Play Offs It Is

[My_Wife_Camille]

Title race over imo. There will be plenty more games like that between now and the end of the season.

The entire Stubbs era summed up in 90 minutes today

[Islington Hibs]

Title race over imo. There will be plenty more games like that between now and the end of the season.

The entire Stubbs era summed up in 90 minutes today


While you may be right I am glad you are not the manager throwing in the towel already

[Greencore]

That's the spirit.

[hibee_girl]

Jeezo there's about 30 games left!

[PeterboroHibee]

Id like to think it isnt over (Rangers havent had a dip in form/injuries yet), but it is disappoining that its been over a season under Stubbs and we still cant break teams down who are just happy to sit in against us.

[lucky]

Title race over imo. There will be plenty more games like that between now and the end of the season.

The entire Stubbs era summed up in 90 minutes today

Usual over reaction. Your predicting the outcome of so many games that you must have the bookies petrified. All teams will drop points between now and the end of the season.

[Pretty Boy]

Whilst it's tough to concede the title this early we need to improve dramatically or we'll be in a similar siutation to last year.

A year on from our woeful start last season and we still seem scoobied when it comes to breaking down teams with a little bit organisation.

[My_Wife_Camille]

Exactly the responses I expected to be fair. Also the exact responses that were being posted this time last year.

30 games left to consolidate 2nd place.

[B.H.F.C]

Usual over reaction. Your predicting the outcome of so many games that you must have the bookies petrified. All teams will drop points between now and the end of the season.

I don't think its an over reaction. We are 8 points behind already. Not good enough. And it's exactly the same issues as last year.

[broondog]

to be honest with Rangers on the sort of form they are on we were never going to win the title anyway. Think we are quite a bit behind them in terms of quality this season due to the fact they have spent ridiculous sums on wages that we cant compete with. it was always going to be the play offs again this year. Really hope we can pull it out the bag in the play offs but my gut feeling is that we will have to wait until the huns are out of this league to really stand a chance of getting promoted. I think we need to set realistic expectations and not get carried away as some have been doing lately.

[Carheenlea]

Rangers will spill points which makes results this afternoon all the more frustrating. Draws and defeats are just the same in this league this season if we have title aspirations. Nothing other than wins should be acceptable regardless of opposition.

[Keith_M]

We're in fourth place, 8 points off the top spot.

Hibs need to work out how to break down defensive sides in the manner that DerHun have this season and the The Yams did last year, or we can forget about winning anything.

[My_Wife_Camille]

We're in fourth place, 8 points off the top spot.

Hibs need to work out how to break down defensive sides in the manner that DerHun have this season and the The Yams did last year, or we can forget about winning anything.
Exactly. The excuse that teams sit in against us is becoming painful to hear. Are the people using this excuse of the belief that these teams aren't sitting in against Rangers and didn't against Hearts last season?

We weren't good enough last season and we haven't started well enough this season. Rangers and Hearts regularly score 4,5 or 6 goals against the teams that we struggle to score 2 goals into. We've dropped points in 3 of our 7 games so far and judgjng by our record since Stubbs came in, that type of inconsistency is likely to continue over the course of the season.

[Spike Mandela]

Games like today are the reason we won't get promoted.

Hearts last year and Rangers this year have found the formula for breaking down teams like this. We're still searching.

[SteveHFC]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

[Ronniekirk]

We're in fourth place, 8 points off the top spot.

Hibs need to work out how to break down defensive sides in the manner that DerHun have this season and the The Yams did last year, or we can forget about winning anything.

We knew what we needed to do ,and apRt from signing Deeks , we have the squad we have and have had time to work out a way to break teams down .The fact we can't do this regularly is frustrating and is what's preventing us challenging Rangers at this stage

[Pretty Boy]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

I don't see how you could be slated for that opinion.

Thankfully the scenario is a long way off yet though.

[DaveF]

Title race over imo. There will be plenty more games like that between now and the end of the season.

The entire Stubbs era summed up in 90 minutes today

Cant disagree with any of that. Our lack of intensity is really doing my nut in. We spent the first 25mins today fannying around which set the tone for the match.

[Hank Schrader]

I was at the Alloa game a fortnight ago, and whilst I was happy we won I was disappointed at the lack of cutting edge and urgency on show. Lots of nice, pretty short passes but not much penetration.

I always remember Mowbray when he arrived at Hibs saying that he would have us playing good football with a cutting edge. Stubbs brand of football is nice on the eye, like Mowbrays philosophy, but doesn't excite me. I have no doubt he has the acumen and the tools to change things but he needs to work it out quickly. A draw at home to St Mirren is not nearly good enough.

[Tyler Durden]

to be honest with Rangers on the sort of form they are on we were never going to win the title anyway. Think we are quite a bit behind them in terms of quality this season due to the fact they have spent ridiculous sums on wages that we cant compete with. it was always going to be the play offs again this year. Really hope we can pull it out the bag in the play offs but my gut feeling is that we will have to wait until the huns are out of this league to really stand a chance of getting promoted. I think we need to set realistic expectations and not get carried away as some have been doing lately.

Personally think we have a squad easily as good as Rangers. However that is actually irrelevant - our failure is beating teams like St Mirren and Dumbarton. Teams who would look at our wage bill and know they can't compete with:

Really pathetic from Hibs unfortunately

[gjb1875]

Usual over reaction. Your predicting the outcome of so many games that you must have the bookies petrified. All teams will drop points between now and the end of the season.
Think results so far speak for themselves we are struggling to break teams down and sevco are scoring 5 against them.

[bingo70]

We're in fourth place, 8 points off the top spot.

Hibs need to work out how to break down defensive sides in the manner that DerHun have this season and the The Yams did last year, or we can forget about winning anything.

We needed to work that out a year ago, not now.

[hibee-boys]

We've scored 9 goals in 7 league games, Rangers have scored 24 whilst we have both conceded 4 goals. Our defence is not the problem it's our inability to convert possession into goals. The difference between us and them is the contribution made from our respective full backs. Until we put people in wide positions who can either beat a man or at least deliver dangerous balls into the box we will continue to drop points against championship teams.

[hibee92]

Just come back for the play offs then pal

[hibs0666]

Title race over imo. There will be plenty more games like that between now and the end of the season.

The entire Stubbs era summed up in 90 minutes today

Thank Christ you're not the manager with a losers attitude like that.

[bingo70]

Just come back for the play offs then pal

The op is right though.

Of course mathematically it's not over but let's get real, we drop too many daft points to think about winning the league, not even thinking about the lead rangers already have and how ruthless they look this season.

Anyone who thinks we can win the league this year still is living on a different planet.

[BIGK]

We needed to work that out a year ago, not now.

Totaly agree. We don't show enough bravery as a team. By that I mean that we don't try things that can result in failure. If 1 in 5-6 come of equils 1-2 goals. It's all to safe.

[Smartie]

We've scored 9 goals in 7 league games, Rangers have scored 24 whilst we have both conceded 4 goals. Our defence is not the problem it's our inability to convert possession into goals. The difference between us and them is the contribution made from our respective full backs. Until we put people in wide positions who can either beat a man or at least deliver dangerous balls into the box we will continue to drop points against championship teams.

The delivery is only part of the problem.

We are rarely going to score from crosses with the forwards we have. Even when we get into decent positions out wide we struggle to get bodies into the box and those that we get in there don't have the required movement or aggression to get on the end of crosses.

I just don't see how we're going to create enough of the type of chances that our strikers can take.

Same old, same old. It was what cost us last season.

If we've not sorted it out by now then frankly we're not going to.

We've got enough to get by the likes of Alloa but it is different when Falkirk, St Mirren or Raith sit in against us.

Whilst I'm not giving up the Championship just yet, there is nothing about this team that suggests we are not going to have more days like today over the course of the season.

We're good enough to get into the playoffs and if we come up against teams who play football against us we'll be fine. But if they sit in then we'll be edged out again.

Unless Feruz, Farid, Anier or Keatings can come in and make a difference that is.

[broondog]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

I doubt anyone could disagree with you on that. If it hadn't been for the fact that we never give managers enough time and have a habit of sacking based on knee-jerk reactions he would have went last season. Irrespective of whether we had hearts and rangers in the league, to finish 25 points off the top in what is a league with part time sides in it is disgraceful. In saying that I am glad we did not sack him then but there will be absolutely no defence if we fail to come up this season which I fear will happen.

[Ozyhibby]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

Do we wait till it happens or try and prevent it. Has Stubbs shown any sign that he knows how to get us scoring goals yet?


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[Matty_Jack04]

I doubt anyone could disagree with you on that. If it hadn't been for the fact that we never give managers enough time and have a habit of sacking based on knee-jerk reactions he would have went last season. Irrespective of whether we had hearts and rangers in the league, to finish 25 points off the top in what is a league with part time sides in it is disgraceful. In saying that I am glad we did not sack him then but there will be absolutely no defence if we fail to come up this season which I fear will happen.

Why do u fear we won't go up? I've seen nothing to suggest we are'nt good enough to at least finish 2nd and I'm not really too scared of any teams likely to finish in the bottom half of the top league

[Northernhibee]

Do we wait till it happens or try and prevent it. Has Stubbs shown any sign that he knows how to get us scoring goals yet?


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Congratulations, you've outdone yourself on that one. Beggars belief.

[neil7908]

Rangers will definitely drop points this season and it will be interesting to see how they cope after losing on Tuesday. However are we consistent enough to take advantage? I fear not at the moment.

[neil7908]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

I hope not as it would be the only option. A minimum of 3 years in the lower leagues would be an absolute disgrace for a club our size.

[Ozyhibby]

Congratulations, you've outdone yourself on that one. Beggars belief.

I really expected us to have a better team this year than last year. Only Stubbs can explain why that's not the case.


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[Steve20]

I'll probably get slated for this but if we don't go up through the play-offs then Stubbs has to go in my opinion.

Why would you be slated? If a manager can't get us prompted in two attempts then he has to go. Can't be allowed a chance to fail a third time.

[Hibeesmad]

I think we will get promoted via play offs but let's just see how it goes, long way to go. I can't see The Rangers having a drop in form like last season however

[rcarter1]

I really expected us to have a better team this year than last year. Only Stubbs can explain why that's not the case.


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I think we have in general better players than last year, apart from the loss of Allan. I can only imagine that we still don't have an appropriate system designed for packed defences, and perhaps not an aggressive enough mental attitude.

[GreenCastle]

We did ok at times today - some good play and build up.

Little differences are stopping us win games...

Corners...how many do we have and rarely score - Fontaine over the bar etc

Sloppy goal - looked offside - chasing the game quite early

Finishing / Creativity - we don't score enough from distance and we need more dribblers to beat players - seems we have lots of passers. Someone to beat a player and get in behind - think Boyle but more direct.

Saints defended pretty well - but I see that as 2 points dropped at home. Just puts more pressure on us to keep winning.

Any word on Keatings or Farid ? Could do with more striker options - thought Boyle and Cummings worked hard but we still lack a target player to win headers / flick ons.

[Matty_Jack04]

I think we will get promoted via play offs but let's just see how it goes, long way to go. I can't see The Rangers having a drop in form like last season however

They don't have much squad depth outside their matchday squad IMO injuries suspensions loss of form will take its toll at some point I don't think we'll win the league I expect them to be quite active in Jan but I'm pretty confident we'll get stronger as the season goes on and comfortably finish 2nd

[HappyAsHellas]

We still lack width in the final third. Opposing managers know that Lewis very rarely tries to skin the full back which means the ball inevitably comes back into the packed central defence, where we will pass the ball across the way trying to find a way through, or an Arsenal type killer pass which very rarely, if ever, comes off. Every time Lewis got the ball today Boyle started running inside, whereas if he came out wide and took on the full back we'd have been in behind them. On the right DG does his best but some of the crosses are woeful, and if they are good, Al Agui isn't even on the bench. We need Anier or someone who can come in and challenge opposing centre halves. In short, our plan B is the same as our plan A, but with different faces. I do believe we have a better squad than last season and can only hope when everyone is fit we'll be able to trounce the teams that want to sit in. I do however entirely trust Stubbs to turn things round.

[The Harp Awakes]

We have the best squad of players for many years, some great individual players but clearly we are struggling to find a cutting edge. Our full backs are energetic and great team players but they find it difficult to beat a man and provide a telling cross. We need to be more offensive at home.

[GreenCastle]

We will have to go on some run if we are to win it and have to beat Sevco at least twice doing so..if not 3 times.

My head says playoffs - just wondering how we will do in that and which team will come 2nd bottom of the Prem league - Motherwell showed last year the challenge.

[emerald green]

I would rather Hibs had lost to Aberdeen on Wednesday, and won today.

Getting 3 points today would have put us second, but yet again Hibs can't do it when it really matters. Lose to QOS next week, and Hibs could be down to 5th I think.

What ever happened to all the chat about league reconstruction? Looks like that was all bull**** too. It won't be on the agenda if it can be seen that newco are going up.

[Scouse Hibee]

Exactly the responses I expected to be fair. Also the exact responses that were being posted this time last year.

30 games left to consolidate 2nd place.

Yes I agree.

[matty_f]

Tend to agree with the OP. We need to win home games, no blips, to win the league. We've dropped eight points now, The Rangers have dropped none.

Draws aren't good enough whether it's now or the end of the season. There's no way to dress up today's result, it's bad, and probably cost us the league.

[brog]

I think there must be a mad scramble for the usual suspects to be first to start a negative thread & wear it like a badge of honour. We need to be realistic, we've just won 5 games in a row without conceding a goal including beating the leaders of the league above us. We've now drawn with a team who were in the league above us last season & who had one shot on goal. These things happen. In my lifetime of supporting Hibs we've finished above Sevco in the league on a handful of occasions. Sevco were strong favs before the season started & nothing has changed. Sevco will, per the odds probably win the league & we will at a minimum be in the play-offs. That doesn't mean we give up. We fight to win the league until such time as it may be mathematically impossible, we then if necessary target going up through the play offs. It doesn't matter how we achieve our prime objective for the season but we won't help our cause by people giving up on our team before the end of September!

[Sir David Gray]

Today was very frustrating and whilst it's looking very much as if we'll be finishing second again, there are still 87 points to play for.

We do need to speed up our build up play though, we're far too slow.

[Alfred E Newman]

Games like today are the reason we won't get promoted.

Hearts last year and Rangers this year have found the formula for breaking down teams like this. We're still searching.

We will finish at least second in the league by a country mile. Unless we beat Rangers 3 times which isn't impossible we will be in the play offs.
Failing to break down St Mirren today will have no effect on the play off games.

[Ronniekirk]

Today was very frustrating and whilst it's looking very much as if we'll be finishing second again, there are still 87 points to play for.

