I'll do it then... STUBBS OUT!

[Allant1981]

Don't think hibs will have a choice in the matter, we're a basket case and he'll have offers. Ta ta

Why would he have offers, 2 years in a row he couldnt get us our this league, this season we have arguably one of the best squads in the country and still we fail

[rcarter1]

Why would the BOARD sack AS right now ???
Were all down., Why shouldnt we be??
However we can still win this Donkee of our backs...GET US INTO EUROPE ALAN....Build a team for next year. Its in your hands

I seem to recall that you need to score goals, and not concede to do well in Europe. Alan Stubbs leading us into Europe? What a nightmare..

[GGTTH07]

Two seasons of playing the same style of football has been Stubbs downfall,no pace,no width and no midfielder who can regularly chip in with goals.if you don't have pace in this division you need aggressive 6 feet 4 beasts to get out this division,Stubbs should have realised this after his first season here

[Badge]

Been struggling all season to break teams down, no pace and no width, too easy to defend against. Gutted tonight, even the wife is asking why ffs. Win or lose next week Stubbs has to go.

Spot on. No width, no pace. Hertz and the rangers have both won this league by having wingers who run at teams and cause all sorts of problems. They must have had about 30 penalties between them by just attacking teams at pace. Why has Stubbs not realised that is the way to win games in this league.

[SeanWilson]

Ridiculous if he does considering he's won **** all and can't get us out of a league with a bigger budget than everyone else outside Rangers.

Lovely guy good eye for a player but ***** manager.

Not sure, there is something there with Stubbsy, however he can't possibly keep his job now - shame. I think there'll be clubs keen on him (a Bolton for instance is a shoo-in)

Why would he have offers, 2 years in a row he couldnt get us our this league, this season we have arguably one of the best squads in the country and still we fail

I don't think logically he should, however I'd be willing to bet my mortgage that he's manager of a bigger club than hibs (in current terms) next year

[biotech]

Simply not ruthless enough to lead a team. Nice guy but nice guys finish last!
Stuck with out-of-form players in the run-in and incapable of changing tactics when required.

[neil7908]

He's done for me, only question is if he's still around for the final.

[The Green Goblin]

Someone else posted that it was typical of us that, as unlikely as it might seem, we could yet win the holy grail we have been after for 114 years, and after that happens, we'll be binning the guy who won it for us. So even if we win it, there will be pish in the pool and infighting to sour it slightly. Always some element of bad joojoo with us. I don't know about Stubbs either way. The mental weakness is still there at the club. I don't know what the answer is. Tough times...

[mcfly]

We have to see how we get on next week but you would have to be the most optimistic person to really think we will win at Hampden.

Can these players pick themselves up??

I hate to say it but I don't think so

Prove me wrong hibs

[Ronster117]

And the next manager is


Does it it really matter ?
i could have been in charge and not got promotion..... Whoever comes in is on a hiding to nothing

[Andy74]

Should have been done weeks ago. Winning next week would make no odds come the reality of next season.

[southern hibby]

Said after Alloa away to part company. We are now In a position probably looking for a new manager who has no game time to assess the players here, so who does he keep???it will Take time to bring a manager in who
Does he go for? Yet again we go into next season as we did last season chasing rainbows with no showers or sunshine to provide them.

Really is a joke it's came to this.

GGTTH

[Thecat23]

Should have been done weeks ago. Winning next week would make no odds come the reality of next season.

Hard to defend him that's for sure. You and Blackpool both said he's not good enough and league is priority. Hold my hand up and tell you it's simply now good enough.

I'd hoped we would do them and overall we did play ok. But it's goals that count and we don't score enough. Stubbs takes the blame. Really fear for sat now.

[Allez Hibs]

**** off OP

[Gatecrasher]

Should have been done weeks ago. Winning next week would make no odds come the reality of next season.

:agree: I have said it before and I'll say it again he should have been gone ages ago, the 2 games against falkirk summed up our time with Stubbs in charge, he has to go.

[Stokesy's on fire]

He has the Scottish cup final to save his hibs career we mess that up and he has to go simple as.

[blackpoolhibs]

Hard to defend him that's for sure. You and Blackpool both said he's not good enough and league is priority. Hold my hand up and tell you it's simply now good enough.

I'd hoped we would do them and overall we did play ok. But it's goals that count and we don't score enough. Stubbs takes the blame. Really fear for sat now.

Bit of a knee jerk there is it not, only last week we were going to beat Falkirk and everything was going to be alright, now two games later the man is not good enough?

Stubbs has not learnt a thing since coming to the club, so much so we have actually got worse.

And that did not just happen in the last week.

[Expecting Rain]

Nonsense regarding Stubbs out. He has brought a lot of positives to the club, thoughI guess maybe others will see his worth, those who are more professional and carry more knowledge than some here.

[Since1875]

In my opinion punt him now. Roll the dice for next week, let the team pick themselves and go out and win it knowing they are all playing for their future at the club. Only chance we have if you ask me! Teams that sack managers normally get a good response the game after and let's face it this is it now for us.

[easty]

He'll go at the end of the season, but we could get rid now and it'd prob make nae difference to how the cup final goes. The players need to be well up for it, wether Stubbs is in charge or no.

He is done though. I've backed him, but I'll no be sad to see him go. Not good enough Alan.

[easty]

Bit of a knee jerk there is it not, only last week we were going to beat Falkirk and everything was going to be alright, now two games later the man is not good enough?

Stubbs has not learnt a thing since coming to the club, so much so we have actually got worse.

And that did not just happen in the last week.

What's your point? "I was right ages ago"?

Aye well done you.

[blackpoolhibs]

What's your point? "I was right ages ago"

Aye well done you.

Not at all, just fed up being told that i'd rather the team lost than support the manager who was clearly making the same mistakes week after week.

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

Now is never the time to reflect on a league campaign cause ****** me it hurts. Did we deserve to lose to Falkirk over 2 legs? Not for me we didn't. Did Stubbsy make mistakes throughout the ties? Aye he did but they should have been buried out there.

But is the season over? Certainly not for me it ain't. 1 week away from immortality and we wanna talk about our manager leaving? Crazy talk imo - my alarm is set to be down at the TO for the crack of dawn for my final ticket (partly due to the ticket fiasco) but mostly cause some of the highs following hibs under Stubbsy and this team are too good to give up now. The whole club needs to be together and stand as one - United over the next week

[Brightside]

Not at all, just fed up being told that i'd rather the team lost than support the manager who was clearly making the same mistakes week after week.

did he make a mistake tonight? bossed the game. certain players let us down

[Centre Hawf]

You've failed Alan. Last season we were so happy to just see our club turned round and heading in the right direction. This year you've somehow went back a step. We've had some great memories in the cups and big results in the league.

But ultimately your job was to get us out of this division, beat the drossy semi pro tinpot clubs and you struggled to find the winning formula on a consistent enough basis for that. You failed to pick the team up from the slide that saw drop enough points to kill our title race, a league cup final, and never fully recovered it in time to get us up via the playoffs.

Best of luck next week Alan, and wherever you end up next. I would say you're leaving us in a better position you found us in two years ago, but the idea of having a club this size in this division for so long leaves me worried what kind of team I'll see play in that jersey I love for the first Championship game of our THIRD year down here.

[blackpoolhibs]

did he make a mistake tonight? bossed the game. certain players let us down

Playing Gray and Stevenson as our wide attackers EVERY bloody week is a mistake, it gives us virtually no quality going forward at all, and leaves us vulnerable to the counter attack.

Cant believe he took Keatings off, and i'd also have put Fontaine on for Fyvie who was just having his worst game ever for us.

Ponderous, and he built this team.

[Unseen work]

Beefster referenced his on the other Stubbs thread so thought I’d bring it back up now there is a lot of chat on new managers.

Have a quick read and I wonder if folk will still want him back

[shetlandhibee]

Beefster referenced his on the other Stubbs thread so thought I’d bring it back up now there is a lot of chat on new managers.

Have a quick read and I wonder if folk will still want him back
everybody knows all this? BUT HE WON WHEN IT MATTERED MOST NO? and gave every single one of us the best footballing day of our lives fort his reasons its a big yes from me!!:agree: last manager in SCOTLAND out with celtic to win a trophy come home STUBBSY :flag:

[Speedway]

everybody knows all this? BUT HE WON WHEN IT MATTERED MOST NO? and gave every single one of us the best footballing day of our lives fort his reasons its a big yes from me!!:agree: last manager in SCOTLAND out with celtic to win a trophy come home STUBBSY :flag:

He did and now it’s done.

Thank you and goodbye Alan.

[ABZHFC]

Beefster referenced his on the other Stubbs thread so thought I’d bring it back up now there is a lot of chat on new managers.

Have a quick read and I wonder if folk will still want him back

All I see is Hibs fans being typically knee-jerk and reactionary?

What a shame some can't see the bigger picture :rolleyes:

[shetlandhibee]

He did and now it’s done.

Thank you and goodbye Alan.
WOW i suppose its your opinion IMO its sad to see fellow fans writing of what is a living HIBS LEGEND after what he did but hey ho?! your entitled to your opinion:aok:

[hibeesam]

The Return of the Stubbs😀😇

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Must be full moon.
Our club really is ****** - all this fear and self loathing. What is wrong with people?
Take the person responsible for the ultimate - ULTIMATE - bar none - of our Hibs supporting lives (and he almost bagged 2 cups) yet we dilute his memory.
Contrast that with the other dross we’ve had “managing” us.
We’ve lost perspective - reduced everything to the same common denominator. There must be a term for this in psychology - that’s gonna need a big effing couch.

[Todi114]

This thread just shows how short term and reactionary some fans are
Alan Stubbs gave hope pride and most importantly joy
Neil Lennon gave us 1 great season
we need someone to stay a little longer and build something that will last after they’ve gone

[Clarence]

This thread just shows how short term and reactionary some fans are
Alan Stubbs gave hope pride and most importantly joy
Neil Lennon gave us 1 great season
we need someone to stay a little longer and build something that will last after they’ve gone

Unfortunately we have seen how quickly progress can be reversed so the building needs to be done by the club rather than the manager.

[Yorkshire HFC]

Unfortunately we have seen how quickly progress can be reversed so the building needs to be done by the club rather than the manager.

Hibs don't like to think long term - any manager is only a couple of games away from criticism, pressure from the Board, the sack and a big pay off. And then we start from scratch again.

Give a manager a season or two to start building a team and put a system and culture into place - no chance.

Bring through a few of the young players? No way, that's too much hassle. It's easier to sign someone from the 3rd / 4th tier in England, Finland or Germany.

I think it's the main reason why we rarely win a Cup or get into Europe.

Hibs are the McDonalds of the football world - fast food, instant and short term gratification demanded - but it leaves you hungry and unsatisfied after half an hour!

[Peevemor]

Hibs don't like to think long term - any manager is only a couple of games away from criticism, pressure from the Board, the sack and a big pay off. And then we start from scratch again.

Give a manager a season or two to start building a team and put a system and culture into place - no chance.

Bring through a few of the young players? No way, that's too much hassle. It's easier to sign someone from the 3rd / 4th tier in England, Finland or Germany.

I think it's the main reason why we rarely win a Cup or get into Europe.

Hibs are the McDonalds of the football world - fast food, instant and short term gratification demanded - but it leaves you hungry and unsatisfied after half an hour!

The board are currently being criticised by some (many) for not binning Heckingbottom sooner. Are you saying that he should have been given longer?

[Pretty Boy]

There is nothing I hate more than a thread being bumped years after an event so people can get their jollies mocking people by reading posts with no context.

What point does it prove? Football fans are emotional? Football fans think in the short term? Football fans are reactionary? It's hardly hold the front page stuff. It's probably the one thing that marks out internet discussion as completely different from real life. If you were in a pub and came out with 'I recall in March 2016 you clearly said.....' people would look at you like you had 2 heads and laugh.

I accept everyone is different but it's the emotional swings that keep me going to football. Beat Hearts and we are Brazil 1970, draw with St Mirren and we are San Marino any vintage. If that gives someone a bit of a thrill several years down the line then so be it.

[Yorkshire HFC]

The board are currently being criticised by some (many) for not binning Heckingbottom sooner. Are you saying that he should have been given longer?

That's in the past now.

What I want for the future is the club to stick with the next man - what worries me is who the next man will be.

It's always a massive gamble - there's no guarantee that he'll be better than Heckingbottom.

[calumhibee1]

Pleased to see I didn’t post on this thread. Love you Stubbsy.

[Speedway]

WOW i suppose its your opinion IMO its sad to see fellow fans writing of what is a living HIBS LEGEND after what he did but hey ho?! your entitled to your opinion:aok:

Legend?

Or

Chancer who got lucky and has been found out quickly twice since?

Or

Both?

[Allant1981]

He wasnt good enough then and he hasnt improved since, the board didnt bring him back when Lennon was sacked and he hasnt been in a job to improve since so it will be the same scenario, amazing day when we won the cup, best left at that

[superfurryhibby]

He wasnt good enough then and he hasnt improved since, the board didnt bring him back when Lennon was sacked and he hasnt been in a job to improve since so it will be the same scenario, amazing day when we won the cup, best left at that

Who is “good enough”?

[Beefster]

There is nothing I hate more than a thread being bumped years after an event so people can get their jollies mocking people by reading posts with no context.

Given I linked to this thread in the current Stubbs thread without actually bumping it, I suppose this is at lease partly aimed at me.

For the record, the aim wasn’t to ‘get my jollies’ or mock anyone. It was to provide a counter to an overwhelmingly rosy-tinted view of Stubbs’ performance by providing an insight to the actual views of the time rather than though the prism of the Scottish Cup win.

If the thread had been a two-pager then I wouldn’t have bothered but, at the time, there was a sizeable proportion, if not a majority, of posters on here thought his time was up.

[Pretty Boy]

Given I linked to this thread in the current Stubbs thread without actually bumping it, I suppose this is at lease partly aimed at me.

For the record, the aim wasn’t to ‘get my jollies’ or mock anyone. It was to provide a counter to an overwhelmingly rosy-tinted view of Stubbs’ performance by providing an insight to the actual views of the time rather than though the prism of the Scottish Cup win.

If the thread had been a two-pager then I wouldn’t have bothered but, at the time, there was a sizeable proportion, if not a majority, of posters on here thought his time was up.

I hadn't seen this linked in the other thread.

Given your last post on there is actually adding context to the link then it's not really the same thing as just bumping the thread up the board. I'd still argue it's possible to have been angry at the time, I've not checked but I'm certain I'll have posted on this thread multiple times, but with a bit time for reflection and having removed the emotional instant reaction from things comes to a different conclusion.

[Allant1981]

Who is “good enough”?

Good question, I would say someone who has a track record of sorting clubs out who are in a bit of a mess and getting them to progress as a club, not someone who couldnt get out of the scottish championship with arguably one of the best teams in the country and then be so bad at his next 2 jobs that he was sacked in a few months, if stubbs had not been at hibs previously and we seen his managerial record theres not a chance fans would be wanting him at the club. Who the next manager could be though I've no idea, depends on what the board are looking for I suppose

[Smartie]

Quite pleased to see that I didn't contribute to this thread at the time, but......

Is it that unreasonable to be very unhappy with the way Hibs had capitulated in the league and failed to be promoted, then thoroughly acknowledge the massive achievement that was winning our first Scottish Cup in 114 years?

That righted a good few wrongs and I reckon we should be fairly forgiving of each other for angry, heat of the moment comments at a tough time.

You have to take the whole package with Stubbs and appraise it accordingly - the Cup win, the good runs in the other cups, the improvement from an awful starting position, the excellent recruitment, the football that often lacked a cutting edge, the drop off in league form during the second season, the ultimate failure to gain promotion, the unexpected item in the kitty.

[Hiber-nation]

Who is “good enough”?

Exactly. Every successful manager we've had has come a cropper at some point.

[Cataplana]

Good question, I would say someone who has a track record of sorting clubs out who are in a bit of a mess and getting them to progress as a club, not someone who couldnt get out of the scottish championship with arguably one of the best teams in the country and then be so bad at his next 2 jobs that he was sacked in a few months, if stubbs had not been at hibs previously and we seen his managerial record theres not a chance fans would be wanting him at the club. Who the next manager could be though I've no idea, depends on what the board are looking for I suppose

Yogis CV would be more impressive than Stubbs.

[SHODAN]

I can't help but feel like us bringing back Stubbs would be like Scotland bringing back McLeish.

It was great while is lasted, but now it's over. Move on.

[hibsbollah]

There is nothing I hate more than a thread being bumped years after an event so people can get their jollies mocking people by reading posts with no context.

What point does it prove? Football fans are emotional? Football fans think in the short term? Football fans are reactionary? It's hardly hold the front page stuff. It's probably the one thing that marks out internet discussion as completely different from real life. If you were in a pub and came out with 'I recall in March 2016 you clearly said.....' people would look at you like you had 2 heads and laugh.

I accept everyone is different but it's the emotional swings that keep me going to football. Beat Hearts and we are Brazil 1970, draw with St Mirren and we are San Marino any vintage. If that gives someone a bit of a thrill several years down the line then so be it.

Personally I like to see dredged up threads, particularly if I'm involved, or as in this case, if posters who I have no time for today were clearly still ignorant bellends in the distant past too :greengrin. It's like finding a lovely message in a glass bottle on a beach.

Some quality tantrums and keyboard warrior/square go outside content too.

[Barman Stanton]

People understandably upset over the failure of promotion. There was also threads wanting Lennon sacked. Then when he was people went bonkers. Most football fans are fickle as hell.

Will say though, no one in my group of mates that go to games wanted Stubbs sacked. Its mostly black and white with Hibs.net, such is the way online works.

[worcesterhibby]

I can't help but feel like us bringing back Stubbs would be like Scotland bringing back McLeish.

It was great while is lasted, but now it's over. Move on.

It's only like that if McLeish had won the World Cup the first time he was manager.

[worcesterhibby]

The difference 45 days can make.

On the 21st of February we defeated Alloa 3-0 shortly after knocking Hearts out of the cup. Back then Stubbs was Mowbray 2.0.

This is the key post for me...shows the lack of patience that fans have and the way we turn on managers when it doesn't go well.

[1 8 7 5]

There is nothing I hate more than a thread being bumped years after an event so people can get their jollies mocking people by reading posts with no context.

What point does it prove? Football fans are emotional? Football fans think in the short term? Football fans are reactionary? It's hardly hold the front page stuff. It's probably the one thing that marks out internet discussion as completely different from real life. If you were in a pub and came out with 'I recall in March 2016 you clearly said.....' people would look at you like you had 2 heads and laugh.

I accept everyone is different but it's the emotional swings that keep me going to football. Beat Hearts and we are Brazil 1970, draw with St Mirren and we are San Marino any vintage. If that gives someone a bit of a thrill several years down the line then so be it.

In this instance I disagree. There is much misty eyed clamour to bring him back, and I think its good to remind people how they were feeling at the time. Lots of posters on this thread were wanting him gone. There is context here, absolutely!
Your 3rd paragraph is moot as you can say the same for every single football team out there! Thats how fans are.

We are no different.

[seanshow]

While we are regurgitating old posts, it just proves Football forums are the epicentre of the fickle fan,

So just for a laugh let me shoehorn some forum quotes about Hecky as of 6 months ago,.. this was before he dragged numerous dog turds into HTC

"" Paul Heckingbottom, Actual born winner.

We have one heck of a gaffer in charge.

Man crush alert.

One in the eye for the (very small number of) Hibbies that said he was useless and we'd get murdered today.
You know who you are!

Already achieved things Lennon couldn't.

Can’t remember a Hibs manager having as good a start.

I’m sure BT Sport said he’s the best since the 50’s...

Every player does what instructed with a smile on their faces. Incredible turnaround.

He's hot stuff. Love muffin

best start for a Hibs manager ever.

Amazing and shows class the way he acts.

He’s a brilliant coach. Brilliant.
hes come in and made us a team with a smile on our faces.

He is Hibs class just like Stubbs was.

Thank goodness he was appointed rather than Appleton

Getting that warm fuzzy feeling I got when Stubbs and Mowbray were here..

I liked Heck from the first interview as he sounded exactly what we needed. He is Stubbs with more tactical nous.

He's very like Stubbs in touchline mentality and behaviour, he doesn't panic or rant - always positive. Really impressive and a real 'manager'.


If we lose and he remains calm some folk will be up in arms.


+
Looks like Leanne has worked her magic again. ""



:tee hee:

[CRAZYHIBBY]

I think stubbs has a better eye for players than yogi

[wookie70]

In this instance I disagree. There is much misty eyed clamour to bring him back, and I think its good to remind people how they were feeling at the time. Lots of posters on this thread were wanting him gone. There is context here, absolutely!
Your 3rd paragraph is moot as you can say the same for every single football team out there! Thats how fans are.

We are no different. I didn't post in this thread but I liked Stubbs and wanted him to at the very least see out the season. He improved us massively and in most seasons our points total would have been enough to be promoted. Both seasons point total in the Championship under Stubbs, with better teams, would have won the league comfortably in the season Lennon got us up. My view was patience at the time. I wasn't Lennon's biggest fan but even when he was incoherent and had a team that was underperforming and shambolic I still said give him till the end of the season. I was the same with Fenlon, it was dull and I wanted better but his big failure was getting into a Cup Final and Europe. That led to two of our worst results and the achievement of getting there was lost.

I would have persevered with Heck a little longer. His problem was we were in a position in the league that if it didn't improve was perilous. In my view we were never getting relegated and although results were poor performances were improving and he would have got us into a better position. We will never know but at the end of the season or perhaps sooner we will know whether sacking Heck was correct. We can just as easily get worse from here as better and if you sack managers quickly it can get messy very quickly.

[marinello59]

I'll admit it, I walked out of Falkirk's ground after losing the play off and wanted him sacked before the cup final. After the cup final I wanted him to stay in the job for life. I'm fickle, what can I say. :greengrin
I'd like to see him come back, I feel he could get something more out of this group of players.

[ads913]

my god how silly is this, to prove a point bringing up a old thread, whole point of a forum is to discuss current content. to bring up a piece from a very disappointing moment in time is very unfair. what next will we bring up the Stubbs threads after numerous glory moments much more in quantity to the bad moment in his tenure . multi threading please admins suspend.

[worcesterhibby]

While we are regurgitating old posts, it just proves Football forums are the epicentre of the fickle fan,

So just for a laugh let me shoehorn some forum quotes about Hecky as of 6 months ago,.. this was before he dragged numerous dog turds into HTC

"" Paul Heckingbottom, Actual born winner.

We have one heck of a gaffer in charge.

Man crush alert.

One in the eye for the (very small number of) Hibbies that said he was useless and we'd get murdered today.
You know who you are!

Already achieved things Lennon couldn't.

Can’t remember a Hibs manager having as good a start.

I’m sure BT Sport said he’s the best since the 50’s...

Every player does what instructed with a smile on their faces. Incredible turnaround.

He's hot stuff. Love muffin

best start for a Hibs manager ever.

Amazing and shows class the way he acts.

He’s a brilliant coach. Brilliant.
hes come in and made us a team with a smile on our faces.

He is Hibs class just like Stubbs was.

Thank goodness he was appointed rather than Appleton

Getting that warm fuzzy feeling I got when Stubbs and Mowbray were here..

I liked Heck from the first interview as he sounded exactly what we needed. He is Stubbs with more tactical nous.

He's very like Stubbs in touchline mentality and behaviour, he doesn't panic or rant - always positive. Really impressive and a real 'manager'.


If we lose and he remains calm some folk will be up in arms.


+
Looks like Leanne has worked her magic again. ""



:tee hee:


"LOVE MUFFIN" :shocked::shocked::rotflmao:

[hibsbollah]

"LOVE MUFFIN" :shocked::shocked::rotflmao:

Guilty as charged :faf:

My intention was to be humourous... He does know how to rock quality knitwear.

[basehibby]

I'm in favour of a Stubbs return but there's nothing misty eyed about it.

I realise he's not the perfect coach - there is really no such thing - but believe there is such a thing as a good fit for a job and Stubbs ticks the boxes for Hibs.

He gets Hibs and where we fit in with Scottish football, favours a style which sits well with the support (V Important) and, perhaps most vitally, has shown an eye for the kind of player that will do well for a club of this stature.

I know he didn't do too well at Rotherham or St Mirren but the above makes him about as safe a bet as you could get for us in my eyes. There are other good coaches out there - Jack Ross among them - but every one is a gamble to some extent. With Stubbs there is an element of familiarity on both sides which lessens the risk factor.

[1 8 7 5]

I didn't post in this thread but I liked Stubbs and wanted him to at the very least see out the season. He improved us massively and in most seasons our points total would have been enough to be promoted. Both seasons point total in the Championship under Stubbs, with better teams, would have won the league comfortably in the season Lennon got us up. My view was patience at the time. I wasn't Lennon's biggest fan but even when he was incoherent and had a team that was underperforming and shambolic I still said give him till the end of the season. I was the same with Fenlon, it was dull and I wanted better but his big failure was getting into a Cup Final and Europe. That led to two of our worst results and the achievement of getting there was lost.

I would have persevered with Heck a little longer. His problem was we were in a position in the league that if it didn't improve was perilous. In my view we were never getting relegated and although results were poor performances were improving and he would have got us into a better position. We will never know but at the end of the season or perhaps sooner we will know whether sacking Heck was correct. We can just as easily get worse from here as better and if you sack managers quickly it can get messy very quickly.

Going back quite a bit,average of around 2 years per manager.. so in that sence PHB hasn't been given what other managers have been. (Personally <and I know its irrational> I wanted him punted after Ibrox. That result in itself was completely unacceptable, but it was the performances etc in the lead up ie pre season/league cup etc and including that debacle. PHB team has no spine)

We could easily get worse from here, but I really think we wont. I think it was wholly correct to sack him and RS. No game management imho.

[1 8 7 5]

my god how silly is this, to prove a point bringing up a old thread, whole point of a forum is to discuss current content. to bring up a piece from a very disappointing moment in time is very unfair. what next will we bring up the Stubbs threads after numerous glory moments much more in quantity to the bad moment in his tenure . multi threading please admins suspend.

I really didnt think its been brought back to "prove" anything... look it as a gentle reminder, to see how fans felt in the moment. Its vital Hibernian progress...we have gone so far back in such as short period! Its imperative that nostalgia does NOT play a part in Hibernian recruiting our next manager.

[Deansy]

I'd take Stubbs back in an instant - I want attacking football back at Easter Road !

[lucky]

I don’t want any of our previous managers back. Stubbs and his coaching staff delivered the greatest day in my Hibs supporting life but that’s in past. We don’t forget and all remember that weekend and move on looking for more.

[HibeeHibernian4]

Yogis CV would be more impressive than Stubbs.

Time for me to log off. That’s the most bat**** mental thing I’ll ever read on .net.

[rotherhamrob]

Good question, I would say someone who has a track record of sorting clubs out who are in a bit of a mess and getting them to progress as a club, not someone who couldnt get out of the scottish championship with arguably one of the best teams in the country and then be so bad at his next 2 jobs that he was sacked in a few months, if stubbs had not been at hibs previously and we seen his managerial record theres not a chance fans would be wanting him at the club. Who the next manager could be though I've no idea, depends on what the board are looking for I suppose

You do realise that we were in a mess, he brought the club on and eventually built one of the best teams in the country and delivered the Scottish cup while he was at it😎

[MikeyS]

Time for me to log off. That’s the most bat**** mental thing I’ll ever read on .net.

You cant have been on here long then, not sure how it can be argued that Hughes' achievements arent greater than Stubbs?

For what it's worth I wouldn't want either of them back anyway.

[HibeeHibernian4]

You cant have been on here long then, not sure how it can be argued that Hughes' achievements arent greater than Stubbs?

For what it's worth I wouldn't want either of them back anyway.

Achievements such as sending Raith Rovers hurtling into the seaside leagues, being found out at Inverness as soon as the half-decent sides returned to the top flight? Help me out here.

[ads913]

I really didnt think its been brought back to "prove" anything... look it as a gentle reminder, to see how fans felt in the moment. Its vital Hibernian progress...we have gone so far back in such as short period! Its imperative that nostalgia does NOT play a part in Hibernian recruiting our next manager.
Could you just have discussed it in the other thread.... I think in general nostalgia cup win besides ,he turned the club around he started the ball rolling in a major overhaul to produce the best football and team its not fantasy its only a few years ago and some of the team are still here.

[MikeyS]

Achievements such as sending Raith Rovers hurtling into the seaside leagues, being found out at Inverness as soon as the half-decent sides returned to the top flight? Help me out here.

Falkirk promoted as Champions and kept in top flight for 4 years. Stubbs took 2 shots with us & couldnt do it.

Won the Scottish at ICT then finished 3rd the following year taking them in to Europe for 1st time in history.

Stubbs obviously won the Scottish with us but that's his only achievement in football management. He's been sacked from 2 of his 3 posts.

Yogi has been sacked from 2 of his 6 posts. He was also manager of the year at ICT.

[neil7908]

I was in the Stubbs out camp but definitely changed my mind.

If we can get a better coach then great but I haven't been enthused by many of the names being floated about.

Stubbs on a deal until the end of season would make sense unless a truly outstanding candidate is available.

[1 8 7 5]

Could you just have discussed it in the other thread.... I think in general nostalgia cup win besides ,he turned the club around he started the ball rolling in a major overhaul to produce the best football and team its not fantasy its only a few years ago and some of the team are still here.

eh?

I posted in response to the point in your post : "my god how silly is this, to prove a point bringing up a old thread..."

Iv clearly stated its hardly "proving a point". What the thread CLEARLY shows, is that the vast majority of the Hibs.net chuntering class wernae all that pleased with Stubbs at the time! The regurgitated thread brough a bit of balance to the question of Stubbs returning.

Im not adverse to him coming back (with the correct backroom), loved what was achieved at Hibernian in his tenure, but would rather we looked elsewhere personally.

[HibeeHibernian4]

Falkirk promoted as Champions and kept in top flight for 4 years. Stubbs took 2 shots with us & couldnt do it.

Won the Scottish at ICT then finished 3rd the following year taking them in to Europe for 1st time in history.

Stubbs obviously won the Scottish with us but that's his only achievement in football management. He's been sacked from 2 of his 3 posts.

Yogi has been sacked from 2 of his 6 posts. He was also manager of the year at ICT.

I am not going to telling you or anyone else again that "promoted from the Championship" is an achievement which fluctuates in its impressiveness depending on how difficult that second tier was. Alan Stubbs had the two toughest second divisions ever competed in.

John Hughes' Falkirk had title rivals such as Clyde, St Mirren and Airdrie United.

It is not even in the same stratosphere as Stubbs' Championships were in terms of difficulty.

And you can reverse that for Caley's Premiership. Utter, utter dross throughout the top flight. Hibs were a better team than half the league but couldn't get into the Premiership because of a bottleneck. As our cup record shows, we made short work of almost every Premiership side we faced under Stubbs.

[MikeyS]

I am not going to telling you or anyone else again that "promoted from the Championship" is an achievement which fluctuates in its impressiveness depending on how difficult that second tier was. Alan Stubbs had the two toughest second divisions ever competed in.

John Hughes' Falkirk had title rivals such as Clyde, St Mirren and Airdrie United.

It is not even in the same stratosphere as Stubbs' Championships were in terms of difficulty.

And you can reverse that for Caley's Premiership. Utter, utter dross throughout the top flight. Hibs were a better team than half the league but couldn't get into the Premiership because of a bottleneck. As our cup record shows, we made short work of almost every Premiership side we faced under Stubbs.

You can only beat what's in front of you, He didnt hand pick his opponents on the way to winning that league or winning the cup. You should maybe get in touch with the SPL to denounce all titles won by Celtic while us, Hearts & Rangers were out the league.


Incidently, Robbie Neilson and a bunch of bairns made light work of it at Hearts. Looking back at the teams, there isn't many individuals I'd swap from their team either.

[hibee-boys]

Most were calling for Stubbs to go prior to cup win, remembering that, combined with his record since then, puts him out of the equation for me. Oh, and kittygate would question whether the club would request his services again.

[basehibby]

This thread should be "stickied" as a reference to the dangers of being a bedwetting fandan.

If the board had listened to the self appointed experts blowing their trumpets early on in this thread we'd still be waiting for our first Scottish Cup win since 1902 - SHAME ON YOU ALL!

[Danderhall Hibs]

Great thread. It shows how damaged our fan bases psyche is after Terry Butcher. The club could do with offering counselling.

[ABZHFC]

As I say, people saying "this thread shows be careful what you wish for with Stubbs" are fundamentally wrong. It shows the absolute irrationality of football fans, and is possibly a decent advertisement for why fans shouldn't be logging onto forums foaming at the mouth after a defeat

[blackpoolhibs]

As I say, people saying "this thread shows be careful what you wish for with Stubbs" are fundamentally wrong. It shows the absolute irrationality of football fans, and is possibly a decent advertisement for why fans shouldn't be logging onto forums foaming at the mouth after a defeat

I don't see anyone wanting any manager out the door after a defeat, its normally a number of defeats and poor performances.

Stubbs results were the poorest in my lifetime, we were in the 2nd tier of Scottish football, losing to the likes of Alloa.

He won the cup, and for that i thank him every day for the rest of my life, and its given him more kudos than any manager i've seen at Hibs.

[Keith_M]

2014/15 - Stubbs
1 Hearts Gd +70 Pts 91 (Record Points Total)
2 Hibernian Gd +38 Pts 70
3 Rangers Gd +30 Pts 67

2015/16 - Stubbs
1 Rangers Gd +54 Pts 81
2 Falkirk Gd +27 Pts 70
3 Hibernian Gd +25 Pts 70 (League Cup Runners Up, Scottish Cup Winners)

2016/17 - Lennon
1 Hibernian Gd +34 Pts 71
2 Falkirk Gd +18 Pts 60
3 D-United Gd +8 Pts 57

[The 90+2]

This thread should be "stickied" as a reference to the dangers of being a bedwetting fandan.

If the board had listened to the self appointed experts blowing their trumpets early on in this thread we'd still be waiting for our first Scottish Cup win since 1902 - SHAME ON YOU ALL!

That’s a bit unfair, I just read the whole thread and csaba laszlo may have done a similar thing 😂😂😂😂😂😂

[Centre Hawf]

I contributed to this thread and having read my post back I'm embarrassed I thought in the aftermath of a play off defeat it was wise to vent thoughts so quickly.

There is some truth in my post in that he did struggle to find a solid tactic to beat the tinpot teams consistently (Anyone remember Henri Anier's two decent contributions that won us about 4 points then we never saw him again?). Thankfully we won't be playing Alloa or Falkirk in the league any time soon (Fingers crossed). And he did struggle to recover a slide that saw us fall out the title race and we were beaten in a cup final.

But truth being told I'd still have him back.

[Unseen work]

Also worth nothing since he left us he managed till October with Rotherham before being sacked and only September with St mirren before being sacked.

He doesn’t exactly have the best track record, Scottish cup aside.

[HibeeHibernian4]

Also worth nothing since he left us he managed till October with Rotherham before being sacked and only September with St mirren before being sacked.

He doesn’t exactly have the best track record, Scottish cup aside.

As posted on another thread.


Again though, isn't some context required?

Rotherham are traditionally a third tier club in English football. They bounce between the second and fourth tiers in their good/bad years, but their level is typically League One. Having won the Play-offs on penalties in 2014, they finished 21st in both seasons in the Championship before Stubbs arrived, one place above the relegation zone.

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Rotherham_United_F.C._seasons#/media/File:RotherhamUnitedFC_League_Performance.svg)

If you want to question Stubbs' judgment for taking the job, I'd completely agree. It was an extremely risky one to take and was always likely to end badly. They are a tiny club in the Championship, relatively speaking, and would be doing well to survive every season they're there. The English equivalent of Hamilton Accies, for example.

But in terms of Stubbs' record there, I don't think it's particularly much worse than most managers would've done. He also, in those 140 days, signed Will Vaulks, who has since gone on to Wales international caps and been sold to Cardiff for a club record fee. Again, demonstrating Stubbs' eye for a player.

Onto St Mirren, again I wouldn't say that the top tier of Scottish football is their natural home. A bit of a yo-yo club, who bounce between the first and second tiers. I'd say this graph (akin to Rotherham's) proves my point quite well:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:St_Mirren_FC_League_Performance.svg

His signings at St Mirren? Not good. I do think not having Doolan and Taff with him hindered him, so if he were at Hibs again, I'd want them back too. I think St Mirren's board did push the panic button too quickly.

I certainly think, in conclusion, his time at Rotherham and St Mirren wasn't successful, but it doesn't counterweight the amount of success he had at Hibs.

[easty]

As posted on another thread.

Yeah but you pick and choose your info to what can best back up your Stubbs being the best man for the job opinion.

Aye, Will Vaulks turned out to be a good signing, Vaulks wasn't the only player he signed at Rotherham though. He spent more on Jon Taylor...thier most expensive player purchase. Who turned out to be *****.

[lord bunberry]

my god how silly is this, to prove a point bringing up a old thread, whole point of a forum is to discuss current content. to bring up a piece from a very disappointing moment in time is very unfair. what next will we bring up the Stubbs threads after numerous glory moments much more in quantity to the bad moment in his tenure . multi threading please admins suspend.
Agreed, why don’t I bring back the cup final thread to prove how great Stubbs is.

[MacGruber]

2014/15 - Stubbs
1 Hearts Gd +70 Pts 91 (Record Points Total)
2 Hibernian Gd +38 Pts 70
3 Rangers Gd +30 Pts 67

2015/16 - Stubbs
1 Rangers Gd +54 Pts 81
2 Falkirk Gd +27 Pts 70
3 Hibernian Gd +25 Pts 70 (League Cup Runners Up, Scottish Cup Winners)

2016/17 - Lennon
1 Hibernian Gd +34 Pts 71
2 Falkirk Gd +18 Pts 60
3 D-United Gd +8 Pts 57

What this goes to show aswell as the comparisons between Lennon and Stubbs Hibs campaigns is the difference in the quality of the challengers in the league with Hibs.
The 3rd season there was no real challengers - a league Stubbs would have won. Lennon wouldnt have won either of the 1st 2 championship seasons either - in my opinion

[shetlandhibee]

I'm in favour of a Stubbs return but there's nothing misty eyed about it.

I realise he's not the perfect coach - there is really no such thing - but believe there is such a thing as a good fit for a job and Stubbs ticks the boxes for Hibs.

He gets Hibs and where we fit in with Scottish football, favours a style which sits well with the support (V Important) and, perhaps most vitally, has shown an eye for the kind of player that will do well for a club of this stature.

I know he didn't do too well at Rotherham or St Mirren but the above makes him about as safe a bet as you could get for us in my eyes. There are other good coaches out there - Jack Ross among them - but every one is a gamble to some extent. With Stubbs there is an element of familiarity on both sides which lessens the risk factor.
:top marksto sensible a post in my eyes:agree: IMO i would be very surprized and disapointed if hes not on at least on the short list for the job leane dempster knows that she has to get the next appointment right and she knows what stubbs brung last time around ,, make it happen HIBS please from me anyway:gwa:

[shetlandhibee]

:top marks
What this goes to show aswell as the comparisons between Lennon and Stubbs Hibs campaigns is the difference in the quality of the challengers in the league with Hibs.
The 3rd season there was no real challengers - a league Stubbs would have won. Lennon wouldnt have won either of the 1st 2 championship seasons either - in my opinion

[Smartie]

Also worth nothing since he left us he managed till October with Rotherham before being sacked and only September with St mirren before being sacked.

He doesn’t exactly have the best track record, Scottish cup aside.

He has an appalling record at choosing jobs.

He took us on post-Butcher when we were virtually a basket case and we have been his biggest success.

Going to clubs who sacked him in September and October might tell us as much about them as they did about him.

[B.H.F.C]

What this goes to show aswell as the comparisons between Lennon and Stubbs Hibs campaigns is the difference in the quality of the challengers in the league with Hibs.
The 3rd season there was no real challengers - a league Stubbs would have won. Lennon wouldnt have won either of the 1st 2 championship seasons either - in my opinion

Basically, our head to head record against Falkirk and Utd won us the league. Improvement, given our record against Falkirk the year before.

[HibeeHibernian4]

Basically, our head to head record against Falkirk and Utd won us the league. Improvement, given our record against Falkirk the year before.

Lennon's record against Dundee United (P4 W2 D1 L1) was not as good as Stubbs' in the first season against Rangers (P4 W3 D0 L1) and fractionally better than his record against them in the second season (P4 W2 D0 L2).

[RoYO!]

A few questions to ponder: would you take stubbsy’s cup record? Would you take his signings record? Would you take his style of play? What do you make of stubbsy’s derby record?

No brainer for me.

[B.H.F.C]

As I say, people saying "this thread shows be careful what you wish for with Stubbs" are fundamentally wrong. It shows the absolute irrationality of football fans, and is possibly a decent advertisement for why fans shouldn't be logging onto forums foaming at the mouth after a defeat

I think the thread was started after a defeat to the mighty Alloa, a couple of years in to the job. It received further contributions after a play off defeat to the, slightly more mighty, Falkirk a couple of years in to the job. The reaction at the time was hardly irrational and off the back of just a poor result.

I said before Heckingbottom was even sacked I’d be on the phone to Stubbs and give him it until the end of the season. More I think about it, the more I’m not so sure.

[B.H.F.C]

Lennon's record against Dundee United (P4 W2 D1 L1) was not as good as Stubbs' in the first season against Rangers (P4 W3 D0 L1) and fractionally better than his record against them in the second season (P4 W2 D0 L2).

Don’t really see the relevance of that, other than to show that there must have been a hell of a lot of poor results against the poor sides in the league under Stubbs.

[HibeeHibernian4]

Don’t really see the relevance of that, other than to show that there must have been a hell of a lot of poor results against the poor sides in the league under Stubbs.

2014/15:
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2015/16
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2016/17
P36 W19 D14 L3 PTS 71

A hell of a lot of poor results under Lennon in his season too, don't you think?

[B.H.F.C]

2014/15:
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2015/16
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2016/17
P36 W19 D14 L3 PTS 71

A hell of a lot of poor results under Lennon in his season too, don't you think?

Never said there wasn’t. But you don’t seem to want to accept that there was under Stubbs?

I’ve never said that the championship season under Lennon was really good either, it wasn’t. I just don’t see that Stubbs particularly deserves more credit for his league efforts.

[Crunchie]

2014/15:
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2015/16
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2016/17
P36 W19 D14 L3 PTS 71

A hell of a lot of poor results under Lennon in his season too, don't you think?

:aok:
And the football on offer was sub standard too. I would love to see Stubbsy back as well but just can't see it happening.

[ABZHFC]

2014/15:
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2015/16
P36 W21 D7 L8 PTS 70

2016/17
P36 W19 D14 L3 PTS 71

A hell of a lot of poor results under Lennon in his season too, don't you think?

People talk of Lennon instilling a 'winning mentality' into Hibs, truthfully it was more of a drawing mentality. We certainly did lose less under Lennon in his first two years in charge though, and I respect and thank him immensely for that, especially the second half of the 2017-18 season, which was one of the most exciting times to support Hibs that I can remember

[Winston Ingram]

People talk of Lennon instilling a 'winning mentality' into Hibs, truthfully it was more of a drawing mentality. We certainly did lose less under Lennon in his first two years in charge though, and I respect and thank him immensely for that, especially the second half of the 2017-18 season, which was one of the most exciting times to support Hibs that I can remember

I suppose it was a not losing mentality. We lost 3 league games that season as opposed to the 8 we lost each of the 2 previous.

[Keith_M]

Basically, our head to head record against Falkirk and Utd won us the league. Improvement, given our record against Falkirk the year before.


As already mentioned, one point of a difference from the previous two seasons, but with no Rangers or Hearts to compete with... or cup finals to win.

Not much of an improvement.

[B.H.F.C]

As already mentioned, one point of a difference from the previous two seasons, but with no Rangers or Hearts to compete with... or cup finals to win.

Not much of an improvement.

We won the league. Lost less games in the league. It was an improvement in the league. In our first year up, Lennon also lost less games in the top flight than Stubbs did in both championship seasons.

I’m making it sound like a Stubbs v Lennon thing when I actually liked both. I just don’t think Stubbs poor results in the league should be excused as much as they are.

Our results against Rangers and Hearts over the two seasons weren’t what stopped us getting up either.

[Nicho87]

So some people don’t want Stubbs back because he couldn’t get us out the championship.

But those stats are great btw finished 1 point less in both seasons than when Lennon won the league with weeks to spare.

First season we played rangers and hearts 8 times.

Far to harsh on Stubbs.

No brainer for me.

Love stubbsy.

[B.H.F.C]

So some people don’t want Stubbs back because he couldn’t get us out the championship.

But those stats are great btw finished 1 point less in both seasons than when Lennon won the league with weeks to spare.

First season we played rangers and hearts 8 times.

Far to harsh on Stubbs.

No brainer for me.

Love stubbsy.

The results against those two were fine. Good in fact. Those results didn’t affect where the title went. It was losing to the likes of Dumbarton.

[Nicho87]

The results against those two were fine. Good in fact. Those results didn’t affect where the title went. It was losing to the likes of Dumbarton.

Yes not denying those results. But the point I’m making is in more competitive league I’d hope you’d agree both years. Stubbs only finished 1 point less.

Scottish cup semi first year

2 cup finals second year.

Not bad to be fair to him.

[lord bunberry]

It wasn’t Stubbs fault that we were in the championship and it wasn’t his fault we didn’t get out of it under him. The first season we were an absolute shambles and he worked wonders to achieve what he did. The second season we were right up there with the huns until the cup runs meant we ran out of gas in the league. For all the people having a go at Stubbs, how would you look back on his time at hibs had we been knocked out of both cup competitions in the early stages but gained promotion that season?

[B.H.F.C]

It wasn’t Stubbs fault that we were in the championship and it wasn’t his fault we didn’t get out of it under him. The first season we were an absolute shambles and he worked wonders to achieve what he did. The second season we were right up there with the huns until the cup runs meant we ran out of gas in the league. For all the people having a go at Stubbs, how would you look back on his time at hibs had we been knocked out of both cup competitions in the early stages but gained promotion that season?

I don’t think the cup runs really caused us to fall out of contention in the league. They beat us at Christmas, at which point we fell behind. By the end of January (before the cup runs had kicked in) we’d dropped a couple of points further back. By the end of February we were out of it, having had one cup replay to contend with.

I’m certainly not having a go at Stubbs. I posted elsewhere that I would probably have him back (until the end of the season initially) and that I think the good outweighs the bad. I just don’t think the ‘reasons’ for the poor league form are as valid as some.

[Smartie]

I always thought he should have rotated his squad more. There were decent squad players like Stanton who could have come in and done a decent job (good enough to compete with Alloa, Morton and Dumbarton anyway) without burning out his first team. They managed their final hurrah with some style but often looked dead on their feet in the weeks leading up to that, and I think he could have done more to keep them fresh.

[lord bunberry]

I don’t think the cup runs really caused us to fall out of contention in the league. They beat us at Christmas, at which point we fell behind. By the end of January (before the cup runs had kicked in) we’d dropped a couple of points further back. By the end of February we were out of it, having had one cup replay to contend with.

I’m certainly not having a go at Stubbs. I posted elsewhere that I would probably have him back (until the end of the season initially) and that I think the good outweighs the bad. I just don’t think the ‘reasons’ for the poor league form are as valid as some.
I think you’re spot on with that, but without the cup runs I’m sure we’d have finished well ahead of Falkirk and that seems to be the main criticism from many on here.