Tornadoes question

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

I am not old enough to have seen them, so i wondered if anyone could help me with some questions. I was reading tom wright's book and two things struck me -

Firstly how blooming frustrating it is that they didnt win more. Apparently we were third favourites behind leeds utd and ac milan to win the cup winners cup!

Secondly, i have always heard it said that it was never the same after 72/73 yet their best two league finishes came after this 'peak' (consecutive 2nd places) - so what happened there? Was it a case of the opposition weakening?

[G B Young]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves relegated at the end of the decade.

[Sammy7nil]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves relegated at the end of the decade.

That about sums it up very good summary cant argue with any of it.

[brog]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves

relegated at the end of the decade.


A very good summary. Although many of the Celtc European cup winning team had gone by 1972, McNeill & Johnstone both played in the LC final. In addition younger players such as Dalglish, Macari, Hay, Connelly & McGrain had stepped up. A measure of how good Hibs were was shown by Stein playing Jimmy Johnstone on the left in a ( vain ) attempt to curb Brownlie's attacking play. For all we celebrated in May this year, December 1972 was as much of a milestone in that it was our 1st cup of any kind in 70 years & it was our first trophy win at Hampden! A wonderful team.

[Bostonhibby]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves relegated at the end of the decade.
Right on the money I'd say[emoji106]

We had some great European nights and generally ran rings round the now defunct version of Glasgow rangers in those days too.

Sent from my HTC One mini 2 using Tapatalk

[scoopyboy]

I am not old enough to have seen them, so i wondered if anyone could help me with some questions. I was reading tom wright's book and two things struck me -

Firstly how blooming frustrating it is that they didnt win more. Apparently we were third favourites behind leeds utd and ac milan to win the cup winners cup!

Secondly, i have always heard it said that it was never the same after 72/73 yet their best two league finishes came after this 'peak' (consecutive 2nd places) - so what happened there? Was it a case of the opposition weakening?

The Tornadoes didn't actually play all that long as a team.

For example Alan Gordon arrived in January 1972 and departed in November 1974.

Jimmy O'Rourke left in May 1974.

When people speak about the Turnbull Tornadoes they inevitably think of the O'Rourke Gordon partnership, they played less than 2 and a half seasons together.

Mind you what a two and a half seasons it was.:greengrin

[BSEJVT]

Cant multi quote but the posts from GBYoung, Brog & Scoopyboy are all bang on the money

Wonderful wonderful team and a great period to watch Hibs in.

The only downside being that very few games, let alone teams have ever lived up to the absolute joy of watching the Tornadoes in full flow and that has made the last 40 odd years hard viewing at times.

[houstonhibbee]

The Tornadoes didn't actually play all that long as a team.

For example Alan Gordon arrived in January 1972 and departed in November 1974.

Jimmy O'Rourke left in May 1974.

When people speak about the Turnbull Tornadoes they inevitably think of the O'Rourke Gordon partnership, they played less than 2 and a half seasons together.

Mind you what a two and a half seasons it was.:greengrin



Did someone on here not say that the tornados actually only played 22 times as a team?

[scoopyboy]

Did someone on here not say that the tornados actually only played 22 times as a team?

It's possible, I thought it might have been more.

If we are talking about the exact same team that won the League Cup and beat Hearts 7-0 then that could well be right.

John Brownlie broke his leg the game after 7-0 which meant him and Alan Gordon were teammates for less than a calendar year.

Alex Edwards served a long suspension not long afterwards so it would all add up.

[Onion]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves relegated at the end of the decade.

Yip, good sum up. Folk forget just how good a team Celtic had in the early 70's (European Cup Finalists in 1970), and were the only reason Hibs didn't win much more.

[Earlydelivery]

An absolute fantastic side only bettered by a great Celtic side that frequently went to latter stages of European cup , I'm sure joe Harper's debut was at Falkirk and at that time you could hop on special buses from St. Andrews sq bus station (which I did ) brockville was rammed to rafters I personally think that was the end off the tornadoes when Jimmy left for him but for me the tornadoes were the greatest Scottish side ever , never to win a championship what fantastic memories they gave me as a very young teenager

[Tom Hart RIP]

Did someone on here not say that the tornados actually only played 22 times as a team?

I'm believe they played 22, won 19 drew 2 and only list 1 which was the 2-1 home leg against Sporting Lisbon.
Never played together after East Fife game.
Would have loved to see more trophies but it was their brand of football that made them special.

[Smiggy 7-0]

I am not old enough to have seen them, so i wondered if anyone could help me with some questions. I was reading tom wright's book and two things struck me -

Firstly how blooming frustrating it is that they didnt win more. Apparently we were third favourites behind leeds utd and ac milan to win the cup winners cup!

Secondly, i have always heard it said that it was never the same after 72/73 yet their best two league finishes came after this 'peak' (consecutive 2nd places) - so what happened there? Was it a case of the opposition weakening? Best Hibs team think I will ever see as we feared NOBODY and went out expecting to win every game, and mostly did. Would agree with other posters the arrival of Harper (even though he scored many a goal) was the end. Was at the corner old east/shed when JB broke his leg, where you clearly heard it happen even though it happened at the other end of the west (ouch).
TORNADOES v FAMOUS FIVE years, my late dad and I could never agree who were all round better. For me it was TORNADOES, for him it was FAMOUS FIVE (I wasn't alive to see the five so can't comment).
Difference being, FF won more. But I will never change my mind.

