: I'd have thought that a match day was perfect for these meetings. Have we only had one this season and that was at a pre season game in the middle/end of trades holidays?

The working together group is supposed to be working to improve stuff not a surgery with the fans reps?

2 different meetings.

[edinburghhibee]

:agree: I'd have thought that a match day was perfect for these meetings. Have we only had one this season and that was at a pre season game in the middle/end of trades holidays?

The working together group is supposed to be working to improve stuff not a surgery with the fans reps?

2 different meetings.

So if we have an issue with the statement and want questions answered from the board have we to go to this meeting or is a fans reps meeting being arranged?


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[Beefster]

Do you not think there should be a chance for folk to air their views at a weekend, when most folk are off and have more of a chance to get to the ground, maybe like a matchday?

Not everyone can make an obscure monday night, but if there is a game on, they will be going to Easter Road?

In their defence, it's totally normal to hold surgeries on a random night, during an unrelated meeting.

I used to be an employee rep years ago and it was a major pain in the arse tbh. So much so that I ended up holding the meetings on a Tuesday night at 9:30pm in my house, after my bath. None of the employees turned up despite their continual grumbling. Job done.

[blackpoolhibs]

In their defence, it's totally normal to hold surgeries on a random night, during an unrelated meeting.

I used to be an employee rep years ago and it was a major pain in the arse tbh. So much so that I ended up holding the meetings on a Tuesday night at 9:30pm in my house, after my bath. None of the employees turned up despite their continual grumbling. Job done.

:greengrin

[Johnny Clash]

This is an old thread so it's confusing people. There isn't a fans reps Surgery on Saturday at the Hibs Club


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Yeh - I was replying to an older post from Tracey about the fans rep surgery set up in July to suggest it would be a good idea to hold a similar one this Saturday. I'm not sure why but a new thread with the old thread title seems to have been created. That might be confusing (although it does say 15 July). Is there anyway to change the title?

[Danderhall Hibs]

Does anyone know when the next fans surgery is?

When was the last update we received from Tracey (or Frank)?

[Pretty Boy]

Does anyone know when the next fans surgery is?

When was the last update we received from Tracey (or Frank)?

It's been a while.

I do think it's interesting we have now seen 2 successful candidates promise extensive communication across various platforms (along with a promise from Frank to diversify his communication style) and it hasn't really happened.

I think that probably points to it not being their fault for various reasons.

[Dalianwanda]

It's been a while.

I do think it's interesting we have now seen 2 successful candidates promise extensive communication across various platforms (along with a promise from Frank to diversify his communication style) and it hasn't really happened.

I think that probably points to it not being their fault for various reasons.
Surely Frank was experienced enough to know the lay of the land before making false promises?

[blackpoolhibs]

Does anyone know when the next fans surgery is?

When was the last update we received from Tracey (or Frank)?

Tracey has been on here quite a lot, and other social media types. The other one promised he'd do more when up for election, but there's been nothing I have seen from him.

Very happy to be put right on this, but I doubt it.

Tracey seems to have been gagged, ( i obviously understand why) how would we know if the other one had been gagged if we never hear anything anyway?

[bigwheel]

Tracey has been on here quite a lot, and other social media types. The other one promised he'd do more when up for election, but there's been nothing I have seen from him.

Very happy to be put right on this, but I doubt it.

Tracey seems to have been gagged, ( i obviously understand why) how would we know if the other one had been gagged if we never hear anything anyway?

Your "gagged" point feels right .....Iirc. Tracey had previously committed an update on this matter after a board meeting a couple of months ago. It never appeared. It is now clear from the recent statement that this matter was not concluded over one board meeting, it took successive meetings to agree a position..

The fans reps should have simply updated in the mean time...a truthful statement of "the matter was discussed, the board have not concluded their views yet and it will be further explored at the next meeting"...would have been an honest and clear way of providing an update. The fact that Tracey didn't come back in it , does suggest a request not to - as she has been pretty good at engaging on a range of topics ..

inconsistent communications approaches confuses us fans ...we don't expect to get all the answers if they are not there neither can we expect to agree with all of the views and decisions - but keep us updated in line with commitments- that's all I ask for

[Firestarter]

The Working Together group is open to anyone who fancies going along (I think).

Thanks mate.

[ColinNish]

Thanks mate.

Think you have to email though to say if you're wanting to go.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Tracey has been on here quite a lot, and other social media types. The other one promised he'd do more when up for election, but there's been nothing I have seen from him.

Very happy to be put right on this, but I doubt it.

Tracey seems to have been gagged, ( i obviously understand why) how would we know if the other one had been gagged if we never hear anything anyway?

The other one???? Not know his name, or too petty to use it?

[blackpoolhibs]

Think you have to email though to say if you're wanting to go.

So you have to use the world wide web to see a rep, but one of them won't use it to keep us informed :faf:

[WhileTheChief..]

The other one???? Not know his name, or too petty to use it?

You seem to know Frank Dougan well. Any reason he doesn't post on here?

It's a fair question, I watched the video when they were pitching for votes and he definitely said he'd be more accessible than previously.

I've yet to hear a word from him on any subject since he was re-elected.

[blackpoolhibs]

The other one???? Not know his name, or too petty to use it?

Is that his name, not seen anything from him for ssooooooooo long i'd forgotten it?

Its funny how you are right on here sticking up for him, when it seems he wont for some reason or other?

Do you remember his words when he wanted to be voted in again?

[Carheenlea]

Is that his name, not seen anything from him for ssooooooooo long i'd forgotten it?

Its funny how you are right on here sticking up for him, when it seems he wont for some reason or other?

Do you remember his words when he wanted to be voted in again?

I think he simply requesting a bit of manners towards a fellow Hibs fan, regardless off any issues you have with either of the fans reps.

[Skol]

I know I have been critical of the fans reps, but I feel for them (or Tracey anyway) as she has been badly let down by the board and clearly told to say nothing. I guess that shows what our board think of the fans reps.

Frank is another matter. You need to know him or know where to find him, but all is Ok cos he attends functions to represent the club and holds the licence on behind the goals and can tell us what is going on...........

[Smartie]

I don't know Frank Dougan but I know who he is.

It is a bit unfair to say he's not very visible.

He's about as visible a Hibs fan as it is possible to get.

You see him at every game, somewhere or other.

When there are mad ticket scrambles he is there, trying to smooth things out.

He may not be the most visible online (which I suppose may be a fair and reasonable criticism in this internet age) but for some folk the internet just isn't their thing.

It's easy to forget that with Hibs, a lot exists beyond hibs.net - I think (from little knowledge other than going to Hibs games and speaking to fellow fans) that Frank does a cracking job engaging with Hibs fans in all the important areas outwith the internet.

[Baldy Foghorn]

You seem to know Frank Dougan well. Any reason he doesn't post on here?

It's a fair question, I watched the video when they were pitching for votes and he definitely said he'd be more accessible than previously.

I've yet to hear a word from him on any subject since he was re-elected.


Is that his name, not seen anything from him for ssooooooooo long i'd forgotten it?

Its funny how you are right on here sticking up for him, when it seems he wont for some reason or other?

Do you remember his words when he wanted to be voted in again?

He doesn't post but browses. Him and Tracey liaise daily and any statements put out by Tracey, are joint discussions they have had.

Can tell you he is thoroughly fed up of the constant criticism, of him, Tracey and the Club. He used to go to the games to enjoy them, not so sure that's the case anymore. I only stick up for him as he is a friend, as I'm sure you would do too if roles were reversed

[Bostonhibby]

I don't know Frank Dougan but I know who he is.

It is a bit unfair to say he's not very visible.

He's about as visible a Hibs fan as it is possible to get.

You see him at every game, somewhere or other.

When there are mad ticket scrambles he is there, trying to smooth things out.

He may not be the most visible online (which I suppose may be a fair and reasonable criticism in this internet age) but for some folk the internet just isn't their thing.

It's easy to forget that with Hibs, a lot exists beyond hibs.net - I think (from little knowledge other than going to Hibs games and speaking to fellow fans) that Frank does a cracking job engaging with Hibs fans in all the important areas outwith the internet.

Fair points, but you don't need to be a board director of the club to do any of the things here and others that are done for the love of the club, a reps role would more than cover it, and would free up the rep from the sort of issue that has arisen here where it seems they haven't really been able to represent the fans anyway, or at least say how they've done it, what they've contributed and why.

[Billy Whizz]

I don't know Frank Dougan but I know who he is.

It is a bit unfair to say he's not very visible.

He's about as visible a Hibs fan as it is possible to get.

You see him at every game, somewhere or other.

When there are mad ticket scrambles he is there, trying to smooth things out.

He may not be the most visible online (which I suppose may be a fair and reasonable criticism in this internet age) but for some folk the internet just isn't their thing.

It's easy to forget that with Hibs, a lot exists beyond hibs.net - I think (from little knowledge other than going to Hibs games and speaking to fellow fans) that Frank does a cracking job engaging with Hibs fans in all the important areas outwith the internet.

Smartie, re your last paragraph, spot on. I see Frank at every home and away game, and development games as well. I see Tracey slightly less, but she's always around at games if I wanted to catch up

[blackpoolhibs]

He doesn't post but browses. Him and Tracey liaise daily and any statements put out by Tracey, are joint discussions they have had.

Can tell you he is thoroughly fed up of the constant criticism, of him, Tracey and the Club. He used to go to the games to enjoy them, not so sure that's the case anymore. I only stick up for him as he is a friend, as I'm sure you would do too if roles were reversed

So when Tracey says anything on social media, she's talking for him too?

Everything she says are his thoughts too, brilliant, i had a wife like that once.

When he said during nominations that he'd have to be more social media friendly, what he really meant was i will get someone else to do it for me.

[Danderhall Hibs]

He doesn't post but browses. Him and Tracey liaise daily and any statements put out by Tracey, are joint discussions they have had.

Can tell you he is thoroughly fed up of the constant criticism, of him, Tracey and the Club. He used to go to the games to enjoy them, not so sure that's the case anymore. I only stick up for him as he is a friend, as I'm sure you would do too if roles were reversed

Is there that much to do that they chat daily? It'd be good to hear an update on what they've been discussing over the last few weeks.

[Baldy Foghorn]

So when Tracey says anything on social media, she's talking for him too?

Everything she says are his thoughts too, brilliant, i had a wife like that once.

When he said during nominations that he'd have to be more social media friendly, what he really meant was i will get someone else to do it for me.

Fair enough, you have made it fairly apparent there is no point discussing it with you, as you can't debate without pot shots

[Baldy Foghorn]

Is there that much to do that they chat daily? It'd be good to hear an update on what they've been discussing over the last few weeks.

Would suggest there is always something going on, they both get emails direct from supporters on various issues

[Firestarter]

Smartie, re your last paragraph, spot on. I see Frank at every home and away game, and development games as well. I see Tracey slightly less, but she's always around at games if I wanted to catch up

Billy, why didn't you stand for rep? Serious question? You would be ideal imo.

[Skol]

Fair enough, you have made it fairly apparent there is no point discussing it with you, as you can't debate without pot shots

I dont think Frank is helping himself here. I for one have no idea who he is or how to find him.

There must be a way for the fans reps to engage with the people they represent and who actually voted them in !

[Baldy Foghorn]

I dont think Frank is helping himself here. I for one have no idea who he is or how to find him.

There must be a way for the fans reps to engage with the people they represent and who actually voted them in !

He is at every game and readily accessible

[blackpoolhibs]

Fair enough, you have made it fairly apparent there is no point discussing it with you, as you can't debate without pot shots

Why dont you do his talking for him, as im hearing more from you.

If i failed to do something i'd said during the run up to the reps vote, after been criticised for not doing it the previous year, but promised that would change if i was voted back in.

I'd expect that to be questioned.

[Billy Whizz]

Billy, why didn't you stand for rep? Serious question? You would be ideal imo.

Thanks, but it's not for me just now.
I enjoy going to see Hibs, without getting involved in the politics of it

[Firestarter]

He is at every game and readily accessible

Have you got a link to his profile page so people can recognise him? I know Frank, he's a top guy but many who don't frequent the Hibs club might not.

[Firestarter]

Thanks, but it's not for me just now.
I enjoy going to see Hibs, without getting involved in the politics of it

Cool mate. I look forward to the day you do :)

[Skol]

He is at every game and readily accessible

In amongst 13k season ticket holders he will be easy to find right enough

[WhileTheChief..]

He doesn't post but browses. Him and Tracey liaise daily and any statements put out by Tracey, are joint discussions they have had.

