View Full Version : Uber
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jun/08/uber-customers-sexual-harassment-tech-companies
I've never used them but is it just me that's got impression that its run by a shower of utter ****s?
ballengeich
08-06-2017, 03:59 PM
There's an article in the Times today about how they avoid UK VAT (sorry no link available). They treat their UK drivers as small businesses, and bill drivers fees from the Netherlands. There's an EU loophole that exempts cross-border transactions from VAT, while the UK drivers are unlikely to have sufficient turnover to have to pay any.
lord bunberry
08-06-2017, 06:58 PM
It's been debated a few times on here. My opinion is that they're a horrible horrible company that thrives on exploitation and dodging tax. They bring nothing to this countries economy, profit is all they care about. If you compare them to the black cab companies in Edinburgh where they are owned by the drivers and any profit is put back into the local economy through advertising, sponsorships and charitable donations it's not hard to see who is better for Edinburgh or whichever city you live in.
That being said I understand why people use them and I'm not complaining about the competition, that's just something everyone has to deal with in whatever field you work in.
BroxburnHibee
08-06-2017, 07:07 PM
Heard that one of their drivers got £12 for St Andrews Sq. to the George Hotel on Saturday night (literally 100 metres!!!)
More fool them but it's black cabs that are a rip off eh?
grunt
08-06-2017, 07:20 PM
Thought this was a sad story. It made me think what it must be like to be in that position.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/08/guide-dog-taxis-uber-illegal-drivers
Thought this was a sad story. It made me think what it must be like to be in that position.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/08/guide-dog-taxis-uber-illegal-drivers
The race to the bottom goes on.
It's been debated a few times on here. My opinion is that they're a horrible horrible company that thrives on exploitation and dodging tax. They bring nothing to this countries economy, profit is all they care about. If you compare them to the black cab companies in Edinburgh where they are owned by the drivers and any profit is put back into the local economy through advertising, sponsorships and charitable donations it's not hard to see who is better for Edinburgh or whichever city you live in.
That being said I understand why people use them and I'm not complaining about the competition, that's just something everyone has to deal with in whatever field you work in.
I'm all for getting something cheap but not if it involves ****ting on some poor bugger with limited chances in life! Won't use Deliveroo for the same reason.
lord bunberry
08-06-2017, 08:06 PM
I'm all for getting something cheap but not if it involves ****ting on some poor bugger with limited chances in life! Won't use Deliveroo for the same reason.
Uber have started food delivery service as well. They will slowly try and muscle in on every industry they can, making themselves richer and everyone else poorer. They are everything that's wrong with capitalism.
snooky
18-06-2017, 12:24 PM
Uber have started food delivery service as well. They will slowly try and muscle in on every industry they can, making themselves richer and everyone else poorer. They are everything that's wrong with capitalism.
Ubet!
Holmesdale Hibs
18-06-2017, 05:01 PM
Tin hat on judging by the posts so far, but I use Uber a lot and have always found it to be a good service. The main advantage is its a lot cheaper than back cabs but it's also a lot more convenient because you don't have to wait around find one. Living a London a black cab home is circa £50 and Uber is usually half price or less.
I get that there's issues with the way they run their business (although don't claim to know a lot about it) but I'm willing to overlook them given the ease of use and magnitude of the saving. It's different than boycotting, say, Starbucks (which I do) because there are plenty of substitutes that are all similar quality and price
lord bunberry
18-06-2017, 07:39 PM
Tin hat on judging by the posts so far, but I use Uber a lot and have always found it to be a good service. The main advantage is its a lot cheaper than back cabs but it's also a lot more convenient because you don't have to wait around find one. Living a London a black cab home is circa £50 and Uber is usually half price or less.
I get that there's issues with the way they run their business (although don't claim to know a lot about it) but I'm willing to overlook them given the ease of use and magnitude of the saving. It's different than boycotting, say, Starbucks (which I do) because there are plenty of substitutes that are all similar quality and price
There is a reason that they're cheap
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jun/17/uber-drivers-homeless-assault-travis-kalanick
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
19-06-2017, 12:43 PM
I dont use them by choice. I dont like their tax model, and i know a few black cab drivers and would rather support a well regulated, local business.
I also dont use private hire cars by choice.
However in saying that, i know lots of colleagues in london use them all the time.
Its a tricky one, because while they can be slated for tax etc, they provide a service way less than their competitors, allbeit on a very unfair playing field from what i know.
Absolutely ripe for regulation imo.
Andy74
20-06-2017, 12:52 PM
I dont use them by choice. I dont like their tax model, and i know a few black cab drivers and would rather support a well regulated, local business.
I also dont use private hire cars by choice.
However in saying that, i know lots of colleagues in london use them all the time.
Its a tricky one, because while they can be slated for tax etc, they provide a service way less than their competitors, allbeit on a very unfair playing field from what i know.
Absolutely ripe for regulation imo.
As a consumer I think it's up to the tax man to deal with all that side of things.
They provide a good, easy to use service at a good price. That's about all that matters to most.
Let's not pretend black cab companies have been looking after us all for years!
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
20-06-2017, 03:11 PM
As a consumer I think it's up to the tax man to deal with all that side of things.
They provide a good, easy to use service at a good price. That's about all that matters to most.
Let's not pretend black cab companies have been looking after us all for years!
Fair points, its pesonal choice.
Where possible or practical, i like to use my power as a consumer.
Completely individual choice though.
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 03:27 PM
Heard that one of their drivers got £12 for St Andrews Sq. to the George Hotel on Saturday night (literally 100 metres!!!)
More fool them but it's black cabs that are a rip off eh?
When the prices "surge" it tells you on the app. If you book an Uber when the prices have surged then you will pay significantly more than a black cab. I got an Uber on Saturday night from Dalkeith to Stockbridge and it cost me £18. One of my family then got a taxi (don't know if it was a private hire or black cab to be fair) to and from the exact same houses about an hour later and paid £33.
Every time I've used Uber it's been a faultless service and significantly cheaper, especially for longer journeys. I'll be using them from now on ahead of any other company.
Fair points, its pesonal choice.
Where possible or practical, i like to use my power as a consumer.
Completely individual choice though.
It restores your faith when you see people like yourself who engage their brain before opening their wallet.
As for black cabbies not looking after us, I'm sure the kids who were at the beach the other week will disagree with that.
When the prices "surge" it tells you on the app. If you book an Uber when the prices have surged then you will pay significantly more than a black cab. I got an Uber on Saturday night from Dalkeith to Stockbridge and it cost me £18. One of my family then got a taxi (don't know if it was a private hire or black cab to be fair) to and from the exact same houses about an hour later and paid £33.
Every time I've used Uber it's been a faultless service and significantly cheaper, especially for longer journeys. I'll be using them from now on ahead of any other company.
The fares are being subsidised. That's why they are so cheap.
Wha are you going to use to get to Dalkeith from Stockbridge when Uber are charging you £60 and the "expensive" £33 option is gone?
Or do you think the hedge funds won't want a return and it'll be like this forever?
lord bunberry
20-06-2017, 03:39 PM
When the prices "surge" it tells you on the app. If you book an Uber when the prices have surged then you will pay significantly more than a black cab. I got an Uber on Saturday night from Dalkeith to Stockbridge and it cost me £18. One of my family then got a taxi (don't know if it was a private hire or black cab to be fair) to and from the exact same houses about an hour later and paid £33.
Every time I've used Uber it's been a faultless service and significantly cheaper, especially for longer journeys. I'll be using them from now on ahead of any other company.
£33 from Stockbridge to Dalkeith is pish. There's no way it would cost that much.
Speedy
20-06-2017, 04:14 PM
When the prices "surge" it tells you on the app. If you book an Uber when the prices have surged then you will pay significantly more than a black cab. I got an Uber on Saturday night from Dalkeith to Stockbridge and it cost me £18. One of my family then got a taxi (don't know if it was a private hire or black cab to be fair) to and from the exact same houses about an hour later and paid £33.
Every time I've used Uber it's been a faultless service and significantly cheaper, especially for longer journeys. I'll be using them from now on ahead of any other company.
I don't think it tells you the surge any more. I can only see a price estimate now.
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 05:10 PM
It definitely comes up saying the fares are high as of a couple of days ago. Maybe doesn't use the word surge mind you.
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 05:12 PM
£33 from Stockbridge to Dalkeith is pish. There's no way it would cost that much.
Well it did... im going to hazard a guess you're a taxi driver :rolleyes: . And it's not a journey I've ever done in a taxi before so I asked the lassie that sits beside me at work who lives out there how much she pays to get to centre of town and she said it was about £25.. £1 a min in a black cab in Edinburgh is probably about right from my experience/everyone else that I know
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 05:16 PM
The fares are being subsidised. That's why they are so cheap.
Wha are you going to use to get to Dalkeith from Stockbridge when Uber are charging you £60 and the "expensive" £33 option is gone?
Or do you think the hedge funds won't want a return and it'll be like this forever?
Taxi driver I presume? If uber started charging £60 for a trip like that then someone else would come along and do an Uber to Uber and muscle into become the majority/only taxi show in town. It's the way it goes.
lord bunberry
20-06-2017, 05:49 PM
Well it did... im going to hazard a guess you're a taxi driver :rolleyes: . And it's not a journey I've ever done in a taxi before so I asked the lassie that sits beside me at work who lives out there how much she pays to get to centre of town and she said it was about £25.. £1 a min in a black cab in Edinburgh is probably about right from my experience/everyone else that I know
£25 would be about right not £33
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 05:56 PM
£25 would be about right not £33
Aye but the £25 she was talking about was to the middle of town, not Stockbridge which would be another £5 or so. The taxi industry is an antiquated service industry which for some reason seems totally against moving with the times which Uber is providing and that's not even taking the price difference into account. Even at the exact same prices I'd sooner book an Uber for convenience than phone or try flag down a taxi which half the time will just drive right past you.
lord bunberry
20-06-2017, 06:14 PM
Aye but the £25 she was talking about was to the middle of town, not Stockbridge which would be another £5 or so. The taxi industry is an antiquated service industry which for some reason seems totally against moving with the times which Uber is providing and that's not even taking the price difference into account. Even at the exact same prices I'd sooner book an Uber for convenience than phone or try flag down a taxi which half the time will just drive right past you.
It wouldn't be another £5 to Stockbridge. All the major taxi companies offer you the exact same service as uber do through their own apps so you point about moving with the times is just plain wrong. I use Gett taxi and that is the same idea as uber.
I've got no problem with people using uber it's a free country, what I dislike is when there's misinformation put out to back up the argument for using them.
calumhibee1
20-06-2017, 06:39 PM
It wouldn't be another £5 to Stockbridge. All the major taxi companies offer you the exact same service as uber do through their own apps so you point about moving with the times is just plain wrong. I use Gett taxi and that is the same idea as uber.
I've got no problem with people using uber it's a free country, what I dislike is when there's misinformation put out to back up the argument for using them.
I've never seen any of these apps, can you pay by card on them? What I will say about Uber is that I and my family have used it many times. I've always had great drivers (presumably due to the rating system used on the app) who use GPS to go the fastest route (sometimes I find myself wondering where the hell black cab drivers are taking you), always arrive on time and I don't need to have cash on me or pay tips (I realise you don't need to but I've actually had taxi drivers act like ********s when they don't get one). At this point in time it's also a hell of a lot cheaper than any other taxi service. I'll definitely be continuing to use it until any of this changes.
Taxi driver I presume? If uber started charging £60 for a trip like that then someone else would come along and do an Uber to Uber and muscle into become the majority/only taxi show in town. It's the way it goes.
Why are you asking? Is it only unreasonable taxi drivers who have a low opinion of Uber and can see what they are doing? You'll be surprised.
You have more faith than I do in the free market to deliver a good deal. Get rid of all regulation and let the private sector take over a sector of public transport and use their algorithms to dictate prices? Why not just have a capped system where the majority of people can afford transport at any time?
lord bunberry
20-06-2017, 06:54 PM
I've never seen any of these apps, can you pay by card on them? What I will say about Uber is that I and my family have used it many times. I've always had great drivers (presumably due to the rating system used on the app) who use GPS to go the fastest route (sometimes I find myself wondering where the hell black cab drivers are taking you), always arrive on time and I don't need to have cash on me or pay tips (I realise you don't need to but I've actually had taxi drivers act like ********s when they don't get one). At this point in time it's also a hell of a lot cheaper than any other taxi service. I'll definitely be continuing to use it until any of this changes.