[houstonhibbee]

Turnballs Tornadoes in my mind refers to 11 players (plus John Hazel as the sub) rather than an era

These 11 players played together from pre 1972 SCF which we lost (but didn't include cropley who was injured?) until the East Fife game in early Jan 1973 when they were top of the league. During that period they broke all kinds of scoring records including the LCF win but fell away towards the end of 72-73 season due to aforementioned injuries and suspensions - including losing 3-0 in Split in the CWC QF second which put us out - and was the catalyst that led Turnbull to dismantle that team in an attempt to make it better

Paradoxically he changed the forwards rather than the defense (1-6 to Celtic) and should have strengthened CH and GK rather than forward line.............

[snooky]

The reason TT's didn't win more was lack of cover in key positions.
Alex Edwards was suspended a lot mainly due to teams goading him and playing on his firey temper. (He never got the protection he deserved)
Joe Harper was brought in but despite his scoring record, his persona never 'fitted in'. (He was the Hibs' Yoko Ono)
Although a decent CH, Jim Black always seemed to have a mare against Dixie Dean's which didn't help.
Onion's broken leg (I heard the crack too) was probably the moment the Tornados ironically broke up as well.
Paddy says that Turnbull upped the training when they went top of the league and this overstressed the players. Who am I to argue with either of those Hibs legends?

For me, what made the Tornados great was the individual skills and the variety of the mix that all blended into one.

They were the best team I've ever seen and I feel honoured that I was one of the thousands of fans that experienced their magic. Thank you, lads

[Dashing Bob S]

Yip, good sum up. Folk forget just how good a team Celtic had in the early 70's (European Cup Finalists in 1970), and were the only reason Hibs didn't win much more.

The real difference was Stein. Turnbull had as good, if not better players than Celtic. He was at least as astute tactically. But Hibs players would never play for him like Celtic, Hibs or Dunfermline players did for Stein. Turnbull was too gruff and dogmatic with the players. He was feared, but Stein was loved.

Turnbull had a few victories against him, first at Hibs then at A'deen, but could never get past him at either.

[MM19]

I'm believe they played 22, won 19 drew 2 and only list 1 which was the 2-1 home leg against Sporting Lisbon.
Never played together after East Fife game.
Would have loved to see more trophies but it was their brand of football that made them special.

They lost the away leg against Sporting Lisbon and won the home leg 6-1. It was 1-1 at half time. It was another brilliant European night though there seemed to be quite a lot of them.

[snooky]

I'm believe they played 22, won 19 drew 2 and only list 1 which was the 2-1 home leg against Sporting Lisbon.
Never played together after East Fife game.
Would have loved to see more trophies but it was their brand of football that made them special.

Oddly enough, I think it was Jimmy O'R that said the Sporting Lisbon away result was Hibs best result in Europe despite losing by one goal. Hibs did play really well that night.

[cmcd]

Turnballs Tornadoes in my mind refers to 11 players (plus John Hazel as the sub) rather than an era

These 11 players played together from pre 1972 SCF which we lost (but didn't include cropley who was injured?) until the East Fife game in early Jan 1973 when they were top of the league. During that period they broke all kinds of scoring records including the LCF win but fell away towards the end of 72-73 season due to aforementioned injuries and suspensions - including losing 3-0 in Split in the CWC QF second which put us out - and was the catalyst that led Turnbull to dismantle that team in an attempt to make it better

Paradoxically he changed the forwards rather than the defense (1-6 to Celtic) and should have strengthened CH and GK rather than forward line.............

I agree the loss of Brownlie was crucial but Edwards long suspension was also . I also agree that Turnbull broke the team up too early .Gordon and Jim Orourke were scoring for fun so why change a striker when it was a Centre back we needed .As much as I liked ET he made some strange decisions latterly

[snooky]

They lost the away leg against Sporting Lisbon and won the home leg 6-1. It was 1-1 at half time. It was another brilliant European night though there seemed to be quite a lot of them.

Aye, playing doon the slope second half!

[Kato]

He was at least as astute tactically.

Turnbull was miles ahead of Stein tactically. Bobby Murdoch and Bertie Auld were the main architects of Celtics tactics back then, Stein being almost fully a "man-manager". Not a coincidence that as soon as Stein was given the Scotland job he brought Turnbull in as his assistant.

[AndyM_1875]

Turnbull was miles ahead of Stein tactically. Bobby Murdoch and Bertie Auld were the main architects of Celtics tactics back then, Stein being almost fully a "man-manager". Not a coincidence that as soon as Stein was given the Scotland job he brought Turnbull in as his assistant.

Stein was a genius at delegation though. He used Turnbull as an assistant and also grabbed Alex Ferguson later on in his Scotland career. He also used a young coach called Andy Roxburgh and identified him as a future Scotland manager.

Anyway.. back on topic...

[MM19]

Aye, playing doon the slope second half!


It always seemed to be playing doon the slope that they were brilliant

[Ray_]

Turnballs Tornadoes in my mind refers to 11 players (plus John Hamilton as the sub) rather than an era

These 11 players played together from pre 1972 SCF which we lost (but didn't include cropley who was injured?) until the East Fife game in early Jan 1973 when they were top of the league. During that period they broke all kinds of scoring records including the LCF win but fell away towards the end of 72-73 season due to aforementioned injuries and suspensions - including losing 3-0 in Split in the CWC QF second which put us out - and was the catalyst that led Turnbull to dismantle that team in an attempt to make it better

Paradoxically he changed the forwards rather than the defense (1-6 to Celtic) and should have strengthened CH and GK rather than forward line.............

We had no depth at all, Johnny Hamilton was the usual sub & was surprisingly released after the 72/3 season, when he joined Rangers on a free. John Hazel was another, but often a target for the boo boys. John Hazel scored a great goal against Hearts on the way to the 1971 semi & the follow year, when Hibs again played in the semi, he had a superb game playing centre forward playing against der hun, but on the whole, he wasn't good enough, left to join Morton [I think] and then just faded out of things.

Ned was too stubborn with little man management skills, hooking Alex Edwards [when he was a little "under the weather"] instead of the "arm around the shoulder" at half time, when we were leading Celtic at parkhead, with wee mickey running the show was an example of that. This game was two weeks to the day after the 72 league cup final and celtic had their noses in front of us in the league at this time. With mickey hooked, we lost control of the game and this cost us a point and gave our rivals one as well. It is well documented that the 7-0 put us top of the league, but it was the 5ft goal that put us top [goal difference] and celtic had a game in hand, so not getting the full points at parkhead, a week or so before the derby, at the time was a big thing.

Once Onion broke his leg, five days after the derby slaughter, our next game was against Dundee United, in Dundee, we had already pumped them 5-1 there in the league cup and with Des Bremner [recently signed from the highland league] making his debut in Onions position, we were beaten and from then until the end of the season, we'd have the odd renaissance's [scottish cup games against der hun] extremely unluckily beaten by a goal three yards offside, after we had pummeled them for 90 minutes in the ER replay.

Those performances like against rangers were too few and far between and by the time we came to our our final game, a vastly inferior rangers had overtaken us in the league. The last game that season was at ER against celtic, with the likes of Bobby Smith playing and celtic went off with a very easy 3-0 victory.

The following two season's, Hibs were back to their inconsistent best [even although they finished both season's second]. Given the quality of the players Hibs had, they could beat celtic and rangers again in holding on to the Drybrough and play the best team down south, off the park, in both legs, but they totally lacked the consistency to keep up those high levels of performance [during season 73/4]. The following season was much the same, beating rangers home and away in the league cup and getting 11 goals taken off us by celtic over two games in a fortnight during that autumn.

[Kato]

Stein was a genius at delegation though.


Without doubt. Stein's genius was getting the best out of everyone's talents.

[Ray_]

Turnbull was miles ahead of Stein tactically. Bobby Murdoch and Bertie Auld were the main architects of Celtics tactics back then, Stein being almost fully a "man-manager". Not a coincidence that as soon as Stein was given the Scotland job he brought Turnbull in as his assistant.

Auld joined Hibs the same time as Turnbull did in July 71, their debut against Boro was the famous Nobby Stiles V Bertie Auld, in which Stiles was carried off after an attempt at going in late against the then hibs midfielder, Bertie was too canny for him, rode the tackle and made sure he done some damage on the way down. :)

[greenpaper55]

As a previous poster mentioned Jim Black was the weak link in the team at the back But Turnbull stuck by him when everyone could see we needed better, only when the team was in decline did he sign George Stewart but it was two seasons to late. Turnbull also played John Hazel in some big games but to many he just was not up to the standard that we needed but Ned was a stubborn man who took no criticism, there was also no love lost between Stanton and Turnbull but give Pat his due it never stopped him giving his all for the team. Having said all that when they were at their best they were a joy to watch and played football of such a high standard that even after all these years no Hibs team has come close to playing like they did.

[Cheshire Hibby]

The reason TT's didn't win more was lack of cover in key positions.
Alex Edwards was suspended a lot mainly due to teams goading him and playing on his firey temper. (He never got the protection he deserved)
Joe Harper was brought in but despite his scoring record, his persona never 'fitted in'. (He was the Hibs' Yoko Ono)
Although a decent CH, Jim Black always seemed to have a mare against Dixie Dean's which didn't help.
Onion's broken leg (I heard the crack too) was probably the moment the Tornados ironically broke up as well.
Paddy says that Turnbull upped the training when they went top of the league and this overstressed the players. Who am I to argue with either of those Hibs legends?

For me, what made the Tornados great was the individual skills and the variety of the mix that all blended into one.

They were the best team I've ever seen and I feel honoured that I was one of the thousands of fans that experienced their magic. Thank you, lads


I agree. They were the best Hibs team, I have seen but we are talking about the first eleven only. Looking back, the squad lacked depth. We had, Johnny Hamilton and John Hazel but I cannot recall many others. Johnny Hamilton's goal in around 10 seconds at Falkirk is a strong memory of the era as is the LC win in December 72 and of course 01/01/73. European nights were brilliant and I remember feeling we were good enough to go to the ECWC Final. Hadjuk Split put us out, signalling the end of the Tornadoes. I was a teenager in the Dunbar Road end when my hero of the time, John Brownlie had his leg broken. The whole ground heard the bone break. Alex Edwards suspension coupled with Brownlies absence really weakened the right side of the team and stopped our challenge to Celtic.