Can tell you he is thoroughly fed up of the constant criticism, of him, Tracey and the Club. He used to go to the games to enjoy them, not so sure that's the case anymore. I only stick up for him as he is a friend, as I'm sure you would do too if roles were reversed

Thanks for the reply. It does seem strange that he doesn't post himself though, I mean just generally.

Never comments on the games or manager or anything at all really!

He must have known going in for the role that it would mean constant criticism. That's all directors ever get! If he us fed up with it and it starts to ruin his own experience of watching Hibs he would probably be best jacking it in when his term is up.

The concept of fans reps has probably run it course anyways.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Why dont you do his talking for him, as im hearing more from you.

If i failed to do something i'd said during the run up to the reps vote, after been criticised for not doing it the previous year, but promised that would change if i was voted back in.

I'd expect that to be questioned.

I can't explain why Frank doesn't post here. Maybe he is avoiding confrontation, with those only too willing to stick the boot in?

[Baldy Foghorn]

In amongst 13k season ticket holders he will be easy to find right enough

Try an away game smarty

[blackpoolhibs]

I can't explain why Frank doesn't post here. Maybe he is avoiding confrontation, with those only too willing to stick the boot in?

Why would anyone want to stick the boot in?

And if he does not want confrontation, the fans rep job is not for him?

[Skol]

Try an away game smarty

I still wouldnt know where to start. Do I just go about everyone and ask if they are Frank Dougan - easily accessible !!!

[Baldy Foghorn]

Thanks for the reply. It does seem strange that he doesn't post himself though, I mean just generally.

Never comments on the games or manager or anything at all really!

He must have known going in for the role that it would mean constant criticism. That's all directors ever get! If he us fed up with it and it starts to ruin his own experience of watching Hibs he would probably be best jacking it in when his term is up.

The concept of fans reps has probably run it course anyways.

Do you think it would be wise for a rep, to start talking tactics or about games/manager on a forum?

[Baldy Foghorn]

I still wouldnt know where to start. Do I just go about everyone and ask if they are Frank Dougan - easily accessible !!!

Hilarious, pat on the back:aok:

[Baldy Foghorn]

Why would anyone want to stick the boot in?

And if he does not want confrontation, the fans rep job is not for him?

You are constantly doing it on here, like "the other one", No need really is there?

[Firestarter]

Hilarious, pat on the back:aok:

It's a genuine point to be honest. Have you got a link to that profile please? People might notice him then.

[Baldy Foghorn]

It's a genuine point to be honest. Have you got a link to that profile please? People might notice him then.

I think Skol was trolling to be honest.....

And no, find link for yourself:aok:

[The Modfather]

I don't know Frank Dougan but I know who he is.

It is a bit unfair to say he's not very visible.

He's about as visible a Hibs fan as it is possible to get.

You see him at every game, somewhere or other.

When there are mad ticket scrambles he is there, trying to smooth things out.

He may not be the most visible online (which I suppose may be a fair and reasonable criticism in this internet age) but for some folk the internet just isn't their thing.

It's easy to forget that with Hibs, a lot exists beyond hibs.net - I think (from little knowledge other than going to Hibs games and speaking to fellow fans) that Frank does a cracking job engaging with Hibs fans in all the important areas outwith the internet.

The other side of that is that I'm a bit of a Luddite so don't do social media. I go to all home games and and probably about a quarter of away games, give or take. Do my own thing in terms of pre match (generally Joseph Pearce) and travelling to away games.

So speaking for myself and my group of season ticket holders Hibs.net and the official site is where we get all our updates from. I was at McDirmiad Park early on sat so saw who I assumed to be Tracy and Frank standing outside the main stand entrance with Dempster & Petrie, but otherwise couldn't pick them out of a lineup.

How typical I am of the general support, who knows. However I'm fairly skeptical of the role of fans reps thus far. Tracy has been semi visible on here in general, but no idea what Frank has done or said. So for me the whole EBT statement fiasco has disengaged me further from the point of having fans rep roles. The first issue I've actively wanted to hear about, even just updates to say "it's still being worked on and looked at by all about involved" would have satisfied me. It came across as the first real time a fans rep role was in place for the barricades went up and it was back to a feeling of us v them.

As I said, maybe I'm an anomaly and there's not a huge portion of the support being missed like myself. Tracy/Frank, I play 5s on a Thursday night welcome to pop by each week and keep me personally abreast 😀 Haha

[blackpoolhibs]

You are constantly doing it on here, like "the other one", No need really is there?

Aw, Tracey has at least tried to do what she said she would at the hustings, the other one who was elected has a wee browse.

[Firestarter]

I think Skol was trolling to be honest.....

And no, find link for yourself:aok:

Possibly Brockie but it raises a point. Even if Big Frank doesn't like online stuff which is fine he should still have an online persona so people who don't know who he is then know. I'll search when I'm game.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Aw, Tracey has at least tried to do what she said she would at the hustings, the other one who was elected has a wee browse.

Grow up Gary FFS

[Firestarter]

.

[Johnny Clash]

I know I have been critical of the fans reps, but I feel for them (or Tracey anyway) as she has been badly let down by the board and clearly told to say nothing. I guess that shows what our board think of the fans reps.

Frank is another matter. You need to know him or know where to find him, but all is Ok cos he attends functions to represent the club and holds the licence on behind the goals and can tell us what is going on...........


Thing is though Skol - we elected our reps to represent the consensus of Hibs supporters in the boardroom to the best of their ability . I'm aware a few posters have always been unconvinced by the role of the reps but I've always felt it was a very worthy initiative so long as our collective voice is heard and then considered by the their fellow non execuyive directors.

If pressure was put on our reps to vote against their better judgement then that should have been rejected by them . That very well could have resulted in a vote: 7 votes for with 2 against. Not a good result as far as I'm concerned but at least there'd be no issue with the accountability of our reps.

To make matters worse - if 'the board' then put pressure on our elected reps to gagg themselves then that is another serious misjudgment. The consequences for our reps integrity would be obvious especially to the more experienced board members. I really hope that never happened coz that's akin to hanging our two reps out to dry.

I have no idea what's happened. I do intend to send an email to both reps asking. If I was a rep and any of the above happened I'd honestly now explain myself to the very people who put their faith in me and stand true to the principles that made me campaign hard to get elected.

[lord bunberry]

He doesn't post but browses. Him and Tracey liaise daily and any statements put out by Tracey, are joint discussions they have had.

Can tell you he is thoroughly fed up of the constant criticism, of him, Tracey and the Club. He used to go to the games to enjoy them, not so sure that's the case anymore. I only stick up for him as he is a friend, as I'm sure you would do too if roles were reversed
What exactly is it that he is fed up with? He seems like a decent guy, but when people were looking for answers regarding the Rangers situation, there seemed to be complete silence. If they'd been told to say nothing then I think they should have came out and said that. Both of them seem to be stuck in the middle and only being able to carry out their role when it suits the hibs board.
I would prefer if either of them had issues with the fans criticism, they would come out and say what those issues are. They're both fans as well as fans reps, and I think people would appreciate more openness.

[blackpoolhibs]

Grow up Gary FFS

Grow up, FFS we have a fans rep who either lied to us or can't be bothered doing what he said he'd do to help get elected, which one is it?

[Brooster]

Try an away game smarty

Your wasting your time Brockie. Its amazing how many folk live their lives on the internet. As you say Frank is easy to contact either on email or at games. He is easily in the top 3 most recognisable match attending Hibs fans. Folk will contact him if they really want to......either that or moan on here but do nothing.

[Skol]

I think Skol was trolling to be honest.....

And no, find link for yourself:aok:

I am not trolling. If you know who Frank is then he is accessible. If you dont then you have to go to great lengths to find him. Surely the main reqt for a fans rep is to be accessible.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Grow up, FFS we have a fans rep who either lied to us or can't be bothered doing what he said he'd do to help get elected, which one is it?

Ask him next time you see him....I'm not his PA

[Brooster]

Grow up, FFS we have a fans rep who either lied to us or can't be bothered doing what he said he'd do to help get elected, which one is it?

I thought you guys had made up when I introduced you to each other at Ewood Park Blackburn Rovers.

[blackpoolhibs]

Ask him next time you see him....I'm not his PA

If he just did as he said he would when he wanted folk to vote for him, we'd not be having this discussion.

[Smartie]

Billy, why didn't you stand for rep? Serious question? You would be ideal imo.

I know this isn't aimed at me, but I'll answer on behalf of myself anyway. :wink:

I thought about it and quite fancied it.

The truth is, I am a bit of an internet geek. I quite like debate on hibs.net, I quite like getting involved. It is a good platform with a lot of good debate, and I feel quite comfortable sticking my oar in, having an opinion, debating it, defending it and disagreeing with people from a position of anonymity. You can see a point that someone has made, pause for thought, gather your thoughts and post a reply as you see it. Some people may agree with your opinion, some people won't.

This is tougher face to face. Thinking on the spot and responding to problems, concerns and issues in person takes a certain skill set, possibly different to those required over the net. That's why I wouldn't give Frank a kicking for his lack of contribution on hibs.net - the squabbles we have over the internet may not suit his skill set, he may not want to get involved in an arena where he might not do himself justice. Face to face, on the day - I'm sure that is where he is at his best. He's a well-known face and has been trusted by many to represent us, so he must be doing something right for a large number of people.

The main reason I wouldn't stand - I think it is a thankless, impossible task. How on Earth are you meant to represent the Hibs support? We are a huge, diverse group, some reasoned and sensible, some utter bampots. It is literally impossible to do justice to the diversity and strength of opinion that exists amongst us. The "board position on EBTs" is such a topic. It is passionate, overly-emotional and very difficult. The fans reps are piggy in the middle, they'll have a lot more information than any of us to make a decision but have to represent our uninformed position to the board.

I have sympathy for the fans reps, but only to a point, as surely they would have known this when they stood for election. They will have known exactly what they were getting themselves into. It is a position that is a constant ball ache and brings constant aggro. Ok, now it is EBTs. But it could have been relegation, non-promotion, the team on the park being cack, the Scottish Cup final aftermath, a ballsed-up new stand build etc etc etc.

[Billy Whizz]

I know this isn't aimed at me, but I'll answer on behalf of myself anyway. :wink:

I thought about it and quite fancied it.

The truth is, I am a bit of an internet geek. I quite like debate on hibs.net, I quite like getting involved. It is a good platform with a lot of good debate, and I feel quite comfortable sticking my oar in, having an opinion, debating it, defending it and disagreeing with people from a position of anonymity. You can see a point that someone has made, pause for thought, gather your thoughts and post a reply as you see it. Some people may agree with your opinion, some people won't.

This is tougher face to face. Thinking on the spot and responding to problems, concerns and issues in person takes a certain skill set, possibly different to those required over the net. That's why I wouldn't give Frank a kicking for his lack of contribution on hibs.net - the squabbles we have over the internet may not suit his skill set, he may not want to get involved in an arena where he might not do himself justice. Face to face, on the day - I'm sure that is where he is at his best. He's a well-known face and has been trusted by many to represent us, so he must be doing something right for a large number of people.

The main reason I wouldn't stand - I think it is a thankless, impossible task. How on Earth are you meant to represent the Hibs support? We are a huge, diverse group, some reasoned and sensible, some utter bampots. It is literally impossible to do justice to the diversity and strength of opinion that exists amongst us. The "board position on EBTs" is such a topic. It is passionate, overly-emotional and very difficult. The fans reps are piggy in the middle, they'll have a lot more information than any of us to make a decision but have to represent our uninformed position to the board.

I have sympathy for the fans reps, but only to a point, as surely they would have known this when they stood for election. They will have known exactly what they were getting themselves into. It is a position that is a constant ball ache and brings constant aggro. Ok, now it is EBTs. But it could have been relegation, non-promotion, the team on the park being cack, the Scottish Cup final aftermath, a ballsed-up new stand build etc etc etc.

Spot on, I could have posted this myself

[Brooster]

I am not trolling. If you know who Frank is then he is accessible. If you dont then you have to go to great lengths to find him. Surely the main reqt for a fans rep is to be accessible.

You dont really. What failed attempts have you made to find him?

[Radium]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RgUIXA2066o&feature=youtu.be

Not hard to find!

I have always viewed the Reps as complementary (which is why I voted for them), so the online was always going to be led by Tracey as far as I was concerned.

Been off work with a bit of gender specific sniffles so missed the development on Tuesday, suspect Frank was there and answering questions as normal.

I have given my views across a few threads and stated previously that the loss of the updates from Reps has been a real shame.

