Persevere - Sunshine on Leith

[Glorious St Pat]

Was reading the wonderful Story behind Persevere on the outside of the Persevere pub and it got me thinking about our anthem.

The Leith coat of arms depicts a boat, Mary and Jesus and a bright ray of sunshine above. Is this possibly why the Proclaimers penned 'Sunshine on Leith' ie it was taken from the Leith coat of arms?

[VivaHiberña]

Interesting theory. Never thought of that but it's possible. Either way, "Persevere" as a motto for Leith has always struck me as an apt refrain for a Hibs fan.

[madabouthibs]

Wasn't Persevere the name of the album too? Or was that later, canny mind......

[Mr White]

Wasn't Persevere the name of the album too? Or was that later, canny mind......

Good bit later. Sunshine on leith album 1988, persevere released 2001 I think.

[jodjam]

Did they not come up with the idea for SoL when on a flight back into Edinburgh?

[aljo7-0]

In a parallel universe Hearts fans "The Anitclaimers" released their single "Peeing down on Tynecastle" from their album "Why persevere ..... just cheat"

[Bostonhibby]

In a parallel universe Hearts fans "The Anitclaimers" released their single "Peeing down on Tynecastle" from their album "Why persevere ..... just cheat"
[emoji1] [emoji106] Very good.

Gargoyles on gorgie sprang to mind.

[woodythehibee]

Did they not come up with the idea for SoL when on a flight back into Edinburgh?

Correct. Craig had the melody for months and months but couldn't quite get the lyrics. On a flight coming back to Edinburgh the sun was over Leith and the song was written in minutes after that :agree:

[Billy Whizz]

Correct. Craig had the melody for months and months but couldn't quite get the lyrics. On a flight coming back to Edinburgh the sun was over Leith and the song was written in minutes after that :agree:

Interesting, any idea what the lyrics might have been?

[woodythehibee]

Interesting, any idea what the lyrics might have been?

C&C have always said that it's a love song, either between a couple or perhaps with religious connotation with love to a potential higher power. I see it as a classic love song, with some hibee connotations :aok:

EDIT - misread your post, thought you were asking about the meaning. Don't think he had any lyrics for it. Just the melody then he got the spark and the rest is history :agree:

[Billy Whizz]

C&C have always said that it's a love song, either between a couple or perhaps with religious connotation with love to a potential higher power. I see it as a classic love song, with some hibee connotations :aok:

EDIT - misread your post, thought you were asking about the meaning. Don't think he had any lyrics for it. Just the melody then he got the spark and the rest is history :agree:

Thanks, thought maybe there was a "scrambled eggs" type lyric, similar to Yesterday

[Ronniekirk]

Correct. Craig had the melody for months and months but couldn't quite get the lyrics. On a flight coming back to Edinburgh the sun was over Leith and the song was written in minutes after that :agree:
Think he had the melody for over 12 months and Yep it was on a flight back to Edinburgh from Heathrow and when he saw the sunshine on the Docks at Lieth the phrase Sunshine on Leith came into his head and then he wrote the song within days seemingly .

[NadeAteMyLunch!]

I remember 'persevere' being written on the back of one our home tops a few years ago. Mowbray era maybe? Have always thought it should be a permanent feature. Great Leith Moto and perfectly sums up being a Hibs fan. It should certainly go on the top the season after we finally win this bloody cup(please be next season)

[Jack]

The Leith coat of arms is full of intrigue.

There's the ship, but should there lady be there, sometimes she is and sometimes she isn't ... who is she and who is the child that is sometimes and sometimes not in her arms?

Is there a link to the Davinci Code?

Is there a link to the ye olde and ancient stained glass windows in York Cathedral? Very close to each other are windows depicting the Leith coat of arms and folk getting pished lol.

The Leith coat of arms is facinatining ... as is the history of Leith; full of deceit, muurrduurr; suspicious goings on and Royalty, not to mention the [inadvertent] role in the demise of Scotland as a nation.

[Future17]

In a parallel universe Hearts fans "The Anticlaimers" released their single "Peeing down on Tynecastle" from their album "Why persevere ..... just cheat"

Not to forget their follow-up alternative to "Letter From America" which I believe was called "Fax From Lithuania".

[CropleyWasGod]

As a kid, I remember people talked about Sunny Leith. I assumed SOL came from that.