You can load your credit card details onto the app and pay in the exact same way you pay with uber. Gett taxi is exactly the same and has a ratings system as well.
City cabs was using this system on their app before uber even arrived in Edinburgh. I'm not with city cabs anymore, but I remember doing jobs through the app.
As I said it's entirely up to the customer to chose which service they use I just think that some of the nonsense that comes out is unhelpful
BroxburnHibee
20-06-2017, 07:02 PM
I was sitting at the Royal Infirmary last night when an Uber driver pulled in. Guy got out went up to the revolving doors had a look in then walked over towards me.
'Here we go' I thought.
Now I am not kidding this guy could hardly speak a word of English and when I opened my window he said please help or something along those lines anyway he didn't know how to say 'Steedman Row' the address he was looking for so shoved a bit paper at me with the street name.
I tried to explain where it was but like I said he could hardly understand a word. I eventually got a job so had to say my goodbyes.
If that level of service is worth a few pennies saved then crack on. :greengrin
Steedman Row is in Greendykes by the way so he was close :tee hee:
I was sitting at the Royal Infirmary last night when an Uber driver pulled in. Guy got out went up to the revolving doors had a look in then walked over towards me.
'Here we go' I thought.
Now I am not kidding this guy could hardly speak a word of English and when I opened my window he said please help or something along those lines anyway he didn't know how to say 'Steedman Row' the address he was looking for so shoved a bit paper at me with the street name.
I tried to explain where it was but like I said he could hardly understand a word. I eventually got a job so had to say my goodbyes.
If that level of service is worth a few pennies saved then crack on. :greengrin
Steedman Row is in Greendykes by the way so he was close :tee hee:
Yeah but what about their GPS that helps them get there faster? Maybe he should have used that.
Saying that, it hasn't stopped them driving on the wrong side of the road, going through no entry signs and driving the wrong way up one way streets.
BroxburnHibee
20-06-2017, 07:08 PM
Both major black cab companies have their own apps which do exactly the same thing as Uber but hardly anyone seems to know about it.
Central recently went into a partnership with Gett to allow their drivers to use it. I haven't bothered with it yet.
Mr White
20-06-2017, 07:09 PM
Yeah but what about their GPS that helps them get there faster? Maybe he should have used that.
Saying that, it hasn't stopped them driving on the wrong side of the road, going through no entry signs and driving the wrong way up one way streets.
They'll fit in well in northern ireland if they set up over here then as I see drivers do that stuff on a regular basis. I saw an old boy go the wrong way round a roundabout a few months ago. People moved over to let him through.
brianmc
20-06-2017, 07:14 PM
I once waved down a van driver who was going the wrong way on a 1 way street...
Van driver: Whit is it??
Me : this is a one way street mate
Van driver: I'm only gaun one way!!
and off he went.....
*this is 100% true, worryingly. Though I did chuckle at it for most of the day 😊
Pretty Boy
20-06-2017, 08:00 PM
I'm always happy to pay an extra few pound to have a driver who actually knows where they are going and be spared the inevitable crap, blaring music you tend to get with Uber and private hire.
Holmesdale Hibs
20-06-2017, 08:15 PM
I don't think it tells you the surge any more. I can only see a price estimate now.
As far as I know, it only tells you if a surge factor is being applied, which will tend to be when late a night when there are less drivers and folk are leaving the pub.
Speedy
20-06-2017, 08:38 PM
As far as I know, it only tells you if a surge factor is being applied, which will tend to be when late a night when there are less drivers and folk are leaving the pub.
That definitely was the case. Now I'm not convinced it does (on android at least) as I've checked a fare in advance of booking and had something different when I actually booked it.
Holmesdale Hibs
20-06-2017, 09:04 PM
That definitely was the case. Now I'm not convinced it does (on android at least) as I've checked a fare in advance of booking and had something different when I actually booked it.
Ah right, maybe it's changed then and it's just included in the price. It gives the fares as a range as well to account for traffic. I used to assume it was always the maximum of the range but to be fair when I checked this wasn't always the case.
Andy74
21-06-2017, 09:37 AM
It restores your faith when you see people like yourself who engage their brain before opening their wallet.
As for black cabbies not looking after us, I'm sure the kids who were at the beach the other week will disagree with that.
My brain is pretty well engaged thanks.
The kids trip is a lovely thing - not unusual though. I work for bank and we do a minimum of 2 volunteering days a year.
Does that mean we are looking after our customers any more than if we didn't do that? No, they are totally different things.
As I live in West Lothian I've paid a premium for years to make the short journey from the airport in black cabs.
I can now do the journey at a much more sensible price. I've never really sent the black cabs as a premium service - the quality of driving has been extremely varied over the years. I've had no issues at all with the quality of Uber here or anywhere else in the world.
Like any other service if I think the quality of the thing I'm paying for isn't worth the lower price anymore I will go somewhere else.
Every industry is being disrupted now by technology or other types of competition, that's the way it goes.
Hibs Class
21-06-2017, 11:36 AM
My brain is pretty well engaged thanks.
The kids trip is a lovely thing - not unusual though. I work for bank and we do a minimum of 2 volunteering days a year.
Does that mean we are looking after our customers any more than if we didn't do that? No, they are totally different things.
As I live in West Lothian I've paid a premium for years to make the short journey from the airport in black cabs.
I can now do the journey at a much more sensible price. I've never really sent the black cabs as a premium service - the quality of driving has been extremely varied over the years. I've had no issues at all with the quality of Uber here or anywhere else in the world.
Like any other service if I think the quality of the thing I'm paying for isn't worth the lower price anymore I will go somewhere else.
Every industry is being disrupted now by technology or other types of competition, that's the way it goes.
Not knocking it, as I worked in a bank and did the same, but it's not quite the same thing. The cab drivers give up a day's work and income to do the outing, whereas corporate volunteering is usually a day out away from the office but you still get paid so there is little personal cost or sacrifice. Even if giving up a weekend day it doesn't cost anything as you'll still get your full wage for the week.
lord bunberry
21-06-2017, 11:56 AM
Not knocking it, as I worked in a bank and did the same, but it's not quite the same thing. The cab drivers give up a day's work and income to do the outing, whereas corporate volunteering is usually a day out away from the office but you still get paid so there is little personal cost or sacrifice. Even if giving up a weekend day it doesn't cost anything as you'll still get your full wage for the week.
:agree: The other differences with black cabs is that any money they make is spent either improving the service for customers with things like free wifi and contactless chip and pin machines, or it's spent on advertising locally or sponsorships and charitable donations. There isn't any shareholders to pay money to. The service is obviously a business and making a living is the primary aim for a taxi driver, but in doing so we contribute to the local economy, unlike uber.
My brain is pretty well engaged thanks.
The kids trip is a lovely thing - not unusual though. I work for bank and we do a minimum of 2 volunteering days a year.
Does that mean we are looking after our customers any more than if we didn't do that? No, they are totally different things.
As I live in West Lothian I've paid a premium for years to make the short journey from the airport in black cabs.
I can now do the journey at a much more sensible price. I've never really sent the black cabs as a premium service - the quality of driving has been extremely varied over the years. I've had no issues at all with the quality of Uber here or anywhere else in the world.
Like any other service if I think the quality of the thing I'm paying for isn't worth the lower price anymore I will go somewhere else.
Every industry is being disrupted now by technology or other types of competition, that's the way it goes.
My bank only does 1 volunteering day a year. Wish it was 2 as the 1 we did this year was very good. :agree:
snooky
21-06-2017, 01:30 PM
My bank only does 1 volunteering day a year. Wish it was 2 as the 1 we did this year was very good. :agree:
What does your 'Bank' actually do in terms of volunteering? By Bank, do you mean the 'Bank employees'? What contribution does the Bank itself make? Time off? Some sort of support with transport or the like? BTW, I'm not being sarky here, just curious.
calumhibee1
21-06-2017, 03:32 PM
What does your 'Bank' actually do in terms of volunteering? By Bank, do you mean the 'Bank employees'? What contribution does the Bank itself make? Time off? Some sort of support with transport or the like? BTW, I'm not being sarky here, just curious.
I'm a Civil Servant and we're entitled to two volunteering days a year. My work does nothing other than allows you 2 full days out the office with full pay. They don't have a hand in organising, donating money etc.
Just Alf
21-06-2017, 04:01 PM
When I worked for BT they were very good at that sort of thing, they even had an intranet Web site set up where various charities etc were listed by location etc and essentially we could sign up for up to a week of volunteering.
Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk
PiemanP
21-06-2017, 06:54 PM
I use uber and think it's a great system. Most young people don't carry cash with them so it suits perfect. It's also significantly cheaper than black cabs. If the black cabs do have similar apps then they are very poorly marketed as I've never heard of any.
I also like the fact that you get a proper car (admittedly a Prius usually) whereas the traditional style black cabs are all noisy rattly things (although these Peugeot van-come-cabs seem to be taking over now).
lord bunberry
21-06-2017, 07:08 PM
I use uber and think it's a great system. Most young people don't carry cash with them so it suits perfect. It's also significantly cheaper than black cabs. If the black cabs do have similar apps then they are very poorly marketed as I've never heard of any.
I also like the fact that you get a proper car (admittedly a Prius usually) whereas the traditional style black cabs are all noisy rattly things (although these Peugeot van-come-cabs seem to be taking over now).
It's not necessarily that they're poorly marketed, it's more a case that they're limited by cost when trying to market these things. Unlike companies like uber, local businesses have to pay tax.
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
22-06-2017, 05:52 AM
I do agree with people who say its legitimate disruption etc, and businesses need to adapt and compete, or die.
However there definitely seems to be an unfair playong field with regards regulation etc - and that equals cost, leaving aside the tax arrangements.
So one side are competing with both hands tied behind their backs, which seems unfair to me.
Ive always disliked private hires, because ive always thought they are likely to be money laundering fronts for unsavoury businesses, and i dislike uber because they seem exploitative and ultimately id rather pay a bit more for a local business (plus i have family that drive black cabs, which may make me bias!)
But it does cone down to personal choice, convenience etc
calumhibee1
23-06-2017, 07:27 AM
I do agree with people who say its legitimate disruption etc, and businesses need to adapt and compete, or die.
However there definitely seems to be an unfair playong field with regards regulation etc - and that equals cost, leaving aside the tax arrangements.
So one side are competing with both hands tied behind their backs, which seems unfair to me.
Ive always disliked private hires, because ive always thought they are likely to be money laundering fronts for unsavoury businesses, and i dislike uber because they seem exploitative and ultimately id rather pay a bit more for a local business (plus i have family that drive black cabs, which may make me bias!)
But it does cone down to personal choice, convenience etc
I do actually agree with this side of the argument and if I had the time and money I would always support local business, whether that's taxi companies, newsagents over supermarkets etc but it's just not possible (for me anyway) to support small businesses at the expense of myself when I can get things so much cheaper/easier from these big companies.
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
23-06-2017, 07:34 AM
I do actually agree with this side of the argument and if I had the time and money I would always support local business, whether that's taxi companies, newsagents over supermarkets etc but it's just not possible (for me anyway) to support small businesses at the expense of myself when I can get things so much cheaper/easier from these big companies.
Yeah, all things being equal - obviously its not always possible, im not religious about it.
The whole point i suppose is that there is a choice, which is a good thing. Competition drives innovation.
BroxburnHibee
23-06-2017, 08:17 AM
I posted this picture on Facebook yesterday.
18783
Taken at the Quality St/Queensferry Road junction yesterday.
Perfect example of the kind of drivers now on our roads because Edinburgh council throw out licenses blindly like confetti without checking credentials.
This guy has been reported so hopefully dealt with swiftly.
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
23-06-2017, 08:25 AM
I posted this picture on Facebook yesterday.
18783
Taken at the Quality St/Queensferry Road junction yesterday.
Perfect example of the kind of drivers now on our roads because Edinburgh council throw out licenses blindly like confetti without checking credentials.
This guy has been reported so hopefully dealt with swiftly.
Jeezo, what a choob.
heretoday
23-06-2017, 09:02 AM
It's a market and you either regulate it from on high or adapt to it.
pacoluna
23-06-2017, 01:21 PM
I posted this picture on Facebook yesterday.
18783
Taken at the Quality St/Queensferry Road junction yesterday.
Perfect example of the kind of drivers now on our roads because Edinburgh council throw out licenses blindly like confetti without checking credentials.
This guy has been reported so hopefully dealt with swiftly.
Has the person who took the picture in the driving seat while stopped in a junction box been reported as well :D
Has the person who took the picture in the driving seat while stopped in a junction box been reported as well :D
Maybe it was in a holder on the dashboard. Mine is.
BroxburnHibee
23-06-2017, 04:09 PM
Has the person who took the picture in the driving seat while stopped in a junction box been reported as well :D
Lots of people use dashcams nowadays.
Godsahibby
24-06-2017, 08:55 AM
I use Uber because its normally cheaper and I find it easier although thanks to those on here who have mentioned the Gett Taxi app, I wasnt aware of it and have downloaded it. Will give that a try.
I do have to laugh though at some of the chat on here, the posts singling out uber for their corporate greed, tax avoidance and minimum wage. I wonder how many people were sitting their typing that on their Iphone with the Nike Hibs top on and starbucks Latte in hand!
Plus I dont think taxi drivers are really ones to comment about tax avoidance schemes. Being self employed the majority will do whatever they can to reduce their taxable income. Always interesting to see how many earn minimum wage! Thats the way it is though, Uber are just doing the exact swm things using the laws to their own benefit.
I use Uber because its normally cheaper and I find it easier although thanks to those on here who have mentioned the Gett Taxi app, I wasnt aware of it and have downloaded it. Will give that a try.
I do have to laugh though at some of the chat on here, the posts singling out uber for their corporate greed, tax avoidance and minimum wage. I wonder how many people were sitting their typing that on their Iphone with the Nike Hibs top on and starbucks Latte in hand!
Plus I dont think taxi drivers are really ones to comment about tax avoidance schemes. Being self employed the majority will do whatever they can to reduce their taxable income. Always interesting to see how many earn minimum wage! Thats the way it is though, Uber are just doing the exact swm things using the laws to their own benefit.
The main difference between Uber and the other companies you mention is that they aren't "disrupting" a system that's regulated to ensure affordability for it's users and a fair wage for its workers. If the coffee industry was Nationalised and a fair price was £2 a cup regardless of where you bought it, the alarm bells would be ringing if I knew that someone else was offering coffee at a loss.
The point about taxi drivers avoiding tax is disappointing and is a familiar argument used by Uber, their backers and those who swallow their narrative. The days of cabbies being dishonest are long gone due to technology and comparing the exploitation of weak international tax laws (ones that leaders of all political parties have criticised and ones that other, reputable companies don't exploit) with making sure cabbies put through all their clothing allowance is laughable.
The message they are trying to get across is that taxis are an international cartel who dodge tax and have been ripping people off and Uber are this plucky, edgy underdog who are making travel cheaper. The reality is that cabbies are running a service for a local authority without any of the benefits a council employee enjoys. They don't know each other, aren't unionised and the only way they avoid the minimum wage is by working extremely unsociable hours. This plucky underdog that people are almost feeling sorry for are worth billions, backed by hedge funds, companies like Google and the good old Saudi government.
The last thing I'm going to say on the matter is that I know how much it costs to run a taxi and a private hire and these prices uber are charging....
They. Aren't. Real.
People are going to find out the hard way once the machine has convinced everyone that regulation of fares is a bad thing but it'll be too late. It's a shame because, believe it or not, black taxis aren't just there to take people home on a Saturday night.
CapitalGreen
24-06-2017, 05:21 PM
The reality is that cabbies are running a service for a local authority without any of the benefits a council employee enjoys. They don't know each other, aren't unionised and the only way they avoid the minimum wage is by working extremely unsociable hours.
I sympathise with many of the points raised by cabbies but don't make out your are doing us all some sort of favour.
Onceinawhile
24-06-2017, 05:32 PM
How can someone make minimum wage if they are self employed?
I sympathise with many of the points raised by cabbies but don't make out your are doing us all some sort of favour.
Taxis are a form of public transport and if you use them we are doing you a favour. We're doing the council a favour too.
It's a two way thing though and the passengers are doing us a favour.
Like I said, black cabs do a lot more than simply take steamers home at the weekend.
How can someone make minimum wage if they are self employed?
What do you mean?
It's a simple case of looking at what your earnings are and dividing it by your hours worked.
Killiehibbie
24-06-2017, 05:54 PM
How can someone make minimum wage if they are self employed?Many self employed people make less than the equivalent of the hourly minimum wage, taxi drivers would most of the time if they worked an 8 hour shift. As for uber i really hope they're forced to employ the drivers as these guys are not really self employed and free to do as they wish. Uber are a drain on the economy in every area they operate in.
Many self employed people make less than the equivalent of the hourly minimum wage, taxi drivers would most of the time if they worked an 8 hour shift. As for uber i really hope they're forced to employ the drivers as these guys are not really self employed and free to do as they wish. Uber are a drain on the economy in every area they operate in.
Being forced to class drivers as workers will be the end of them in the U.K. They could hang about and become a legitimate private hire company but that's not what they're all about. If they do lose their appeal then surely every PHC driver will also be entitled to workers status as they are tied to their company. They won't lose though as money talks at that level.
For balance, people should recognise the good things about Uber. The app is good and link to PayPal is convenient. The driving rating system is also good st weeding out bad drivers and improving customer experiences. There are some cabbies out there with bad attitudes and a sense of entitlement who aren't helping the trade.
However, if something is too good to be true then it usually is and that's the case with Uber. Things are being sacrificed for these low prices, mainly investors money, workers rights and your cash when they ramp up their fares. There's no such thing as a free lunch.
Onceinawhile
24-06-2017, 06:38 PM
What do you mean?
It's a simple case of looking at what your earnings are and dividing it by your hours worked.
That's absolutely not how the tax system works though.
If you are self employed there is no minimum wage.
lord bunberry
24-06-2017, 06:46 PM
How can someone make minimum wage if they are self employed?
Sometimes we earn less than the equivalent of a minimum wage. Uber drivers took the company to court and won over whether they are self employed or not.
As Pete says we are working for the council, but don't get any benefits of other council workers. I'm not complaining about that, but when a company like uber comes in and can get away with doing whatever they want because they have huge financial backing, it makes for an un level playing field.
That's absolutely not how the tax system works though.
If you are self employed there is no minimum wage.
No offence but I've been self employed for over 14 years so I know how the tax system works and know that I'm not on an hourly rate.
Again, I apologise if I'm picking you up wrong but what's your point?
Andy74
24-06-2017, 07:27 PM
Taxis are a form of public transport and if you use them we are doing you a favour. We're doing the council a favour too.
It's a two way thing though and the passengers are doing us a favour.
Like I said, black cabs do a lot more than simply take steamers home at the weekend.
Jeez. No wonder this 'service' was ripe for disruption.
Jeez. No wonder this 'service' was ripe for disruption.
I know, how dare we let people know about the service we provide and how we operate.
We should know our place.
Taxis are a form of public transport and if you use them we are doing you a favour. We're doing the council a favour too.
It's a two way thing though and the passengers are doing us a favour.
Like I said, black cabs do a lot more than simply take steamers home at the weekend.
As a slightly sideways discussion, what do you mean by your last point here Pete?
Im not being a smartarse btw, genuinely curious by what you're referring to :aok:
lord bunberry
24-06-2017, 08:09 PM
As a slightly sideways discussion, what do you mean by your last point here Pete?
Im not being a smartarse btw, genuinely curious by what you're referring to :aok:
I'm sure Pete will be along with a more articulate answer than me in a minute, but taxis provide an essential service to the elderly and the disabled. These services are provided at a discounted rate and without them many people would be housebound. This sort of work is time consuming for the driver and often the journeys are quite short. We all realise though that it's all part of the service we provide and I can honestly say it means a lot to me when someone is so thankful for the service I have provided, it means far more to me than a tip. Taxis generally ferry people around for the NHS as there simply isn't the resources to provide this service in house. Also things are sent between different hospital labs via taxis. This service is also provided at a discounted rate.
As a slightly sideways discussion, what do you mean by your last point here Pete?
Im not being a smartarse btw, genuinely curious by what you're referring to :aok:
All cabs have to be wheelchair accessible so they do a lot of patient transport.
There are also the school runs which cabs do as their drivers are checked thourougly and have disclosure.
They also carry specimens between hospitals for fixed prices and transport blood and organs for transfusion.
People say that private hire cars can do some of these things too but questions regarding insurance, driver training and fishy ownership structures usually rule them out.
Also, during the rush hour we are allowed to use the bus lanes and are the quickest way for businesses to transport people...even fat cats who would deregulate everything and let the open market weed out the weak and let the strong survive. ;-)
I'm sure Pete will be along with a more articulate answer than me in a minute.
That's only because I'm sober.
Don't worry, I'll be back to normal shortly. :-D
lord bunberry
24-06-2017, 08:29 PM
That's only because I'm sober.
Don't worry, I'll be back to normal shortly. :-D
Ill have you know I've only had 1 small sherry purely for medicinal purposes:greengrin
Ill have you know I've only had 1 small sherry purely for medicinal purposes:greengrin
I believe you.
I've just taken a wheelchair passenger from Tranent to the Royal infirmary which cost the NHS £26.
A large Uber, one that doesn't even guarentee wheelchair access, would cost £22-30 for the same journey. This is without Uber's price surging.
Imagine what an Über would charge the NHS when the passenger has to go back in an hours time and they are charging their rip-off prices.
What is it so many people have said already? Oh yeah, that's the way it is.
lord bunberry
24-06-2017, 11:03 PM
I believe you.
I've just taken a wheelchair passenger from Tranent to the Royal infirmary which cost the NHS £26.
A large Uber, one that doesn't even guarentee wheelchair access, would cost £22-30 for the same journey. This is without Uber's price surging.
Imagine what an Über would charge the NHS when the passenger has to go back in an hours time and they are charging their rip-off prices.
What is it so many people have said already? Oh yeah, that's the way it is.
You're wrong mate. A white knight is apparently going to come charging in to save us all with even cheaper fares. You have to remember that uber are owned by google and they would never try and corner the market. Look at all those other successful search engines out there that we all use, there's eh eh ...... none. As a result they're able to dictate how our data is used, but that's fine because that's the way it is.
CapitalGreen
24-06-2017, 11:53 PM
You're wrong mate. A white knight is apparently going to come charging in to save us all with even cheaper fares. You have to remember that uber are owned by google and they would never try and corner the market. Look at all those other successful search engines out there that we all use, there's eh eh ...... none. As a result they're able to dictate how our data is used, but that's fine because that's the way it is.
Google own shares in Uber but they do not have a controlling stake. This type of misinformation does nothing for your argument.
Google own shares in Uber but they do not have a controlling stake. This type of misinformation does nothing for your argument.
We'll it hardly blows his argument out the water, does it?
The cultures are the same.
Edit: in fact, uber put google to shame when it comes to aggression.
You're wrong mate. A white knight is apparently going to come charging in to save us all with even cheaper fares. You have to remember that uber are owned by google and they would never try and corner the market. Look at all those other successful search engines out there that we all use, there's eh eh ...... none. As a result they're able to dictate how our data is used, but that's fine because that's the way it is.
Five stars for you lad.
Just done the return for a super black cab rip-off price capped at £26.
There's a cheeky wee surge and the Uber would cost £35-48 for the same journey. I guess they'll just have to wait until Uber's super cheap minimum price of around £26 appears...whenever that is.
Also, while in East Lothian I could order an Uber from one destination to another within the area. Do they have, or need a licence to operate within East Lothian?
What will they send? An Edinburgh car or one from another licensing borough with slack regulations?
They won't tell you where your "partners" car is licenced. Just so seedy.
:rotflmao:
Live from the coal face:
Job £6.10 in a black will cost you £6-8 in an Uber banger and even more if there's five of you. The surge is going up and down like a hoores knickers...is this what people really want?
One of them has just stopped dead in the middle of the West Approach Road FFS!
Uber from canonmills garage to the Tron is the same price as a black (shock horror).
However, Uber's super duper sat nav will take you up Leith Street, down Calton Road, up new street then up the high street. Firstly, it's shut and second, it's plain wrong. If a black took you that way he'd be expecting to be pulled into the cab office.
Another Uber stops at the junction of the grass market and the cowgate, obviously confused by the no entry sign that his superb Uber GPS doesn't tell him about. What the hell...through he goes. No surprise really as that happens nightly.
Saying that, you might get lucky and get the S class merc. How the ****??
Sorry for boring you all, last reply. Honestly. :-)
There were only the two more incidents with Ubers last night. One where I was approaching a crossroads and the Uber approaching from the other direction suddenly turned right without indicating, forcing me to brake heavily. It then sped off up the road blissfully unaware. The second resulted in the bizarre situation where for a good ten seconds, an Uber and myself were travelling side by side along Haymarket Terrace with me on the correct side of the road and him on the other. It was down to him pulling out and being totally unaware of my presence.
People might think I'm exaggerating or making it up but honestly, I don't have to. It's like wacky races meets amateur hour out there now with the amount of new private hires with drivers who don't have a clue. Their reliance on their sat nav compromises safety and if people think that a transport system can be run with untrained drivers who are unfamiliar with the city then I say it with a smile on my face but you don't have a ****ing scooby what you're talking about. The funny thing was that I was wasn't even out for that long and I didn't spend much of it in town.
I'm willing to bet the first Uber driver was in a hurry for one of two reasons. He could be toiling for cash as he's been duped into Ubers spin about making lots of money and is barely keeping his head above water. You run about daft trying to squeeze as much as you can in if you're only being paid pennies per job. Secondly, he's probably petrified of being late and getting a bad rating as a result.
The rating system is great in theory but in reality, all it does is make drivers miserable, nervous and indecisive...petrified to put a foot wrong in case a bad rating takes them below a certain threshold that can put them off the road. Nervous and indecisive people make great drivers eh?
There will no doubt be people who say I need to get with it and realise that it's all about the customer, who ultimately is king as they hold the cash. They can judge people how they like. Unlike banks or call centres, there is no appeal system when it comes to complaints with Uber. There are no recordings that can be listened back to and no sympathetic higher authority to give you the benefit of the doubt. It's bang, one star and that's it. As the power of the man with the money is increased, the dignity of the service provider is decreased and it's gone too far. It's almost dehumanising.
I got a one star rating on Gett for having the audacity to tell someone the route they wanted to take wasn't possible and I could take them a better one. The girl looked at me as to say "who the **** do you think you're talking to?, I'm paying you to do as I say". When I did take them on the journey I could tell they were wondering where I was going but they just didn't know as much as they thought they did and I was doing them a favour. At the end of the journey it was bang: one star for me. I think it was for me daring to suggest that our transaction didn't involve me basically begging for her approval rating, which is what modern society (where the consumer is all powerful) is teaching people.
I can switch Gett off but Uber drivers can't switch Uber off. It must be hard for them and I almost feel sorry for their drivers. Still, people will believe all of Ubers spin and continue using them because they think the sun shines out of their erse, they are the creators of the taxi app and everything is rosy.
I'm done, but all I'll say is that it's laughable and sad in equal measure.
I'm sure Pete will be along with a more articulate answer than me in a minute, but taxis provide an essential service to the elderly and the disabled. These services are provided at a discounted rate and without them many people would be housebound. This sort of work is time consuming for the driver and often the journeys are quite short. We all realise though that it's all part of the service we provide and I can honestly say it means a lot to me when someone is so thankful for the service I have provided, it means far more to me than a tip. Taxis generally ferry people around for the NHS as there simply isn't the resources to provide this service in house. Also things are sent between different hospital labs via taxis. This service is also provided at a discounted rate.
All cabs have to be wheelchair accessible so they do a lot of patient transport.
There are also the school runs which cabs do as their drivers are checked thourougly and have disclosure.
They also carry specimens between hospitals for fixed prices and transport blood and organs for transfusion.
People say that private hire cars can do some of these things too but questions regarding insurance, driver training and fishy ownership structures usually rule them out.
Also, during the rush hour we are allowed to use the bus lanes and are the quickest way for businesses to transport people...even fat cats who would deregulate everything and let the open market weed out the weak and let the strong survive. ;-)
thank you guys.
I knew of some of those vaguely, but not all of them. Very interesting, I appreciate you taking the time :aok:
thank you guys.
I knew of some of those vaguely, but not all of them. Very interesting, I appreciate you taking the time :aok:
Nae bother.
We do all that yet we still get a barrowload of grief. **** it, I'm off to the buses. :greengrin
What does your 'Bank' actually do in terms of volunteering? By Bank, do you mean the 'Bank employees'? What contribution does the Bank itself make? Time off? Some sort of support with transport or the like? BTW, I'm not being sarky here, just curious.
We get one day per year organised by the bank to go to help anyone that needs it. These can range from building paths to working in charity shops to painting. Anything that helps out is allowed. Usually do the work for charities or people in need.
It's a good experience to be honest I have done it last 10 years or so. I also believe the bank donates to local charties quite often too.
Onceinawhile
25-06-2017, 11:46 AM
No offence but I've been self employed for over 14 years so I know how the tax system works and know that I'm not on an hourly rate.
Again, I apologise if I'm picking you up wrong but what's your point?
My point is that someone above (not you) was trying to disparage self employed taxi drivers as they are self employed but make minimum wage.
Anyone with that basic a misunderstanding of the tax system shouldn't be taken seriously on this type of topic was my point.
Godsahibby
25-06-2017, 12:46 PM
My point is that someone above (not you) was trying to disparage self employed taxi drivers as they are self employed but make minimum wage.
Anyone with that basic a misunderstanding of the tax system shouldn't be taken seriously on this type of topic was my point.
If it is my post you are referring to I was far from trying to disparage self employed taxi drives.
I was merely trying to make the point that companies whether that be massive corporations a like über or a one man company will do whatever they can within the rules available to them to limit the amount of tax they pay.
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 01:49 PM
Sorry for boring you all, last reply. Honestly. :-)
There were only the two more incidents with Ubers last night. One where I was approaching a crossroads and the Uber approaching from the other direction suddenly turned right without indicating, forcing me to brake heavily. It then sped off up the road blissfully unaware. The second resulted in the bizarre situation where for a good ten seconds, an Uber and myself were travelling side by side along Haymarket Terrace with me on the correct side of the road and him on the other. It was down to him pulling out and being totally unaware of my presence.
People might think I'm exaggerating or making it up but honestly, I don't have to. It's like wacky races meets amateur hour out there now with the amount of new private hires with drivers who don't have a clue. Their reliance on their sat nav compromises safety and if people think that a transport system can be run with untrained drivers who are unfamiliar with the city then I say it with a smile on my face but you don't have a ****ing scooby what you're talking about. The funny thing was that I was wasn't even out for that long and I didn't spend much of it in town.
I'm willing to bet the first Uber driver was in a hurry for one of two reasons. He could be toiling for cash as he's been duped into Ubers spin about making lots of money and is barely keeping his head above water. You run about daft trying to squeeze as much as you can in if you're only being paid pennies per job. Secondly, he's probably petrified of being late and getting a bad rating as a result.
The rating system is great in theory but in reality, all it does is make drivers miserable, nervous and indecisive...petrified to put a foot wrong in case a bad rating takes them below a certain threshold that can put them off the road. Nervous and indecisive people make great drivers eh?
There will no doubt be people who say I need to get with it and realise that it's all about the customer, who ultimately is king as they hold the cash. They can judge people how they like. Unlike banks or call centres, there is no appeal system when it comes to complaints with Uber. There are no recordings that can be listened back to and no sympathetic higher authority to give you the benefit of the doubt. It's bang, one star and that's it. As the power of the man with the money is increased, the dignity of the service provider is decreased and it's gone too far. It's almost dehumanising.
I got a one star rating on Gett for having the audacity to tell someone the route they wanted to take wasn't possible and I could take them a better one. The girl looked at me as to say "who the **** do you think you're talking to?, I'm paying you to do as I say". When I did take them on the journey I could tell they were wondering where I was going but they just didn't know as much as they thought they did and I was doing them a favour. At the end of the journey it was bang: one star for me. I think it was for me daring to suggest that our transaction didn't involve me basically begging for her approval rating, which is what modern society (where the consumer is all powerful) is teaching people.
I can switch Gett off but Uber drivers can't switch Uber off. It must be hard for them and I almost feel sorry for their drivers. Still, people will believe all of Ubers spin and continue using them because they think the sun shines out of their erse, they are the creators of the taxi app and everything is rosy.
I'm done, but all I'll say is that it's laughable and sad in equal measure.
You do realise that some black cab drivers are absolutely brutal aswell don't you? Like the one that done a U-turn in the middle of the road to pick up a fare this morning (no indicators used and judging by the way he done it I don't even think he bothered checking to make sure it was safe) which I would have t-boned if I hadn't managed to stop in time.
As an aside, you have a major bone to pick with Uber and apparently went out for a short period of time and by the sounds of things witnessed them causing absolute carnage on the roads. How come only black cab drivers are the ones who notice this? Because it's their competitors and they want to make out like they're a hell of a lot worse than they are? I've never noticed it (no more than you notice it with black cabs, private hires or just your average Joe in his car) and I do about 12000 miles a year.
As for the point about ratings systems etc, in pretty much every other line of work you have to meet a certain level of service. That's all the ratings system is doing, measuring the service provided by the Uber drivers. It's certainly not the dehumanising, morale wrecking, stopping people from doing there job right system that you make it out to be. I manage fine to meet customer satisfaction levels in my work, car salesmen earn there bonus off it, restaurant staff hand you out vouchers for money off if you fill in a survey about the standard of service etc and they all manage just fine.
I'd also like to point out that I got an Uber on Friday night from the Village hotel on Friday night up to the east end of George Street. Cost me £5.10. I then got a black cab later on in the night from the middle of Dundas Street to Comely Bank and paid £6.40 (£3 something or other as soon as I got in) and had to pay an additional fee for the privilege of paying by card. Not massive differences price wise as such because it was such a short journey, but considering the journey time is so short and the second journey was probably only about 50% of the distance of the first one it's also not a marginal difference either.
lord bunberry
25-06-2017, 01:58 PM
You do realise that some black cab drivers are absolutely brutal aswell don't you? Like the one that done a U-turn in the middle of the road to pick up a fare this morning (no indicators used and judging by the way he done it I don't even think he bothered checking to make sure it was safe) which I would have t-boned if I hadn't managed to stop in time.
As an aside, you have a major bone to pick with Uber and apparently went out for a short period of time and by the sounds of things witnessed them causing absolute carnage on the roads. How come only black cab drivers are the ones who notice this? Because it's their competitors and they want to make out like they're a hell of a lot worse than they are? I've never noticed it (no more than you notice it with black cabs, private hires or just your average Joe in his car) and I do about 12000 miles a year.
As for the point about ratings systems etc, in pretty much every other line of work you have to meet a certain level of service. That's all the ratings system is doing, measuring the service provided by the Uber drivers. It's certainly not the dehumanising, morale wrecking, stopping people from doing there job right system that you make it out to be. I manage fine to meet customer satisfaction levels in my work, car salesmen earn there bonus off it, restaurant staff hand you out vouchers for money off if you fill in a survey about the standard of service etc and they all manage just fine.
I'd also like to point out that I got an Uber on Friday night from the Village hotel on Friday night up to the east end of George Street. Cost me £5.10. I then got a black cab later on in the night from the middle of Dundas Street to Comely Bank and paid £6.40 (£3 something or other as soon as I got in) and had to pay an additional fee for the privilege of paying by card. Not massive differences price wise as such because it was such a short journey, but considering the journey time is so short and the second journey was probably only about 50% of the distance of the first one it's also not a marginal difference either.
The ratings system that uber use gives the driver zero comeback on it. He or she has no chance to explain themselves and the rating doesn't get removed.
lord bunberry
25-06-2017, 01:59 PM
You do realise that some black cab drivers are absolutely brutal aswell don't you? Like the one that done a U-turn in the middle of the road to pick up a fare this morning (no indicators used and judging by the way he done it I don't even think he bothered checking to make sure it was safe) which I would have t-boned if I hadn't managed to stop in time.
As an aside, you have a major bone to pick with Uber and apparently went out for a short period of time and by the sounds of things witnessed them causing absolute carnage on the roads. How come only black cab drivers are the ones who notice this? Because it's their competitors and they want to make out like they're a hell of a lot worse than they are? I've never noticed it (no more than you notice it with black cabs, private hires or just your average Joe in his car) and I do about 12000 miles a year.
As for the point about ratings systems etc, in pretty much every other line of work you have to meet a certain level of service. That's all the ratings system is doing, measuring the service provided by the Uber drivers. It's certainly not the dehumanising, morale wrecking, stopping people from doing there job right system that you make it out to be. I manage fine to meet customer satisfaction levels in my work, car salesmen earn there bonus off it, restaurant staff hand you out vouchers for money off if you fill in a survey about the standard of service etc and they all manage just fine.
I'd also like to point out that I got an Uber on Friday night from the Village hotel on Friday night up to the east end of George Street. Cost me £5.10. I then got a black cab later on in the night from the middle of Dundas Street to Comely Bank and paid £6.40 (£3 something or other as soon as I got in) and had to pay an additional fee for the privilege of paying by card. Not massive differences price wise as such because it was such a short journey, but considering the journey time is so short and the second journey was probably only about 50% of the distance of the first one it's also not a marginal difference either.
Why didn't you get an uber back?
Allant1981
25-06-2017, 02:10 PM
black cab drivers are every bit as bad at driving as any other taxi driver and if they say otherwise then they are kidding themselves on, i have seen lots of questionable driving manoeuvres by black cab drivers that make you sit and shake your head
CapitalGreen
25-06-2017, 02:16 PM
black cab drivers are every bit as bad at driving as any other taxi driver and if they say otherwise then they are kidding themselves on, i have seen lots of questionable driving manoeuvres by black cab drivers that make you sit and shake your head
This. Spend 10 minutes at Albyn Place and you'll see them all at it. Black Cabs, PH and Uber's all performing illegal manoeuvres.
So is this the only argument left? Saying that black cab drivers are just as bad?
They do make some shockers I agree but Uber are taking it to a whole new level and do you know why?
Not only are the doing the stereotypical thing of making bold moves without due consideration, they are totally reliant on their GPS for directions and that takes away their attention.
You can sit and stare out your window and try and speak from a position of authority but you don't see them anywhere near as much as I do and don't see why they are making these mistakes.
It's only going to get worse and if you get into an accident with a black cab at least you know they'll be fully ensured. For you information a normal PHC might be but Uber, they are actively encouraging their drivers not to get proper hire and reward insurance so they don't have as many overheads.
The ratings system that uber use gives the driver zero comeback on it. He or she has no chance to explain themselves and the rating doesn't get removed.
Exactly. It's not the same and things like surveys in restaurants etc..aren't as brutal and have an option to give an explaination.
Plus, they're not being judged on their driving...and a five minute snapshot of it at that.
P.s. I think we can guess why we didn't get an Uber home.
And before anyone thinks I'm just a bitter black cabbie who has an unreasonable bone to pick with Uber then you're wrong. One thing I have done is a little bit more research into the way they operate and the way their drivers behave simply because they are directly involved in my current field of work. Most other "bitter" cabbies are the same and recognise that in Edinburgh, they won't really be effected by Uber's rise, it will be the other PHC companies. There already is a cheaper alternative to black cabs.
It's not going to effect me either as I'll be out the cab game in a few months anyway. No vested interests Im afraid...I'm just saying it as I see it.
Peace.
Blakey.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 03:53 PM
So is this the only argument left? Saying that black cab drivers are just as bad?
They do make some shockers I agree but Uber are taking it to a whole new level and do you know why?
Not only are the doing the stereotypical thing of making bold moves without due consideration, they are totally reliant on their GPS for directions and that takes away their attention.
You can sit and stare out your window and try and speak from a position of authority but you don't see them anywhere near as much as I do and don't see why they are making these mistakes.
It's only going to get worse and if you get into an accident with a black cab at least you know they'll be fully ensured. For you information a normal PHC might be but Uber, they are actively encouraging their drivers not to get proper hire and reward insurance so they don't have as many overheads.
Anybody using one them better hope they're not in an accident and sustain injuries. i imagine insurance is null and void if a PH licenced in Edinburgh is doing a hire that doesn't drop off or pick up within Edinburgh.
Anybody using one them better hope they're not in an accident and sustain injuries. i imagine insurance is null and void if a PH licenced in Edinburgh is doing a hire that doesn't drop off or pick up within Edinburgh.
Indeed, and uber don't even tell you which licensing authority their "partner" uses.
And while Uber aren't actually publicly telling their drivers not to get HR insurance, they have campaigned against it as it doesn't fit in with their casualisation ideology.
There's a loophole/trick that everyone knows about and you wonder if a company that releases such statements will therefore encourage their drivers to use it.
Any trouble and they could just turn into a tech company again.
Anyway, I'm out. Deep down people must know the score.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 04:16 PM
Indeed. And while Uber aren't actually publicly telling their drivers not to get it, they have campaigned against it as it doesn't fit in with their casualisation ideology.
There's a loophole/trick that everyone knows about and you wonder if a company that releases such statements will therefore encourage their drivers to use it.
Any trouble and they could just turn into a tech company again.
Anyway, I'm out. Deep down people must know the score.Surely they need to be licenced in the area they operate in and have proper insurance. Can't see how i'm just a casual driver stands up in court when they get charged with not having hire and reward insurance and then wee Tam trying to sue the driver personally for his loss of earnings and whiplash injuries whilst saving 2 quid on his journey. No point in Tam suing uber as they don't give a ****.
CapitalGreen
25-06-2017, 04:39 PM
💚 Uber
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 04:56 PM
Why didn't you get an uber back?
Because the person I was with decided to flag down a taxi, most of the time after a night out I walk home from town.
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 05:00 PM
So is this the only argument left? Saying that black cab drivers are just as bad?
They do make some shockers I agree but Uber are taking it to a whole new level and do you know why?
Not only are the doing the stereotypical thing of making bold moves without due consideration, they are totally reliant on their GPS for directions and that takes away their attention.
You can sit and stare out your window and try and speak from a position of authority but you don't see them anywhere near as much as I do and don't see why they are making these mistakes.
It's only going to get worse and if you get into an accident with a black cab at least you know they'll be fully ensured. For you information a normal PHC might be but Uber, they are actively encouraging their drivers not to get proper hire and reward insurance so they don't have as many overheads.
It's far from the only arguement left, it is however the main arguement that's been presented against uber so far - that they're drivers can't drive and that's because they use a sat nav. When in reality some of their drivers are crap at driving for the same reasons some black cab drivers are - because they're just not very good at it.
lord bunberry
25-06-2017, 05:04 PM
Because the person I was with decided to flag down a taxi, most of the time after a night out I walk home from town.
It couldn't have been £6.40 if you flagged it down. If you phoned it because you didn't want to pay the uber surge price it could've been £6.40.
Andy74
25-06-2017, 05:13 PM
It's far from the only arguement left, it is however the main arguement that's been presented against uber so far - that they're drivers can't drive and that's because they use a sat nav. When in reality some of their drivers are crap at driving for the same reasons some black cab drivers are - because they're just not very good at it.
Yep and as consumers we don't have to argue for or against anything. We just use what service we want.
Surely they need to be licenced in the area they operate in and have proper insurance. Can't see how i'm just a casual driver stands up in court when they get charged with not having hire and reward insurance and then wee Tam trying to sue the driver personally for his loss of earnings and whiplash injuries whilst saving 2 quid on his journey. No point in Tam suing uber as they don't give a ****.
Sorry wee Tam, that's the way it is.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 05:27 PM
Sorry wee Tam, that's the way it is.
How do they get a compliance certificate without proper insurance? No chance of getting past inspectors through here without it.
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 05:33 PM
It couldn't have been £6.40 if you flagged it down. If you phoned it because you didn't want to pay the uber surge price it could've been £6.40.
:confused:
Go on, tell me how it couldn't have been £6.40. That's twice I've been told on this thread that black cab fares couldn't have possibly been the price that they were. Trying to point blank deny black cabs charge the prices that they do charge isn't really much of an argument.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 05:34 PM
:confused:
Go on, tell me how it couldn't have been £6.40. That's twice I've been told on this thread that black cab fares couldn't have possibly been the price that they were. Trying to point blank deny black cabs charge the prices that they do charge isn't really much of an argument.Flagfall then increments that mean it's not possible for it to be that amount.
It's far from the only arguement left, it is however the main arguement that's been presented against uber so far - that they're drivers can't drive and that's because they use a sat nav. When in reality some of their drivers are crap at driving for the same reasons some black cab drivers are - because they're just not very good at it.
That's "reality" is it? I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about.
Uber users and supporters remind me of smokers. The facts from people who do actually know what they're talking about are there but you don't want to hear them. They tell you something bad about something you like and you don't want to know.
It's all about the short term. Bad things might be coming later (market domination, price hikes) but that's shoved to the side and the fingers are in the ear.
It then comes down to plain stubbornness and fooling yourself into believing that there will be no down sides but deep down you know you're being taken for a ****ing mug.
As Andy says, don't think, just spend.
I'm genuinely out now as you're all good posters and there's no point in falling out. You can all do what you like...and like I said I've no real agenda as I'll be out the cab game soon.
:aok:
How do they get a compliance certificate without proper insurance? No chance of getting past inspectors through here without it.
You can cancel your policy within 14 days.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 05:40 PM
You can cancel your policy within 14 days.Are spot checks done during the year or is that just for hacks?
Are spot checks done during the year or is that just for hacks?
Do you mean the boys that pull people up at the ranks? I've genuinely not seen one of them for years so I can't imagine them being strict when it comes to PHC checks.
Numbers of PHC have ballooned so maybe they should concentrate on them a bit more...if they are still about.
lord bunberry
25-06-2017, 05:50 PM
:confused:
Go on, tell me how it couldn't have been £6.40. That's twice I've been told on this thread that black cab fares couldn't have possibly been the price that they were. Trying to point blank deny black cabs charge the prices that they do charge isn't really much of an argument.
£3.10 and then the meter rises by £0.25 meaning your fare could never be £6.40. That's not me making an argument, that's me stating a fact.
Killiehibbie
25-06-2017, 05:54 PM
Do you mean the boys that pull people up at the ranks? I've genuinely not seen one of them for years so I can't imagine them being strict when it comes to PHC checks.
Numbers of PHC have ballooned so maybe they should concentrate on them a bit more...if they are still about.Yes, one of the reasons given for cost of licence. They also visit offices to check that every vehicle on radio system is legal, twice a year we had to provide insurance and also licence details of every driver permitted to work taxi. Used to often see them in Glasgow with cctv van monitoring what was going on at weekends.
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 05:59 PM
£3.10 and then the meter rises by £0.25 meaning your fare could never be £6.40. That's not me making an argument, that's me stating a fact.
I know it's roughly they amounts, however judging by the maps app on the iPhone it's about a 2.4km journey. £3.10, going up 25p every 180m or so I think it is? (although admittedly I don't know for sure, I'm sure you'll be able to confirm, it's just a figure that I vaguely remember hearing before) Is an extra £3.25. That's £6.35. Chuck in a card charge of presumably 50p or so and it can be about that amount can't it?
calumhibee1
25-06-2017, 06:05 PM
That's "reality" is it? I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about.
Uber users and supporters remind me of smokers. The facts from people who do actually know what they're talking about are there but you don't want to hear them. They tell you something bad about something you like and you don't want to know.
It's all about the short term. Bad things might be coming later (market domination, price hikes) but that's shoved to the side and the fingers are in the ear.
It then comes down to plain stubbornness and fooling yourself into believing that there will be no down sides but deep down you know you're being taken for a ****ing mug.
As Andy says, don't think, just spend.
I'm genuinely out now as you're all good posters and there's no point in falling out. You can all do what you like...and like I said I've no real agenda as I'll be out the cab game soon.
:aok:
We'll agree to disagree mate. Although I think the fact that you've suggested bad things "might" be coming later would suggest you're also not in any position to say for definite what's coming either, so I'm not sure how you can point blank say that other people don't know what they're talking about when you're working on scenarios that you don't even know will unfold.
If Uber is a success and ends up dominating the market while charging outrageous prices as a couple of posters on this thread seem to suggest, I don't see any reason why somebody else wouldn't come swooping in and do exactly the same to Uber as they've done to the black cabs/private hires to (potentially) reach a position of market dominance. If people think that Uber are going to come along and start charging a hell of a lot more money than black cabs/private hires currently charge with the public having no other option because all other options have been ran out of town then that's their opinion, but it shouldn't be dressed up as an inevitable fact.
We'll agree to disagree mate. Although I think the fact that you've suggested bad things "might" be coming later would suggest you're also not in any position to say for definite what's coming either, so I'm not sure how you can point blank say that other people don't know what they're talking about when you're working on scenarios that you don't even know will unfold.
If Uber is a success and ends up dominating the market while charging outrageous prices as a couple of posters on this thread seem to suggest, I don't see any reason why somebody else wouldn't come swooping in and do exactly the same to Uber as they've done to the black cabs/private hires to (potentially) reach a position of market dominance. If people think that Uber are going to come along and start charging a hell of a lot more money than black cabs/private hires currently charge with the public having no other option because all other options have been ran out of town then that's their opinion, but it shouldn't be dressed up as an inevitable fact.
Nae bother mate.
Uber's appeal against the ruling that all their drivers should be classed as workers is at the end of September. The picture will become a lot clearer then and it will undoubtedly have wide ranging implications for the gig economy in general.
Watch this space I guess.
Yes, one of the reasons given for cost of licence. They also visit offices to check that every vehicle on radio system is legal, twice a year we had to provide insurance and also licence details of every driver permitted to work taxi. Used to often see them in Glasgow with cctv van monitoring what was going on at weekends.
I'm not sure of the procedures in Edinburgh but anything that stops drivers having dodgy insurance is a good thing.
All I know is that some PHC have been getting away with it and it's time they were clamped down on. It's not fair on everyone else and I mean other PHC owners too. That's something we can all agree on.
lord bunberry
25-06-2017, 06:46 PM
I know it's roughly they amounts, however judging by the maps app on the iPhone it's about a 2.4km journey. £3.10, going up 25p every 180m or so I think it is? (although admittedly I don't know for sure, I'm sure you'll be able to confirm, it's just a figure that I vaguely remember hearing before) Is an extra £3.25. That's £6.35. Chuck in a card charge of presumably 50p or so and it can be about that amount can't it?
It can't be exactly £6.40 is what I was saying, unless you pre booked it.
CapitalGreen
25-06-2017, 07:49 PM
It can't be exactly £6.40 is what I was saying, unless you pre booked it.
If he had used Uber he'd be able to check his app to see exactly how much it had cost him. Confusion avoided 👍
Andy74
25-06-2017, 10:34 PM
That's "reality" is it? I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about.
Uber users and supporters remind me of smokers. The facts from people who do actually know what they're talking about are there but you don't want to hear them. They tell you something bad about something you like and you don't want to know.
It's all about the short term. Bad things might be coming later (market domination, price hikes) but that's shoved to the side and the fingers are in the ear.
It then comes down to plain stubbornness and fooling yourself into believing that there will be no down sides but deep down you know you're being taken for a ****ing mug.
As Andy says, don't think, just spend.
I'm genuinely out now as you're all good posters and there's no point in falling out. You can all do what you like...and like I said I've no real agenda as I'll be out the cab game soon.
:aok:
I've honestly rarely seen so much pish spoken about business and customer behaviour.
I've honestly rarely seen so much pish spoken about business and customer behaviour.
Well that's my theory and I'm sticking to it. ;-)
Pretty Boy
09-07-2017, 09:32 AM
Just to drag this up again.
Was at the Braehead last night. Taxi out there was just over £14 whilst Uber quoted between £8 and £10. For the return leg the taxi we got was still £14 or thereabouts, Uber quoted between £35 and £50 due to high demand.
That's why I like black cabs, the service and pricing is consistent.
WhileTheChief..
09-07-2017, 08:15 PM
Interesting read.
I need to use taxis a lot just now for work and generally use black cabs instead of private hire. Airport runs mostly.
Question is, which one should I use? I want an app to book them instead of phoning. Any suggestions?
BroxburnHibee
09-07-2017, 08:19 PM
Interesting read.
I need to use taxis a lot just now for work and generally use black cabs instead of private hire.
Question is, which one should I use? I want an app to book them instead of phoning. Any suggestions?
Both City and Central have their own apps which work just like Uber.
A lot of people use the Gett app for black cabs as it is available in a lot of places in the UK which makes them more practical.
Central now have a relationship with Gett which means Gett has access to the Central drivers giving them a larger presence in this city.
WhileTheChief..
09-07-2017, 08:33 PM
Both City and Central have their own apps which work just like Uber.
A lot of people use the Gett app for black cabs as it is available in a lot of places in the UK which makes them more practical.
Central now have a relationship with Gett which means Gett has access to the Central drivers giving them a larger presence in this city.
Just got Gett. Thanks.
RyeSloan
09-07-2017, 11:07 PM
Both City and Central have their own apps which work just like Uber.
A lot of people use the Gett app for black cabs as it is available in a lot of places in the UK which makes them more practical.
Central now have a relationship with Gett which means Gett has access to the Central drivers giving them a larger presence in this city.
Does Central prioritise its own direct business (say via a call or their own app) first over that available via Gett?
Does Central prioritise its own direct business (say via a call or their own app) first over that available via Gett?
I think they do.
CapitalGreen
10-07-2017, 09:38 AM
One for the taxi drivers: When allocated a job via Gett, do you turn your light off or are you still available for on-street pick-ups before you reach the Gett customer?
lord bunberry
10-07-2017, 12:10 PM
One for the taxi drivers: When allocated a job via Gett, do you turn your light off or are you still available for on-street pick-ups before you reach the Gett customer?
You turn your light off and head straight to pick up the passenger. Occasionally I forget and I'll see someone stick their hand out, but I certainly wouldn't stop.
I've read a few people post about taxis driving past with their lights on, often this is the reason. Sometimes you just forget to put it off.
I used to use Hailo but that seems to have been taken over by myTaxi. Don't know gett.
It's all a bit confusing. I wonder who is behind these companies.
johnbc70
14-07-2017, 07:37 PM
Had my first bad experience with Uber today. I ordered one to take me home, was not a huge journey maybe a few miles but I needed to meet the wife and kids quickly and the bus was 20 mins away. So I ordered the car and the app said it was 8 mins away, I tracked the car all the way to where I was and got the app notifcation saying he was just arriving. A few seconds later I get a message saying the driver has cancelled and I needed to order a new car, which was another 10 minute wait.
I do like Uber but if that becomes a regular occurence I can quickly see me going off it. Very annoying!
Had my first bad experience with Uber today. I ordered one to take me home, was not a huge journey maybe a few miles but I needed to meet the wife and kids quickly and the bus was 20 mins away. So I ordered the car and the app said it was 8 mins away, I tracked the car all the way to where I was and got the app notifcation saying he was just arriving. A few seconds later I get a message saying the driver has cancelled and I needed to order a new car, which was another 10 minute wait.
I do like Uber but if that becomes a regular occurence I can quickly see me going off it. Very annoying!
Same happened to a group of us in London in December, watched the app showing the driver going round in circles, looked like they couldn't find the entrance to the hotel, so cancelled the job.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 07:32 AM
Same happened to a group of us in London in December, watched the app showing the driver going round in circles, looked like they couldn't find the entrance to the hotel, so cancelled the job.
Do you get charged if they cancel the job? I picked a group of students up recently and I heard them complaining that their uber hadn't shown up, but they were being charged the fare. I got the impression that they might have been accusing the driver of saying he had been at there house and they hadn't came out. Either way they were being charged for the ride they didn't get.
Speedy
15-07-2017, 07:55 AM
Do you get charged if they cancel the job? I picked a group of students up recently and I heard them complaining that their uber hadn't shown up, but they were being charged the fare. I got the impression that they might have been accusing the driver of saying he had been at there house and they hadn't came out. Either way they were being charged for the ride they didn't get.
I had a driver phone me asking me to cancel because he was too far away, I did and was charged a cancellation fee.
I appealed it and got the credit back but still naughty.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 08:07 AM
I had a driver phone me asking me to cancel because he was too far away, I did and was charged a cancellation fee.
I appealed it and got the credit back but still naughty.
Maybe it was a cancellation fee they were charged then.
johnbc70
15-07-2017, 09:23 AM
Do you get charged if they cancel the job? I picked a group of students up recently and I heard them complaining that their uber hadn't shown up, but they were being charged the fare. I got the impression that they might have been accusing the driver of saying he had been at there house and they hadn't came out. Either way they were being charged for the ride they didn't get.
I never got charged and I believe if the driver cancels there should be no charge. The fare estimate was £3-4 so I am pretty sure he got a better offer and cancelled.
Do you get charged if they cancel the job? I picked a group of students up recently and I heard them complaining that their uber hadn't shown up, but they were being charged the fare. I got the impression that they might have been accusing the driver of saying he had been at there house and they hadn't came out. Either way they were being charged for the ride they didn't get.
I'm not sure tbh mate, it wasn't me who had booked it.
i can say, in a side note, the previous evening we'd booked an uber to get to the 'do' we were down for, which meant travelling in rush hour traffic. The quote was something like £12-£14 for the 5 and a half mile trip, but it took about 50 minutes due to sheer congestion. After the first 15 minutes or so, the driver started taking all sorts of risks, and driving agressively and at points maniacally, which I put down to the fact that the longer he was with us, the more jobs he was missing out on, and wasn't going to be getting anything more than the quoted price.
The return trip to the hotel, in much quieter road conditions, was very good though, different car and driver (still uber), much more relaxed and chatty.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 10:08 AM
I'm not sure tbh mate, it wasn't me who had booked it.
i can say, in a side note, the previous evening we'd booked an uber to get to the 'do' we were down for, which meant travelling in rush hour traffic. The quote was something like £12-£14 for the 5 and a half mile trip, but it took about 50 minutes due to sheer congestion. After the first 15 minutes or so, the driver started taking all sorts of risks, and driving agressively and at points maniacally, which I put down to the fact that the longer he was with us, the more jobs he was missing out on, and wasn't going to be getting anything more than the quoted price.
The return trip to the hotel, in much quieter road conditions, was very good though, different car and driver (still uber), much more relaxed and chatty.
I've done a few fixed fare jobs over the years and I found it extremely frustrating when the traffic was busy. During the tram works it was ridiculous. Jobs that would normally take 5 minutes were taking 30 mins and I was still paid the same amount. Thankfully in my position those jobs were few and far between.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 10:10 AM
I never got charged and I believe if the driver cancels there should be no charge. The fare estimate was £3-4 so I am pretty sure he got a better offer and cancelled.
I didn't think they were allowed to do that. When I worked with city cabs we certainly weren't allowed to do that.
I didn't think they were allowed to do that. When I worked with city cabs we certainly weren't allowed to do that.
Drivers phoning passengers to tell them they are cancelling their job because they are too far away? WTF is that all about?
As for the cancellation charge, I believe if the driver is there for something like 5 minutes, he can cancel the job if the passenger doesn't show up. If it's a rubbish job that's less than a fiver then a cancellation is better for them so they either hide from view then cancel or drive about then cancel, hoping the passenger either accepts it or doesn't complain.
I never knew that any refunds were in the form of Uber credits. That's erm, good of them.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 02:58 PM
Drivers phoning passengers to tell them they are cancelling their job because they are too far away? WTF is that all about?
As for the cancellation charge, I believe if the driver is there for something like 5 minutes, he can cancel the job if the passenger doesn't show up. If it's a rubbish job that's less than a fiver then a cancellation is better for them so they either hide from view then cancel or drive about then cancel, hoping the passenger either accepts it or doesn't complain.
I never knew that any refunds were in the form of Uber credits. That's erm, good of them.
I'd tell them what to do with their credits.
Killiehibbie
15-07-2017, 03:56 PM
Do Uber drivers get to charge waiting time? I used to get some very irate passengers when their fiver journey cost them a lot more because they took ages to come out after they knew I was there.
johnbc70
15-07-2017, 06:58 PM
I complained to Uber and got told action would be taken, whatever that means. Gave the guy 1 star feedback as well.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 07:18 PM
I complained to Uber and got told action would be taken, whatever that means. Gave the guy 1 star feedback as well.
I don't think he would've had a better offer, as once he's been sent a job he wouldn't be sent another until the original job was completed. It seems more likely that he's just not fancied doing it.
BroxburnHibee
15-07-2017, 07:27 PM
I don't think he would've had a better offer, as once he's been sent a job he wouldn't be sent another until the original job was completed. It seems more likely that he's just not fancied doing it.
Or he's picked up on the street.
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 07:48 PM
Or he's picked up on the street.
Aye well there's always that possibility
CapitalGreen
15-07-2017, 09:21 PM
Or he's picked up on the street.
How can an Uber pick up on the street?
lord bunberry
15-07-2017, 11:12 PM
How can an Uber pick up on the street?
By turning up outside a bar on Saturday night and agreeing to take one of the many people looking to get home. They have private hire plates on their vehicles and most people will realise that they can jump in and be taken home. They just agree a price and they'll take you. You see it all the time at the train station when it's busy.
pacoluna
22-09-2017, 10:37 AM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41358640
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41358640
Good. Well done Sadiq.
lord bunberry
22-09-2017, 09:35 PM
Good. Well done Sadiq.
Seconded my friend
stoneyburn hibs
23-09-2017, 12:32 AM
Seconded my friend
Competition for the consumer is surely more healthy?
lord bunberry
23-09-2017, 07:44 AM
Competition for the consumer is surely more healthy?
Only if that competition is playing by the same rules.
lyonhibs
23-09-2017, 01:30 PM
Thirded. Once their hierarchy isn't a bunch of sexist pigs and they accord their FTE the right benefits and protections that that status should get then they can come back.
Also enjoyed the outcry from my perfectly well to do London mates wailing about the removal of Uber like someone had just disconnected their leccy, gas and mains water.
If only there was some other high density, mass transit network(s) in London. Can't think of any alternatives to Uber tbh.......
Hibbyradge
23-09-2017, 01:54 PM
Only if that competition is playing by the same rules.
Ryanair doesn't play by the same rules as British Airways.
Hibrandenburg
23-09-2017, 05:16 PM
Ryanair doesn't play by the same rules as British Airways.
And they're paying for it now.
lord bunberry
23-09-2017, 05:18 PM
Ryanair doesn't play by the same rules as British Airways.
They have to adhere to industry standards and rules though.
They have to adhere to industry standards and rules though.
Bare minimum effort. They’re abusing people with limited incomes.
Ryanair doesn't play by the same rules as British Airways.
Different countries different rules within the overall aviation rules.
It's also a different business model.
heretoday
24-09-2017, 08:19 AM
Anything that undercuts the disgraceful black cabs is OK. What a ridiculous price!
And you're expected to tip the surly b******* too!
danhibees1875
24-09-2017, 08:54 AM
Do any of our taxi ITK folk know why there is a 5% charge to use card?
I've only ever experienced a card charge at very small shops that I can remember.
lord bunberry
24-09-2017, 09:26 AM
Do any of our taxi ITK folk know why there is a 5% charge to use card?
I've only ever experienced a card charge at very small shops that I can remember.
To take card payments you need to have a merchant bank account or rent/buy a card machine. It's not possible for a sole trader like a taxi driver to get a merchant bank account, so we have to get a card machine from one of the online companies. PayPal and izettlle do the small card readers and other companies do chip and pin machines. It's these companies that take the 5%, not the taxi driver.
I believe the law is changing next year, and charging people to use their card is to be abolished.
danhibees1875
24-09-2017, 09:36 AM
To take card payments you need to have a merchant bank account or rent/buy a card machine. It's not possible for a sole trader like a taxi driver to get a merchant bank account, so we have to get a card machine from one of the online companies. PayPal and izettlle do the small card readers and other companies do chip and pin machines. It's these companies that take the 5%, not the taxi driver.
I believe the law is changing next year, and charging people to use their card is to be abolished.
:aok: thanks!
Competition for the consumer is surely more healthy?
Not when it relies on exploitation.
steakbake
25-09-2017, 02:44 AM
Not when it relies on exploitation.
What a bunch of free enterprise, consumerist Thatcher's children we've all become.
When it comes to workers rights, as long as we've got our own...
SouthsideHarp_Bhoy
25-09-2017, 05:18 AM
Quite surprised at this, but pleasantly so.
I know market disruption and innovation are good generally, but too many of these tech firms seem to be inhibating grey areas between laws and regulations and exploiting that position which shouldnt be allowed.
Well dont sadiq khan and TFL for standing up to them.
One Day Soon
25-09-2017, 08:15 AM
This seems to be as much about the failure of government and regulatory bodies - at various levels - to adapt to the digital age as it does anything else.
Google, Amazon and Uber have a lot in common. Spawned with disruptive technology, creating new marketplaces rather than invading or transforming existing ones and largely effectively unregulated.
I'm in favour of proper regulation for the consumer and against ripping the pi5h to rig markets for vested interests whether that interest is Uber black cabs or any other kind of operator. What a fu**ing centrist eh?
I see the PR machine is in full flow, helped by our impartial friends at the BBC. "How safe will women be" they ask in an article where several millennials are moaning about how they'll be stranded at night. Maybe they should just do what everyone else did before Uber came along...pay for a mode of transport that doesn't rely on exploitation or subsidies from hedge funds.
I see their cuddly new CEO has been all apologetic (while basically threatening TFL with court) and is begging for talks. He'll probably get them and I wonder if money will indeed talk.
I can't help feel that this is all a red herring though as the more important case, regarding driver status, will be seen this week. If Uber lose that then the PR battle won't be as easy for them as it is this time.
CapitalGreen
26-09-2017, 09:52 AM
I hope they take the decision on the chin, pack up and head back to the US of A. Please leave Brtain to our good old honest cabbies. I tell you, they'll think twice about messing with our Princes in Black Armour again.
lord bunberry
26-09-2017, 11:52 AM
I see the PR machine is in full flow, helped by our impartial friends at the BBC. "How safe will women be" they ask in an article where several millennials are moaning about how they'll be stranded at night. Maybe they should just do what everyone else did before Uber came along...pay for a mode of transport that doesn't rely on exploitation or subsidies from hedge funds.
I see their cuddly new CEO has been all apologetic (while basically threatening TFL with court) and is begging for talks. He'll probably get them and I wonder if money will indeed talk.
I can't help feel that this is all a red herring though as the more important case, regarding driver status, will be seen this week. If Uber lose that then the PR battle won't be as easy for them as it is this time.
The nonsense that's been spouted since this was announced has been unbelievable. Their license has been refused due to the way they operate, this includes public safety issues. I agree 100% about this being a bit of a red herring, the general consensus is that Uber will be successful in their appeal.
The other court case is the one that will have far more wide reaching consequences for Uber and many other companies that operate a similar style of business.
On a personal note, I don't really care if Uber are banned from operating as someone else will come in and fill the void. Hopefully either Uber will start playing by the rules, or their replacement will. They've been around for long enough now, and it's had zero effect on me or any other taxi drivers I know.
Its the private hire guys who are suffering from this.
The nonsense that's been spouted since this was announced has been unbelievable. Their license has been refused due to the way they operate, this includes public safety issues. I agree 100% about this being a bit of a red herring, the general consensus is that Uber will be successful in their appeal.
The other court case is the one that will have far more wide reaching consequences for Uber and many other companies that operate a similar style of business.
On a personal note, I don't really care if Uber are banned from operating as someone else will come in and fill the void. Hopefully either Uber will start playing by the rules, or their replacement will. They've been around for long enough now, and it's had zero effect on me or any other taxi drivers I know.
Its the private hire guys who are suffering from this.
There could be big changes in the private hire car business...I see drivers for Addison Lee have won their case to be classed as workers instead of self employed. It weakens Ubers argument that their drivers should remain "self employed" as they're no different to any other minicab firm.
A solution would be minicabs with drivers who are treated as workers alongside a black cab trade who really are self employed. Their drivers would have the security that things like an hourly rate brings, while the firms wouldn't be able to undercut so aggressively.
They could even work with local authorities, in the way bus companies do, to create an efficient transport system. However, I can't see Uber buying into that as they are about brutal capitalism and profit, not transport.
cabbageandribs1875
21-11-2017, 09:54 PM
glad i've never used them....and now i never will even if ransom was paid
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-42075306
Uber concealed a hack that affected 57 million customers and drivers, the company has confirmed.
The 2016 breach was hidden by the ride-sharing firm which paid hackers $100,000 (£75,000) to delete the data.
Killiehibbie
19-02-2021, 10:05 AM
Supreme Court rules that their drivers are not contractors but are employees. Will they make a strategic withdrawal? Parcel companies hopefully next.
Will be interesting to see what happens with that - I can't see them paying £9 an hour to hundreds of drivers to sit in a car when it's quiet....
patch1875
19-02-2021, 12:19 PM
They have stated that it only applies to the drivers involved it’s as you were for the current drivers.
The terms have changed since then.
Hibbyradge
19-02-2021, 12:21 PM
Will be interesting to see what happens with that - I can't see them paying £9 an hour to hundreds of drivers to sit in a car when it's quiet....
I doubt it will affect their pay rates. The drivers' income will average out at much higher than minimum wage.
I doubt it will affect their pay rates. The drivers' income will average out at much higher than minimum wage.
Do you reckon the ruling does not change much for Uber?
Killiehibbie
19-02-2021, 12:29 PM
I doubt it will affect their pay rates. The drivers' income will average out at much higher than minimum wage.
Not once running costs are accounted for.
CropleyWasGod
19-02-2021, 12:31 PM
I doubt it will affect their pay rates. The drivers' income will average out at much higher than minimum wage.
Do you reckon the ruling does not change much for Uber?
You're maybe right about the drivers as they are at the moment, but it's about more than that for Uber. Employers' NI, pension contributions, holiday pay, sick pay. They will all mount up, and they may try to force the hourly rate down.
Edit. There's also VAT to be considered now. HMRC reportedly hit them with a £1.5b (billion) assessment recently. https://goodlawproject.org/update/hmrc-to-collect-1-5bn-uber/
patch1875
19-02-2021, 12:34 PM
I doubt it will affect their pay rates. The drivers' income will average out at much higher than minimum wage.
It’s close just now but in normal times it’s well above.
Hibbyradge
19-02-2021, 01:33 PM
Not once running costs are accounted for.
That won't affect Uber though.
Hibbyradge
19-02-2021, 01:35 PM
Do you reckon the ruling does not change much for Uber?
As Cropley points out, a lot will change, but I doubt the pay rates will be affected.
Pretty Boy
19-02-2021, 03:37 PM
Hopefully this sees the end of jobs being falsely advertised as self employed when they are nothing of the sort.
Northernhibee
19-02-2021, 03:42 PM
Hopefully this sees the end of jobs being falsely advertised as self employed when they are nothing of the sort.
There was a petrol station in Aberdeen looking for cashiers to work there on a self employed basis when I lived up there. Staggering how that would be allowed.
CropleyWasGod
19-02-2021, 04:14 PM
There was a petrol station in Aberdeen looking for cashiers to work there on a self employed basis when I lived up there. Staggering how that would be allowed.
That's illegal as well as immoral.
patch1875
19-02-2021, 04:14 PM
It’s a big can of worms to open many people like the flexibility of the gig economy as it can revolve around your own life choices.
I drive for Uber but only for a few months of the year the flexibility for me is why I do it I can switch off for months and then start again with no issues or dip in and out when I want.
In normal times I’m happy with the money I can earn.
CropleyWasGod
19-02-2021, 04:19 PM
It’s a big can of worms to open many people like the flexibility of the gig economy as it can revolve around your own life choices.
I drive for Uber but only for a few months of the year the flexibility for me is why I do it I can switch off for months and then start again with no issues or dip in and out when I want.
In normal times I’m happy with the money I can earn.
Yep, that's the other side of it.
My son works for Deliveroo, and he loves the flexibility of it. His comment this morning, after hearing the Uber decision, was along the lines of "I don't want to be employed. If I get offered a delivery on the other side of town, I don't need to take it. I can earn a lot more by doing a few jobs at this side of town in the same time. I don't want Deliveroo telling me what jobs I have to take."
I can understand the needs of those who want the regular hours and wage, but not everyone wants that.
Killiehibbie
19-02-2021, 09:58 PM
That won't affect Uber though.
The way I see it is drivers should be making a wage once all
running costs are paid
Hibbyradge
19-02-2021, 11:23 PM
The way I see it is drivers should be making a wage once all
running costs are paid
Which costs though?
Every driver pays a different amount for their car, their fuel, insurance, repairs and general maintenance etc.
There's no way a company can account for that, is there? :dunno:
RyeSloan
19-02-2021, 11:39 PM
The way I see it is drivers should be making a wage once all
running costs are paid
I’m sure they probably do or otherwise they would do something else!
It’s a bit of a minefield with the accusations of exploration on one side and claims of freedom and flexibility on the other.
Killiehibbie
20-02-2021, 07:40 AM
[QUOTE=RyeSloan;6470741]I’m sure they probably do or otherwise they would do something else!
It’s a bit of a minefield with the accusations of exploration on one side and claims of freedom and flexibility on the other.[/QUOTE
Most of them realise once they've got a clapped out car that needs replaced that they've not made nearly as much as they thought. Have a read of some of the comments on Quora from former drivers.
It suits guys who want to earn pocket money on a Saturday night but not as a full time job.
Killiehibbie
20-02-2021, 07:58 AM
Which costs though?
Every driver pays a different amount for their car, their fuel, insurance, repairs and general maintenance etc.
There's no way a company can account for that, is there? :dunno:
It's now up to them to make sure their employees earn at least the minimum wage.
Let them run a fleet of cars and see the costs involved
Hibbyradge
20-02-2021, 09:53 AM
Are taxi drivers employees?
CropleyWasGod
20-02-2021, 10:07 AM
Are taxi drivers employees?
The black cab and PHC drivers are almost all self employed in Scotland.
RyeSloan
20-02-2021, 10:27 AM
[QUOTE=RyeSloan;6470741]I’m sure they probably do or otherwise they would do something else!
It’s a bit of a minefield with the accusations of exploration on one side and claims of freedom and flexibility on the other.[/QUOTE
Most of them realise once they've got a clapped out car that needs replaced that they've not made nearly as much as they thought. Have a read of some of the comments on Quora from former drivers.
It suits guys who want to earn pocket money on a Saturday night but not as a full time job.
Yeah I get all that....yet still there is plenty people driving for Uber.
I think, like almost any type of job or business where you need a car or van or use consumables or whatever, people tend to make less than they think at the start as they take the headline earnings and underestimate the costs.
But as I said it’s a total minefield this one so I’ve not got much else to say on it I suppose [emoji2957]
lord bunberry
20-02-2021, 10:54 AM
[QUOTE=RyeSloan;6470741]I’m sure they probably do or otherwise they would do something else!
It’s a bit of a minefield with the accusations of exploration on one side and claims of freedom and flexibility on the other.[/QUOTE
Most of them realise once they've got a clapped out car that needs replaced that they've not made nearly as much as they thought. Have a read of some of the comments on Quora from former drivers.
It suits guys who want to earn pocket money on a Saturday night but not as a full time job.
That last part is correct. I k ow a few guys that do it full time and they work ridiculous hours for little money. There’s periods in the year when they make good money, but it’s not enough to balance itself out over the year. If they’ve invested money into a new vehicle it’s difficult to walk away. As you say it’s great if you’ve already got a car and you want to earn a few quid on the side.
Hibbyradge
20-02-2021, 02:24 PM
The black cab and PHC drivers are almost all self employed in Scotland.
So why are Uber drivers employees? As you can deduce, I've not been following this story.
CropleyWasGod
20-02-2021, 02:51 PM
So why are Uber drivers employees? As you can deduce, I've not been following this story.
There's a decent summary here:-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56123668
This is a key statement:- Looking at these and other factors, the court determined that drivers were in a position of subordination to Uber
In essence, Uber are in control; they are who the passenger has the contract with. Uber set the prices, and vary them at will.
In the black cab situation, each driver is a separate entity, and the passenger has the contract with them. The prices are set by a 3rd party, and don't vary.
patch1875
20-02-2021, 04:45 PM
Uber use a time and distance fare just like any other cab/phc.
They have changed to a fix fare recently but that is mostly working in the drivers favour I think they also have surge pricing when demand goes up but again that is a benefit because Uber take the same percentage whatever the fare.
patch1875
20-02-2021, 04:47 PM
Uber are essentially a middle man the contract is between driver and passenger.
CropleyWasGod
20-02-2021, 04:56 PM
Interesting PS to this:-
As for Uber, Rachel Mathieson, senior associate at Bates Wells, which represented Mr Farrar and Mr Aslam, said her firm's position was that the ruling applies to all 90,000 drivers who have been active with Uber since and including 2016.
"Our position is that the ruling applies to all of their drivers at large," she said.
Dr Alex Wood, an Internet Institute research associate on gig economy at Oxford University, disagrees.
He told the BBC that because the UK doesn't have a labour inspectorate, these "rules aren't enforced and it falls to workers to bring subsequent tribunals".
This means that "in reality, it's very easy for Uber to just ignore this until more tribunals come for the remaining 40,000 [drivers]".
lord bunberry
21-02-2021, 02:00 PM
Is one of the issues that Uber drivers can only do work from Uber? It’s the same with deliveroo and other similar companies. Obviously that’s a bit different from black cabs as they can pick up from the street and find their own work.
patch1875
21-02-2021, 02:55 PM
Is one of the issues that Uber drivers can only do work from Uber? It’s the same with deliveroo and other similar companies. Obviously that’s a bit different from black cabs as they can pick up from the street and find their own work.
Never seen anything to say you can’t. Sure some london drivers will be doing bolt, ola etc. Up here I know a few who were doing the 555’s well but think it was them that were stopping it and not Uber.
Just filled in a survey from Uber regarding all this and what you want as a driver I wonder if they will give you the option of either but just can’t see how being an employee works regarding the car and it’s cost.
I signed a new contact with Uber recently and they always have you agreeing you are working as an independent contractor and your excepting the condition they operate under.
Some may say you have no choice but sign them but Uber are not forcing you to drive for them.
CropleyWasGod
21-02-2021, 03:10 PM
Is one of the issues that Uber drivers can only do work from Uber? It’s the same with deliveroo and other similar companies. Obviously that’s a bit different from black cabs as they can pick up from the street and find their own work.
Deliveroo bikers can work for others. That's one of the central planks of self employment.
If Uber drivers were prevented from working for others, HMRC would have been on their backs a long time ago.
Killiehibbie
21-02-2021, 03:47 PM
Is the difference that the passenger pays them and not the driver?
No flexibility was the central argument against the parcel companies in that they dictated your whole working week and you weren't an independent contractor.
CropleyWasGod
21-02-2021, 04:07 PM
Is the difference that the passenger pays them and not the driver?
No flexibility was the central argument against the parcel companies in that they dictated your whole working week and you weren't an independent contractor.
Trying to understand the judgement, that is part of it. That word "subordination" that I used earlier is significant.
As I'm understanding it, Uber are being held as the "principal", who set the fares themselves, collect the money and pay the driver their share on terms that Uber determine. In a black cab situation, the driver is the principal; s/he collects the fares and pays Central/City/whoever a monthly flat monthly fee for the radio dues.
I regularly mark exam questions on this stuff, from a tax point of view rather than labour rights, although the issues are often the same. One of the factors is, as you say, who determines your hours; the parcel company situation, as you describe it, would definitely be employment. The Uber thing is still, for me, up in the air employment/self employment wise from a tax point of view, but I'm sure HMRC are sharpening their pencils.
CapitalGreen
21-02-2021, 04:25 PM
Is one of the issues that Uber drivers can only do work from Uber? It’s the same with deliveroo and other similar companies. Obviously that’s a bit different from black cabs as they can pick up from the street and find their own work.
In the states nearly all the drivers I used were working for both Uber and Lyft so they certainly could work for others there.
wookie70
21-02-2021, 04:33 PM
In the states nearly all the drivers I used were working for both Uber and Lyft so they certainly could work for others there.
One of the drivers interviewed said he worked for 4 companies and switched off 3 apps when he got a job for the fourth. Uber etc make a fortune for doing very little as far as I am concerned and anything that makes it better for drivers is good news. The gig economy may make sense and be welcome for people that want a gig but I suspect most want a proper job with good conditions, security and protection.
I might look into a wee part time roll with Uber as I have a good condition large estate and do very little on weekend evenings.
lord bunberry
21-02-2021, 06:04 PM
One of the drivers interviewed said he worked for 4 companies and switched off 3 apps when he got a job for the fourth. Uber etc make a fortune for doing very little as far as I am concerned and anything that makes it better for drivers is good news. The gig economy may make sense and be welcome for people that want a gig but I suspect most want a proper job with good conditions, security and protection.
I might look into a wee part time roll with Uber as I have a good condition large estate and do very little on weekend evenings.
Has it got a euro 6 engine?
lord bunberry
21-02-2021, 06:05 PM
Never seen anything to say you can’t. Sure some london drivers will be doing bolt, ola etc. Up here I know a few who were doing the 555’s well but think it was them that were stopping it and not Uber.
Just filled in a survey from Uber regarding all this and what you want as a driver I wonder if they will give you the option of either but just can’t see how being an employee works regarding the car and it’s cost.
I signed a new contact with Uber recently and they always have you agreeing you are working as an independent contractor and your excepting the condition they operate under.
Some may say you have no choice but sign them but Uber are not forcing you to drive for them.
Cheers.
patch1875
21-02-2021, 06:40 PM
One of the drivers interviewed said he worked for 4 companies and switched off 3 apps when he got a job for the fourth. Uber etc make a fortune for doing very little as far as I am concerned and anything that makes it better for drivers is good news. The gig economy may make sense and be welcome for people that want a gig but I suspect most want a proper job with good conditions, security and protection.
I might look into a wee part time roll with Uber as I have a good condition large estate and do very little on weekend evenings.
It’s taking up to a year currently to get a new car plated.
You also need a apply for a PH drivers licence which will probably take as long.
Also Uber are not take any drivers on but sure that will change once the pandemic is over.
Smartie
22-02-2021, 06:13 AM
One of the drivers interviewed said he worked for 4 companies and switched off 3 apps when he got a job for the fourth. Uber etc make a fortune for doing very little as far as I am concerned and anything that makes it better for drivers is good news. The gig economy may make sense and be welcome for people that want a gig but I suspect most want a proper job with good conditions, security and protection.
I might look into a wee part time roll with Uber as I have a good condition large estate and do very little on weekend evenings.
Is it not true that Uber make very little indeed?
Are they not one of these rapidly expanding, hugely disruptive companies that manages to do so without making much of a profit?
Or did I mishear that at some point?
CropleyWasGod
22-02-2021, 07:16 AM
Is it not true that Uber make very little indeed?
Are they not one of these rapidly expanding, hugely disruptive companies that manages to do so without making much of a profit?
Or did I mishear that at some point?
A quick look round says that it makes a profit in the UK, but losses worldwide.
Speedy
22-02-2021, 08:27 AM
Is it not true that Uber make very little indeed?
Are they not one of these rapidly expanding, hugely disruptive companies that manages to do so without making much of a profit?
Or did I mishear that at some point?
It makes a huge loss. Not sure how that breaks down between today's BAU activities and investment/research for the future. Long term they'll be setting up for driverless cars.
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