We do need to speed up our build up play though, we're far too slow.

We have been saying this for weeks now that we need to speed up our build up play .Presumably Stubbs can see this issue so it begs the question what's stopping this happening .

[Fogzie]

Why would you be slated? If a manager can't get us prompted in two attempts then he has to go. Can't be allowed a chance to fail a third time.
Behave yourself. "Sack the manager if he doesn't take us up in 2 seasons". Like that has worked over the last 10 years. What is the hurry? Get he CLUB back on level terms and look to the future. If it takes 5 years , it takes 5 years. We do it without cheating and we do it in a way the Hibernian will be here forever. GGTTH

[Onion]

Games like today are the reason we won't get promoted.

Hearts last year and Rangers this year have found the formula for breaking down teams like this. We're still searching.

Sadly, have to agree.

IMO it is a lack of balls and belief among the players and Stubbs that's killing us. We dropped 2 points today, without really giving it a go. NewHuns and Yams always seem to throw caution to the wind in these situations and go get the points. Ok, sometimes it goes tits up and they lose the game, but better to win one, lose one than meekly draw two.

[Sylar]

2:23 gone and Wales lead England 3-0.

England should just head into the locker room right now! :rolleyes:

[Betty Boop]

2:23 gone and Wales lead England 3-0.

England should just head into the locker room right now! :rolleyes:

Some monsters on that pitch ! Cannae believe the size of these guys ! :greengrin

[CropleyWasGod]

Some monsters on that pitch ! Cannae believe the size of these guys ! :greengrin
Tsk. Size isn't everything.

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[Mikey09]

That's that then... Nae point going back till the play offs! Save us pay at the gate guys a lot of dosh! :rolleyes:

[Ozyhibby]

That's that then... Nae point going back till the play offs! Save us pay at the gate guys a lot of dosh! :rolleyes:

Sadly, that is what will happen. The football is not entertaining enough.


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[Betty Boop]

Tsk. Size isn't everything.

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This is true. :wink:

[Lee Marvin]

I agree with OP. we have no chance of winning the league! Even of we beat rangers 3 times, I still think we woukd drop too many stupid points.

If rangers win tomorrow, we are 11 points behind them by September! We will finish 20 points behind them.

[silverhibee]

Behave yourself. "Sack the manager if he doesn't take us up in 2 seasons". Like that has worked over the last 10 years. What is the hurry? Get he CLUB back on level terms and look to the future. If it takes 5 years , it takes 5 years. We do it without cheating and we do it in a way the Hibernian will be here forever. GGTTH

Wow.

[GlasgowHibee]

So our next games Queen of the South away next week, Dumbarton at home, Falkirk away then Raith Rovers away, before we play The Rangers.

My main concern is that we drop more points in these games, as that puts us under a lot of pressure for the game against them.

[Franck Stanton]

I think there must be a mad scramble for the usual suspects to be first to start a negative thread & wear it like a badge of honour. We need to be realistic, we've just won 5 games in a row without conceding a goal including beating the leaders of the league above us. We've now drawn with a team who were in the league above us last season & who had one shot on goal. These things happen. In my lifetime of supporting Hibs we've finished above Sevco in the league on a handful of occasions. Sevco were strong favs before the season started & nothing has changed. Sevco will, per the odds probably win the league & we will at a minimum be in the play-offs. That doesn't mean we give up. We fight to win the league until such time as it may be mathematically impossible, we then if necessary target going up through the play offs. It doesn't matter how we achieve our prime objective for the season but we won't help our cause by people giving up on our team before the end of September!

At last, a sensible post. Well said Brog.

[DaveF]

I think there must be a mad scramble for the usual suspects to be first to start a negative thread & wear it like a badge of honour. We need to be realistic, we've just won 5 games in a row without conceding a goal including beating the leaders of the league above us. We've now drawn with a team who were in the league above us last season & who had one shot on goal. These things happen. In my lifetime of supporting Hibs we've finished above Sevco in the league on a handful of occasions. Sevco were strong favs before the season started & nothing has changed. Sevco will, per the odds probably win the league & we will at a minimum be in the play-offs. That doesn't mean we give up. We fight to win the league until such time as it may be mathematically impossible, we then if necessary target going up through the play offs. It doesn't matter how we achieve our prime objective for the season but we won't help our cause by people giving up on our team before the end of September!

All fairly sensible stuff brog, but in the stands the sense of frustration is very evident when we continue to struggle in breaking teams down who come with a defensive game plan. Stubbs apparent failure to work out this problem is a real cause for concern and that is (IMO) what you see behind most of the perceived negative posting on here.

[snedzuk]

All fairly sensible stuff brog, but in the stands the sense of frustration is very evident when we continue to struggle in breaking teams down who come with a defensive game plan. Stubbs apparent failure to work out this problem is a real cause for concern and that is (IMO) what you see behind most of the perceived negative posting on here.


Just back and agree with this but earlier on this thread theres a few comments about who will finish second bottom of the premier - theres no guarantee that is going to matter to us if we cant learn to break down teams that sit in as on the strength of today a double header against St Mirren is not a "shoo in"

[Sir David Gray]

Just back and agree with this but earlier on this thread theres a few comments about who will finish second bottom of the premier - theres no guarantee that is going to matter to us if we cant learn to break down teams that sit in as on the strength of today a double header against St Mirren is not a "shoo in"

Who's to say that St Mirren will finish in the top four?

[snedzuk]

Who's to say that St Mirren will finish in the top four?

Whos to say Hibs will? -but assuming we do we do not get a 'bye' to the play off final - we have yet to beat anyone comprehensively.

[Dashing Bob S]

I agree with the OP. Rangers, like Hearts before them, are simply set up better to roll over teams in this division. They will have a lot fewer St Mirren's and Dumbarton's than us. We struggle to break down teams who set out to defend against us, and if they score first it's doubly difficult.

We thrive against the better clubs who let us play football. So paradoxically, our style is far better suited to the play-offs than Rangers, and I'd fancy us to do well in big one-off games.

I'm not despondent, but I think if Stubb's tenure has proved anything, is that this is where we're at. There is the (fairly remote) chance that we'll learn to ruthlessly dispatch those teams, but we've probably already given Rangers too much ground to catch them for the flag.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Exactly the responses I expected to be fair. Also the exact responses that were being posted this time last year.

30 games left to consolidate 2nd place.

Is there a Blue Peter badge on offer?

[Sir David Gray]

Whos to say Hibs will? -but assuming we do we do not get a 'bye' to the play off final - we have yet to beat anyone comprehensively.

We will finish easily inside the top four.

We won't finish lower than second.

[Alfred E Newman]

I agree with OP. we have no chance of winning the league! Even of we beat rangers 3 times, I still think we woukd drop too many stupid points.

If rangers win tomorrow, we are 11 points behind them by September! We will finish 20 points behind them.

You are right. It's a total waste of time, better tell Dempster to shut the doors.

[Thecat23]

Why do folk go mental at others who think the league is over? I'd be stunned if Hibs won the league from here, in fact if anyone wants a bet I'll bet them we finish behind The Rangers! Doesn't mean our season is over just means again we will be in the play offs and this time it's win or bust because another season down here will send more fans away and the budget will be nothing like it has been.

Hopefully we finish strongly and can go into the play offs on a high and win them! I'm not negative I'm realistic, league is gone.

[cmcd]

Im out Too much nonsense spouted on here

[Golden Bear]

Im out Too much nonsense spouted on here

It's Saturday night and not to be taken too seriously!

[Forza Fred]

My objective take on things..

We won't finish first..never were realistically going to challenge the 'new' Huns for top spot ..Last season when they were absolutely gash and having the season from hell off the field was our best opportunity.

Having said that the season is far from over............and I hate to say it but I detect a bit of arrogance in many people's automatic assumption that we will finish in second place.

Second place has to be earned, and as is quite evident, we are capable of dropping points when teams sit in....so I would expect we will drop significantly more points.

We KNEW before the season that teams will sit in, but we have been thus far unable to consistently counter that, and again despite all the pre season hype about us being REALLY prepared for the start of the season , we were not.

People can point to injuries, but we SIGNED players who were injured!

Alan Stubbs has my full backing.at the moment,.....I'd even give him another season if we fail to go up in the play offs this time round...but that would be it...we are already not that far from tipping point where we will be a long term lower division side.

As Jim B pointed out on another post, Rangers and Hearts were relegated for financial irregularities...we were relegated because we were a crap fitba team, and that means we can have no automatic right to expect we simply need to turn u, even with the squad have, and we'll finish second.

I reckon we have two seasons to ensure we get promoted, however we do it,...otherwise we will be languishing in the nether regions, for a long time to come.

[Ronniekirk]

My objective take on things..

We won't finish first..never were realistically going to challenge the 'new' Huns for top spot ..Last season when they were absolutely gash and having the season from hell off the field was our best opportunity.

Having said that the season is far from over............and I hate to say it but I detect a bit of arrogance in many people's automatic assumption that we will finish in second place.

Second place has to be earned, and as is quite evident, we are capable of dropping points when teams sit in....so I would expect we will drop significantly more points.

We KNEW before the season that teams will sit in, but we have been thus far unable to consistently counter that, and again despite all the pre season hype about us being REALLY prepared for the start of the season , we were not.

People can point to injuries, but we SIGNED players who were injured!

Alan Stubbs has my full backing.at the moment,.....I'd even give him another season if we fail to go up in the play offs this time round...but that would be it...we are already not that far from tipping point where we will be a long term lower division side.

As Jim B pointed out on another post, Rangers and Hearts were relegated for financial irregularities...we were relegated because we were a crap fitba team, and that means we can have no automatic right to expect we simply need to turn u, even with the squad have, and we'll finish second.

I reckon we have two seasons to ensure we get promoted, however we do it,...otherwise we will be languishing in the nether regions, for a long time to come.

I am by no means a happy clapper ,but despite today's result,i would be still expect us to finish second . I have said on other threads I thought it would take us till Into October to secure second place ,and despite some tricky fixtures coming up I would expect that to happen .
However our lack of goals remains a concern for me and that's why I think it's not too early to say we are out the title race unless Rangers for some inexplicable reason start losing games .
Stubbs if he took us to second again and has a good cup run ,would IMO be a Manager who other clubs might see his Potential at a bigger Club ,so if we were to be in the Championship a third year which is unthinkable there is no guarantee Stubbs would still be here.

[bigwheel]

I am by no means a happy clapper ,but despite today's result,i would be still expect us to finish second . I have said on other threads I thought it would take us till Into October to secure second place ,and despite some tricky fixtures coming up I would expect that to happen .
However our lack of goals remains a concern for me and that's why I think it's not too early to say we are out the title race unless Rangers for some inexplicable reason start losing games .
Stubbs if he took us to second again and has a good cup run ,would IMO be a Manager who other clubs might see his Potential at a bigger Club ,so if we were to be in the Championship a third year which is unthinkable there is no guarantee Stubbs would still be here.

If we spend a third year down, I would not want Stubbs to be here - he wouldn't deserve to be

[B.H.F.C]

Why do folk go mental at others who think the league is over? I'd be stunned if Hibs won the league from here, in fact if anyone wants a bet I'll bet them we finish behind The Rangers! Doesn't mean our season is over just means again we will be in the play offs and this time it's win or bust because another season down here will send more fans away and the budget will be nothing like it has been.

Hopefully we finish strongly and can go into the play offs on a high and win them! I'm not negative I'm realistic, league is gone.

There is no in between. There is those who think the league is gone. And there are this who (blindly IMO) think the opposite and label the former as bedwetters and the like.

8 points behind already and a stadium that isn't even half full tells its own story. Especially after all the talk of a quick start over the summer.

[Forza Fred]

I am by no means a happy clapper ,but despite today's result,i would be still expect us to finish second . I have said on other threads I thought it would take us till Into October to secure second place ,and despite some tricky fixtures coming up I would expect that to happen .
However our lack of goals remains a concern for me and that's why I think it's not too early to say we are out the title race unless Rangers for some inexplicable reason start losing games .
Stubbs if he took us to second again and has a good cup run ,would IMO be a Manager who other clubs might see his Potential at a bigger Club ,so if we were to be in the Championship a third year which is unthinkable there is no guarantee Stubbs would still be here.

Don't see any conflict in my post and your response Ronnie, and agree that it is entirely possible that
stubb's is courted prior to the end of what could be his third season.....he is obviously using Hibs as a stepping stone and I would be surprised if his grand plan involves spending several years in the lower Scottish divisions.

I too would hope and expect that we finish in second spot....unless that is, the playing and coaching staff get the mindset that there is an inevitability about that, something which I have detected a sniff of by some posters on this site.

[Greenblood70]

Tend to agree with the OP. We need to win home games, no blips, to win the league. We've dropped eight points now, The Rangers have dropped none.

Draws aren't good enough whether it's now or the end of the season. There's no way to dress up today's result, it's bad, and probably cost us the league.

Spot on, we've engineered a situation where by the end of September we already face a massive points deficit in the league. Our tactics today were absolutely woeful, and we failed to change anything in our approach. We show, frankly ***** teams, far too much respect and our tippy tappy aimless posession football has been ringing alarm bells for most who actually bother to go to the games for a while. I fear my optimism this season has been misplaced but tbh I'll accept any way out of this pish division. Failure to do that and there's no way Stubbs could survive for a third tilt at it imo.

[Gatecrasher]

Did anyone really and I mean really think or buy into all the ***** discussed on here about Rangers skint and gash again this year after the embarrassment they had last year? because there was no chance that was going to happen. Whilst them getting stuffed by Motherwell was funny at the time it was always us that ws going to suffer the consequences because it was us who would be up against them for promotion.

lets get get real here, we have got off to a good start to the season, OK Dumbarton was stupid but we recovered well since then. Rangers have blown the league away and will continue to do so. There is no point in putting a stupid amount of pressure on the players and management to compete with them, yes we should strive to win every game but its unrealistic for us to actually do this.

The best thing we can do is chill out a bit and support Stubbs and the players as the season goes on unless things go seriously tits up there is no point in having a big panic every time things quite don't go our way.

[silverhibee]

Why do folk go mental at others who think the league is over? I'd be stunned if Hibs won the league from here, in fact if anyone wants a bet I'll bet them we finish behind The Rangers! Doesn't mean our season is over just means again we will be in the play offs and this time it's win or bust because another season down here will send more fans away and the budget will be nothing like it has been.

Hopefully we finish strongly and can go into the play offs on a high and win them! I'm not negative I'm realistic, league is gone.

Remember and change the bed covers in the morning.















:greengrin

[Phoenix]

2:23 gone and Wales lead England 3-0.