Hopefully the WT meeting next week will be an opportunity for them to restart


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Baldy Foghorn]

I know this isn't aimed at me, but I'll answer on behalf of myself anyway. :wink:

I thought about it and quite fancied it.

The truth is, I am a bit of an internet geek. I quite like debate on hibs.net, I quite like getting involved. It is a good platform with a lot of good debate, and I feel quite comfortable sticking my oar in, having an opinion, debating it, defending it and disagreeing with people from a position of anonymity. You can see a point that someone has made, pause for thought, gather your thoughts and post a reply as you see it. Some people may agree with your opinion, some people won't.

This is tougher face to face. Thinking on the spot and responding to problems, concerns and issues in person takes a certain skill set, possibly different to those required over the net. That's why I wouldn't give Frank a kicking for his lack of contribution on hibs.net - the squabbles we have over the internet may not suit his skill set, he may not want to get involved in an arena where he might not do himself justice. Face to face, on the day - I'm sure that is where he is at his best. He's a well-known face and has been trusted by many to represent us, so he must be doing something right for a large number of people.

The main reason I wouldn't stand - I think it is a thankless, impossible task. How on Earth are you meant to represent the Hibs support? We are a huge, diverse group, some reasoned and sensible, some utter bampots. It is literally impossible to do justice to the diversity and strength of opinion that exists amongst us. The "board position on EBTs" is such a topic. It is passionate, overly-emotional and very difficult. The fans reps are piggy in the middle, they'll have a lot more information than any of us to make a decision but have to represent our uninformed position to the board.

I have sympathy for the fans reps, but only to a point, as surely they would have known this when they stood for election. They will have known exactly what they were getting themselves into. It is a position that is a constant ball ache and brings constant aggro. Ok, now it is EBTs. But it could have been relegation, non-promotion, the team on the park being cack, the Scottish Cup final aftermath, a ballsed-up new stand build etc etc etc.

Great post

[WhileTheChief..]

Do you think it would be wise for a rep, to start talking tactics or about games/manager on a forum?

Any need for the antsy reply?

You knew fine well what I meant. He's doesn't post on here about anything. Results, tickets, Hearts stand, the EBT issue etc etc.

There are plenty of different subjects discussed on here every week and yet he's 'scared' to voice his own opinion in case of confrontation? Sounds like just the kinda guy we need fighting our corner right enough.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Any need for the antsy reply?

You knew fine well what I meant. He's doesn't post on here about anything. Results, tickets, Hearts stand, the EBT issue etc etc.

There are plenty of different subjects discussed on here every week and yet he's 'scared' to voice his own opinion in case of confrontation? Sounds like just the kinda guy we need fighting our corner right enough.

Antsy?

Why would he comment on other teams stands? If he was to post about a result or tickets, he would get abuse from the "keyboard warriors"....Part of the problem unfortunately

[blackpoolhibs]

Antsy?

Why would he comment on other teams stands? If he was to post about a result or tickets, he would get abuse from the "keyboard warriors"....Part of the problem unfortunately

Has Tracey been abused? :confused:

[Baldy Foghorn]

Has Tracey been abused? :confused:

Has Tracey posted on matches after the game etc?

Tracey always comes across well, amid some weird questioning at times. Maybe Frank not confident on social media?

[blackpoolhibs]

Has Tracey posted on matches after the game etc?

Tracey always comes across well, amid some weird questoning at times. Maybe Frank not confident on social media?

How will we ever know?

[Baldy Foghorn]

How will we ever know?

I get it, I'm out at this juncture

[Pretty Boy]

I don't really give a toss if Frank is good on social media or otherwise. In the dealings I've had with him, admittedly limited, he's been approachable and helpful. Likewise I've exchanged a few PMs with Tracey and she's been very helpful.

The communication is never going to be what some want, and I include myself, because the reps are bound by the same confidentiality as everyone else on the board. If there is sensitive information that has influenced their vote on this issue they can't now issue a statement revealing it.

It's a thankless task, and with no disrespect intended to those who have taken on the role, I said at the time of the last elections the whole thing should be scrapped and I stand by that now.

[Johnny Clash]

I don't really give a toss if Frank is good on social media or otherwise. In the dealings I've had with him, admittedly limited, he's been approachable and helpful. Likewise I've exchanged a few PMs with Tracey and she's been very helpful.

The communication is never going to be what some want, and I include myself, because the reps are bound by the same confidentiality as everyone else on the board. If there is sensitive information that has influenced their vote on this issue they can't now issue a statement revealing it.

It's a thankless task, and with no disrespect intended to those who have taken on the role, I said at the time of the last elections the whole thing should be scrapped and I stand by that now.

If a rep did feel that they had based their decision on some mysterious piece of information that was so sensitive it would harm Hibs by discussing publicly then it would be appreciated if they just said that!

I think there's two things at stake here - Firstly, the voting by elected supporters' reps for an option that clearly most fans are against and secondly the radio silence regards why they did this? I mean, perhaps neither could make the meeting and it was unanimous vote of those who could attend? We just don't know.

[bigwheel]

If a rep did feel that they had based their decision on some mysterious piece of information that was so sensitive it would harm Hibs by discussing publicly then it would be appreciated if they just said that!

I think there's two things at stake here - Firstly, the voting by elected supporters' reps for an option that clearly most fans are against and secondly the radio silence regards why they did this? I mean, perhaps neither could make the meeting and it was unanimous vote of those who could attend? We just don't know.

Board decisions are made collectively...they should be fully supported by all board members after the event...I would be disappointed if a board colleague then shared their individual views - once the position is agreed , they should all support it

That doesn't mean we couldn't have been given some updates along the way though . Equally, and perhaps more importantly, we should expect that they have sought and represented the views of Supporters at the. meetings. It's a key part of their role.

I'm not expecting to agree with all decisions Hibs make - I do expect the fans reps to keep their commitment of regular updates after board meetings and consistent communications etc. This isn't there yet for me

[Pretty Boy]

If a rep did feel that they had based their decision on some mysterious piece of information that was so sensitive it would harm Hibs by discussing publicly then it would be appreciated if they just said that!

I think there's two things at stake here - Firstly, the voting by elected supporters' reps for an option that clearly most fans are against and secondly the radio silence regards why they did this? I mean, perhaps neither could make the meeting and it was unanimous vote of those who could attend? We just don't know.

Your last paragraph is exactly the issue I was getting at.

If the 2 reps get an agenda that will be marked confidential how do they accurately canvas the wishes of the fans? A poll on here or a chat with a few people at a game doesn't do that and breaches confidentiality. They also then can't discuss confidential information discussed within that meeting unless given permission to do so. The voting intention of members of the board will also be known and influenced prior to a vote, once the vote takes place and a decision is reached that becomes collective.

I made this point at the time of the elections. I've sat on a couple of boards and I know the kind of communication that fans want, myself included, about every decision, or at least some of them, made by the Hibs board is impossible.

[Onion]

I know this isn't aimed at me, but I'll answer on behalf of myself anyway. :wink:

I thought about it and quite fancied it.

The truth is, I am a bit of an internet geek. I quite like debate on hibs.net, I quite like getting involved. It is a good platform with a lot of good debate, and I feel quite comfortable sticking my oar in, having an opinion, debating it, defending it and disagreeing with people from a position of anonymity. You can see a point that someone has made, pause for thought, gather your thoughts and post a reply as you see it. Some people may agree with your opinion, some people won't.

This is tougher face to face. Thinking on the spot and responding to problems, concerns and issues in person takes a certain skill set, possibly different to those required over the net. That's why I wouldn't give Frank a kicking for his lack of contribution on hibs.net - the squabbles we have over the internet may not suit his skill set, he may not want to get involved in an arena where he might not do himself justice. Face to face, on the day - I'm sure that is where he is at his best. He's a well-known face and has been trusted by many to represent us, so he must be doing something right for a large number of people.

The main reason I wouldn't stand - I think it is a thankless, impossible task. How on Earth are you meant to represent the Hibs support? We are a huge, diverse group, some reasoned and sensible, some utter bampots. It is literally impossible to do justice to the diversity and strength of opinion that exists amongst us. The "board position on EBTs" is such a topic. It is passionate, overly-emotional and very difficult. The fans reps are piggy in the middle, they'll have a lot more information than any of us to make a decision but have to represent our uninformed position to the board.

I have sympathy for the fans reps, but only to a point, as surely they would have known this when they stood for election. They will have known exactly what they were getting themselves into. It is a position that is a constant ball ache and brings constant aggro. Ok, now it is EBTs. But it could have been relegation, non-promotion, the team on the park being cack, the Scottish Cup final aftermath, a ballsed-up new stand build etc etc etc.

Great post.

IMO the reps job, and that of the Board, would be much easier if Hibs had, and published, a clear set of values that defined what the club stands for, their principles and ethos that we can all get behind. I started to follow Hibs in the 70s and there is most definitely a set of values which attracts me to the club, the way they got about their business, the way the team plays, the sense of fair play and quality in everything the do (whether it comes off or not). They hold some of the same values as me. But I've never seen it written down or explained.

If this was clearly articulated, folk could perhaps start to understand how decisions are made and fit in with our values - even if they don't agree with them. It's when decisions or actions by the club are at odds with the perception of the clubs values and personality, that folk get confused and brassed off. The independent investigation of the Rangers debacle is a good example.

IMO without that, we'll continue to have disparate views, debate and confusion when it comes to generic issues such as the direction of the game and how we'd like to see the game develop. And the reps will be on a hiding to nothing.

[oldbutdim]

So when Tracey says anything on social media, she's talking for him too?

Everything she says are his thoughts too, brilliant, i had a wife like that once.



That explains everything.

If my wife was always quoting Frank Dougan I'd be raging too.

Sympathies mate.

[Eyrie]

Your last paragraph is exactly the issue I was getting at.

If the 2 reps get an agenda that will be marked confidential how do they accurately canvas the wishes of the fans? A poll on here or a chat with a few people at a game doesn't do that and breaches confidentiality. They also then can't discuss confidential information discussed within that meeting unless given permission to do so. The voting intention of members of the board will also be known and influenced prior to a vote, once the vote takes place and a decision is reached that becomes collective.

I made this point at the time of the elections. I've sat on a couple of boards and I know the kind of communication that fans want, myself included, about every decision, or at least some of them, made by the Hibs board is impossible.

The reps could monitor the tone of the discussions on here and the Bounce. If the issue is that important, then fans will approach them at matches or by email to raise concerns. The reps can then inform the Board of what they are hearing.

Given that the reps are meant to be the voice of the supporters, and the overwhelming majority on here (and I suspect the Bounce) wanted the EBT decision examined, the statement that the Board decision was unanimous makes it sound like our views are unrepresented.

I agree that all directors are then bound to support the decision in public whether they voted for it or not.

[blackpoolhibs]

That explains everything.

If my wife was always quoting Frank Dougan I'd be raging too.

Sympathies mate.


:faf: :thumbsup:

[bigwheel]

Your last paragraph is exactly the issue I was getting at.

If the 2 reps get an agenda that will be marked confidential how do they accurately canvas the wishes of the fans? A poll on here or a chat with a few people at a game doesn't do that and breaches confidentiality. They also then can't discuss confidential information discussed within that meeting unless given permission to do so. The voting intention of members of the board will also be known and influenced prior to a vote, once the vote takes place and a decision is reached that becomes collective.

I made this point at the time of the elections. I've sat on a couple of boards and I know the kind of communication that fans want, myself included, about every decision, or at least some of them, made by the Hibs board is impossible.

It is indeed inappropriate to share discussions and individual voting intentions from board meetings - board take collective decisions , which all should support once that consensus is agreed..

The Rangers topic is a well known high profile topic . It wasn't a secret it was to be discussed - so there should be active approaches to secure the general views of the supporter base, so that it was properly represented at the meeting - it may not change the decision and I suspect (without knowing) that fans views likely were shared by the reps. The Boards role Is to make what they think is the best decision for Hibs - not a populist position based on fans views . They clearly feel they have (based on their statement)

On the broader point , I feel the fans reps (in general) have not got regular communication right yet - albeit it has been an improvement from Last term - and this is causing frustration...with the Rangers topic being a sensitive one - it called for increased engagement..rather than less fans rep feedback ..

[Thecat23]

Grow up, FFS we have a fans rep who either lied to us or can't be bothered doing what he said he'd do to help get elected, which one is it?

I think maybe if you addressed him by his name there may be a chance he'd reply? We haven't agreed on many things for a long time but I do agree with most of the posts you have said on The Rangers investigation.

I don't think you need to continue talking about Frank by saying the "other one." I've met Frank couple of times and he has the clubs best interests at heart and always happy to chat so I am surprised he's not really been on here. Tracey I do know better, and have a lot of time for if I'm honest. I'm just glad I'm not a fan rep that's for sure!

