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RSS Bot
25-03-2015, 11:00 AM
More... (http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/5298)

Kojock
25-03-2015, 11:12 AM
If we are serious about kicking out bigotry then why did we allow hundreds of bigots into Easter Road on Sunday?
Pounds over principles.

marinello59
25-03-2015, 11:14 AM
If we are serious about kicking out bigotry then why did we allow hundreds of bigots into Easter Road on Sunday?
Pounds over principles.

Good work there by our club. Obviously your need to trash it is more important than giving them credit though. Sad stuff.

Golden Bear
25-03-2015, 11:14 AM
If we are serious about kicking out bigotry then why did we allow hundreds of bigots into Easter Road on Sunday?
Pounds over principles.

Let's not be too precious on this one - unfortunately we have a sprinkling of bigots amongst our own support.

Kojock
25-03-2015, 11:20 AM
Good work there by our club. Obviously your need to trash it is more important than giving them credit though. Sad stuff.

Where did I trash what the club was trying to do, I asked what I deemed to be a pertinent and relevant question. Maybe you can answer why we allowed hundreds of bigots into ER ??

marinello59
25-03-2015, 11:25 AM
Where did I trash what the club was trying to do, I asked what I deemed to be a pertinent and relevant question. Maybe you can answer why we allowed hundreds of bigots into ER ??

You mean the Rangers fans?
Your pounds over principles is hardly supportive is it?

Kojock
25-03-2015, 11:31 AM
You mean the Rangers fans?

Thats exactly who I mean, How many people outwith Hibs will read about our latest campaign ?

The evidence was there for all to hear last Sunday. If we were bold enough to say until the Rangers fans stop all their party songs they will not be allowed access to Easter Road. Imagine how big a news story that would be.

Because IMO Hibs wont ban them cause they would lose too much money hence my pound over principles quote.

marinello59
25-03-2015, 11:36 AM
Thats exactly who I mean, How many people outwith Hibs will read about our latest campaign ?

The evidence was there for all to hear last Sunday. If we were bold enough to say until the Rangers fans stop all their party songs they will not be allowed access to Easter Road. Imagine how big a news story that would be.

Because IMO Hibs wont ban them cause they would lose too much money hence my pound over principles quote.

So you are saying all Rangers fans are by default bigots? Isn't that bigoted thinking? :greengrin
This is a story about education, surely the club deserves credit for that?

Kojock
25-03-2015, 11:46 AM
So you are saying all Rangers fans are by default bigots? Isn't that bigoted thinking? :greengrin
This is a story about education, surely the club deserves credit for that?

I agree they deserve credit, but there is so much more Hibs and all the other clubs in Scotland can do about it, but they wont due to loss of revenue.

Im not saying all The Rangers fans are bigots but 99% of the bigots there on Sunday are Rangers fans.

marinello59
25-03-2015, 11:54 AM
I agree they deserve credit, but there is so much more Hibs and all the other clubs in Scotland can do about it, but they wont due to loss of revenue.

Im not saying all The Rangers fans are bigots but 99% of the bigots there on Sunday are Rangers fans.

Do you think we should have been banned from grounds because of the Skacel song then. We might be able to argue otherwise but most people outside of Hibs would see it as Racist so by your reasoning we should all be banned for being racists. How about banning the Hearts fans for homophobic abuse? Why stop there, there are some pretty distasteful songs sung by fans of every club. Where would it stop?
Education is the single most important tool in our armoury. Sectarian singing at ER by Hibs fans wasn't eradicated by banning supporters but by other Hibs fans making it known it was no longer acceptable.

Bostonhibby
25-03-2015, 12:01 PM
More... (http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/5298)

Another good move by the club, tough one but we have to start somewhere.

When I saw the headline I thought we were advertising tickets in advance for the play-offs against the rangers.

NAE NOOKIE
25-03-2015, 12:03 PM
If we are serious about kicking out bigotry then why did we allow hundreds of bigots into Easter Road on Sunday?
Pounds over principles.

In an ideal world that would be the way to go, but its not an ideal world is it.

If we banned the current buns without banning celtic and the Yams too it would not look like standing up to bigotry, it would look like taking sides with one set of bigots over another. Hibs view on bigotry, racism and sectarianism is crystal clear and there is proof of this in the clubs written policies and the fact that in the past prayer facilities have been set aside for our Muslim players.