[Vini1875]

As a kid, I remember people talked about Sunny Leith. I assumed SOL came from that.

I assumed the same.

[Glorious St Pat]

The Leith coat of arms is full of intrigue.

There's the ship, but should there lady be there, sometimes she is and sometimes she isn't ... who is she and who is the child that is sometimes and sometimes not in her arms?

Is there a link to the Davinci Code?

Is there a link to the ye olde and ancient stained glass windows in York Cathedral? Very close to each other are windows depicting the Leith coat of arms and folk getting pished lol.

The Leith coat of arms is facinatining ... as is the history of Leith; full of deceit, muurrduurr; suspicious goings on and Royalty, not to mention the [inadvertent] role in the demise of Scotland as a nation.

I was always under the impression that the lady and child were Mary and Baby Jesus. Mary is the patron saint of all sea men so it would make sense.

[Glorious St Pat]

I remember 'persevere' being written on the back of one our home tops a few years ago. Mowbray era maybe? Have always thought it should be a permanent feature. Great Leith Moto and perfectly sums up being a Hibs fan. It should certainly go on the top the season after we finally win this bloody cup(please be next season)

Cant remember that....sure it wasn't 'since 1875'? I have the bottle green away strip from around that time and it has that on the back.

[Jack]

I was always under the impression that the lady and child were Mary and Baby Jesus. Mary is the patron saint of all sea men so it would make sense.

Others suggest the child is the son of Jesus in the arms of his mother, Mary Magdalene!

Edit Neither Mary is the Patron Saint of Seamen/sailors.

From Wiki
Nicholas of Myra – sailors, fishermen , merchants , pharmacists , archers, pawnbrokers , lawyers in Paris bar
Nicholas of Tolentine – Mariners

[Mr White]

I was always under the impression that the lady and child were Mary and Baby Jesus. Mary is the patron saint of all sea men so it would make sense.

I'm sure there's a captain pugwash-esque joke in there somewhere about the irony of that.

[Glorious St Pat]

I'm sure there's a captain pugwash-esque joke in there somewhere about the irony of that.

I was waiting for a typical response!

[Mr White]

I was waiting for a typical response!

You set them up etc etc :greengrin

[One Day]

Others suggest the child is the son of Jesus in the arms of his mother, Mary Magdalene!

Edit Neither Mary is the Patron Saint of Seamen/sailors.

From Wiki
Nicholas of Myra – sailors, fishermen , merchants , pharmacists , archers, pawnbrokers , lawyers in Paris bar
Nicholas of Tolentine – Mariners

Don't think that's right they were two different people

[NadeAteMyLunch!]

Cant remember that....sure it wasn't 'since 1875'? I have the bottle green away strip from around that time and it has that on the back.

Pretty sure. The bottle green was defo 'since 1875' but I'm fairly sure the home top said 'persevere' just below the collar on the back. 2007 I think

[Glorious St Pat]

Others suggest the child is the son of Jesus in the arms of his mother, Mary Magdalene!

Edit Neither Mary is the Patron Saint of Seamen/sailors.

From Wiki
Nicholas of Myra – sailors, fishermen , merchants , pharmacists , archers, pawnbrokers , lawyers in Paris bar
Nicholas of Tolentine – Mariners

Think you've muddled this bit up Jack - some speculation that Mary Magdalene, a follower of Jesus who was at the crucifixion and at the tomb, was alleged to have had two children to Jesus. The church have refuted this accusation and were raging at Scorcese's 'Last Temptation of Christ' film alluding to the above.

If I've got the patron saint bit wrong...fair enough.

[Glorious St Pat]

Ok Mary might not be the patron saint of seamen/sailors but possibly her depiction on the boat is due to 'Stella Maris' - Mary Star of the Sea. Another Hibernian connection due to the Constitution Church playing a major role in our rebirth.

[Jack]

Ok Mary might not be the patron saint of seamen/sailors but possibly her depiction on the boat is due to 'Stella Maris' - Mary Star of the Sea. Another Hibernian connection due to the Constitution Church playing a major role in our rebirth.

I don't really think there's any right or wrong in the stories. There's so much speculation and so little fact that can be evidenced.