[Thecat23]

I don't really give a toss if Frank is good on social media or otherwise. In the dealings I've had with him, admittedly limited, he's been approachable and helpful. Likewise I've exchanged a few PMs with Tracey and she's been very helpful.

The communication is never going to be what some want, and I include myself, because the reps are bound by the same confidentiality as everyone else on the board. If there is sensitive information that has influenced their vote on this issue they can't now issue a statement revealing it.

It's a thankless task, and with no disrespect intended to those who have taken on the role, I said at the time of the last elections the whole thing should be scrapped and I stand by that now.

Agree with all this, Both very approachable and it can't be easy. But I don't think having fan reps on the board works to be honest. This is a prime example and I'd be surprised if they continue down this route.

[Ozyhibby]

Billy, why didn't you stand for rep? Serious question? You would be ideal imo.

I'd vote for Billy.


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[Pretty Boy]

It is indeed inappropriate to share discussions and individual voting intentions from board meetings - board take collective decisions , which all should support once that consensus is agreed..

The Rangers topic is a well known high profile topic . It wasn't a secret it was to be discussed - so there should be active approaches to secure the general views of the supporter base, so that it was properly represented at the meeting - it may not change the decision and I suspect (without knowing) that fans views likely were shared by the reps. The Boards role Is to make what they think is the best decision for Hibs - not a populist position based on fans views . They clearly feel they have (based on their statement)

On the broader point , I feel the fans reps (in general) have not got regular communication right yet - albeit it has been an improvement from Last term - and this is causing frustration...with the Rangers topic being a sensitive one - it called for increased engagement..rather than less fans rep feedback ..

Yep agree with much of that.

All of which strengthens my belief the whole idea isn't needed. If the other board members feel the feedback from supporters via fans reps isn't in the best interests of the club then they will simply disregard it.

[.Sean.]

I'd vote for Billy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
As would I, certainly one of the better posters on here :agree:

[blackpoolhibs]

I think maybe if you addressed him by his name there may be a chance he'd reply? We haven't agreed on many things for a long time but I do agree with most of the posts you have said on The Rangers investigation.

I don't think you need to continue talking about Frank by saying the "other one." I've met Frank couple of times and he has the clubs best interests at heart and always happy to chat so I am surprised he's not really been on here. Tracey I do know better, and have a lot of time for if I'm honest. I'm just glad I'm not a fan rep that's for sure!

I'd love to hear Frank tell me why he's failed to deliver what he said he would in this video, especially the bit 55 minutes in when asked what he could do better.

https://www.facebook.com/HibernianFootballClubOfficial/videos/1205148882917504/

[Firestarter]

I know this isn't aimed at me, but I'll answer on behalf of myself anyway. :wink:

I thought about it and quite fancied it.

The truth is, I am a bit of an internet geek. I quite like debate on hibs.net, I quite like getting involved. It is a good platform with a lot of good debate, and I feel quite comfortable sticking my oar in, having an opinion, debating it, defending it and disagreeing with people from a position of anonymity. You can see a point that someone has made, pause for thought, gather your thoughts and post a reply as you see it. Some people may agree with your opinion, some people won't.

This is tougher face to face. Thinking on the spot and responding to problems, concerns and issues in person takes a certain skill set, possibly different to those required over the net. That's why I wouldn't give Frank a kicking for his lack of contribution on hibs.net - the squabbles we have over the internet may not suit his skill set, he may not want to get involved in an arena where he might not do himself justice. Face to face, on the day - I'm sure that is where he is at his best. He's a well-known face and has been trusted by many to represent us, so he must be doing something right for a large number of people.

The main reason I wouldn't stand - I think it is a thankless, impossible task. How on Earth are you meant to represent the Hibs support? We are a huge, diverse group, some reasoned and sensible, some utter bampots. It is literally impossible to do justice to the diversity and strength of opinion that exists amongst us. The "board position on EBTs" is such a topic. It is passionate, overly-emotional and very difficult. The fans reps are piggy in the middle, they'll have a lot more information than any of us to make a decision but have to represent our uninformed position to the board.

I have sympathy for the fans reps, but only to a point, as surely they would have known this when they stood for election. They will have known exactly what they were getting themselves into. It is a position that is a constant ball ache and brings constant aggro. Ok, now it is EBTs. But it could have been relegation, non-promotion, the team on the park being cack, the Scottish Cup final aftermath, a ballsed-up new stand build etc etc etc.

Take my hat off to you, Sir. Top post.

[Thecat23]

I'd love to hear Frank tell me why he's failed to deliver what he said he would in this video, especially the bit 55 minutes in when asked what he could do better.

https://www.facebook.com/HibernianFootballClubOfficial/videos/1205148882917504/

I hadn't seen that before. I don't think you are asking to much for him to come on after his speech. I still think out of respect you can call him by his name though.

Maybe someone who knows him could maybe help him out if he's struggling with the social media side of things. Face to face he's very easy to speak too and I like him. But if you stand up and make a promise it's best to keep that promise and try communicate with the fans, more so now than ever!

[hibbymick]

Thats the first time ive seen that video. Wasnt the most clever thing to ask Pat. Is that why he took himself out of the vote ?

[Firestarter]

Thats the first time ive seen that video. Wasnt the most clever thing to ask Pat. Is that why he took himself out of the vote ?

Pat got slaughtered, verging on humiliation on here (almost made me want to sign up but was the wrong time for me) and on the bounce and on other social media. That's why he withdrew.

In the Rangers case, the word transparency comes into place a lot of the time, wouldn't it be great if we could get a simple yes or no from the fans reps if they voted against any further investigation into the whole thing? They could be getting slaughtered having voted with the majority of the support in saying yes to an sfa enquiry. None of us know.

[Johnny Clash]

Board decisions are made collectively...they should be fully supported by all board members after the event...I would be disappointed if a board colleague then shared their individual views - once the position is agreed , they should all support it

That doesn't mean we couldn't have been given some updates along the way though . Equally, and perhaps more importantly, we should expect that they have sought and represented the views of Supporters at the. meetings. It's a key part of their role.

I'm not expecting to agree with all decisions Hibs make - I do expect the fans reps to keep their commitment of regular updates after board meetings and consistent communications etc. This isn't there yet for me

I don't disagree . Once a decision is made then normally everyone on that body would be expected to get behind it. However that does not mean that all decisions must be unanimous nor does it mean our elected representatives cannot communicate with their constituents. Decisions are made by a simple majority.

[ColinNish]

Pat got slaughtered, verging on humiliation on here (almost made me want to sign up but was the wrong time for me) and on the bounce and on other social media. That's why he withdrew.

In the Rangers case, the word transparency comes into place a lot of the time, wouldn't it be great if we could get a simple yes or no from the fans reps if they voted against any further investigation into the whole thing? They could be getting slaughtered having voted with the majority of the support in saying yes to an sfa enquiry. None of us know.

Pat did not get "slaughtered" on the Bounce.

[Pretty Boy]

Pat did not get "slaughtered" on the Bounce.

Tbf he didn't get slaughtered on here either. The person who raised what they believed to be important points with Pat Stanton at the hustings event at Sunnyside got a far harder time and far more abuse than Pat ever did.

The whole situation was a bit bizarre. Some people clearly felt because he is who he is that it should have just been an uncontested procession. I was at the event at Sunnyside and it became quickly apparent that Pat was one of 2 or 3 candidates, and a fair few people asking questions as well, who didn't seem to really understand the role and performed poorly as a result.

Situations like the current one are why I was a bit uncomfortable with Pats candidacy. It's bad enough that Frank and Tracey are getting personal grief at the moment, it would be even more shameful if it was being directed at a club legend.

[Nakedmanoncrack]

I don't disagree . Once a decision is made then normally everyone on that body would be expected to get behind it. However that does not mean that all decisions must be unanimous nor does it mean our elected representatives cannot communicate with their constituents. Decisions are made by a simple majority.

Exactly, I've been in that position myself after arguing vehemently against something, then having to go out and support a position I didnt take. Its called collective responsibility and the only way to function coherently. If the policy is one that you cannot support - you resign. That's what the reps should have done, but instead we find that they apparently voted unanimously with the board. It's an untenable position.

[Firestarter]

Tbf he didn't get slaughtered on here either. The person who raised what they believed to be important points with Pat Stanton at the hustings event at Sunnyside got a far harder time and far more abuse than Pat ever did.

The whole situation was a bit bizarre. Some people clearly felt because he is who he is that it should have just been an uncontested procession. I was at the event at Sunnyside and it became quickly apparent that Pat was one of 2 or 3 candidates, and a fair few people asking questions as well, who didn't seem to really understand the role and performed poorly as a result.

Situations like the current one are why I was a bit uncomfortable with Pats candidacy. It's bad enough that Frank and Tracey are getting personal grief at the moment, it would be even more shameful if it was being directed at a club legend.

Some very good points made there PrettyBoy.

[ekhibee]

I've not read through this whole thread, but surely the question regarding the reps revolves around whether the decision to issue the statement was unnanimous? The reps might well have voted against it, which IMO would have been the right thing to do, whilst still respecting that the majority decision was to issue the statement as it was. If the vote was indeed unnanimous, and the reps voted along with the rest of the board, in my opinion that is not representative of the majority of Hibs fans, and up to an extent raises the question of how relevant them being on the board is in the first place, but that is purely my opinion, and there are other issues where the reps can make a significant input on behalf of the fans. I suppose we'll never know.

[oldbutdim]

We do.

It was unanimous.

[traceyhibs]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



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[matty_f]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty shameful that you and Frank were being personally abused. Pathetic, really.

[Pretty Boy]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Really poor that you and Frank are getting personal abuse regarding this. Hope it all does down quickly as it's totally out of order.

[traceyhibs]

Really poor that you and Frank are getting personal abuse regarding this. Hope it all does down quickly as it's totally out of order.

We get it but when it gets personal it's a bit much. Luckily have a thick skin. We have put ourselves out there so we no it's no breeze but felt it was best to take a step back and let people calm ( we know it's not going away) then hopefully we can talk to people and have more constructive conversations.




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[Sir David Gray]

Pretty shameful that you and Frank were being personally abused. Pathetic, really.


Really poor that you and Frank are getting personal abuse regarding this. Hope it all does down quickly as it's totally out of order.

Disgusting.

People resorting to personally abusing others because of a statement they didn't like the content of is actually mental.

[marinello59]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No personal abuse of yourselves is acceptable, sorry to hear how bad it has become recently. Unfortunately when you are bold enough to stick your head over the parapet a minority see it as a green light to have a go at you.
The explanation/confirmation of how you and Frank work together is welcome. It really must feel like a thankless task just now. Sometimes you just can't win. :greengrin

[HibeeSince85]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Are you able to share which way you voted regarding the EBT statement?

Personal abuse is out of order but in the role you have been elected to there are justified questions from the fans that many feel require an answer.

[Ozyhibby]

There could not have been any abuse on Hibs.net as it would not have been tolerated.
I'll email. Will you still be attending the working together meeting and is it open to all to attend?


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[bigwheel]

Are you able to share which way you voted regarding the EBT statement?

Personal abuse is out of order but in the role you have been elected to there are justified questions from the fans that many feel require an answer.

Not sure where people get this "voting " thing...boards rarely have votes on topics ...they discuss them, explore the topic , debate it and then finally agree a position on it...it's not a democracy, it's a consensus driven meeting.

[traceyhibs]

Are you able to share which way you voted regarding the EBT statement?

Personal abuse is out of order but in the role you have been elected to there are justified questions from the fans that many feel require an answer.

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




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[traceyhibs]

Not sure where people get this "voting " thing...boards rarely have votes on topics ...they discuss them, explore the topic , debate it and then finally agree a position on it...it's not a democracy, it's a consensus driven meeting.

Yes you're right vote is probably the wrong word.


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[traceyhibs]

There could not have been any abuse on Hibs.net as it would not have been tolerated.
I'll email. Will you still be attending the working together meeting and is it open to all to attend?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hi haven't seen any on here at myself.

I'll still be at the Working Together Meeting and it's open to all Hibs supporters.

It's at 6.30pm via the West Stand reception on Monday 25th September.

Thanks

Tracey


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[Baldy Foghorn]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well thought out reply....

Now I'm sure some scoffed, that you and Frank worked closely. I wonder if they will be so pragmatic as to offer an apology?

[Danderhall Hibs]

Well thought out reply....

Now I'm sure some scoffed, that you and Frank worked closely. I wonder if they will be so pragmatic as to offer an apology?

