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View Full Version : Sort out our conversion rate or we're staying in this league.



Diclonius
12-11-2016, 04:56 PM
Today was one of our best performances of the whole season - IF you don't count the number of goals we've actually scored. This is a CHRONIC problem that we've had not only ever since we've been down here but the season we were relegated too. We simply CANNOT convert dominance, chances, even shots at ****ing goal into goals and we have NEVER even looked like fixing it.

How easy was it to predict that Falkirk would get less than 3 clear cut chances and score 1 of them? How easy was it to predict that we would have all the dominance, all the possession and score less than 3 goals? We need to address this and soon - no ****ing about - or we'll end up not having the money to buy players that can sustain yet another promotion push.

Really angry watching that - a carbon copy of almost every game we play against Falkirk this season. We deserved way more than a point out of that and yet it was the same old story.

Keith_M
12-11-2016, 05:01 PM
There's been a similar pattern in most of our games for over two years.


Our goals to shots ratio is pathetic and the opposition invariably convert 1 in 2 or 1 in 3 of their shots at goal.


Hibs should really have been out of sight long before the end... again.

blackpoolhibs
12-11-2016, 05:15 PM
Today showed us the lack of quality we have in the wide positions, Gray and Stevenson once again couldn't beat the first man with their appalling efforts at crossing.

Then we bring on Harris who's frightened to go outside his man, and the once or twice he did he was easily muscled off the ball.

We just dont create enough chances, and we dont convert enough of the ones we do.

Spike Mandela
12-11-2016, 05:16 PM
Said it before and I'll say it again, Lennon came in late to the party, took too long to assess the squad, underestimated the sheer mediocrity throughout our squad and made limited signings of minimal improvement.

Was never convinced he was the right man for the job and remain to be convinced. I find his teams mirror the man, dour and uninspiring. He needs his team to improve massively and a with a crucial set of games coming up he needs them to do it quickly and then a very important transfer window follows for him.

hibee_girl
12-11-2016, 05:17 PM
Today showed us the lack of quality we have in the wide positions, Gray and Stevenson once again couldn't beat the first man with their appalling efforts at crossing.

Then we bring on Harris who's frightened to go outside his man, and the once or twice he did he was easily muscled off the ball.

We just dont create enough chances, and we dont convert enough of the ones we do.

Stevenson put in a number of good crosses (and a number of bad ones before you start) but when only one player makes any effort to get into the box there's not much more he can do!

Basildon Hibs
12-11-2016, 05:21 PM
There's been a similar pattern in most of our games for over two years.


Our goals to shots ratio is pathetic and the opposition invariably convert 1 in 2 or 1 in 3 of their shots at goal.




I've been saying this for over two years. I wonder why it's never been addressed by our managers...? :confused:

Borderhibbie76
12-11-2016, 05:24 PM
Alex Harris needs to be shown the door...he is simply not good enough
...and we need a left full back who can cross the ball...I love wee Lewis but the number of waster crosses today was criminal

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MWHIBBIES
12-11-2016, 05:31 PM
Been converting fine the last 3 weeks, isnt easy vs 10 defenders.

brog
12-11-2016, 05:37 PM
I've been saying this for over two years. I wonder why it's never been addressed by our managers...? :confused:

Did we miss clear chances today or were we not creating chances & shooting in desperation? I'd be more worried if it was the latter. The goals to shots ratio can be misleading. A great save, or a superb shot striking woodwork is treated exactly the same as missing an open goal from a yard. I've said all season we'll win the league based on our away form. NL is a cautious manager. Playing 3 centre backs at home is unnecessary IMO given Sevco are no longer in our league. We've only had 1 really good home performance, against Morton. Time to be more expansive.

blackpoolhibs
12-11-2016, 05:39 PM
Stevenson put in a number of good crosses (and a number of bad ones before you start) but when only one player makes any effort to get into the box there's not much more he can do!
I must have watched a different game to you?

A Hi-Bee
12-11-2016, 05:45 PM
Today was one of our best performances of the whole season - IF you don't count the number of goals we've actually scored. This is a CHRONIC problem that we've had not only ever since we've been down here but the season we were relegated too. We simply CANNOT convert dominance, chances, even shots at ****ing goal into goals and we have NEVER even looked like fixing it.

How easy was it to predict that Falkirk would get less than 3 clear cut chances and score 1 of them? How easy was it to predict that we would have all the dominance, all the possession and score less than 3 goals? We need to address this and soon - no ****ing about - or we'll end up not having the money to buy players that can sustain yet another promotion push.

Really angry watching that - a carbon copy of almost every game we play against Falkirk this season. We deserved way more than a point out of that and yet it was the same old story.

Hard to disagree, with the above, I did not manage to get to the game today so difficult to comment on a one-off game but it is as you rightly say a problem area at ER and has been for some time, perhaps I have just been spoiled in the past having seen so many great goalscorers at ER, but I will say this again, we need to go out and spend some real cash to get out of this league and that means spending on a real proven experienced goalscorer, JC is not enough, if we dont the other way to do it is to go out and bring in a load of journeymen players who know this league and know how to get out of it, I would rather the first option otherwise we turn into a team like the rankers or perhaps worse the previous bunch of **** who ran away wi this league.

Time to get real and to realise that while this present team has given more than we could even have dreamed off I in my humble opinion dont think they yet have enough to get us out of this horrible league, and the longer it goes on the more difficult it becomes as resources dwindle away.

Ozyhibby
12-11-2016, 05:47 PM
I hoped Shinnie would help our goal scoring but he was hopeless again today


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Pretty Boy
12-11-2016, 05:47 PM
Alex Harris needs to be shown the door...he is simply not good enough
...and we need a left full back who can cross the ball...I love wee Lewis but the number of waster crosses today was criminal

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Agree with this. Laddie is scared of his own shadow. On at least 2 occasions he had 30/40 yards of space to drive into and his 1st thought was to cut inside and offload the ball. When he did try to go outside he was brushed aside like he wasn't there.

Few folk around me, and myself as well, thought there was a couple of times other players looked like they didn't want to pass to him.

dastardly8
12-11-2016, 05:52 PM
We need a prolific experienced finisher who isn't scared to shoot , we continually try and walk it in , with the amount of shots we have on goal each game we should be murdering all teams were up against

Enough said
12-11-2016, 05:59 PM
Stevenson put in a number of good crosses (and a number of bad ones before you start) but when only one player makes any effort to get into the box there's not much more he can do!

Stevenson never beat the first man today

hibee_girl
12-11-2016, 06:06 PM
Stevenson never beat the first man today

He did on a number of occasions, he also never on a number of occasions

RIP
12-11-2016, 06:10 PM
It's crazy that we started yet another campaign so light on goalscorers.

leither17
12-11-2016, 06:12 PM
Agree with this. Laddie is scared of his own shadow. On at least 2 occasions he had 30/40 yards of space to drive into and his 1st thought was to cut inside and offload the ball. When he did try to go outside he was brushed aside like he wasn't there.

Few folk around me, and myself as well, thought there was a couple of times other players looked like they didn't want to pass to him.

Holt had a go at him twice, he looked like he didn't want to be on the pitch

Thecat23
12-11-2016, 06:14 PM
I must have watched a different game to you?

I also thought he stuck a few good crosses in. Falkirk had 8 men in the 18 yard box at times so it's luck if we can get on the end of it! But some of the crosses he done were frustrating.

The Captain....
12-11-2016, 06:14 PM
Agree with this. Laddie is scared of his own shadow. On at least 2 occasions he had 30/40 yards of space to drive into and his 1st thought was to cut inside and offload the ball. When he did try to go outside he was brushed aside like he wasn't there.

Few folk around me, and myself as well, thought there was a couple of times other players looked like they didn't want to pass to him.

Its just ,sadly,not going to happen for him imo, I was one of his biggest champions, if Im honest I've probably been guilty of hoping he'd show his early form again and ignoring what he is currently producing for too long. You're right there was 2 or 3 opportunities when he could have been positive and driven into the space in front of him but checked inside to take an easy option.

Thecat23
12-11-2016, 06:15 PM
He did on a number of occasions, he also never on a number of occasions

Correct.

Sir David Gray
13-11-2016, 12:10 PM
Our chances to goals ratio is awful. I wasn't even annoyed when Falkirk scored as I've seen it all before.

We could easily have had four or five yesterday but a 1-1 draw is so frustrating. I just hope it doesn't cost us.

My_Wife_Camille
13-11-2016, 12:12 PM
Our conversion rate has us top of the pile so far and will have us top of the pile at the end of the season

Real Emerald
13-11-2016, 12:16 PM
Shocking stats to read.

We can blame refs and other teams tactics but we have to sort the scoring and shooting out.

Sorry meant to post the stats

Shots Hibs 20, Falkirk 2
On Target Hibs 5, Falkirk 1
Corners Hibs 18, Falkirk 1

Out of the 20 shots we had we only managed 5 on target and 1 goal. Falkirk managed to score 1 goal from their only corner and only shot on target. Eighteen corners, yes that's right eighteen corners which were a total waste of time. Shocking

lucky
13-11-2016, 12:26 PM
Stevenson's crossing was better than Gray's yesterday but as always he's an easy target for the boo boys. I thought Shinnie played well and was positive but like Stevenson and McGinn made errors because he was forcing the game. Harris is just not good enough why Carmichael was released and he was kept is beyond me. If I'm being honest I don't think Lennon has improved us a team.

CallumHibs07
13-11-2016, 12:40 PM
This is a result of Lennon's chronic style of play. Lump up to the big guy, get as many corners as possible (18 yesterday?) and hope we bundle it over the line. Until he does away with that pish we're never going to be scoring 3 or 4 in a game.

staunchhibby
13-11-2016, 01:06 PM
Dont know why harris gets a game.He is living on his past glory from cup semi.Better players have been let go

IanM
13-11-2016, 01:14 PM
This is a result of Lennon's chronic style of play. Lump up to the big guy, get as many corners as possible (18 yesterday?) and hope we bundle it over the line. Until he does away with that pish we're never going to be scoring 3 or 4 in a game.

We tried more than lump it yesterday. Lennon was furious at Gray and McGinn not passing it more and keeping things simple. We tried to cut down their defence with balls wide, balls crossed into the box, long range efforts, passing to feet into the box. We just couldn't score
The corners were a result that we can't beat and man then cross

MWHIBBIES
13-11-2016, 01:16 PM
This is a result of Lennon's chronic style of play. Lump up to the big guy, get as many corners as possible (18 yesterday?) and hope we bundle it over the line. Until he does away with that pish we're never going to be scoring 3 or 4 in a game.Really? We scored 3 last week. 3 against Dunfermline as well. 4 against Morton too.

Apart from that, though, right?

CallumHibs07
13-11-2016, 01:23 PM
Really? We scored 3 last week. 3 against Dunfermline as well. 4 against Morton too.

Apart from that, though, right?


3 times out of 13 games we've scored more than 2, scored less than Dundee Utd and consistently fail to break down average teams due to our obvious tactics. Cut them open at pace and we'll beat these teams with ease.

Highland_Hibee
13-11-2016, 01:23 PM
Shocking stats to read.

We can blame refs and other teams tactics but we have to sort the scoring and shooting out.

Sorry meant to post the stats

Shots Hibs 20, Falkirk 2
On Target Hibs 5, Falkirk 1
Corners Hibs 18, Falkirk 1

Out of the 20 shots we had we only managed 5 on target and 1 goal. Falkirk managed to score 1 goal from their only corner and only shot on target. Eighteen corners, yes that's right eighteen corners which were a total waste of time. Shocking

The difference being we made Falkirks one shot on target easy to convert. None of our chances were mistakes or particularly easy conversions bar maybe the one Fontaine scooped wide. Boyle had one other chance in the net but was deemed offside which I'm not sure has been confirmed yet as the correct decision?


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Real Emerald
13-11-2016, 01:30 PM
[QUOTE=Highland_Hibee;4858271]The difference being we made Falkirks one shot on target easy to convert. None of our chances were mistakes or particularly easy conversions bar maybe the one Fontaine scooped wide. Boyle had one other chance in the net but was deemed offside which I'm not sure has been confirmed yet as the correct decision?

We can't start blaming the chances not being easy enough. At the end of the season we don't want to sit back and say ah well Dundee Utd won the league because they had easier chances than us. We have to start making use of 18 corners and 20 shots at goal. This is simply not good enough.

matty_f
13-11-2016, 01:32 PM
Stevenson's crossing was better than Gray's yesterday but as always he's an easy target for the boo boys. I thought Shinnie played well and was positive but like Stevenson and McGinn made errors because he was forcing the game. Harris is just not good enough why Carmichael was released and he was kept is beyond me. If I'm being honest I don't think Lennon has improved us a team.

Tend to agree with this post. We're very similar to last season's side. I think we look a little short on confidence, similar to the start to the season we had in our first year down under Stubbs.

Highland_Hibee
13-11-2016, 01:41 PM
We can't start blaming the chances not being easy enough. At the end of the season we don't want to sit back and say ah well Dundee Utd won the league because they had easier chances than us. We have to start making use of 18 corners and 20 shots at goal. This is simply not good enough.

That's not what I'm saying I'm saying we shouldn't have seen such schoolboy defending allow them to score. They didn't even want the goal, they had barely anyone in the box to attack it! They were content with a point sitting on their 18 yard box. That's why we had so many shots off target because they were pot shots from range.

Only stat that matters come the end of the season is the league points and despite how poor some folk think we are we're still top of that.



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Real Emerald
13-11-2016, 01:50 PM
That's not what I'm saying I'm saying we shouldn't have seen such schoolboy defending allow them to score. They didn't even want the goal, they had barely anyone in the box to attack it! They were content with a point sitting on their 18 yard box. That's why we had so many shots off target because they were pot shots from range.

Only stat that matters come the end of the season is the league points and despite how poor some folk think we are we're still top of that.



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The defence was at fault for their goal but our defence was the best in the UK up until yesterday. Although they maybe to blame for that goal, we should be able to concede the odd goal and still go on to win if we could convert a fraction of the attempts we get during games. If we can't get any change out of eighteen corners they're obviously not working and something needs to change.

Highland_Hibee
13-11-2016, 01:57 PM
The defence was at fault for their goal but our defence was the best in the UK up until yesterday. Although they maybe to blame for that goal, we should be able to concede the odd goal and still go on to win if we could convert a fraction of the attempts we get during games. If we can't get any change out of eighteen corners they're obviously not working and something needs to change.

We need the delivery man that's the change we need! [emoji12]


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Real Emerald
13-11-2016, 02:00 PM
[QUOTE=Highland_Hibee;4858295]We need the delivery man that's the change we need! [emoji12]

Now that would be nice! We also miss Keatings as he seems to be the only one who can deliver a dangerous ball.

Highland_Hibee
13-11-2016, 02:08 PM
[QUOTE=Highland_Hibee;4858295]We need the delivery man that's the change we need! [emoji12]

Now that would be nice! We also miss Keatings as he seems to be the only one who can deliver a dangerous ball.

Yes Keatings has looked to have a good cross on him and confident with set pieces too.

Our main issue I feel is despite our formation working best for the players we have available we don't have anyone who's soul responsibility is to get down the wing and put the ball in the box.

A player like Carmichael who I'm sure was signed for that very reason never got a look in because we stick with the idea we have to use wingbacks.

IMO if a player like Boyle was told to go work on his crossing he could be a very effective winger.

EDIT- I don't know what happened with your quote but I now appear to be talking to myself.....

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B.H.F.C
13-11-2016, 02:15 PM
Dont know why harris gets a game.He is living on his past glory from cup semi.Better players have been let go

I find it a bit concerning that we are asking him to come on and win us a game. Makes me question the recruitment in the summer.

eastcoasthibby
13-11-2016, 03:30 PM
A number of problems I think with our lack of goals,-
Don't get forward quick enough too many passes in midfield.
Stevenson too often wants an extra touch before trying to deliver result gets blocked by his marker or defenders are standing waiting for any cross..oh or he checks back at the 18 yard box an d goes back ...whip the flinkin ball in early Lewis how many years you been playing !!
Gray ..isn't in the game enough for me and looks like he can't be bothered ..his crossing is marginally better than Stevensons.
Our no.9 plays most of his game outside the box, trying to link play and when it goes wide to go in he hasn't got the legs to get in ..play as a no 9 .Holt .
Holt also plays with too many flicks, while some pay off , I prefer to see him do what he does at times and that's hold the ball in draw defenders to him and then play.
Shoot more often instead of trying to walk it in ..
Vary the corners drag players about ..we go in and stand ..never a deep runner or sitting player at the back of 6 yard box ..for anything deep.
Play with a bit of pace ..it works wonders Boyle did it when he moved to the left and run at defenders ..defenders hate it ..
Midfielder s need to have more shots from edge of the box ..at them ..not just McGinn ..

Perm any 2-3;from those and ourxratio should go up ..well I think so anyway 😊

MWHIBBIES
13-11-2016, 04:19 PM
3 times out of 13 games we've scored more than 2, scored less than Dundee Utd and consistently fail to break down average teams due to our obvious tactics. Cut them open at pace and we'll beat these teams with ease.Boyle is fast, why didn't he murder Falkirk yesterday? Is it perhaps because pace is completely ****ing useless when teams sit on the edge of their 6 yard line for 90 minutes?

Our tactics were just fine when we won 5 games in a row. They have been just fine in the last 3 weeks as well.

Ozyhibby
13-11-2016, 04:29 PM
We probably could have used wingers instead of full backs yesterday. Especially if we are going 3 at the back.
We need some creativity.


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ancient hibee
13-11-2016, 05:03 PM
Boyle is fast, why didn't he murder Falkirk yesterday? Is it perhaps because pace is completely ****ing useless when teams sit on the edge of their 6 yard line for 90 minutes?

Our tactics were just fine when we won 5 games in a row. They have been just fine in the last 3 weeks as well.

Those two banks of four just mean that playing the ball in behind for someone with pace is impossible.Regards the poor corners another fault is the big boys at the back must go charging in with their eyes shut.Frankly they get in the way.

rcarter1
13-11-2016, 07:27 PM
A big tall chap who can cause problems for teams that play the 'packed defence' strategy,would be the highest priority in the Xmas window. I would like to think we have a bit of cash for another body.

Steve20
14-11-2016, 07:44 AM
Been converting fine the last 3 weeks, isnt easy vs 10 defenders.

Teams that want promoted find a way to get past ten men. Dundee Utd managed it last week against Dunfermline.

B.H.F.C
14-11-2016, 08:19 AM
Teams that want promoted find a way to get past ten men. Dundee Utd managed it last week against Dunfermline.

Much as l think we have a lot to improve on, you do know that at this point we have accumulated more points than Dundee Utd?

matty_f
14-11-2016, 08:34 AM
Teams that want promoted find a way to get past ten men. Dundee Utd managed it last week against Dunfermline.

How far ahead of us in the league are they?

We beat 10 man Dunfermline 1-3, by the way.

green day
14-11-2016, 01:01 PM
Teams that want promoted find a way to get past ten men. Dundee Utd managed it last week against Dunfermline.

Know what, I am as peeved as everyone else after Saturday - its frustrating.

But have a look at the table -

Our "awful" goals for is only one behind Dundee Utd

Our "pathetic, useless, zonal defence" has only conceded 7 goals

This adds up to a better GD than Dundee United and still a point clear - and they are on an amazing run !!!

So - in summary, yes it was a PITA on Saturday, Yes I would prefer to be out of sight, but WE ARE STILL TOP OF THE LEAGUE.

Highland_Hibee
14-11-2016, 01:23 PM
Know what, I am as peeved as everyone else after Saturday - its frustrating.

