Pace

[Ozyhibby]

We must try and add some pace to the team over the summer. Motherwell showed tonight why it's so important.

[Smartie]

100% right.

If you take the players with pace out of any team they struggle.

It is 100% the most important thing we need to add for next season.

[Carheenlea]

:agree: We have been crying out for pace for a number of years now. I`m sure this will be addressed by this management team.

[Billy Whizz]

:agree: We have been crying out for pace for a number of years now. I`m sure this will be addressed by this management team.

Should have done it this season, only brought in Boyle in January. Too much tippy tappy football from us at times

[Smartie]

Should have done it this season, only brought in Boyle in January. Too much tippy tappy football from us at times

It's a bit easy to criticise him for that.

Stubbs needed to add a goalkeeper and cover, at least one centre-back, a right-back, several central midfielders, at least 3 strikers before we even get started on other options out wide etc.

He did add Boyle who was generally a great success when he played.

To expect him to address all of our shortcomings in just 2 transfer windows is plain unrealistic.

Now though, he has a decent platform with many problem positions now sorted. Adding a bit of pace and guile in the final third is the main priority imo (once the futures of the out-of-contract players is sorted).

[One Day Soon]

We must try and add some pace to the team over the summer. Motherwell showed tonight why it's so important.

If we'd had a winger or two with pace I think we'd have been playing Motherwell tonight. It is totally gutting to think how close we came only to have to try and do it all over again.

[ElginHibbie]

I really hope we sign Boyle, he just started to hit good form when he got injured and he could have made the difference in the Rangers games and the semi.

He'll rip the league apart next year if we sign him.

[HoboHarry]

I really hope we sign Boyle, he just started to hit good form when he got injured and he could have made the difference in the Rangers games and the semi.

He'll rip the league apart next year if we sign him.
You really an Elgin Hibee? Don't live there anymore but that's where I grew up......

[MWHIBBIES]

You'd think it was FIFA the way people go on about pace. I'd have 11 quality players over 11 quick ones.

[ElginHibbie]

You really an Elgin Hibee? Don't live there anymore but that's where I grew up......

I am indeed, go see City most weeks as supporting Hibs hasn't been punishment enough these last few years

[bingo70]

I really hope we sign Boyle, he just started to hit good form when he got injured and he could have made the difference in the Rangers games and the semi.

He'll rip the league apart next year if we sign him.

I'm not convinced by Boyle yet. He had a few good games towards the end of the season but I think people are getting a bit carried away, imo he's pretty average although he does have potential.

I wouldn't mind him being signed as a squad player but I hope we sign two better out and out wingers.

[Smartie]

You'd think it was FIFA the way people go on about pace. I'd 11 quality players over 11 quick ones.

I wouldn't. You end up with tidy, tippy-tappy passing and no cutting edge.

11 quick players, 11 tricky players, 11 big players - all make hopeless one-dimensional TEAMS.

You need a bit of everything in there. We have quality players who can pass the ball, we have a finisher, we have big and strong defenders. What we lack is pace.

You don't need it everywhere but 1 or 2 quick players add another dimension to a team's attacking play and our team would be miles better off with it in there (see the positive impact that a fairly limited all-round but very pacy player like Boyle made for us).

[ElginHibbie]

I'm not convinced by Boyle yet. He had a few good games towards the end of the season but I think people are getting a bit carried away, imo he's pretty average although he does have potential.

I wouldn't mind him being signed as a squad player but I hope we sign two better out and out wingers.

Yeah, two wingers sounds right to me, Boyle can play on the wing or as a striker which is useful but we need a proper plan b which wingers should give us

[marleyhib]

Hope we sign Boyle, agree with OP - more pace please

[MWHIBBIES]

I wouldn't. You end up with tidy, tippy-tappy passing and no cutting edge.

11 quick players, 11 tricky players, 11 big players - all make hopeless one-dimensional TEAMS.

You need a bit of everything in there. We have quality players who can pass the ball, we have a finisher, we have big and strong defenders. What we lack is pace.

You don't need it everywhere but 1 or 2 quick players add another dimension to a team's attacking play and our team would be miles better off with it in there (see the positive impact that a fairly limited all-round but very pacy player like Boyle made for us).Pace wouldn't have made a difference in 9/10 of our games this season, pace does nothing when teams are sitting on their 18 yard line defending all game, it is brilliant in open games where both teams are attacking.

Obviously pace is nice to have but you don't need pace to run with the ball and penetrate teams, you need quality.

[Ozyhibby]

I really hope we get better than Boyle.

[Leith_Hibee]

Scouts at youth level are obsessed by pace...you also need skill and a football brain.
For me the best attribute for any footballer is balance...I give you Russell Latapy.

[Stokesy's on fire]

I am indeed, go see City most weeks as supporting Hibs hasn't been punishment enough these last few years

Sic Itur as Astra

There's more than one a Elgin hibee here!

[HoboHarry]

Sic Itur as Astra

There's more than one a Elgin hibee here!
If you can't remember how to spell that properly you must not have grown up in the educated New Elgin area. Maybe Bishopmill or South Lesmurdie?...... :greengrin Sic Itur ad Astra

[Peevemor]

Sic Itur as Astra

There's more than one a Elgin hibee here!

My mum was from Forres. Does that count?

[NorthNorfolkHFC]

It's a bit easy to criticise him for that.

Stubbs needed to add a goalkeeper and cover, at least one centre-back, a right-back, several central midfielders, at least 3 strikers before we even get started on other options out wide etc.

He did add Boyle who was generally a great success when he played.

To expect him to address all of our shortcomings in just 2 transfer windows is plain unrealistic.

Now though, he has a decent platform with many problem positions now sorted. Adding a bit of pace and guile in the final third is the main priority imo (once the futures of the out-of-contract players is sorted).

Pace doesn't need to be limited to wingers though. Aside of goalkeeper we should have been signing quick, strong athletic players.


"And on the day that 67-year-old Norwich resident Mary Leese has woken from a three-year coma, we’ll be asking – what’s the best night’s sleep you’ve ever had?"

[Geo_1875]

I agree that pace is important. Who wouldn't love to have a winger as fast as Alan O'Brien? What is more important is having midfielders who can spot and play a pass quickly. This allows even medium paced wingers and forwards to get through and behind packed defences.

[Ronniekirk]

Should have done it this season, only brought in Boyle in January. Too much tippy tappy football from us at times
fair point Billy , butcher had identified this issue and said he had players lined up to come to us with pace but Stubbs came in later to a different league so no doubt the quality players with pace wouldn't of been available to us at that point
Can you think of anyone that was around then or January that might of been a realistic target for us

[Stokesy's on fire]

If you can't remember how to spell that properly you must not have grown up in the educated New Elgin area. Maybe Bishopmill or South Lesmurdie?...... :greengrin Sic Itur ad Astra

I blame iphone for that!

I'm from none of those places lucky enough. Elgin has a fine chipper

[Stokesy's on fire]

My mum was from Forres. Does that count?

No!!

[blackpoolhibs]

I read yesterday that Dundee have offered Boyle a contract, can't remember where i read it?

[3pm]

I read yesterday that Dundee have offered Boyle a contract, can't remember where i read it?

I am surprised that was in 'bored housewives'.

[FranckSuzy]

I am surprised that was in 'bored housewives'.

:tee hee:

[CockneyRebel]

I read yesterday that Dundee have offered Boyle a contract, can't remember where i read it?


I read it too - must have been on here somewhere or Hibs.net. No mention of source at all so it could be just a rumour (although I understand that doesn't happen much on here).

[blackpoolhibs]

I am surprised that was in 'bored housewives'.


:tee hee:


They are never bored, or maybe they are :wink: when i turn up.

[thebausburst]

i don't agree that we need pace in this Division as TBH we won't get a chance to use it as teams will just sit in against us more often than not, so not as if we'll be hitting on the break. What we need is players with invention and/or wingers who can get past people and make things happen as currently all too often Hibs pas across the 18 yard line and struggle to create anything in the final 3rd.

[green day]

......What we need is players with invention and/or wingers who can get past people and make things happen....

Agreed - but pace helps them with that. We have inventive players, but are pedestrian at times.

If you watched Motherwell break v the orcs, or ICT in the Scottish cup final, you see that pace breaks teams and turns pressure into goals.

[bingo70]

Agreed - but pace helps them with that. We have inventive players, but are pedestrian at times.

If you watched Motherwell break v the orcs, or ICT in the Scottish cup final, you see that pace breaks teams and turns pressure into goals.

Motherwell is maybe not a great example considering they finished second bottom of the league.

[green day]

Motherwell is maybe not a great example considering they finished second bottom of the league.

Fair point, but we need a team capable of breaking teams down in the Championship.

Remember what hearts did this year? Level on points in derby games v us, but over 20 points ahead overall - largely due to destroying smaller teams home and away. They got the first goal more often than not, then it was game over.

Tippy tappy nice fitba won't win us the league, and if we consistently beat the smaller teams, the 4 games v The Rangers may not be as crucial.

IMO if we add pace on both wings, plus one penalty box poacher, we have the basis of it.

[bingo70]

Fair point, but we need a team capable of breaking teams down in the Championship.

Remember what hearts did this year? Level on points in derby games v us, but over 20 points ahead overall - largely due to destroying smaller teams home and away. They got the first goal more often than not, then it was game over.

Tippy tappy nice fitba won't win us the league, and if we consistently beat the smaller teams, the 4 games v The Rangers may not be as crucial.

IMO if we add pace on both wings, plus one penalty box poacher, we have the basis of it.

Tbh I agree. Was just being a dick earlier by pointing out the flaw in your argument.

I think the way we packed the midfield against the pish teams was unnecessary and left us short on the wings where they were vulnerable.

We were too reliant on full backs for width and that showed at the end of the season.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Tbh I agree. Was just being a dick earlier by pointing out the flaw in your argument.

I think the way we packed the midfield against the pish teams was unnecessary and left us short on the wings where they were vulnerable.

We were too reliant on full backs for width and that showed at the end of the season.

:agree: teams sussed out the full backs being our only source of width and shut them out.

I think what we need is a midfielder that can ping one in from 20 yards on a frequent basis.

[Phil MaGlass]

Pace wouldn't have made a difference in 9/10 of our games this season, pace does nothing when teams are sitting on their 18 yard line defending all game, it is brilliant in open games where both teams are attacking.

Obviously pace is nice to have but you don't need pace to run with the ball and penetrate teams, you need quality.

team definitely lack pace, a bit of pace and we would have humped the buns.
I think its one of the reasons we drew so many games this season.

[superfurryhibby]

:agree: teams sussed out the full backs being our only source of width and shut them out.

I think what we need is a midfielder that can ping one in from 20 yards on a frequent basis.

There has to be a reason why our team, which was way the best footballing side, failed to win so many games.

Lack of goals from midfield was a factor, as was lack of width and a plan B. When we got Farid back that added another dimension to our game, albeit with a traditional twist.

How did Hearts do it so effectively, one wonders? 20 points gap says they were better tactically?

[Danderhall Hibs]

There has to be a reason why our team, which was way the best footballing side, failed to win so many games.

Lack of goals from midfield was a factor, as was lack of width and a plan B. When we got Farid back that added another dimension to our game, albeit with a traditional twist.

How did Hearts do it so effectively, one wonders? 20 points gap says they were better tactically?

I think variety. They had guys that would strike it and make teams come out then thy could pick them off.

Where we struggled was breaking teams down - that gave them encouragement to dig in even more and made out square balls across the 18 yard line even more ineffective.

[superfurryhibby]

I think variety. They had guys that would strike it and make teams come out then thy could pick them off.

Where we struggled was breaking teams down - that gave them encouragement to dig in even more and made out square balls across the 18 yard line even more ineffective.

To be fair to them, they were ruthless. Having seen them twice against us though I still struggle to understand quite how they did it.

I only saw Hibs in half a dozen games last season so I suppose I can't really say I have any major insight into it, but lack of cutting edge is a factor. The times we dominated play, with some really lovely football and a fair bit of grit too, but didn't get a goal suggests we lacked something up front, despite the good goals tally from Cummings and Malonga. However, I also realise our midfielders didn't score too many either( I think Robertson had the most?).

Anyways, if ŵe don't get to keep Boyle then it's a must that we sign a decent wide player. I reckon that will be a crucial signing for Stubbs, alongside the re-signing of all the key guys from this season. We need proven quality, not a young loanee and I reckon Stubbs will ensure we have that position sorted for the start of the next season.

[PatHead]

We also need to be more productive at corners and throw ins. How many corners did we get in games and how many goals did we score at corners or free kicks for that matter

Set pieces need to be better.

[Danderhall Hibs]

We also need to be more productive at corners and throw ins. How many corners did we get in games and how many goals did we score at corners or free kicks for that matter

Set pieces need to be better.

They do. We also need more variety from them.

And a midfielder or 2 that chip in with 8-12 goals a season.

[B.H.F.C]

They do. We also need more variety from them.

And a midfielder or 2 that chip in with 8-12 goals a season.

Yep more goals from midfield is a must. For the ability we had in there this season we got nowhere near enough goals from that area.

[matty_f]

I think variety. They had guys that would strike it and make teams come out then thy could pick them off.

Where we struggled was breaking teams down - that gave them encouragement to dig in even more and made out square balls across the 18 yard line even more ineffective.

Variety was definitely a strength of the yams :agree:

We'd be patient trying to pass a team to death when teams would just park the bus, the Yams would chuck a cross in from deep and score, or crack one in from 20 yards, and once they got the first goal they were able to pick off teams and pass the ball into the net.

It was very effective, and something we definitely lacked. Getting someone that can chip in with goals from midfield is essential, IMHO.

[Mikey09]

I predict Alex Harris will play a big part in Stubbs plans next season. I would like to see him pushed inside more and play on the right of a diamond. Get him more involved in the game.

[bingo70]

Variety was definitely a strength of the yams :agree:

We'd be patient trying to pass a team to death when teams would just park the bus, the Yams would chuck a cross in from deep and score, or crack one in from 20 yards, and once they got the first goal they were able to pick off teams and pass the ball into the net.

It was very effective, and something we definitely lacked. Getting someone that can chip in with goals from midfield is essential, IMHO.

We had the personnel in midfield that should have been able to do that. Allan, Mcgeoch and Craig are all attacking midfielders but something stopped them from getting amongst the goals. I wonder if playing such a packed centre of midfield also meant there just wasn't space for them to move into.

Imo it's essential we replace some of our centre midfielders with wingers, if we do that it'll stretch the opposition and midfielders will be able to make runs into the box. It'll mean we might not keep having 70 or 80% possession but Maybe we just need to trust our defence more.

[matty_f]

We had the personnel in midfield that should have been able to do that. Allan, Mcgeoch and Craig are all attacking midfielders but something stopped them from getting amongst the goals. I wonder if playing such a packed centre of midfield also meant there just wasn't space for them to move into.

Imo it's essential we replace some of our centre midfielders with wingers, if we do that it'll stretch the opposition and midfielders will be able to make runs into the box. It'll mean we might not keep having 70 or 80% possession but Maybe we just need to trust our defence more.

We might have had the players but they were very shot-shy if that's the case. There were loads of games where a winger would have struggled because there was no space for them to have gone into because teams parked the bus. That's where you need someone that can just rattle one in from distance.

[bingo70]

We might have had the players but they were very shot-shy if that's the case. There were loads of games where a winger would have struggled because there was no space for them to have gone into because teams parked the bus. That's where you need someone that can just rattle one in from distance.

Winger beats a man, centre half needs to come out to tackle winger which then leads to the space in the middle for the midfielder to run into.

Instead of that we tried to do it all centrally so teams would pack the midfield and defence knowing that's where our attacks would come from. When we did get it wide our full backs would swing it in to the area they'd crowded out.

Obviously I'm generalising about our play but I do think if we were to try and stretch the game a bit more we'd get more success against the smaller teams.

[hibees 7062]

Marvin Johnson anyone ?

[anon1875]

You'd think it was FIFA the way people go on about pace. I'd have 11 quality players over 11 quick ones.
Scottish mentality mate. You don't have to be quick to run in behind, against rangers our top two were so static when they were sitting in, the one time cummings actually made a little run he nearly scored.

[AlbertK86]

Marvin Johnson anyone ?

He was excellent over both games against SEVCO but doubt he'd drop a division

[nellio]

How about Gregg Wylde? Out of COntract at St Mirren. I seem to remember him bveing pretty rapid. Just been relegated with St Mirren but could do a job as a squad player in thge championship for us?

[heid the baw]

Pace is needed but stamina and tempo was what Hertz brought to many of those fixtures that they scooshed. If you are fitter and press relentlessly from the off, teams like Livi, Alloa, Raith cannot live with you

[Turkish Green]

More by chance than by design but Hearts tore the opposition apart last season by using two wingers who could cut inside and score in addition to beating their FB and crossing into the box.

Motherwell showed over 2 legs how pace and wingmen beat the slow Sevco defence. Against Sevco, Hibs played it too central into a congested box which the experienced, if slow, Sevco defence could cope with. To often trying to walk the ball into the goal ended in blockage.

Of course it will be a totally new Sevco next season but where Hibs lost out last season was the inability to put lesser teams away. We must hit the ground running next season and not drop points to teams we should be beating.

[Turkish Green]

Variety was definitely a strength of the yams :agree:

We'd be patient trying to pass a team to death when teams would just park the bus, the Yams would chuck a cross in from deep and score, or crack one in from 20 yards, and once they got the first goal they were able to pick off teams and pass the ball into the net.

It was very effective, and something we definitely lacked. Getting someone that can chip in with goals from midfield is essential, IMHO.

I hate using the yams as an example but their tactics against the lesser teams was spot-on. Against teams that would park the bus they would start the game at speed and take attempts at goal from outside the box Until the nut was cracked and the defence was opened.

although they scored 26 more goals than us, the goals were spread throughout the team. I read somewhere that all outfield players in their squad scored. While Cummings and Malonga topped the charts they were far too erratic.

[jacomo]

Pace is needed but stamina and tempo was what Hertz brought to many of those fixtures that they scooshed. If you are fitter and press relentlessly from the off, teams like Livi, Alloa, Raith cannot live with you

True enough. Again, though, I would expect an improvement on this area next season, because the squad will know that AS will demand superior fitness from them.

He said he was pretty shocked at the condition if the players when he arrived last summer. I'm sure players will return from their holidays in better shape and go from there.

Goals from midfield a definite weakness though and needs to be addressed.

[Franck Stanton]

I read yesterday that Dundee have offered Boyle a contract, can't remember where i read it?

Was a banner headline in the Edinburgh Evening News

[blackpoolhibs]

Was a banner headline in the Edinburgh Evening News


My local newsagent does not stock it. :wink:

[MyJo]

I see Ricky Foster has been released by Sevco.

would definately add some pace to the team as one of the only players i've ever seen keep pace with Sproule when he was with Aberdeen :agree:

versatile as well as he can play full back as well as a winger on either side i think.

[MWHIBBIES]

I see Ricky Foster has been released by Sevco.

would definately add some pace to the team as one of the only players i've ever seen keep pace with Sproule when he was with Aberdeen :agree:

versatile as well as he can play full back as well as a winger on either side i think.This is what I was saying about quality over pace, Foster is absolutely awful, please god no.

[broondog]

OP spot on. this is a must if we want to challenge next year. need 2 players that are quick minimum. our team is technically excellent with little to no pace

[Dashing Bob S]

OP spot on. this is a must if we want to challenge next year. need 2 players that are quick minimum. our team is technically excellent with little to no pace

Unfortunately we are in the second tier of Scottish football, and anybody with both technical ability and pace won't be enticed there, or certainly not for long. Best bet for that is to find somebody in the youth ranks or lower leagues.

[jacomo]

Having read this thread, I am now deeply troubled by the word 'pace'.

I might have nightmares tonight, waking in a cold sweat while trying to blink away the letters from my eyes.

P A C E

[Jim Herriot]

Is this the guy we need?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie_Pace