Its Hibs responsibility to make clear their disapproval of bigotry. Its the job of the police to enforce the law regarding bigoted behaviour, though its clear that so long as there is enough of you doing it there is no chance of the police stepping in for fear of losing control of the situation.

The solution to this problem, at least inside the stadiums lies in the hands of the SFA the SPFL and of course The Rangers football club, Celtic FC and to a lesser extent Heart of Midlothian FC. We have the odd idiot ourselves, but I cant remember the last time I heard a Hibs crowd sing a song which could in any way be described as sectarian. "Go home ya Huns" doesn't count IMO.

Kojock
25-03-2015, 12:12 PM
Do you think we should have been banned from grounds because of the Skacel song then. We might be able to argue otherwise but most people outside of Hibs would see it as Racist so by your reasoning we should all be banned for being racists. How about banning the Hearts fans for homophobic abuse? Why stop there, there are some pretty distasteful songs sung by fans of every club. Where would it stop?
Education is the single most important tool in our armoury. Sectarian singing at ER by Hibs fans wasn't eradicated by banning supporters but by other Hibs fans making it known it was no longer acceptable.

The only time the Skacel song rears its ugly head is against Hearts and if they as a club banned Hibs supporters from their ground because of it then that would be a decision we would have to respect. If such drastic action was taken the decent Hibs fans would ensure the Skacel song was stopped immediately.

After the Hysel disaster Uefa banned every English Club from European competitions. Because of such drastic action the English FA took immediate steps to make it easier to ban trouble makers from entering stadiums.

WeeRussell
25-03-2015, 12:22 PM
In an ideal world that would be the way to go, but its not an ideal world is it.

If we banned the current buns without banning celtic and the Yams too it would not look like standing up to bigotry, it would look like taking sides with one set of bigots over another. Hibs view on bigotry, racism and sectarianism is crystal clear and there is proof of this in the clubs written policies and the fact that in the past prayer facilities have been set aside for our Muslim players.

Its Hibs responsibility to make clear their disapproval of bigotry. Its the job of the police to enforce the law regarding bigoted behaviour, though its clear that so long as there is enough of you doing it there is no chance of the police stepping in for fear of losing control of the situation.

The solution to this problem, at least inside the stadiums lies in the hands of the SFA the SPFL and of course The Rangers football club, Celtic FC and to a lesser extent Heart of Midlothian FC. We have the odd idiot ourselves, but I cant remember the last time I heard a Hibs crowd sing a song which could in any way be described as sectarian. "Go home ya Huns" doesn't count IMO.

Absolutely :aok:

HFC07
25-03-2015, 12:32 PM
It really is a question of What can football clubs actually do to eradicate sectarian singing?

They can education as much as possible, but where is the action when the sectarian singing is taking place?

All football club's say that sectarian singing will not be tolerated.... well it seems like it is being tolerated, nothing as far as I know is being done to those that partake in such songs.

Phil D. Rolls
26-03-2015, 08:05 AM
I'm with Kojock on this one. It's all very well clubs paying lip service with these campaigns. It amounts to nothing if they continue to allow fans of clubs who sing bigoted songs, to pay their way into the game.

This problem has gone on long enough, and there does not seem to be any progress in the fans of those clubs cleaning up their act. If Hibs and the rest are truly against it, it's time that they banned their fans.

No point in saying we despise bigotry and then cashing in on that bigotry as we did on Sunday. Stronger protest than a nice squeaky clean media campaign is needed. You can't be "a wee bit" anti bigotry.

blackpoolhibs
26-03-2015, 08:26 AM
I'm with Kojock on this one. It's all very well clubs paying lip service with these campaigns. It amounts to nothing if they continue to allow fans of clubs who sing bigoted songs, to pay their way into the game.

This problem has gone on long enough, and there does not seem to be any progress in the fans of those clubs cleaning up their act. If Hibs and the rest are truly against it, it's time that they banned their fans.

No point in saying we despise bigotry and then cashing in on that bigotry as we did on Sunday. Stronger protest than a nice squeaky clean media campaign is needed. You can't be "a wee bit" anti bigotry.

:agree: How many times have we heard the words, NOW its time for actions. The SFA will NEVER take the necessary steps to stop this, if they were not allowed to go to the games then the bile and hatred STOPS at football matches.

There will still be bigots, but there will not be airing their views at Easter Road. Now if every team did this, then Scottish football could rid itself of this disease very quickly.

Of course it would not get rid of it from society, but it would be a start.

We have to start somewhere, and this bollox about educating is just that. The knuckledraggers pass this on through the generations, if we are relying on education we will still be here in 500 years talking about this.

We have to start ourselves, and if football is genuine in ridding itself from this, then the clubs need to take the bull by the horns.

Pretty Boy
26-03-2015, 08:45 AM
Do we have an obligation to give a club tickets for an away match?

And could the decision to brand all visiting Celtic and Rangers fans as bigots not in itself be painted as bigoted by a media who habitually ignore the sectarian problem?

McIntosh
26-03-2015, 08:46 AM
I'm with Kojock on this one. It's all very well clubs paying lip service with these campaigns. It amounts to nothing if they continue to allow fans of clubs who sing bigoted songs, to pay their way into the game.

This problem has gone on long enough, and there does not seem to be any progress in the fans of those clubs cleaning up their act. If Hibs and the rest are truly against it, it's time that they banned their fans.

No point in saying we despise bigotry and then cashing in on that bigotry as we did on Sunday. Stronger protest than a nice squeaky clean media campaign is needed. You can't be "a wee bit" anti bigotry. :agree::top marks

Peevemor
26-03-2015, 09:00 AM
Do we have an obligation to give a club tickets for an away match?

And could the decision to brand all visiting Celtic and Rangers fans as bigots not in itself be painted as bigoted by a media who habitually ignore the sectarian problem?

In the cup yes, but I'm not sure for the league - remember the huns banning Celtc fans from a derby at Ibrox (JC free kick game).

greenginger
26-03-2015, 09:05 AM
The only way that these type of songs will be stopped would be by a points deduction by the SPFL.

First a warning , second time a provisional points deduction suspended , third repeat offence take points off the offending club.

Has Scottish Football got the balls to do this ? ...... Not in a month of Saturdays IMHO.

Bostonhibby
26-03-2015, 09:40 AM
The only way that these type of songs will be stopped would be by a points deduction by the SPFL.

First a warning , second time a provisional points deduction suspended , third repeat offence take points off the offending club.

Has Scottish Football got the balls to do this ? ...... Not in a month of Saturdays IMHO.

Maybe to one of the lesser sides as a statement of intent and to look good to FIFA and EUFA, but can you see them admitting they have a problem with the uglies, then warning them about possible action then actually doing something? Not a chance, the celtc and the rangers tail wags the senile overweight dog that is the SPFL/SFA.

JimBHibees
26-03-2015, 10:26 AM
:agree: How many times have we heard the words, NOW its time for actions. The SFA will NEVER take the necessary steps to stop this, if they were not allowed to go to the games then the bile and hatred STOPS at football matches.

There will still be bigots, but there will not be airing their views at Easter Road. Now if every team did this, then Scottish football could rid itself of this disease very quickly.

Of course it would not get rid of it from society, but it would be a start.

We have to start somewhere, and this bollox about educating is just that. The knuckledraggers pass this on through the generations, if we are relying on education we will still be here in 500 years talking about this.

We have to start ourselves, and if football is genuine in ridding itself from this, then the clubs need to take the bull by the horns.

Completely agree more this was pretty much gone from the game yet is now back as bad as ever. We got told the reason that the Football authorities couldn't deal with it was that the clubs themselves had agreed that the clubs could not be held responsible for the actions of their fans. To me that is the biggest cop out ever. No responsibility is irresponsibility.

JimBHibees
26-03-2015, 10:28 AM
The only way that these type of songs will be stopped would be by a points deduction by the SPFL.

First a warning , second time a provisional points deduction suspended , third repeat offence take points off the offending club.

Has Scottish Football got the balls to do this ? ...... Not in a month of Saturdays IMHO.

That would be too sensible and would kill it dead for good.

Hibbyradge
26-03-2015, 10:37 AM
The only way that these type of songs will be stopped would be by a points deduction by the SPFL.