Like the post above, it was this team that started my now 45 years of Hibernian support and I too feel privleged to have seen them. Simply fantastic football.

I hope that in 45 years time, young fans of today who have seen our beloved Hibernian win the Scottish Cup will look back to that win as the end of a dire period and the start of the third great Hibernian era. GGTTH

[killie-hibby]

While at their peak a Tornadoes match was shown on Match of the Day.While summarising,Jimmy Hill expressed an opinion that both Hibs and Celtic be invited to join the English league.Yes,at that time,both teams were at least equal to the top English clubs.
Don't know if MOTD was broadcast to Scotland at that time.If it was I hope management and supporters of the club formerly known as Rangers were watching and listening.
Are any netters aware if any other Scottish league game has been shown on MOTD?

[ancient hibee]

A very good summary. Although many of the Celtc European cup winning team had gone by 1972, McNeill & Johnstone both played in the LC final. In addition younger players such as Dalglish, Macari, Hay, Connelly & McGrain had stepped up. A measure of how good Hibs were was shown by Stein playing Jimmy Johnstone on the left in a ( vain ) attempt to curb Brownlie's attacking play. For all we celebrated in May this year, December 1972 was as much of a milestone in that it was our 1st cup of any kind in 70 years & it was our first trophy win at Hampden! A wonderful team.

What a boob that was by Stein.The minute I saw Johnstone on the left I knew we would win because he'd made it obvious he was afraid of our attacking triangle down the right.Never known Celtic to do something like that.As it was they got away with a 2-1 when it could easily have been 5 or 6.
Convinced that if George Stewart had been signed 2/3 seasons earlier we would have won the league.Jim Black was sound but regularly got taken to the cleaners by Deans.

[McD]

I'm too young to remember them (or even see them), but the way my dad's eyes light up when they come into conversation says it all :flag:

[emerald green]

I am not old enough to have seen them, so i wondered if anyone could help me with some questions. I was reading tom wright's book and two things struck me -

Firstly how blooming frustrating it is that they didnt win more. Apparently we were third favourites behind leeds utd and ac milan to win the cup winners cup!

Secondly, i have always heard it said that it was never the same after 72/73 yet their best two league finishes came after this 'peak' (consecutive 2nd places) - so what happened there? Was it a case of the opposition weakening?

I note you were reading Tom Wright's book. I've not read that book, so I don't know how much detail it contains about Turnbull's Tornadoes.

I would however recommend Ted Brack's book -"There is a Bonny Fitba Team". Chapter 8 of the book is devoted entirely to Turnbull's Tornadoes. That will tell you all you need to know.

I could go on for ages about what a great football team they were, the great players (I don't use that description easily or lightly), and how a great team with its best years ahead of it was to be systematically dismantled on the whim of Eddie Turnbull.

Coincidentally, the Saturday after TTs won the League Cup after beating a brilliant Celtic team at Hampden, Hibs entertained Ayr United at ER. Before the game, the Hibs youth team carried both the League Cup & Drybrough Cup round the pitch. There was no nonsense that day as Hibs annihilated Ayr United 8-1.

[brog]

While at their peak a Tornadoes match was shown on Match of the Day.While summarising,Jimmy Hill expressed an opinion that both Hibs and Celtic be invited to join the English league.Yes,at that time,both teams were at least equal to the top English clubs.
Don't know if MOTD was broadcast to Scotland at that time.If it was I hope management and supporters of the club formerly known as Rangers were watching and listening.
Are any netters aware if any other Scottish league game has been shown on MOTD?

I don't remember us being on MOTD though I remember the English media being very complimentary & somewhat surprised by our excellent performance against Leeds at Elland Road. That game got extensive TV coverage all over the UK..

[Bishop Hibee]

I'm really too young to have appreciated the Tornadoes although the first Hibs goal I remember was a Gordon header in a 0-1 win at East Fife in November '72.

One of the saddest things I've ever heard was at one of Ted Brack's book launches when John Blackley apologised to all there for the team not fulfilling their potential. Those present made it clear no apology was needed and the great memories many present had of this great team sustained them in dark times afterwards.

[Lago]

All I can say is that I was privileged to watch them, the anticipation of going to Easter Road on a Saturday to see that team, I don't think I'll feel that again.

[Jonnyboy]

Oddly enough, I think it was Jimmy O'R that said the Sporting Lisbon away result was Hibs best result in Europe despite losing by one goal. Hibs did play really well that night.

Was actually Pat Stanton though knowing Jimmy, he probably claimed it :greengrin

[LoaningCrHibbie]

While at their peak a Tornadoes match was shown on Match of the Day.While summarising,Jimmy Hill expressed an opinion that both Hibs and Celtic be invited to join the English league.Yes,at that time,both teams were at least equal to the top English clubs.
Don't know if MOTD was broadcast to Scotland at that time.If it was I hope management and supporters of the club formerly known as Rangers were watching and listening.
Are any netters aware if any other Scottish league game has been shown on MOTD?

I've asked for help with your question on another forum I'm a member of. I'll let you know if I get an answer.

