Remembrance Day at Ibrox tomorrow.

[iwasthere1972]

A day for the armed forces to remember Rangers.

[Keith_M]

A day for the armed forces to remember Rangers.

They also get to stand on the pitch wearing "keep ulster protestant" scarves and sing sectarian songs.

[Future17]

A day for the armed forces to remember Rangers.

Gone but, unfortunately, not forgotten.

[liamh2202]

Can I ask what the issue is with rangers having armed forces day? I know a few lads who serve with me who have no ties to Scottish football who have chosen rangers as their team because of initiatives like this .

[Mr White]

Can I ask what the issue is with rangers having armed forces day? I know a few lads who serve with me who have no ties to Scottish football who have chosen rangers as their team because of initiatives like this .

Personally I don't have an issue with it but I think for others it probably stems from the event they held 2 years ago where the behaviour of some of the service personnel in uniform fell short of that expected by the armed forces.

[DH1875]

The idea behind it is a great idea, but if youve ever seen it in action, not good.

[liamh2202]

Personally I don't have an issue with it but I think for others it probably stems from the event they held 2 years ago where the behaviour of some of the service personnel in uniform fell short of that expected by the armed forces.

Can you clarify what that behavour was?

[johnbc70]

Can you clarify what that behavour was?

Singing sectarian songs while in their uniforms.

[Mr White]

Can you clarify what that behavour was?

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/armed-forces-involvement-sectarian-rangers-protest-pr-disaster/6182

Apologies if the link doesn't work.

[Bostonhibby]

Can you clarify what that behavour was?

Try this

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/armed-forces-involvement-sectarian-rangers-protest-pr-disaster/6182

[Sir David Gray]

There's a lot that Sevco can be criticised for but inviting members of the Armed Forces to Ibrox isn't one of them.

The reaction from their supporters may leave a lot to be desired however.

[Mr White]

Try this

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/armed-forces-involvement-sectarian-rangers-protest-pr-disaster/6182

Thanks for the link. Here's a wee excerpt

For a prolonged period, British armed forces in uniform waved, clapped, danced, did the “bouncy” and snapped their selfies in front of fans – as the Ibrox faithful went through their repertoire of Rule Britannia, Derry’s Walls, The Sash and so forth. A number of chants praised the Northern Irish paramilitary organisation the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF). Like Celtic fans praising the IRA, this is illegal under recent Scottish anti-sectarian laws.

[liamh2202]

Singing sectarian songs while in their uniforms.

Agreed that is not acceptable and not the way we should conduct ourselves. Although it should be the individuals that are reprimanded not the idea rubbished. As a submariner we travel to the states alot and its actually sickening how their service personell are treated compared to us. We don't do it for the recognition and anyone who knows anything about the submarine service will know that we are happy working in these situations but I squirm when I see events like this get rubbished. I hate rangers with the best of them but I do think their public and charity work with the armed forces are top notch (and have dealt with them first hand)

[Bostonhibby]

Thanks for the link. Here's a wee excerpt

For a prolonged period, British armed forces in uniform waved, clapped, danced, did the “bouncy” and snapped their selfies in front of fans – as the Ibrox faithful went through their repertoire of Rule Britannia, Derry’s Walls, The Sash and so forth. A number of chants praised the Northern Irish paramilitary organisation the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF). Like Celtic fans praising the IRA, this is illegal under recent Scottish anti-sectarian laws.

:aok:

Sadly toothless laws, enacted by the Scottish parliament but not acted upon effectively, especially where there are large scale offences..

[liamh2202]

Try this

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/armed-forces-involvement-sectarian-rangers-protest-pr-disaster/6182

Thanks Boston I wasn't denying anything happened ,I never heard of this (must have been deployed)

[Bostonhibby]

Agreed that is not acceptable and not the way we should conduct ourselves. Although it should be the individuals that are reprimanded not the idea rubbished. As a submariner we travel to the states alot and its actually sickening how their service personell are treated compared to us. We don't do it for the recognition and anyone who knows anything about the submarine service will know that we are happy working in these situations but I squirm when I see events like this get rubbished. I hate rangers with the best of them but I do think their public and charity work with the armed forces are top notch (and have dealt with them first hand)

I always support the institutions of the UK armed forces, coincidentally my mate is a retired submariner and its some job I agree, we both have the same view of the behaviour of some of the servicemen at the hun game in question - they basically blended with and played to the bigots on that particular day rather than what we have come to expect from professional British servicemen and women.

[Bostonhibby]

Thanks Boston I wasn't denying anything happened ,I never heard of this (must have been deployed)

No problem.

[liamh2202]

I always support the institutions of the UK armed forces, coincidentally my mate is a retired submariner and its some job I agree, we both have the same view of the behaviour of some of the servicemen at the hun game in question - they basically blended with and played to the bigots on that particular day rather than what we have come to expect from professional British servicemen and women.

Correct, BTW if you ever see a group of guys with dolphins sitting drunk singing up the back of the east that'll be us,, we are not trying to blend in that's just a standard day out ;)

[Bostonhibby]

Correct, BTW if you ever see a group of guys with dolphins sitting drunk singing up the back of the east that'll be us,, we are not trying to blend in that's just a standard day out ;)
No really difficult to spot then!

My mate is also a fan of the team formerly known as Glasgow rangers and a few of them used to go from helensburgh. They are still in touch as a unit but none go to the new boys, a bit disenchanted with Scottish football it seems.

[Keith_M]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.

While many Newspapers mentioned the one Soldier to be investigated for joining in a sectarian song, not one mentioned the fact that thousands in the crowd were singing it, otherwise he would not have been able to 'join in'. The scarf he was wearing, with the words 'Keep Ulster Protestant', was thrown to him by someone in the crowd. Not surprising, as anyone who has ever been to Ibrox can bear witness to the sectarian paraphernalia sported by many of their Fans.

This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

[ginger_rice]

Agreed that is not acceptable and not the way we should conduct ourselves. Although it should be the individuals that are reprimanded not the idea rubbished. As a submariner we travel to the states alot and its actually sickening how their service personell are treated compared to us. We don't do it for the recognition and anyone who knows anything about the submarine service will know that we are happy working in these situations but I squirm when I see events like this get rubbished. I hate rangers with the best of them but I do think their public and charity work with the armed forces are top notch (and have dealt with them first hand)

I served in the RN for 12 years and the RNR for 6, got to say I was disgusted at the behaviour of the Naval (and other service) personnel at Ibrox that day so much so that I wrote a letter to the second sea lord regarding it. I don't have a problem with them attending matches in uniform but not bouncing about on the pitch singing no surrender!!

I seem to recall that Hibs do something for the forces too but much more low key, and at one time in the 70's wasn't there a supporters association branch in the Royal Scots?

[liamh2202]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.

While many Newspapers mentioned the one Soldier to be investigated for joining in a sectarian song, not one mentioned the fact that thousands in the crowd were singing it, otherwise he would not have been able to 'join in'. The scarf he was wearing, with the words 'Keep Ulster Protestant', was thrown to him by someone in the crowd. Not surprising, as anyone who has ever been to Ibrox can bear witness to the sectarian paraphernalia sported by many of their Fans.

This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

I respect your opinion but don't feel that is the aim of their club. But don't disagree it is what their support see it as. Like I said previously they do lots of charity work with all three services and I feel days like today are nothing more than an extension of that.its funny how they get slated for doing days like this but Celtic get away with rubbishing anything to do with the armed forces , their disrespectful replies to requests for raffle prizes for service charities etc are outrageous but are generally accepted because maybe these charities should know better than to ask them.

[ginger_rice]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.



This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

:agree::top marks

[liamh2202]

I served in the RN for 12 years and the RNR for 6, got to say I was disgusted at the behaviour of the Naval (and other service) personnel at Ibrox that day so much so that I wrote a letter to the second sea lord regarding it. I don't have a problem with them attending matches in uniform but not bouncing about on the pitch singing no surrender!!

I seem to recall that Hibs do something for the forces too but much more low key, and at one time in the 70's wasn't there a supporters association branch in the Royal Scots?

I agree mate. Hibs have recently started working with tickets for troops again too. Done in typically hibs fashion though ,don't ram it down peoples throat or go shouting to every paper looking for a chuck up but always willing to help out when requests are made.

[ginger_rice]

Correct, BTW if you ever see a group of guys with dolphins sitting drunk singing up the back of the east that'll be us,, we are not trying to blend in that's just a standard day out ;)

Sitting at the back of the East to dodge the sun eh? :greengrin

[liamh2202]

Sitting at the back of the East to dodge the sun eh? :greengrin

;)

[pontius pilate]

My main problem is that they sung and took part in whatever shenanigans were happening on the pitch in UNIFORM. If they were in civvies fine but you should not and do not discredit the uniform you are wearing from any of our three services. As much as it pains me to say this the Rangers do have a good affiliation with the services but our own club is doing a lot as well with tickets for today's game and St mirrens available in the tickets for troops website. Unfortunately my time in the services both halves of the Glasgow bigots had more than their fair share combined against other teams

[liamh2202]

My main problem is that they sung and took part in whatever shenanigans were happening on the pitch in UNIFORM. If they were in civvies fine but you should not and do not discredit the uniform you are wearing from any of our three services. As much as it pains me to say this the Rangers do have a good affiliation with the services but our own club is doing a lot as well with tickets for today's game and St mirrens available in the tickets for troops website. Unfortunately my time in the services both halves of the Glasgow bigots had more than their fair share combined against other teams

Agree 100% mate. We have a hard enough job with public relations nowadays without shooting ourselves in the foot with muppets acting like that.

[Keith_M]

I agree mate. Hibs have recently started working with tickets for troops again too. Done in typically hibs fashion though ,don't ram it down peoples throat or go shouting to every paper looking for a chuck up but always willing to help out when requests are made.


:agree:


and that's how it should be done.

[southern hibby]

I did 22 years in the Royal Navy and have met many serving members of the Armed Forces who I had a great time serving with until it came to football and then you would see a different side come out in them.

At no time would I embarrass the Armed Forces by behaving like this however what I am about to say is the truth. I received the queens jubilee medal ( at least I think it's that one as medals mean dilly squat to me ) and I never ever got it put beside my other 4 on my chest. The reason was simple the ribbon is Maroon and white.
Call me stupid, call me immature but as God is my whiteness I'd rather stick rusty barb wire up my bum than maroon and white on my chest.
Was asked by numerous higher ranking officials why it was never added to my collection and used to reply that I was still awaiting delivery of it even though it was lobbed in a drawer.
GGTTh

[green&left]

Can I ask what the issue is with rangers having armed forces day? I know a few lads who serve with me who have no ties to Scottish football who have chosen rangers as their team because of initiatives like this .

Where you not on another thread saying football and politics shouldn't mix...?


The Rangers and their "armed forces day" is pretty crass and reeks of "hey look at us".

Unveiling a massive Lee Rigby banner and having his family on the pitch, only club in Britain to do so and as far as i'm aware Rigby didn't have an affiliation to Glasgow or The Rangers. Never even seen an article stating the lad was into fitba! Then there was the the Remembrance Sunday stuff a few years with some soldier abseiling the *** stand with the match ball. Then last year about 100 troops singing the billy boys and sash.

[FranckSuzy]

I did 22 years in the Royal Navy and have met many serving members of the Armed Forces who I had a great time serving with until it came to football and then you would see a different side come out in them.

At no time would I embarrass the Armed Forces by behaving like this however what I am about to say is the truth. I received the queens jubilee medal ( at least I think it's that one as medals mean dilly squat to me ) and I never ever got it put beside my other 4 on my chest. The reason was simple the ribbon is Maroon and white.
Call me stupid, call me immature but as God is my whiteness I'd rather stick rusty barb wire up my bum than maroon and white on my chest.
Was asked by numerous higher ranking officials why it was never added to my collection and used to reply that I was still awaiting delivery of it even though it was lobbed in a drawer.
GGTTh

:faf: :thumbsup:

[liamh2202]

Where you not on another thread saying football and politics shouldn't mix...?


The Rangers and their "armed forces day" is pretty crass and reeks of "hey look at us".

Unveiling a massive Lee Rigby banner and having his family on the pitch, only club in Britain to do so and as far as i'm aware Rigby didn't have an affiliation to Glasgow or The Rangers. Never even seen an article stating the lad was into fitba! Then there was the the Remembrance Sunday stuff a few years with some soldier abseiling the *** stand with the match ball. Then last year about 100 troops singing the billy boys and sash.

Our armed forces are political? Ok buddy.by the way the sru also use abseiling paras etc . is that wrong too?

[liamh2202]

I did 22 years in the Royal Navy and have met many serving members of the Armed Forces who I had a great time serving with until it came to football and then you would see a different side come out in them.

At no time would I embarrass the Armed Forces by behaving like this however what I am about to say is the truth. I received the queens jubilee medal ( at least I think it's that one as medals mean dilly squat to me ) and I never ever got it put beside my other 4 on my chest. The reason was simple the ribbon is Maroon and white.
Call me stupid, call me immature but as God is my whiteness I'd rather stick rusty barb wire up my bum than maroon and white on my chest.
Was asked by numerous higher ranking officials why it was never added to my collection and used to reply that I was still awaiting delivery of it even though it was lobbed in a drawer.
GGTTh

Haha :)

[PatHead]

:agree:


and that's how it should be done.

We will being repeating last year's remembrance day commemoration where all ex-service personnel will get the chance of a free ticket. Be sure and let any ex-service personnel know. Once details of collection and application are known I will post it. It will be the match v Livingston on 14 November.

The Tickets for Troops relationship has been re-established as you said.

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

Agreed that is not acceptable and not the way we should conduct ourselves. Although it should be the individuals that are reprimanded not the idea rubbished. As a submariner we travel to the states alot and its actually sickening how their service personell are treated compared to us. We don't do it for the recognition and anyone who knows anything about the submarine service will know that we are happy working in these situations but I squirm when I see events like this get rubbished. I hate rangers with the best of them but I do think their public and charity work with the armed forces are top notch (and have dealt with them first hand)

I've seen these debates before on here.

How come every time a military person is in the debate, they start by saying 'we don't expect special treatment/recognition, then go on to demonstrate that they do.

Why would you be sickened by no getting special treatment (as the military do in the USA)? Personally I like the fact that here in Britain, we aren't as far down the road of militarism as the USA is.

I don't really care if Hibs make a low key contribution to tickets for soldiers or whatever, God knows we have the spare seats, but anyone who pretends that the Huns military association is anything other than a celebration of the role that they played in NI (or are perceive to have played) during the troubles is lying to themselves.

The fact that the soldiers served only to justify this view with their shameful appearance at Ibrox in front of the old Huns did kind of reinforce these negative perceptions.

[Alex Trager]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.

While many Newspapers mentioned the one Soldier to be investigated for joining in a sectarian song, not one mentioned the fact that thousands in the crowd were singing it, otherwise he would not have been able to 'join in'. The scarf he was wearing, with the words 'Keep Ulster Protestant', was thrown to him by someone in the crowd. Not surprising, as anyone who has ever been to Ibrox can bear witness to the sectarian paraphernalia sported by many of their Fans.

This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

Then the solution is simple.

More clubs have this.
Make it so that it's not just the Rangers but I fact all clubs. This will certainly stop any notion that it is only a thing done to celebrate their Hun ways.

[givescotlandfreedom]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.

While many Newspapers mentioned the one Soldier to be investigated for joining in a sectarian song, not one mentioned the fact that thousands in the crowd were singing it, otherwise he would not have been able to 'join in'. The scarf he was wearing, with the words 'Keep Ulster Protestant', was thrown to him by someone in the crowd. Not surprising, as anyone who has ever been to Ibrox can bear witness to the sectarian paraphernalia sported by many of their Fans.

This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

Very good post.

[bigwheel]

Supporting the Armed Forces is not what most people have a problem with.

It is the blatant manipulation of this kind of event to reinforce the stereotype of Rangers and their Supporters as Loyal to the Crown and the Armed Forces, as opposed to their rivals on the other side of the city. This is a microcosm of Northern Ireland set in Glasgow.

It is nothing more than a public reinforcement of many of their fans 'Loyalist' stance.

While many Newspapers mentioned the one Soldier to be investigated for joining in a sectarian song, not one mentioned the fact that thousands in the crowd were singing it, otherwise he would not have been able to 'join in'. The scarf he was wearing, with the words 'Keep Ulster Protestant', was thrown to him by someone in the crowd. Not surprising, as anyone who has ever been to Ibrox can bear witness to the sectarian paraphernalia sported by many of their Fans.

This event, and associating it with such people, demeans the Armed Forces in many people's eyes.

Completely agree with this post

[Kaiser1962]

I respect your opinion but don't feel that is the aim of their club. But don't disagree it is what their support see it as. Like I said previously they do lots of charity work with all three services and I feel days like today are nothing more than an extension of that.its funny how they get slated for doing days like this but Celtic get away with rubbishing anything to do with the armed forces , their disrespectful replies to requests for raffle prizes for service charities etc are outrageous but are generally accepted because maybe these charities should know better than to ask them.

So what is the aim of their club? I have no issues supporting the armed forces, or some other state institutions, and think it is scandalous that men wounded serving their country, whether you agree with the cause/legality of it or not, require charitable donations to aid their rehabilitation having been wounded in the flesh or of the mind.

What is equally scandalous is that clubs like Rangers moved heaven and earth to avoid paying taxes due to said state, taxes that could have bought equipment to protect them or medical services to heal them, in order to pursue their own glories on the sporting field gaining a substantial advantage over their rivals at the same time. Rangers, and to a lesser extent Hearts, extol the virtues of how their club is so supportive of the armed forces, whilst insinuating that their city rivals do not. I really don't think they get it or how they think the apparatus of state is supposed to work. They are either wholly ignorant or clinically stupid. Probably both.

I will continue to be supportive of our servicemen, as will our club, and contribute without any of the hypocritical flag waving triumphalism that will be present at Ibrox.

[oneone73]

I did 22 years in the Royal Navy and have met many serving members of the Armed Forces who I had a great time serving with until it came to football and then you would see a different side come out in them.

At no time would I embarrass the Armed Forces by behaving like this however what I am about to say is the truth. I received the queens jubilee medal ( at least I think it's that one as medals mean dilly squat to me ) and I never ever got it put beside my other 4 on my chest. The reason was simple the ribbon is Maroon and white.
Call me stupid, call me immature but as God is my whiteness I'd rather stick rusty barb wire up my bum than maroon and white on my chest.
Was asked by numerous higher ranking officials why it was never added to my collection and used to reply that I was still awaiting delivery of it even though it was lobbed in a drawer.
GGTTh

Like.

[heretoday]

Bunch of fascists.

[FranckSuzy]

So what is the aim of their club? I have no issues supporting the armed forces, or some other state institutions, and think it is scandalous that men wounded serving their country, whether you agree with the cause/legality of it or not, require charitable donations to aid their rehabilitation having been wounded in the flesh or of the mind.

What is equally scandalous is that clubs like Rangers moved heaven and earth to avoid paying taxes due to said state, taxes that could have bought equipment to protect them or medical services to heal them, in order to pursue their own glories on the sporting field gaining a substantial advantage over their rivals at the same time. Rangers, and to a lesser extent Hearts, extol the virtues of how their club is so supportive of the armed forces, whilst insinuating that their city rivals do not. I really don't think they get it or how they think the apparatus of state is supposed to work. They are either wholly ignorant or clinically stupid. Probably both.

I will continue to be supportive of our servicemen, as will our club, and contribute without any of the hypocritical flag waving triumphalism that will be present at Ibrox.

:top marks

[Hibrandenburg]

I don't see why the armed forces should get special treatment ahead of say the police, fire service or hospital staff. I'm not saying they don't deserve reward but if we're going to do it there are other deserving cases too.

[Billie Jo]

**** the huns and all who support them, ****

[Deansy]

So what is the aim of their club? I have no issues supporting the armed forces, or some other state institutions, and think it is scandalous that men wounded serving their country, whether you agree with the cause/legality of it or not, require charitable donations to aid their rehabilitation having been wounded in the flesh or of the mind.

What is equally scandalous is that clubs like Rangers moved heaven and earth to avoid paying taxes due to said state, taxes that could have bought equipment to protect them or medical services to heal them, in order to pursue their own glories on the sporting field gaining a substantial advantage over their rivals at the same time. Rangers, and to a lesser extent Hearts, extol the virtues of how their club is so supportive of the armed forces, whilst insinuating that their city rivals do not. I really don't think they get it or how they think the apparatus of state is supposed to work. They are either wholly ignorant or clinically stupid. Probably both.

I will continue to be supportive of our servicemen, as will our club, and contribute without any of the hypocritical flag waving triumphalism that will be present at Ibrox.

Agreed, there's countless stories of servicemen being killed/injured due to decent or inferior kit !

P.s the last line - yes both are ignorant and stupid but also both are inherently criminal. Both clubs operated fraudulently over a long period of time, the Hun at least 10 years but due to 'missing paperwork' who knows how long they were really at it - Murray's reign was almost 30 years so who knows ??. The 'Charity Thieves' started their 'Finance Football' business-plan with Mercer - 30+ years !!

[Bostonhibby]

They could have helped kit out a few military hospitals if they'd kept up their tax and national insurance payments. Scotlands' shame

[Lucius Apuleius]

I started going to Remembrance Day parades when I was a little lad, mainly because the cenotaph was about 200 yards away and the bus to the church, which was a fair bit out of the village, left late that day because of the service. I then went as part of the Lifeboys and then BB. I then went to sea and attended whenever I was home or stopped and had a wee think at the names on it if I had missed the ceremony. In latter years, again when I have been home, I have gone and represented various organizations. What I cannot get my head round is why all of a sudden, maybe 3 or 4 years ago, this became a big issue. Now, I am not for one nanosecond saying this is a bad thing. It is in fact brilliant the recognition the forces are now getting (and us merchantmen 😁) but I really don't understand how it all came to pass. Again, as said before, no problem with der hun doing this, it is the antics of those who attended and also the belief amongst the hun that they are the only people who can possibly support our armed forces. A friend of many years, a Falkirk supporter of many years, has actually had a huge poppy with " Lest we forget" tattooed on his arm. Why? He is in his 50s and has no affiliation to the military.

[pontius pilate]

We will being repeating last year's remembrance day commemoration where all ex-service personnel will get the chance of a free ticket. Be sure and let any ex-service personnel know. Once details of collection and application are known I will post it. It will be the match v Livingston on 14 November.

The Tickets for Troops relationship has been re-established as you said.

Pathead sounds good fella I will need to keep up to date with the details. I know a few guys I served with in the royal scots through one reason or another cant make games due to illness. Like myself a few of us had tickets for today but when one falls ill we are there for him to brin him through. Anyway I digress. Could you keep me informed please

GGTTH

[pontius pilate]

I started going to Remembrance Day parades when I was a little lad, mainly because the cenotaph was about 200 yards away and the bus to the church, which was a fair bit out of the village, left late that day because of the service. I then went as part of the Lifeboys and then BB. I then went to sea and attended whenever I was home or stopped and had a wee think at the names on it if I had missed the ceremony. In latter years, again when I have been home, I have gone and represented various organizations. What I cannot get my head round is why all of a sudden, maybe 3 or 4 years ago, this became a big issue. Now, I am not for one nanosecond saying this is a bad thing. It is in fact brilliant the recognition the forces are now getting (and us merchantmen 😁) but I really don't understand how it all came to pass. Again, as said before, no problem with der hun doing this, it is the antics of those who attended and also the belief amongst the hun that they are the only people who can possibly support our armed forces. A friend of many years, a Falkirk supporter of many years, has actually had a huge poppy with " Lest we forget" tattooed on his arm. Why? He is in his 50s and has no affiliation to the military.

The parents who set up help4hereos really brought it to the fore ( they have however been investigated) the problem there was they only really helped guys from recent conflicts Iraq and afghan more afghan and not NI Falklands etc. now you have organisations and charities springing up everywhere but the charities that desperately need the funding aren't getting it That's not to say they all don't need the funding or help but charities like combat stress and even ssafa struggle. I hated walking home from dreghirn with uniform on and it's only 10 years this November I've been out

[AndyM_1875]

Got to say I really don't get this whole Rangers schtick of them pretending to be the great football backer of the Armed Forces. Whilst boys from Hibs and Hearts & also Celtic fought their way through the mud of the Somme during the Great War, the Rangers were hiding in the shipyards.

My old boy served 10 years in the Army, grandad & 2 great uncles were Royal Marines who served at D Day, they would find this nonsense at Ibrox vulgar, tasteless & inappropriate. What Hibs do with the tickets for troops and with the respectful commemoration of Quintinshill during the play off game gets it right.

[JimBHibees]

So what is the aim of their club? I have no issues supporting the armed forces, or some other state institutions, and think it is scandalous that men wounded serving their country, whether you agree with the cause/legality of it or not, require charitable donations to aid their rehabilitation having been wounded in the flesh or of the mind.

What is equally scandalous is that clubs like Rangers moved heaven and earth to avoid paying taxes due to said state, taxes that could have bought equipment to protect them or medical services to heal them, in order to pursue their own glories on the sporting field gaining a substantial advantage over their rivals at the same time. Rangers, and to a lesser extent Hearts, extol the virtues of how their club is so supportive of the armed forces, whilst insinuating that their city rivals do not. I really don't think they get it or how they think the apparatus of state is supposed to work. They are either wholly ignorant or clinically stupid. Probably both.

I will continue to be supportive of our servicemen, as will our club, and contribute without any of the hypocritical flag waving triumphalism that will be present at Ibrox.

Fantastic post. I wonder how many serving personnel's wages could have been funded by the tax Rangers and also Hearts for that matter avoided over the last few years.

[Bristolhibby]

I don't see why the armed forces should get special treatment ahead of say the police, fire service or hospital staff. I'm not saying they don't deserve reward but if we're going to do it there are other deserving cases too.

Add volunteers at food banks, or carers who need a break & social workers. More deserving IMHO,

The list is endless.

J

[Bristolhibby]

I started going to Remembrance Day parades when I was a little lad, mainly because the cenotaph was about 200 yards away and the bus to the church, which was a fair bit out of the village, left late that day because of the service. I then went as part of the Lifeboys and then BB. I then went to sea and attended whenever I was home or stopped and had a wee think at the names on it if I had missed the ceremony. In latter years, again when I have been home, I have gone and represented various organizations. What I cannot get my head round is why all of a sudden, maybe 3 or 4 years ago, this became a big issue. Now, I am not for one nanosecond saying this is a bad thing. It is in fact brilliant the recognition the forces are now getting (and us merchantmen 😁) but I really don't understand how it all came to pass. Again, as said before, no problem with der hun doing this, it is the antics of those who attended and also the belief amongst the hun that they are the only people who can possibly support our armed forces. A friend of many years, a Falkirk supporter of many years, has actually had a huge poppy with " Lest we forget" tattooed on his arm. Why? He is in his 50s and has no affiliation to the military.

You are right, bigging up of the military started when we had to push the unpopular wars against Muslims.

It's simple bandwagon jumping, pushing a narrative that the masses gladly consume. It also papers over the cracks in our governments policies.

J

[Baader]

Hearing Armed Forces personnel belting out songs about killing Catholics 2 years ago and joining in the hate fest at Ibrox was at best embarrassing, at worst offensive and divisive and those involved got off very lightly.

Let's not pretend Rangers do this for any reason other than a thinly veiled attempt to legitimise the bigotry their horrible club continues to tar our football and nation with.

Not an attack on the Armed Forces by the way but those scenes two years ago were an absolute disgrace. So loyal to the Crown are Rangers that they paid no tax to Her Majesty's Revenue and Custom service for a number of years...

[wookie70]

I don't see why the armed forces should get special treatment ahead of say the police, fire service or hospital staff. I'm not saying they don't deserve reward but if we're going to do it there are other deserving cases too.

Totally agree with this. Servicemen are just Public Servants to me. If they were conscripted I would have a different opinion but they are workers employed by the state and as such should expect no more than other workers. If losing your life or being injured are the reasons servicemen are getting free tickets to games then why not Builders, Farmers, Miners or those who work at sea who have comparable rates of death at work.

Nothing particularly against Servicemen but they do seem to be ridiculously celebrated in our country compared to other workers. Being a Public Servants it really gets my goat that Servicemen seem to be seem as some kind of super civil servant when they are just someone doing a job.

[tamig]

Totally agree with this. Servicemen are just Public Servants to me. If they were conscripted I would have a different opinion but they are workers employed by the state and as such should expect no more than other workers. If losing your life or being injured are the reasons servicemen are getting free tickets to games then why not Builders, Farmers, Miners or those who work at sea who have comparable rates of death at work.

Nothing particularly against Servicemen but they do seem to be ridiculously celebrated in our country compared to other workers. Being a Public Servants it really gets my goat that Servicemen seem to be seem as some kind of super civil servant when they are just someone doing a job.

A bit hard hitting but I agree with your sentiments. And it's a job they have chosen to do.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Hearing Armed Forces personnel belting out songs about killing Catholics 2 years ago and joining in the hate fest at Ibrox was at best embarrassing, at worst offensive and divisive and those involved got off very lightly.

Let's not pretend Rangers do this for any reason other than a thinly veiled attempt to legitimise the bigotry their horrible club continues to tar our football and nation with.

Not an attack on the Armed Forces by the way but those scenes two years ago were an absolute disgrace. So loyal to the Crown are Rangers that they paid no tax to Her Majesty's Revenue and Custom service for a number of years...

Spot on, Scotland's shame, still.....

[IberianHibernian]

Usually try to avoid all the threads about British military , Remembrance Day etc stuff since things are always misrepresented afterwards . But 2 questions occur to me :
1. If anyone here went to a football match during a foreign holiday and saw an armed forces parade within the stadium or heard that military personnel got in free what would they think of the country ?
2. The ex or present British armed forces personnel here , presumably you had different reasons for joining forces but none of these reasons would include receiving tickets for football matches or taking part in ceremonies in stadiums on match days ?
Many Hibs fans contribute to Hibs related initiatives like Kicks For Kids and the fantastic Ukraine programme which help young people near Easter Road and in Ukraine . Many of us also contribute to organisations which have no connection to Hibernian FC . If I want a group of British military people ( or any other group of society ) to get free tickets to watch my club ( even if working ) I suppose I can go to the ticket office , buy tickets and secretly hand them over . That way our club gets the money and our club is not seen to favour any group .
Likewise when club decides on who uses our training facilities .

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I did 22 years in the Royal Navy and have met many serving members of the Armed Forces who I had a great time serving with until it came to football and then you would see a different side come out in them.

At no time would I embarrass the Armed Forces by behaving like this however what I am about to say is the truth. I received the queens jubilee medal ( at least I think it's that one as medals mean dilly squat to me ) and I never ever got it put beside my other 4 on my chest. The reason was simple the ribbon is Maroon and white.
Call me stupid, call me immature but as God is my whiteness I'd rather stick rusty barb wire up my bum than maroon and white on my chest.
Was asked by numerous higher ranking officials why it was never added to my collection and used to reply that I was still awaiting delivery of it even though it was lobbed in a drawer.
GGTTh

Thats quite sad is it not?

[Scouse Hibee]

Thats quite sad is it not?

It's remarkable that people get so hung up on a colour!

[ronaldo7]

It's remarkable that people get so hung up on a colour!

And yet the British armed forces salute it every day:rolleyes:

[liamh2202]

And yet the British armed forces salute it every day:rolleyes:

Maroon?

[ronaldo7]

Maroon?

No.

[liamh2202]

No.

I'm lost , I thought the quote was referring to the post about a jubilee medal because it had a maroon ribbon.

[ronaldo7]

I'm lost , I thought the quote was referring to the post about a jubilee medal because it had a maroon ribbon.

Submariners often get lost, normally on leave, and never turn up for days on end.

My post referenced scouse's, when he talked about getting hung up about a colour. The British Forces hang colours every day.:wink:

[liamh2202]

Submariners often get lost, normally on leave, and never turn up for days on end.

My post referenced scouse's, when he talked about getting hung up about a colour. The British Forces hang colours every day.:wink:

Haha woosh I realized after I wrote it but thought I deserved the ribbing so never edited it. We are never in before colours or still there after so its a strange concept to me lol

[ronaldo7]

Haha woosh I realized after I wrote it but thought I deserved the ribbing so never edited it. We are never in before colours or still there after so its a strange concept to me lol

Too busy spending your Hard Lying money:wink:

:titanic:

[southern hibby]

Thats quite sad is it not?

Yes it is to be fair. However I am what I am and make no excuses for it.

GGTTH.

[ginger_rice]

Too busy spending your Hard Lying money:wink:

:titanic:

To be fair it wasn't just submariners that got that I got Hard Lyers on Ton class minesweepers

[Baldy Foghorn]

Yes it is to be fair. However I am what I am and make no excuses for it.

GGTTH.

:greengrin:agree::agree:

[ronaldo7]

To be fair it wasn't just submariners that got that I got Hard Lyers on Ton class minesweepers

:agree:http://www.godfreydykes.info/hard_lying_money_method_af_asses.htm

[Bad Martini]

I don't see why the armed forces should get special treatment ahead of say the police, fire service or hospital staff. I'm not saying they don't deserve reward but if we're going to do it there are other deserving cases too.

:agree:

Fitba is fitba.

The real world is the real world. Complete with real world issues and bams who mix them up JUST to argue and fight. Its a shame that some folk (afforementioned bams) LOOK for things to actively warp such as the huns display mentioned in this thread but it will happen. Some "fans" of some teams will spark up their sectarianisim and/or political issues, NONE of which relate to 22 men kicking a ball...

Lets keep them nicely apart.