Patrick Thistle not very happy...

[Hibs90]

http://ptfc.co.uk/news/2016-2017/june_2016/club_statement_about_fixture_list

[TamHibs]

Fair statement imo, we'd be the same if Hearts got 4 & we only got 2 against the ugly sisters

[BigKev]

Fair play to Thistle and they're absolutely correct.

For the SPFL not to have discussed this with the 3 clubs affected shows just how incompetent Doncaster and his cronies are.

The Huns are back in the top flight- f*** everyone else seems to be their attitude.

[marinello59]

Sevco are just in the door and already the needs of all the other clubs are being ignored. Shameful that this has been done without prior explanation.

[StevieCowan]

Rangers replaced DUFC, no special status IMO.

SPFL have done right.

[fordie2]

Clubs basing their yearly revenues around how many times the old firm are coming to town is the exact reason the old firm have so much power.

Its short sighted attitudes like this that will ensure that Scottish football continues to struggle.

[GreenArmyyy!]

They are quite right to complain about that. No disrespect at all intended but smaller clubs like that will rely on the old firm gates heavily and have effectively been punished here for no good reason.

[s.a.m]

Good for them. If clubs are going to be handed that kind of disadvantage (which they shouldn't be), then at the very least they should be compensated for the financial loss.

[rcarter1]

Another inherent problem with a split after 3 games. It often causes problems with numbers of home games vs certain opponents and now this. Can empathise with Partick on this, but if its all done randomly than its just the luck of the draw really.

[Pete]

What are they saying?

[HibsNutter]

Clubs basing their yearly revenues around how many times the old firm are coming to town is the exact reason the old firm have so much power.

Its short sighted attitudes like this that will ensure that Scottish football continues to struggle.


:agree:

[Radium]

What are they saying?

Friday 17th June 2016 at 16:24
The Board of Partick Thistle FC has expressed anger and frustration at the fixture list for season 2016/17 announced by the SPFL earlier today, which will put the Club and two other Premiership sides at a sporting and financial disadvantage in the forthcoming season.
In previous seasons where both Rangers and Celtic were in the Premiership, pre-split fixtures have been organised to ensure that every club plays three home games against the Old Firm. Without any notification from the SPFL to the contrary, we had expected that this practice would continue this season and that is the basis on which we and other clubs have budgeted.
However, this season we, Motherwell and Hamilton have been handed only two Old Firm games at home whilst Dundee, Inverness Caledonian Thistle and Hearts have four home games. That means an expected loss in revenues for the Club of £120,000 before a ball is even kicked, whilst other clubs will get an unexpected bonus of a similar figure.
Financial implications aside, we believe there is a significant sporting disadvantage created by the fixture list as it stands. Pre-split, we will make four trips away to the two biggest clubs in the country while some clubs will only make two. In the past, each club has made three trips.
It is also worth noting that, for the second time in three seasons, SPFL fixturing means that we will have no competitive match on the second weekend of the campaign.
Having had no communication from the SPFL explaining these changes prior to this morning’s announcement, Partick Thistle intends to seek compensation from the SPFL for all clubs concerned or that they reconsider the fixture list to ensure a level playing field for all.

[Big_Franck]

This is the part that stands out to me and I totally agree.


Financial implications aside, we believe there is a significant sporting disadvantage created by the fixture list as it stands. Pre-split, we will make four trips away to the two biggest clubs in the country while some clubs will only make two. In the past, each club has made three trips.


We can chalk this up as another Doncaster **** up I'd say.

[SuperAllyMcleod]

I noticed Celtic are at the PBS on the opening day - so they are not getting to unfurl their flag as champions but Sevco are? I'd have thought winning the top league should have taken precedence?

[s.a.m]

Another inherent problem with a split after 3 games. It often causes problems with numbers of home games vs certain opponents and now this. Can empathise with Partick on this, but if its all done randomly than its just the luck of the draw really.

I agree that it's an inherent fault of the system, but I don't think it's acceptable. I'm sure we've had similar problems in the past. A system which leaves clubs going into a season not knowing how many home games they are being allocated isn't good enough. Add in the sporting disadvantage, and I'd say it isn't fit for purpose. As a minimum, I would say there should be some means of compensating clubs who are left short of games compared with their competitors.