[LoaningCrHibbie]

Was actually Pat Stanton though knowing Jimmy, he probably claimed it :greengrin

Pat Stanton said: "Sporting should'nt make any advance arrangements for the second round" (Evening News 14/09/72)

Also, Stewart Brown of the Evening News recalled that after the 1st leg John Brownlie remarked: "They won't know what hits them when we get them down the hill at Easter Road" (Evening News 28/09/72)

[killie-hibby]

I don't remember us being on MOTD though I remember the English media being very complimentary & somewhat surprised by our excellent performance against Leeds at Elland Road. That game got extensive TV coverage all over the UK..

I lived in Oxford at time of my viewing the programme .What I wanted to know is, was it broadcast to Scotland?

[blackpoolhibs]

The 6-1 Sporting Lisbon game is probably the game where i think is the best atmosphere i have ever been in at a Hibs game.

Even better than Liverpool or Leeds or AEK, the ground was rocking that night and it's stayed with me since.:top marks

[killie-hibby]

I don't remember us being on MOTD though I remember the English media being very complimentary & somewhat surprised by our excellent performance against Leeds at Elland Road. That game got extensive TV coverage all over the UK..


Was at the game. Unfortunately my memory only allows me to say we should have won. What I do remember specifically was several Hibs supporters dancing on the pub tables before the game . Absolutely no malice or trouble , the locals genuinely appreciated the entertainment.

[snooky]

I lived in Oxford at time of my viewing the programme .What I wanted to know is, was it broadcast to Scotland?

Not as I recall. But as I've said before, some of mates went down to the game at Leeds and they said Tony Higgins played a blinder.
I have no visual memory of the game so it probably wasn't shown up here.

[snooky]

Was actually Pat Stanton though knowing Jimmy, he probably claimed it :greengrin

You are correct Jonnyboy. I knew it was one or the other. I had an inkling it might have been Pat but plumped for Jimmy instead.
(Matches my luck at pitch and toss :wink:)

[JimBHibees]

Not as I recall. But as I've said before, some of mates went down to the game at Leeds and they said Tony Higgins played a blinder.
I have no visual memory of the game so it probably wasn't shown up here.

Definitely was on tv. Hibs were brilliant and should have won by 3 or 4 but couldn't score. The home game was one of the most frustrating ever. Should have horsed them. Billy bremner was sensational and held them together.

[blackpoolhibs]

Not as I recall. But as I've said before, some of mates went down to the game at Leeds and they said Tony Higgins played a blinder.
I have no visual memory of the game so it probably wasn't shown up here.

Higgins should have scored from about 5 yards out, but as Tony usually did, he couldn't get off the bloody ground to get his head on the cross.

[eastterrace]

Was at the game. Unfortunately my memory only allows me to say we should have won. What I do remember specifically was several Hibs supporters dancing on the pub tables before the game . Absolutely no malice or trouble , the locals genuinely appreciated the entertainment. yes I was down at elland road and we were dancing on the tables in the pub across the road from the ground great memories

[Ray_]

Not as I recall. But as I've said before, some of mates went down to the game at Leeds and they said Tony Higgins played a blinder.
I have no visual memory of the game so it probably wasn't shown up here.

I'm sure the program it was on was "Sportsnight with Coleman", the infamous David Coleman who was often very critical of Scottish football.

[Lago]

Not as I recall. But as I've said before, some of mates went down to the game at Leeds and they said Tony Higgins played a blinder.
I have no visual memory of the game so it probably wasn't shown up here.
Game was on TV, they were absolutely raving about the hibs play. I was iving in Stevenage at the time & can remember going intonwork the next to be asked all about the hibs.

[brog]

Higgins should have scored from about 5 yards out, but as Tony usually did, he couldn't get off the bloody ground to get his head on the cross.

Unfortunately Tony did get the top of his head on the cross but as you say he was about 6 inches off the ground & put it over the bar. Even worse, Gordon was right behind him with an empty net beckoning! Great performance though & some support, 6,000 IIRC.

[Edson Arantes]

Best Hibs team ever.

In my opinion, Alex Cropley was the most gifted number 10 ever.

[Ray_]

Game was on TV, they were absolutely raving about the hibs play. I was iving in Stevenage at the time & can remember going intonwork the next to be asked all about the hibs.

I had the same thing, I had recently moved to just outside Manchester and my boss was from Northern Ireland. Our first conversation, on my first day, soon got around to football. He mentioned the home international game from that May, when they beat us 1-0 at Hampden. He was impressed when I said that I had gone to the match. He asked about the game and in particular, what I thought of the goal scorer. I was very truthful that it was all Scotland and that the goal was the only thing the player had done.

My boss then said that was his brother, he was a Man Utd player at the time. After that we got on really well and of course I was going on about Hibs and I hadn't been there all that long when we played Leeds, when I went in the following morning he was saying how incredibly good Hibs were. Leeds at that time were on a winning run in the English league that went on and set the record of games won on the trot and they were streets ahead of all the other teams in their league that season and Hibs went down there and tore them apart.

[LoaningCrHibbie]

While at their peak a Tornadoes match was shown on Match of the Day.While summarising,Jimmy Hill expressed an opinion that both Hibs and Celtic be invited to join the English league.Yes,at that time,both teams were at least equal to the top English clubs.
Don't know if MOTD was broadcast to Scotland at that time.If it was I hope management and supporters of the club formerly known as Rangers were watching and listening.
Are any netters aware if any other Scottish league game has been shown on MOTD?

I've just had a reply from renowned Scottish football author Ronnie McDevitt here's what he had to say...

Can't say 100% but it would almost certainly have been either (or both) of the 1972 or 1974 League Cup Finals (both Hibs V Celtic and of course covered by BBC Scotland) and likely just the goals.

If the Hill quote is accurate it suggests it was a match between the Greens.

Also the 1971 League Cup was definitely featured on MOTD although it was a headline grabber due to the margin of Partick Thistles shock victory.

The first leg of Hibs V Liverpool in the UEFA Cup was shown on Sportsnight in late 1975 so the poster may be thinking of this although David Coleman would have been presenting but I do recall Hill contributing on some editions.

[killie-hibby]

I've just had a reply from renowned Scottish football author Ronnie McDevitt here's what he had to say...

Can't say 100% but it would almost certainly have been either (or both) of the 1972 or 1974 League Cup Finals (both Hibs V Celtic and of course covered by BBC Scotland) and likely just the goals.

If the Hill quote is accurate it suggests it was a match between the Greens.

Also the 1971 League Cup was definitely featured on MOTD although it was a headline grabber due to the margin of Partick Thistles shock victory.

The first leg of Hibs V Liverpool in the UEFA Cup was shown on Sportsnight in late 1975 so the poster may be thinking of this although David Coleman would have been presenting but I do recall Hill contributing on some editions.

Thanks for researching my query.
I am certain it was a Hibs league match on MOTD. Dont remember if they showed highlights or just the goals. I am sure Hill presented the programme. Whoever did present it,wanted Hibs and Celtic in the English league. I was in Oxford at the time of this league game. I was in Scotland for both of the 1972 and 1974 LC finals so could not have watched them on telly in England.
This thread highlights how good Hibs were then, that they actually got positive publicity from English based commentators. Unfortunately, Sky TV has ensured that we are no longer equal to top English clubs. I feel very lucky to have seen the Baker Boy and Turnbulls team. Younger supporters can only dream of,the great football older guys like me have seen at ER.

[monktonharp]

They were unlucky to peak at the same time Celtic were in the middle of their 9-in-a-row era. Otherwise they might well have won a league title and another cup final or two. Rangers were always beatable at that time.

Celtic's decline (if you can call it that) didn't really start until Hibs had also weakened with the break-up of the classic Tornadoes line-up. The majority of Hibs fans who watched the team then point to the arrival of Joe Harper as the end of an era. Great striker who did score a lot of goals, but it meant the end of the very popular Gordon/O'Rourke pairing up front which yielded a phenomenal amount of goals. Many of the Tornadoes team have since said they felt Eddie Turnbull broke up the team too soon having decided after we blew a great chance to get to the semi-final of the Cup Winners Cup that we weren't strong enough.

Another factor was John Brownlie breaking his leg the week after the 7-0 game. Coupled with a long suspension for Alex Edwards it definitely affected our hopes of winning the title that season.

Nevertheless, we remained a club which competed at the top end of the table for a few more years and at the time you refer to it was unthinkable that we would find ourselves relegated at the end of the decade.:agree: that virtually sums it up for me. also, well infront of Hadyuk bSplit at ER and won 4-2. should have been better but lost out in the second leg QF.. outplayed by Juventus after leading, they brought on a rather plump looking sub late on called ALTAFINI. he destroyed us in minutes with 2 goals. looked like he liked a pizza now and then but what a performance. the Tornados team had some special players and scored by the barrowload. was very unfair that they did not win much in terms of trophies

[monktonharp]

yes I was down at elland road and we were dancing on the tables in the pub across the road from the ground great memorieswas there too. pub called the Peacock, or the pheasant. was fantastic night and yes, we outplayed them with 8000 Hibs fans there.

[LoaningCrHibbie]

Thanks for researching my query.
I am certain it was a Hibs league match on MOTD. Dont remember if they showed highlights or just the goals. I am sure Hill presented the programme. Whoever did present it,wanted Hibs and Celtic in the English league. I was in Oxford at the time of this league game. I was in Scotland for both of the 1972 and 1974 LC finals so could not have watched them on telly in England.
This thread highlights how good Hibs were then, that they actually got positive publicity from English based commentators. Unfortunately, Sky TV has ensured that we are no longer equal to top English clubs. I feel very lucky to have seen the Baker Boy and Turnbulls team. Younger supporters can only dream of,the great football older guys like me have seen at ER.

Pleasure researching Hibs, especially the Tornadoes, what a team! the best Hibs team I've ever seen or will probably ever see. I was at the away games at Elland Road and before that down at Anfield.

I was a teenager at the time and just took the Tornadoes for granted, never stopping to realise that I was lucky to be seeing such a team. Also the League Cup win and destroying THEM at Tynecastle. Great days.

I agree with previous posters that say we were unfortunate not to have won more, even to have won the league. But Celtic had such a great team. It just shows you how great our team was that we got within 4 points of them in 1973/74 season I think.

By the way another poster on my other forum got back to me and said... Bear in mind that Jimmy Hill's first season presenting MOTD was 1973/74. Before that he worked on LWT's The Big Match.

So it looks as though the match you remember was possibly the 1973/74 season?

[brog]

I've just had a reply from renowned Scottish football author Ronnie McDevitt here's what he had to say...

