Ched Evans

[MJN1875]

Just heard his his appeal will be reviewed now due to new evidence.

Would you take him if the conviction was overturned?

[lord bunberry]

Just heard his his appeal will be reviewed now due to new evidence.

Would you take him if the conviction was overturned?
Why wouldn't we? He would be an innocent man.

[KeithTheHibby]

10 pager coming up.

[LaMotta]

Why wouldn't we? He would be an innocent man.

Indeed, and it wouldn't matter anyway as there would be a queue of clubs with better spending power than us after his signature.

[frazeHFC]

Not for me. Has he even played a game in the last 3 years? There's no way Cummings, Boyle, Malonga etc would get shifted out the team for him.

[marinello59]

10 pager coming up.

Not if it veers even close to the previous thread on this subject here.:greengrin

[Monts]

Rightly or wrongly he would still be vilified by opposition supports. It would be an unwelcome distraction IMO.

[Billychaotic182]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

[green day]

Rightly or wrongly he would still be vilified by opposition supports. It would be an unwelcome distraction IMO.

Correct.

And, so far, we appear to have harmony in the dressing room.

Introducing someone who's (rightly or wrongly) been accused of something horrible brings out so many potential issues - moral and otherwise - that it's not worth the risk.

[Hibbyradge]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

She didn't make the complaint of rape against him. The police did.

If he wins his appeal, he'll be free to play for anyone who thinks he'd be an asset and rightly so.

whether he'd still have the skill set he did before he was jailed is the thing in question.

[hibeemikey21]

Rightly or wrongly he would still be vilified by opposition supports. It would be an unwelcome distraction IMO.

Well it would clearly be wrongly if his conviction is overturned!!!!

[MJN1875]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

Difference is though ched was convicted and did time.

If any woman is prosecuted for crying rape they should get the same punishment as a rapist would.

[portycabbage]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

I'm not sure why she would get the same sentence as him given she isn't guilty of rape. She has had her life turned upside-down as a result of this in any case, and that was when she was purely the victim in the eyes of the law (as she still is currently).

[MJN1875]

I'm not sure why she would get the same sentence as him given she isn't guilty of rape. She has had her life turned upside-down as a result of this in any case, and that was when she was purely the victim in the eyes of the law (as she still is currently).

She should only get the same sentence if it's proved she lied. If she didn't lie, then I hope ched rots in his own wee lonely ex footballing world.

Newtongrange would take him I suppose....

[Speedy]

Just heard his his appeal will be reviewed now due to new evidence.

Would you take him if the conviction was overturned?

No

[CropleyWasGod]

She should only get the same sentence if it's proved she lied. If she didn't lie, then I hope ched rots in his own wee lonely ex footballing world.

Newtongrange would take him I suppose....
Would you extend that punishment to all situations where witnesses have lied?[

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

[allezsauzee]

I very much doubt he'll be considering Hibs as an option if his conviction is overturned

[jacomo]

Difference is though ched was convicted and did time.

If any woman is prosecuted for crying rape they should get the same punishment as a rapist would.

Sorry but why? It's not the same offence.

[jacomo]

Not if it veers even close to the previous thread on this subject here.:greengrin

Don't worry - other than above comment I'm staying well clear this time!

[Billychaotic182]

I'm not sure why she would get the same sentence as him given she isn't guilty of rape. She has had her life turned upside-down as a result of this in any case, and that was when she was purely the victim in the eyes of the law (as she still is currently).

It's a hard one really. After all she is still the victim here. But I wonder what punishment if any she would recive if it is proven she lied.

This boy is life ruined. Even if proven not guilty people will still have doubts. Just look at Twitter. Woman slating him men defending him. It's a hard one to judge really.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Had she ever said she was raped? I read some articles on this case a few months back and pretty sure the police made the case and her statement was she can't remember?

How could she be done for lying if that was the case?

[Hibbyradge]

Had she ever said she was raped? I read some articles on this case a few months back and pretty sure the police made the case and her statement was she can't remember?

How could she be done for lying if that was the case?

She never even said she had any sexual contact.

[LaMotta]

Had she ever said she was raped? I read some articles on this case a few months back and pretty sure the police made the case and her statement was she can't remember?

How could she be done for lying if that was the case?


She never even said she had any sexual contact.


It is possible that she could actually remember what happened and that therefore when she says she couldn't remember she was in fact lying, leading to the conviction. Not saying this is the case, but is one scenario that is possible.

[bobbyhibs1983]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

its a tough one and as a few posters have said above it seems the police stated(the right word here?) rape.
Is this guy is proven innocent he should have no quirms in suing the police force for this(imo)
As for females whom lie about rape it should be a minium of 10years in jail imo.
of course there have been cases of woman doing this, e.g it was reported in the sun in the last week about a female teacher having sex with a 15-14 year odl boy. she admitted this, what happened? nothing
as far as i am aware.

I read an intresting quote somewhere on the evans appeal from a random guy whom said if he(the random guy) had got smashed, pure drunk and ended up naked with a woman, and she said they had sex would this be rape? :confused:

rape is sooo easy for a female to get revenage on an ex , a bad date, though not all woman are like this but there are a few i must say

[MJN1875]

I very much doubt he'll be considering Hibs as an option if his conviction is overturned

I think he'd consider whoever makes an offer

[MJN1875]

Sorry but why? It's not the same offence.

But if proved she lied look at his life. Any man who is accused will always have this with him. He done 3 yrs or whatever, so should she if proved she lied.

[Thecat23]

Had she ever said she was raped? I read some articles on this case a few months back and pretty sure the police made the case and her statement was she can't remember?

How could she be done for lying if that was the case?

If she can't remember how the hell can he be done for rape then? Surely works both ways?

[Monts]

If she can't remember how the hell can he be done for rape then? Surely works both ways?

I have no idea about the specifics of this case, but a scenario where it's established that she was too drunk to consent, and it is established they had sex, in the eyes of the law that is rape.

Again, no idea about this case, but it's a possible scenario.

[portycabbage]

If she can't remember how the hell can he be done for rape then? Surely works both ways?

I think it was because they said she was unconscious so hadn't consented.

[Hibbyradge]

I think it was because they said she was unconscious so hadn't consented.

Yes, along those lines.

[portycabbage]

its a tough one and as a few posters have said above it seems the police stated(the right word here?) rape.
Is this guy is proven innocent he should have no quirms in suing the police force for this(imo)
As for females whom lie about rape it should be a minium of 10years in jail imo.
of course there have been cases of woman doing this, e.g it was reported in the sun in the last week about a female teacher having sex with a 15-14 year odl boy. she admitted this, what happened? nothing
as far as i am aware.

I read an intresting quote somewhere on the evans appeal from a random guy whom said if he(the random guy) had got smashed, pure drunk and ended up naked with a woman, and she said they had sex would this be rape? :confused:

rape is sooo easy for a female to get revenage on an ex , a bad date, though not all woman are like this but there are a few i must say

I don't think many rapists get a minimum sentence of ten years, and there are hardly any that get convicted if reported.

The Evans case is nothing like a "bad date", as she was judged by the court to be incapable by the time he even appeared. There was also a bit more to it than she "ended up naked with" him and his pal, as one texted the other to come over after he'd jumped in her taxi, and Evans had booked the hotel and snuck off avoiding passing reception afterwards.

[LaMotta]

I have no idea about the specifics of this case, but a scenario where it's established that she was too drunk to consent, and it is established they had sex, in the eyes of the law that is rape.

Again, no idea about this case, but it's a possible scenario.


The question of intoxication and consent is of course central to this case. The prosecution case was that the woman was too drunk to consent to sex. Evans’s team have questioned whether the law was applied correctly and have referred to a standard test case, called R -v- Bree (2007), in which the Court of Appeal established that someone can still consent to sex even if they have consumed substantial quantities of alcohol:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1546789/Drunk-women-can-consent-to-sex-judges-rule.html


The argument in the Evans appeal is likely to be similar, in that the jury's verdict could not possibly be regarded as safe, as the second scenario was a possibility.

[SunshineOnLeith]

Not the first time someone cries rape on a pro football player. What I would like to know is if he is found not guilty and evidence shows that she was lying she should get the same punishment he had to. Sure the same happened to Stack?

Don't take my comments the wrong way either as I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the man has raped the woman. But there are plenty of cases of attention seeking woman too. Be interesting to see what the new evidence is

Except she didn't cry rape.

[Billychaotic182]

Except she didn't cry rape.

Yeah after finding out more I neve realised that it was the police that pushed the case. She is as things stand still a victim and as such should be treated like one. I just am unsure of what exactly went on in that hotel. Again would love to know what new evidence they found

[Hibbyradge]

I don't think many rapists get a minimum sentence of ten years, and there are hardly any that get convicted if reported.

The Evans case is nothing like a "bad date", as she was judged by the court to be incapable by the time he even appeared. There was also a bit more to it than she "ended up naked with" him and his pal, as one texted the other to come over after he'd jumped in her taxi, and Evans had booked the hotel and snuck off avoiding passing reception afterwards.

And, as I understand it, he allowed yet other mate(s) to film it.

He may or may not be technically guilty of rape, the court of appeal will decide that, but I imagine a lot of people will struggle with the notion that Ched Evans is "innocent" in the wider meaning.

However, if that's the court's decision, he should be allowed to get on with his career.

[Steve-O]

How did the Police actually find out about it in the first place?

[bobbyhibs1983]

I don't think many rapists get a minimum sentence of ten years, and there are hardly any that get convicted if reported.

The Evans case is nothing like a "bad date", as she was judged by the court to be incapable by the time he even appeared. There was also a bit more to it than she "ended up naked with" him and his pal, as one texted the other to come over after he'd jumped in her taxi, and Evans had booked the hotel and snuck off avoiding passing reception afterwards.


in your first point i can understand that, but i think the point i was trying to make,(i worded it badly) is if a woman is PROVED to have lied about rape then she should be jailed for 10years, , I dunno what people whom rape get, but if somone was to LIE about rape and they knew they faced 10years in jail they d think about it wouldn't they?
I have no really followed the case so i ll have to take what you have said and say fair enough.

as others have said weather he is proved to be innocent, his life could be in peices no matter what and this is terriable waste imo

[CropleyWasGod]

in your first point i can understand that, but i think the point i was trying to make,(i worded it badly) is if a woman is PROVED to have lied about rape then she should be jailed for 10years, , I dunno what people whom rape get, but if somone was to LIE about rape and they knew they faced 10years in jail they d think about it wouldn't they?
I have no really followed the case so i ll have to take what you have said and say fair enough.

as others have said weather he is proved to be innocent, his life could be in peices no matter what and this is terriable waste imo

2 points:-

1. rape is a very difficult crime to prove. It often comes down to the word of one against the other, and the skill of the respective legal teams. The result is that "the winner" is held to have told the truth, and the other lied. Against that background, it's going to discourage men and women who have been raped from going to Court, for fear of having their stories questioned, being branded a liar and sent to prison for 10 years. When rape conviction rates are so low, that's not going to help IMO.

2. as I asked someone else earlier, and didn't get a reply, would you extend that rationale to all other types of case? eg if someone lied in a murder trial, would you give them life?

[Hibbyradge]

in your first point i can understand that, but i think the point i was trying to make,(i worded it badly) is if a woman is PROVED to have lied about rape then she should be jailed for 10years, , I dunno what people whom rape get, but if somone was to LIE about rape and they knew they faced 10years in jail they d think about it wouldn't they?
I have no really followed the case so i ll have to take what you have said and say fair enough.

as others have said weather he is proved to be innocent, his life could be in peices no matter what and this is terriable waste imo

The sentence for perverting the course of justice, which is what a false allegation would be, is already between 4 months and 3 years imprisonment.

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sentencing_manual/perverting_the_course_of_justice/

[bobbyhibs1983]

2 points:-

1. rape is a very difficult crime to prove. It often comes down to the word of one against the other, and the skill of the respective legal teams. The result is that "the winner" is held to have told the truth, and the other lied. Against that background, it's going to discourage men and women who have been raped from going to Court, for fear of having their stories questioned, being branded a liar and sent to prison for 10 years. When rape conviction rates are so low, that's not going to help IMO.

2. as I asked someone else earlier, and didn't get a reply, would you extend that rationale to all other types of case? eg if someone lied in a murder trial, would you give them life?


yep i can understand both your points.
in regards yourpoint one i can fully see how hard it is to prove and can see how it will dis courage whom have been raped going to court, but i guess my point way back, is how EASY it is for someone to lie, I can say from some experince how easy it is for a woman to lie, change her story, again and again and again.


as for point 2 i think in a way no, i think my point if someone is proved to be lying about something very vital then they should be punished, but not for life imo

and thanks to Hibbyradge for the info.I can say i do not know what the sentences were for lying and well sorta just pulled a figure from my head without due thinking.

[CropleyWasGod]

yep i can understand both your points.
in regards yourpoint one i can fully see how hard it is to prove and can see how it will dis courage whom have been raped going to court, but i guess my point way back, is how EASY it is for someone to lie, I can say from some experince how easy it is for a woman to lie, change her story, again and again and again.


as for point 2 i think in a way no, i think my point if someone is proved to be lying about something very vital then they should be punished, but not for life imo

and thanks to Hibbyradge for the info.I can say i do not know what the sentences were for lying and well sorta just pulled a figure from my head without due thinking.

... as it is for a man.:wink:

[Newry Hibs]

How did the Police actually find out about it in the first place?

According to another forum I read that is going over the case in minute details, the woman was reporting her handbag had been stolen to police (it hadn't). After going over the events with her, the police felt that a rape had occurred.

[MJN1875]

According to another forum I read that is going over the case in minute details, the woman was reporting her handbag had been stolen to police (it hadn't). After going over the events with her, the police felt that a rape had occurred.

If that's true then he will get it overturned.

How was that allowed to not be brought up in the court case?

[Hibbyradge]

If that's true then he will get it overturned.

How was that allowed to not be brought up in the court case?

The court was well aware of it.

The fact that she couldn't remember anything was key to the prosecution's case.

[Colr]

The court was well aware of it.

The fact that she couldn't remember anything was key to the prosecution's case.

I understood that Evans and his mate went out to get a woman (any woman) as pissed as they possibly could so they could have sex with her. It was something they were in the habit of doing. That's rape if its what they did.

[Hibbyradge]

I understood that Evans and his mate went out to get a woman (any woman) as pissed as they possibly could so they could have sex with her. It was something they were in the habit of doing. That's rape if its what they did.

I thought McDonald met her in a kebab shop after a night out? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Evans

they did have an hotel room booked, right enough, but that may have been for McDonald.

I see that the "new evidence" is from women who knew the victim and men who have had relationships with her.

I wonder if the prosecution will try to find women with whom Evans has had relationships with too.

Messy stuff.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/rapist-footballer-ched-evans-dossier-6611546

[Colr]

I thought McDonald met her in a kebab shop after a night out? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Evans

they did have an hotel room booked, right enough, but that may have been for McDonald.

I see that the "new evidence" is from women who knew the victim and men who have had relationships with her.

I wonder if the prosecution will try to find women with whom Evans has had relationships with too.

Messy stuff.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/rapist-footballer-ched-evans-dossier-6611546

He's used his footballers wages to hire private detectives to dig up as much detail about her past sexual activities as they can. "Lifestyle inconsistencies" he's calling it.As if they justifies his actions. Guy's a **** bag.

[Betty Boop]

He's used his footballers wages to hire private detectives to dig up as much detail about her past sexual activities as they can. "Lifestyle inconsistencies" he's calling it.As if they justifies his actions. Guy's a **** bag.

His fiancee's Dad has hired the private investigators.

[Future17]

If that's true then he will get it overturned.

Don't think how it was reported really matters in relation to whether or not he is guilty of rape.

[easty]

According to another forum I read that is going over the case in minute details, the woman was reporting her handbag had been stolen to police (it hadn't). After going over the events with her, the police felt that a rape had occurred.


If that's true then he will get it overturned.

How was that allowed to not be brought up in the court case?

What exactly in Newry Hibs statement suggests that the girl wasnt raped?:confused:

[#FromTheCapital]

Changed my opinion on this since I first read about it last year. I sided with Evans initially and couldn't get my head around how he was convicted but his mate wasn't. After reading further into it he had absolutely no business being back at that hotel. There are grey areas in the case but I think the verdict was correct in the end, he should never play football again. It's a real shame for the girl in question that this continues to drag on and impact her life.