But have a look at the table -

Our "awful" goals for is only one behind Dundee Utd

Our "pathetic, useless, zonal defence" has only conceded 7 goals

This adds up to a better GD than Dundee United and still a point clear - and they are on an amazing run !!!

So - in summary, yes it was a PITA on Saturday, Yes I would prefer to be out of sight, but WE ARE STILL TOP OF THE LEAGUE.

[emoji106]

Too many fans **** the bed and read everything from one match as some kind of metaphor for the way the whole season will go. Everything will pale into insignificance when we are still top of the league come may.


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matty_f
14-11-2016, 01:57 PM
Know what, I am as peeved as everyone else after Saturday - its frustrating.

But have a look at the table -

Our "awful" goals for is only one behind Dundee Utd

Our "pathetic, useless, zonal defence" has only conceded 7 goals

This adds up to a better GD than Dundee United and still a point clear - and they are on an amazing run !!!

So - in summary, yes it was a PITA on Saturday, Yes I would prefer to be out of sight, but WE ARE STILL TOP OF THE LEAGUE.

Well said.

Meanest defence in the country, IIRC. 9 goals in 4 games since we last failed to score (v Raith).

It's hardly yelling out ineptitude, is it?

eastcoasthibby
14-11-2016, 02:51 PM
Sorry ..but the last two posters ...it's not bed wetting nor a slanted view of reality ! It's fact that yes we have a very good defensive record which is the foundation of getting results, but how often can we rely on not conceding, whilst missing too many chances or not creating enough clear cut ones , to keep us in contention.
I don't see it as bed wetting but the reality, what is wrong when we get into the last third of the pitch ?? I think we overplay in that area, too many passes and a reluctance to shoot, also our movement at set pieces is poor, and we put too many bodies in the area, 6 x 2 players in a very tight space, neither wonder the officials state the don't see anything ! Let's get less players in there and see how it works out , with better viewing and one to one's instead of multiple numbers going for any crossball.
The reality is people are reflecting on past experience of our chance after chance missing escapades, that's why we're are still in this league, and if it doesn't improve we will be here next year at this time...A fear laden prediction.!!

mjhibby
14-11-2016, 06:49 PM
Know what, I am as peeved as everyone else after Saturday - its frustrating.

But have a look at the table -

Our "awful" goals for is only one behind Dundee Utd

Our "pathetic, useless, zonal defence" has only conceded 7 goals

This adds up to a better GD than Dundee United and still a point clear - and they are on an amazing run !!!

So - in summary, yes it was a PITA on Saturday, Yes I would prefer to be out of sight, but WE ARE STILL TOP OF THE LEAGUE.

Us hibs fans are an odd bunch. Eternal optimists,easy going and some who beat themselves up when things aren't going right. I'm in the middle group but I must admit surely let's allow Neil Lennon to work out what we need to do. He was very late coming in so we have had the usual rushed preseason and at the moment he has keatings injured,who was playing very well before that,mcgeogh still not fit,cummings not at the races and Fontaine has missed a good chunk of the season. He's already said that he will be strengthening in January and I'm sure we will kick on after the new year. United,although picking up wins aren't playing great and their two games against the pars were turgid and they were lucky to win them and also they only beat Falkirk in the last few minutes when Falkirk missed the best chances. We are top of the league and are well clear of third. We're also nine clear of Falkirk even after Saturdays draw. Let's just take each game as it comes. We are only a third through the season and once keatings is back I'm sure we'll be back banging in the goals. Of course there will be bumps on the road but it's always the way with us is it not. My grey hairs can testify to that.

Unseen work
14-11-2016, 07:08 PM
We don't score enough but also;

Falkirk score with what, there second shot of the game?

Absolutely pathetic defending for the goal.

I don't know if we would of conceded that goal with Marciano as he seems to organise us well.

3 hibs players challenged one Falkirk player for the ball and every player was ridiculously slow to react to the 2nd ball

mjhibby
14-11-2016, 07:35 PM
Yep defence seems more secure with rocky there. Hopefully not out for long.