I had a wee quest a couple of years ago trying to find out more and maybe find enough evidence to be at least fairly certain what the story was. Alas like the Holy Grail itself I could find nothing to prove anything.

It was a facinatining read though, that, and the general history of Leith.

[Bostonhibby]

I don't really think there's any right or wrong in the stories. There's so much speculation and so little fact that can be evidenced.

I had a wee quest a couple of years ago trying to find out more and maybe find enough evidence to be at least fairly certain what the story was. Alas like the Holy Grail itself I could find nothing to prove anything.

It was a facinatining read though, that, and the general history of Leith.
Agree; reading The Water of Leith just now. Edited by Stanley Jamieson for the water of Leith project group. On page 165 they reproduce the coat of arms and the cloud is definitely above the boat but no rays of sunshine. Maybe I'll colour it in[emoji1]

[Mikey]

I was always under the impression that the lady and child were Mary and Baby Jesus. Mary is the patron saint of all sea men so it would make sense.

It's Leeann and Alan.

[Pretty Boy]

It's Leeann and Alan.

'But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation'.

Mark 3:29.

[Mikey]

'But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation'.

Mark 3:29.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk

[Bostonhibby]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk

Blessed are the green for they shall inherit the earth - **** the rangers

A.N Atheist

Something like that anyway.

[Jack]

Agree; reading The Water of Leith just now. Edited by Stanley Jamieson for the water of Leith project group. On page 165 they reproduce the coat of arms and the cloud is definitely above the boat but no rays of sunshine. Maybe I'll colour it in[emoji1]

The cloud will mysteriously disappear when we get promoted and/or lift the Scottish Cup ;-)

[Pretty Boy]

The Leith coat of arms is full of intrigue.

There's the ship, but should there lady be there, sometimes she is and sometimes she isn't ... who is she and who is the child that is sometimes and sometimes not in her arms?

Is there a link to the Davinci Code?

Is there a link to the ye olde and ancient stained glass windows in York Cathedral? Very close to each other are windows depicting the Leith coat of arms and folk getting pished lol.

The Leith coat of arms is facinatining ... as is the history of Leith; full of deceit, muurrduurr; suspicious goings on and Royalty, not to mention the [inadvertent] role in the demise of Scotland as a nation.

Any idea where about in York Minster the Leith coat of arms is J?

I've been round there a few times and can't say I've ever spotted it.

[Jack]

Any idea where about in York Minster the Leith coat of arms is J?

I've been round there a few times and can't say I've ever spotted it.

It's one of the stained glass windows.

I took photos but that might have even been with an older phone. TBH it's maybe not Leith but the resemblance is uncanny to the point of plagiarism. My suspicions were raised when very close to it was scene of drunkenness!

I'm off to the match now but I'll spend some time tomorrow trying to find them.

[hibernator]

The Leith coat of arms is full of intrigue.

There's the ship, but should there lady be there, sometimes she is and sometimes she isn't ... who is she and who is the child that is sometimes and sometimes not in her arms?

Is there a link to the Davinci Code?

Is there a link to the ye olde and ancient stained glass windows in York Cathedral? Very close to each other are windows depicting the Leith coat of arms and folk getting pished lol.

The Leith coat of arms is facinatining ... as is the history of Leith; full of deceit, muurrduurr; suspicious goings on and Royalty, not to mention the [inadvertent] role in the demise of Scotland as a nation.

Search Leith Black Madonna, see http://www.leithhistory.co.uk/category/knights-templar/ for instance :
It is also a fact that Leith was Church Property during the Middle Ages and the representation of Mary Magdalene was used to show what property was owned by the church and this in time came to represent Leith.
In fact what we have on the Coat of Arms of Leith is a form of Black Madonna. That is the possible reason why the Coat of Arms of Leith weren’t changed at the Reformation for the simple fact it didn’t represent the Virgin Mary at all but St Mary Magdalene.

[Jack]

It's one of the stained glass windows.

I took photos but that might have even been with an older phone. TBH it's maybe not Leith but the resemblance is uncanny to the point of plagiarism. My suspicions were raised when very close to it was scene of drunkenness!

I'm off to the match now but I'll spend some time tomorrow trying to find them.

Here it is. My memory was maybe playing tricks on me, my apologies, the caption for whatever it says its Noahs Ark! But you can see the similarity.