Official Site: MEETING HELD TO REVIEW LOYALTY POINTS SCHEME

[RSS Bot]

More... (http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/6249)

[Onion]

Surprised one of the stated aims isn't to generate additional revenue for the club. Implied by giving 10 points for a home match and only 5 for away. :confused:

[Golden Bear]

I'm not a fan of the loyalty scheme nevertheless I appreciate the efforts of all those involved in trying to find an ideal system which will appeal to the vast majority of supporters.

Well done to everyone involved.

:thumbsup:

[Beefster]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

[high bee]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

Quite the opposite for me, I have been given priority over those who attend less despite me not having a season ticket or being able to attend every game. If this scheme didn't exist it would've been season ticket holders then everyone else and I would've been in the every one else category.

[BoomtownHibees]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

It's pretty grim that someone has raised that as an opposition to the loyalty scheme

[Monts]

It's pretty grim that someone has raised that as an opposition to the loyalty scheme

I'm not sure but I think it might just be poorly worded. I would think it is meaning that people haven't bothered to collect loyalty points as they don't think it will make enough difference for them for the big games.

[zlatan]

- The decision to award HSL members with loyalty points was debated, as was the concept of rewarding fans for other commitments, for example the purchase of shares or merchandise. Linked to this was the idea that the club could operate a separate system of ‘reward’ points that is not linked to attendance at matches.

There was a website a few years ago where you linked your bank card to it and in return for purchases you got points that could be exchanged for stuff from the shop or other rewards. Buying a big holiday for example got someone on here a tour of the training ground or the likes I'm sure. It was a great thing, bring that back and link it to the shop, HSL, buying shares etc

[Danderhall Hibs]

Do you get loyalty points if you attend the meetings about loyalty points?

[BoomtownHibees]

I'm not sure but I think it might just be poorly worded. I would think it is meaning that people haven't bothered to collect loyalty points as they don't think it will make enough difference for them for the big games.

If that's what it is meaning, it's not just "badly worded"!!!

[Green Reaper]

Do you get loyalty points if you attend the meetings about loyalty points?

Not sure as I couldn't attend the loyalty points meeting as I didn't have enough loyalty points

[Yuillsy]

Quite the opposite for me, I have been given priority over those who attend less despite me not having a season ticket or being able to attend every game. If this scheme didn't exist it would've been season ticket holders then everyone else and I would've been in the every one else category.
That's an excellent example. If Loyalty points were awarded only for away game attendance and walk ups to ER I think it would be a better scheme.
As someone else said earlier though no scheme is perfect and you won't be able to keep everyone happy.

[Pete]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

Bizzare.

Anyway, I find the term "loyalty points" rather provocative and divisive. Happy points is better.

[Carheenlea]

It`s positive to hear of a meeting that has taken on board some of the queries and ideas that echo a lot of the debate on here over the scheme.
On the point of a three year rolling scheme, I can`t see how it can be done any other way to enable the most regular attendees to be in the top bracket. I think the Scotland one is over two years, and that keeps those in the top bracket relevant to the last few campaigns, and gives those starting out a level playing field to be able to catch up in time, which a system that members just keep adding points to tally's swollen from years of attending doesn`t really allow.

[HiBremian]

Do you get loyalty points if you attend the meetings about loyalty points?

Well I'm willing to try any route, but as someone who should have received HSL loyalty points but hasn't, I'd like to complain about the difficulty in getting to loyalty points meetings on time from Bremen. The Zeppelin service is just not what it used to be. :grr:

[CentreLine]

Was there any discussion about additional points being added for those who take the Cup Top-Up option?
:big grin::angeldevi

[matty_f]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

I'm sure being on the bread line was one of the objections to getting loyalty points for HSL subs, so being on the bread line must also be an issue for attending away matches.

Not my opinion, of course.

[Argylehibby]

That's an excellent example. If Loyalty points were awarded only for away game attendance and walk ups to ER I think it would be a better scheme.
As someone else said earlier though no scheme is perfect and you won't be able to keep everyone happy.

Why would you award someone who is a "walk up" points for going to ER but not to a season ticket holder who is at the same game? I agree with only for away games but you can't award points to some who go to a home game and not to others.

[guillaume]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

I think that's a reasonable point - the loyalty point scheme infers people are less loyal fans because they don't go to away games, when there are many reasons why some people aren't able to go to all the games without being any less loyal to the club.

You're right though that there is no single scheme that would keep everyone happy - which is why i now think the whole thing was a mistake.

The scheme appears to have been devised by a small group who imposed it on 20,000 or so other fans.

I'm sure the scheme was set up with the best of intentions but it's likely that the creators will personally benefit from it whereas the vast majority of fans don't.

[Beefster]

Bizzare.

Anyway, I find the term "loyalty points" rather provocative and divisive. Happy points is better.

That was another corker. My vote is for 'having these in no way makes you a better supporter points'. That's a little less provocative and divisive.


I think that's a reasonable point - the loyalty point scheme infers people are less loyal fans because they don't go to away games, when there are many reasons why some people aren't able to go to all the games without being any less loyal to the club.

You're right though that there is no single scheme that would keep everyone happy - which is why i now think the whole thing was a mistake.

The scheme appears to have been devised by a small group who imposed it on 20,000 or so other fans.

I'm sure the scheme was set up with the best of intentions but it's likely that the creators will personally benefit from it whereas the vast majority of fans don't.

There's a few bits there I disagree with.

Your main objection seems to be around the rewarding of those fans who go to games. That's the entire point. I'll be honest, I could claim to be a loyal Ferrari fan but, given I can't afford one and generally only watch Formula 1 and maybe look at the latest model on the web, I don't expect to get the same treatment from Ferrari as some rich guy who buys one every now and then.

Anyone who goes to a single game benefits from the scheme as has been shown by the cup final tickets sale.

The vast majority of schemes that are applied to a large population are devised by small groups. That doesn't make them invalid. Supporters have been asking for a scheme for years. It's not practical to consult everyone on these things and you'd never actually achieve anything.

[Andy74]

That was another corker. My vote is for 'having these in no way makes you a better supporter points'. That's a little less provocative and divisive.



There's a few bits there I disagree with.

Your main objection seems to be around the rewarding of those fans who go to games. That's the entire point. I'll be honest, I could claim to be a loyal Ferrari fan but, given I can't afford one and generally only watch Formula 1 and maybe look at the latest model on the web, I don't expect to get the same treatment from Ferrari as some rich guy who buys one every now and then.

Anyone who goes to a single game benefits from the scheme as has been shown by the cup final tickets sale.

The vast majority of schemes that are applied to a large population are devised by small groups. That doesn't make them invalid. Supporters have been asking for a scheme for years. It's not practical to consult everyone on these things and you'd never actually achieve anything.

Which supporters have been asking for this?

Like any initiative you should look at what problem you are trying to solve.

You should also assess whether solving that problem will create other issues and whether those issues are worth it to solve the initial problem.

I think this scheme is a great example of solving a problem that didn't really exist but has created many other issues instead.

[liamh2202]

Why would you award someone who is a "walk up" points for going to ER but not to a season ticket holder who is at the same game? I agree with only for away games but you can't award points to some who go to a home game and not to others.

Imo st holders should always be in the top bracket.no need for points. Worked well for years , scheme has created problems whilst trying to solve one that wasnt there

[Sir David Gray]

"That some fans were feeling excluded from the scheme if they could not afford to attend every match or were only able to attend some matches due to other commitments."

If nothing else, the above just shows that the club will have folk moaning no matter what they do.

:greengrin I had a wee chuckle at that too.

If that is exactly how that was worded then that's a belter!

[guillaume]

I'll be honest, I could claim to be a loyal Ferrari fan but, given I can't afford one and generally only watch Formula 1 and maybe look at the latest model on the web, I don't expect to get the same treatment from Ferrari as some rich guy who buys one every now and then.

No offence but I couldn't care less what kind of loyalty scheme works for Ferrari, or Tesco, or Hearts, or Scotland Travel Club. I want us to do what's best for Hibs and Hibs fans, and if that's unique then I wouldn't be too surprised.

I just know that as a >500 point holder I'm embarrassed when I get preferential treatment over guys I know who have had season tickets since before I was born but don't make it to many away games any more, or guys who earn less than me so make a far bigger sacrifice to pay for their season tickets than I do but definitely can't afford to pay into HSL.

I would hate them to think that I believe I am more loyal than them.



The vast majority of schemes that are applied to a large population are devised by small groups. That doesn't make them invalid. Supporters have been asking for a scheme for years. It's not practical to consult everyone on these things and you'd never actually achieve anything.

I'm very grateful that people take the time to try to make things better for the club, but in most scenarios there would usually be a chance for the wider population to vote out the initial small group or vote against their schemes - I'd be happy for all members of the scheme to vote on whether it should continue.

[lord bunberry]

Which supporters have been asking for this?

Like any initiative you should look at what problem you are trying to solve.

You should also assess whether solving that problem will create other issues and whether those issues are worth it to solve the initial problem.

I think this scheme is a great example of solving a problem that didn't really exist but has created many other issues instead.
:agree: This system was designed to help a small number of people and has ended up pissing off a larger number of fans. I've never had any problems getting tickets for matches I wanted to attend up until this season.

[Yuillsy]

Why would you award someone who is a "walk up" points for going to ER but not to a season ticket holder who is at the same game? I agree with only for away games but you can't award points to some who go to a home game and not to others.

I wouldn't, I'm a season ticket holder but because of work I can't make away games. If loyalty points were awarded for away games only for season tickets they could release tickets in 3 waves, Season ticket holders with loyalty points(so this would cover regular away game attendees) then season ticket holders then regular walk ups before a general sale. I suppose this is not really any different to how they do it now. Season ticket holders should get preference before anybody as they pay their hard earned cash in advance regardless of what's happening.

[Beefster]

Which supporters have been asking for this?

The club have had requests for a membership scheme / way of recording loyalty other than STs for years. I'm pretty sure that a quick search on here would show a fair number of mentions before the scheme was devised too.


I'm very grateful that people take the time to try to make things better for the club, but in most scenarios there would usually be a chance for the wider population to vote out the initial small group or vote against their schemes - I'd be happy for all members of the scheme to vote on whether it should continue.

It's a fair point but there are supporter-elected directors and anyone can attend LWT meetings IIRC.

PS I'm not a cheerleader for the scheme.

[HappyHanlon]

It's really quite simple.

Stop giving loyalty points to HSL and reward the bloody fans who go week in, week out.

[easty]

Imo st holders should always be in the top bracket.no need for points. Worked well for years , scheme has created problems whilst trying to solve one that wasnt there

I don't understand how folk can still say this sort of thing. We have more season ticket holders than we get allocation of tickets for some games. You can't argue with that, it's a fact. So a loyalty points scheme means that those who go to more away games get preference over season ticket holders who don't often go to away games. That's not solving a problem that wasn't there.

Where they've got it wrong was the points for joining HSL. In my opinion.

[lucky]

Change the name from "loyalty" as this is taken in the wrong context by some fans. There is no perfect scheme, but the reality is that Hibs set this up because of fan demand. Rewarding those who put the most in either through ST, away games and HSL. The club explained why whose who bought shares missed out on extra points. The club need to decide on whether ST numbers will drop because they've been devalued. ST money is the life blood of the club and we have to be careful not to play around with it. This present scheme only got criticism for HSL getting points and the big differences in the categories for releasing tickets for the PBS.

[BoomtownHibees]

It's really quite simple.

Stop giving loyalty points to HSL and reward the bloody fans who go week in, week out.

The HSL reward only happened the once. I can't see the club doing that again.

And the fans who go to most games are being rewarded with points so I don't see an issue there

[Andy74]

I don't understand how folk can still say this sort of thing. We have more season ticket holders than we get allocation of tickets for some games. You can't argue with that, it's a fact. So a loyalty points scheme means that those who go to more away games get preference over season ticket holders who don't often go to away games. That's not solving a problem that wasn't there.

Where they've got it wrong was the points for joining HSL. In my opinion.

Those fans never had bother getting tickets. That's the problem that wasn't there.

[LancashireHibby]

Personally I much preferred the old membership scheme from a few years ago, but that's purely because it suited me as a non season ticket holder who knew I'd always be next in line before general sale. Although the current system could do with a few tweaks, I think it serves it's purpose well enough on the whole.

[guillaume]

I don't understand how folk can still say this sort of thing. We have more season ticket holders than we get allocation of tickets for some games. You can't argue with that, it's a fact. So a loyalty points scheme means that those who go to more away games get preference over season ticket holders who don't often go to away games. That's not solving a problem that wasn't there.

Where they've got it wrong was the points for joining HSL. In my opinion.

I think if there was a problem it was pretty niche, in that some fans who went to a lot of away games wanted priority to buy tickets for away games with small allocations, eg Rangers & Dumbarton.

Unfortunately to solve that minor issue a scheme was introduced that impacts thousands of other fans who had no complaints about the previous set up.

The HSL element is the only reason I can see for continuing the scheme as it actually raised money for the club, in contrast to the rest of the scheme which just appears to take up the club's resources to keep a relatively small proportion of the fans happy.

[liamh2202]

I don't understand how folk can still say this sort of thing. We have more season ticket holders than we get allocation of tickets for some games. You can't argue with that, it's a fact. So a loyalty points scheme means that those who go to more away games get preference over season ticket holders who don't often go to away games. That's not solving a problem that wasn't there.

Where they've got it wrong was the points for joining HSL. In my opinion.

When has it happened in the past that there has been a game you couldnt get a ticket for if you wanted one as a st. Now guys .. Like it or not are not going because they cant sit in groups .

It wasnt planned to be this way... It was meant to create anotyer tier below sts for walk ups. Not create a tier above

[Carheenlea]

The HSL element is the only reason I can see for continuing the scheme as it actually raised money for the club, in contrast to the rest of the scheme which just appears to take up the club's resources to keep a relatively small proportion of the fans happy.

And quite rightly so. That small proportion of fans are the fans the club can always rely on in continued support of the club.

[Just Jimmy]

I've held STs for years. I've also had seasons where I didn't and until this year I've had a ticket to every game I wanted to be at.

The scheme is not needed.

[liamh2202]

And quite rightly so. That small proportion of fans are the fans the club can always rely on in continued support of the club.

Disagree. St holders are what you deacribed

[Leithenhibby]

I don't understand how folk can still say this sort of thing. We have more season ticket holders than we get allocation of tickets for some games. You can't argue with that, it's a fact. So a loyalty points scheme means that those who go to more away games get preference over season ticket holders who don't often go to away games. That's not solving a problem that wasn't there.

Where they've got it wrong was the points for joining HSL. In my opinion.

Granted, the points awarded (by the club) were a tad high, but it did bring in much needed money to the club at the time. Everyone is in this together, and everyone should have a slice of the pie, in my opinion.

How the club cut the pie into fair pieces is open to debate.

http://www.hiberniansupporters.co.uk/donate.html

GGTTH

[guillaume]

And quite rightly so. That small proportion of fans are the fans the club can always rely on in continued support of the club.

You've just made that up.

There's no evidence at all that the small group of season ticket holders which got preference for Dumbarton tickets have been more reliable over the years than any other season ticket holders.

[Nazz]

- It was noted that only three matches, since the introduction of the scheme, had not went to public sale – two matches at Ibrox against Rangers and one match against Hearts at Tynecastle.

Call me pedantic but I'd expect better grammar in official statements. Or maybe it's a youth thing that I just don't get...

[lyonhibs]

Personally I much preferred the old membership scheme from a few years ago, but that's purely because it suited me as a non season ticket holder who knew I'd always be next in line before general sale. Although the current system could do with a few tweaks, I think it serves it's purpose well enough on the whole.

What happened to that? Did it just die a silent death for some reason?

[Argylehibby]

I wouldn't, I'm a season ticket holder but because of work I can't make away games. If loyalty points were awarded for away games only for season tickets they could release tickets in 3 waves, Season ticket holders with loyalty points(so this would cover regular away game attendees) then season ticket holders then regular walk ups before a general sale. I suppose this is not really any different to how they do it now. Season ticket holders should get preference before anybody as they pay their hard earned cash in advance regardless of what's happening.

To be honest that's not too far away from the suggestion I put to the club.

There are probably about 300 fans that miss only 2 or 3 away games every season and I would expect that the overwhelming majority of them are season ticket holders. Picking a figure out of the air lets say the non season ticket holders in that group total 30 and that's probably too high?

Make that group band 1 and band 2 as all season ticket holders. that would mean if the numbers are correct of course that 870 of the 900 tickets we get for Ibrox are available to season ticket holders. Those people who cant afford a season ticket but go every week don't miss out and those who have bought a season still have a decent chance to get a ticket.

Band 3 would be remaining loyalty points people and then onto open sale. BTW only 3 games have not gone to open sale so maybe it's not as big a problem as it is perceived to be.

[LancashireHibby]

What happened to that? Did it just die a silent death for some reason?

I had one for both of the seasons that it operated and enquired if it would return and was told they were 'considering it' and then that was that. Shame as I'm sure it was a relatively decent earner for the club at £30 a chuck for only marginal returns. I could definitely feel the difference myself when for one cup final the tickets were sewn up with no worries at all with a priority period, and then the following season without a membership was a mad scramble on general sale.

[blackpoolhibs]

The main reason i used to buy a season ticket was because of the benefits it gave, IE first in line for away games along with the other season ticket holders. Now thats gone they wont be getting my season ticket money when we are promoted, it will be pay at the gate.

And i used to miss quite a few games that were televised, so Hibs will miss out on my season ticket money and only get my gate money.

[StevieC]

The main reason i used to buy a season ticket was because of the benefits it gave, IE first in line for away games along with the other season ticket holders. Now thats gone they wont be getting my season ticket money when we are promoted, it will be pay at the gate.

And i used to miss quite a few games that were televised, so Hibs will miss out on my season ticket money and only get my gate money.

To be honest, I used to be the same. Season tickets were never "value for money" for me, and it was the additional benefits that kept me buying.

Getting back to the loyalty scheme though, whilst I agree that season ticket holders should be given priority I also feel that there are levels within season ticket holders that deserve more priority than others .. and loyalty points is a decent way to address this.

I also think that "walk-ups" deserve a level of recognition and additional "membership" levels outwith season tickets isn't a bad idea.

[ben johnson]

The main reason i used to buy a season ticket was because of the benefits it gave, IE first in line for away games along with the other season ticket holders. Now thats gone they wont be getting my season ticket money when we are promoted, it will be pay at the gate.

And i used to miss quite a few games that were televised, so Hibs will miss out on my season ticket money and only get my gate money.

I am very interested in your reasons for not intending to buy a season for next year when it could be all hands to the pump if the play offs don't go our way. I wondered if any one from the Club had picked up on your comments and had been in touch to go over the problems you have touched on. We can't afford to lose good season ticket holders IMO.

[marinello59]

The main reason i used to buy a season ticket was because of the benefits it gave, IE first in line for away games along with the other season ticket holders. Now thats gone they wont be getting my season ticket money when we are promoted, it will be pay at the gate.

And i used to miss quite a few games that were televised, so Hibs will miss out on my season ticket money and only get my gate money.

My three probably won't be renewed for similar reasons to yourself. I never thought I'd give up my seats but as somebody else has said, the loyalty scheme talked about in the past was to create an additional tier below ST holders. We have created one above them now. Basically they have been devalued. It's poor value for money for me anyway, removing one of the benefits makes it harder for me to justify funding Hibs from the family budget.

[Onion]

The main reason i used to buy a season ticket was because of the benefits it gave, IE first in line for away games along with the other season ticket holders. Now thats gone they wont be getting my season ticket money when we are promoted, it will be pay at the gate.

And i used to miss quite a few games that were televised, so Hibs will miss out on my season ticket money and only get my gate money.

:agree: very big attraction for me too, as it rarely made any economic sense to buy a ST. With that auto priority removed, STs have definitely been devalued.

[ben johnson]

My three probably won't be renewed for similar reasons to yourself. I never thought I'd give up my seats but as somebody else has said, the loyalty scheme talked about in the past was to create an additional tier below ST holders. We have created one above them now. Basically they have been devalued. It's poor value for money for me anyway, removing one of the benefits makes it harder for me to justify funding Hibs from the family budget.

I really hope someone from the Club or fans reps are picking up on this.

[Ozyhibby]

I really hope someone from the Club or fans reps are picking up on this.

It's been said many times on here but has been ignored in favour of the purity of an absolutely fair system for those who attend most games.
The unintended consequence of this is the devaluing of the season ticket.
I would have thought this a very bad idea at this time. A system that discourages people from buying season tickets just so a small group can get to the front of the q for Tynecastle tickets is a terrible system IMHO.
The people who designed the system are defending it to the hilt though so I can only see it changing if Leeann takes an executive decision.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[liamh2202]

My three probably won't be renewed for similar reasons to yourself. I never thought I'd give up my seats but as somebody else has said, the loyalty scheme talked about in the past was to create an additional tier below ST holders. We have created one above them now. Basically they have been devalued. It's poor value for money for me anyway, removing one of the benefits makes it harder for me to justify funding Hibs from the family budget.

Me too,i have sat in my seat 3 times this year due to work. May keep my sons on as its cheap but doubt ill keep mine

[Danderhall Hibs]

Me too,i have sat in my seat 3 times this year due to work. May keep my sons on as its cheap but doubt ill keep mine

I've got 4 at the moment but 2 of them are rarely used.

Definitely only renewing 2 next year.

[Yuillsy]

The more I think about it the loyalty point scheme will be pointless when we get promoted. Only Ibrox and Tynecastle will not be able to meet our demand for tickets, there's plenty seats in every other ground so people won't have to buy tickets in advance. How can you award loyalty points to someone who decides at 12pm that suddenly decides to head through to an away game that's pay at the gate???

[Argylehibby]

The more I think about it the loyalty point scheme will be pointless when we get promoted. Only Ibrox and Tynecastle will not be able to meet our demand for tickets, there's plenty seats in every other ground so people won't have to buy tickets in advance. How can you award loyalty points to someone who decides at 12pm that suddenly decides to head through to an away game that's pay at the gate???

That's worse than this season. Only league games that have been an issue this season have been the 2 at Ibrox. Problem arises though when you get drawn away to someone like Albion Rovers in the cup. You're right though on the pay at the gate for games next season and I have no idea how the club can cover that.

[Eyrie]

It's been said many times on here but has been ignored in favour of the purity of an absolutely fair system for those who attend most games.
The unintended consequence of this is the devaluing of the season ticket.
I would have thought this a very bad idea at this time. A system that discourages people from buying season tickets just so a small group can get to the front of the q for Tynecastle tickets is a terrible system IMHO.
The people who designed the system are defending it to the hilt though so I can only see it changing if Leeann takes an executive decision.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Easiest way to restore value to the season ticket is to give bonus points to the holder - eg 210 points for an early bird and 200 points for a season ticket. That would give an edge over someone who simply attends home games (max of 180 at 10 per game) as they would need several away games (at 5 points each) and more if they missed a home game.

There is a payment plan in place for those who can't afford the cost of the season ticket up front.

[Baldy Foghorn]

It's been said many times on here but has been ignored in favour of the purity of an absolutely fair system for those who attend most games.
The unintended consequence of this is the devaluing of the season ticket.
I would have thought this a very bad idea at this time. A system that discourages people from buying season tickets just so a small group can get to the front of the q for Tynecastle tickets is a terrible system IMHO.
The people who designed the system are defending it to the hilt though so I can only see it changing if Leeann takes an executive decision.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


:confused::confused::confused:

[PatHead]

The loyalty scheme worked well until the 100 points were given for HSL membership. (which I got BTW).

To get around that they should give 75 points to everyone who never qualified for the HSL points which would even things back to the original starting point whilst still giving a bonus to HSL members.

[Sir David Gray]

- It was noted that only three matches, since the introduction of the scheme, had not went to public sale – two matches at Ibrox against Rangers and one match against Hearts at Tynecastle.

Call me pedantic but I'd expect better grammar in official statements. Or maybe it's a youth thing that I just don't get...

I noticed that too, pretty poor mistake.

[guillaume]

The loyalty scheme worked well until the 100 points were given for HSL membership. (which I got BTW).

To get around that they should give 75 points to everyone who never qualified for the HSL points which would even things back to the original starting point whilst still giving a bonus to HSL members.

The anger some people feel about the 100 points for HSL gives the impression that they are only happy with the scheme when they are the primary beneficiaries, and now that another group are also being seen to benefit it's a major issue.

The club have repeatedly stated that the policy of giving 100 points for HSL has raised significant sums - that's the single best thing that the loyalty scheme has achieved in my opinion.

[PatHead]

The anger some people feel about the 100 points for HSL gives the impression that they are only happy with the scheme when they are the primary beneficiaries, and now that another group are also being seen to benefit it's a major issue.

The club have repeatedly stated that the policy of giving 100 points for HSL has raised significant sums - that's the single best thing that the loyalty scheme has achieved in my opinion.

Well they would still have 25 bonus points. Nowhere in the rules that says they couldn't give it to whoever they want. It would help overcome the issue caused by giving them to HSL contributors. As I mentioned I benefited but I don't believe that was correct.

[guillaume]

Well they would still have 25 bonus points. Nowhere in the rules that says they couldn't give it to whoever they want. It would help overcome the issue caused by giving them to HSL contributors. As I mentioned I benefited but I don't believe that was correct.

I think it would show really bad faith to have promised people 100 point to sign up for HSL but then greatly reduce the benefit because everyone else gets 75 anyway.

The club need to be really careful not to antagonise far more fans than benefit from this scheme.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I also feel that there are levels within season ticket holders that deserve more priority than others .. and loyalty points is a decent way to address this.

Is this not the definition of "loyalty scheme"? I cant comprehend why some find the issue so confusing, the clue is in the word "loyalty".

[Ozyhibby]

Is this not the definition of "loyalty scheme"? I cant comprehend why some find the issue so confusing, the clue is in the word "loyalty".

Nobody is finding it confusing. I think the system has been designed to be fair to those who go to most games. However, an unintended consequence of this is that it is discouraging people from buying season tickets.
The club have to make a decision on whether they want the purity of a totally fair system or try and protect their most important revenue stream. If they go with the former then those at the top of the loyalty point tree will be happy but of course the quality on the pitch will be affected by the reduction in income.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

It doesnae seem to be a problem for other clubs who operate their schemes in a similar manner.

[0762]

Is this not the definition of "loyalty scheme"? I cant comprehend why some find the issue so confusing, the clue is in the word "loyalty".

Agree 100% - and the plan was this was linked to attending matches. Nothing else.
I had lengthy dialogue on this with the Club going back to before he 2013 cup final and the plan was always about linking the scheme to attending matches so when it came to scarce tickets those who have attended most matches got first option on tickets.

HSL being given points is a nonsense. That's about ability to pay as opposed to loyalty. Points should be linked to Season Tickets, (home and away where possible) and for those living remote to Hibs TV Subscription. If you want to have a scheme linked to your ability to pay that's a reward scheme. The more you spend the bigger the discount you get. It's not rocket science but in the last 12 months the club have turned something pretty simple into something that's over complicated.

[lord bunberry]

It doesnae seem to be a problem for other clubs who operate their schemes in a similar manner.

You're right, but it probably something that was needed at other clubs. I don't think it has been of any benefit to us.

[Kojock]

Agree 100% - and the plan was this was linked to attending matches. Nothing else.
I had lengthy dialogue on this with the Club going back to before he 2013 cup final and the plan was always about linking the scheme to attending matches so when it came to scarce tickets those who have attended most matches got first option on tickets.

HSL being given points is a nonsense. That's about ability to pay as opposed to loyalty. Points should be linked to Season Tickets, (home and away where possible) and for those living remote to Hibs TV Subscription. If you want to have a scheme linked to your ability to pay that's a reward scheme. The more you spend the bigger the discount you get. It's not rocket science but in the last 12 months the club have turned something pretty simple into something that's over complicated.

Re the bit in bold, attending away matches is also down to the ability to pay. If someone cant afford to attend an away match does that make them less loyal ?

[bigwheel]

Re the bit in bold, attending away matches is also down to the ability to pay. If someone cant afford to attend an away match does that make them less loyal ?

in a loyalty points "club"...yes, they are "less" loyal....


remember this is not rating "emotion" it is rating measurable actions...e.g.. how many games you attend.

[marinello59]

in a loyalty points "club"...yes, they are "less" loyal....


remember this is not rating "emotion" it is rating measurable actions...e.g.. how many games you attend.

How much you spend on club merchandise is measurable as well then. Wearing some of the dreadful stuff we have produced over the years surely deserves extra loyalty points.

[bigwheel]

How much you spend on club merchandise is measurable as well then. Wearing some of the dreadful stuff we have produced over the years surely deserves extra loyalty points.


not a bad idea....anyone who wears some of the dross produced by Hibs deserves some sort of reward!

[guillaume]

in a loyalty points "club"...yes, they are "less" loyal....


remember this is not rating "emotion" it is rating measurable actions...e.g.. how many games you attend.

This is why I fundamentally disagree with the scheme, it's selecting one variable of attending away games and using that to measure 'loyalty' and therefore which group 'deserves' preferential treatment.

I believe loyalty to Hibs isn't determined purely by how many away games you've been to in the last year.

As it's not easy to measure real loyalty, and the scheme doesn't seem to achieve much apart from dividing the support and using up valuable club resources, I think we should completely rethink it.

[Danderhall Hibs]

10 points for every positive post on here.

-5 for everyone that chooses a scapegoat.

[Argylehibby]

This is why I fundamentally disagree with the scheme, it's selecting one variable of attending away games and using that to measure 'loyalty' and therefore which group 'deserves' preferential treatment.

I believe loyalty to Hibs isn't determined purely by how many away games you've been to in the last year.

As it's not easy to measure real loyalty, and the scheme doesn't seem to achieve much apart from dividing the support and using up valuable club resources, I think we should completely rethink it.

The club announcement says they are looking at the name no doubt because of comments like this about the title of the scheme. I don't think there is or was ever any intention of suggesting those with the highest points total were the most loyal fans and I don't see it as the issue that others clearly do. It will be the easiest of the issues to sort though!

[Carheenlea]

This is why I fundamentally disagree with the scheme, it's selecting one variable of attending away games and using that to measure 'loyalty' and therefore which group 'deserves' preferential treatment.

I believe loyalty to Hibs isn't determined purely by how many away games you've been to in the last year.

As it's not easy to measure real loyalty, and the scheme doesn't seem to achieve much apart from dividing the support and using up valuable club resources, I think we should completely rethink it.

Points are awarded for both home and away tickets. Points are used for distribution of tickets. Tickets for away allocations are sold first to those with most points.
Is there really anything wrong with regular attendees being given priority for match tickets when demand is high?

[wookie70]

This is why I fundamentally disagree with the scheme, it's selecting one variable of attending away games and using that to measure 'loyalty' and therefore which group 'deserves' preferential treatment.

I believe loyalty to Hibs isn't determined purely by how many away games you've been to in the last year.

As it's not easy to measure real loyalty, and the scheme doesn't seem to achieve much apart from dividing the support and using up valuable club resources, I think we should completely rethink it.

The only reward for loyalty points is the ability to get tickets for games and imo the only reasonable way of gaining those points is by attending games. I go to all the home games and a fair chunk of away games and I have no issue with those that go to all the away games having a higher priority than me. They are our most loyal fans, in terms of going to games, and deserve first dibs when tickets are scarce. I just don't get why non away game attending season ticket holders think they should have equal priority for away games to the supporters who go to all the away games.

The loyalty system is spot on in terms of the points awarded barring the decision about the 100 points for HSL. Not so sure we've quite got the hang of how the points should benefit supporters. The cup game at Tynie is a good example of where there should have been a higher threshold for the second tranche. In my view this was made very low to appease season ticket holders, but in reality opened it up to fans who may not have even went to any game at ER this season never mind a cup or away game.

[Sammy7nil]

Agree 100% - and the plan was this was linked to attending matches. Nothing else.
I had lengthy dialogue on this with the Club going back to before he 2013 cup final and the plan was always about linking the scheme to attending matches so when it came to scarce tickets those who have attended most matches got first option on tickets.

HSL being given points is a nonsense. That's about ability to pay as opposed to loyalty. Points should be linked to Season Tickets, (home and away where possible) and for those living remote to Hibs TV Subscription. If you want to have a scheme linked to your ability to pay that's a reward scheme. The more you spend the bigger the discount you get. It's not rocket science but in the last 12 months the club have turned something pretty simple into something that's over complicated.

A season ticket is based on ability to pay for many people.

[et_hibby]

The only reward for loyalty points is the ability to get tickets for games and imo the only reasonable way of gaining those points is by attending games. I go to all the home games and a fair chunk of away games and I have no issue with those that go to all the away games having a higher priority than me. They are our most loyal fans, in terms of going to games, and deserve first dibs when tickets are scarce. I just don't get why non away game attending season ticket holders think they should have equal priority for away games to the supporters who go to all the away games.

The loyalty system is spot on in terms of the points awarded barring the decision about the 100 points for HSL. Not so sure we've quite got the hang of how the points should benefit supporters. The cup game at Tynie is a good example of where there should have been a higher threshold for the second tranche. In my view this was made very low to appease season ticket holders, but in reality opened it up to fans who may not have even went to any game at ER this season never mind a cup or away game.
Just as school/college exams can favour those who are good at exams rather than those who know the subject best, maybe the loyalty club favours those good at gathering points. I've bought tickets from the pod on match day & not claimed back points (possible?) and only recently learned I could allocate multiple purchases to others in my network, so lost points. Not bothered though! Fair play to any Hibby though that's maximised their points but, of course, those who haven't will be just as 'loyal' or more so. So, as previously suggested, choice of the word loyalty perhaps part of the problem (and it has Hun connotations :-)
'Hibernian Points System?'
' Hibs points plan?'
'Green Shield Stamps club' (remember them?!)

[Iceman1875]

I am not a season ticket holder but pick my games when I can attend due to work/kids/golf commitments. I have acquired 75 loyalty points this season and I believe this system works. Don't change it.


At Easter Road we play...

[NAE NOOKIE]

The anger some people feel about the 100 points for HSL gives the impression that they are only happy with the scheme when they are the primary beneficiaries, and now that another group are also being seen to benefit it's a major issue.

The club have repeatedly stated that the policy of giving 100 points for HSL has raised significant sums - that's the single best thing that the loyalty scheme has achieved in my opinion.

Rubbish

[BigKev]

Can't help but think folk are looking to find problems with a loyalty points system.

Who really cares what it's called? If people are shelling out on monthly HSL subscriptions and get a reward for it then fair play to them.

The points received for being a ST holder will always allow those fans first dibs on prime tickets and that's as it should be.

Walk up fans can get points by pre purchasing a ticket- no problem there. If they only decide at 2 o'clock they can go they can still buy online and print at home or collect from the TO.

Some folk just like to whinge about things when it doesn't suit them.

There's not much wrong with the way points are allocated IMO.

[lord bunberry]

Can't help but think folk are looking to find problems with a loyalty points system.

Who really cares what it's called? If people are shelling out on monthly HSL subscriptions and get a reward for it then fair play to them.

The points received for being a ST holder will always allow those fans first dibs on prime tickets and that's as it should be.

Walk up fans can get points by pre purchasing a ticket- no problem there. If they only decide at 2 o'clock they can go they can still buy online and print at home or collect from the TO.

Some folk just like to whinge about things when it doesn't suit them.

There's not much wrong with the way points are allocated IMO.
That's the problem, it doesn't. A season ticket holder gets 180 points and the points required for tynecastle were something like 390. Even someone who has had a season ticket for years wouldn't have had enough points. It's making people( me being one) reconsider buying a season ticket.

[Seveno]

I think that Season Tickets holders should always get priority as they are paying up front helping the Club to invest and budget. They are also committing their money in advance when they do not know what product is going to be served up.

Those who follow the team everywhere deserves to be recognised but it should be borne in mind that many of our supporters turning up at ER have travelled a long distance to get there. For instance, my brother and two of his mates travel from Montrose. The guy in front of me comes up from Newcastle. Every game is an 'away' game for them.

[cabbageandribs1875]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36020849


Tickets to watch Premier League leaders Leicester's final home game are being offered for £15,000 a pair through an online re-sale website.
The 7 May match against Everton, which could see the Foxes become champions, sold out in 90 minutes on Monday.

One fan who contacted BBC Sport said he had missed out on a ticket, despite having a membership package and having been to all but three home games this season.


shame some regular attenders will miss out

[green&left]

That's the problem, it doesn't. A season ticket holder gets 180 points and the points required for tynecastle were something like 390. Even someone who has had a season ticket for years wouldn't have had enough points. It's making people( me being one) reconsider buying a season ticket.

Season ticket holders + away day regulars should get first dibs, then season ticket holders who don't travel, then general sale.

Won't matter much next season except Tynie if we get promoted. Loyalty points won't be needed at all if we're still in the championship.

[cabbageandribs1875]

Season ticket holders + away day regulars should get first dibs, then season ticket holders who don't travel, then general sale.

Won't matter much next season except Tynie if we get promoted. Loyalty points won't be needed at all if we're still in the championship.


why should away day regulars get loyalty points before regular walk-up's at ER ?

[Bristolhibby]

why should away day regulars get loyalty points before regular walk-up's at ER ?

Because that's how we have set up the system. Again, if you are walking up, then buy a ticket in advance and get the points. The only people excluded are those who decide to come on the spur of the moment.

Regarding that guy from Leicester, if he had been to every game bar three, why the hell didn't he buy a season ticket, then he wouldn't be complaining.

J

[cabbageandribs1875]

Because that's how we have set up the system. Again, if you are walking up, then buy a ticket in advance and get the points. The only people excluded are those who decide to come on the spur of the moment.

Regarding that guy from Leicester, if he had been to every game bar three, why the hell didn't he buy a season ticket, then he wouldn't be complaining.

J


could be a number of reasons ? i'l bet a pound to a penny there's hibs fans that go to most home games and don't have a ST

[Bad Martini]

This doesn't need to be an either / or for loyalty between those paying for games (home/away or season tickets) and those investing or paying into the club via HSL, shop or otherwise.

All you need to do is agree a weight to EVERY "support" of the club which will naturally favour those who go to more games i.e.

Season ticket purchase = 100 points
Per home match = x points
Per away match = y points
HSL membership = z points
Hibs Tops/crap from shop = a points
****ty pies/pizza = b points :greengrin
etc etc etc

Simples. Weight the points based on what matters/costs most (Season tickets, followed by matches, followed by everything else). Then everyone wins. And for someone to get the same "benefit" as a ST holder who doesnt go to games, they need to buy 2389434 shirts and 3242374274 bits of pizza (Which would need you to be in the stadium anyway :greengrin)

Points for pizza is a piss take of course...the rest is simple. Works for plenty other huge clubs. Loyalty and Reward scheme all in one. Why is that difficult for anyone with more than a quarter of an ounce more sense than a yam complimicated? :na na:

SORTED> Next. World peace.:aok:

[Ozyhibby]

could be a number of reasons ? i'l bet a pound to a penny there's hibs fans that go to most home games and don't have a ST

Not that many these days. [emoji22]

[Geo_1875]

Because that's how we have set up the system. Again, if you are walking up, then buy a ticket in advance and get the points. The only people excluded are those who decide to come on the spur of the moment.

Regarding that guy from Leicester, if he had been to every game bar three, why the hell didn't he buy a season ticket, then he wouldn't be complaining.

J

Because he's got the membership package. He'll have paid £30-40 each season to get priority tickets before a public sale. If Leicester were struggling mid-table he wouldn't be so worried about missing out. West Ham have the same deal but have had to ballot tickets for their final 3 home games this season. They've sold over 1,500 memberships in the last month.

[DH1875]

Because he's got the membership package. He'll have paid £30-40 each season to get priority tickets before a public sale. If Leicester were struggling mid-table he wouldn't be so worried about missing out. West Ham have the same deal but have had to ballot tickets for their final 3 home games this season. They've sold over 1,500 memberships in the last month.

Any ideas how many memberships Leicester have sold?

[Onceinawhile]

why should away day regulars get loyalty points before regular walk-up's at ER ?

I think he means season ticket holders who also go to away games rather than how you've interpreted it.