England should just head into the locker room right now! :rolleyes:


As it turned out ...... yes!:wink:

[Greenworld]

Behave yourself. "Sack the manager if he doesn't take us up in 2 seasons". Like that has worked over the last 10 years. What is the hurry? Get he CLUB back on level terms and look to the future. If it takes 5 years , it takes 5 years. We do it without cheating and we do it in a way the Hibernian will be here forever. GGTTH
Enjoy sitting at Easter road on your own "The last hibee" film will follow.
What a comment that is "whats the hurry "
This is Scottish football for christ sake we are not trying to get into the EPl we are trying to get into a league with Motherwell...Dundee ....Dundee Utd ...Inverness....Ross County...and you say your Happy to wait Five years to compete with these Scottish giants of the game.
No if we are not promoted this year by whatever method then Stubbs is out... in my eyes he will have failded.


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[NORTHERNHIBBY]

Just come back for the play offs then pal

And the facts are that there are about 4,000 Hibbies who intend to do exactly that.

[Betty Boop]

Enjoy sitting at Easter road on your own "The last hibee" film will follow.
What a comment that is "whats the hurry "
This is Scottish football for christ sake we are not trying to get into the EPl we are trying to get into a league with Motherwell...Dundee ....Dundee Utd ...Inverness....Ross County...and you say your Happy to wait Five years to compete with these Scottish giants of the game.
No if we are not promoted this year by whatever method then Stubbs is out... in my eyes he will have failded.


Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk
:top marks

[brog]

All fairly sensible stuff brog, but in the stands the sense of frustration is very evident when we continue to struggle in breaking teams down who come with a defensive game plan. Stubbs apparent failure to work out this problem is a real cause for concern and that is (IMO) what you see behind most of the perceived negative posting on here.

I agree & understand that Dave, I was quite frustrated at Livi last week, It's just I really don't understand the mentality of folks rushing to start negative threads 5 minutes after a game, that we drew, has finished. Let's put things in perspective, after the first series of games last season we had won 3 times, against Sevco, Livi & Cowdenbeath! We had lost to Alloa, Q of S, & Yams away, & lost/drew at home to Falkirk & Dumbarton/Raith respectively. On Saturday, we conceded our first home league goal of the season & our first in 7, yes 7, home league & LC games. We were at least as far behind Sevco at this stage last season & ended up 3 points ahead of them yet people say we should throw in the towel! Nonsense, all IMO of course! :wink:

[The Leith Dutch]

Exactly. The excuse that teams sit in against us is becoming painful to hear. Are the people using this excuse of the belief that these teams aren't sitting in against Rangers and didn't against Hearts last season?

We weren't good enough last season and we haven't started well enough this season. Rangers and Hearts regularly score 4,5 or 6 goals against the teams that we struggle to score 2 goals into. We've dropped points in 3 of our 7 games so far and judgjng by our record since Stubbs came in, that type of inconsistency is likely to continue over the course of the season.

While I won't be throwing in the towel yet the above is spot on.

There were a lot of folk berating the defence but the fact is we don't score enough goals.

Simple statistical analysis will show that most of the points teams drops are in games where they score less than 2 goals.
Scoring 3 almost eliminates the dropped points.

We get very few goals from midfield and the service to the strikers is generally pretty poor - not much in the way of killer balls, hitting the byline or good crossing.

Oddly, I like our midfielders but there needs to be some end product as this poor man's Arsenal of endless tippy tappy around the opposition area isn't getting us the goals we need.

There's still a lot of games to go but we've now left ourselves needing to win pretty much all the remaining games to win the league.

[Forza Fred]

I agree & understand that Dave, I was quite frustrated at Livi last week, It's just I really don't understand the mentality of folks rushing to start negative threads 5 minutes after a game, that we drew, has finished. Let's put things in perspective, after the first series of games last season we had won 3 times, against Sevco, Livi & Cowdenbeath! We had lost to Alloa, Q of S, & Yams away, & lost/drew at home to Falkirk & Dumbarton/Raith respectively. On Saturday, we conceded our first home league goal of the season & our first in 7, yes 7, home league & LC games. We were at least as far behind Sevco at this stage last season & ended up 3 points ahead of them yet people say we should throw in the towel! Nonsense, all IMO of course! :wink:

But Brian surely you would concede that there is a vast difference between last season's Rangers and this season's Rangers, and therefore exceedingly unlikely that we will overhaul them.

No?

[The Leith Dutch]

But Brian surely you would concede that there is a vast difference between last season's Rangers and this season's Rangers, and therefore exceedingly unlikely that we will overhaul them.

No?

While I tend more towards happy clapper than neg ferret this is the crucial point for me.
This seasons sevco look like they're going to batter pretty much all the other teams - much like the yams did last season.

Same problem we had last season too - not putting away the other teams.

Had we matched the yams and sevco's results against the other teams we'd have been promored as champions as the mini league of head to heads read:
Hibs P8 W4 D2 L2 Pts: 14
Yams P8 W3 D3 L2 Pts:12
Sevco P8 W2 D1 L5 Ots: 7

Sevco did 4 points better against the others and the yams 23 points better.

[H18S NX]

Enjoy sitting at Easter road on your own "The last hibee" film will follow.
What a comment that is "whats the hurry "
This is Scottish football for christ sake we are not trying to get into the EPl we are trying to get into a league with Motherwell...Dundee ....Dundee Utd ...Inverness....Ross County...and you say your Happy to wait Five years to compete with these Scottish giants of the game.
No if we are not promoted this year by whatever method then Stubbs is out... in my eyes he will have failded.


Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk...Spot on m8.

[emerald green]

Behave yourself. "Sack the manager if he doesn't take us up in 2 seasons". Like that has worked over the last 10 years. What is the hurry? Get he CLUB back on level terms and look to the future. If it takes 5 years , it takes 5 years. We do it without cheating and we do it in a way the Hibernian will be here forever. GGTTH

Are you serious? In no way am I agreeing with the "sack the manager" stuff, but if it takes five years for Hibs to get out of the Championship then I fear this club will have gone into a possibly irreversible decline by that time.

I could go into details as to why I think that would be the case, but I'm p***** off enough and can't be bothered TBH. I think most folk would have been able to figure that out for themselves anyway.

[Sir David Gray]

Behave yourself. "Sack the manager if he doesn't take us up in 2 seasons". Like that has worked over the last 10 years. What is the hurry? Get he CLUB back on level terms and look to the future. If it takes 5 years , it takes 5 years. We do it without cheating and we do it in a way the Hibernian will be here forever. GGTTH

Five years?

I can accept not going up last season and this season, given that we were up against Sevco and Hearts. However if we fail to get promoted this season then we absolutely must get promoted next season, there would be no excuses.

It shouldn't take anywhere near five years for Hibs to be promoted, that would just be ridiculous.

[Scouse Hibee]

I said when we went down with Rangers and Hearts that I feared we would be down for at least 3 seasons, I think I was right.

[AFKA5814_Hibs]

I think it's fair to say that The Rangers will win the league and win it comfortably. Yes, they will drop points, but as yesterday proved, so will Hibs and we look likely to drop more points than they do. I would expect Hibs to finish 2nd though and get into the final play off game against the 2nd bottom PL team.

[Heisenberg]

The playoffs are only acceptable if we go up. I'd punt Stubbs if he fails again, we've got a bigger budget than most in the top divison never mind this diddy league.

[brog]

But Brian surely you would concede that there is a vast difference between last season's Rangers and this season's Rangers, and therefore exceedingly unlikely that we will overhaul them.

No?

Not really Freddie. People have short memories. Until mid Nov last season Sevco had lost only 2 games, to us & Yams. They'd beaten Raith 10-1 over 2 games & Falkirk 6-0. They'd also beaten ICT & St J, the team that humped them last week, in the League Cup. I accept they've improved but they're far from invincible. We can only take care of our results & not worry about them. They have a huge advantage with their reputation & support, not to mention getting a pen each week but those things can work against them when results go wrong, as they will. Keep the faith!

[B.H.F.C]

Not really Freddie. People have short memories. Until mid Nov last season Sevco had lost only 2 games, to us & Yams. They'd beaten Raith 10-1 over 2 games & Falkirk 6-0. They'd also beaten ICT & St J, the team that humped them last week, in the League Cup. I accept they've improved but they're far from invincible. We can only take care of our results & not worry about them. They have a huge advantage with their reputation & support, not to mention getting a pen each week but those things can work against them when results go wrong, as they will. Keep the faith!

I agree with a lot of what you say about Rangers. However the big issue is taking care off our own results. That's what we haven't done.

[Forza Fred]

Not really Freddie. People have short memories. Until mid Nov last season Sevco had lost only 2 games, to us & Yams. They'd beaten Raith 10-1 over 2 games & Falkirk 6-0. They'd also beaten ICT & St J, the team that humped them last week, in the League Cup. I accept they've improved but they're far from invincible. We can only take care of our results & not worry about them. They have a huge advantage with their reputation & support, not to mention getting a pen each week but those things can work against them when results go wrong, as they will. Keep the faith!

Gotta admire your confidence Brian, you must let me know how much it costs a bottle and where I can get some from.....:wink:

Seriously, I''ve realistically conceded that we won't finish first....we've given them too much of a start too soon...and they ain't gonna blow it....whereas we regularly drop 'silly' points.....but I hope as hell that we DO finish second.

I think the point that we are currently only fourth in the table is overlooked by some...who automatically think we will finish no worse than second.

Nobody is going to make it easy for us to finish second, and there is still that to play and if necessary, scrap for, but I just don't have the same optimism as you when it comes to first place I'm afraid....I think they have a word for it on the other side of town that starts with D.....:greengrin

[DH1875]

Wouldn't go as far to say Stubbs should be punted if we dont go up. Anything could happen in the playoff final and lets not forget it'll be a prem team we'd be playing. What I would say though is that IF we dont make that final then no doubt, he would have to go. Losing to Falkirk or St Mirren, no matter how they set up in the playoffs cant happen.

[Thecat23]

Not really Freddie. People have short memories. Until mid Nov last season Sevco had lost only 2 games, to us & Yams. They'd beaten Raith 10-1 over 2 games & Falkirk 6-0. They'd also beaten ICT & St J, the team that humped them last week, in the League Cup. I accept they've improved but they're far from invincible. We can only take care of our results & not worry about them. They have a huge advantage with their reputation & support, not to mention getting a pen each week but those things can work against them when results go wrong, as they will. Keep the faith!

Sadly we don't "take care of our own results" we kept saying last season Hearts would drop points and hit a bad patch they didn't! The Rangers are a better team than Hearts had last season.

[Sir David Gray]

Not really Freddie. People have short memories. Until mid Nov last season Sevco had lost only 2 games, to us & Yams. They'd beaten Raith 10-1 over 2 games & Falkirk 6-0. They'd also beaten ICT & St J, the team that humped them last week, in the League Cup. I accept they've improved but they're far from invincible. We can only take care of our results & not worry about them. They have a huge advantage with their reputation & support, not to mention getting a pen each week but those things can work against them when results go wrong, as they will. Keep the faith!

Unfortunately we aren't taking care of our own results though.

We've already dropped five points to Dumbarton and St Mirren and it's only the end of September.

I think there's a good chance that Sevco would have won the league anyway but we're making life a lot easier for them.

We're averaging less than 2 points per game just now which means we are on track for less points than we got last season and we ended up more than 20 points behind Hearts last year.

[Ozyhibby]

If we don't go up this season then the club will be significantly downsized over the summer. The money just won't be there. We are at 8000 crowds just now and another season down here will see that drop further. Prices will also have to fall as 3 season at prem prices in the championship would be a brass neck even for Petrie. Our break even for Crowds is 11,000. Our losses this year will be large.



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[Smartie]

If we don't go up this season then the club will be significantly downsized over the summer. The money just won't be there. We are at 8000 crowds just now and another season down here will see that drop further. Prices will also have to fall as 3 season at prem prices in the championship would be a brass neck even for Petrie. Our break even for Crowds is 11,000. Our losses this year will be large.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think we'll see our crowds drop quite a lot over the next few games to be honest, never mind the next few years.

Season tickets were sold on the basis that we were going to have a shot at the Championship.

That is no longer a realistic ambition and we're not out of September yet. I'm happy enough that I stumped up the cash for a season ticket when this was the bold ambition but to be honest I've got better things to do with my weekends than pitch up and watch us scrap for 2nd place in the second tier of a third rate footballing nation's league competition.

I'll probably get interested again as we get towards the end of the season.

I'm sure I'm not alone.

I can't see many people who haven't paid in advance pitching up and paying for more of this.

Yesterday's result was a disaster.

[Baldy Foghorn]

If we don't go up this season then the club will be significantly downsized over the summer. The money just won't be there. We are at 8000 crowds just now and another season down here will see that drop further. Prices will also have to fall as 3 season at prem prices in the championship would be a brass neck even for Petrie. Our break even for Crowds is 11,000. Our losses this year will be large.



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Our crowds have already dropped. After Wednesday I really thought more would turn up. It's going to take something extraordinary to get our crowds up.....

[Ozyhibby]

Our crowds have already dropped. After Wednesday I really thought more would turn up. It's going to take something extraordinary to get our crowds up.....

Attractive football and goals. It's an age old recipe for getting crowds in. Stubbs is failing on that front. If thing continue then I don't see him lasting the season. We simply can't afford to carry on like this.


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[Baldy Foghorn]

Attractive football and goals. It's an age old recipe for getting crowds in. Stubbs is failing on that front. If thing continue then I don't see him lasting the season. We simply can't afford to carry on like this.


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Who realistically would get us out of this division?

[Ozyhibby]

Who realistically would get us out of this division?

Difficult to pick someone who would fit into our new management structure.
It's a bit early yet but if solutions do not appear on the horizon soon then I think Leeann will have to act. She will have no choice.


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[B.H.F.C]

Our crowds have already dropped. After Wednesday I really thought more would turn up. It's going to take something extraordinary to get our crowds up.....

Good wins for a sustained period of time. When we do something good (like Wednesday) it's too often followed by something not so good (like yesterday). Any feel good factor just disappears.

Being in a competitive title race would also help.

That said, I did think we may have added a bit to the gate yesterday.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Good wins for a sustained period of time. When we do something good (like Wednesday) it's too often followed by something not so good (like yesterday). Any feel good factor just disappears.

Being in a competitive title race would also help.

That said, I did think we may have added a bit to the gate yesterday.

It's disappointing to have dropped 8 points, and see the rangers blowing everyone aside, but too many have "chucked it". Bet your bottom dollar should we get to League Cup Final, 30,000 will want tickets, meanwhile 8,500 continue to watch us at home, is it always going to be like this? Hardcore at home until a chance of glory?

