PDA

View Full Version : Jamie Insall - Failed Drugs Test



Heisenberg
23-04-2017, 01:45 PM
Scotsman article from today;

Hibs striker Jamie Insall has failed a drugs test.

Insall, who is currently on loan at East Fife, tested positive after a match against Livingston on March 11.

The UK Anti-Doping (UKAD) has reportedly informed the League One outfit, who passed on the news to his parent club.

Insall joined Hibs in summer 2015 and is contracted with the club until 2018. Should UKAD uphold the findings, Insall could face a lengthy ban. According to a Sunday newspaper report, the player is contesting the result - claiming he had taken cold medication earlier that day. Insall, who has not made a competitive first-team appearance at Hibs, has scored 14 times in 50 games for East Fife. Hibs have declined to comment.

Read more at: http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/hibs-striker-jamie-insall-fails-drugs-test-1-4427161

Billy Whizz
23-04-2017, 01:50 PM
I wondered why he hadn't been involved with East Fire in the last 5/6 weeks or so

makaveli1875
23-04-2017, 01:54 PM
barry lavety the 2nd :greengrin

Keyser Sauzee
23-04-2017, 02:00 PM
Started a thread the other week about this but it was deleted for some reason 🤔

hibee_girl
23-04-2017, 02:01 PM
Started a thread the other week about this but it was deleted for some reason 🤔

Because it was just a rumour at that stage

Keyser Sauzee
23-04-2017, 02:02 PM
It actually wasn't, it was fact and has been proven so

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:03 PM
Stupis stupid laddie. Possibly just blown his big break and chance to be a proffessional footballer.

Stubbs took a big chance on him, raised a few eyebrows at the time but he's had a decent couple of seasons at East Fife. I don't think he was ever going to make it at hibs anyway, especially since Stubbs left but he potentially could have gotten a contract with a lower league club.

He's blown his chance at a career away but he has only himself to blame if he's been taking stuff. Very silly indeed.

hibee_girl
23-04-2017, 02:04 PM
It actually wasn't, it was fact and has been proven so

Maybe so but we have to be careful with what is said on here. I'm sure you understand.

Keyser Sauzee
23-04-2017, 02:04 PM
Maybe so but we have to be careful with what is said on here. I'm sure you understand.

No worries just didn't know why at the time 👍🏼

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 02:06 PM
What has he tested positive for?

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:07 PM
What has he tested positive for?

Cocaine i'm sure was reported in the original thread on this but i'm not sure if thats just a rumour or not.

Unseen work
23-04-2017, 02:11 PM
A lot of young men would give everything to be given the chance he was, and he has chucked it all away.

I'm a year younger than him and I cannot put into words what I would give to have that opportunity.

Absolute disgrace.

northstandhibby
23-04-2017, 02:15 PM
Should perhaps hold off from judging the lad until any allegations have been proven, the lad's disputing the findings and deserves the opportunity to be heard.

glory glory

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:16 PM
A lot of young men would give everything to be given the chance he was, and he has chucked it all away.

I'm a year younger than him and I cannot put into words what I would give to have that opportunity.

Absolute disgrace.

Exactly. Got the chance to live out his dream of playing football for a living and he's chucked it. Bizarre signign but clearly Stubbs saw something that could be nurtured into a player over the course of a few years. Hes attracted attention to himself due to being leagues top scorer so even if he didn't cut it at hibs i'm pretty sure he would have been offered something elsewhere.

No excuse for drug taking though and i hope he realises just how stupid he's been. The club will quite rightly come down very hard on him.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 02:21 PM
barry lavety the 2nd :greengrin

I remember his first game with us, which Im sure was against hearts at tyncastle, where he was a sub and warming up infront of the Hibs fans. We started belting out theres only one barry lavety, he puts the ball in the netty to the tune of the celtic song for Jorge Cadete which made him beam with pride. The following lines, however, were he takes the E's, and scores with ease which promptly turned his face sour and he ran to the other side lookin a little unimpressed. Good times :thumbsup:

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:21 PM
Should perhaps hold off from judging the lad until any allegations have been proven, the lad's disputing the findings and deserves the opportunity to be heard.

glory glory

Fair point and I totally agree but IF (and its a big IF because your right, nothing has been proved or disproved yet as far as we're concerned) it is something like cocaine then there really is no defence, he knows what it is, he knows its illegal not only in the game but legally as well. It's not like he can claim he didn't know it was a banned substance or he took something not realising it contained a banned substance.

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 02:23 PM
Fair point and I totally agree but IF (and its a big IF because your right, nothing has been proved or disproved yet as far as we're concerned) it is something like cocaine then there really is no defence, he knows what it is, he knows its illegal not only in the game but legally as well. It's not like he can claim he didn't know it was a banned substance or he took something not realising it contained a banned substance.

Personally I dont believe that any drugs should be illegal. And cocaine is not performance enhancing. Unless he was banging it at half time.

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:28 PM
Personally I dont believe that any drugs should be illegal. And cocaine is not performance enhancing. Unless he was banging it at half time.

Well whether you agree they should or should not be legal, its irrelevant, thats an argument for another day but the fact is that they are illagal and he knows fine well he shouldn't be taking it.

Diclonius
23-04-2017, 02:32 PM
Oot.

Scouse Hibee
23-04-2017, 02:34 PM
Personally I dont believe that any drugs should be illegal. And cocaine is not performance enhancing. Unless he was banging it at half time.

Wow! Would love to hear your reasoning for decriminalisation of drugs.

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 02:36 PM
Wow! Would love to hear your reasoning for decriminalisation of drugs.

Harm reduction.
Anyway on Insall, if he was any good I would say help him through it. But hes not good enough anyway so agree lets empty him.

Allant1981
23-04-2017, 02:38 PM
I remember his first game with us, which Im sure was against hearts at tyncastle, where he was a sub and warming up infront of the Hibs fans. We started belting out theres only one barry lavety, he puts the ball in the netty to the tune of the celtic song for Jorge Cadete which made him beam with pride. The following lines, however, were he takes the E's, and scores with ease which promptly turned his face sour and he ran to the other side lookin a little unimpressed. Good times :thumbsup:

was his first game not a cup game? one of the lower league teams? probably talking rubbish though


just checked and his first game was against brechin and he scored

northstandhibby
23-04-2017, 02:38 PM
Fair point and I totally agree but IF (and its a big IF because your right, nothing has been proved or disproved yet as far as we're concerned) it is something like cocaine then there really is no defence, he knows what it is, he knows its illegal not only in the game but legally as well. It's not like he can claim he didn't know it was a banned substance or he took something not realising it contained a banned substance.

Any footballer should know not to take cocaine and if proven they should face the appropriate consequences of possible ban etc, and be helped with any addiction/s. As you rightly agree we should hold off from prejudging until we know for sure if the lad is guilty of anything.

glory glory

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:39 PM
Harm reduction.
Anyway on Insall, if he was any good I would say help him through it. But hes not good enough anyway so agree lets empty him.

So basically if your a good player you wont be punished for drugs as harshly than a poor player for doing drugs. Hardly sends out the right message. Drugs are drugs regardless of how good a player you are and the club need to be consistant with their zero tolerance to them. Not say the club shouldn't offer him help but it can't be a sacking for one player and not another.

ColinNish
23-04-2017, 02:42 PM
Fair point and I totally agree but IF (and its a big IF because your right, nothing has been proved or disproved yet as far as we're concerned) it is something like cocaine then there really is no defence, he knows what it is, he knows its illegal not only in the game but legally as well. It's not like he can claim he didn't know it was a banned substance or he took something not realising it contained a banned substance.

Ever heard of innocent until proven guilty? Jeezo!!
Its a total rumour it was cocaine and the fact he's stating he took a cold medication kinda makes me think it was something else that came up on the test. Don't know many cold medications with Charlie in them!

Billy Whizz
23-04-2017, 02:42 PM
Maybe he needs some help, rather than throwing him out the door

Sir David Gray
23-04-2017, 02:43 PM
Such a shame to hear this.

He was given a massive opportunity when he signed for us and although it hasn't really worked out with Hibs, he had been playing regularly for East Fife up until the last couple of months and he had a decent if not spectacular goals record.

It looks like he might be finding himself without a club very soon if this gets upheld.

Dashing Bob S
23-04-2017, 02:44 PM
The boy would have been fine in Leith. It was moving to Fife that ruined him.

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 02:45 PM
So basically if your a good player you wont be punished for drugs as harshly than a poor player for doing drugs. Hardly sends out the right message. Drugs are drugs regardless of how good a player you are and the club need to be consistant with their zero tolerance to them. Not say the club shouldn't offer him help but it can't be a sacking for one player and not another.

Its full hypocritical I know. But the reality is if it was Mcginn we would all rally round him. But its Insall so we wont.

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:51 PM
Ever heard of innocent until proven guilty? Jeezo!!
Its a total rumour it was cocaine and the fact he's stating he took a cold medication kinda makes me think it was something else that came up on the test. Don't know many cold medications with Charlie in them!

Hense why i said IF. Not stating anything as fact and don't get me wrong I really do hope he is innocent and that he hasn't been so stupid as to chuck away his future as a footballer like this.

Sir David Gray
23-04-2017, 02:52 PM
So basically if your a good player you wont be punished for drugs as harshly than a poor player for doing drugs. Hardly sends out the right message. Drugs are drugs regardless of how good a player you are and the club need to be consistant with their zero tolerance to them. Not say the club shouldn't offer him help but it can't be a sacking for one player and not another.

Absolutely.

I would hope that Hibs would treat every player the same with regards to this type of thing, regardless of whether it's Jamie Insall or John McGinn.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 02:52 PM
was his first game not a cup game? one of the lower league teams? probably talking rubbish though


just checked and his first game was against brechin and he scored

Must have been the first game I saw him. Pretty sure BH Hibs, who posts on here, is a mate of his as they are both grew up together in Armadale.

Itsnoteasy
23-04-2017, 02:56 PM
I remember his first game with us, which Im sure was against hearts at tyncastle, where he was a sub and warming up infront of the Hibs fans. We started belting out theres only one barry lavety, he puts the ball in the netty to the tune of the celtic song for Jorge Cadete which made him beam with pride. The following lines, however, were he takes the E's, and scores with ease which promptly turned his face sour and he ran to the other side lookin a little unimpressed. Good times :thumbsup:

Remember it well.

IIRC it went like this

There's only 1 Barry Lavety
He puts the ball in the netty
Bashers his name
Rave is his game
And when he scores it's Hibees ecstasy.

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 02:57 PM
Its full hypocritical I know. But the reality is if it was Mcginn we would all rally round him. But its Insall so we wont.

True because you will always try and hang onto the important players and yes it would be much more of a sickner having to get rid of the likes of McGinn etc who is such a vital player to us compared to Insall who has never even properly played for us but nevertheless the club have to be consistant with all players. Drugs are drugs and no player should get special treatment over them.

Billy Whizz
23-04-2017, 02:59 PM
Must have been the first game I saw him. Pretty sure BH Hibs, who posts on here, is a mate of his as they are both grew up together in Armadale.

Thought Basher was from Paisley

Heisenberg
23-04-2017, 03:00 PM
I would punt him because he's clearly not good enough as a footballer. We're not a charity and shouldn't keep him on because he might have an issue with drugs. He can find himself some help for that elsewhere.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 03:06 PM
Thought Basher was from Paisley

Cool, I am clearly having a bit of a mare here. Was funny tho

lord bunberry
23-04-2017, 03:12 PM
So basically if your a good player you wont be punished for drugs as harshly than a poor player for doing drugs. Hardly sends out the right message. Drugs are drugs regardless of how good a player you are and the club need to be consistant with their zero tolerance to them. Not say the club shouldn't offer him help but it can't be a sacking for one player and not another.
If a player is considered an asset that could net the club millions, the club will take a completely different stance to a fringe player.
I've never understood why drugs like cocaine are considered to be performance enhancing. If a player is caught he should be dealt with by the law. He shouldn't be banned from football, it's not like he's cheating.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 03:14 PM
Thought Basher was from Paisley


Just remembered, it was Graham Love who is from Armadale, not Basher.

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 03:18 PM
If a player is considered an asset that could net the club millions, the club will take a completely different stance to a fringe player.
I've never understood why drugs like cocaine are considered to be performance enhancing. If a player is caught he should be dealt with by the law. He shouldn't be banned from football, it's not like he's cheating.

I totally get your point and I agree that it would be far worse having to sack/suspend an important player like McGinn for example than it would be for Insall but I still say that it can't be one rule for one player, one rule for another. Thats not fair and it also sends out the wrong message that if your a good enough player you can get away with wrong doings, if your not so good you'll be hammered.

If i did something wrong at my work and got the sack/suspended and another colleague did the same but never got sacked/suspended just because they were better at their job I would still think that was very unfair. Same crime but one person gets special treatment.

Allant1981
23-04-2017, 03:19 PM
Just remembered, it was Graham Love who is from Armadale, not Basher.

got there eventually😀

SON OF PADDY
23-04-2017, 03:21 PM
was his first game not a cup game? one of the lower league teams? probably talking rubbish though


just checked and his first game was against brechin and he scored


Yup it was my son's 7th birthday 13th August, doesn't time fly !
He's a big hairy bloke now

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 04:15 PM
got there eventually😀

Yup, I resorted to google at first as I knew it was Graham something, but couldnt get Graham Hunter out my head and every hibs related hit for him, as all respectable hibees will know, went along the lines of Hibs, Hibs, woohoowooooooo Hibs, Hibs

But yeah got there eventually.

blackpoolhibs
23-04-2017, 04:20 PM
Was Lavety's first game against Morton away, did he score the winner that night?:confused:


Memories poached after last nights boozefest.

Broken Gnome
23-04-2017, 04:25 PM
Was Lavety's first game against Morton away, did he score the winner that night?:confused:


Memories poached after last nights boozefest.

He was there for the relegation season - including goal against Hearts - but can't remember if he was signed for the play-off season previous to that.

Did score the winner at Morton though.

Allant1981
23-04-2017, 04:29 PM
Was Lavety's first game against Morton away, did he score the winner that night?:confused:


Memories poached after last nights boozefest.

brechin

Tamhere1875
23-04-2017, 04:32 PM
Word is he's no longer at Easter Road.

Michael
23-04-2017, 04:32 PM
I totally get your point and I agree that it would be far worse having to sack/suspend an important player like McGinn for example than it would be for Insall but I still say that it can't be one rule for one player, one rule for another. Thats not fair and it also sends out the wrong message that if your a good enough player you can get away with wrong doings, if your not so good you'll be hammered.

If i did something wrong at my work and got the sack/suspended and another colleague did the same but never got sacked/suspended just because they were better at their job I would still think that was very unfair. Same crime but one person gets special treatment.

Club (or company) just needs to act in its best interests (legally) in the case of wrong doing. It would be mental not to consider the individual's talent (except for really serious stuff obviously).

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 04:46 PM
brechin

Nah it was morton first game in the first division. Bizare that it was a midweek game. I was at scout camp and only found the score by hunting down a daily record the next day. Simpler times...

Pete
23-04-2017, 04:50 PM
Get rid.

Ryan69
23-04-2017, 04:51 PM
Wow! Would love to hear your reasoning for decriminalisation of drugs.

So it can be controlled?
Could even tax it too. Lol

Decriminalisation of cannabis in the Netherlands works.


Alcohol kills far more people than drug also.

Allant1981
23-04-2017, 04:54 PM
Nah it was morton first game in the first division. Bizare that it was a midweek game. I was at scout camp and only found the score by hunting down a daily record the next day. Simpler times...

nope was a 2 nil win at brechin 13th of august 1996, we were in the premier league when he signed

NORTHERNHIBBY
23-04-2017, 04:56 PM
Dissapointed if this is true. He said all the right stuff about having a shot at glory late on in his career but this seals his future I think.

Colr
23-04-2017, 05:09 PM
barry lavety the 2nd :greengrin

I don't think our Jamie will get into Bath University.

Northernhibee
23-04-2017, 05:09 PM
Daft, daft laddie.

oldbutdim
23-04-2017, 05:10 PM
The cocaine rumour sounds a bit unlikely if Insall is claiming a cold remedy is to blame.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 05:14 PM
The cocaine rumour sounds a bit unlikely if Insall is claiming a cold remedy is to blame.

Depends whether or not he gets his "cold remedies" from the same pharmacy as Lance Armstrong.

Sir David Gray
23-04-2017, 05:15 PM
The cocaine rumour sounds a bit unlikely if Insall is claiming a cold remedy is to blame.

He has played in Methil for the last couple of seasons, God knows what they put in their cold medicines up there.

Danderhall Hibs
23-04-2017, 05:16 PM
He has played in Methil for the last couple of seasons, God knows what they put in their cold medicines up there.

Meths?

hfc rd
23-04-2017, 05:23 PM
Silly boy if this is true. Has surely knackered his dream career now.

oldbutdim
23-04-2017, 05:27 PM
He has played in Methil for the last couple of seasons, God knows what they put in their cold medicines up there.

Or why he chose to snort it.

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 05:31 PM
Maybe he needs some help, rather than throwing him out the door


Billy, don't know what the rules are here in SFA land regards drug taking by players and making it public, but down South i'm sure the club is informed but they don't have to put it in the public domain for folk to know, I'm just wondering if this has been leaked by someone and gives Hibs the opportunity to either help him or get him out the door.

I'm_cabbaged
23-04-2017, 05:31 PM
Whatever it is they cannae be very good?

Waxy
23-04-2017, 05:32 PM
Askit fights the miseries.

cookin_on_gaz
23-04-2017, 05:33 PM
Billy, don't know what the rules are here in SFA land regards drug taking by players and making it public, but down South i'm sure the club is informed but they don't have to put it in the public domain for folk to know, I'm just wondering if this has been leaked by someone and gives Hibs the opportunity to either help him or get him out the door.

Was the OP's link not to the crime section of the evening news? If so it looks like someone has grassed him up.

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 05:37 PM
Its full hypocritical I know. But the reality is if it was Mcginn we would all rally round him. But its Insall so we wont.

That's nonsense.

I'm sure he has weight problems, so maybe taking something to shed a few stones/pounds.

If a player gets caught on match day after game for a drug test be assured he has been dabbling in it in the last 24/48 hours before the game.

neil7908
23-04-2017, 06:03 PM
Wow! Would love to hear your reasoning for decriminalisation of drugs.

1) Take income away from criminal gangs who cause untold pain and misery around the world
2) Boost tax revenues massively
3) Allow the police to focus their time and resources on violent offenders, rather than than those who take recreational drugs and do no harm to others
4) Use some of that increased tax revenue to improve treatment facilities rather than just sticking folk in prison
5) Better medical facilities to promote things like clean needle exchanges to stop the spread of terrible diseases like HIV

Sergey
23-04-2017, 06:27 PM
Insall has to watch what he says here as it could come back to bite him.

Firstly, he's failed either a urine or blood test and he can request for the B sample to be retested if he thinks he has a case. Unfortunately, UKAD will also now take a hair sample and this will be analysed. If for example he's tested positive for cocaine, there will be DNA in his hair and they can estimate with some degree of accuracy exactly when he took the drug and how often. They might also find other illegal substances that they didn't find with the urine/blood test.

He'll get a ban and the length will probably be determined as to his cooperation with the authorities. Alas the 'cold remedy' ruse wont wash.

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 06:34 PM
That's nonsense.

I'm sure he has weight problems, so maybe taking something to shed a few stones/pounds.

If a player gets caught on match day after game for a drug test be assured he has been dabbling in it in the last 24/48 hours before the game.

I know how drug tests work.
And its not nonsense. Its the truth. People are hypocrites. Its the way of the world.

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 06:35 PM
If a player is considered an asset that could net the club millions, the club will take a completely different stance to a fringe player.
I've never understood why drugs like cocaine are considered to be performance enhancing. If a player is caught he should be dealt with by the law. He shouldn't be banned from football, it's not like he's cheating.

Did Chelsea not get rid of a big name player for taking gear, I highly doubt you could say coke is a enhancing drug, even if you were taking it straight before a game, simple fact is it is a banned drug and if found in your system the player will know the risks if he gets caught, the law can do nothing about it, no legal expert here :greengrin but what could he be charged with, and your right it's not cheating to gain a advantage but it won't go down well with the club he's at, he works in a profession where taking drugs is a no no and if caught could ruin your career.

HibbyAndy
23-04-2017, 06:37 PM
Did Chelsea not get rid of a big name player for taking gear, I highly doubt you could say coke is a enhancing drug, even if you were taking it straight before a game, simple fact is it is a banned drug and if found in your system the player will know the risks if he gets caught, the law can do nothing about it, no legal expert here :greengrin but what could he be charged with, and your right it's not cheating to gain a advantage but it won't go down well with the club he's at, he works in a profession where taking drugs is a no no and if caught could ruin your career.

Adrian Mutu

Sergey
23-04-2017, 06:38 PM
Adrian Mutu


...and also Mark Bosnich the keeper.

Edit - wrong spelling

at last 61
23-04-2017, 06:44 PM
Come on now at this present time he is a hibs player so give him some slack until we know the facts all this talk about cocain just wait until the results either way he must be ####### himself

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 06:59 PM
Adrian Mutu


That's the one Andy.

Did he not sue Chelsea to get his contract paid out after Chelsea had terminated it ?

scoopyboy
23-04-2017, 07:11 PM
If it is to do with medication he has taken then it certainly isn't cocaine.

Cocaine isn't used in medication.

If he has tested positive for cocaine he's away IMHO.

lord bunberry
23-04-2017, 07:23 PM
Did Chelsea not get rid of a big name player for taking gear, I highly doubt you could say coke is a enhancing drug, even if you were taking it straight before a game, simple fact is it is a banned drug and if found in your system the player will know the risks if he gets caught, the law can do nothing about it, no legal expert here :greengrin but what could he be charged with, and your right it's not cheating to gain a advantage but it won't go down well with the club he's at, he works in a profession where taking drugs is a no no and if caught could ruin your career.

I just think that if a play takes something like cocaine the club has the right to terminate his contract. I don't see why the player should have to serve a ban from football if he hasn't done anything to gain an advantage.
What I'm saying is that the drugs on the banned list should be in 2 different categories. 1 should be performance enhancing and the other should be illegal substances. If you're caught taking performance enhancing drugs you're cheating. Taking recreational drugs is against the law, but it isn't cheating. They shouldn't be treated the same when handing out punishment.

Billychaotic182
23-04-2017, 07:23 PM
He has played in Methil for the last couple of seasons, God knows what they put in their cold medicines up there.

Hey watch what you are saying about my home town lol!! Not all hibees are from Edinburgh!

Saying that if it is coke he's taken then that's very disappointing. My mum is an east fife fan as was raving about him. Said he's excellent. Big blow for the fifers! They are pushing for the play offs

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 07:27 PM
I just think that if a play takes something like cocaine the club has the right to terminate his contract. I don't see why the player should have to serve a ban from football if he hasn't done anything to gain an advantage.
What I'm saying is that the drugs on the banned list should be in 2 different categories. 1 should be performance enhancing and the other should be illegal substances. If you're caught taking performance enhancing drugs you're cheating. Taking recreational drugs is against the law, but it isn't cheating. They shouldn't be treated the same when handing out punishment.

Completely agree. No idea why this is not the case.

Mantis Toboggan
23-04-2017, 07:28 PM
That's the one Andy.

Did he not sue Chelsea to get his contract paid out after Chelsea had terminated it ?

Yeah they sued him for millions and won. Dull yin!

21.05.2016
23-04-2017, 07:42 PM
If he really wanted to give his career a fighting chance he'd be staying away from **** like that anyway. He's a far cry away from being near our first team so you'd think he'd be doing everything in his power to keep himself as fit as possible and give himself a fighting chance.

Billy Whizz
23-04-2017, 08:09 PM
If it is to do with medication he has taken then it certainly isn't cocaine.

Cocaine isn't used in medication.

If he has tested positive for cocaine he's away IMHO.

It will be in their contracts

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 08:27 PM
I just think that if a play takes something like cocaine the club has the right to terminate his contract. I don't see why the player should have to serve a ban from football if he hasn't done anything to gain an advantage.
What I'm saying is that the drugs on the banned list should be in 2 different categories. 1 should be performance enhancing and the other should be illegal substances. If you're caught taking performance enhancing drugs you're cheating. Taking recreational drugs is against the law, but it isn't cheating. They shouldn't be treated the same when handing out punishment.

If you are caught taking cocaine or failed a drug test with your club us (the fans) will never hear a thing about it, it will be dealt with in house, the difference here for Insall is he has been caught by the doping authorites, and he will face a long ban, it would seem he has been found guilty and is appealing it, so as of now he is guilty of taking something, just think of players in the not to long time ago who were caught in possession of drugs in Edinburgh, they were dealt with the courts, they were never banned by either clubs from playing football, if both clubs were serious about things they would have had these players in for a drug test as soon as they got out of the police station and i'm sure they would have tested positive, but the clubs don't want to lose there players for a long time, so they turn a blind eye and let the courts deal with it, with Insall, it's not happened that way and he has been caught by the doping mob and Hibs will have to make a decision about him.

Billy Whizz
23-04-2017, 08:56 PM
If you are caught taking cocaine or failed a drug test with your club us (the fans) will never hear a thing about it, it will be dealt with in house, the difference here for Insall is he has been caught by the doping authorites, and he will face a long ban, it would seem he has been found guilty and is appealing it, so as of now he is guilty of taking something, just think of players in the not to long time ago who were caught in possession of drugs in Edinburgh, they were dealt with the courts, they were never banned by either clubs from playing football, if both clubs were serious about things they would have had these players in for a drug test as soon as they got out of the police station and i'm sure they would have tested positive, but the clubs don't want to lose there players for a long time, so they turn a blind eye and let the courts deal with it, with Insall, it's not happened that way and he has been caught by the doping mob and Hibs will have to make a decision about him.

Silver, I'd be surprised if clubs don't do testing on a regular basis. I know players have to do urine samples etc, very regularly

Fuzzywuzzy
23-04-2017, 09:16 PM
Maybe he needs some help, rather than throwing him out the door

Totally agree. This seems to be the case in sports. There is no support and if you get caught youre ****ed.

It would be extremely naive to believe that there are professional sportsman that don't take recreational drugs. With the amount of money and free time that some of them have its bound to happen and I'm not just talking about the insalls of the game.

I'm sure that there was chat on sportsound or something after a st mirren player I think failed one saying that drug testing was few and far between as it wasn't an issue in the game.

Same goes for any addiction anyone has. They need the support and infrastructure there to help them.

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 09:29 PM
Silver, I'd be surprised if clubs don't do testing on a regular basis. I know players have to do urine samples etc, very regularly

I'm sure they do Billy, but if a player fails the club deal with it and it will be in both interests not to make it public, players who were caught a few years ago up town with white powders were never punished by there clubs, only by the courts, a couple even had the charges dropped against them, think what I'm saying is if clubs were serious about this kind of thing they would have had these players in straight away and had them tested and if found to be positive they could have been sacked, it's in there contracts what they can do and not do, but both players kept there place in there teams so it would give the impression that the clubs may have not tested them as they were playing and important players to there clubs at the time.

silverhibee
23-04-2017, 09:37 PM
Silver, I'd be surprised if clubs don't do testing on a regular basis. I know players have to do urine samples etc, very regularly

The pee test is done regulary Billy, it's more to see if players are dehydrated with to much bevvy. :greengrin

wpj
24-04-2017, 09:36 AM
Maybe it was Crystal Methil :dunno:

JDHibs
24-04-2017, 09:42 AM
Christ, we dont even know what the laddie has taken and folk are calling for him to be binned.

Could be anything, hes fighting it, he must believe hes innocent, or else hes getting himself into more problems.

Innocent until proven guilty, which im sure will come out in a few weeks.

NORTHERNHIBBY
24-04-2017, 09:48 AM
Christ, we dont even know what the laddie has taken and folk are calling for him to be binned.

Could be anything, hes fighting it, he must believe hes innocent, or else hes getting himself into more problems.

Innocent until proven guilty, which im sure will come out in a few weeks.

Not everyone is saying that though?

Mikey09
24-04-2017, 09:48 AM
Personally I dont believe that any drugs should be illegal. And cocaine is not performance enhancing. Unless he was banging it at half time.


No drugs should be illegal?!?! :crazy:

speedy_gonzales
24-04-2017, 10:13 AM
Cocaine isn't used in medication.



Are you sure? When I was younger I had an operation on my nose and post-op my nasal cavity was filled with gauze soaked in a cocaine based solution to help reduce bone swelling.
I vaguely remember being as high as a kite and taking to my mum where ever 2nd word began with an F or a C. Mother was mortified and kept apologising to the nurses.

I also thought McFarlane Smith at Gorgie produced medical grade coke?

SaulGoodman
24-04-2017, 10:43 AM
I also thought McFarlane Smith at Gorgie produced medical grade coke?

It's Diamorphine they make is not? Medical Heroin

pacoluna
24-04-2017, 10:51 AM
If it is to do with medication he has taken then it certainly isn't cocaine.

Cocaine isn't used in medication.

If he has tested positive for cocaine he's away IMHO.
TAC is quite a common topical anaesthetic.

bubblesmorrison
24-04-2017, 11:44 AM
He took medicine for sore gums and teeth without knowing what was in it.

Smartie
24-04-2017, 11:58 AM
He took medicine for sore gums and teeth without knowing what was in it.

What on Earth is likely to be in that that it would see you fail a drugs test?

pacoluna
24-04-2017, 11:59 AM
He took medicine for sore gums and teeth without knowing what was in it.
seems plausible.

Billy Whizz
24-04-2017, 12:02 PM
He took medicine for sore gums and teeth without knowing what was in it.

Crazy if he's taken something without 1st checking with Hibs medical people first

Brightside
24-04-2017, 12:08 PM
Crazy if he's taken something without 1st checking with Hibs medical people first

hes not the brightest tbh

lord bunberry
24-04-2017, 12:13 PM
What on Earth is likely to be in that that it would see you fail a drugs test?

Cocaine has the effect of numbing your gums. It's why you always see on films them rubbing a bit of it on their gums to check it's purity
I've no idea if it's present in any medication though.

Wilson
24-04-2017, 12:14 PM
Cocaine has the effect of numbing your gums. It's why you always see on films them rubbing a bit of it on their gums to check it's purity

Missed that on Wizard of Oz.

lord bunberry
24-04-2017, 12:15 PM
Missed that on Wizard of Oz.

It was on the bonus DVD mate :greengrin

silverhibee
24-04-2017, 12:23 PM
Crazy if he's taken something without 1st checking with Hibs medical people first


:agree:


Players know the drill Billy, they are warned not to take anything from over the counter chemists, if players have the cold they get sent home and are told to drink lots of water and stay in bed for a few days, they don't go out and buy cold remedies to get them through it, if anything is to be prescribed it would go through the club doctor.

Billy Whizz
24-04-2017, 12:27 PM
:agree:


Players know the drill Billy, they are warned not to take anything from over the counter chemists, if players have the cold they get sent home and are told to drink lots of water and stay in bed for a few days, they don't go out and buy cold remedies to get them through it, if anything is to be prescribed it would go through the club doctor.

Exactly. Where we would he buy the sort of thing he was supposed to take anyway?

scoopyboy
24-04-2017, 12:33 PM
TAC is quite a common topical anaesthetic.

Correct, for example it is used as a local anaesthetic for some eye ops.

Not aware of it being used in medicines though.

scoopyboy
24-04-2017, 12:35 PM
Are you sure? When I was younger I had an operation on my nose and post-op my nasal cavity was filled with gauze soaked in a cocaine based solution to help reduce bone swelling.
I vaguely remember being as high as a kite and taking to my mum where ever 2nd word began with an F or a C. Mother was mortified and kept apologising to the nurses.

I also thought McFarlane Smith at Gorgie produced medical grade coke?

Are you sure it wasn't cocaine that was used as the local anaesthetic?

Macfarlan Smith does indeed make it for the Pharmaceutical Industry.

scoopyboy
24-04-2017, 12:35 PM
It's Diamorphine they make is not? Medical Heroin

Do both.

Andy74
24-04-2017, 12:42 PM
Anyhow, he's not up to standard as a footballer so on that basis we won't see him playing for us again.

Interesting argument though if he was any good do you stand by him. The answer does depend how valuable they are to you and there's nothing wrong with that.

There is a school of though that management should be about trying to improve your poor performers or those with some issues impacting their jobs and to spend time with them and bring them up to standard. I prefer the alternative view that is being taught a lot more now in business which is to spend much more time with your good people and don't waste your time on trying to work through the issues with the others. It is rarely efficient or effective use of time and resource and you risk losing the good people who you really want to keep.

Jag7
24-04-2017, 12:49 PM
Anyhow, he's not up to standard as a footballer so on that basis we won't see him playing for us again.

Interesting argument though if he was any good do you stand by him. The answer does depend how valuable they are to you and there's nothing wrong with that.

There is a school of though that management should be about trying to improve your poor performers or those with some issues impacting their jobs and to spend time with them and bring them up to standard. I prefer the alternative view that is being taught a lot more now in business which is to spend much more time with your good people and don't waste your time on trying to work through the issues with the others. It is rarely efficient or effective use of time and resource and you risk losing the good people who you really want to keep.

Andy that is totally against what the glorious SNP want .. they want everyone the same .. dumb and controllable

Eyrie
24-04-2017, 01:15 PM
Andy that is totally against what the glorious SNP want .. they want everyone the same .. dumb and controllable

I'm no fan of the SNP, but let's keep this sort of stuff on the Holy Ground.

JimBHibees
24-04-2017, 03:16 PM
Andy that is totally against what the glorious SNP want .. they want everyone the same .. dumb and controllable

Most irrelevant post ever. :greengrin

Mantis Toboggan
24-04-2017, 03:28 PM
No drugs should be illegal?!?! :crazy:

Aye the current approach works brilliantly right enough. People die unnecessarily because of government policy.
But this is also probably a holy ground topic tbh.

OsloHibs
24-04-2017, 05:48 PM
He took medicine for sore gums and teeth without knowing what was in it.

Must pay a visit to the high street chemist when next in Scotland!

Slavoj Zizek
24-04-2017, 06:10 PM
Scotsman article from today;

Hibs striker Jamie Insall has failed a drugs test.

Insall, who is currently on loan at East Fife, tested positive after a match against Livingston on March 11.

The UK Anti-Doping (UKAD) has reportedly informed the League One outfit, who passed on the news to his parent club.

Insall joined Hibs in summer 2015 and is contracted with the club until 2018. Should UKAD uphold the findings, Insall could face a lengthy ban. According to a Sunday newspaper report, the player is contesting the result - claiming he had taken cold medication earlier that day. Insall, who has not made a competitive first-team appearance at Hibs, has scored 14 times in 50 games for East Fife. Hibs have declined to comment.

Read more at: http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/crime/hibs-striker-jamie-insall-fails-drugs-test-1-4427161

Sounds about right. Saw him [and a few others] in TigerLilly last Friday [21st Apr] night.... :rolleyes:

marinello59
24-04-2017, 06:12 PM
Sounds about right. Saw him [and a few others] in TigerLilly last Friday [21st Apr] night.... :rolleyes:

What relevance does that have?

Slavoj Zizek
24-04-2017, 06:13 PM
What relevance does that have?

Nothing at all there Ace. Just sharing what I saw on Friday.

Pete
24-04-2017, 06:13 PM
What relevance does that have?

Tigerlilly is Chinese for opium den.

Allant1981
24-04-2017, 06:40 PM
Nothing at all there Ace. Just sharing what I saw on Friday.

apart from the fact you didnt really share much apart from you seen him!

Slavoj Zizek
24-04-2017, 06:46 PM
apart from the fact you didnt really share much apart from you seen him!

Balls. I've been rumbled. But of course, this post is of no relevance at all. :rolleyes:

Allant1981
24-04-2017, 07:24 PM
Balls. I've been rumbled. But of course, this post is of no relevance at all. :rolleyes:

glad you know

mixumatosis
24-04-2017, 09:19 PM
Christ, we dont even know what the laddie has taken and folk are calling for him to be binned.

Could be anything, hes fighting it, he must believe hes innocent, or else hes getting himself into more problems.

Innocent until proven guilty, which im sure will come out in a few weeks.

Far from it. The club(s) will have to continue paying him until the result of the B sample is confirmed since, as you say, he is innocent until proven guilty and it's the B sample that is regarded as conclusive. If he knows his career is over as a result of taking something he shouldn't, or because he was careless, then why would he not squeeze out an extra few weeks or months wages.

If the B sample confirms the original finding the club could take him to court to get that money back, but there's more PR value in just binning him and calling the matter closed, never mind the cost of going to court.

It's a pretty well worn ploy used by plenty of cyclists in the past.

Jack
24-04-2017, 09:30 PM
Medical heroin, medical cocaine, medical the other one I can't spell!

None of these are available over the counter, even at the chemist!!! I'm not even sure they're available on prescription!

I really hope this is something that's been blown out of all proportion and the only action needed by the club is to give him a doing for not clearing an otherwise normal medication with either of the club doctors.