Can't say 100% but it would almost certainly have been either (or both) of the 1972 or 1974 League Cup Finals (both Hibs V Celtic and of course covered by BBC Scotland) and likely just the goals.

If the Hill quote is accurate it suggests it was a match between the Greens.

Also the 1971 League Cup was definitely featured on MOTD although it was a headline grabber due to the margin of Partick Thistles shock victory.

The first leg of Hibs V Liverpool in the UEFA Cup was shown on Sportsnight in late 1975 so the poster may be thinking of this although David Coleman would have been presenting but I do recall Hill contributing on some editions.

I really do think you're getting confused with the Leeds game. I rarely missed a Tornadoes game & can't recall any league game on tv. The reason Hibs & Celtc would both havr been mentioned was we were the top 2 in the league at that time & also the memory of Celtc beating Leeds in European Cup was stil fresh in the mind.

[Kato]

a rather plump looking sub late on called ALTAFINI.

Incredible appearance from him. Came on looking like a grandad but was head and shoulders above everyone
else on the pitch.

14 years beforehand he had won the 1958 with Brazil and when you see his stats it truly was a privilege to see him at ER.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Altafini

[LoaningCrHibbie]

I really do think you're getting confused with the Leeds game. I rarely missed a Tornadoes game & can't recall any league game on tv. The reason Hibs & Celtc would both havr been mentioned was we were the top 2 in the league at that time & also the memory of Celtc beating Leeds in European Cup was stil fresh in the mind.

No, you misunderstand I was quoting Ronnie McDevitt who's the author of a few football books in the past. Those are Ronnie's thoughts not mine.

moving on, I think I'm right in saying that Tom Hart denied us some great memories by banning the TV cameras from Easter Road on more than one occasion just when we had a fantastic side. I'm sure I've seen some stuff in old newspapers about the ban.

Tom Hart did some great things for Hibs but banning the cameras was'nt one of them.

[scoopyboy]

No, you misunderstand I was quoting Ronnie McDevitt who's the author of a few football books in the past. Those are Ronnie's thoughts not mine.

moving on, I think I'm right in saying that Tom Hart denied us some great memories by banning the TV cameras from Easter Road on more than one occasion just when we had a fantastic side. I'm sure I've seen some stuff in old newspapers about the ban.

Tom Hart did some great things for Hibs but banning the cameras was'nt one of them.

I think by the time he banned them we had a crap side.

[killie-hibby]

I really do think you're getting confused with the Leeds game. I rarely missed a Tornadoes game & can't recall any league game on tv. The reason Hibs & Celtc would both havr been mentioned was we were the top 2 in the league at that time & also the memory of Celtc beating Leeds in European Cup was stil fresh in the mind.

It was definitely a Hibs league match shown on MOTD. Is it possible that this specific programme was not shown in Scotland. LoaningCrHibbie contacted an author to help clarification. The cup finals mentioned by him,I attended,therefore did not see the highlights on TV. I also travelled up for the European ties.
My initial question was asking if any other Scottish league match has been shown on MOTD in England. Whatever the answer it's a great credit to Turnbull and Hibs that programmers in England showed an interest.

[greenpaper55]

Altafini, came on and turned the match for Juve, i think it was shades who was vainly trying to claim for offside but he had timed his run to perfection, just looking at his stats i wonder if he was in the Napoli side that we beat ? Changed days indeed when you look at the level of opposition we were playing back then, i doubt we will see the likes ever again as the gulf between the rich clubs and the rest seems to widen every year.

[Jonnyboy]

Altafini, came on and turned the match for Juve, i think it was shades who was vainly trying to claim for offside but he had timed his run to perfection, just looking at his stats i wonder if he was in the Napoli side that we beat ? Changed days indeed when you look at the level of opposition we were playing back then, i doubt we will see the likes ever again as the gulf between the rich clubs and the rest seems to widen every year.

Altafini played in the first leg which Napoli won 4-1
So confident of going through, Napoli left Altafini at home for the return leg and the rest, as they say, is history :greengrin
When he played for Juventus at ER he was around 35 or 36 but had blistering pace as well as mountains of skill. One of the best players I've ever seen

[Earlydelivery]

There's a small snippet of action on tornadoes DVD at Elland road that many hibs fans down that we had to go on the huge home terracing couldn't get in behind goals , we outplayed them over 2 legs and the year after they played in European cup final that's how good the tornadoes where

[blackpoolhibs]

Not sure of the dates or years, but there was a regular spot on match of the day at the end, for a 2 or 3 minute snippet of the match of the day in Scotland.

[hibeerealist]

IF my memory serves me well KH, in the programme for one of the European ties against Liverpool, in the days before this corrupt seeding, it was said that the teams were jointly ranked 14th in Europe and unfortunately drawn each other in an early round of the competition.

We are light years behind Liverpool now but that was then and the Tornadoes put may teams to the sword in getting that ranking.



While at their peak a Tornadoes match was shown on Match of the Day.While summarising,Jimmy Hill expressed an opinion that both Hibs and Celtic be invited to join the English league.Yes,at that time,both teams were at least equal to the top English clubs.
Don't know if MOTD was broadcast to Scotland at that time.If it was I hope management and supporters of the club formerly known as Rangers were watching and listening.
Are any netters aware if any other Scottish league game has been shown on MOTD?

[brog]

No, you misunderstand I was quoting Ronnie McDevitt who's the author of a few football books in the past. Those are Ronnie's thoughts not mine.

moving on, I think I'm right in saying that Tom Hart denied us some great memories by banning the TV cameras from Easter Road on more than one occasion just when we had a fantastic side. I'm sure I've seen some stuff in old newspapers about the ban.

Tom Hart did some great things for Hibs but banning the cameras was'nt one of them.

Sorry, my comments were intended for Killie Hibby who has responded. Re the TV ban IIRC it was at the time we were sponsored by Bukta, Hibs were 1st UK club with sponsorship. BBC refused to cover Hibs games because of the logos being shown & in return the SFA or League pulled the plug on TV broadcasts. It was a short lived ban I think, I believe we compromised by wearing our away strip with a smaller logo. Of course Bukta were delighted, they got more publicity than they could have dreamed of!! Changed days! The Bukta days were of course post Tornadoes.

[Peevemor]

Sorry, my comments were intended for Killie Hibby who has responded. Re the TV ban IIRC it was at the time we were sponsored by Bukta, Hibs were 1st UK club with sponsorship. BBC refused to cover Hibs games because of the logos being shown & in return the SFA or League pulled the plug on TV broadcasts. It was a short lived ban I think, I believe we compromised by wearing our away strip with a smaller logo. Of course Bukta were delighted, they got more publicity than they could have dreamed of!! Changed days! The Bukta days were of course post Tornadoes.

That's where the first purple strip came from. It was produced and worn for tv games. Of course, the fact that Hibs were wearing a different strip meant people, including commentators and journalists, talked about why.

[lapsedhibee]

The real difference was Stein. Turnbull had as good, if not better players than Celtic. He was at least as astute tactically. But Hibs players would never play for him like Celtic, Hibs or Dunfermline players did for Stein. Turnbull was too gruff and dogmatic with the players. He was feared, but Stein was loved.

Turnbull had a few victories against him, first at Hibs then at A'deen, but could never get past him at either.

Other way round :nerd:

[LoaningCrHibbie]

Sorry, my comments were intended for Killie Hibby who has responded. Re the TV ban IIRC it was at the time we were sponsored by Bukta, Hibs were 1st UK club with sponsorship. BBC refused to cover Hibs games because of the logos being shown & in return the SFA or League pulled the plug on TV broadcasts. It was a short lived ban I think, I believe we compromised by wearing our away strip with a smaller logo. Of course Bukta were delighted, they got more publicity than they could have dreamed of!! Changed days! The Bukta days were of course post Tornadoes.

Thanks for the reply Brog. I take on board what you say about Bukta, but I've got a feeling that Tom Harts' ban on TV coverage actually pre-dated our sponsored shirt deal?

I'll start investigating this and let you know

[O'Rourke3]

David Coleman gushing over Hibs on the telly was the first leg at Elland Road. Niddrie ran the show and Coleman could not believe the range of his passing. I still can't believe we lost that tie....

[Ray_]

David Coleman gushing over Hibs on the telly was the first leg at Elland Road. Niddrie ran the show and Coleman could not believe the range of his passing. I still can't believe we lost that tie....

Absolutely superb, as was Higgins and Cropley, they totally dominated the then English league leaders and subsequent league champions. The following season Leeds made it to the European cup final where they succumbed to Bayern's triple winning team. This is an indication of the levels Hibs could achieve, if only they had the consistency of the Glasgow teams.

[snooky]

That's where the first purple strip came from. It was produced and worn for tv games. Of course, the fact that Hibs were wearing a different strip meant people, including commentators and journalists, talked about why.

The first time Hibs played in anything other than green and white was the away tie at Sporting Lisbon 13 Sept 1972.
The top was like a normal Hibs strip of that era but the green part was purple.

[ihibs7]

Incredible appearance from him. Came on looking like a grandad but was head and shoulders above everyone
else on the pitch.

14 years beforehand he had won the 1958 with Brazil and when you see his stats it truly was a privilege to see him at ER.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Altafini

Probably inspired by the famous five when they visited Brazil.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dchibs]

Absolutely superb, as was Higgins and Cropley, they totally dominated the then English league leaders and subsequent league champions. The following season Leeds made it to the European cup final where they succumbed to Bayern's triple winning team. This is an indication of the levels Hibs could achieve, if only they had the consistency of the Glasgow teams.
Hibs played brilliant against Leeds, Higgins was twice through one on one v Harvey and missed both chances. i will always remember getting onto the Hibs bus after the game at Eiiand rd to get sir pats and my favorite Aiex Edwards autographs.

[snooky]

Probably inspired by the famous five when they visited Brazil.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Aye, a poor man's Ned. :wink:

[calumhibee1]

I presume there isn’t much video footage of the tornadoes? Highlights from European games or league matches? Always wondered what it would have been like to watch these guys play. Derby record was great, some brilliant results in Europe that we can only dream of nowadays.

[Golden Bear]

I presume there isn’t much video footage of the tornadoes? Highlights from European games or league matches? Always wondered what it would have been like to watch these guys play. Derby record was great, some brilliant results in Europe that we can only dream of nowadays.

The 0-7 you tube video has been played many many times in my house.