Jo Cox Labour MP shot in Birstall

[easty]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304

Scary

Reported that he shouted "Britain first" after he shot her.

[GlesgaeHibby]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304

Scary

Reported that he shouted "Britain first" after he shot her.

Sadly died. Heartbreaking for her husband and two young kids.

[Haymaker]

Apparently now died?

[Mr White]

That's absolutely awful.

[Pretty Boy]

The world is a ****ed up place.

The sooner global warming, a nuclear apocalypse or something else finishes us off the better.

[ronaldo7]

Sad state of affairs when an MP can't even have a surgery without getting killed.

[Billy Whizz]

Shocking news. Where do these people get their guns from?

[GreenLake]

Shocking news. Where do these people get their guns from?

I think the gun was improvised and self made. The guy must be mentally ill to kill this young woman over political views.

[Scottie]

Sadly died. Heartbreaking for her husband and two young kids.
May she rest in peace. Absolutely tragic.

[One Day Soon]

I know a lot of people think our politicians are a bunch of grasping thieves only in it for themselves, but having worked very closely with a large number of them across all parties I know the vast majority are genuinely decent people who want to make our country a better place - regardless of party. Public service is largely thankless but without it we would have no democracy.

I hope this person was mentally ill, I can't bear to think of any other explanation.

That fact that she was a mother of two young kids makes this even more depressingly sad than it already would have been.

[Finn2015]

Tragic and thoughts with the family who have lost a wife/mother. Very sad

[hibsbollah]

Ive scanned the press and no one is describing it as a terrorist attack. He will be portrayed as a lone wolf lunatic and his mental health problems will be emphasised, as always happens when right wing nuts go, well, nuts. 'Terrorist' now just means 'Muslim' in the media consciousness.

What a terrible thing to happen to what appears to be a kind and caring woman with a history of helping people less fortunate than herself. A violent world we live in.

[magpie1892]

Where do these people get their guns from?

Not actually as difficult as you might imagine, if you really want one. Plenty of websites offering guns of various types - from the real deal (for big money) down to sawn-offs, and replicas and starter pistols which have been converted into viable firearms. The 'dark web' is pretty much beyond my ken but if you want an AK-47 and have the cash, you can make a deal.

[Pretty Boy]

The reaction on social media is almost as tragic as the senseless killing itself.

Described as a 'war casualty', a claim that the 'left' have used a 'patsy' to carry out the killing to generate a 'remain surge' and others claimimg it's ok because she chose to get into politics.

[McD]

Absolute tragedy. I was deeply shocked when I saw this, even more so since her death has been confirmed. Thoughts with her family.

[BigKev]

Frightening that this can happen in the UK in broad daylight and if, as suggested, it's down to her support of migrants then it's an unbelievably sad state of affairs.

RIP to Jo and hope her family are supported through what will be an extremely tough time in the public eye.

[Haymaker]

The reaction on social media is almost as tragic as the senseless killing itself.

Described as a 'war casualty', a claim that the 'left' have used a 'patsy' to carry out the killing to generate a 'remain surge' and others claimimg it's ok because she chose to get into politics.


:bitchy: I ****ing despair sometimes.

[Haymaker]

Ive scanned the press and no one is describing it as a terrorist attack. He will be portrayed as a lone wolf lunatic and his mental health problems will be emphasised, as always happens when right wing nuts go, well, nuts. 'Terrorist' now just means 'Muslim' in the media consciousness.

What a terrible thing to happen to what appears to be a kind and caring woman with a history of helping people less fortunate than herself. A violent world we live in.

You'll be hard pressed to find it I reckon.

[Hibrandenburg]

Terrible thing to happen to a young mother. She seemed to be an extremely caring person. Sadly I think this is only the start of more to come due to the present political climate.

[SunshineOnLeith]

You'll be hard pressed to find it I reckon.

ITV news clearly said that if it was politically motivated then it is terrorism.

There's so many rumours and Internet nonsense flying around that at this stage the correct thing to do focus on the tragedy of it, arguments about terminology and reporting can wait.

[Hibrandenburg]

ITV news clearly said that if it was politically motivated then it is terrorism.

There's so many rumours and Internet nonsense flying around that at this stage the correct thing to do focus on the tragedy of it, arguments about terminology and reporting can wait.

Paradoxically those kind of rumours have probably played a role in this tragedy.

[hibee_girl]

Horrendous tragedy.

2 young children now without a mother.

[hibsbollah]

ITV news clearly said that if it was politically motivated then it is terrorism.

There's so many rumours and Internet nonsense flying around that at this stage the correct thing to do focus on the tragedy of it, arguments about terminology and reporting can wait.

It's possible to do both at once. And necessary IMHO.

[HappyHanlon]

I think the gun was improvised and self made. The guy must be mentally ill to kill this young woman over political views.

Guaranteed.

IMO, the evil ******* should be euthanised. Too many occasions where someone is murdered and the perpetrator is deemed 'mentally ill' - not good enough.

Death penalty should be reinstated in cases where its glaringly obvious who murdered someone i.e. todays tragedy and Lee Rigby murder.

The fear of death might sort out this f****d up country.

[judas]

Absolutely sickening event. I can't watch the news.

Is this killer evil, or simply mentally ill? No doubt this will come our over the coming days.

[Sir David Gray]

I despair at the human race sometimes.

Awful news, just so sad.

The thought of someone going to their work in the morning and not ever returning home is just heartbreaking.

[heretoday]

A nutcase.

[Sergio sledge]

Ive scanned the press and no one is describing it as a terrorist attack. He will be portrayed as a lone wolf lunatic and his mental health problems will be emphasised, as always happens when right wing nuts go, well, nuts. 'Terrorist' now just means 'Muslim' in the media consciousness.

What a terrible thing to happen to what appears to be a kind and caring woman with a history of helping people less fortunate than herself. A violent world we live in.

I think you are being a bit harsh. Do we know he is right wing? or is that just based on the rumour that he shouted "Britain First" during the attack? The ITV news last night said that if it was politically motivated then it was a terrorist attack.

We should wait till the investigation takes its course before speculation IMHO, as should happen in all cases.

[Hibs Class]

Guaranteed.

IMO, the evil ******* should be euthanised. Too many occasions where someone is murdered and the perpetrator is deemed 'mentally ill' - not good enough.

Death penalty should be reinstated in cases where its glaringly obvious who murdered someone i.e. todays tragedy and Lee Rigby murder.

The fear of death might sort out this f****d up country.

Whatever the answers are, they cannot involve "euthanizing" the mentally ill. Quite astonishing to even see it suggested.

[Moulin Yarns]

A good read and true to how things have changed

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/16/mood-ugly-mp-dead-jo-cox

[The_Todd]

I'm in shock. While the guilty party is clearly not mentally well, it seems like enough inflammatory talk about immigrants, foreigners, traitors and general jingoism was going to eventually push some of these people off the edge.

[Sylar]

Stunning and saddening news - poor woman went to work and was butchered by some fascist zealot.

I equally loathe the rush to attach a mental illness to this guy as some excuse for his actions. He methodically created a weapon, researched her schedule to know where/when she'd be conducting a clinic and carried out his act with a calm and calculated manner (according to the eye-witness reports).

That's not the sign of mental illness - that's someone who's in full control of their faculties and has methodically planned an executed an ideological attack on an elected official in broad daylight. There is no binary to mindless killing, whereby brown person = terrorism, white person = mental illness.

[snooky]

A good read and true to how things have changed

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/16/mood-ugly-mp-dead-jo-cox

It is a good read and sadly, the divide she talks about has been brewing for some time.

"Something close to a chilling culture war is breaking out in Britain, a divide deeper than I have ever known, as I listen to the anger aroused by this referendum campaign. The air is corrosive, it has been rendered so. One can register shock at what has happened, but not complete surprise."

[hibsbollah]

Stunning and saddening news - poor woman went to work and was butchered by some fascist zealot.

I equally loathe the rush to attach a mental illness to this guy as some excuse for his actions. He methodically created a weapon, researched her schedule to know where/when she'd be conducting a clinic and carried out his act with a calm and calculated manner (according to the eye-witness reports).

That's not the sign of mental illness - that's someone who's in full control of their faculties and has methodically planned an executed an ideological attack on an elected official in broad daylight. There is no binary to mindless killing, whereby brown person = terrorism, white person = mental illness.

:agree:

Browsing at The Sun The Express The Times The Telegraph front pages this morning lots of mention of 'history of mental illness' 'loner psycho' even bizarrely 'lived in a nearby council estate' in The Times (so he's a schemie). The Express had nothing at all about the guy on their front page, you'd just assume it was another jihaadist.

No. He wasn't JUST a nutter. He was a politically motivated right wing terrorist. If he'd shouted 'Allahu Akbar' instead of 'Britain First' we wouldn't even be discussing it.

[lord bunberry]

:agree:

Browsing at The Sun The Express The Times The Telegraph front pages this morning lots of mention of 'history of mental illness' 'loner psycho' even bizarrely 'lived in a nearby council estate' in The Times (so he's a schemie). The Express had nothing at all about the guy on their front page, you'd just assume it was another jihaadist.

No. He wasn't JUST a nutter. He was a politically motivated right wing terrorist. If he'd shouted 'Allahu Akbar' instead of 'Britain First' we wouldn't even be discussing it.

This is exactly the reason I stopped buying newspapers. Absolute low life's with no morals.

[CropleyWasGod]

Stunning and saddening news - poor woman went to work and was butchered by some fascist zealot.

I equally loathe the rush to attach a mental illness to this guy as some excuse for his actions. He methodically created a weapon, researched her schedule to know where/when she'd be conducting a clinic and carried out his act with a calm and calculated manner (according to the eye-witness reports).

That's not the sign of mental illness - that's someone who's in full control of their faculties and has methodically planned an executed an ideological attack on an elected official in broad daylight. There is no binary to mindless killing, whereby brown person = terrorism, white person = mental illness.

I agree.

It's a bit like the GermanWings pilot who was pilloried for "having depression". All this kind of stuff does is add to the stigma that people with emotional and mental-health problems already have to deal with. It's not helpful, either to them, or to making a proper judgement on the facts of the case.

[Beefster]

I'm in shock. While the guilty party is clearly not mentally well, it seems like enough inflammatory talk about immigrants, foreigners, traitors and general jingoism was going to eventually push some of these people off the edge.

Yup. Some politicians should be ashamed of themselves.

[cabbageandribs1875]

hang the b...

[lord bunberry]

I don't think he had mental health problems, I just think he was a right wing nut job. If he was Muslim he wouldn't have been able to order all the stuff he got without being under surveillance. This killing is terrorism and I've no idea why the media are tip toeing around it.

[The_Todd]

I admit it probably wasn't right of me to assume he was mentally unwell, but I really hate the alternative that he was sound of mind and could still do that to another human being. It's just so awful. It's just not comprehensible.

Politicians, especially those who like fostering a feeling of "otherness", really have to take a look at themselves. Especially Nigel Farage, that poster he unveiled yesterday was sickening.

[lord bunberry]

I admit it probably wasn't right of me to assume he was mentally unwell, but I really hate the alternative that he was sound of mind and could still do that to another human being. It's just so awful. It's just not comprehensible.

Politicians, especially those who like fostering a feeling of "otherness", really have to take a look at themselves. Especially Nigel Farage, that poster he unveiled yesterday was sickening.
Politics in this country is an absolute affront to decency. We have a situation were two parties can agree on a policy, but are afraid to admit it in fear of being made to look weak. We have guys like Alastair Campbell and Andy Coulson becoming as important as the leaders of the party.
Its all about who gets the backing of the Murdoch press and who manages to persuade Satchi and Satchi to do their bidding, rather than who has the best policies. Image is everything, integrity means nothing.

[Pete]

I'm hearing lots of stuff on the news about right wing links as well as mental illness. There was also the "you ain't no Muslim bruv" attacker who tried to decapitate someone...He wasn't described as a terrorist and mental issues were mentioned.

Don't understand the outrage.

[lord bunberry]

I'm hearing lots of stuff on the news about right wing links as well as mental illness. There was also the "you ain't no Muslim bruv" attacker who tried to decapitate someone...He wasn't described as a terrorist and mental issues were mentioned.

Don't understand the outrage.
This event is a bit of a game changer in this country. Whilst the you ain't no Muslim stuff might not have been a terrorist attack, it was of the copycat variety. What happened yesterday was a first for our country and could inspire further and more organised attacks. That's the worry for me.

[Hibernia&Alba]

Lunacy; what a terrible premature end to a life given to the common good.

[hibsbollah]

I'm hearing lots of stuff on the news about right wing links as well as mental illness. There was also the "you ain't no Muslim bruv" attacker who tried to decapitate someone...He wasn't described as a terrorist and mental issues were mentioned.

Don't understand the outrage.

I don't have a link to stories about that guy but I betcha he was described as a terrorist. (Unless his he failed to actually kill anyone made the termimology less necessary?) The most obvious comparison with this case is the Lee Rigby one. The differences in coverage are painfully obvious.

[HappyHanlon]

Whatever the answers are, they cannot involve "euthanizing" the mentally ill. Quite astonishing to even see it suggested.

He's been checked over by psychiatrists and deemed fit to stand trial. Gave his name Death to Traitors, Freedom for Britain.

He's a terrorist and should be executed.

[heretoday]

He's been checked over by psychiatrists and deemed fit to stand trial. Gave his name Death to Traitors, Freedom for Britain.

He's a terrorist and should be executed.

If the state was given the right to kill its citizens we'd be going down a dangerous road.

I've always thought capital punishment was a way of sweeping things under the carpet instead of confronting problems in our society.

[CropleyWasGod]

He's been checked over by psychiatrists and deemed fit to stand trial. Gave his name Death to Traitors, Freedom for Britain.

He's a terrorist and should be executed.

Do you have a link for that part? Psychiatric assessments don't normally happen that quickly.

In any event, it would be the defence's prerogative to make that case, no? He has only been charged so far. There is a lot to happen before a trial starts.

[snooky]

Politics in this country is an absolute affront to decency. We have a situation were two parties can agree on a policy, but are afraid to admit it in fear of being made to look weak. We have guys like Alastair Campbell and Andy Coulson becoming as important as the leaders of the party.
Its all about who gets the backing of the Murdoch press and who manages to persuade Satchi and Satchi to do their bidding, rather than who has the best policies. Image is everything, integrity means nothing.

:agree: In a nutshell.
Whatever is deemed 'right' - no pun intended - for this country, be it UK or Scotland, is being dictated by self-serving people with political power. We have become a nation of flocking sheep.

Back to the main subject of this thread.
RIP, Jo.
I hear that Obama has called Jo Cox's husband.

[NYHibby]

:agree:

No. He wasn't JUST a nutter. He was a politically motivated right wing terrorist. If he'd shouted 'Allahu Akbar' instead of 'Britain First' we wouldn't even be discussing it.

Glenn Greenwald expressed similar sentiment.

https://theintercept.com/2016/06/17/why-is-the-killer-of-british-mp-jo-cox-not-being-called-a-terrorist (https://theintercept.com/2016/06/17/why-is-the-killer-of-british-mp-jo-cox-not-being-called-a-terrorist)

[CropleyWasGod]

Glenn Greenwald expressed similar sentiment.

https://theintercept.com/2016/06/17/why-is-the-killer-of-british-mp-jo-cox-not-being-called-a-terrorist (https://theintercept.com/2016/06/17/why-is-the-killer-of-british-mp-jo-cox-not-being-called-a-terrorist)

I'm a bit wary of putting labels on people. I'm not sure what good defining someone as a "terrorist" or a "nutjob" actually does.

Somebody killed someone here. Surely getting to the actual reasons why that happened (which may be simple, or complex, and may be a combination of political, health, social and other factors yet to be discussed) is more important than having an endless discussion about semantics?

[lord bunberry]

I'm a bit wary of putting labels on people. I'm not sure what good defining someone as a "terrorist" or a "nutjob" actually does.

Somebody killed someone here. Surely getting to the actual reasons why that happened (which may be simple, or complex, and may be a combination of political, health, social and other factors yet to be discussed) is more important than having an endless discussion about semantics?
You are correct, but in this case semantics are important. I've already seen a couple of articles written by Muslims who feel aggrieved that this isn't being called terrorism. We have a large section of our population who feel victimised.

[Jim44]

If the state was given the right to kill its citizens we'd be going down a dangerous road.

I've always thought capital punishment was a way of sweeping things under the carpet instead of confronting problems in our society.

Why can't we confront problems in our society and at the same time execute the vermin who are caught bang to rights executing innocent victims. I'd be happy to go down that 'dangerous road' in situations like this.

[NYHibby]

On a related semantics point, has anyone else noticed that UK media is primarily using verbs like killed, murdered, shot, etc but is not using assassinated? On the other hand, non-UK media is using assassinated much more frequently.

Is assassinated more of an American term than a British term (hence why its non-use stands out to me)? Or is the UK media trying to avoid implying a degree of premeditation that is usual associated with assassinations?

[hibsbollah]

I'm a bit wary of putting labels on people. I'm not sure what good defining someone as a "terrorist" or a "nutjob" actually does.

Somebody killed someone here. Surely getting to the actual reasons why that happened (which may be simple, or complex, and may be a combination of political, health, social and other factors yet to be discussed) is more important than having an endless discussion about semantics?

The way words (nutter, psycho, terrorist, collateral damage, rendition, democracy) are deployed is important because it reveals double standards which in turn reveals how we are governed. I find the language the press uses really fascinating because it gives you a glimpse of the greasy wheels of power turning. And if that's a bit Orwell it's probably deliberate :greengrin

[Hibernia&Alba]

I'm a bit wary of putting labels on people. I'm not sure what good defining someone as a "terrorist" or a "nutjob" actually does.

Somebody killed someone here. Surely getting to the actual reasons why that happened (which may be simple, or complex, and may be a combination of political, health, social and other factors yet to be discussed) is more important than having an endless discussion about semantics?

It's a very fair point, yet terms such as terrorist and very quickly applied to others. We all need to be as objective as possible and try to cut through the hysteria and agendas that are in play. Ultimately a young woman has been murdered and two young children left without a mother.

[(((Fergus)))]

Another white British nutter/terrorist attempts, but fails, to shoot a politician dead:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-36582770

[Finn2015]

Very moving interview from her husband on bbc news. Tragic loss and he makes a valid point about her worries, insecurities in this country and populist politicians exploiting them and whipping up fears.