[Pete]

Cheers guys.

The split is rubbish and needs done away with.

[bigwheel]

That is really tough on Thistle - 120k would be two + decent players wages for them .....a big hit on their budget


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[Since90+2]

I noticed Celtic are at the PBS on the opening day - so they are not getting to unfurl their flag as champions but Sevco are? I'd have thought winning the top league should have taken precedence?

Celtic would have agreed to it. If they hadn't we would have heard from Celtic by now.

[marinello59]

Clubs basing their yearly revenues around how many times the old firm are coming to town is the exact reason the old firm have so much power.

Its short sighted attitudes like this that will ensure that Scottish football continues to struggle.

What about the sporting disadvantage? It's simply wrong.

[Ozyhibby]

Celtic would have agreed to it. If they hadn't we would have heard from Celtic by now.

Celtic have asked for the week 2 off so they can play in America so that had to be one of their Home games, so makes sense they are away first week.


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[fordie2]

What about the sporting disadvantage? It's simply wrong.

The fixtures are impossible to balance due to the odd number of games and unfortunately some teams get a raw deal.

However if Thistle base their budgets on hosting the old firm 4 times a season we will never be able to move to a 16 or 18 team league as financially it doesn't suit them.

[marinello59]

The fixtures are impossible to balance due to the odd number of games and unfortunately some teams get a raw deal.

However if Thistle base their budgets on hosting the old firm 4 times a season we will never be able to move to a 16 or 18 team league as financially it doesn't suit them.

It's not a case of them basing their budget on those games. It's that other teams will gain a financial AND sporting advantage over them. That can be balanced out as it was in the past.

[Jim44]

I sympathise with PT and have no idea why the anomaly has arisen, but it angers me that this sort of situation highlights and exacerbates the notion that every club is dependent on the financial spin-off from the Ugly Sisters and the superior attitude that they and their supporters adopt towards other teams. I would rather go shoeless than crawl to them with the begging bowl.

[Keith_M]

The fixtures are impossible to balance due to the odd number of games and unfortunately some teams get a raw deal.

However if Thistle base their budgets on hosting the old firm 4 times a season we will never be able to move to a 16 or 18 team league as financially it doesn't suit them.


Surely they could work it in such a way that all the other clubs have 3 home games against the uglies before the split.... 1 v DerHun and 2 v Celtc, or vice-versa.

[marinello59]

Surely they could work it in such a way that all the other clubs have 3 home games against the uglies before the split.... 1 v DerHun and 2 v Celtc, or vice-versa.

They can.

[Danderhall Hibs]

They can.

:agree: and have done in the past.

[Eyrie]

Celtic have asked for the week 2 off so they can play in America so that had to be one of their Home games, so makes sense they are away first week.


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I complain about this every season, but why are they allowed to cancel a league game so that they can cash in elsewhere?

I could understand why it was allowed the first time, because the friendlies had already been arranged, but this has been happening for four or five years now.

[weonlywon6-2]

Scottish football bosses are clueless, well done thistle for standing up to this

[StevieCowan]

What about the sporting disadvantage? It's simply wrong.


Why? We all want Rangers to be treated equally and when they are (as a promoted team from the Championship) there are moans that somehow they are a special case.

I'd say it would be wrong to change the fixture permutations just because its Rangers.

[CropleyWasGod]

Why? We all want Rangers to be treated equally and when they are (as a promoted team from the Championship) there are moans that somehow they are a special case.

I'd say it would be wrong to change the fixture permutations just because its Rangers.
If we want to get closer to a level playing field, financially and sporting, we have to recognise commercial reality.

It's not that RFC are being treated as a special case here. Rather that Thistle are being treated unfairly.

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[Mr White]

18 teams playing each other once at home and once away. Have things improved in any measurable way since we abandoned that format?

[West lower]

Fair statement imo, we'd be the same if Hearts got 4 & we only got 2 against the ugly sisters
I couldn't care less if we never played the uglies ever again. I know financially that is daft but from a purely sporting and fun point of view I honestly don't care.

[northstandhibby]

I am not surprised in the slightest Partick have complained about this shocking situation. Has fairness and integrity been erased from the SFA? It is simply outrageous that the fixtures list has been manipulated to such an extent that some teams are financially disadvantaged and others like the Jambos are rewarded.

Partick and the others in the same boat should take this matter to the highest body if need be.








Glory Glory

[lyonhibs]

Who are they kidding. They'll most likely get bummed home and away by both members of the Old Firm.

It's all about money. We need clubs to focus on filling their stadiums with home games and not sitting their, financial cock in hand, slavering over 5000 OF fans per game. Hibs included in the above statement, once we're back in the top league

[JeMeSouviens]

Why? We all want Rangers to be treated equally and when they are (as a promoted team from the Championship) there are moans that somehow they are a special case.

I'd say it would be wrong to change the fixture permutations just because its Rangers.

Spot on. This is just about money. Tiny and Pittodrie will probably both be tougher to go to than Ibrox next season.

[marinello59]

Why? We all want Rangers to be treated equally and when they are (as a promoted team from the Championship) there are moans that somehow they are a special case.

I'd say it would be wrong to change the fixture permutations just because its Rangers.

Let's just ignore th financial realities of a pro-sport then. Hearts benefit at the expense of clubs like Partick Thistle. Are you really happy with that.
The main thing though is the sporting disadvantsge. That just seems to be getting ignored.

[Hibs1969]

Even more reason to have an 18 or 20 team top division. Then Partick would know for sure that they would have Celtic, RFC, Hearts and Aberdeen amongst others home and away without the farce of computer generated nonsense like this.

[marinello59]

Who are they kidding. They'll most likely get bummed home and away by both members of the Old Firm.

It's all about money. We need clubs to focus on filling their stadiums with home games and not sitting their, financial cock in hand, slavering over 5000 OF fans per game. Hibs included in the above statement, once we're back in the top league

It's a pro-sport. More money gives you an advantage. It should be a level playing field. It's not.

[Dr Jimmy]

Clubs basing their yearly revenues around how many times the old firm are coming to town is the exact reason the old firm have so much power.

Its short sighted attitudes like this that will ensure that Scottish football continues to struggle.

What a stupid statement. It's called a revenue forecast, which every club will have and each will be based on the expected income generated from expected fixtures. This will enable them to work out their business budget. The SPFL Making changes without notification is a disgrace.
Good on Partick for not just rolling over.

[Marco G]

Friday 17th June 2016 at 16:24
The Board of Partick Thistle FC has expressed anger and frustration at the fixture list for season 2016/17 announced by the SPFL earlier today, which will put the Club and two other Premiership sides at a sporting and financial disadvantage in the forthcoming season.
In previous seasons where both Rangers and Celtic were in the Premiership, pre-split fixtures have been organised to ensure that every club plays three home games against the Old Firm. Without any notification from the SPFL to the contrary, we had expected that this practice would continue this season and that is the basis on which we and other clubs have budgeted.
However, this season we, Motherwell and Hamilton have been handed only two Old Firm games at home whilst Dundee, Inverness Caledonian Thistle and Hearts have four home games. That means an expected loss in revenues for the Club of £120,000 before a ball is even kicked, whilst other clubs will get an unexpected bonus of a similar figure.
Financial implications aside, we believe there is a significant sporting disadvantage created by the fixture list as it stands. Pre-split, we will make four trips away to the two biggest clubs in the country while some clubs will only make two. In the past, each club has made three trips.
It is also worth noting that, for the second time in three seasons, SPFL fixturing means that we will have no competitive match on the second weekend of the campaign.
Having had no communication from the SPFL explaining these changes prior to this morning’s announcement, Partick Thistle intends to seek compensation from the SPFL for all clubs concerned or that they reconsider the fixture list to ensure a level playing field for all.




I think that this statement is a load of garbage. We are talking about getting clubs to avoid this need to plan for "an old firm windfall" and start to plan for getting their own fans to turn out in bigger numbers. One hundred grand over 18 home games is about getting another 400 or so Partick fans to turn up every home game. Why not sort that out instead of worrying about fixture lists?

[northstandhibby]

I think that this statement is a load of garbage. We are talking about getting clubs to avoid this need to plan for "an old firm windfall" and start to plan for getting their own fans to turn out in bigger numbers. One hundred grand over 18 home games is about getting another 400 or so Partick fans to turn up every home game. Why not sort that out instead of worrying about fixture lists?

Ludicrous.

Of course Partick should have concerns about a manipulated fixture list which disadvantages it and rewards others with more big games against clubs who have a big travelling support.




Glory Glory

[StevieCowan]

Let's just ignore th financial realities of a pro-sport then. Hearts benefit at the expense of clubs like Partick Thistle. Are you really happy with that.
The main thing though is the sporting disadvantsge. That just seems to be getting ignored.

How's it a sporting advantage playing a team that are just been promoted after 4 seasons out of the top flight?

Or are you saying that Rangers ARE a special case and should be treated differently?

[StevieCowan]

What a stupid statement. It's called a revenue forecast, which every club will have and each will be based on the expected income generated from expected fixtures. This will enable them to work out their business budget. The SPFL Making changes without notification is a disgrace.
Good on Partick for not just rolling over.

Surely Partick done their homework and knew that Rangers would effectively replace Dundee Utd's fixtures from last year as that's what's happened every season previously?

[northstandhibby]

Surely Partick done their homework and knew that Rangers would effectively replace Dundee Utd's fixtures from last year as that's what's happened every season previously?

I don't think you've fully understood the context of what Partick are complaining of?









Glory Glory

[Marco G]

Ludicrous.

Of course Partick should have concerns about a manipulated fixture list which disadvantages it and rewards others with more big games against clubs who have a big travelling support.




Glory GloryWell to me the fixture list should be about any teams in the league being drawn against each other without two"special cases" getting preference or being lusted after!

[northstandhibby]

Well to me the fixture list should be about any teams in the league being drawn against each other without two"special cases" getting preference or being lusted after!

Why do you think clubs want to play against the other top clubs in the top divisions all over the world?








Glory Glory

[dalkeith stu]

It's a double hit for them, both missing out on the revenue and having to play 4 away games against the old firm before the split!!

[northstandhibby]

It's a double hit for them, both missing out on the revenue and having to play 4 away games against the old firm before the split!!

:top marks

[Marco G]

Why do you think clubs want to play against the other top clubs in the top divisions all over the world?








Glory GloryYes that's a fair point. Most leagues have a system where you play home and away so as long as you are in the league you get what you say the clubs who are not the top clubs want. Our top league is oddly different and so this sort of thing can happen. But I still think it's better to sort your own problems than moan about lack of visit from one of the ugly sisters.

[Bishop Hibee]

No surprise Hertz are on the right side of this screw up.

[Marco G]

Yes that's a fair point. Most leagues have a system where you play home and away so as long as you are in the league you get what you say the clubs who are not the top clubs want. Our top league is oddly different and so this sort of thing can happen. But I still think it's better to sort your own problems than moan about lack of visit from one of the ugly sisters.Hang on, in these other leagues you just play the top teams once at home, but here you may get two shots at it, so it's not as simple as I thought.

[Just Jimmy]

No surprise Hertz are on the right side of this screw up.
That was my first thought. Shocker the establishment club wins out again.

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[monktonharp]

I sympathise with PT and have no idea why the anomaly has arisen, but it angers me that this sort of situation highlights and exacerbates the notion that every club is dependent on the financial spin-off from the Ugly Sisters and the superior attitude that they and their supporters adopt towards other teams. I would rather go shoeless than crawl to them with the begging bowl.you have a serious hangup about the OF, and without being accused of supporting their superior position (in fan base terms), how are they adopting any stance/ they have not compiled the fixture list, the spfl have. no doubt it is biased in their favour or one of their's? but their fans have not done it and the real problem that now exists is that it seems that there is not a Level Playing Field when it comes to smaller clubs. the JAGS,'WELL and ACCIES all must be seething. you, me and others on here take some sort of superior attitude over a season when it comes to playing against Queens,Sons,Raith and the Wasps and make comments like....we should be hammering the likes of them,we should be winning 4 nil etc. sorry, but I cant see that it lies with the OF.

[Pete70]

Who is this "old Firm" that Partick are referring to? Given that The Rangers are only about 4 years old, doesn't that make Celtic v Partick Thistle the "old Firm" rivalry?

Having said that, I totally agree with them. The split doesn't work. 16 or 18 team top league playing each other once at home and once away should be the format

[Sir David Gray]

Who is this "old Firm" that Partick are referring to? Given that The Rangers are only about 4 years old, doesn't that make Celtic v Partick Thistle the "old Firm" rivalry?

Having said that, I totally agree with them. The split doesn't work. 16 or 18 team top league playing each other once at home and once away should be the format

It would have to be 18 teams, a 16 team league would only mean 30 matches per season which wouldn't be enough.

[NAE NOOKIE]

I couldn't care less about Partick's moaning about not having enough fixtures at home against the ugly sisters and how much money they will lose .... tough titty I say .... If I had been their owner years ago I would have actively pushed them as the alternative to sectarianism, rather than the team of luvvies and the like, perhaps the sane folk of Glasgow would have backed them in bigger numbers.

As for it being unfair that they have to play the OF away from home more than some other clubs .... what difference does it really make in a sporting sense. If they only have Celtic & Sevco once at Firhill before the split it means they have more home fixtures against teams the actually have a chance of beating ... like most clubs they have about as much ( as little ) chance of beating the ugly sisters at home as they do away, so if they have two 'easier' home games than other clubs its probably them gaining the advantage.

[monktonharp]

agree it should be 18 teams. but they are now trying another format by re-arranging the League cup instead of focusing on the real issues. I suppose my argument is for another thread so I'll leave it at that

[northstandhibby]

I couldn't care less about Partick's moaning about not having enough fixtures at home against the ugly sisters and how much money they will lose .... tough titty I say .... If I had been their owner years ago I would have actively pushed them as the alternative to sectarianism, rather than the team of luvvies and the like, perhaps the sane folk of Glasgow would have backed them in bigger numbers.

As for it being unfair that they have to play the OF away from home more than some other clubs .... what difference does it really make in a sporting sense. If they only have Celtic & Sevco once at Firhill before the split it means they have more home fixtures against teams the actually have a chance of beating ... like most clubs they have about as much ( as little ) chance of beating the ugly sisters at home as they do away, so if they have two 'easier' home games than other clubs its probably them gaining the advantage.

Maybe they shouldn't have bothered trying for promotion to the top league then if they are to be mere cannon fodder and expected to be told to miss out on a level playing field and play equal amount of games against the bigger clubs?

Why bother eh?



Glory Glory

[NAE NOOKIE]

Maybe they shouldn't have bothered trying for promotion to the top league then if they are to be mere cannon fodder and expected to be told to miss out on a level playing field and play equal amount of games against the bigger clubs?

Why bother eh?



Glory Glory

I wasn't suggesting that Thistle are cannon fodder any more than any other club ..... also if you read my post properly I was making a case that in a sporting sense a club in Thistle's position may even gain a slight advantage in making the top 6.

EG

Thistle play away at Celtic and Sevco twice each and once each at Firhill ..... but that means they play once away at Aberdeen and Hearts and play them twice each at Firhill ...... If given the choice of two home games against Hearts or Aberdeen or two home games against Celtic or Sevco, which one would you choose to give you the best chance of picking up points?

[poolman]

Cheers guys.

The split is rubbish and needs done away with.

This

[MWHIBBIES]

It would have to be 18 teams, a 16 team league would only mean 30 matches per season which wouldn't be enough.30 games would be fine, especially with 2 cup competitions.

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

The fact Partick and others, feel they have been disadvantaged financially by the return of rangers probably says more than anything to me. Whilst it wasn't quite the "armageddon" we were promised by the person overseeing the whole structure of Scottish fitbaw (😂😂😂😂) everybody should have been looking to kick on a notch with an extra place up the league and 4 less hard games thus a better chance of winning more. To budget on the return to the "as is" for Scottish fitbaw is nae gid. A paying customer is a happy customer and if the team is achieving fans will show up (more cash via club store etc) i know theres mitigating circumstances for the likes of partick having a smaller fanbase even a couple hundred fans can make all the difference but because people encourage the talking down of our game we'll probably never kick on.

My honest belief is that celtic, Aberdeen, rangers, hearts (grudgingly) and hibs (although in the championship) have squads that are being built. In 5/6 years time we could have 4 or 5 teams believing they could win the title if we had a 16 team league. 15 home 15 away - Keep yer special split if it's so precious so another 7 games. Sorted. But na, we cany have anything that would take the shine of the "wonderful old firm derby" 4 times a season. D*cks!! I dunno the maths right now but a sold out easter road every home game would surely bring in a few bob? Scottish fitbaw isny THAT bad and could be saved. Will it? Probably not because of the fear from top to bottom

[StevieCowan]

I don't think you've fully understood the context of what Partick are complaining of?









Glory Glory

I do. They made an incorrect assumption based on what happened several years ago.

Did they make a statement this time last year when they got Celtic and Aberdeen twice st home and other clubs got them once? Surely sporting integrity would dictate that these are the two best teams in the land?

[Beefster]

They are quite right to complain about that. No disrespect at all intended but smaller clubs like that will rely on the old firm gates heavily and have effectively been punished here for no good reason.

The clubs and fans want it all ways. One minute they're complaining about the Old Firm centric nature of our game and the broadcasters. Next minute they're moaning about the number of home games they get against them and implying that they rely on the cash.

[Spike Mandela]

agree it should be 18 teams. but they are now trying another format by re-arranging the League cup instead of focusing on the real issues. I suppose my argument is for another thread so I'll leave it at that

League reconstruction talk was only ever a safety net incase Sevco looked like failing to get promoted again. Never going to happen.( Unless they get relegated or liquidated again:aok:)

[northstandhibby]

I do. They made an incorrect assumption based on what happened several years ago.

Did they make a statement this time last year when they got Celtic and Aberdeen twice st home and other clubs got them once? Surely sporting integrity would dictate that these are the two best teams in the land?

I think Partick have a strong case to make as to the fixture list for next season being unfairly compiled. Every club needs to maximise it's financial structure and it is why clubs like Partick etc strive to attain top league status and playing at home against the bigger clubs means more revenue - tickets sold - merchandise - tv money - extra food/beverage sold etc. To then discover the fixture list is unevenly distributed to such an extent is imo very unfair regardless of what happened the season before. It's simply unfair and should of course be highlighted by the clubs who are going to miss out on several big pay-days next season. If it happened to Hibernian to such an extent I would hope we would also make a case for change.


Glory Glory

[malcolm]

PT are complaining about the the rangers being treated like a normal promoted club rather than being placed in the presumed top 6 as some seem to think is their right and proper place in the world. Thing about the financial unfairness gripe is that PT should really compare it with the number of games they had in the league the previous season against them - looks like it's more this time around :wink:.

I hope the the rangers end up in the bottom half of the league next season and even better that they end up in the bottom two.. Well ok bottom spot:greengrin. But the real grounds for PT's complaint is the bonkers split and I'd be fully with them on that - if they had come out and said that but I can't support anyone who complains that the the rangers are not getting the special treatment they imagine they are entitled to.

[marinello59]

PT are complaining about the the rangers being treated like a normal promoted club rather than being placed in the presumed top 6 as some seem to think is their right and proper place in the world. Thing about the financial unfairness gripe is that PT should really compare it with the number of games they had in the league the previous season against them - looks like it's more this time around :wink:.

I hope the the rangers end up in the bottom half of the league next season and even better that they end up in the bottom two.. Well ok bottom spot:greengrin. But the real grounds for PT's complaint is the bonkers split and I'd be fully with them on that - if they had come out and said that but I can't support anyone who complains that the the rangers are not getting the special treatment they imagine they are entitled to.

They are not talking about the special treatment of Sevco. Where Sevco finish up in the league doesn't matter at all in terms of this argument so I don't see why you have mentioned it. This is about having a level playing field before the split.
For what it's worth I think Sevco will finish in the bottom six, as a football team they are a long way off being title challengers.

[West lower]

This debate emphasises all that is wrong in our game. It is clubs like Thistle and Motherwell who rely on away fans to survive in the top league. They only ever vote for anything if it preserves what they can get out of other clubs. It is this self preservation that has been killing our game for years. It is time the league structure was simplified, ie same amount of home and away games for all against all.
But then Partick and Motherwell voted against this.

[marinello59]

This debate emphasises all that is wrong in our game. It is clubs like Thistle and Motherwell who rely on away fans to survive in the top league. They only ever vote for anything if it preserves what they can get out of other clubs. It is this self preservation that has been killing our game for years. It is time the league structure was simplified, ie same amount of home and away games for all against all.
But then Partick and Motherwell voted against this.

Every single club, including our own, will always vote for the situation that best suits them.There really is nothing wrong with that.

[Bristolhibby]

This debate emphasises all that is wrong in our game. It is clubs like Thistle and Motherwell who rely on away fans to survive in the top league. They only ever vote for anything if it preserves what they can get out of other clubs. It is this self preservation that has been killing our game for years. It is time the league structure was simplified, ie same amount of home and away games for all against all.
But then Partick and Motherwell voted against this.

This. Turkeys voting for Christmas springs to mind.

Focusing subsistence strategy. Scottish Football could be so much more with a little vision and the clubs not cow towing to the OF.

J

[marinello59]

This. Turkeys voting for Christmas springs to mind.

Focusing subsistence strategy. Scottish Football could be so much more with a little vision and the clubs not cow towing to the OF.

J

This is not bowing down to the Old Firm though. It's the SPFL being called out for yet more inompetence.

[GreenCastle]

Every year there are issues with the split fixtures and this year it seems that before the season has started there is an issue.

The split is nonsense and the sooner they get rid of it the better for Scottish football.

[West lower]

Every single club, including our own, will always vote for the situation that best suits them.There really is nothing wrong with that.

That is not correct. There were clubs who were happy to vote for a bigger league, as they thought it would benefit the national game. These same clubs were accepting a financial hit would be the price to pay.

[malcolm]

They are not talking about the special treatment of Sevco. Where Sevco finish up in the league doesn't matter at all in terms of this argument so I don't see why you have mentioned it. This is about having a level playing field before the split.
For what it's worth I think Sevco will finish in the bottom six, as a football team they are a long way off being title challengers.

IIRC there is an assumption built into the fixture computation to avoid a team facing relegation having played against more top six teams pre split than their rivals for relegation. This relies on the previous season's finishing positions. Unlike any other time this new club (apparently) was in the top league their position as a promoted team for this fairness weighting will have been to take the finishing position of the team they replaced. So the complaint of PT is that this team are not being treated differently and being assumed that will be at the top challenging.

You can't have a level playing field before the split that also gives a level playing field after it unless the clubs all end up in the predicted positions - you are all arguing for special treatment for a 'special' promoted club. It is right and proper that this is not the case - as of course any team that flirts with relegation will not want to have played more top teams overall that their rivals. Not having looked at the fixture maybe this does advantage the newly promoted team and I hope it is an issue.:wink:

[HappyHanlon]

Celtic have asked for the week 2 off so they can play in America so that had to be one of their Home games, so makes sense they are away first week.


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They should be made to play the match on that date. If they can't they forfeit the match and 3-0 win and 3pts are awarded to their opponents.

[Humo]

I would honestly love for nothing more than an 18 team league. Playing each team home and away and that's it. The league would be more competitive and interesting and derbies would mean more. Each game would mean more.

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[NORTHERNHIBBY]

Guessing that Plastic Whistle are forecasting a fairly p1shy season if they are already mumping about numbers in the away end over being properly prepared to get numbers in the home end.

[Keith_M]

I wouldn't be happy either if people were spelling the name of my club wrong.


:wink:

[Eyrie]

I wasn't suggesting that Thistle are cannon fodder any more than any other club ..... also if you read my post properly I was making a case that in a sporting sense a club in Thistle's position may even gain a slight advantage in making the top 6.

EG

Thistle play away at Celtic and Sevco twice each and once each at Firhill ..... but that means they play once away at Aberdeen and Hearts and play them twice each at Firhill ...... If given the choice of two home games against Hearts or Aberdeen or two home games against Celtic or Sevco, which one would you choose to give you the best chance of picking up points?

On the other hand, each game against Celtc or Sevco is estimated to be worth £120k because of the larger travelling support. Partick Thistle, Motherwell and Hamilton now find themselves £240k worse off which puts them at a competitive disadvantage because their budgets will be smaller than Dundee and Inverness who will instead be £240k better off. And that is five teams who would be expected to be at a similar level, which is why I omitted Hearts.

How would we feel if we had been promoted and found ourselves having two trips to Parkhead and Ibrox, with only one home fixture against those clubs? Then give Aberdeen and Hearts the opposite, with two home games and one trip against Celtc and Sevco. We'd be spitting blood on here.

[Danderhall Hibs]

I just remembered about this the other day. Any idea what happened? I can't see any response from the SPFL.

[jgl07]

However many OF home fixtures Partick get will be more than they get next season after they are relegated.

I used to have a lot of time for Thistle but they are beginning to get on my nerves with their moaning.

Last week Alan Archibald laid into Pat Bonner after he tipped Partick and Accies for the drop. Archibald doubted that Pat Bonnor knew where Partick was! Reality check here. This is the same Pat Bonner who played for Celtic for over 20 years and made 483 appearances a significant number of which would have been away to the Jags.

The question is, does Alan Archibald have a clue where Partick is? It is certainly nowhere near Maryhill where his team play.

[green&left]

Particks complaint sums up this mickey mouse league. We blame the big bad old firm for all of Scottish football's problems, yet moan like **** 'cos you're not getting to play them twice. That complaint just sums up how much some clubs rely on the old firm, which in turn gives rangers and celtic all the power, which is why the sfa/spfl will generally bend over backwards for them.

[Danderhall Hibs]

The complaint was made in mid June and I can see nothing on it after that.

Were they just paid off?

I'm basing that on if they had been told to piss off they'd have said something else about it?

[easty]

Particks complaint sums up this mickey mouse league. We blame the big bad old firm for all of Scottish football's problems, yet moan like **** 'cos you're not getting to play them twice. That complaint just sums up how much some clubs rely on the old firm, which in turn gives rangers and celtic all the power, which is why the sfa/spfl will generally bend over backwards for them.

I don't think that's particularly fair. It's the shambles that is the league construction that's the problem here, not Partick Thistle. There are always going to be teams in any league where fixtures against them provide more income than other fixtures.

[RoxburghHibs]

Clubs basing their yearly revenues around how many times the old firm are coming to town is the exact reason the old firm have so much power.

Its short sighted attitudes like this that will ensure that Scottish football continues to struggle.


This 100%

:top marks

Clubs need to live within their means - end off story.

[green&left]

I don't think that's particularly fair. It's the shambles that is the league construction that's the problem here, not Partick Thistle. There are always going to be teams in any league where fixtures against them provide more income than other fixtures.

Their biggest complain seems to be about losing £100k though, not about the daft top six bottom six nonsense.

[easty]

Their biggest complain seems to be about losing £100k though, not about the daft top six bottom six nonsense.

It's one and the same. If there's no split, then it never becomes an issue.

[Scorrie]

I can't see what's too difficult in having a league where everyone plays each other the same number of times at each other's grounds. Beyond the wit of SPFL administrators obviously 😞

[green&left]

It's one and the same. If there's no split, then it never becomes an issue.

Split seems to have suited them though when guaranteed 3 OF visits? Its only now they're losing out on some £££ they're complaining. If the split was an issue for them why not complain last year, or the last 5 years infact seeing as the concept of the split has remained the same. The only difference is their bank balance at the end of the season.

I agree BTW, the split is utter **** but Patricks complain is about losing money due to the split, and not the actual split itself.

[Jim Herriot]

Tricky one - good arguments on both sides. For fairness, Celtic and the team that plays at Ibrox shouldn't be treated as special cases, but in reality the fact that they do have large supports mean revenue should be considered carefully.

Plus, of course, the thread is an excuse for things like this...
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