First a warning , second time a provisional points deduction suspended , third repeat offence take points off the offending club.

Has Scottish Football got the balls to do this ? ...... Not in a month of Saturdays IMHO.

What's to stop someone taking a mob round to hearts matches to sing the sash etc every week. :wink:

Kojock
26-03-2015, 11:34 AM
Do we have an obligation to give a club tickets for an away match?

And could the decision to brand all visiting Celtic and Rangers fans as bigots not in itself be painted as bigoted by a media who habitually ignore the sectarian problem?

Only for cup games do you have to give visiting fans a % of tickets.

As for your second point I allude to my post where after the Hysel disaster ALL English clubs were banned from European competitions not just Liverpool who were involved that game.

Stranraer
26-03-2015, 12:42 PM
Glad to see this on the official site. A guy in Section 43 behind me complained to the Police (who had video cameras) that Rangers fans were singing the Billy Boys, that immediately provokes a reaction but I'm glad we only booed them when they started their pish.

Glorious St Pat
26-03-2015, 01:19 PM
It's another token gesture but right one by the club to ensure that they have measures in place with the offending behaviour at but the police and SFA are powerless to do anything as all the Scottish clubs bar three voted against 'strict liability' laws that punishes clubs for their fans behaviour. This vote was taken in 2013. Sanction include fines and points deductions. Both Celtic, Rangers and St Johnstone have been fined under such Uefa laws in the past.

Backward thinking again from our clubs in knocking back the vote.

Keith_M
26-03-2015, 01:26 PM
If Hibs are really serious about Bigotry, how about they make announcements at ER whenever The Rangers (or Hearts( singing their bigotted songs. They should specifically state in the announcement who it is they are asking to stop singing, e.g.


"This is a club announcement, we would kindly ask the Fans in the South Stand to abide by the rules on Bigotry and Racism and to stop singing offensive songs"

Glorious St Pat
26-03-2015, 01:39 PM
If Hibs are really serious about Bigotry, how about they make announcements at ER whenever The Rangers (or Hearts( singing their bigotted songs. They should specifically state in the announcement who it is they are asking to stop singing, e.g.


"This is a club announcement, we would kindly ask the Fans in the South Stand to abide by the rules on Bigotry and Racism and to stop singing offensive songs"

Nice idea but one that would probably backfire with the noise cranked up a notch.

Newry Hibs
26-03-2015, 01:40 PM
Only for cup games do you have to give visiting fans a % of tickets.

As for your second point I allude to my post where after the Hysel disaster ALL English clubs were banned from European competitions not just Liverpool who were involved that game.

Luton Town banned away fans in 1985/6 or so for a couple of years - after the Millwall riot. They were excluded from the League Cup because they wouldn't give away tickets.

Just Alf
26-03-2015, 08:04 PM
Really not sure why any Hibs fan can't see that this is a GOOD THING by our club?

Yeah, it's small steps and all that, but as each club begins to take them then it gets easier to point at those who are not coming on the same journey... Arguably the Yams, via the Budge, have already started and it's great we're on the same wavelength as them....

Unless we take those 1st steps nothing will ever change :dunno:

Phil D. Rolls
26-03-2015, 08:19 PM
Really not sure why any Hibs fan can't see that this is a GOOD THING by our club?

Yeah, it's small steps and all that, but as each club begins to take them then it gets easier to point at those who are not coming on the same journey... Arguably the Yams, via the Budge, have already started and it's great we're on the same wavelength as them....

Unless we take those 1st steps nothing will ever change :dunno:

You need both feet to take the small steps one after the other. If you are only stepping forward with one foot, you go round in circles.

This small step seems to be repeated over and over again - I mean, is this really the first time that Hibs and Hearts have spoken out against bigotry?

Initiatives like this are as effective as using a box of matches to melt an iceberg.

Sunday showed that the Hun still has the mentality that rules don't apply to him. Whether it's on the field, or off, they continue to thumb their nose at any form of authority.

I can't comment on what Timmy does these days, as we haven't played them recently. As well as that, they probably don't feel they need to bring out the song book to proclaim their version of history when they play us

I wish the whole lot of them would **** off back to 18th Century Europe. They'd feel at home there and the rest of us could get on with taking responsibility for our own failures, rather than looking for a bogeyman to blame our inadequacies on.