It is a good reply - I personally think it would've been good for it to have been released shortly after the club statement and it may have saved some of the negativity around the role of the reps.

[traceyhibs]

Well thought out reply....

Now I'm sure some scoffed, that you and Frank worked closely. I wonder if they will be so pragmatic as to offer an apology?

Apparently i didn't write it


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[Baldy Foghorn]

It is a good reply - I personally think it would've been good for it to have been released shortly after the club statement and it may have saved some of the negativity around the role of the reps.

After the abuse on social media, some here, some twitter, it is easy to see why they never bothered

[oneone73]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails.

Based on minority views, quite clearly. I too could talk to 50 people and base my vote on the views of five of them, thus being able to use the same disclaimer you have.

[Danderhall Hibs]

After the abuse on social media, some here, some twitter, it is easy to see why they never bothered

I only saw the abuse on here which I don't think was too bad - as Tracey acknowledged. Pretty poor from those that have personally abused on twitter or wherever but I don't think they should've ignored the majority while they were avoiding the minority.

[SirDavidsNapper]

Opinions are like aresholes, everyone has one. I'm sick of hearing about the statement almost as much as I'm sick of hearing about EBT's. Hibs have told us their stance on it lets move on. Thank god our team are playing tomorrow so we can talk about something else.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I only saw the abuse on here which I don't think was too bad - as Tracey acknowledged. Pretty poor from those that have personally abused on twitter or wherever but I don't think they should've ignored the majority while they were avoiding the minority.

Thats's fair enough, but after the twitter abuse, I would not have switched laptop on again if I were them

[oneone73]

Opinions are like aresholes, everyone has one. I'm sick of hearing about the statement almost as much as I'm sick of hearing about EBT's. Hibs have told us their stance on it lets move on. Thank god our team are playing tomorrow so we can talk about something else.

And let's all forget about corruption and never complain again, no matter what. You are Stewart Regan and I claim my five pounds.

[Ozyhibby]

Hi haven't seen any on here at myself.

I'll still be at the Working Together Meeting and it's open to all Hibs supporters.

It's at 6.30pm via the West Stand reception on Monday 25th September.

Thanks

Tracey


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you. Catching up on a matchday does not work for me as I have my 10 year old with me, so I prefer to make that just about the footy. I'll be at the working together meeting.


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[Carheenlea]

Thankfully Pat Stanton saw sense to withdraw from the election. It's bad enough seeing good Hibs fans in the fan rep positions receiving online abuse from so called supporters, let alone a club hero.
The questions put to Pat on the night made for uncomfortable viewing, but ultimately they did him a big favour in the long run.

[Peevemor]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkI really don't want to sound patronising but well done. It's obviously an emotive subject (for some more than others it would seem) but you're decision on how to vote was based on the information available to you, and if you're comfortable with that, then you've done your job.

[Hibbyradge]

Based on minority views, quite clearly. I too could talk to 50 people and base my vote on the views of five of them, thus being able to use the same disclaimer you have.

I would vouch that the vast majority of Hibs supporters are either happy enough with the club's statement or are unconcerned about it and the issue itself.

[Mikey]

Apparently i didn't write it




Some people are just ****ing mental.

[MrSmith]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agree re abuse being totally unacceptable. I have not commented on your or Frank's part whatsoever. However, I do think that all this talk about legal issues and further legal issues is just talk. I don't disbelieve you in the slightest but these legal issue are being rolled out with no real evidence being put forward except for a point of view by a QC who is only one of many legal eagles who could as easily put forward a contrary argument. I think it may be pertinent to release said legal advice laying it out so that others can come to the same conclusions as yourself and Frank.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Agree re abuse being totally unacceptable. I have not commented on your or Frank's part whatsoever. However, I do think that all this talk about legal issues and further legal issues is just talk. I don't disbelieve you in the slightest but these legal issue are being rolled out with no real evidence being put forward except for a point of view by a QC who is only one of many legal eagles who could as easily put forward a contrary argument. I think it may be pertinent to release said legal advice laying it out so that others can come to the same conclusions as yourself and Frank.

Confidential issues?

[MrSmith]

Highly emotive subject area, if you say it prove it! The information to us re the legal issues are being talked at us, why should we believe it?

[Peevemor]

Highly emotive subject area, if you say it prove it! The information to us re the legal issues are being talked at us, why should we believe it?Then what? Should the fans' reps be obliged to release sensitive information to back up every decision made by the board?

[DarrenSQH]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Strange the decision was taken from looking at the views on the forum but 87.5% of fans have voted against the statement on the Bounce.

[traceyhibs]

Based on minority views, quite clearly. I too could talk to 50 people and base my vote on the views of five of them, thus being able to use the same disclaimer you have.

Likewise with majority views


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[Pretty Boy]

Thats's fair enough, but after the twitter abuse, I would not have switched laptop on again if I were them

Twitter is a total minefield sometimes as it is to all intents and purposes not moderated, certainly short term. Complaints can take weeks to be dealt with.

We've tried to deal with anything that's gone too far on here but for the most part it's seemed to be ok to me.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Twitter is a total minefield sometimes as it is to all intents and purposes not moderated, certainly short term. Complaints can take weeks to be dealt with.

We've tried to deal with anything that's gone too far on here but for the most part it's seemed to be ok to me.

Agreed PB, twitter is a different ball game, language, tone, aggression.....Not sure I would take that level of abuse

[traceyhibs]

Thank you. Catching up on a matchday does not work for me as I have my 10 year old with me, so I prefer to make that just about the footy. I'll be at the working together meeting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's no problem at all. Look forward to meeting you at the next meeting


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[traceyhibs]

Twitter is a total minefield sometimes as it is to all intents and purposes not moderated, certainly short term. Complaints can take weeks to be dealt with.

We've tried to deal with anything that's gone too far on here but for the most part it's seemed to be ok to me.

.net and Bounce has actually been fine. Not everyone posts on forums or social media so some is direct. Everyone on here and Bounce have actually just vented and shown their anger and I have no issues with that at all.


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[Tornadoes70]

Highly emotive subject area, if you say it prove it! The information to us re the legal issues are being talked at us, why should we believe it?

I'm obviously not in the know but I would hazard a guess that legal issues have accumulated since the five way agreement was agreed upon. There was zero legal issues to have prevented the footballing governing bodies from stripping the titles based on the grounds there having been ineligible player registrations upon the side letters being found etc etc. Having stripped the titles the Oldco would then have had the opportunity to challenge the decision if they had so wished as is normal legal procedure.

If Oldco had chosen to lodge an action most probably in the way of Judicial Review, the norm for challenging decisions made by authorities they would have generated a legal ruling on the matter further down the line.

Its gone way past that simplistic action that was the morally correct one now and there very probably are legal issues surrounding any further action that could now be acted on. As the club have made their stance known I've accepted the board are acting in the best interests of Hibernian Football Club and the game in general however I would have been all for having stripped the mendacious Oldco of its dubious titles. However, we will always know they titles were won under false pretence. Maybe it is time to move on as its looking ever more unlikely the titles will be stripped of which was of course the morally correct action to have taken especially in light of the Supreme Court ruling, however its very probably true there are legal issues now in play that make it very difficult for retrospective action to be taken.

I'm merely speculating but probably not that far off the mark so to speak.

Now lets get a good result on Saturday for goodness sake Hibs!

:flag:

[Beefster]

Thats's fair enough, but after the twitter abuse, I would not have switched laptop on again if I were them

That's the nature of the beast nowadays for anyone with a public profile and has been for a number of years now. Celebrities, industry experts, politicians, journalists etc etc.

Doesn't make it right but if, like me, you aren't prepared for it to happen and ignored then you've got two choices, stay off Twitter or don't put yourself in the position in the first place.

By the way, I am ‪@DonaldJTrumpJr‬ on Twitter if anyone fancies a debate/pop.

[sleeping giant]

Pretty disappointed to hear of the abuse although I always expected it to happen
The fans reps have a thankless task and are in a position where people feel that they can blame them and vent their anger toward them when decisions do not go the way they desired.
Faceless internet personas can cause a lot of grief over a key board and say things that they would never say in a face to face meeting.

I'm also struggling to believe that Hibs fans who attend matches didn't know who Frank was.
He's nearly as famous as Tam McCourt :-)

[Baldy Foghorn]

That's the nature of the beast nowadays for anyone with a public profile and has been for a number of years now. Celebrities, industry experts, politicians, journalists etc etc.

Doesn't make it right but if, like me, you aren't prepared for it to happen and ignored then you've got two choices, stay off Twitter or don't put yourself in the position in the first place.

:agree::agree::agree:

[Baldy Foghorn]

Pretty disappointed to hear of the abuse although I always expected it to happen
The fans reps have a thankless task and are in a position where people feel that they can blame them and vent their anger toward them when decisions do not go the way they desired.
Faceless internet personas can cause a lot of grief over a key board and say things that they would never say in a face to face meeting.

I'm also struggling to believe that Hibs fans who attend matches didn't know who Frank was.
He's nearly as famous as Tam McCourt :-)

Indeed:aok::aok:

[edinburghhibee]

Hi Tracey, thanks for your reply and I'm sorry you have to put up with the abuse you and frank have received.

From reading your post regarding the decision it seems, to me anyway, that you based your decision on what you believed was right which given you have all the info is fine. However if your a fans rep surely you can't vote either way unless you ask the support or at least set up some sort of meeting with us? I'm a member here and on the bounce and there are, again in my opinion, more fans who are dismayed at the statement than not.

I agree that might not be the case off social media forums but out of the 7 of us who attend regularly of varying ages non of us agree with this statement.

I just find it strange that you came to the decision you did when I look on here and the bounce.


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[Nakedmanoncrack]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



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No real point discussing it face to face unless you are willing to eloborate more than you are prepared to here, is that the case?

[MrSmith]

Then what? Should the fans' reps be obliged to release sensitive information to back up every decision made by the board?


Sorry shouldve been more precise, I was in context with the Hibernian board when making that point.

[18Craig75]

Hi All,

Frank and I unfortunately had to take a step back from social media and the whole situation due to some abuse we were receiving. We understand there are supporters who are angry with the statement and everyone is entitled to their opinions but personal abuse is unacceptable.

Frank and I are happy to speak with anyone prior to the game on Saturday just let us know. Happy also if anyone wants to discuss over the phone. Email us your details and we will get in touch. I find these things are better face to face or by phone as posts on Social Media can often be misconstrued.

What we would like to do is apologise for the silence after we told you a statement would be out and it wasn't. The delays were quite simply as stated in Monday's statement. We hadn't been gagged as some have suggested but didn't have anything concrete to tell you. Error of judgement on our part.

If you want to discuss any other matters please do not hesitate to contact us. Our silence we feel has certainly undone a lot of good work we have put in with communication and we will work hard to restore that.

For those who have questioned how Frank and I work - Frank and I speak several times a day and work as a team. Frank receives many calls from supporters, face to face and emails whereas because I work online I can deal with all the online queries as well as emails and face to face. This works well for us and think we compliment each other. We are always well aware of what the other is doing and dealing with.

Our emails again are:

fdougan@hibernianfc.co.uk
tsmith@hibernianfc.co.uk



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You mention that you both had to take a step back from social media because of abuse. You then go on to say further down the thread that there was no personal abuse from Hibs.net or the bounce.

Given you were very active on .net during your campaign (not sure about the bounce), and Frank to a lesser extent, id assume that a decent proportion of your votes came from the readership here.

This is why I can't understand how you came to the decision you did without once canvassing opinion on either of the sites. I'm not saying that you exclusively represent the views of .net readers...but surely when coming to your decision, you could've asked given evidently a large portion of .net users must have voted you in to represent them.

Personally can't see the fans rep role remaining tenable after this term.

[3pm]

Thats's fair enough, but after the twitter abuse, I would not have switched laptop on again if I were them

Get with the times man, get an iPad! :o)

[Baldy Foghorn]

Get with the times man, get an iPad! :o)

My eyes are fine R:greengrin

Don't like the pirate look

[hibee_nation]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




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Find that hard to believe. Seemed to me pretty much everywhere the majority was opposed to it.

[JeMeSouviens]

As rotten as it is that the reps have to put up with abuse, it's as predictable as it is depressing. I don't think it's a good enough reason not to engage with the fanbase as much as possible both before and after. Non-communication only makes things worse. You might do a great job of talking to people who know who you at games, but you're never going to be able to reach the sort of numbers you need to that way to make fans' reps a viable thing, imo.

[CallumLaidlaw]

I must've got the wrong end of the stick regarding the fans reps. I was always under the impression that after their statements, we then elected 2 people that we wanted us to represent the fans on the board. I certainly didn't think they had to go and conduct a poll on every single matter.

The personal abuse is simply disgusting. Some "fans" really let the majority of fans down at times. The problem with the internet in 2017 is its accessible to basically everybody, so any idiot can fire abuse at whoever they want behind a faceless profile. The amount of insults I've seen thrown about online because a person said they just want to move on is unbelievable. Bigoted comments, and just generally disgusting insults. Very much reminded me of the ugly side of the Scottish Referendum.

From looking across facebook and twitter tho, I seem to be seeing the same handful of people that are trying to shout really loudly on the matter. I get that folk want the SFA to be investigated, but if Hibs feel moving on is best for OUR CLUB, then I'm happy with that.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I must've got the wrong end of the stick regarding the fans reps. I was always under the impression that after their statements, we then elected 2 people that we wanted us to represent the fans on the board. I certainly didn't think they had to go and conduct a poll on every single matter.

The personal abuse is simply disgusting. Some "fans" really let the majority of fans down at times. The problem with the internet in 2017 is its accessible to basically everybody, so any idiot can fire abuse at whoever they want behind a faceless profile. The amount of insults I've seen thrown about online because a person said they just want to move on is unbelievable. Bigoted comments, and just generally disgusting insults. Very much reminded me of the ugly side of the Scottish Referendum.

From looking across facebook and twitter tho, I seem to be seeing the same handful of people that are trying to shout really loudly on the matter. I get that folk want the SFA to be investigated, but if Hibs feel moving on is best for OUR CLUB, then I'm happy with that.

In a nutshell C

[bigwheel]

The fans reps are getting challenged because the outcome of the board decision isn't the populist position many would have hoped for...

For me, I'm confident that the fans reps will have represented theirs and others views at the meeting - that's all I personally ask of them..

We won't like every decision that Hibs make, but if they are making them in the best interest of our club then I will support them...

Some will never let this go ...mind you I'm still annoyed with John McDonald for cheating for a penalty in the late 70s ! [emoji6]

[lapsedhibee]

The fans reps are getting challenged because the outcome of the board decision isn't the populist position many would have hoped for...

For me, I'm confident that the fans reps will have represented theirs and others views at the meeting - that's all I personally ask of them..

We won't like every decision that Hibs make, but if they are making them in the best interest of our club then I will support them...

Some will never let this go ...mind you I'm still annoyed with John McDonald for cheating for a penalty in the late 70s ! [emoji6]

What, a hun got away with cheating in the 1970s? And the 1980s, and the 1990s, and the 2000s, and the 1960s, and ..... well in that case, probably best to move on then. That'll show them.

[green day]

Find that hard to believe. Seemed to me pretty much everywhere the majority was opposed to it.

How can you say that with absolutely nothing to back it up?

The people opposed to it were/are very vocal, yes - but that certainly doesnt mean that "the majority" were opposed to it.

Hibs.net has a lot of members (dont know how many), and so far 272 people have voted that they were opposed to it.

Thats less than 2% of the Hibs fans who will be there tomorrow - we have absolutely no idea how the other 98% would vote, nor can you extrapolate the .net poll results over the entire support.

[ancient hibee]

Find that hard to believe. Seemed to me pretty much everywhere the majority was opposed to it.
Are there any polls on this site where the majority of net members are opposed to the statement?You seem to confuse a majority of those who cared enough to vote as the same as an overall majority.

[Nakedmanoncrack]

How can you say that with absolutely nothing to back it up?

The people opposed to it were/are very vocal, yes - but that certainly doesnt mean that "the majority" were opposed to it.

Hibs.net has a lot of members (dont know how many), and so far 272 people have voted that they were opposed to it.

Thats less than 2% of the Hibs fans who will be there tomorrow - we have absolutely no idea how the other 98% would vote, nor can you extrapolate the .net poll results over the entire support.

We have no idea how the silent people would vote- correct.

However the claim from the rep is that she "voted for the statement that came out and based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to".

That simply doesn't stand up, unless she is looking at different forums and talking to different people from the rest of us.

Some evidence would be appreciated.

[Tornadoes70]

How can you say that with absolutely nothing to back it up?

The people opposed to it were/are very vocal, yes - but that certainly doesnt mean that "the majority" were opposed to it.

Hibs.net has a lot of members (dont know how many), and so far 272 people have voted that they were opposed to it.

Thats less than 2% of the Hibs fans who will be there tomorrow - we have absolutely no idea how the other 98% would vote, nor can you extrapolate the .net poll results over the entire support.

To be fair the man or woman's allowed a viewpoint even if its based solely on common sense alone. The common sense being that not many folk appreciate sporting titles being won by spending money that cheated the taxpayer out of many millions of pounds. I think that would be a given to most folk. Its a fair enough assumption to make in my opinion too.

GGTTH

[green day]

We have no idea how the silent people would vote- correct.

However the claim from the rep is that she "voted for the statement that came out and based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to".

That simply doesn't stand up, unless she is looking at different forums and talking to different people from the rest of us.

Some evidence would be appreciated.

Aye, asking where these came from is fair - however I suspect that its the "people she has spoken to" that has the larger numbers than (for example) those posting on the Rangers EBT thread over the last couple of months (which seems to me to have been a relatively small number of people in the scheme of things).


To be fair the man or woman's allowed a viewpoint even if its based solely on common sense alone. The common sense being that not many folk appreciate sporting titles being won by spending money that cheated the taxpayer out of many millions of pounds. I think that would be a given to most folk. Its a fair enough assumption to make in my opinion too.

GGTTH

Well, common sense in your opinion - but that doesnt mean you are right (or me for that matter) - as the nakedman above says, if she has canvassed a number of people and got X result then thats good enough for me.

[Tornadoes70]

Aye, asking where these came from is fair - however I suspect that its the "people she has spoken to" that has the larger numbers than (for example) those posting on the Rangers EBT thread over the last couple of months (which seems to me to have been a relatively small number of people in the scheme of things).



Well, common sense in your opinion - but that doesnt mean you are right (or me for that matter) - as the nakedman above says, if she has canvassed a number of people and got X result then thats good enough for me.

It's still a fair assumption to make by using common sense that most people would be against football clubs winning titles by cheating HMRC out of many millions of pounds in doing so. I surmise i'm 100% correct in my assumption no matter if you sit on the fence stating 'nobody knows'. Sometimes its perfectly ok to make assumptions using common sense alone.

GGTTH

[Beefster]

Thats less than 2% of the Hibs fans who will be there tomorrow - we have absolutely no idea how the other 98% would vote, nor can you extrapolate the .net poll results over the entire support.

2% of a constituency would be abnormally high for any poll, I'd have thought.

[green day]

2% of a constituency would be abnormally high for any poll, I'd have thought.

Actually, including the people supporting the statement or on the fence, it was between 3 and 4%.

So, yep it would be a great indicator if it was a representative cross section - but in my opinion, a few hundred responses on Hibs net isnt really representative of the overall Hibs support.

I might be wrong, but I dont think so.

[ancient hibee]

2% of a constituency would be abnormally high for any poll, I'd have thought.
Not when the constituency was based on a common interest.In this case Hibs.

[JeMeSouviens]

Actually, including the people supporting the statement or on the fence, it was between 3 and 4%.

So, yep it would be a great indicator if it was a representative cross section - but in my opinion, a few hundred responses on Hibs net isnt really representative of the overall Hibs support.

I might be wrong, but I dont think so.

I accept it's an unscientific, self-selecting straw poll but otoh I think at a minimum it indicates that those who feel strongly are likely to be against the statement. And it's not as if the result is in any way close. Add in 108 from the seemingly condsiderably more militant Bounce who have voted 94-14 that it's a resigning issue for the fans' reps (although there's bound to be overlap, I just voted on the bounce poll to see the result).

So I think you're right that it's not conclusive evidence but I think you're wrong to dismiss it entirely. Especially when there's such strong vocal support for the board position here.

[green day]

I accept it's an unscientific, self-selecting straw poll but otoh I think at a minimum it indicates that those who feel strongly are likely to be against the statement. And it's not as if the result is in any way close. Add in 108 from the seemingly condsiderably more militant Bounce who have voted 94-14 that it's a resigning issue for the fans' reps (although there's bound to be overlap, I just voted on the bounce poll to see the result).

So I think you're right that it's not conclusive evidence but I think you're wrong to dismiss it entirely. Especially when there's such strong vocal support for the board position here.

I dont dismiss it entirely, lets be honest its the only poll we have got !!

What I have been saying is that none of us can say that this result is representative of the entire constituency - any more than a poll of people in Edinburgh was v the entire UK ahead of the Brexit referendum.

Tracey and Frank need to expand on the decision making process when they meet people F2F. Until then, any talk of losing faith in the reps or them stepping down should be shelved.

[BSEJVT]

Exactly, I've been in that position myself after arguing vehemently against something, then having to go out and support a position I didnt take. Its called collective responsibility and the only way to function coherently. If the policy is one that you cannot support - you resign. That's what the reps should have done, but instead we find that they apparently voted unanimously with the board. It's an untenable position.

Nail on head

As PB did, I said at the time it was an impossible position and will always be so and should be done away with.

The idea also that a majority of supporters stand for any particular position on anything is completely false.

A vocal majority maybe, but a majority who knows.

Judging by our Cup Final attendances we have circa 35,000 fans, short of making them all members of something and giving them a secure individual online vote which they all must use on every issue then there is no way of telling anything.

The downside of sitting on any board but possibly particularly the board of a sporting entity is that you are often forced to make or acquiesce in decisions that go against what you want but which are necessary for the business to survive or flourish.

I wouldn't wish being a Fans Rep (or HSL Rep when the time comes) on the board on my worst enemy.

[WhileTheChief..]

Whilst I agree that no one should be subjected to abuse surely this also applies to Petrie?

He's had way more abuse than either Frank or Tracey yet that seems to be acceptable?

Consistency.

[JeMeSouviens]

Whilst I agree that no one should be subjected to abuse surely this also applies to Petrie?

He's had way more abuse than either Frank or Tracey yet that seems to be acceptable?

Consistency.

He's a bit of a lightning Rod (boom, boom).

[lapsedhibee]

I dont dismiss it entirely, lets be honest its the only poll we have got !!

What I have been saying is that none of us can say that this result is representative of the entire constituency - any more than a poll of people in Edinburgh was v the entire UK ahead of the Brexit referendum.

By way of backing up your belief that the polls on here and the bounce are unrepresentative of Hibs fans as a whole, can you think of any other polls on here or the bounce which have been overwhelmingly in favour of one position, yet the Hibs support at large have proved to be in favour of a completely different thing?

[Johnny Clash]

Nail on head

As PB did, I said at the time it was an impossible position and will always be so and should be done away with.

The idea also that a majority of supporters stand for any particular position on anything is completely false.

A vocal majority maybe, but a majority who knows.

Judging by our Cup Final attendances we have circa 35,000 fans, short of making them all members of something and giving them a secure individual online vote which they all must use on every issue then there is no way of telling anything.

The downside of sitting on any board but possibly particularly the board of a sporting entity is that you are often forced to make or acquiesce in decisions that go against what you want but which are necessary for the business to survive or flourish.

I wouldn't wish being a Fans Rep (or HSL Rep when the time comes) on the board on my worst enemy.


Just so I understand - are you saying the 2 directors who we have a say in electing snd who we can freely contact should be done away with leaving 7 directors that we have absolutely no say in their appointment?

You think it's progress to ditch two committed lifelong hibs supporters and just have faceless directors who may not even attend games (other than Rod and Leeann) ?

Incidentally - it is possible to gauge the opinion of Hibs fans and nobody forced Frank or Tracey to do anything. Who is saying they were forced?

[BSEJVT]

Just so I understand - are you saying the 2 directors who we have a say in electing snd who we can freely contact should be done away with leaving 7 directors that we have absolutely no say in their appointment?

You think it's progress to ditch two committed lifelong hibs supporters and just have faceless directors who may not even attend games (other than Rod and Leeann) ?

Incidentally - it is possible to gauge the opinion of Hibs fans and nobody forced Frank or Tracey to do anything. Who is saying they were forced?

That's exactly what I am saying

They are on a hiding to nothing, unable to report on most of the burning issues we would want them to because of the need for confidentiality

They are a historical anomaly to a time when the board was seen as being completely out of touch with the Fans.

When you sit on a board you have two choices, support the position or resign, anything else is fragrantly dishonest of those involved.

I don't believe either Tracy or Frank were forced to do anything and would not for one second accuse them of being fragrantly dishonest.

Board's and their members need to compromise sometimes, its a pity that supporters free of those responsibilities cant see that or wont see that.

The simple truth is the board do what they have to do for the clubs future and prosperity.

That is often fully at odds with the fans wishes and having the entire Scottish Cup winning team in their place wouldn't change that if some of the fans didn't agree and felt strongly enough about the issue.

They do a great job representing the club at functions, funerals and visits here and there, but the only thing a seat on the board gives them is greater kudos in doing so.

If we feel strongly enough about anything we can contact the CEO

If this whole sorry mess has shown nothing else it is that having Fans Reps on the board will still result in a significant portion of the fans being aggrieved at decisions

Football decisions are never black or white, I am way beyond caring what happened years ago and prefer to look to the future. Others feel differently and are absolutely entitled to but it seems to me that those making all the noise on the topic (as is often the case on any topic) believe that they speak for everyone, they don't.

I am certainly not going to condemn the club or its current office bearers over it as I believe fully they have the clubs best interests at heart and acted in them and with the benefit of much more information and insight than those condemning them.

Its not possible to gauge the opinion of the support accurately without doing as I said or something akin to it as folk engage or don't as the case may be over so many different mediums and ways.

You can learn the opinion of the majority of the medium(s) you are canvassing, no more

It is an impossible task, even then lets say every fan thought the board should do something but the board knew they couldn't or shouldn't what would change?

The board are there to take the hard decisions that fans with their emotional involvement wont and suffer the consequences

The Time for Heroes video must have left no-one in doubt what Hibs mean to Rod Petrie and STF, yet even now Rod Petrie is derided for making hard decisions knowing they and he will be unpopular as a result as everything bad is Rod' s fault .

[lapsedhibee]

That's exactly what I am saying

They are on a hiding to nothing, unable to report on most of the burning issues we would want them to because of the need for confidentiality

They are a historical anomaly to a time when the board was seen as being completely out of touch with the Fans.

When you sit on a board you have two choices, support the position or resign, anything else is fragrantly dishonest of those involved.

I don't believe either Tracy or Frank were forced to do anything and would not for one second accuse them of being fragrantly dishonest.

Board's and their members need to compromise sometimes, its a pity that supporters free of those responsibilities cant see that or wont see that.

The simple truth is the board do what they have to do for the clubs future and prosperity.

That is often fully at odds with the fans wishes and having the entire Scottish Cup winning team in their place wouldn't change that if some of the fans didn't agree and felt strongly enough about the issue.

They do a great job representing the club at functions, funerals and visits here and there, but the only thing a seat on the board gives them is greater kudos in doing so.

If we feel strongly enough about anything we can contact the CEO

If this whole sorry mess has shown nothing else it is that having Fans Reps on the board will still result in a significant portion of the fans being aggrieved at decisions

Football decisions are never black or white, I am way beyond caring what happened years ago and prefer to look to the future. Others feel differently and are absolutely entitled to but it seems to me that those making all the noise on the topic (as is often the case on any topic) believe that they speak for everyone, they don't.

I am certainly not going to condemn the club or its current office bearers over it as I believe fully they have the clubs best interests at heart and acted in them and with the benefit of much more information and insight than those condemning them.

Its not possible to gauge the opinion of the support accurately without doing as I said or something akin to it as folk engage or don't as the case may be over so many different mediums and ways.

You can learn the opinion of the majority of the medium(s) you are canvassing, no more

It is an impossible task, even then lets say every fan thought the board should do something but the board knew they couldn't or shouldn't what would change?

The board are there to take the hard decisions that fans with their emotional involvement wont and suffer the consequences

The Time for Heroes video must have left no-one in doubt what Hibs mean to Rod Petrie and STF, yet even now Rod Petrie is derided for making hard decisions knowing they and he will be unpopular as a result as everything bad is Rod' s fault .

If fans reps are going to be dishonest, they should definitely smell nice while doing it. :agree: :wink:

[Johnny Clash]

That's exactly what I am saying

They are on a hiding to nothing, unable to report on most of the burning issues we would want them to because of the need for confidentiality

They are a historical anomaly to a time when the board was seen as being completely out of touch with the Fans.

When you sit on a board you have two choices, support the position or resign, anything else is fragrantly dishonest of those involved.



I don't believe either Tracy or Frank were forced to do anything and would not for one second accuse them of being fragrantly dishonest.

Board's and their members need to compromise sometimes, its a pity that supporters free of those responsibilities cant see that or wont see that.

The simple truth is the board do what they have to do for the clubs future and prosperity.

That is often fully at odds with the fans wishes and having the entire Scottish Cup winning team in their place wouldn't change that if some of the fans didn't agree and felt strongly enough about the issue.

They do a great job representing the club at functions, funerals and visits here and there, but the only thing a seat on the board gives them is greater kudos in doing so.

If we feel strongly enough about anything we can contact the CEO

If this whole sorry mess has shown nothing else it is that having Fans Reps on the board will still result in a significant portion of the fans being aggrieved at decisions

Football decisions are never black or white, I am way beyond caring what happened years ago and prefer to look to the future. Others feel differently and are absolutely entitled to but it seems to me that those making all the noise on the topic (as is often the case on any topic) believe that they speak for everyone, they don't.

I am certainly not going to condemn the club or its current office bearers over it as I believe fully they have the clubs best interests at heart and acted in them and with the benefit of much more information and insight than those condemning them.

Its not possible to gauge the opinion of the support accurately without doing as I said or something akin to it as folk engage or don't as the case may be over so many different mediums and ways.

You can learn the opinion of the majority of the medium(s) you are canvassing, no more

It is an impossible task, even then lets say every fan thought the board should do something but the board knew they couldn't or shouldn't what would change?

The board are there to take the hard decisions that fans with their emotional involvement wont and suffer the consequences

The Time for Heroes video must have left no-one in doubt what Hibs mean to Rod Petrie and STF, yet even now Rod Petrie is derided for making hard decisions knowing they and he will be unpopular as a result as everything bad is Rod' s fault .

Sorry mate - 'your post is cap in hand' nonsense. On this occasion our elected reps have made what looks like a serious misjudgment after probably listening to people with similar views to yourself '.

Not so long ago there were posts praising our reps. So don't panic - you want to contact CEO direct then on you go. Don't see many posts on here by the CEO mind you.! Or offers to meet the support on Sayurday - which I think is admirable. You gonna be meeting the CEO on Saturday? I don't think so.

Supporters reps need to learn from this. Unlike you I do not think elected reps must be toothless on the board They can and hopefully will argue on behalf of supporters even if Rod disagrees. I bet you they probably both did - but then succumbed to this notion of having to be unanimous. Which is complete bollocks.

As for the other 5 directors what you saying about them ? ... you'd need to spend all night on google to find out who they are yet they also voted for the Rod!

[Mellow Hibee]

Football decisions are never black or white, I am way beyond caring what happened years ago and prefer to look to the future.

Sorry, but sporting rules should always be black or white. If they're not black or white then they shouldn't exist. Grey areas exist in business, in politics, that's fine, but when they exist in sport then they go against everything that sport should stand for.

What amazes me is the number of people who are backing the statement (which basically says there is no value in spending the money on a review) without even asking how much a review would cost Hibs. If someone doesn't care any more then I can accept that, it means that they have no opinion on the matter, they are neutral; so why does it appear that they do actually have an opinion? That they specifically believe that we are better off not having a review when we don't even know what the downside to having a review is?

[Lancs Harp]

Sorry, but sporting rules should always be black or white. If they're not black or white then they shouldn't exist. Grey areas exist in business, in politics, that's fine, but when they exist in sport then they go against everything that sport should stand for.

What amazes me is the number of people who are backing the statement (which basically says there is no value in spending the money on a review) without even asking how much a review would cost Hibs. If someone doesn't care any more then I can accept that, it means that they have no opinion on the matter, they are neutral; so why does it appear that they do actually have an opinion? That they specifically believe that we are better off not having a review when we don't even know what the downside to having a review is?

Mellow Hibee in the circustances might be an interesting nic. Perhaps for some its a question of loving Hibs more than hating rangers (despite what they have done).

[Mellow Hibee]

Mellow Hibee in the circustances might be an interesting nic. Perhaps for some its a question of loving Hibs more than hating rangers (despite what they have done).

I consider myself someone who loves Hibs more than I hate Rangers, but I don't understand why backing a review would somehow diminish my love of Hibs. With the best will in the world, I can't see the downside to a review. If someone showed me why a review would be detrimental to Hibs, then I would give it some consideration, but so far I haven't seen anything (happy to be enlightened though).

[BSEJVT]

Sorry mate - 'your post is cap in hand' nonsense. On this occasion our elected reps have made what looks like a serious misjudgment after probably listening to people with similar views to yourself '.

Not so long ago there were posts praising our reps. So don't panic - you want to contact CEO direct then on you go. Don't see many posts on here by the CEO mind you.! Or offers to meet the support on Sayurday - which I think is admirable. You gonna be meeting the CEO on Saturday? I don't think so.

Supporters reps need to learn from this. Unlike you I do not think elected reps must be toothless on the board They can and hopefully will argue on behalf of supporters even if Rod disagrees. I bet you they probably both did - but then succumbed to this notion of having to be unanimous. Which is complete bollocks.

As for the other 5 directors what you saying about them ? ... you'd need to spend all night on google to find out who they are yet they also voted for the Rod!

What is cap in hand about it?

I think the Fans Reps are a distraction and short of their good works in representing the club at various events have and will achieve the square root of FA meaningful.

I suspect the boot is on the other foot in that you have deluded yourself into believing they can effect change whilst representing the fans.

They cant, they have the same responsibilities to the board as the other board members.

They were IMO a sop to the support at a time the relationship with the fans had completely broken down.

If the much vaunted anti EBT "majority" are to be believed they have done exactly the opposite of what IMO the role should be about and argued that "majority's" decision on the matter at the board.

If that majority exists, which I highly doubt, amongst the wider support they should have voted against the boards position and when that position was upheld resigned.

Instead they made up their own minds and voted accordingly disregarding the "majority" mandate they were given.

I have no problem with that, they are perfectly entitled to do so and I am certain did so honourably

But exactly how did they represent the "majority" of the support in this situation? They did not, could not, can not and never can.

All boards reach unanimous decisions, it needs to be so to show unity.

But if you cant support the boards decision IMO you should resign if you feel strongly enough against the stance taken.

You might not agree that that is the way it should be, but that is exactly how it is.

We will never know and rightly so, how the debate on the topic went, but what is clear is that no-one felt the need to resign.

BTW this isn't anti Tracy or Frank, its a comment on the unenviable position they find themselves in.

I have huge personal admiration for them giving up their time and taking the abuse they get.

This is much more about the ****ty end of the stick they find themselves holding, they are asked to do an impossible job.

BTW and to answer your other point, I have nothing to speak to the CEO about so wont be, but if I did I am confident she would hear my voice at a time appropriate to us and then do what she thought was right for the club.

Do you really think that if Frank told her the seagulls were annoying and dangerous just before kick off he would get much air time?

As for the other 5 directors, as far as I am aware they aren't part of this debate on the effectiveness or appropriateness of fans reps?

But fwiw I think they heard what they needed to hear and voted as their consciences dictated. Exactly as they should have.

Again as far I know though they didn't have "majority" mandate from those they were specifically appointed to the board to represent to carry any particular message to the board or to vote according to that mandate in any debate?

[Johnny Clash]

What is cap in hand about it?

I think the Fans Reps are a distraction and short of their good works in representing the club at various events have and will achieve the square root of FA meaningful.

I suspect the boot is on the other foot in that you have deluded yourself into believing they can effect change whilst representing the fans.

They cant, they have the same responsibilities to the board as the other board members.

They were IMO a sop to the support at a time the relationship with the fans had completely broken down.

If the much vaunted anti EBT "majority" are to be believed they have done exactly the opposite of what IMO the role should be about and argued that "majority's" decision on the matter at the board.

If that majority exists, which I highly doubt, amongst the wider support they should have voted against the boards position and when that position was upheld resigned.

Instead they made up their own minds and voted accordingly disregarding the "majority" mandate they were given.

I have no problem with that, they are perfectly entitled to do so and I am certain did so honourably

But exactly how did they represent the "majority" of the support in this situation? They did not, could not, can not and never can.

All boards reach unanimous decisions, it needs to be so to show unity.

But if you cant support the boards decision IMO you should resign if you feel strongly enough against the stance taken.

You might not agree that that is the way it should be, but that is exactly how it is.

We will never know and rightly so, how the debate on the topic went, but what is clear is that no-one felt the need to resign.

BTW this isn't anti Tracy or Frank, its a comment on the unenviable position they find themselves in.

I have huge personal admiration for them giving up their time and taking the abuse they get.

This is much more about the ****ty end of the stick they find themselves holding, they are asked to do an impossible job.

BTW and to answer your other point, I have nothing to speak to the CEO about so wont be, but if I did I am confident she would hear my voice at a time appropriate to us and then do what she thought was right for the club.

Do you really think that if Frank told her the seagulls were annoying and dangerous just before kick off he would get much air time?

As for the other 5 directors, as far as I am aware they aren't part of this debate on the effectiveness or appropriateness of fans reps?

But fwiw I think they heard what they needed to hear and voted as their consciences dictated. Exactly as they should have.

Again as far I know though they didn't have "majority" mandate from those they were specifically appointed to the board to represent to carry any particular message to the board or to vote according to that mandate in any debate?

Sorry - don't have time for a lengthy response - distracted watching the EBT cheats get pumped just now .

Suffice to say your comment : "All boards reach unanimous decisions" tells me you don't understand how 'all boards' work so I can see why your other points are so contradictory and wrong. 'Cap in hand' as in subservient - which you're entitled to be it's just I don't agree with that mindset. That's all.

[ancient hibee]

Sorry mate - 'your post is cap in hand' nonsense. On this occasion our elected reps have made what looks like a serious misjudgment after probably listening to people with similar views to yourself '.

Not so long ago there were posts praising our reps. So don't panic - you want to contact CEO direct then on you go. Don't see many posts on here by the CEO mind you.! Or offers to meet the support on Sayurday - which I think is admirable. You gonna be meeting the CEO on Saturday? I don't think so.

Supporters reps need to learn from this. Unlike you I do not think elected reps must be toothless on the board They can and hopefully will argue on behalf of supporters even if Rod disagrees. I bet you they probably both did - but then succumbed to this notion of having to be unanimous. Which is complete bollocks.

As for the other 5 directors what you saying about them ? ... you'd need to spend all night on google to find out who they are yet they also voted for the Rod!

Total tosh.In other words reps must do what you think or their thinking is wrong.

[Johnny Clash]

Total tosh.In other words reps must do what you think or their thinking is wrong.

No. Absolutely not.

[BSEJVT]

Sorry - don't have frond for a lengthy response - distracted watching the EBT cheats get pumped just now .

Suffice to say your comment : "All boards reach unanimous decisions" tells me you don't understand how 'all boards' work so I can see why your other points are so contradictory and wrong. 'Cap in hand' as in subservient - which you're entitled to be it's just I don't agree with that mindset. That's all.

As I sit on a couple of boards I am pretty confident I do!

By the time the decision hits the papers it is unanimous, if its not then you are opening up divisions for inspection and interrogation or folk have resigned.

I am well aware of what cap in hand means.

To be honest, before your dig above, I had not a clue who you thought was cap in hand

I thought it may have been the Fans Reps as they have done as they were told by the board as opposed to following the direction of the "majority" of the support who elected them.

I am too polite to say so but I would class your position as far more cap in hand, you have swallowed the sweetener that is the Fans Reps but the brew tastes just as bad.

I support the boards decision, as I said before it is old ground that long ceased interesting me, quite how that makes me cap in hand you will need to explain.

There's no point in arguing with someone who knows everything, listens to nothing and cant debate points he is called to order on, so I am out.

But maybe you could indulge me before I go by telling me exactly what our Fans Reps have achieved of substance to date and what you think they can achieve in future that makes them so essential to our future?

You could maybe then go on to tell me why most other clubs have not followed this model and why they are missing out on the opportunity to do so?

It is pure window dressing, it is nice to think we are represented but as I keep saying if the "majority" view was that The Rangers should be held to account over the EBT's and this wasn't the outcome then what role are they fulfilling?

What value are they adding to the support if they act according to their conscience rather than their mandate?

IMO that makes them no different to the other 5 directors you glibly derided earlier?

I cant for the life of me see what they have done to support your position on this matter that makes them worthy of such stout praise or defence, but good on you for it.

[SRHibs]

Tbf he didn't get slaughtered on here either. The person who raised what they believed to be important points with Pat Stanton at the hustings event at Sunnyside got a far harder time and far more abuse than Pat ever did.

The whole situation was a bit bizarre. Some people clearly felt because he is who he is that it should have just been an uncontested procession. I was at the event at Sunnyside and it became quickly apparent that Pat was one of 2 or 3 candidates, and a fair few people asking questions as well, who didn't seem to really understand the role and performed poorly as a result.

Situations like the current one are why I was a bit uncomfortable with Pats candidacy. It's bad enough that Frank and Tracey are getting personal grief at the moment, it would be even more shameful if it was being directed at a club legend.

I think most accepted that he wasn't a great candidate, but the person who asked the questions was extremely disrespectful, which was the main issue for many.

[Deansy]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Will the information/legal side info be made public ?.

[itslegaltender]

A lot of her argument is that it's based on views and emails on forums and emails. She should maybe stop going on Follow Follow as much.

[macca70]

Hi there,

I voted for the statement that came out and was based on views from forums and from people we had spoken to and from emails. I also was privy to further information and the legal side. I thought I was quite clued up on all of this but was very surprised with information that was given to me. We had a tough decision to make and made it based on everything I had in front of me. No one forced me and didn't do it to appease the board. It's not something I did lightly. No one would ever tell me to do something I didn't want to do.

I know this will anger a lot of supporters and happy to take the flak that comes my way as I've put myself in that position.

Happy to discuss further face to face or on the phone. Will be at the match tomorrow, Livingston on Tues and Ross County away.

Thanks

Tracey




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Personally I think this whole official statement saga is completely over the top, we have enough to focus our energy on as a club, let's move on. Rangers got punted down to the bottom league and have played there way back up through the leagues. Let's move on!!

I am surprised to see our fans reps are voting on behalf of the fans on decisions at board meetings but voting based on their personal view and info they are privy to but the fans they represent are not. Very strange.

These fans rep roles were to be transparent and the biggest issue Hibs fans had with the roles was communication. poor Charlene got shot down during the nomination process for providing comm's from the working together meeting but this is the kind of things the fans want.

The fans rep role is not just 1 way where they take our moans and groans to the club, we need info communicated coming back out of the club eg topics that have been discussed at board meetings. It's not all sensitive info, that's just a screen for saying they don't want the fans knowing what's discussed. Or is there a central site/forum that I have missed where comms/minutes from our fans reps are kept.

[ColinNish]

Some of the comments on here - jeezo!
This is not about a hatred of the Huns and stripping titles, its to do with backing a review on the integrity of the folk who were/are in charge of our game. Don't know why folk can't see that.

Tracey has not answered anything in her reps statement about why the reps voted the way they did other than the 2 of them suffered abuse on social media and folk accusing their statements being written by someone else.

[MrSmith]

Some of the comments on here - jeezo!
This is not about a hatred of the Huns and stripping titles, its to do with backing a review on the integrity of the folk who were/are in charge of our game. Don't know why folk can't see that.

Tracey has not answered anything in her reps statement about why the reps voted the way they did other than the 2 of them suffered abuse on social media and folk accusing their statements being written by someone else.

To be fair, Tracey did say that both were privy to further legal opinion/documents/advice that led them to their conclusion.

[blackpoolhibs]

I wonder why we need 2 fans reps, when one does all the talking for both?

[lapsedhibee]

Personally I think this whole official statement saga is completely over the top, we have enough to focus our energy on as a club, let's move on. Rangers got punted down to the bottom league and have played there way back up through the leagues. Let's move on!!

Still. This. In 2017. Really?

[sleeping giant]

A lot of her argument is that it's based on views and emails on forums and emails. She should maybe stop going on Follow Follow as much.

You're a funny guy .

[oldbutdim]

You're a funny guy .

Good line wasn't it?

[oneone73]

Good line wasn't it?

I liked it!

[Tornadoes70]

Some of the comments on here - jeezo!
This is not about a hatred of the Huns and stripping titles, its to do with backing a review on the integrity of the folk who were/are in charge of our game. Don't know why folk can't see that.

Tracey has not answered anything in her reps statement about why the reps voted the way they did other than the 2 of them suffered abuse on social media and folk accusing their statements being written by someone else.

To a great number of folk it will always be about stripping titles that were obtained while playing ineligibly registered players. Any inquiry could open a door that would allow what should have been the ordinary process of having stripped them when using ineligibly registered players to be looked at again. I'm backing the board's decision but still feel aggrieved at a the Oldco being allowed to retain titles that ordinarily would have been rendered null and void in almost any other sport.

[Blaster]

I wonder why we need 2 fans reps, when one does all the talking for both?

Maybe they have different skill sets but both provide a valuable contribution

You seem to be bordering on a personal vendetta though

[blackpoolhibs]

Maybe they have different skill sets but both provide a valuable contribution

You seem to be bordering on a personal vendetta though

Hahahaha, one has had 30 years of working with computers, then promises the world because he got it wrong in the past, but then passes it all off to Tracey, completely disregarding what he promised when he wanted our votes.

If this was Petrie he'd be getting the same questioning from me.

[macca70]

Still. This. In 2017. Really?

No idea what you are getting at or what your question is, put it in format of a sentence rather than just random words.

[oneone73]

Hahahaha, one has had 30 years of working with computers, then promises the world because he got it wrong in the past, but then passes it all off to Tracey, completely disregarding what he promised when he wanted our votes.

If this was Petrie he'd be getting the same questioning from me.
Although at least Petrie is afforded the courtesy of a namecheck.

[lapsedhibee]

No idea what you are getting at or what your question is, put it in format of a sentence rather than just random words.

Ok, my questions are:
(1) Do you think Rangers have been punished sufficiently by being relegated to the bottom division, and that's why it's right to move on?
(2) If it turned out that Rangers hadn't been relegated at all, and were in fact liquidated, would you still say that their relegation was sufficient punishment for their decade or so of systematic cheating?

[Beefster]

To be fair, Tracey did say that both were privy to further legal opinion/documents/advice that led them to their conclusion.

This is one of the [many] issues with supporter reps on the board. Any awkward situations can be batted away with 'we had information that we can't share'.

[Peevemor]

This is one of the [many] issues with supporter reps on the board. Any awkward situations can be batted away with 'we had information that we can't share'.
Same for any board member. However, given that the supporters' reps are elected by the fans (or those that can be bothered) we can be sure that, other than their love of Hibs, they don't have a vested interest.

[MrSmith]

This is one of the [many] issues with supporter reps on the board. Any awkward situations can be batted away with 'we had information that we can't share'.


I agree and questioned that very statement some posts ago. No response.

[blackpoolhibs]

Although at least Petrie is afforded the courtesy of a namecheck.


Aye, teflon.

[ColinNish]

To be fair, Tracey did say that both were privy to further legal opinion/documents/advice that led them to their conclusion.

Yes but they still voted the way "they" saw fit, not representing the majority fan views because they didn't bother to garner this information properly.

[Velma Dinkley]

Seeing as the organisations that have apparently sought legal advice haven't explained what this advice was, why they sought it or in fact exactly what the advice was regarding, it's difficult to figure out how it has impacted any decision. At a guess, the legal advice is simply regarding the stripping of titles, which means the SFA, hibs, Aberdeen etc have completely missed the point. A review is needed into the mismanagement of the game in Scotland, which led to titles not being g stripped as per the rules. No legal advice is required to make a decision on such a review.

[CropleyWasGod]

Seeing as the organisations that have apparently sought legal advice haven't explained what this advice was, why they sought it or in fact exactly what the advice was regarding, it's difficult to figure out how it has impacted any decision. At a guess, the legal advice is simply regarding the stripping of titles, which means the SFA, hibs, Aberdeen etc have completely missed the point. A review is needed into the mismanagement of the game in Scotland, which led to titles not being g stripped as per the rules. No legal advice is required to make a decision on such a review.The SPFL published theirs.

https://spfl.co.uk/news/article/spfl-press-release-84/

Sent from my SM-A510F using Tapatalk

[marinello59]

Seeing as the organisations that have apparently sought legal advice haven't explained what this advice was, why they sought it or in fact exactly what the advice was regarding, it's difficult to figure out how it has impacted any decision. At a guess, the legal advice is simply regarding the stripping of titles, which means the SFA, hibs, Aberdeen etc have completely missed the point. A review is needed into the mismanagement of the game in Scotland, which led to titles not being g stripped as per the rules. No legal advice is required to make a decision on such a review.

I agree we need a review but most of those questions have been answered in some way though. :confused: