The perfect storm - Hearts dire derby defeat.

[emerald green]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

[Iggy Pope]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

That was an enjoyable read indeed.

[emerald green]

That was an enjoyable read indeed.

I thought so too Iggy Pope. The author of the article pretty much called it spot on IMO.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Good article ... sums it all up really. Everything that enabled the Yams to dominate the derby for years ( financial doping aside ) is now what enables Hibs to dominate it. Even in the days where Scottish football was supposedly of a higher quality the first thing to do in an Edinburgh derby was win the battle .... it has always been that way and always will be. Our players and manager get that, the Yams clearly don't.

[Jim44]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

........except for the accompanying snippet about Rodgers fancying John McGinn.

[greenlex]

The hurt runs deep as do their problems LAV IT. :flag:

[Joe6-2]

Good read. Am I the only one who finds the name Perry Kitchen hilarious?

[Carheenlea]

Does the author still record his podcast along with a few others? It used to be pretty decent but I got fed up after a few weeks when it was pretty much all about Hearts. One of the others writes for The Scotsman as well I think?
Back to the piece though - a pretty good analysis from a Hearts perspective on Wednesday nights match.

[emerald green]

........except for the accompanying snippet about Rodgers fancying John McGinn.

Aye just ignore that though Jim44. Just enjoy the article.

That said, it's no real surprise, but Rodgers can forget it unless his club comes up with loads of cash up front and Henderson & Griffiths. How about that for starters?

That's what I'd be telling him if I ran things at ER. :greengrin

[Deansy]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

It IS a good read but I'm starting to get hacked-off with the media's 2 day-long autopsy into what went wrong with Hearts, almost as if the result was a one-off, a fluke never to be repeated ?. Thanks to Hearts no longer having access to 'Other people's money' the derby-fortunes WILL change - it's going to be interesting times to see how the Scottish media explain WHY/HOW* the derby has changed at the same time as avoiding stating the bleeding obvious !!


* they cheated !

[Pete]

Ian Cathro and the Omnishambles.

[WoreTheGreen]

It IS a good read but I'm starting to get hacked-off with the media's 2 day-long autopsy into what went wrong with Hearts, almost as if the result was a one-off, a fluke never to be repeated ?. Thanks to Hearts no longer having access to 'Other people's money' the derby-fortunes WILL change - it's going to be interesting times to see how the Scottish media explain WHY/HOW* the derby has changed at the same time as avoiding stating the bleeding obvious !!


* they cheated !

Dr Quincey what was the cause of death"? The hibees played them off the park Case closed

[The Green Goblin]

"Hunry Hippo"- freudian slip there :greengrin

I think the roots of Wednesday night run far deeper than the article suggests. To put it simply, the yams are experiencing the flip side of their shameless years of cheating. They have sacrificed a difficult but more prudent period of slow rebuilding and preparation for a few highs bought with other people's money, and now that the balloon has burst and it's a "level playing field", they are hopelessly lost. It's like that fable of the grasshopper and the cricket, where one gathers fuel for the winter and the other one just wastes time and has a wee jolly. Well guess what yams, winter finally arrived and youse are freezing pish.

[AltheHibby]

I had a look across the road, and a few sensible posters agree its a good article.

[bingo70]

It IS a good read but I'm starting to get hacked-off with the media's 2 day-long autopsy into what went wrong with Hearts, almost as if the result was a one-off, a fluke never to be repeated ?. Thanks to Hearts no longer having access to 'Other people's money' the derby-fortunes WILL change - it's going to be interesting times to see how the Scottish media explain WHY/HOW* the derby has changed at the same time as avoiding stating the bleeding obvious !!


* they cheated !

Good post. I enjoyed reading the article but it did cross my mind we were being patronised a little.

Let's get some perspective, hibs beat hearts at home. It's something that shouldn't be unusual in the same way there wouldn't be this inquest if hibs lost at tynecastle. The way hearts are going on you'd think they just lost to East Stirling or the like.

[Northernhibee]

Good post. I enjoyed reading the article but it did cross my mind we were being patronised a little.

Let's get some perspective, hibs beat hearts at home. It's something that shouldn't be unusual in the same way there wouldn't be this inquest if hibs lost at tynecastle. The way hearts are going on you'd think they just lost to East Stirling or the like.

I think it was more the manner of the defeat that surprised, there was no fight in Hearts from the first whistle to the last. They were beyond awful.

[SuperAllyMcleod]

A good article but I felt it didn't pick up on the role of both sets of fans across the two fixtures.

While the Hibs fans kept a prolonged wall of noise going for both games the Hearts fans had nothing to come back at us with and that's what gave them their 'resigned' attitude.

The Hibs team then fed off the support they were getting and the silence of the yams had a similar effect on their team.

In fact, just after we went two up all three stands were absolutely bouncing and you could see Jamie Walker lose it and take Louis out with a disgraceful tackle above the knees. The fact that Louis wasn't really going anywhere and was about to be crowded out anyway didn't cross Walkers mind - the crowd had got to him.

[Northernhibee]

A good article but I felt it didn't pick up on the role of both sets of fans across the two fixtures.

While the Hibs fans kept a prolonged wall of noise going for both games the Hearts fans had nothing to come back at us with and that's what gave them their 'resigned' attitude.

The Hibs team then fed off the support they were getting and the silence of the yams had a similar effect on their team.

In fact, just after we went two up all three stands were absolutely bouncing and you could see Jamie Walker lose it and take Louis out with a disgraceful tackle above the knees. The fact that Louis wasn't really going anywhere and was about to be crowded out anyway didn't cross Walkers mind - the crowd had got to him.
We really have taken away almost all of their songbook. Pleasing.

[Onion]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

Hibs are the cup holders, playing at home to a full house and can beat any team in Scotland on their day. Yet, defeat for Hearts is perceived as a catastrophe that needs huge amounts of soul-searching, recrimination and apology.

As long as the Yams dwell on the past and see it as their god-given right to win these games, they'll continue to be spanked and sent home to cry again. Level playing field is a bugger, eh Yams ?

[marinello59]

A great read for Hibs fans.


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/hearts/the-perfect-storm-5-reasons-for-hearts-dire-derby-defeat-1-4376131

It doesn't give us nearly enough credit. Hearts were made to look poor on Wednesday because our team went about their business so well. There is no mention of their failure to come to terms with the lack of financial doping which sustained them for so many years. The real story is that we now have a level playing field.

[jacomo]

Good post. I enjoyed reading the article but it did cross my mind we were being patronised a little.

Let's get some perspective, hibs beat hearts at home. It's something that shouldn't be unusual in the same way there wouldn't be this inquest if hibs lost at tynecastle. The way hearts are going on you'd think they just lost to East Stirling or the like.


I think the Jambo hubris is catching up with them, more than anything else.

[Mantis Toboggan]

It doesn't give us nearly enough credit. Hearts were made to look poor on Wednesday because our team went about their business so well. There is no mention of their failure to come to terms with the lack of financial doping which sustained them for so many years. The real story is that we now have a level playing field.

Completely agree. All about their failings i.e. they let this happen. When in fact they were comprehensively thumped.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

We really have taken away almost all of their songbook. Pleasing.

You're 100% correct, take away their wee Frank Sinatra ditty and they pretty much have nowt left (apart from twirling their scarves in the air) and I'm loving it.

[Tobias Funke]

First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

Hibs are the cup holders, playing at home to a full house and can beat any team in Scotland on their day. Yet, defeat for Hearts is perceived as a catastrophe that needs huge amounts of soul-searching, recrimination and apology.

As long as the Yams dwell on the past and see it as their god-given right to win these games, they'll continue to be spanked and sent home to cry again. Level playing field is a bugger, eh Yams ?

:top marks

[hibee_nation]

A good article but I felt it didn't pick up on the role of both sets of fans across the two fixtures.

While the Hibs fans kept a prolonged wall of noise going for both games the Hearts fans had nothing to come back at us with and that's what gave them their 'resigned' attitude.

The Hibs team then fed off the support they were getting and the silence of the yams had a similar effect on their team.

In fact, just after we went two up all three stands were absolutely bouncing and you could see Jamie Walker lose it and take Louis out with a disgraceful tackle above the knees. The fact that Louis wasn't really going anywhere and was about to be crowded out anyway didn't cross Walkers mind - the crowd had got to him.

That was the worst part of the 4 nil defeat in the semi at Hampden. Being totaly outsung before a ball was kicked. Changed days and long may it continue.

[RyeSloan]

Completely agree. All about their failings i.e. they let this happen. When in fact they were comprehensively thumped.

Totally agree...yeah they were crap and lacked 'fight' but Hibs played some cracking football. The passing and movement for the first two were excellent.

The fact that Hearts struggled to get forward wasn't just down to a lack of fight either, Hibs were well drilled and stayed focussed throughout so you can bemoan Hearts performance but at the same time you have to credit ours as well.

[Dashing Bob S]

First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

Hibs are the cup holders, playing at home to a full house and can beat any team in Scotland on their day. Yet, defeat for Hearts is perceived as a catastrophe that needs huge amounts of soul-searching, recrimination and apology.

As long as the Yams dwell on the past and see it as their god-given right to win these games, they'll continue to be spanked and sent home to cry again. Level playing field is a bugger, eh Yams ?

Agree 100% but your last paragraph says it all. The longer they live with this deluded 'big team' mentality, the longer it will take them to adjust to the level playing field. The longer it takes them to adjust, the more derbies will be fraught with pain and embarrassment for them. I'm sniffing a club in decline, and scenting fear coming out of its every pore. And the terror for the Jambos is that they are catching the same odious whiff from themselves.

The aren't psychologically equipped for the level playing field era. And with their stand to pay for and a fan-owned business model geared to punish failure, it might not be that level for much longer.

[tamig]

Your 100% correct, take away their wee Frank Sinatra ditty and they pretty much have nowt left (apart from twirling their scarves in the air) and I'm loving it.

Cannae remember the last time I witnessed their mass twirling spectacle tbh. Maybe that's been binned too.

[LithgaeHibby]

Ah, welcome to living within your means. I am looking forward to a lengthy period of that lot being in our shadow.

[Craig_HFC]

Good read. Am I the only one who finds the name Perry Kitchen hilarious?

Nope, you're not alone. A proper weird name.

Their captain as well; can you imagine someone called Perry trying to inspire folk?

:hilarious

[Joe6-2]

A good article but I felt it didn't pick up on the role of both sets of fans across the two fixtures.

While the Hibs fans kept a prolonged wall of noise going for both games the Hearts fans had nothing to come back at us with and that's what gave them their 'resigned' attitude.

The Hibs team then fed off the support they were getting and the silence of the yams had a similar effect on their team.

In fact, just after we went two up all three stands were absolutely bouncing and you could see Jamie Walker lose it and take Louis out with a disgraceful tackle above the knees. The fact that Louis wasn't really going anywhere and was about to be crowded out anyway didn't cross Walkers mind - the crowd had got to him.

Silence of the yams 👍

[surreyhibbie]

Cannae remember the last time I witnessed their mass twirling spectacle tbh. Maybe that's been binned too.

Good. I always found that embarrassing to be honest, they look like a bunch of wee schoolgirls.

:greengrin

[Hibee Mac]

Focusses too much on hearts poor performance and not enough on our excellent performance.

The main reasons we won that tie are not the 5 reasons "hearts lost it" as he's trying to put across.

We outplayed them by a country mile cause our players wanted it more.

[green day]

Focusses too much on hearts poor performance and not enough on our excellent performance.

The main reasons we won that tie are not the 5 reasons "hearts lost it" as he's trying to put across.

We outplayed them by a country mile cause our players wanted it more.

Understandable though, Fowler is a Jambo, so his article analyses the problems with Hearts.

[emerald green]

First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

I didn't read the article as being intentionally insulting to Hibs. It thought it was more intended to draw attention to the failings of HOMFC the way I read it. But there you go.


It doesn't give us nearly enough credit. Hearts were made to look poor on Wednesday because our team went about their business so well. There is no mention of their failure to come to terms with the lack of financial doping which sustained them for so many years. The real story is that we now have a level playing field.

He does say Hibs were simple and effective. The archetypical derby performance. Everything that went wrong (for Hearts) was simply compounded by a professional and at times ferocious, as Neil Lennon put it, Hibs performance.

The thrust of the article was clearly aimed at Hearts failings, rather than Hibs total domination of the match. I enjoy reading about Hearts failings. That's why I thought it was a good read.

I think you'll wait until hell freezes over before anyone has the courage to write honestly and openly about "financial doping" at HOMFC. Too many friends in high places have the Jambos. No names...


Completely agree. All about their failings i.e. they let this happen. When in fact they were comprehensively thumped.

See above. Hibs beat them as easily as I've seen for a long time. Totally dominated them. It should have been by more than two goals. My only criticism.

[cookin_on_gaz]

I haven't read all the other replies but surely I am not the only one to find that article a little disrespectful to hibs? You would think they had just been beaten by cove rangers or some other small team.

Sent from my VF-1397 using Tapatalk

[Sioux]

All the stuff over the last few days simply amplifies the fact that their sole existence depends on being better than Hibs, in their eyes of course. That makes them a big team. If they had been put out by Dundee Utd or any 'bottom six' club, we wouldn't have had all of their woe is us tripe.

It's already been said a few times on here that they don't like this real world malarkey.

[emerald green]

Understandable though, Fowler is a Jambo, so his article analyses the problems with Hearts.

Who is "Fowler"? The article was written by someone called Joel Sked.

[et_hibby]

Silence of the yams 👍

Delicious, indeed. Wi fava beans...

[RyeSloan]

I didn't read the article as being intentionally insulting to Hibs. It thought it was more intended to draw attention to the failings of HOMFC the way I read it. But there you go.



He does say Hibs were simple and effective. The archetypical derby performance. Everything that went wrong (for Hearts) was simply compounded by a professional and at times ferocious, as Neil Lennon put it, Hibs performance.

The thrust of the article was clearly aimed at Hearts failings, rather than Hibs total domination of the match. I enjoy reading about Hearts failings. That's why I thought it was a good read.

I think you'll wait until hell freezes over before anyone has the courage to write honestly and openly about "financial doping" at HOMFC. Too many friends in high places have the Jambos. No names...



See above. Hibs beat them as easily as I've seen for a long time. Totally dominated them. It should have been by more than two goals. My only criticism.

Aimed at the Jambos or not it's the whole tone of how long it will take them to recover from such an embarrassment...

They are not the first top flight team to get spanked at ER the last couple of years so there should be nothing surprising in the fact they lost.

Sure the manner in which they lost was a touch surprising but remember they had struggled badly in the last round and in the first tie.

Anyway who cares, if they want to wallow in over exaggerated grief then I'm all for it [emoji23]

[GreenLake]

I'm torn between wanting Levein/Castro to stay on and Rudi Skacel to come in as player coach. Maybe the new pitch will help and improve things for their team. They are installing Castroturf and each divot sends a tweet back to his laptop.

[JackLadd]

I think I first heard the Sinatra number at ER when we skelped them 3-1 in early 2000. I still don't know what the eff they're singing about.

[Not In The Know]

That article is a disgrace for a national newspaper. It should stay on kickback where the bitter journalist I imagine does most of his writing. Hearts lost at Easter Road to Hibs. Fact. Get over it. Quite frankly it's now getting patronising it's like hearts should never have to suffer this from their rivals and it's an insult to every one of them because they deserve better. They deserve nowt. 20 odd years of cheating welcome to the real world. Their superiority complex is if anything hilarious. Ram yer 1902.

[Keith_M]

I think I first heard the Sinatra number at ER when we skelped them 3-1 in early 2000. I still don't know what the eff they're singing about.



They sing something about Hearts playing in "yoooooooo-rup".

Where that is exactly is anybody's guess but I don't think they'll be playing in Europe next season either.

[green day]

Who is "Fowler"? The article was written by someone called Joel Sked.

Aye you are 100% right, must have been a whisky based post😁😁😁

[ajf]

A good article but I felt it didn't pick up on the role of both sets of fans across the two fixtures.

While the Hibs fans kept a prolonged wall of noise going for both games the Hearts fans had nothing to come back at us with and that's what gave them their 'resigned' attitude.

The Hibs team then fed off the support they were getting and the silence of the yams had a similar effect on their team.

In fact, just after we went two up all three stands were absolutely bouncing and you could see Jamie Walker lose it and take Louis out with a disgraceful tackle above the knees. The fact that Louis wasn't really going anywhere and was about to be crowded out anyway didn't cross Walkers mind - the crowd had got to him.

Great post :top marks

[southsider]

I think it was more the manner of the defeat that surprised, there was no fight in Hearts from the first whistle to the last. They were beyond awful.
Agreed. 60 minutes on the clock before they had a shot at goal. In a Scottish Cup derby. Almost beyond belief. We have an experience manager in Neil who knows the script. They have a schoolboy who has been told by Mr 4-6-0 to sit on the naughty step.

[connerg]

Agreed. 60 minutes on the clock before they had a shot at goal. In a Scottish Cup derby. Almost beyond belief. We have an experience manager in Neil who knows the script. They have a schoolboy who has been told by Mr 4-6-0 to sit on the naughty step.

:top marks:thumbsup::faf:

[--------]

It IS a good read but I'm starting to get hacked-off with the media's 2 day-long autopsy into what went wrong with Hearts, almost as if the result was a one-off, a fluke never to be repeated ?. Thanks to Hearts no longer having access to 'Other people's money' the derby-fortunes WILL change - it's going to be interesting times to see how the Scottish media explain WHY/HOW* the derby has changed at the same time as avoiding stating the bleeding obvious !!

* they cheated !



Good post. I enjoyed reading the article but it did cross my mind we were being patronised a little.

Let's get some perspective, hibs beat hearts at home. It's something that shouldn't be unusual in the same way there wouldn't be this inquest if hibs lost at tynecastle. The way hearts are going on you'd think they just lost to East Stirling or the like.



First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

Hibs are the cup holders, playing at home to a full house and can beat any team in Scotland on their day. Yet, defeat for Hearts is perceived as a catastrophe that needs huge amounts of soul-searching, recrimination and apology.

As long as the Yams dwell on the past and see it as their god-given right to win these games, they'll continue to be spanked and sent home to cry again. Level playing field is a bugger, eh Yams ?


I totally agree with you guys. The way that article's written, you would think that a Hibs victory on Wednesday night was something completely out of the question in any normal universe.

Sked writes entirely from the Hearts point of view, and underlying his arguments is the idea that what happened was somehow an aberration.

In Skedworld, Hibs have no right to defeat The Big Team Of Gorgie, and The Big Team must now surely face a crisis previously unimaginable, suffering 'wounds' that somehow should concern the entire readership of the rag he writes for.

The fact is that in the eyes of a massive section of the Scottish sports media - the section inhabited by Sked and his ilk - there's a myth that Scottish football can only be healthy and vibrant when the Jambos and their big cousins at Greyskull are regularly winning trophies and putting it over their rivals. Sked's clearly hurting badly at what Hibs did to his darlings on Wednesday. He's writing about the match as if Hibs' victory was a giant-killing act - Berwick doing the Huns, ICT doing the Soapdodgers, that sort of result.

Well, it wasn't. But that's hard for a lot of people in the west of the city to accept. In their eyes nothing good comes out of Leith, and any success the football team might enjoy is a temporary glitch in the continuum of Jambo domination. Sked's writing reeks of that attitude.

What Hibs have to do now is maintain that level of commitment and skill until promotion is a certainty; we need to do to Ayr what we did to Hearts; and we need to get back to Hampden and REALLY MAKE IT CLEAR THAT THERE IS NO 'WEE TEAM' IN LEITH.

[houstonhibbee]

I totally agree with you guys. The way that article's written, you would think that a Hibs victory on Wednesday night was something completely out of the question in any normal universe.

Sked writes entirely from the Hearts point of view, and underlying his arguments is the idea that what happened was somehow an aberration.

In Skedworld, Hibs have no right to defeat The Big Team Of Gorgie, and The Big Team must now surely face a crisis previously unimaginable, suffering 'wounds' that somehow should concern the entire readership of the rag he writes for.

The fact is that in the eyes of a massive section of the Scottish sports media - the section inhabited by Sked and his ilk - there's a myth that Scottish football can only be healthy and vibrant when the Jambos and their big cousins at Greyskull are regularly winning trophies and putting it over their rivals. Sked's clearly hurting badly at what Hibs did to his darlings on Wednesday. He's writing about the match as if Hibs' victory was a giant-killing act - Berwick doing the Huns, ICT doing the Soapdodgers, that sort of result.

Well, it wasn't. But that's hard for a lot of people in the west of the city to accept. In their eyes nothing good comes out of Leith, and any success the football team might enjoy is a temporary glitch in the continuum of Jambo domination. Sked's writing reeks of that attitude.

What Hibs have to do now is maintain that level of commitment and skill until promotion is a certainty; we need to do to Ayr what we did to Hearts; and we need to get back to Hampden and REALLY MAKE IT CLEAR THAT THERE IS NO 'WEE TEAM' IN LEITH.

We don't need to make it clear to anyone. We dint need to defend ourselves against such nonsense. Better just to ignore it

[jacomo]

I'm not bothered by the tone of the piece to be honest.

However, categorising the game as all blood and thunder isn't quite right. Our first two goals were quality - great assists and calm finishes.

Shinnie's strike was fine too but the keeper really should have done better.

[Deansy]

First few paras just put me off, pandering to the Hearts "Big Team" psyche. Comments like "This is a wound that will take a long time to heal. A long time." are a straight insult to Hibs.

Hibs are the cup holders, playing at home to a full house and can beat any team in Scotland on their day. Yet, defeat for Hearts is perceived as a catastrophe that needs huge amounts of soul-searching, recrimination and apology.

As long as the Yams dwell on the past and see it as their god-given right to win these games, they'll continue to be spanked and sent home to cry again. Level playing field is a bugger, eh Yams ?

Agreed - the most common phrase I've read/heard from them is 'It's not good enough for a cluib like Hearts' - a physche developed from 30+ years of being 'Artificially Financially Inflated', a physche that affects 90-95% of their support ! It seems they've no supporters left from the 70's who remember and know exactly what Hearts were like BEFORE Mercer's 'Finance Football' business-plan turned them into a 'Big team' !. Even their nauseating, girly 'Scarf-twirling' seems to have been binned !

[pedroorange1875]

1 - 0 Partick, cathro football continues :not worth

[GreenLake]

Agreed - the most common phrase I've read/heard from them is 'It's not good enough for a cluib like Hearts' - a physche developed from 30+ years of being 'Artificially Financially Inflated', a physche that affects 90-95% of their support ! It seems they've no supporters left from the 70's who remember and know exactly what Hearts were like BEFORE Mercer's 'Finance Football' business-plan turned them into a 'Big team' !. Even their nauseating, girly 'Scarf-twirling' seems to have been binned !

The last time they did it was against Hibs at the PBS in 2016 when they were 2 goals ahead with 10 minutes to go.

[Eyrie]

The last time they did it was against Hibs at the PBS in 2016 when they were 2 goals ahead with 10 minutes to go.

So they only do it to celebrate a win then, because there is no way that any team could foul up a two goal lead with only ten minutes left.