Just Alf
26-03-2015, 08:37 PM
You need both feet to take the small steps one after the other. If you are only stepping forward with one foot, you go round in circles.

This small step seems to be repeated over and over again - I mean, is this really the first time that Hibs and Hearts have spoken out against bigotry?

Initiatives like this are as effective as using a box of matches to melt an iceberg.

Sunday showed that the Hun still has the mentality that rules don't apply to him. Whether it's on the field, or off, they continue to thumb their nose at any form of authority.

I can't comment on what Timmy does these days, as we haven't played them recently. As well as that, they probably don't feel they need to bring out the song book to proclaim their version of history when they play us

I wish the whole lot of them would **** off back to 18th Century Europe. They'd feel at home there and the rest of us could get on with taking responsibility for our own failures, rather than looking for a bogeyman to blame our inadequacies on.

I get what you're saying and, sort of, agree.... I know it's not our 1st time on this path, but I do believe there's more of an appetite to progress this time around. I still think we have to start somewhere and if we keep fanning the flames yer wee match will gradually burn hotter and hotter and we will start to reduce the size of that iceberg! :-) all be it too slowly for many (me included) but at least it's a start.

Vini1875
26-03-2015, 08:39 PM
No club will sanctions on another club because of fan behaviour. The reason being that clubs do not trust their own fans to behave. The SPFL can't take action because the clubs won't back it.

blackpoolhibs
26-03-2015, 08:47 PM
I get what you're saying and, sort of, agree.... I know it's not our 1st time on this path, but I do believe there's more of an appetite to progress this time around. I still think we have to start somewhere and if we keep fanning the flames yer wee match will gradually burn hotter and hotter and we will start to reduce the size of that iceberg! :-) all be it too slowly for many (me included) but at least it's a start.

Not really is it, especially when you acknowledge at the beginning its not the 1st time we have gone down this path? :wink:

I know why clubs dont just stop these clubs who's fans are the whole cause of this problem, it all boils down to money. You either want rid of the problem and do the very thing that WILL stop it, or you throw out a few words and basically ignore it.

We all know what will happen.

Just Alf
26-03-2015, 09:01 PM
Not really is it, especially when you acknowledge at the beginning its not the 1st time we have gone down this path? :wink:

I know why clubs dont just stop these clubs who's fans are the whole cause of this problem, it all boils down to money. You either want rid of the problem and do the very thing that WILL stop it, or you throw out a few words and basically ignore it.

We all know what will happen.


Grrrrr! :greengrin

Ok... What I'm trying to say... At least it's a start, IF we're serious about it and don't let it fall away again ...... Something like that at least :agree:

Phil D. Rolls
26-03-2015, 09:05 PM
I get what you're saying and, sort of, agree.... I know it's not our 1st time on this path, but I do believe there's more of an appetite to progress this time around. I still think we have to start somewhere and if we keep fanning the flames yer wee match will gradually burn hotter and hotter and we will start to reduce the size of that iceberg! :-) all be it too slowly for many (me included) but at least it's a start.

I'm not so sure, Hibs should really have had more to say about Sunday's performance from the Govan Choir. What better time to take it up than when there is a new board in charge at iPox?

Scottish football has learned it can live without the Hun in the last three years - why not kill the beast when it is down? We'd be killing two birds with one stone, as their partners in crime would surely wither and die without them.

Without that pair and their grandiose ideas, we could have a sensible league that reflects the size of our country - dare I say it along Scandanavian lines.

As it stands Scottish Football is like a faded seaside resort. Large empty structures harking back to a bygone age, with no idea how to compete with the glamour of the continent.

It is a crumbling, post industrial city which thinks it still has a role to play in world affairs......eh, bit close to home there....we are the Whitley Bay of world football.

Jonny1875
27-03-2015, 07:55 AM
What were the Huns singing last weekend? Billy boys? As a 'fenian' it always makes me laugh hearing it.. Just shows those people haven't went through the process of evolution.

Phil D. Rolls
27-03-2015, 08:09 AM
What were the Huns singing last weekend? Billy boys? As a 'fenian' it always makes me laugh hearing it.. Just shows those people haven't went through the process of evolution.

I'm not a fenian Jonny - why does it make you laugh?