[blackpoolhibs]

Remember the argument that Hearts had a whole season to prepare for this league, how long have we had?

The lack of width in our team is laughable, we are still after how many signings, using both full backs as our main men for width, when neither have the guile ability or quality to play that role?

[B.H.F.C]

It's disappointing to have dropped 8 points, and see the rangers blowing everyone aside, but too many have "chucked it". Bet your bottom dollar should we get to League Cup Final, 30,000 will want tickets, meanwhile 8,500 continue to watch us at home, is it always going to be like this? Hardcore at home until a chance of glory?

It's not unique to Hibs though. Rangers were rank rotten last year and Ibrox was half empty. It's not this year because they are winning games and scoring goals. Hearts romped the league last year, people enjoyed going. They proceeded to sell 13k season tickets this year. If their season fades this year and they don't achieve anything then that'll drop next year.

If the team delivers then crowds will rise. If not, they won't.

[blackpoolhibs]

It's disappointing to have dropped 8 points, and see the rangers blowing everyone aside, but too many have "chucked it". Bet your bottom dollar should we get to League Cup Final, 30,000 will want tickets, meanwhile 8,500 continue to watch us at home, is it always going to be like this? Hardcore at home until a chance of glory?

These Glory hunting Hibs fans are great eh.

[Baldy Foghorn]

These Glory hunting Hibs fans are great eh.

Eh nah......

[blackpoolhibs]

Eh nah......

So why do you think crowds are down, and what needs to happen for the crowds to rise?

[Baldy Foghorn]

So why do you think crowds are down, and what needs to happen for the crowds to rise?

Ah the usual patronising toned question.............

[blackpoolhibs]

Ah the usual patronising toned question.............

And the usual non answer, just how great everything is at the club, and we are all satan in disguise and should be ashamed of ourselves for wanting a cup final ticket should we get there?

If we do get to a final, i'm going even though i have zero loyalty points.

Now that's patronising.

[Baldy Foghorn]

And the usual non answer, just how great everything is at the club, and we are all satan in disguise and should be ashamed of ourselves for wanting a cup final ticket should we get there?

If we do get to a final, i'm going even though i have zero loyalty points.

Now that's patronising.

Why would I answer someone who has chucked it....? (Until the glory games come around)

[emerald green]

After the result at Morton today, does anyone seriously think The Rangers will drop many points this season?

Being realistic, it's just not going to happen. Even if Hibs were to beat them (that's a big if) Hibs are then liable to produce results like yesterdays, a few days after beating Aberdeen FFS.

Hibs are struggling to break down garbage like St Mirren, they go away and thrash Morton by 4 goals.

[blackpoolhibs]

Why would I answer someone who has chucked it....? (Until the glory games come around)

Because you can't, other than tell me and others like me that we make you sick.:faf:

I was at the Morton game, i may even be at the QOS game next week. These are real glamour ties, for all of us glory hunters.

[Silky]

Attractive football and goals. It's an age old recipe for getting crowds in. Stubbs is failing on that front. If thing continue then I don't see him lasting the season. We simply can't afford to carry on like this.

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That's one of the reasons I feel we are where we are now. We have been through god knows how many managers. There has to come a time, surely, when someone is given a run at it. We bemoan players leaving after a year or two yet never seem to care about any stability within management ranks. When Stubbs took over, the club was on its erse. It needed massive surgery from top to bottom and was a project. I don't think the project is finished yet but Stubbs needs to be allowed to finish what he started.

[B.H.F.C]

That's one of the reasons I feel we are where we are now. We have been through god knows how many managers. There has to come a time, surely, when someone is given a run at it. We bemoan players leaving after a year or two yet never seem to care about any stability within management ranks. When Stubbs took over, the club was on its erse. It needed massive surgery from top to bottom and was a project. I don't think the project is finished yet but Stubbs needs to be allowed to finish what he started.

There has to be a timeframe for it though. We will be in the playoffs and it is essential he wins them this year.

I could've probably coped with not winning the league this year because Rangers were always going to be miles stronger than last year. But if we fail to even compete for the title that is just not good enough. And after all, it was Stubbs who very openly said the aim was to win the league. You can't make statements like that and not be under pressure of you fall short.

[Ozyhibby]

There has to be a timeframe for it though. We will be in the playoffs and it is essential he wins them this year.

I could've probably coped with not winning the league this year because Rangers were always going to be miles stronger than last year. But if we fail to even compete for the title that is just not good enough. And after all, it was Stubbs who very openly said the aim was to win the league. You can't make statements like that and not be under pressure of you fall short.

I don't want to have to go into the play offs with a team that can't score goals. It needs to be sorted long before then or we need to make a change.



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[Thecat23]

Eh nah......

Would you rather we turned up at Hampeden with only 8k? If it wasn't for folk who turn up to the big games the place would be empty! As much as I hate seeing ER dead I've no problem with fans wanting to attend cup finals.

[Ozyhibby]

That's one of the reasons I feel we are where we are now. We have been through god knows how many managers. There has to come a time, surely, when someone is given a run at it. We bemoan players leaving after a year or two yet never seem to care about any stability within management ranks. When Stubbs took over, the club was on its erse. It needed massive surgery from top to bottom and was a project. I don't think the project is finished yet but Stubbs needs to be allowed to finish what he started.

He has to be showing consistent progress though. Progress has stalled now. That can't be allowed to last long.


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[Alfred E Newman]

So why do you think crowds are down, and what needs to happen for the crowds to rise?

There is too much emphasis on crowds if you ask me probably due to Hearts filling their ground each week. Over the years our gates were always more or less the same as Hearts but now we are miles away from them. The crowd was up slightly yesterday and almost 9000 was still easily the second biggest attendance after Celtic. I don't think there were many more in the home end for the play off game which really sums up our support now. The slow patient built up we persist in playing unfortunately doesn't create much atmosphere and a more exciting style might help but other than going round the doors dragging people down to Easter Road, I don't think there is much that can be done. Sadly too many regulars have given up on the club.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

i may even be at the QOS game next week. These are real glamour ties, for all of us glory hunters.

I'm going to Carlisle next Sat with my mate and my old man, might see you there G?

[SneakersO'Toole]

If we were mounting a serious title challenge there would be many more fans coming to ER on match days. A lot fans see no value in paying £22 for a home game against Alloa when the best we are likely to achieve is 2nd.

That is the reality unfortunately. The club want more fans through the door but they aren't producing the results to entice them. Sad but true.

[blackpoolhibs]

I'm going to Carlisle next Sat with my mate and my old man, might see you there G?


What time are you in Carlisle, not sure if it's the car or the train at the minute?

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

What time are you in Carlisle, not sure if it's the car or the train at the minute?Get there at 0930 leave at 2015.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Because you can't, other than tell me and others like me that we make you sick.:faf:

I was at the Morton game, i may even be at the QOS game next week. These are real glamour ties, for all of us glory hunters.

OK, surprised you even bother given how much negativity you spout on here.......

[Baldy Foghorn]

Would you rather we turned up at Hampeden with only 8k? If it wasn't for folk who turn up to the big games the place would be empty! As much as I hate seeing ER dead I've no problem with fans wanting to attend cup finals.

That's your prerogative...........ER is never more than half full, it's pitiful.....

[Ozyhibby]

That's your prerogative...........ER is never more than half full, it's pitiful.....

Why do you think that is?


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[scoopyboy]

I don't want to have to go into the play offs with a team that can't score goals. It needs to be sorted long before then or we need to make a change.



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Dinnae worry about it Ozy, if we don't score goals we won't be in the play offs. :greengrin

[Baldy Foghorn]

Why do you think that is?


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You seem to have all the answers........

[Thecat23]

That's your prerogative...........ER is never more than half full, it's pitiful.....

I know that it's rank. But every team has glory hunters BF not just Hibs. Until we turn a corner then it will continue to be low crowds and we can't exactly blame them.

It's Hibs fault were we are so its up to Hibs to get themselves back up and get more fans along.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I know that it's rank. But every team has glory hunters BF not just Hibs. Until we turn a corner then it will continue to be low crowds and we can't exactly blame them.

It's Hibs fault were we are so its up to Hibs to get themselves back up and get more fans along.

I get that, but I can't stomach folk that are nowhere to be seen on a matchday, telling all and sundry how "pish" we are, then come back at Finals to then disappear again until the next one comes around. It was never ever going to be easy to get back to SPL, after years of neglect from our Custodians, and changes are starting to be implemented that will help on that front. People who want instant success tend to end up being disappointed.....

[The Leith Dutch]

After the result at Morton today, does anyone seriously think The Rangers will drop many points this season?


Being honest I have to say they won't drop enough.

Currently we're at the very edge of being reliant on others with a 29 game winning streak making us league champions by a point if sevco win all the games bar the ones against us and let's be honest we're not winning 29 games back to back. I'm presuming sevco will shed a few points against the others but probably in the 2 or 3 draws amount whereas we look set to ship quite a few more.

[ekhibee]

I would tend to agree with Baldy Foghorn here. Although there might have been a few more in the crowd against St Mirren part of that might be due to the result against the sheep. I get what people are saying about cost, I can totally appreciate what they're saying from a personal point of view, and how often have the team let us down after getting a good result? But the bottom line is that supporting Hibs is not just about turning up for the big games unfortunately, it's about perseverence and at the end of the day we might lose a few battles along the way, but I can live with that as long as we win the war.

[Ozyhibby]

I get that, but I can't stomach folk that are nowhere to be seen on a matchday, telling all and sundry how "pish" we are, then come back at Finals to then disappear again until the next one comes around. It was never ever going to be easy to get back to SPL, after years of neglect from our Custodians, and changes are starting to be implemented that will help on that front. People who want instant success tend to end up being disappointed.....

None of us can be sure the changes will help, we only hope they will. Progress has come to a halt and that is concerning. Worrying about who gets cup final tickets given our circumstances (i.e. We are not actually in a cup final) seems a bit strange.
Instant success? I think the Hibs fans have been very patient.


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[Ozyhibby]

I would tend to agree with Baldy Foghorn here. Although there might have been a few more in the crowd against St Mirren part of that might be due to the result against the sheep. I get what people are saying about cost, I can totally appreciate what they're saying from a personal point of view, and how often have the team let us down after getting a good result? But the bottom line is that supporting Hibs is not just about turning up for the big games unfortunately, it's about perseverence and at the end of the day we might lose a few battles along the way, but I can live with that as long as we win the war.

That is not the real world though. That is some fantasy land where everyone supports Hibs and goes to every game.
Back here in the real world the club have to start entertaining the fans and scoring goals.
Sending nice emails etc will not bring back the fans, winning matches will.


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[Baldy Foghorn]

None of us can be sure the changes will help, we only hope they will. Progress has come to a halt and that is concerning. Worrying about who gets cup final tickets given our circumstances (i.e. We are not actually in a cup final) seems a bit strange.
Instant success? I think the Hibs fans have been very patient.


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Well aware we are not in a Cup Final, I wasn't worrying either, I was saying look how many will want to go in comparison to how many we get at home games. I'm sure you were well aware of my point though.....

In relation to your last point this is true, we have, but saying AS should be punted if we don't go up (after 2 seasons) is looking for instant success is it not?

[Nutmegged]

Well aware we are not in a Cup Final, I wasn't worrying either, I was saying look how many will want to go in comparison to how many we get at home games. I'm sure you were well aware of my point though.....

In relation to your last point this is true, we have, but saying AS should be punted if we don't go up (after 2 seasons) is looking for instant success is it not?

Expecting Hibernian to be promoted from the 2nd tier of Scottish Football within two years is not expecting "instant success" in my opinion, it's a minimum requirement!

[Baldy Foghorn]

Expecting Hibernian to be promoted from the 2nd tier of Scottish Football within two years is not expecting "instant success" in my opinion, it's a minimum requirement!

In theory, hard to put into practice though..........

[Nutmegged]

In theory, hard to put into practice though..........

We sure make it hard, that's the one certainty

[Smartie]

It's never about "price". It is all about value.

Who begrudged Hibs their £20 last Wednesday? No-one, because the experience far exceeded the price.

Hibs have set the bar high by charging what they do and telling us what they're going to do i.e. challenge for Championships. That leads to high expectations by way of customers getting "value". When they fail miserably to challenge they only heap pressure on themselves.

It's a minor miracle we've still got 8000 or so turning up to see the same creative outlet (Stevenson and Gray at full back, narrow midfield, Cummings, Malonga and Boyle up front, tippy tappy passing and wafty crossing style) fail to make progress in exactly the same way we failed last season.

In many ways I think it is quite impressive that we have held on to such a strong "core" support.

But surely to goodness none of those who go regularly can really blame those who have chosen to stop doing so?

[blackpoolhibs]

Instant success, now that's funny.

[Nutmegged]

I've never met a Hibs fan in the last 7 years who expected instant success to be fair

[blackpoolhibs]

That's right, I'm trolling???. Maybe if I was not picking holes in what you say, and you actually answered the questions rather than handing out insults we'd have a proper conversation?

[Baldy Foghorn]

I've never met a Hibs fan in the last 7 years who expected instant success to be fair

You said gaining promotion was a minimum requirement, that is instant success is it not (for last season anyway)?

[Baldy Foghorn]

That's right, I'm trolling???. Maybe if I was not picking holes in what you say, and you actually answered the questions rather than handing out insults we'd have a proper conversation?

Pick holes all you want, you are happy to come on and bemoan the Club. I am trying to see the bigger picture, no point conversing when we are poles apart.

[Nakedmanoncrack]

It's never about "price". It is all about value.

Who begrudged Hibs their £20 last Wednesday? No-one, because the experience far exceeded the price.

Hibs have set the bar high by charging what they do and telling us what they're going to do i.e. challenge for Championships. That leads to high expectations by way of customers getting "value". When they fail miserably to challenge they only heap pressure on themselves.

It's a minor miracle we've still got 8000 or so turning up to see the same creative outlet (Stevenson and Gray at full back, narrow midfield, Cummings, Malonga and Boyle up front, tippy tappy passing and wafty crossing style) fail to make progress in exactly the same way we failed last season.

In many ways I think it is quite impressive that we have held on to such a strong "core" support.

But surely to goodness none of those who go regularly can really blame those who have chosen to stop doing so?

:agree:

To be getting over 8000 in our current predicament is remarkable, historically Hibs have often been playing to small audiences whilst in the top league.

[blackpoolhibs]

Pick holes all you want, you are happy to come on and bemoan the Club. I am trying to see the bigger picture, no point conversing when we are poles apart.

I suppose you have missed the positive posts I have posted this season, and only read what you want to read as usual. That's not a problem, you just keep discussing how good you think we will be in some mythical future, and I will discuss how things are going in the present.

[Dashing Bob S]

We have to stick with Stubbs.

If we get a Neilson/Warburton grinder in now, then it's already too late as Rangers now have the advantage, and the Stubbs style suits the play-off more.

If we get a Neilson/Warburton grinder in next season, then in the absence of Hearts/Rangers we will probably still win the league due to our stronger resource base.

The grinders would then have to be gotten rid of anyway in the SPL, as we'd be bored ****less and crying out for...a Stubbs figure.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I suppose you have missed the positive posts I have posted this season, and only read what you want to read as usual. That's not a problem, you just keep discussing how good you think we will be in some mythical future, and I will discuss how things are going in the present.

OK...........:aok:

[Nutmegged]

I suppose you have missed the positive posts I have posted this season, and only read what you want to read as usual. That's not a problem, you just keep discussing how good you think we will be in some mythical future, and I will discuss how things are going in the present.

That kind of stuff will never catch on, the here and now? Pffffft witchcraft

[Sergey]

I suppose you have missed the positive posts I have posted this season, and only read what you want to read as usual. That's not a problem, you just keep discussing how good you think we will be in some mythical future, and I will discuss how things are going in the present.

I read both of them and fair play :not worth.

:greengrin

[Thecat23]

Let's just all be honest.. There are folk on here who will constantly post negative stuff about the club, on the other hand their are folk who will only post positives about the club even when it's clear when we have serious issues still.

Then there are folk who post how they feel when Hibs aren't doing well and how they feel when they are. I praise Hibs when it's deserved and recently they have deserved it simple as that! But sat should have been three points in the bag and again how long are we going to keep saying (it takes time) Hearts did and won it, The Huns haven't but are strolling it so it can be done right away. Why do we have this issue? Are we to soft in the head as a support and we except it, or are the players not good enough or got the confidence? What ever it is Hibs must and I stress this MUST return to the top flight this season because even hard core fans get tired of wasting good money and that will see further drops in the crowds.

Everything is far from great at Hibs despite what folk think or say and it's far from doom and gloom. We are plodding along but can do far better, time for the team to dig deep start bullying teams as well as outplaying them. Stubbs must start looking at movement off the ball and it pains me to say it look how The Rangers set up against teams in this division.

[Nutmegged]

Good post, I'm definitely in the "I'll post how I feel at that particular time" camp and don't see anything wrong with that, I don't understand why a few are always so negative but on the flip side I get infuriated when Hibs fans are blantently disingenuous to other Hibs fans on a Hibs website, it feels like you're being treated like a fool at times when they wont post their true feelings and expect you to believe it.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I suppose you have missed the positive posts I have posted this season, and only read what you want to read as usual. That's not a problem, you just keep discussing how good you think we will be in some mythical future, and I will discuss how things are going in the present.

You're not losing patience are you G? :-)

[Baldy Foghorn]

Good post, I'm definitely in the "I'll post how I feel at that particular time" camp and don't see anything wrong with that, I don't understand why a few are always so negative but on the flip side I get infuriated when Hibs fans are blantently disingenuous to other Hibs fans on a Hibs website, it feels like you're being treated like a fool at times when they wont post their true feelings and expect you to believe it.

Who are not posting their true feelings?

[Thecat23]

Good post, I'm definitely in the "I'll post how I feel at that particular time" camp and don't see anything wrong with that, I don't understand why a few are always so negative but on the flip side I get infuriated when Hibs fans are blantently disingenuous to other Hibs fans on a Hibs website, it feels like you're being treated like a fool at times when they wont post their true feelings and expect you to believe it.

Yeah I think a lot of posters on here are in the middle of the spectrum. Post after a game and tell it how it is. I'll not be patronised by anyone on here and I'll also not listen to folk who constantly have a pop at the club. It's a discussion board so I'd like to think most will respect others opinions without constantly pushing their own agenda onto us whether that be negative or positive.

[Ozyhibby]

We have to stick with Stubbs.

If we get a Neilson/Warburton grinder in now, then it's already too late as Rangers now have the advantage, and the Stubbs style suits the play-off more.

If we get a Neilson/Warburton grinder in next season, then in the absence of Hearts/Rangers we will probably still win the league due to our stronger resource base.

The grinders would then have to be gotten rid of anyway in the SPL, as we'd be bored ****less and crying out for...a Stubbs figure.

Stubbs style of football is not exactly swashbuckling? I just want us promoted.


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[rcarter1]

Let's just all be honest.. There are folk on here who will constantly post negative stuff about the club, on the other hand their are folk who will only post positives about the club even when it's clear when we have serious issues still.

Then there are folk who post how they feel when Hibs aren't doing well and how they feel when they are. I praise Hibs when it's deserved and recently they have deserved it simple as that! But sat should have been three points in the bag and again how long are we going to keep saying (it takes time) Hearts did and won it, The Huns haven't but are strolling it so it can be done right away. Why do we have this issue? Are we to soft in the head as a support and we except it, or are the players not good enough or got the confidence? What ever it is Hibs must and I stress this MUST return to the top flight this season because even hard core fans get tired of wasting good money and that will see further drops in the crowds.

Everything is far from great at Hibs despite what folk think or say and it's far from doom and gloom. We are plodding along but can do far better, time for the team to dig deep start bullying teams as well as outplaying them. Stubbs must start looking at movement off the ball and it pains me to say it look how The Rangers set up against teams in this division.

Spot on. :thumbsup:

There is lack of urgency about the club. And far too much running for the tissues and saying its no my fault.

Rip these teams apart.

Just DO it!

[brog]

Despite my mostly positive posts I'm far from being a happy clapper. I recognise we're not the finished article but people really need to step back & look at how far we've come in a year. We lost 4 of our 1st 6 league games last season, we've lost 2 out of 7 this year & knocked The Sheep out the LC. That's not perfect but it's undoubtedly progress. I really do find some of the criticism on here ridiculous, last year we couldn't defend, Oxley, Hanlon & LS were hopeless. This year, we concede 1 goal in 6 games so our tactics & a 20 year old striker in his 2nd full season get stick instead. As for sacking Stubbs, apart from being an insane concept, there's more chance of him leaving us to move up than of us getting rid of him. We must remember 1 significant fact in all this. There have only been 2 seasons in our history when both Hibs & Sevco were in the 2nd tier & those have been the last 2 seasons. Getting automatic promotion was always going to be tough but turning on the team & saying we should stay away until the play offs only makes getting into those play offs more difficult. That's surely not what we as Hibs supporters want, is it? :confused:

[Forza Fred]

Despite my mostly positive posts I'm far from being a happy clapper. I recognise we're not the finished article but people really need to step back & look at how far we've come in a year. We lost 4 of our 1st 6 league games last season, we've lost 2 out of 7 this year & knocked The Sheep out the LC. That's not perfect but it's undoubtedly progress. I really do find some of the criticism on here ridiculous, last year we couldn't defend, Oxley, Hanlon & LS were hopeless. This year, we concede 1 goal in 6 games so our tactics & a 20 year old striker in his 2nd full season get stick instead. As for sacking Stubbs, apart from being an insane concept, there's more chance of him leaving us to move up than of us getting rid of him. We must remember 1 significant fact in all this. There have only been 2 seasons in our history when both Hibs & Sevco were in the 2nd tier & those have been the last 2 seasons. Getting automatic promotion was always going to be tough but turning on the team & saying we should stay away until the play offs only makes getting into those play offs more difficult. That's surely not what we as Hibs supporters want, is it? :confused:

Agree with most of who at you say Brian.

However, while there is little doubt we have improved the serious question is.....have we improved enough, and quickly enough?

I'd be hard pressed to answer with a resounding YES!

Also, are some of us now in danger of accepting playing mid table to top of the second tier of Scottish football, as...an acceptable 'improvement'?

Rangers and Hearts, obviously don't accept such a standard, so why should we?

[Sergey]

Despite my mostly positive posts I'm far from being a happy clapper. I recognise we're not the finished article but people really need to step back & look at how far we've come in a year. We lost 4 of our 1st 6 league games last season, we've lost 2 out of 7 this year & knocked The Sheep out the LC. That's not perfect but it's undoubtedly progress. I really do find some of the criticism on here ridiculous, last year we couldn't defend, Oxley, Hanlon & LS were hopeless. This year, we concede 1 goal in 6 games so our tactics & a 20 year old striker in his 2nd full season get stick instead. As for sacking Stubbs, apart from being an insane concept, there's more chance of him leaving us to move up than of us getting rid of him. We must remember 1 significant fact in all this. There have only been 2 seasons in our history when both Hibs & Sevco were in the 2nd tier & those have been the last 2 seasons. Getting automatic promotion was always going to be tough but turning on the team & saying we should stay away until the play offs only makes getting into those play offs more difficult. That's surely not what we as Hibs supporters want, is it? :confused:

brog - this progress sees us currently 11 points behind SEVCO and we're not even into October. If we get beaten next week and other results don't go in our favour - we slip to 6th in a 10 team league in the 2nd tier of Scottish football.

You must define the meaning of 'progress' over a chilled glass of vino :aok:.

At least Cray Wanderers are undoubtedly progressing!

[hibby6270]

Despite my mostly positive posts I'm far from being a happy clapper. I recognise we're not the finished article but people really need to step back & look at how far we've come in a year. We lost 4 of our 1st 6 league games last season, we've lost 2 out of 7 this year & knocked The Sheep out the LC. That's not perfect but it's undoubtedly progress. I really do find some of the criticism on here ridiculous, last year we couldn't defend, Oxley, Hanlon & LS were hopeless. This year, we concede 1 goal in 6 games so our tactics & a 20 year old striker in his 2nd full season get stick instead. As for sacking Stubbs, apart from being an insane concept, there's more chance of him leaving us to move up than of us getting rid of him. We must remember 1 significant fact in all this. There have only been 2 seasons in our history when both Hibs & Sevco were in the 2nd tier & those have been the last 2 seasons. Getting automatic promotion was always going to be tough but turning on the team & saying we should stay away until the play offs only makes getting into those play offs more difficult. That's surely not what we as Hibs supporters want, is it? :confused:

Agreed.

We all have to be backers of the team not snipe at every bad result, disappointing though it may be, or look for scapegoats who have had an off day.

Support the team. Support the boys. Support Stubbs. Together we can do this.

GGTTH

[rcarter1]

Agreed.

We all have to be backers of the team not snipe at every bad result, disappointing though it may be, or look for scapegoats who have had an off day.

Support the team. Support the boys. Support Stubbs. Together we can do this.

GGTTH

Im happy to do all of this. BUT, it doesn't hide the fact that we should be hammering most of these teams by now. Our best league result is 3-0 vs Alloa who are frankly well rotten. That game was as it should be without really hitting the heights. The Aberdeen game, which I take as Stubbs knowing how to play a tight game against good opponents, is the only match that has truly impressed me in any way, although the 0-1 vs Rangers was not a bad performance either. Touch and go 1-0 wins vs Livi and Morton were accidents waiting to happen. Dumbarton the accident that did happen. Even the 2-0 vs Raith was only OK at best. Our team is far better than this. Complacency will keep us trundling along, its about time we got medieval on these teams..:greengrin

[blackpoolhibs]

You're not losing patience are you G? :-)

No matey, I've chucked it.

[Ronniekirk]

But Brian surely you would concede that there is a vast difference between last season's Rangers and this season's Rangers, and therefore exceedingly unlikely that we will overhaul them.

No?

After today's result for rangers ,I think it must be clear to even the most ferverent Hibbie that they won't be dropping that many points
They have conceded the same amount of goals as us (4). But the problem that most of us Hibs fans are complaining about is the lack of goals scored Rangers have scored 28! We have scored 9 We can break it down to lack of pace in how we play ,lack of width ,lack of creativity and composure in last third etc but bottom line is we don't seem able to sort it out .
when our other front players get fit they need game time to get match fit ,so there is no instant answer to sorting this out
It's also a young midfield ,so their form will be up and down in different games .

[Sir David Gray]

After today's result for rangers ,I think it must be clear to even the most ferverent Hibbie that they won't be dropping that many points
They have conceded the same amount of goals as us (4). But the problem that most of us Hibs fans are complaining about is the lack of goals scored Rangers have scored 28! We have scored 9 We can break it down to lack of pace in how we play ,lack of width ,lack of creativity and composure in last third etc but bottom line is we don't seem able to sort it out .
when our other front players get fit they need game time to get match fit ,so there is no instant answer to sorting this out
It's also a young midfield ,so their form will be up and down in different games .

Sevco's starting XI today was actually younger than our starting XI yesterday.

[broondog]

Let's just all be honest.. There are folk on here who will constantly post negative stuff about the club, on the other hand their are folk who will only post positives about the club even when it's clear when we have serious issues still.

Then there are folk who post how they feel when Hibs aren't doing well and how they feel when they are. I praise Hibs when it's deserved and recently they have deserved it simple as that! But sat should have been three points in the bag and again how long are we going to keep saying (it takes time) Hearts did and won it, The Huns haven't but are strolling it so it can be done right away. Why do we have this issue? Are we to soft in the head as a support and we except it, or are the players not good enough or got the confidence? What ever it is Hibs must and I stress this MUST return to the top flight this season because even hard core fans get tired of wasting good money and that will see further drops in the crowds.

Everything is far from great at Hibs despite what folk think or say and it's far from doom and gloom. We are plodding along but can do far better, time for the team to dig deep start bullying teams as well as outplaying them. Stubbs must start looking at movement off the ball and it pains me to say it look how The Rangers set up against teams in this division.

Good post, agree with almost all of it but I am starting to move towards not believing Stubbs is the right man for the job. He was rightfully given this season to try again but we have made a very similar start to last year, once again in a poor league. He tends to make, in my opinion, very good signings, but if I am being honest I don't think he gets the best out of players and consistently lacks a plan B when things aren't going our way. There are other managers I believe that could motivate and encourage the current squad better and get them playing for each other.

[Ronniekirk]

Sevco's starting XI today was actually younger than our starting XI yesterday.

In that case thiier dip must just be round the corner :rolleyes::wink:

[Thecat23]

Good post, agree with almost all of it but I am starting to move towards not believing Stubbs is the right man for the job. He was rightfully given this season to try again but we have made a very similar start to last year, once again in a poor league. He tends to make, in my opinion, very good signings, but if I am being honest I don't think he gets the best out of players and consistently lacks a plan B when things aren't going our way. There are other managers I believe that could motivate and encourage the current squad better and get them playing for each other.

I'm honestly not sure what it is. I think we have a very good manager who will IMO go onto better things. But is he to soft on our players? Butcher was the complete opposite but what I've found is Stubbs always protects the players after a poor result. Sometimes I wish he'd say that wasn't good enough, my players let myself and themselves down and the fans deserve better.

Maybe if he did the players wouldn't approach games against St. Mirren like they just have to turn up and win. They sometimes need to put that extra yard in to make it count. Can Stubbs get that I have no idea!

[Sir David Gray]

I'm honestly not sure what it is. I think we have a very good manager who will IMO go onto better things. But is he to soft on our players? Butcher was the complete opposite but what I've found is Stubbs always protects the players after a poor result. Sometimes I wish he'd say that wasn't good enough, my players let myself and themselves down and the fans deserve better.

Maybe if he did the players wouldn't approach games against St. Mirren like they just have to turn up and win. They sometimes need to put that extra yard in to make it count. Can Stubbs get that I have no idea!

Maybe he is saying that in private.

A lot of managers say one thing to the media and another thing behind closed doors, when it's just them and the players. Many managers do everything they can not to criticise their team's players in public.

[Ozyhibby]

I'm honestly not sure what it is. I think we have a very good manager who will IMO go onto better things. But is he to soft on our players? Butcher was the complete opposite but what I've found is Stubbs always protects the players after a poor result. Sometimes I wish he'd say that wasn't good enough, my players let myself and themselves down and the fans deserve better.

Maybe if he did the players wouldn't approach games against St. Mirren like they just have to turn up and win. They sometimes need to put that extra yard in to make it count. Can Stubbs get that I have no idea!

I personally don't think there is a lack of effort from the players. I think the way we are set up is not working and Stubbs needs to come up with a solution because carrying on as we are is not an option. It's dire to watch.


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[BoomtownHibees]

Usual over reaction. Your predicting the outcome of so many games that you must have the bookies petrified. All teams will drop points between now and the end of the season.

Why would the bookies be petrified considering they have The Rangers @ 1/50 and Hibs @ 18/1 to win the league?

They clearly agree with the OP

[brog]

brog - this progress sees us currently 11 points behind SEVCO and we're not even into October. If we get beaten next week and other results don't go in our favour - we slip to 6th in a 10 team league in the 2nd tier of Scottish football.

You must define the meaning of 'progress' over a chilled glass of vino :aok:.

At least Cray Wanderers are undoubtedly progressing!

The point is G, we were further behind at this stage last season & finished ahead of Sevco. At this stage they were en route to progressing to the LC semi-final beating ICT & St J along the way, & just like now, their fans were drooling, actually they do that most of the time, & saying bring on Celtc! That went well, didn't it! Another way of looking at our league position is if we win our game in hand we'll be 2nd! Apologies for that positive thought! :wink:
I think it's all about having realistic expectations. My expectations ( along with the bookies ) were we would finish 2nd this season, my hope was we would finish 1st. Nothing has changed for me. At present our league results are mainly in line with my expectations & we've over achieved in the LC. At this stage last year we'd lost to Alloa, Falkirk, Q of S & Raith. A year tomorrow we went to Glasgow & beat Sevco 3-1 but followed that up with home draws against Raith & Dumbarton. So my definition of progress is we're considerably better now than at this stage last year despite losing our most creative player. The challenge now is improving on that. I'll look forward to that glass of wine but I suppose the odds on you buying are roughly the same as ours for the league! :greengrin

[scoopyboy]

I'm honestly not sure what it is. I think we have a very good manager who will IMO go onto better things. But is he to soft on our players? Butcher was the complete opposite but what I've found is Stubbs always protects the players after a poor result. Sometimes I wish he'd say that wasn't good enough, my players let myself and themselves down and the fans deserve better.

Maybe if he did the players wouldn't approach games against St. Mirren like they just have to turn up and win. They sometimes need to put that extra yard in to make it count. Can Stubbs get that I have no idea!

That's definitely not the case.

Not good enough to deal with sides intent of stifling us possibly, but not thinking they have nothing better to do than turn up.

[Ronniekirk]

The point is G, we were further behind at this stage last season & finished ahead of Sevco. At this stage they were en route to progressing to the LC semi-final beating ICT & St J along the way, & just like now, their fans were drooling, actually they do that most of the time, & saying bring on Celtc! That went well, didn't it! Another way of looking at our league position is if we win our game in hand we'll be 2nd! Apologies for that positive thought! :wink:
I think it's all about having realistic expectations. My expectations ( along with the bookies ) were we would finish 2nd this season, my hope was we would finish 1st. Nothing has changed for me. At present our league results are mainly in line with my expectations & we've over achieved in the LC. At this stage last year we'd lost to Alloa, Falkirk, Q of S & Raith. A year tomorrow we went to Glasgow & beat Sevco 3-1 but followed that up with home draws against Raith & Dumbarton. So my definition of progress is we're considerably better now than at this stage last year despite losing our most creative player. The challenge now is improving on that. I'll look forward to that glass of wine but I suppose the odds on you buying are roughly the same as ours for the league! :greengrin

Sensible post Brog . I certainly never expected us to win the Championship but neither did I expect to be so far behind Rangers at this stage .
Having now settled for promotion coming via the play offs it's frustrating to see us still struggling to break packed defences down ,and not scoring more goals .
After the 6. 2 defeat at home ,there was a lot of concern we had kept the same defence as last season . But it's clear that defence now has improved ,as the season has progressed ,and we have now only conceded the same amount of goals as Rangers .So the same players playing week in week has now worked for us .
We are now not scoring as many as last season and that's what's costing us dropped points .However when we consider Stubbs hasn't been able to utilise his Transfer signings up front because of injuries then maybe we need to be more patient and see how we do once Keatings Feruz Anier and Farid get back to full fitness
But it's clearStubbsr doesn't see Cummings and Malonga as a Partnership now which is what most fans view was last season But it's clearly going to take time and players getting and staying fit before Stubbs knows how best to utilise these players .
In the meantime we do need to put another winning run together to get into second place ,and at present we are debating on the thread why we as a team have problems breaking teams down that come to Easter road and sit in ,and score with there first and sometimes only shot on target.( and that does get frustrating )
Think people are openly voicing their concern that if we dont find solutions to how to break teams down ,we will be faced possibly with St Mirren or Falkirk in play offs who will then sit in and leave it up to us to find a way to unlock their defence . Butt suppose there is plenty time and another Transfer window to address this .
We have Queen of the South Away, Falkirk away ,and Dumbarton at home before we play Rangers so we should get further confirmation over these games if we are continuing to progress and which players get back to full fitness and stay fit
So look forward to seeing how we do in these games

[ahibby]

I know I am pointing out the obvious but the only way to be sure of promotion is to win the league. Does anyone think that we are in on a conspiracy to make sure Rangers win the Championship? No? Good that means we still have some of our sanity. Does anyone think that Hibernian FC truly thought that they were in with a shout of winning the league before the league started? I'm beginning to wonder whether reality hit the club before a ball was kicked. There's a fine line between defeatism and being realistic. Anyway if we win all our remaining matches then we will win the league.:rolleyes:

[NAE NOOKIE]

Whatever happened to just being a Hibs supporter. Why does it all have to be about loyalty to the club based on results and / or performance? What's wrong with just supporting the club for the sake of it ........... That doesn't mean not moaning about the clubs performance on or off the park ... hell, even booing the team off when they are crap .... anybody who watched the team in the late 70s will remember the old slow handclap :greengrin

I'm sure we are not going to catch the Huns now .... but until we either are sure to finish below 4th or knocked out in the play offs I for one will not be giving up on promotion or going to watch the team ... hell, even then I wont stop going.

GGTTH

[Ozyhibby]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Nutmegged]

You said gaining promotion was a minimum requirement, that is instant success is it not (for last season anyway)?

Bein promoted from the Championship is not "success" the very fact you believe that to be success tells me how desperately low your belief in the club is, no-one hasa devine right to be promoted but it also isn't "success"..finishing in the top 4 of the Premiership and/or winning a trophy is success, anything else is just floating by and existing.

I get that those goals might be beyond someone whose standards are rock bottom

[Borderhibbie76]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You really are a cheery sod mate...make me wanna slash my wrists with your posts. Our crowds for where we are at present ain't that bad and will get better once we get players back fit and I believe we will go on a winning run. Try and think positively for a change instead of constant doom and gloom

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[Ozyhibby]

You really are a cheery sod mate...make me wanna slash my wrists with your posts. Our crowds for where we are at present ain't that bad and will get better once we get players back fit and I believe we will go on a winning run. Try and think positively for a change instead of constant doom and gloom

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

I'll be happy when we start to turn things around and show we can score the goals needed for promotion.


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[Borderhibbie76]

I'll be happy when we start to turn things around and show we can score the goals needed for promotion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Agreed. ..let's hope that happens sooner rather than later

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[Baldy Foghorn]

Bein promoted from the Championship is not "success" the very fact you believe that to be success tells me how desperately low your belief in the club is, no-one hasa devine right to be promoted but it also isn't "success"..finishing in the top 4 of the Premiership and/or winning a trophy is success, anything else is just floating by and existing.

I get that those goals might be beyond someone whose standards are rock bottom

:faf::faf::faf:

Haha what are you talking about. Desperately low belief in the Club? You obviously don't know me then.........

[Baldy Foghorn]

Whatever happened to just being a Hibs supporter. Why does it all have to be about loyalty to the club based on results and / or performance? What's wrong with just supporting the club for the sake of it ........... That doesn't mean not moaning about the clubs performance on or off the park ... hell, even booing the team off when they are crap .... anybody who watched the team in the late 70s will remember the old slow handclap :greengrin

I'm sure we are not going to catch the Huns now .... but until we either are sure to finish below 4th or knocked out in the play offs I for one will not be giving up on promotion or going to watch the team ... hell, even then I wont stop going.

GGTTH

Careful you are entering "uberfan" territory here NN, no positivity allowed, we are doomed I tell thee.....Armageddon is here

[iwasthere1972]

At this early stage I can't see us catching The Rangers but at the same time I think we will easily finish second. It's not the best we could hoped for but with The Rangers out the way I'm confident we can beat the likes of Falkirk, Partick Thistle, Kilmarnock or whoever it may be over two legs.

A decent cup run in the Scottish Cup and League Cup will ease the blow of missing out on automatic promotion plus financially it will help to reduce the losses we will make this season.

[NorthNorfolkHFC]

At this early stage I can't see us catching The Rangers but at the same time I think we will easily finish second. It's not the best we could hoped for but with The Rangers out the way I'm confident we can beat the likes of Falkirk, Partick Thistle, Kilmarnock or whoever it may be over two legs.

A decent cup run in the Scottish Cup and League Cup will ease the blow of missing out on automatic promotion plus financially it will help to reduce the losses we will make this season.

I remember saying the exact same thing last year


"A friend of mine once said he liked his women like his parmesan: strong smelling and shaved"

[ahibby]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's one of the things that disappoints me. You'd have thought that we would have somehow been able to put the breaks on to stop that decline, but no. I also like the other post above about just being a supporter no matter what. However it's true that I could live with being poor if only I hadn't seen such riches! C'mon the Hibs, promotion it is this season and thereafter to infinity an beyond!

[brog]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As usual you've chosen selectively in order to be as negative as possible. 2006/07 happened to be the season where our attendances were the 2nd highest in the last 50+ years, beaten only by the Tornadoes 16,100 in 1972/73. Unsurprisingly we won a trophy in both these seasons. Our average last season was 10,170, not as you show & this is actually an increase on 3 years ago, a season when we were in a higher league, & reached the cup final. A different comparison is to go back to 1980/81, the first time we were relegated post war. Our title winning attendances that season were a magnificent 4,460 & we only exceeded 10,000 average on 3 occasions in the following 15 seasons. It takes a while to recover from relegation. As recently as 2004 when we reached the LC final & the golden generation were breaking through, we averaged less than last season. Our general increase in attendances coincided with the rebuilding of our decrepit stadium, a fact often overlooked when people criticise the cost of the development work.
There's a proper & sensible debate to be had about our attendances but using selective & misleading statistics just to make a point is not the way to do it.

[Ozyhibby]

As usual you've chosen selectively in order to be as negative as possible. 2006/07 happened to be the season where our attendances were the 2nd highest in the last 50+ years, beaten only by the Tornadoes 16,100 in 1972/73. Unsurprisingly we won a trophy in both these seasons. Our average last season was 10,170, not as you show & this is actually an increase on 3 years ago, a season when we were in a higher league, & reached the cup final. A different comparison is to go back to 1980/81, the first time we were relegated post war. Our title winning attendances that season were a magnificent 4,460 & we only exceeded 10,000 average on 3 occasions in the following 15 seasons. It takes a while to recover from relegation. As recently as 2004 when we reached the LC final & the golden generation were breaking through, we averaged less than last season. Our general increase in attendances coincided with the rebuilding of our decrepit stadium, a fact often overlooked when people criticise the cost of the development work.
There's a proper & sensible debate to be had about our attendances but using selective & misleading statistics just to make a point is not the way to do it.

I used 2007 as that is generally accepted as when our decline started. I never put as much thought into it as you are attributing to me.
My point is that if we get it right on the park then we can win the crowds back.


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[magpie1892]

As usual you've chosen selectively in order to be as negative as possible. 2006/07 happened to be the season where our attendances were the 2nd highest in the last 50+ years, beaten only by the Tornadoes 16,100 in 1972/73. Unsurprisingly we won a trophy in both these seasons. Our average last season was 10,170, not as you show & this is actually an increase on 3 years ago, a season when we were in a higher league, & reached the cup final. A different comparison is to go back to 1980/81, the first time we were relegated post war. Our title winning attendances that season were a magnificent 4,460 & we only exceeded 10,000 average on 3 occasions in the following 15 seasons. It takes a while to recover from relegation. As recently as 2004 when we reached the LC final & the golden generation were breaking through, we averaged less than last season. Our general increase in attendances coincided with the rebuilding of our decrepit stadium, a fact often overlooked when people criticise the cost of the development work.
There's a proper & sensible debate to be had about our attendances but using selective & misleading statistics just to make a point is not the way to do it.

10/10.

Remember a midweek league game v. St Johnstone in the early 90s - Att: 3,383. We've turned a corner since then, it would seem.

[Lucius Apuleius]

brog - this progress sees us currently 11 points behind SEVCO and we're not even into October. If we get beaten next week and other results don't go in our favour - we slip to 6th in a 10 team league in the 2nd tier of Scottish football.

You must define the meaning of 'progress' over a chilled glass of vino :aok:.

At least Cray Wanderers are undoubtedly progressing!


Personally prefer to think IF we win on Saturday where we will be.

[Ray_]

10/10.

Remember a midweek league game v. St Johnstone in the early 90s - Att: 3,383. We've turned a corner since then, it would seem.

I haven't read this thread as the title was self explanatory, I've just logged on the last page and in common with the low crowd you mentioned and the high in 1972/73I, I was in a 4,000 crowd at the start of the seventies [1971], a short time before the TT's and as with the crowds in the mid 00's, it shows what can be achieved, but first you need the team.

[tamig]

As usual you've chosen selectively in order to be as negative as possible. 2006/07 happened to be the season where our attendances were the 2nd highest in the last 50+ years, beaten only by the Tornadoes 16,100 in 1972/73. Unsurprisingly we won a trophy in both these seasons. Our average last season was 10,170, not as you show & this is actually an increase on 3 years ago, a season when we were in a higher league, & reached the cup final. A different comparison is to go back to 1980/81, the first time we were relegated post war. Our title winning attendances that season were a magnificent 4,460 & we only exceeded 10,000 average on 3 occasions in the following 15 seasons. It takes a while to recover from relegation. As recently as 2004 when we reached the LC final & the golden generation were breaking through, we averaged less than last season. Our general increase in attendances coincided with the rebuilding of our decrepit stadium, a fact often overlooked when people criticise the cost of the development work.
There's a proper & sensible debate to be had about our attendances but using selective & misleading statistics just to make a point is not the way to do it.

Spot on. I had realised that 06/07 was a successful season but didn't realise the average crowd that season was as high as it's been in recent times. As you say, selective stats to make (yet another) negative point.

[Mikey]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's a shame you don't put the same effort into trying to make things better. Rather than searching around for average attendances over the years so that you can remind everyone (yet again) about how bad things are, you could have been helping the HSA guys drum up a few more sign ups or working with Pathead in the WT group to try and grow the support.

[CropleyWasGod]

Since the 06/07 season we have lost about 5000 fans. I don't think we can afford another season down here.
Here is our attendances since then.
07 14,488
08 13,840
09 12,684
10 12,164
11 11,672
12 9,909
13 10,491
14 11,017
15 9,624
Until this trend starts to reverse we won't have turned the corner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
On the other hand, we've been increasing the average gates over the past 3 seasons. :)
You can't include this season until we have played everybody at home in the League , including Rangers.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

[stantonhibby]

I used 2007 as that is generally accepted as when our decline started. I never put as much thought into it as you are attributing to me.
My point is that if we get it right on the park then we can win the crowds back.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Your second sentence sums up most of your posts to be fair.

[Vini1875]

We can still win the league. We are struggling because of our striking situation. The huns are playing at full strength right now. They may well lose some players and we will see where their form goes after that. There is still a long, long way to go.

[eastterrace]

We can still win the league. We are struggling because of our striking situation. The huns are playing at full strength right now. They may well lose some players and we will see where their form goes after that. There is still a long, long way to go.

its over mate we just need to make sure we finish second and get ready for the fight.

[Sir David Gray]

We can still win the league. We are struggling because of our striking situation. The huns are playing at full strength right now. They may well lose some players and we will see where their form goes after that. There is still a long, long way to go.

I like your optimism but I highly doubt we'll win the league from the position we're in at the moment.

There is a long way to go but there would need to be a huge turnaround in fortunes for us to win the league from this point.

I still remain hopeful but I think we've left ourselves with too much to do, even at this early stage in the season.

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

I'll be happy when we start to turn things around and show we can score the goals needed for promotion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What, like winning 6 out of our last 7 games conceding only one goal to boot? Is that considered turning a corner or is this corner considerably bigger?

[Ronniekirk]

We can still win the league. We are struggling because of our striking situation. The huns are playing at full strength right now. They may well lose some players and we will see where their form goes after that. There is still a long, long way to go.

Yes there is still a long way to go and yes they will undoubtedly pick up injuries ,but let's just see how we fair in our next four Leaugue games ,the last of which is against Rangers . We really need to win all four just to stay within touching distance ,and then we need to keep on winning .
But they are a different proposition to last seasons team ,and the way they bounced back from the st Johnstone defeat indicates they are unlikely to loose two in a row any time soon .
They brought Miller ,Law and Shields off the bench I think ,on Saturday so they do have some decent players to come into the team
The best chance of any one beating them is us , but we now have to play Dundee United in the Leaugue cup the midweek before this game when they will be idle ,so probably more chance of us picking up injuries .
Your letting your heart rule your head Vinni .Think the pragmatists have got it right on this one .


However you are right in respect of if we can get all our strikers fully match fit ,we should start to see more goals getting scored ,which should equate to more wins if our defence keep their form. But at present there is no real challenge to Rangers who are vulnerable at the back ,so they aren't going into matches under any real pressure ,as they know they can afford to draw or loose the odd game .,whereas we are now under pressure to win every game ,and that can affect players as game wears on and chances get spurned .

But the real prize is promotion and if that has to be by the Playoffs so be it ,but I won't be looking to that until nearer the time as too many managerial changes already and probably more to come and we need to see how that plays out with a view to seeing who finishes second bottom

[Brightside]

There is a long way to go this season. Despite what the regular doom merchants will continue to spout on here WE ARE going in the right direction. The talk of getting rid of Stubbs who has us playing proper decent football for the first time in YEARS is just stupid.

There is every chance that Rangers will win every game. So what. We just continue to support the team. Get behind them. Instead of complaining about the attendance why dont you bring more people along. After the Aberdeen game there was dozens of posts from people saying they would do this...NOW coz we got a draw with St Mirren we are garbage and you wouldnt pay the money to go an watch. Its staggering.

[Steve20]

There is a long way to go this season. Despite what the regular doom merchants will continue to spout on here WE ARE going in the right direction. The talk of getting rid of Stubbs who has us playing proper decent football for the first time in YEARS is just stupid.

There is every chance that Rangers will win every game. So what. We just continue to support the team. Get behind them. Instead of complaining about the attendance why dont you bring more people along. After the Aberdeen game there was dozens of posts from people saying they would do this...NOW coz we got a draw with St Mirren we are garbage and you wouldnt pay the money to go an watch. Its staggering.

If Stubbs has us going in the right direction, it's very very slowly. 'proper decent football' sometimes but just because it isn't Butcher, doesn't make it exciting to watch. Just passing the ball about in front of a team parking the bus isn't good to watch.

Results in this league haven't been great the past year and a bit. We need to win almost every game and not just win more than we don't.

Stubbs should get this season and if he fails a second time, he should go.

[Brightside]

If Stubbs has us going in the right direction, it's very very slowly. 'proper decent football' sometimes but just because it isn't Butcher, doesn't make it exciting to watch. Just passing the ball about in front of a team parking the bus isn't good to watch.

Results in this league haven't been great the past year and a bit. We need to win almost every game and not just win more than we don't.

Stubbs should get this season and if he fails a second time, he should go.

Maybe we have a different idea of what we want football to look like. I think we play the best football in the league. Now and then we dont win. But if we still had the likes of Butcher we;d be down there playing the St Mirren style. I'd love to know who people would replace Stubbs with.

[Thecat23]

The Rangers are playing the best football in the league IMO. They are fast and scoring some good goals. They also play fast one touch stuff. We played the best football last year by quite a distance! Stubbs has us going in the right direction though but he must learn to break teams down like The Rangers do in this league.

[Hibeewilly]

People talking about replacing Stubbs is just ridiculous. We need an experienced proven goalscorer - that's our problem. He did try to get one in the window but with our budget etc it didn't work out. Our current strikers just don't take enough of the chances simple as that. My hope is that we can bring one in during the next window ready for the play offs

[Brightside]

Maybe we dont have the players that can break down a well drilled defence. People may get wound up by that but how often do you see Premieship teams struggling to break down a 1st Division team in Cup games. Perhaps the problem is we've built a squad to compete against the top teams.

[The_Horde]

There is a long way to go this season. Despite what the regular doom merchants will continue to spout on here WE ARE going in the right direction. The talk of getting rid of Stubbs who has us playing proper decent football for the first time in YEARS is just stupid.

There is every chance that Rangers will win every game. So what. We just continue to support the team. Get behind them. Instead of complaining about the attendance why dont you bring more people along. After the Aberdeen game there was dozens of posts from people saying they would do this...NOW coz we got a draw with St Mirren we are garbage and you wouldnt pay the money to go an watch. Its staggering.

In the midst of Saturday I was in the impending doom camp. The more I think about it, when you compare the wages hibs and rangers spend, we really should have no chance. Stubbs is doing a good job, I just think people are a bit frustrated that we don't punish teams the way we should sometimes.

That will come when our strikers are back, but we're suffering a terrible bout of Hibs luck in that respect.

[The_Horde]

One thing I will say, though, is I'd like us to be far more direct at times. Look how we did against Aberdeen doing just that.

[B.H.F.C]

Maybe we have a different idea of what we want football to look like. I think we play the best football in the league. Now and then we dont win. But if we still had the likes of Butcher we;d be down there playing the St Mirren style. I'd love to know who people would replace Stubbs with.

We are capable of playing the best football in the league, definitely. But at the moment we aren't.

9 goals in 7 league games surely tells you that.

[Thecat23]

Maybe we dont have the players that can break down a well drilled defence. People may get wound up by that but how often do you see Premieship teams struggling to break down a 1st Division team in Cup games. Perhaps the problem is we've built a squad to compete against the top teams.

That's exactly what I thought as well. This squad would do fine in the prem as we can play against teams who come at us.

[Smartie]

That's exactly what I thought as well. This squad would do fine in the prem as we can play against teams who come at us.

I agree with this but I still have a problem with it - that is that we are not in the premier league!

Horses for courses, a team that gets 3 points by hook or by crook EVERY SINGLE WEEK is what we need, not one that would hypothetically do better at a higher level.

I don't think we're a million miles away. If we had a big aggressive striker who was capable of knocking defenders out of the way in order to get on the end of crosses, and some quick players who can beat a man and get a cross over after we've passed the ball from side to side for a while then I think we'd look a different team.

If we had that then we wouldn't feel so up against it as soon as we lose the first goal.

I've been thinking this for the best part of a year now though so I don't see it changing any time soon.

[JimBHibees]

There is a long way to go this season. Despite what the regular doom merchants will continue to spout on here WE ARE going in the right direction. The talk of getting rid of Stubbs who has us playing proper decent football for the first time in YEARS is just stupid.

There is every chance that Rangers will win every game. So what. We just continue to support the team. Get behind them. Instead of complaining about the attendance why dont you bring more people along. After the Aberdeen game there was dozens of posts from people saying they would do this...NOW coz we got a draw with St Mirren we are garbage and you wouldnt pay the money to go an watch. Its staggering.

Great post couldnt agree more. The quality of football is the best in years by a mile and we have a number of genuine exciting young talents at the club again night and day from previous years. We are only going to get better.

[The_Exile]

We have got all the ingredients for a good team, it's just unfortunate that around 4 or 5 of those ingredients are injured at the moment so we can only use what's available. I'm not overly stressed about the playoffs either, regardless of who we were to get I reckon we'd have their number this time.

[blackpoolhibs]

Let me get this right, under butcher we built a team for the championship while in the
Spl, now we have a team built for the Spl but are in the Championship. Whilst I agree we probably have a team that would do OK in the top league, I'd prefer to have a team to win and even just compete for the league we are bloody in.

[Brightside]

Let me get this right, under butcher we built a team for the championship while in the
Spl, now we have a team built for the Spl but are in the Championship. Whilst I agree we probably have a team that would do OK in the top league, I'd prefer to have a team to win and even just compete for the league we are bloody in.

Under Butcher we built a team that would be fighting in the bottom of this division and lumping the ball out the park at every oppo. I think we've been very unlucky with our injuries to strikers and that had impacted PLAN B. There are times when we need to more direct and i dont think Cumming or Malonga are really the type of players for that role.

[Lago]

Let me get this right, under butcher we built a team for the championship while in the
Spl, now we have a team built for the Spl but are in the Championship. Whilst I agree we probably have a team that would do OK in the top league, I'd prefer to have a team to win and even just compete for the league we are bloody in.
Gosh what a sensible assessment and not in the least negative, realistic.

[patlowe]

I disagree with folk saying we miss too many chances and this is our problem. We create the odd chance and we miss the odd chance, the odd header over the top here, the odd sclaffed shot there. However, we are not cutting through teams with the penetration or regularity that is required to ensure wins week after week. Look at Hearts last year and Rangers this year - you can't tell me they had/have strikers that are converting every single chance. They simply don't, but they constantly get players in dangerous positions and create so many chances that they score 2, 3, 4 goals a week, regardless of a missed chance here or there. Until Stubbs finds a way to do something similar then laudable passing play in midfield is not on its own going to guarantee us wins on a weekly basis.

[CallumLaidlaw]

I have just spent an hour of my lunch reading this thread. Wow! Its like WW3!! :greengrin



Did anyone really and I mean really think or buy into all the ***** discussed on here about Rangers skint and gash again this year after the embarrassment they had last year? because there was no chance that was going to happen. Whilst them getting stuffed by Motherwell was funny at the time it was always us that ws going to suffer the consequences because it was us who would be up against them for promotion.

lets get get real here, we have got off to a good start to the season, OK Dumbarton was stupid but we recovered well since then. Rangers have blown the league away and will continue to do so. There is no point in putting a stupid amount of pressure on the players and management to compete with them, yes we should strive to win every game but its unrealistic for us to actually do this.

The best thing we can do is chill out a bit and support Stubbs and the players as the season goes on unless things go seriously tits up there is no point in having a big panic every time things quite don't go our way.

I tried to say this in the summer. I said that they would strengthen accordingly, would spend the required money, and would never be as bad as they were last year. My one hope was that they took a couple of months to gel. Ok, they haven't spent £12m on Tore Andre Flo, but Warburton has used his knowledge of the English game, and realises that pace and skill will outdo the majority of cloggers in this league. They have still been able to bring in players on wages 4 or 5 times what we can afford, and instead of having a load of has-beens collecting a retirement fund, they have a load of hungry youngsters that are looking to prove themselves.



Wouldn't go as far to say Stubbs should be punted if we dont go up. Anything could happen in the playoff final and lets not forget it'll be a prem team we'd be playing. What I would say though is that IF we dont make that final then no doubt, he would have to go. Losing to Falkirk or St Mirren, no matter how they set up in the playoffs cant happen.

I kind of agree with this. I cannot believe people are already talking about Stubbs getting sacked. There must be neutrals/other fans looking in, thinking we are mental. And do we believe that LD even has a single thought in her mind about emptying AS at the end of the season? I don't. Him and his staff are very well respected, and I guarantee his next job will be in a higher league/bigger team than us. IF we didn't go up this season, then Stubbs would have no other option than AUTOMATIC promotion next year. IF we didn't make the playoffs this year, then yes he should and would go, but I genuinely can't see that. The Aberdeen game showed we can mix it with the big boys. Yes its dissapointing when we slip up, but Stubbs is still a clever guy, and I have no doubt he knows what he has to address. One problem may be that he is aiming TOO high with the players he's bringing in, which is why he didn't get wingers in - as he couldn't identify any he felt were in our scope and were good enough.


I get that, but I can't stomach folk that are nowhere to be seen on a matchday, telling all and sundry how "pish" we are, then come back at Finals to then disappear again until the next one comes around. It was never ever going to be easy to get back to SPL, after years of neglect from our Custodians, and changes are starting to be implemented that will help on that front. People who want instant success tend to end up being disappointed.....

I have football "fans" of other clubs at my work who try and wind me up on occasion - normally Celtic/Rangers/Hearts fans - but I tend to ignore them because they probably couldnt find their own teams stadium on a map so their opinion is invalid. Same with fans of our own club. How can you possibly judge and criticise the team when you don't support the team one way (attending matches) or another (financially). Surely these are how the club improves - through the support of the fans. It is a bit chicken & the egg I suppose tho.


Yeah I think a lot of posters on here are in the middle of the spectrum. Post after a game and tell it how it is. I'll not be patronised by anyone on here and I'll also not listen to folk who constantly have a pop at the club. It's a discussion board so I'd like to think most will respect others opinions without constantly pushing their own agenda onto us whether that be negative or positive.

I like to think this is where I am. Take every game as it comes. If its crap, then I'll say so, but I won't go looking for positives/negatives just to suit my agenda. Everyone is entitled to their opinion - but its hard not to label some as "trolling" when they are always looking for the negative angle on everything the club does.


I'll be happy when we start to turn things around and show we can score the goals needed for promotion.


I struggle to believe that.


People talking about replacing Stubbs is just ridiculous. We need an experienced proven goalscorer - that's our problem. He did try to get one in the window but with our budget etc it didn't work out. Our current strikers just don't take enough of the chances simple as that. My hope is that we can bring one in during the next window ready for the play offs

Yep, can't fault the club for trying. Billy McKay was very close apparently, and Saturday showed me why we enquired about Jon Daly. A big battering ram up front could well make the difference for us in these type of games.


That's exactly what I thought as well. This squad would do fine in the prem as we can play against teams who come at us.

:top marks Yip, agree completely. Stubbs needs to learn to adjust to different scenarios tho, rather than hoping this style will pay off over 90 minutes. Our plan B needs to be better. I have faith he will do that.


Under Butcher we built a team that would be fighting in the bottom of this division and lumping the ball out the park at every oppo. I think we've been very unlucky with our injuries to strikers and that had impacted PLAN B. There are times when we need to more direct and i dont think Cumming or Malonga are really the type of players for that role.

Saying that Butcher built anything whilst he was at Hibs is far too kind. The way we played from Jan 2014 til May 2014 was absolutely sickening. Agree with the injuries. People say we signed lots of injured players, but Feruz, Anier, Farid, Keatings, were not injured when they signed.

[son of haggart]

I disagree with folk saying we miss too many chances and this is our problem. We create the odd chance and we miss the odd chance, the odd header over the top here, the odd sclaffed shot there. However, we are not cutting through teams with the penetration or regularity that is required to ensure wins week after week. Look at Hearts last year and Rangers this year - you can't tell me they had/have strikers that are converting every single chance. They simply don't, but they constantly get players in dangerous positions and create so many chances that they score 2, 3, 4 goals a week, regardless of a missed chance here or there. Until Stubbs finds a way to do something similar then laudable passing play in midfield is not on its own going to guarantee us wins on a weekly basis.

We (Hearts) had 501 shots, 217 on goal, and scored 96 goals last season

Its about 14 shots a match 6 on goal nearly 3 goals per game, so a good conversion rate I'd guess.

I was keeping a tally of ours last year (as I thought it would be some sort of record at some point).

I stopped counting Hibs similar stats about 2/3rds through the season but I don't think you were as far behind us as people would think in terms of shots, but less on target and less goals.

My impression is you are not getting as many shots in as last year - maybe the midfield (which has nearly completely changed) is the most likely explanation not your strikers.

[rcarter1]

We (Hearts) had 501 shots, 217 on goal, and scored 96 goals last season

Its about 14 shots a match 6 on goal nearly 3 goals per game, so a good conversion rate I'd guess.

I was keeping a tally of ours last year (as I thought it would be some sort of record at some point).

I stopped counting Hibs similar stats about 2/3rds through the season but I don't think you were as far behind us as people would think in terms of shots, but less on target and less goals.

My impression is you are not getting as many shots in as last year - maybe the midfield (which has nearly completely changed) is the most likely explanation not your strikers.

Interesting stuff. This rings a bell actually, seem to recall a weekend where Rangers, Hearts and Hibs had similar total shots (around 20ish). Hearts scored 5, Rangers 1, and Hibs 1 (or something like this). Hearts to be honest had confident scorers all over the place, but I also reckon they created better chances on the whole? I definitely think blaming strikers for lack of goals is unfair if they aren't getting good service.

[mjhibby]

As a lot of people have said we aren't taking our chances and the goals for column shows that. To me it's the injured players are the ones who we are really missing. If either keatings or farid were fully fit then we would be sitting 6 points behind rangers with a game in hand. Unfortunately with these two guys missing and anier as well teams know if they defend like hell they may grab a point. With potent strikers playing teams would know they would have to attack to get anything out of the game. Unless we can get these guys fit and firing second is the best we can hope for. Right now I'd settle for that with all the strikers fit and scoring going into the play offs. We could well be looking at two good cup runs though which should keep our spirits up.

[ekhibee]

Sevco have done well so far this season, but I'm sorry, I still don't think they have much better players than us. Tavernier is the exception, but most of Waghorns goals seem to come from the penalty spot, and they do get a lot of penalties. As for the rest of them? Certainly not any better than what we have. We had great chances against them at Ibrox and there didn't seem much, if anything, between the two teams then. With the team we have, as far as I'm concerned, we should be scoring a lot more than we do. And I wouldn't be including El Alagui in any calculations right now, he's been injured for the vast majority of the time he's been at Hibs. Bottom line is that for the majority of games this season we have underperformed, again, in the goals department. That's not being negative, just factual.

[My_Wife_Camille]

I'd like to hear more from those who think Rangers aren't much better than us despite currently being 11 points and about 15 goals better off than us.

Seriously, the title race is as good as over already. We are in a position where even if we win our game in hand we will still be 8 points behind. We need to now hope that between now and May, Rangers drop 9 more points than us. Using Hearts numbers from last season as a guide, that would mean we could only afford to drop about 6 more points all season at the very most.

That is unless Rangers hit the mystical 'rough patch' that everyone on here said Hearts would hit last year.

[The_Horde]

I'd like to hear more from those who think Rangers aren't much better than us despite currently being 11 points and about 15 goals better off than us.

Seriously, the title race is as good as over already. We are in a position where even if we win our game in hand we will still be 8 points behind. We need to now hope that between now and May, Rangers drop 9 more points than us. Using Hearts numbers from last season as a guide, that would mean we could only afford to drop about 6 more points all season at the very most.

That is unless Rangers hit the mystical 'rough patch' that everyone on here said Hearts would hit last year.

Another 2 months like the ones weve had and the huns will have it done by Christmas.

[Ronniekirk]

I'd like to hear more from those who think Rangers aren't much better than us despite currently being 11 points and about 15 goals better off than us.

Seriously, the title race is as good as over already. We are in a position where even if we win our game in hand we will still be 8 points behind. We need to now hope that between now and May, Rangers drop 9 more points than us. Using Hearts numbers from last season as a guide, that would mean we could only afford to drop about 6 more points all season at the very most.

That is unless Rangers hit the mystical 'rough patch' that everyone on here said Hearts would hit last year.

At this present time they have done what we hoped to do ,hit the ground running .Some people find that unpalatable ,but it doesn't alter the fact .


On our day ,with a fully fit squad ,and Stubbs picking the right team and tactics ,we should if we take our chances ,be capable of beating them .
I think you are right they won't drop that many points and I just can't see them losing two games in a row as they have confidence and momentum.
Stubbs said we dropped points against St Mirren as we were tired after the heroics in the cup v Don's .my concern is we play United in the cup midweek before we play Rangers and that could now work in rangers favour as for me we would of been looking to beat them in that game

but let's see how we do I our next five games as that will then be us into November and we really need to have closed the gap on Rangers and not drop any more points .That will give us a better gauge of where we are ,as we need to get into second spot first .
When Rangers click they seem capable of playing better fluent football that's more direst than us Boyles pace and directness should lead to penalties if he is driving into the box more Rangers seem to have mastered that and we haven't

Wag horn scored a hat trick at the weekend away from home on back of cup defeat a That indicates they have resilience

[jacomo]

I'd like to hear more from those who think Rangers aren't much better than us despite currently being 11 points and about 15 goals better off than us.

Seriously, the title race is as good as over already. We are in a position where even if we win our game in hand we will still be 8 points behind. We need to now hope that between now and May, Rangers drop 9 more points than us. Using Hearts numbers from last season as a guide, that would mean we could only afford to drop about 6 more points all season at the very most.

That is unless Rangers hit the mystical 'rough patch' that everyone on here said Hearts would hit last year.

I'm not prepared to give up yet.

Of course the Rangers might storm through the rest of the season like Hearts did last time, but if they hit a bit of bad form we need to be as close as possible. They've already admitted they don't have the money to strengthen in January so this is as good as it gets for them, our squad is still not full strength.

[The_Horde]

I'm not prepared to give up yet.

Of course the Rangers might storm through the rest of the season like Hearts did last time, but if they hit a bit of bad form we need to be as close as possible. They've already admitted they don't have the money to strengthen in January so this is as good as it gets for them, our squad is still not full strength.

As good as it gets? Having the likes of shiels and miller in reserve isn't half bad.

Leagues out of our hands now. All we can do is win as many ad possible and see what happens.

[brog]

As good as it gets? Having the likes of shiels and miller in reserve isn't half bad.

Leagues out of our hands now. All we can do is win as many ad possible and see what happens.

No it's not. Unlikely yes but technically still in our own control.

[CropleyWasGod]

As good as it gets? Having the likes of shiels and miller in reserve isn't half bad.

Leagues out of our hands now. All we can do is win as many ad possible and see what happens.

If we do that, we win the league.:wink:

[Smartie]

The Rangers haven't had any of the toughest away games.

When they've won at St Mirren, Falkirk, Raith and at Easter Road then I'll concede the league.

Saturday was a disastrous result for us because we have to make Easter Road a fortress and give as little as possible away at home. I can't see Rangers dropping many (if any) points at home. They've played a blinder getting that "fear factor" going in their favour but they have already carried a bit of luck at times.

Until Saturday we'd only had one honking result (at Dumbarton) and been edged out by one goal in an even game at Ibrox. Dropping 2 points by drawing at home against ANYONE is inexcusable this year if we have any ambitions of going up as champions.

Massive game for us this weekend. I'd be delighted with 3 points whichever way the win is achieved (scraping wins away is fine). Rangers won comfortably at Palmerston but only after one of their strikers bottled it and squared it just before half-time at 1-0 and a Queens player was sent off just after half-time ending the game as a spectacle (they even got a dodgy penalty to make sure). We're in for a tough game.

Rangers are very reliant on certain players and if Tavernier, Wallace or Waghorn were to get injured they'd be a different team. I'm sure we'd look very different if we had Farid involved at the moment and we've not been able to call upon him at all so far.

Plenty to play for yet, but we simply cannot afford any more slip-ups, or to psychologically give up and hand it to The Rangers in September.

[Ray_]

No it's not. Unlikely yes but technically still in our own control.

It will remain that way for the foreseeable future and what would change that shorter term is getting less than two points against Rangers in our next two fixtures against them, but then again, if we don't win both those two fixtures and also continue winning the other fixtures, from now on, it will be "not a hope in hell's" chance.

[Sir David Gray]

As good as it gets? Having the likes of shiels and miller in reserve isn't half bad.

Leagues out of our hands now. All we can do is win as many ad possible and see what happens.

If we win all of our remaining matches, we'll win the league.

[The_Horde]

If we win all of our remaining matches, we'll win the league.

We can't even beat st mirren.

[CropleyWasGod]

We can't even beat st mirren.
That's not the point, though. You said that it was out of our hands.

Trig and I both pointed out that that is not the case.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

[The_Horde]

That's not the point, though. You said that it was out of our hands.

Trig and I both pointed out that that is not the case.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

It is out of our hands. Technically it isn't. But technically I could bang Cheryl Cole too. Theres about as much chance.

I don't even like Cheryl Cole.

[Hibbyradge]

I don't even like Cheryl Cole.

You're weird.

[bobbyhibs1983]

You're weird.


Im afraid im with SpeechysList here i must be another weird guy as i cannot stand cheryl cole or whatever her face is called.

As for the thread well, the annoying thing imo about hibs is IF rangers lose/draw a game it is typical hibs to do the same that weekend so we never seem to gain !

oh the joys of being a hibs fan

[wick hibby]

Wait untill after xmas then we will have a better idea

[My_Wife_Camille]

Wonder what the OP has to say about this now. Absolute roaster :rolleyes:

[Beefster]

Wonder what the OP has to say about this now. Absolute roaster :rolleyes:

There's no good to be had by dragging stuff up months later to score a cheap point.

The OP might have been a bit negative but he was far from the only Hibs supporter who thought, by September, that Sevco would skoosh the league.

Edit: Just noticed that you are the OP. I'm the roaster.

[iwasthere1972]

Wonder what the OP has to say about this now. Absolute roaster :rolleyes:

A prize plum if you ask me. :greengrin

[iwasthere1972]

There's no good to be had by dragging stuff up months later to score a cheap point.

The OP might have been a bit negative but he was far from the only Hibs supporter who thought, by September, that Sevco would skoosh the league.

Edit: Just noticed that you are the OP. I'm the roaster.

:greengrin. A couple of roasters.

[Jack Hackett]

Wonder what the OP has to say about this now. Absolute roaster :rolleyes:

Takes one to know one :wink:

[silverhibee]

There's no good to be had by dragging stuff up months later to score a cheap point.

The OP might have been a bit negative but he was far from the only Hibs supporter who thought, by September, that Sevco would skoosh the league.

Edit: Just noticed that you are the OP. I'm the roaster.

:tee hee:

You could still get that slaver of the year nomination now. :thumbsup: