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superfurryhibby
02-12-2014, 06:36 PM
Just listening to Sportsound and there is speculation that Butcher will be the next Motherwell manager. Comment suggests that this is pretty much a done deal.

That would be a boost to our finances. Please be true

Bostonhibby
02-12-2014, 06:38 PM
Please be true.maybe they feel they didn't sack him properly last time and need another go at it?

Hibernia&Alba
02-12-2014, 06:40 PM
They must be mad. He did a decent job there first time around, but he was the worst Hibs manager I've ever seen, even including Calderfud.

sleeping giant
02-12-2014, 06:46 PM
He can do a job if he is allowed to get the players with "his" mindset .
Hope he relegates them though.

Pete
02-12-2014, 06:47 PM
Bringing him in halfway through a season is madness if he is going to behave in a similar way to the way he did here.

If he hasn't changed the only way it could work is if he is brought in at the start of a campaign and allowed to bring in suitable players.

Motherwell would be taking a massive gamble. Better sticking with Black, seeing how it goes and bringing in Butcher, Malpas and Marsella at the immediate end of the season if need be.

Hibernia&Alba
02-12-2014, 06:49 PM
Wonder whether Malpas would return to Motherwell with Butcher. He was a disaster in his season in charge there.

Andy74
02-12-2014, 06:53 PM
Might save us a few bob. Good luck Terry.

Pretty Boy
02-12-2014, 06:54 PM
Please please please.

Motherwell are a team I could never take to so it would be good to watch him **** them over.

The added bonus is he stops getting a monthly handout from us for **** all.

Keith_M
02-12-2014, 06:54 PM
I'd imagine that everybody at Hibs will have their fingers crossed for this.

Mr White
02-12-2014, 06:56 PM
I'd imagine that everybody at Hibs will have their fingers crossed for this.

Ross county and st mirren too I expect.

Keith_M
02-12-2014, 06:58 PM
Ross county and st mirren too I expect.


:tee hee:

Squealing pig
02-12-2014, 07:06 PM
God help them if true .

superfurryhibby
02-12-2014, 07:07 PM
No mention of Malpas. It was a news snippet but the response from the guys on the programme suggested it was no surprise. I think the man in the know was Martin Dowden, one of the producers of the show

SaulGoodman
02-12-2014, 07:10 PM
They really need to bring in Malpas and the super scout/goalie coach extraordinaire Marsella otherwise Butcher might no do as good a job as he did here.



Oh wait.




Fud.

Bronson
02-12-2014, 07:19 PM
I really hate that man.

I didn't even hate him when we got relegated and he was still in charge because I wasn't sure who to blame. But since he's been sacked and everything he did has came out in the wash, I really detest him.

God help Motherwell FC.

KeithTheHibby
02-12-2014, 07:22 PM
Hope he gets it and we can get the muppet off our wage bill.

whiskyhibby
02-12-2014, 07:29 PM
They really need to bring in Malpas and the super scout/goalie coach extraordinaire Marsella otherwise Butcher might no do as good a job as he did here.



Oh wait.




Fud.

Agree! And you're right about him being a fud [emoji1]

Sergio sledge
02-12-2014, 07:31 PM
Butcher is a brilliant manager and an appointment like this is likely to have Motherwell challenging Celtic for many years to come.*










*for the benefit of any Motherwell board members watching this thread.

Broken Gnome
02-12-2014, 07:33 PM
Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff.

Cup win, or promotion by relegating Butcher?

Northernhibee
02-12-2014, 07:36 PM
Never mind a taxi, I'll offer him a piggyback all the way there.

Not Marsella though.

CallumLaidlaw
02-12-2014, 07:40 PM
Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff. Playoff.

Cup win, or promotion by relegating Butcher?

wow, now that would be an interesting 2 legs. Us vs Butchers motherwell!! I expect there would be a few in the Hibs squad that would be VERY keen to prove a point in those games!!!

Northernhibee
02-12-2014, 07:42 PM
I'd take the chance to relegate that horrific bullying ****wit every day of the week.

H18sry
02-12-2014, 07:43 PM
Might save us a few bob. Good luck Terry.

:confused: Really? after what he did to us l hope he flops everywhere he goes.

silverhibee
02-12-2014, 07:44 PM
Just listening to Sportsound and there is speculation that Butcher will be the next Motherwell manager. Comment suggests that this is pretty much a done deal.

That would be a boost to our finances. Please be true


Can't see this happening, would like it to happen as it would get him of our wage bill, but no chance this will happen, yes Butcher will want to get back in to football but Motherwell are skint and i think Butcher will sit tight on gardening leave picking up his nice wage until the summer and then try to get back in to football then.

And Motherwell are only looking for a manager, not a management team, Well will go for the young cheap manager option.

NORTHERNHIBBY
02-12-2014, 07:58 PM
Bet you that Rod will scupper the deal because Well won't offer up enough compensation.

Baldy Foghorn
02-12-2014, 07:58 PM
:confused: Really? after what he did to us l hope he flops everywhere he goes.

Think Andy was being sarcastic, saying good luck in getting job, would get him off our wage bill.....

Jamesie
02-12-2014, 08:10 PM
Can't see this happening, would like it to happen as it would get him of our wage bill, but no chance this will happen, yes Butcher will want to get back in to footballbut Motherwell are skint and i think Butcher will sit tight on gardening leave picking up his nice wage until the summer and then try to get back in to football then.

And Motherwell are only looking for a manager, not a management team, Well will go for the young cheap manager option.

I'm not convinced TBH. A few months before he got emptied from Hibs he was talking about his retirement plans in a Scotsman interview.

emerald green
02-12-2014, 08:34 PM
Why would Motherwell take that f***wit, having seen how his ridiculous mismanagement of Hibs (and clubs before us) was largely responsible for the playing side of the club disintegrating, and ultimately ending in relegation?

The thing that still amazes me was his record at ICT. Did he just strike it lucky there?

bingo70
02-12-2014, 08:38 PM
Has it been confirmed anywhere that we're still paying him and this would stop if he joined someone else?

Waxy
02-12-2014, 08:43 PM
So, for a carlsberg season, we beat QOS in the first playoff, beat the yams in the second playoff, then relegate butchers Motherwell to win promotion, and win the Scottish cup also.

SteveHFC
02-12-2014, 08:46 PM
So, for a carlsberg season, we beat QOS in the first playoff, beat the yams in the second playoff, then relegate butchers Motherwell to win promotion, and win the Scottish cup also.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/gallery/yes/yesjacknicholson.gif

SunshineOnLeith
02-12-2014, 08:56 PM
Just in case the motherwell board are reading....

Best manager we ever had. Honest.

Swedish hibee
02-12-2014, 09:09 PM
I hate that man. I hate Motherwell. Perfect match really :aok:

Pretty Boy
02-12-2014, 09:20 PM
Has it been confirmed anywhere that we're still paying him and this would stop if he joined someone else?

He's on gardening leave, as confirmed by himself, which generally means they remain on the payroll for a notice period. In a fixed term contract like those in football that will be for the remainder of the contract or another agreed timescale.

I can only assume this stops as soon as he gets another job as that would end his contract with Hibs.

bingo70
02-12-2014, 09:29 PM
He's on gardening leave, as confirmed by himself, which generally means they remain on the payroll for a notice period. In a fixed term contract like those in football that will be for the remainder of the contract or another agreed timescale.

I can only assume this stops as soon as he gets another job as that would end his contract with Hibs.

Cheers

Springbank
02-12-2014, 09:32 PM
As an attempt at a balanced honest view...

When ICT appointed Yogi I was like 99% of Hibs fans thinking "what a mistake, he was found out at ER, he had no Plan B".
Yogi's been top of the league and a penalty away from winning silverware in Inverness, better than we've done in that time.

So, when I'm like most Hibs fans thinking "what are Motherwell doing here" they might be thinking of Butcher pre-Hibs, the sought-after ICT boss, successful on a shoestring.

Some managers are the right fit for some clubs and totally wrong for others. Alan Stubbs seems to be a good fit for us Butcher never really was, far too 19th century in his tactics for my liking, but successful at other clubs.

Hope Motherwell throw him a career lifeline...and Hibs free up a wage

Aitchy
02-12-2014, 09:47 PM
As an attempt at a balanced honest view...

When ICT appointed Yogi I was like 99% of Hibs fans thinking "what a mistake, he was found out at ER, he had no Plan B".
Yogi's been top of the league and a penalty away from winning silverware in Inverness, better than we've done in that time.

So, when I'm like most Hibs fans thinking "what are Motherwell doing here" they might be thinking of Butcher pre-Hibs, the sought-after ICT boss, successful on a shoestring.

Some managers are the right fit for some clubs and totally wrong for others. Alan Stubbs seems to be a good fit for us Butcher never really was, far too 19th century in his tactics for my liking, but successful at other clubs.

Hope Motherwell throw him a career lifeline...and Hibs free up a wage

What other clubs? Abject failure everywhere's he's been aside from Inverness. You, like Petrie, should have checked his wikipedia page.

Bishop Hibee
02-12-2014, 09:56 PM
I hate that man. I hate Motherwell. Perfect match really :aok:

This. I'm looking forward to pumping them in the play-offs already!

#FromTheCapital
02-12-2014, 09:58 PM
Hmm failing spl team needs a manager not long before Christmas. Enter Terry Butcher, where have I heard that before?...
Can honestly see them being relegated if he gets the job. Not that I give a ****. Would be perfection if we gained promotion by beating butchers Motherwell in the playoffs... After knocking hearts out beforehand of course :greengrin

yekimevol
02-12-2014, 10:09 PM
:rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao: :rotflmao:

Good luck, enjoy relegation !!!! He is the worst manager ive seen at easter road made caldo look like a saint.

HoboHarry
02-12-2014, 10:09 PM
What other clubs? Abject failure everywhere's he's been aside from Inverness. You, like Petrie, should have checked his wikipedia page.

Not to mention the large number of hibs fans who thought it was a good appointment at the time. Good number of those same fans have convenient memories though.

Glory Lurker
02-12-2014, 10:13 PM
Not to mention the large number of hibs fans who thought it was a good appointment at the time. Good number of those same fans have convenient memories though.

I wasn't one of them. Was always going to end in tears.

Sorry, I know you weren't speaking to me, but thought I'd take the chance to claim innocence!

PatHead
02-12-2014, 10:18 PM
Not to mention the large number of hibs fans who thought it was a good appointment at the time. Good number of those same fans have convenient memories though.

I thought he was a good appointment but admit I got it totally wrong.

HoboHarry
02-12-2014, 10:20 PM
I thought he was a good appointment but admit I got it totally wrong.

Oh me too. I got that one completely wrong but there are a few inherent who will deny it.

HoboHarry
02-12-2014, 10:21 PM
Bloody auto spell. On here is what I meant.

SaulGoodman
02-12-2014, 10:22 PM
I thought he was a good appointment but admit I got it totally wrong.

He's a great talker, he had most of us fooled.

Let's face it if he wasn't a good talker he's be nowhere near football management by now.

Northernhibee
02-12-2014, 10:22 PM
I thought he was a cracking signing that showed ambition. Got that one wrong.

stoneyburn hibs
02-12-2014, 10:28 PM
Great for us if he gets the gig. Whilst I don't wish any bad luck on Motherwell, I want the worst of luck for that arse.

HoboHarry
02-12-2014, 10:50 PM
Great for us if he gets the gig. Whilst I don't wish any bad luck on Motherwell, I want the worst of luck for that arse.

That's about where I am at too.

greenpaper55
02-12-2014, 11:38 PM
Have to own up that i thought he was the man for us but how wrong i was, i also thought McCall would have been good but it seems i was wrong there as well ! Fans on the board, better keep us away from appointing managers !.

Iain G
02-12-2014, 11:40 PM
I thought he was a cracking signing that showed ambition. Got that one wrong.

Based on what he was achieving up north in his current ob, he was a good appointment to take us on from Pat, sometimes it just doesn't translate from one club to another, Butchers career shows more than many that sometimes a manager and a club just click and fit well together.

Mixu62
02-12-2014, 11:46 PM
Can just imagine a play off against 'Well with both sets of fans singing "butcher butcher GTF......":greengrin

jacomo
02-12-2014, 11:54 PM
Not to mention the large number of hibs fans who thought it was a good appointment at the time. Good number of those same fans have convenient memories though.

Eh? You admit you also thought he was a good appointment at the time and yet you are trying to score points? WTF are you on about?

A lot of us (me included) thought Butcher would sort us out, turned out we were wrong. Give it a rest FFS.

jacomo
02-12-2014, 11:54 PM
:confused: Really? after what he did to us l hope he flops everywhere he goes.

Massive whoosh.

Bronson
02-12-2014, 11:54 PM
Even if he doesn't get the Motherwell job, he might be in line to replace Tommy Craig at St Mirren, his coat is on a very shakey peg. A team even more likely to fall victim to the play-offs.

jacomo
03-12-2014, 12:06 AM
Even if he doesn't get the Motherwell job, he might be in line to replace Tommy Craig at St Mirren, his coat is on a very shakey peg. A team even more likely to fall victim to the play-offs.

I have got zero interest in some kind of grudge match against Butcher if we make the play offs. I never want him anywhere near ER again, in any capacity. But I do want him off our wage bill.

Diclonius
03-12-2014, 12:25 AM
Please let this be true. Nothing would be sweeter than relegating Butcher.

HoboHarry
03-12-2014, 01:37 AM
Eh? You admit you also thought he was a good appointment at the time and yet you are trying to score points? WTF are you on about?

A lot of us (me included) thought Butcher would sort us out, turned out we were wrong. Give it a rest FFS.

Errrrrr no. I will give my opinion when I feel like it. Just like you do except I won't use sweary words. I'm not that rude.

muzzhfc
03-12-2014, 01:44 AM
Bet you that Rod will scupper the deal because Well won't offer up enough compensation.

More than likely. No doubt TB will want a month or two's wages too and Petrie will crap himself and decide its better to keep paying him, rather than a lump sum of a month or two's wages and just accepting no compo.


So, for a carlsberg season, we beat QOS in the first playoff, beat the yams in the second playoff, then relegate butchers Motherwell to win promotion, and win the Scottish cup also.

More like, for a Carlsberg season; we win the league and the cup. Yams get relegated and the huns go into liquidation again.


What other clubs? Abject failure everywhere's he's been aside from Inverness. You, like Petrie, should have checked his wikipedia page.

isn't part of the reason we are in this league is due to Wiki? Didn't previous scouts use wiki to "scout" players? Malonga's wiki page isn't great but he is doing well. as is stubbs . . .

To be honest, I thought that TB would have done well with us but it didn't work out. He done well with ITC and done OK with Motherwell first time round so it is understandable that people would think he would do well with us, especially as he has the gift of the gab. prick.

Winston Ingram
03-12-2014, 02:38 AM
As an attempt at a balanced honest view...

When ICT appointed Yogi I was like 99% of Hibs fans thinking "what a mistake, he was found out at ER, he had no Plan B".
Yogi's been top of the league and a penalty away from winning silverware in Inverness, better than we've done in that time.

So, when I'm like most Hibs fans thinking "what are Motherwell doing here" they might be thinking of Butcher pre-Hibs, the sought-after ICT boss, successful on a shoestring.

Some managers are the right fit for some clubs and totally wrong for others. Alan Stubbs seems to be a good fit for us Butcher never really was, far too 19th century in his tactics for my liking, but successful at other clubs.

Hope Motherwell throw him a career lifeline...and Hibs free up a wage

I thought this Butcher was a success pre-Hibs myth had been put to bed.

Taking away other clubs points deductions, he's finished bottom in his 1st season with every Scottish club he's been with. His other jobs outside Scotland in the last decade have seen him binned after 6 months.

The only 'success' he's had is 1 4th place finish with ICT.

If Butcher gets the Motherwell job, the only thing it'll guarantee is Championship football

McIntosh
03-12-2014, 07:08 AM
If he get the jobs I wonder if he will take Malpas. Then it is two wages released.

KeithTheHibby
03-12-2014, 07:20 AM
It surprises me that any club is remotely interested in taking him at all. Putting aside his horrendous record as Hibs manager, it was clear from current and ex players that his man-management skills were shocking and single handedly managed to destroy a squads confidence in the space of a few months.

Jim44
03-12-2014, 07:38 AM
He can do a job if he is allowed to get the players with "his" mindset .
Hope he relegates them though.

Do you mean players who respond to bullying, waffle and the occasional fish supper?

ArmadaleHibs
03-12-2014, 08:42 AM
I can just see it now. He takes the Motherwell job and they end up in the playoffs and who do they go up against, yeh, us.

It's got pain written all over it lol

Billy Whizz
03-12-2014, 09:06 AM
If he get the jobs I wonder if he will take Malpas. Then it is two wages released.

The report suggested that whoever gets it, will keep Kenny Black as his assistant

keep the faith
03-12-2014, 09:07 AM
I would be surprised if he is interested. I reckon he is happy on paid garden leave and doing tv work.
Hope I'm wrong.

Keith_M
03-12-2014, 11:16 AM
I would be surprised if he is interested. I reckon he is happy on paid garden leave and doing tv work.
Hope I'm wrong.

That's a possibility. It's also possible that taking the Motherwell job could mean a loss in income, as Hibs may well have him on a higher contract than Motherwell would be willing to offer.


If we could just get him, Malpas and Marsella off the wage bill, it would free up the money for Sparky's wages in January..............

Heisenberg
03-12-2014, 11:24 AM
Marsella has a job at Grimsby now so I'd assume we aren't paying him. Would be lovely to get rid of Butchers wage but can't see him taking the job.

Smartie
03-12-2014, 11:32 AM
We could look a bit silly if he goes there and is a roaring success.

I still think that given time and an opportunity to get players in who buy into his methods he can do a job. We were absolutely 100% the wrong place for him to come to last year though and Motherwell right now has a similar feel to it. I can't see us getting him off the payroll any time soon.

I don't actually bear him any ill feeling at all. He was part of a problem, no doubt about it, but it oversimplifies it to blame all our ills on one man. Our relegation was combination of mangerial ineptitude over Mixu, Yogi, Calderwood, Fenlon and Butcher/ Malpas. Butcher was just the last nightmare in a chain of nightmares but mostly to blame was the clown who appointed them all then didn't back them (and I don't mean financially which you could argue he did).

PeterboroHibee
03-12-2014, 11:41 AM
We could look a bit silly if he goes there and is a roaring success.

I still think that given time and an opportunity to get players in who buy into his methods he can do a job. We were absolutely 100% the wrong place for him to come to last year though and Motherwell right now has a similar feel to it. I can't see us getting him off the payroll any time soon.

I don't actually bear him any ill feeling at all. He was part of a problem, no doubt about it, but it oversimplifies it to blame all our ills on one man. Our relegation was combination of mangerial ineptitude over Mixu, Yogi, Calderwood, Fenlon and Butcher/ Malpas. Butcher was just the last nightmare in a chain of nightmares but mostly to blame was the clown who appointed them all then didn't back them (and I don't mean financially which you could argue he did).

Although I agree with your last point (it is a much longer term problem), Im still puzzled as to how Butcher managed to take us from being on the verge of the top 6 in January, to relegated in May. It must be up there as one of the worst collapses (if not the worst) in modern Scottish football.

Ultimately Butcher has the second worst win % in our history, and managed to take the team down. During that he played horrible football, seemed to struggle to get his ideas across to the vast majority of the team (including falling out with/alienating some of them), and couldnt adapt his tactics to the players available. He has definitely had success elsewhere, but given that 2 of his last 3 jobs have been complete disasters, I struggle to see why clubs are looking to him.

In saying that Ill be delighted if he gets the job so we get him off of our wage bill.

Bronson
03-12-2014, 12:06 PM
I have got zero interest in some kind of grudge match against Butcher if we make the play offs. I never want him anywhere near ER again, in any capacity. But I do want him off our wage bill.

I would love to cap off our season by relegating that tosser to gain promotion. The fact it's him would make it that extra bit sweeter for me, and I won't pretend otherwise.

bigwheel
03-12-2014, 12:19 PM
We could look a bit silly if he goes there and is a roaring success.

I still think that given time and an opportunity to get players in who buy into his methods he can do a job. We were absolutely 100% the wrong place for him to come to last year though and Motherwell right now has a similar feel to it. I can't see us getting him off the payroll any time soon.

I don't actually bear him any ill feeling at all. He was part of a problem, no doubt about it, but it oversimplifies it to blame all our ills on one man. Our relegation was combination of mangerial ineptitude over Mixu, Yogi, Calderwood, Fenlon and Butcher/ Malpas. Butcher was just the last nightmare in a chain of nightmares but mostly to blame was the clown who appointed them all then didn't back them (and I don't mean financially which you could argue he did).

Nobody is putting all on one man , but I do bear him many ills - he took a mid table team , decimated our performances and relegated our club - at the worst possible time

I frankly couldn't care if he secures success elsewhere - nothing will change my opinion of him and his team as football dinosaurs - I am so delighted they are no longer at this club

southsider
03-12-2014, 12:26 PM
I would love to cap off our season by relegating that tosser to gain promotion. The fact it's him would make it that extra bit sweeter for me, and I won't pretend otherwise.
And it would really annoy Tam Cowan, which would delight ME !

Smartie
03-12-2014, 01:30 PM
Nobody is putting all on one man , but I do bear him many ills - he took a mid table team , decimated our performances and relegated our club - at the worst possible time

I frankly couldn't care if he secures success elsewhere - nothing will change my opinion of him and his team as football dinosaurs - I am so delighted they are no longer at this club

I accept we were a mid-table team but we were lucky to be there. Some of the performances under Fenlon at the start of that season were brutal (the 1-0 win at Partick Thistle, the derbies against the worst ever Hearts team). Fenlon walked because he felt he'd lost the dressing room - I don't think there was anything like enough "mental toughness" there, no spirit, not enough graft and any "next manager" was going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Butcher did well to get a slight short-term improvement but the demise from January onwards was spectacular. The January transfer window was spectacularly bad, appallingly mismanaged by Butcher AND Petrie (telling players they could leave then having to turn to them later on when they couldn't be moved on, the loan signings etc etc) and reeked of complacency. I think that the downturn in our fortunes was inevitable from that point and when you end up in a terrible run of form like that it can be impossible to turn it around.

I like Stubbs a lot, much more than I liked Butcher and I'm glad he's gone. But I don't know how much Stubbs (or anyone else) would/could have done with the mess that Butcher inherited, then the Petrie-esque transfer window. At least Stubbs had the chance to bring in a raft of new, better players and clearing out a lot of the crap had already been done by then.

I'm in no way a Butcher fan but he had no chance of succeeding at Hibs. Although he did manage to make a total arse of an already bad situation.

Prawn Sandwich
03-12-2014, 01:43 PM
The main rumour doing the rounds in Motherwell is that a London based consortium with strong links with South America is likely to take the club over. They want to install Nobby Solano as Manager and use the club as feeder for South American players.

Sorry to disappoint if like me you want Butcher and bad-pass off the wage bill.

lapsedhibee
03-12-2014, 01:48 PM
The main rumour doing the rounds in Motherwell is that a London based consortium with strong links with South America is likely to take the club over. They want to install Nobby Solano as Manager and use the club as feeder for South American players.
Can't quite put my finger on it but this business model rings a bit of a bell. :hmmm:

Andy74
03-12-2014, 02:02 PM
I accept we were a mid-table team but we were lucky to be there. Some of the performances under Fenlon at the start of that season were brutal (the 1-0 win at Partick Thistle, the derbies against the worst ever Hearts team). Fenlon walked because he felt he'd lost the dressing room - I don't think there was anything like enough "mental toughness" there, no spirit, not enough graft and any "next manager" was going to be on a hiding to nothing.

Butcher did well to get a slight short-term improvement but the demise from January onwards was spectacular. The January transfer window was spectacularly bad, appallingly mismanaged by Butcher AND Petrie (telling players they could leave then having to turn to them later on when they couldn't be moved on, the loan signings etc etc) and reeked of complacency. I think that the downturn in our fortunes was inevitable from that point and when you end up in a terrible run of form like that it can be impossible to turn it around.

I like Stubbs a lot, much more than I liked Butcher and I'm glad he's gone. But I don't know how much Stubbs (or anyone else) would/could have done with the mess that Butcher inherited, then the Petrie-esque transfer window. At least Stubbs had the chance to bring in a raft of new, better players and clearing out a lot of the crap had already been done by then.

I'm in no way a Butcher fan but he had no chance of succeeding at Hibs. Although he did manage to make a total arse of an already bad situation.

That's nonsense.

We were short of where we expected to be, top 3 or 4, but we were getting there after a poor start.

We might not have got there obviously but we were most certainly not in any danger of being dragged into any relegation difficulty.

That Hibs team at the time needed some pace and urgency added to the set up that was there - the likes of Kennedy and McGeouch would have been perfect in that team.

There is absolutley no excuse for Butcher to have put us where we find ourselves now.

By the way the pick up in results stuff about Butcher arriving is also myth, might have seemed like that with the immediate couple of results before he arrived, some of which were with Nichol, but as I made clear at the time almost every result we had even in that relatively decent period was no better and more often worse than the corresponding earlier game - and it got much worse from there.

Bronson
03-12-2014, 02:13 PM
And it would really annoy Tam Cowan, which would delight ME !

Another welt of the highest order, good call.

silverhibee
03-12-2014, 02:17 PM
Do you mean players who respond to bullying, waffle and the occasional fish supper?

Worked at ICT. :wink: :greengrin

Smartie
03-12-2014, 02:36 PM
That's nonsense.

We were short of where we expected to be, top 3 or 4, but we were getting there after a poor start.

We might not have got there obviously but we were most certainly not in any danger of being dragged into any relegation difficulty.

That Hibs team at the time needed some pace and urgency added to the set up that was there - the likes of Kennedy and McGeouch would have been perfect in that team.

There is absolutley no excuse for Butcher to have put us where we find ourselves now.

By the way the pick up in results stuff about Butcher arriving is also myth, might have seemed like that with the immediate couple of results before he arrived, some of which were with Nichol, but as I made clear at the time almost every result we had even in that relatively decent period was no better and more often worse than the corresponding earlier game - and it got much worse from there.

To be honest I'm not really expecting anyone to agree with me but as I stated I thought we were in a terrible mess when he took over and like several previous managers managed to make us that little bit worse than when he arrived.

I've been bigging up Craig on another thread, now trying to defend Butcher. Next I'll be starting a "maybe Wallace Mercer was right all along" thread......

Dashing Bob S
03-12-2014, 02:48 PM
Visionary manager, never really given his chance at Hibs, everything he tried to achieved undermined by Petrie and a bigoted, racist Caledonian supremacist Nazi pro-IRA support **who never gave him a chance due to his Rangers and England connections.*





*For any Motherwell directors looking in.

** Okay, maybe I over-egged it slightly.

bigwheel
03-12-2014, 04:04 PM
To be honest I'm not really expecting anyone to agree with me but as I stated I thought we were in a terrible mess when he took over and like several previous managers managed to make us that little bit worse than when he arrived.

I've been bigging up Craig on another thread, now trying to defend Butcher. Next I'll be starting a "maybe Wallace Mercer was right all along" thread......

Ha! Glad to see a sense of humour amongst the madness :-)

emerald green
03-12-2014, 06:37 PM
Nobody is putting all on one man , but I do bear him many ills - he took a mid table team , decimated our performances and relegated our club - at the worst possible time

I frankly couldn't care if he secures success elsewhere - nothing will change my opinion of him and his team as football dinosaurs - I am so delighted they are no longer at this club

Just the person who appointed him still to take his leave.

Borderhibbie76
03-12-2014, 06:38 PM
There could be nothing sweeter than facing a Butcher led Motherwell in a Play Off final...that would most certainly be the sweetest of sweet revenges.
I hate Butcher for what he done to our club, yes he inherited a bit of a mess but I still believe to this day we would have been nowhere near Relegation under Fenlon...Butcher ruined what little belief and spirit there was in that dressing room.

absolute clown of a man who clearly got lucky at ICT though as someone else mentioned...he took them down in his first season too!!

sleeping giant
03-12-2014, 06:45 PM
Do you mean players who respond to bullying, waffle and the occasional fish supper?

Yes that's exactly what I mean.
You ****ing ***** poster that you are . You ****ing coward .
Post better ***** the ****ing next time you ****ing incompetent **** poster.
You are ****. **** . Now **** off and take that ****ing Jeffers with you.

:greengrin

bigwheel
03-12-2014, 07:23 PM
Just the person who appointed him still to take his leave.

Smartie will be on next saying that Petrie is a misunderstood philanthropist. [emoji2]

emerald green
03-12-2014, 07:25 PM
Smartie will be on next saying that Petrie is a misunderstood philanthropist. [emoji2]

:greengrin

CallumLaidlaw
04-12-2014, 10:33 PM
http://www.football-news.com/category/breaking-news/next-motherwell-fc-manager-terry-butcher-all-the-rage-to-get-fir-park-job-again-201412040001/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+footballnewsupdates+%28footba ll-news.com%29

3pm
04-12-2014, 10:38 PM
Good, good.

NadeAteMyLunch!
04-12-2014, 10:41 PM
http://www.football-news.com/category/breaking-news/next-motherwell-fc-manager-terry-butcher-all-the-rage-to-get-fir-park-job-again-201412040001/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+footballnewsupdates+%28footba ll-news.com%29

Caretaker boss Derek Adams???

CallumLaidlaw
04-12-2014, 10:47 PM
Caretaker boss Derek Adams???

Did laugh at that. Wonder how credible that makes it!

Bostonhibby
04-12-2014, 10:49 PM
Visionary manager, never really given his chance at Hibs, everything he tried to achieved undermined by Petrie and a bigoted, racist Caledonian supremacist Nazi pro-IRA support **who never gave him a chance due to his Rangers and England connections.*





*For any Motherwell directors looking in.

** Okay, maybe I over-egged it slightly.

You forgot to mention that he has kept himself match fit and would be able to play for Motherwell as well - a player and a manager for the price of a manager - pretty sure mad Maurice could play as well.

CRAZYHIBBY
04-12-2014, 10:54 PM
If we are still paying his wages and motherwell want him then they should pay compensation.

Greencore
05-12-2014, 01:55 AM
If we are still paying his wages and motherwell want him then they should pay compensation.

They should!

Waxy
05-12-2014, 07:25 AM
If we are still paying his wages and motherwell want him then they should pay compensation.
Why put a potential stumbling block in the way though?

emerald green
06-12-2014, 11:40 AM
There's a wee story on the back page of The Scotsman today saying "Butcher odds on for Motherwell".

Betting firm McBookie.com reported that the ex-England captain - who was manager at Fir Park between 2002 and 2006 - is now 4/7 for the job.

Spokesman Paul Petrie (any relation?) said: "Punters have only been interested in backing Butcher. It would suggest he is on the shortlist and could even be No 1 target."

Elephant Stone
06-12-2014, 11:52 AM
Beating a team managed by Butcher in the play-off would be amazing.

matty_f
06-12-2014, 11:53 AM
Beating a team managed by Butcher in the play-off would be amazing.

Hamilton definitely looked like they enjoyed it, and they'd no reason to hate the ****, so I can only imagine how much satisfaction it'd give us!

emerald green
06-12-2014, 11:55 AM
Beating a team managed by Butcher in the play-off would be amazing.

:agree: My concern though, if that scenario ever came about, is that Butcher would send his team out to kick Hibs off the park.

matty_f
06-12-2014, 11:56 AM
:agree: My concern though, if that scenario ever came about, is that Butcher would send his team out to kick Hibs off the park.

I don't think Butcher's Hibs side would have got close enough to Stubbs' Hibs side to be able to kick them.

emerald green
06-12-2014, 12:08 PM
I don't think Butcher's Hibs side would have got close enough to Stubbs' Hibs side to be able to kick them.

:agree: That's true.

BOB MARLEYS DUG
06-12-2014, 12:10 PM
I don't think Butcher's Hibs side would have got close enough to Stubbs' Hibs side to be able to kick them.

Scotty Allan alone aould rip them apart.

chinaman
06-12-2014, 12:47 PM
Scotty Allan alone aould rip them apart.
Its butcher that needs ripped apart,2nd most useless manager ever after hoggy mcmoist

BOB MARLEYS DUG
06-12-2014, 01:07 PM
Its butcher that needs ripped apart,2nd most useless manager ever after hoggy mcmoist

V true. Im sure Mr Stubbs would do Butcher in and fling wee Maurice about. :greengrin

Billy Whizz
08-12-2014, 11:56 AM
DR today saying he's favourite for the job, might allow a bit of extra budget in the January window if we can get him off the wage bill

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/terry-butcher-favourite-fir-park-4766753

Ozyhibby
08-12-2014, 12:41 PM
DR today saying he's favourite for the job, might allow a bit of extra budget in the January window if we can get him off the wage bill

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/terry-butcher-favourite-fir-park-4766753

Would be a great bit of news. Hopefully he takes Malpas with him.

Billy Whizz
08-12-2014, 12:42 PM
Would be a great bit of news. Hopefully he takes Malpas with him.

Would be nice, but I think motherwell have confirmed that Black would stay as the assistant?

dangermouse
08-12-2014, 03:19 PM
To be honest I'm not really expecting anyone to agree with me but as I stated I thought we were in a terrible mess when he took over and like several previous managers managed to make us that little bit worse than when he arrived.

I've been bigging up Craig on another thread, now trying to defend Butcher. Next I'll be starting a "maybe Wallace Mercer was right all along" thread......

He was, he just got the team name, colours and playing venue all wrong :greengrin

H13BYM
08-12-2014, 03:51 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30360444

Fingers (and everything else) Crossed!! :pray:

Off the bar
08-12-2014, 03:53 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30360444

Fingers (and everything else) Crossed!! :pray:

This would be like an early Christmas present

carnoustiehibee
08-12-2014, 03:54 PM
What's the odds on Motherwell to be relagated ?

Weststandwanab
08-12-2014, 05:03 PM
About to get higher me thinks.

Ronniekirk
08-12-2014, 07:00 PM
Would be nice, but I think motherwell have confirmed that Black would stay as the assistant?
Billy radio tonight says he has been interviewed and so has kennyl shields and some other guy and they may have a new owner soon in conjunction with the money already put in by fans Look forward to hearing more about that given our current situation

Swedish hibee
08-12-2014, 08:04 PM
The man is an horses bum & Motherwell are stinky poop. Perfect match!

Niffy
08-12-2014, 11:25 PM
Butcher loaned from Hibs to Motherwell ?

What with Leeanne's old stomping ground , I wonder if she's struck a deal fir Well to take Butcher and pay part of his wage for his time still contracted to Hibs ?

Might seem crazy but if they approached her and said we'll pay half that wage for you....


Eh eh eh ?

Makes you think eh.

we are hibs
10-12-2014, 08:32 AM
What's the odds on Motherwell to be relagated ?

I got them at 40/1 at the start of the season after hearing rumours that all wasn't going well at fir park.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ringothedog
10-12-2014, 08:43 AM
About to get higher me thinks.
Lower I would have thought.

Hibernia&Alba
10-12-2014, 11:00 AM
I got them at 40/1 at the start of the season after hearing rumours that all wasn't going well at fir park.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You vulture :-D

Winston Ingram
10-12-2014, 12:07 PM
Scotty Allan alone aould rip them apart.

Imagine Scotty Allan playing for Butcher? 'None of this pinpoint passing & beating folk pish - just launch it in the corner!'

Biggie
10-12-2014, 12:53 PM
Would be nice, but I think motherwell have confirmed that Black would stay as the assistant?

yeah Malpas was quoted as saying "f$%£ you, ya £%!?£ %!$^£!% #!@£$ers" when told Black would get the assistant gig

monarch
10-12-2014, 04:21 PM
Sky Sports just announced Butcher quoted that he no longer wants to be considered for Motherwell job. Pity. :confused:

Golden Bear
10-12-2014, 04:30 PM
Sky Sports just announced Butcher quoted that he no longer wants to be considered for Motherwell job. Pity. :confused:

So from that, can we safely presume that Butcher has already been informed that he was not getting the job in any case?

:hmmm:

CallumLaidlaw
10-12-2014, 04:31 PM
So from that, can we safely presume that Butcher has already been informed that he was not getting the job in any case?

:hmmm:

Or they've offering him less than Hibs are paying him

jacomo
10-12-2014, 05:15 PM
Or they've offering him less than Hibs are paying him

I'd send the guy to scout every lower league game across England Scotland and Wales until his contract is up. I'd bin every report he sent through, but at least feel he was doing something for the money.

Might encourage him to get another job too.

bigwheel
10-12-2014, 05:57 PM
I'd send the guy to scout every lower league game across England Scotland and Wales until his contract is up. I'd bin every report he sent through, but at least feel he was doing something for the money.

Might encourage him to get another job too.

Unfortunately employment law would not permit that .....

It's hard to believe his withdrawal is anything other than to keep milking us though ....

Winston Ingram
10-12-2014, 05:58 PM
Gutted.

I was really looking forward to him confirming to the football world how utterly ***** he is.

Winston Ingram
10-12-2014, 06:03 PM
@AgentScotland just said this on Twitter

@AgentScotland: Butcher thought he'd get the Well job, wanted more info but then got impression he wasn't wanted, he pulled out of the running to save face

Save face? Any credibility he had disappeared last May

Blaster
10-12-2014, 06:52 PM
St mirren bound maybe??

emerald green
10-12-2014, 06:59 PM
Sky Sports just announced Butcher quoted that he no longer wants to be considered for Motherwell job. Pity. :confused:

This is bad news, if correct. HFC need to get this clown off the wage bill asap.

The problem as I see it might be that he has been found out after his disastrous tenure at Hibs, and no decent club will touch him now.

Leithenhibby
10-12-2014, 07:05 PM
Gutted.

I was really looking forward to him confirming to the football world how utterly ***** he is.

:agree:

But I'm sure the footballing world know that already :wink:

Sergio sledge
10-12-2014, 07:21 PM
What length of contract did they sign when they came? Are we stuck with them for another season after this?

Billy Whizz
10-12-2014, 07:23 PM
Sky Sports just announced Butcher quoted that he no longer wants to be considered for Motherwell job. Pity. :confused:

I wonder if it's due to the fact that he wasn't able to take Malpas with him?

Gatecrasher
10-12-2014, 07:24 PM
What length of contract did they sign when they came? Are we stuck with them for another season after this?
I could be wrong but I'm sure I read on here we would pay him for a year then he's a free agent after that.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 07:26 PM
****.

Michael
10-12-2014, 07:33 PM
His garden must be stunning.

Swedish hibee
10-12-2014, 08:26 PM
Did the Motherwell players make their feelings known about him?

Just knowing this f***** still gets a wage from us makes me angrier by the minute. Worst manager I have ever seen (and I take no pleasure in writing this)

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 08:41 PM
Worst results in our history. One of the very worst managers in our history. One of the worst human beings to have ever run our club.

I absolutely ****ing detest the "man".

Pete
10-12-2014, 08:55 PM
One of the worst human beings to have ever run our club.

I absolutely ****ing detest the "man".

I think that's a bit harsh. We don't half like to exaggerate things in this day of instant, online communication.

What has he done to merit this tag? He didn't have to leave Inverness where he was actually doing quite well and building something (contrary to popular belief) and had every right to sit on his contract.

Sorry, but some people are like dogs with bones and need to let it go.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 09:08 PM
I think that's a bit harsh. We don't half like to exaggerate things in this day of instant, online communication.

What has he done to merit this tag? He didn't have to leave Inverness where he was actually doing quite well and building something (contrary to popular belief) and had every right to sit on his contract.

Sorry, but some people are like dogs with bones and need to let it go.

Ask Alex Harris if I'm being unfair.

tamig
10-12-2014, 09:10 PM
Worst results in our history. One of the very worst managers in our history. One of the worst human beings to have ever run our club.

I absolutely ****ing detest the "man".

Butcher was pish at Hibs and got us relegated. However, what makes him a bad human being?

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 09:12 PM
Butcher was pish at Hibs and got us relegated. However, what makes him a bad human being?

If I'd gotten a club relegated and was still being paid by them I'd be utterly embarrased to be doing so. For him to withdraw from the application process at another club when we're still being milked for his failure is pathetic.

Plus the stories of how players were managed that have been coming out are disgusting.

blackpoolhibs
10-12-2014, 09:12 PM
I remember before he got the job at easter road, i kept saying to myself i shouldn't like the man. Ex hun, horrible captain for them. ex England captain too, but he always came across in interviews as a decent bloke.

I have that reason now. :rolleyes:

Swedish hibee
10-12-2014, 09:17 PM
Butcher was pish at Hibs and got us relegated. However, what makes him a bad human being?

He got us relegated and wanted to keep his job. And takes a wage from us. That makes him a bad human being in my book.. And that's before hearing all the rumors from the dressing room last season.

I'll never forgive him.

tamig
10-12-2014, 09:18 PM
If I'd gotten a club relegated and was still being paid by them I'd be utterly embarrased to be doing so. For him to withdraw from the application process at another club when we're still being milked for his failure is pathetic.

Plus the stories of how players were managed that have been coming out are disgusting.

Poor man management I agree. Don't think that necessarily affects his qualities as a human being though. He may be a thoroughly decent bloke. Bit of green mist clouding your judgement perhaps? Pish manager does not necessarily equate to an awful person.

Pete
10-12-2014, 09:24 PM
If I'd gotten a club relegated and was still being paid by them I'd be utterly embarrased to be doing so. For him to withdraw from the application process at another club when we're still being milked for his failure is pathetic.

Plus the stories of how players were managed that have been coming out are disgusting.

look at what he was doing before he came here.

The soft as *****, poor wee souls that didn't like the manager were equally as culpable.

Look at it his way: he left a great job where he was succeeding, he was given huddies to work with and wasn't even given the chance (contrary to popular belief) to build his own squad.

I was Terry I would sit on my contract and would invite anyone who disagreed with me to sit down for a personal discussion.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 09:29 PM
look at what he was doing before he came here. The soft as *****, poor wee souls that didn't like the manager were equally as culpable. Look at it his way: he left a great job where he was succeeding, he was given huddies to work with and wasn't even given the chance (contrary to popular belief) to build his own squad. I was Terry I would sit on my contract and would invite anyone who disagreed with me to sit down for a personal discussion. He left a great job, I'm sure you've heard some of the horror stories. Kevin Thomson left on the subs bench half the time for no other apparent reason other than he had the audacity to question the tactic of punting it into the corners, the stories about Harris, the stories about what players were being told - that's not management, in my mind that's flat out bullying. To blame the players for not reacting well to those two fannies is utterly ludicrous.

Pete
10-12-2014, 09:38 PM
He left a great job, I'm sure you've heard some of the horror stories. Kevin Thomson left on the subs bench half the time for no other apparent reason other than he had the audacity to question the tactic of punting it into the corners, the stories about Harris, the stories about what players were being told - that's not management, in my mind that's flat out bullying. To blame the players for not reacting well to those two fannies is utterly ludicrous.

It's not ridiculous at all. Maybe it's an indication of the soft treatment they had become accustomed to.

It's odd that hungrier, fitter players at Inverness who's heads were in proportion to their bodies had no such issues with Butcher or Malpas.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 09:39 PM
It's not ridiculous at all. Maybe it's an indication of the soft treatment they had become accustomed to.

It's odd that hungrier, fitter players at Inverness who's heads were in proportion to their bodies had no such issues with Butcher or Malpas.

It's odd that Alan Stubbs has turned round many of the players who didn't play well under Butcher through proper man management.

.Sean.
10-12-2014, 09:39 PM
His garden must be stunning.
Magic :faf:

Pete
10-12-2014, 10:12 PM
It's odd that Alan Stubbs has turned round many of the players who didn't play well under Butcher through proper man management.

No argument that Stubbs is a better "man manager" but Butcher and Malpas's strengths lay in getting the best out of players who buy into their ideas completely.

It was the wrong time for them in my opinion and I wouldn't class leaving players out that he didn't like and telling them they had no future as "horror stories". If you have what it takes, you turn that into a positive, driving force. You don't go into your shell or bleat about how hard done by you've been.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 10:15 PM
No argument that Stubbs is a better "man manager" but Butcher and Malpas's strengths lay in getting the best out of players who buy into their ideas completely.

It was the wrong time for them in my opinion and I wouldn't class leaving players out that he didn't like and telling them they had no future as "horror stories". If you have what it takes, you turn that into a positive, driving force. You don't go into your shell or bleat about how hard done by you've been.

You don't get the best out of people by making them feel worthless.

Pete
10-12-2014, 10:19 PM
You don't get the best out of people by making them feel worthless.

It depends how much drive to succeed these "people" have.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 10:24 PM
It depends how much drive to succeed these "people" have.

Bollocks, it doesn't work for anybody.

I'd have to question why you're more willing to back the man who relegated us, brought us the worst ever football results and style we've ever seen as a club and still draws a pay packet from us over the players who are finding form again and are battling to get us promoted.

Pete
10-12-2014, 10:37 PM
Bollocks, it doesn't work for anybody.

I'd have to question why you're more willing to back the man who relegated us, brought us the worst ever football results and style we've ever seen as a club and still draws a pay packet from us over the players who are finding form again and are battling to get us promoted.

It doesn't work for anybody, does it? Your talking bollocks.

What about Tom Taiwo who suffered this degrading treatment? What did he do? He got on with it and proved Butcher wrong by working his socks off and giving him "food for thought". Has it never occurred to you that that was the type of reaction he was wanting out of these poor, hard done by players like Thomson and Harris. Maybe they wouldn't be playing at Dundee or stuck in our youth team if they had his attitude.

I'm not as much backing him as I am questioning your attitude towards him. Calling him a disgusting, detestable "man" is a total overreaction.

Smartie
10-12-2014, 10:38 PM
It's odd that Alan Stubbs has turned round many of the players who didn't play well under Butcher through proper man management.

Which players are these?

Craig has undoubtedly improved this year under Stubbs.

Hanlon did fine under Butcher, as did Stevenson. Cummings did well enough when called upon. Maybe they are doing a bit better, maybe they are playing at a lower level?

Stanton arguably did better last year.

Look at Saturday - did you have any confidence that even at a lower level we were going to get goals with Heff, Handling, Cummings and Harris? I didn't, these players simply aren't good enough. They are no better under Stubbs than under Butcher. They are still p!sh.

I am delighted to have Stubbs instead of Butcher. Stubbs is, imo taking us forward after many years of decline and will (if given time) get us to a level that Butcher never could. But I don't think Butcher stood a chance at Hibs and I don't think that it does us any favours to totally demonise him and blame as many of our past/current ills on him as we do. The squad he inherited was horrific - totally lacking in ability, mental toughness, balance - it had nothing, then he wasn't allowed to improve it. People focus on his negativity and the nasty things he did with the players - maybe he'd tried everything else he could without getting a response so felt he had to go for this approach?

Blaming it all on Butcher takes too much heat off Fenlon, Calderwood, to a lesser extent Yogi and Mixu but to the greatest extent Petrie who presided over the entire decline and was the true architect of it all.

(Glad to see that there is one other Hibs fan out there who is prepared to argue for a bit of perspective re Butcher though).

blackpoolhibs
10-12-2014, 10:47 PM
The big rebuilding job was his in the summer, all he needed to do was keep us up.:rolleyes: He did what he usually does and failed.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 10:49 PM
It doesn't work for anybody, does it? Your talking bollocks.

What about Tom Taiwo who suffered this degrading treatment? What did he do? He got on with it and proved Butcher wrong by working his socks off and giving him "food for thought". Has it never occurred to you that that was the type of reaction he was wanting out of these poor, hard done by players like Thomson and Harris. Maybe they wouldn't be playing at Dundee or stuck in our youth team if they had his attitude.

I'm not as much backing him as I am questioning your attitude towards him. Calling him a disgusting, detestable "man" is a total overreaction.

Yep, maybe they wouldn't be playing in a higher league than ours if they were better players :rolleyes:

You clearly don't understand the concept of man management. Leave the discussion to those of us who do and go and read a book about it. Let's face it, Butchers man management was so, so excellent he took a team that were comfortably mid table and relegated them.

Smartie
10-12-2014, 10:50 PM
I agree that he failed and for that he had to go. But I honestly don't think he ever stood a chance.

blackpoolhibs
10-12-2014, 10:53 PM
I agree that he failed and for that he had to go. But I honestly don't think he ever stood a chance.

Have a look at his managerial career, look at who he's managed and how its gone. It was us that never stood a chance.

Pete
10-12-2014, 10:53 PM
Which players are these?

Craig has undoubtedly improved this year under Stubbs.

Hanlon did fine under Butcher, as did Stevenson. Cummings did well enough when called upon. Maybe they are doing a bit better, maybe they are playing at a lower level?

Stanton arguably did better last year.

Look at Saturday - did you have any confidence that even at a lower level we were going to get goals with Heff, Handling, Cummings and Harris? I didn't, these players simply aren't good enough. They are no better under Stubbs than under Butcher. They are still p!sh.

I am delighted to have Stubbs instead of Butcher. Stubbs is, imo taking us forward after many years of decline and will (if given time) get us to a level that Butcher never could. But I don't think Butcher stood a chance at Hibs and I don't think that it does us any favours to totally demonise him and blame as many of our past/current ills on him as we do. The squad he inherited was horrific - totally lacking in ability, mental toughness, balance - it had nothing, then he wasn't allowed to improve it. People focus on his negativity and the nasty things he did with the players - maybe he'd tried everything else he could without getting a response so felt he had to go for this approach?

Blaming it all on Butcher takes too much heat off Fenlon, Calderwood, to a lesser extent Yogi and Mixu but to the greatest extent Petrie who presided over the entire decline and was the true architect of it all.

(Glad to see that there is one other Hibs fan out there who is prepared to argue for a bit of perspective re Butcher though).

Perspective is the key word here.

People harp on about his bad record but don't have much to say about the record of Butcher, Marsella and Malpas together. When they do it's usually mince like "they got lucky" or "fourth wasn't a success" without analysing the team they had built and its potential.

It's pointless debating with these people as their minds aren't for turning but it's also pointless in the sense that it's bald men fighting over a comb. We'll never know how it might have turned out had the players kept us up of if he had been given this season to build.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 10:57 PM
Perspective is the key word here.

People harp on about his bad record but don't have much to say about the record of Butcher, Marsella and Malpas together. When they do it's usually mince like "they got lucky" or "fourth wasn't a success" without analysing the team they had built and its potential.

It's pointless debating with these people as their minds aren't for turning but it's also pointless in the sense that it's bald men fighting over a comb. We'll never know how it might have turned out had the players kept us up of if he had been given this season to build.

Right enough, we should be grateful for Saint Butcher coming to a mid table team, belittling players then wanting them to play for the team, relegating us, subjecting us to awful football and drawing a wage because he once managed Inverness. If Stubbsy ever hopes to emulate the great man then he should start laying into our players or get out.

How any self respecting Hibs fan can back Butcher is unreal. The man took a perfectly decent team, showed horrific man management style, relegated us and now still draws a pay packet from us whilst withdrawing from the running for other management processes. I detest the man far, far more than I did Calderwood and nobody call tell me that I'm being unreasonable - him drawing a wage from us after what he did is a ****ing pisstake and I hope the man fails everywhere he goes.

Pete
10-12-2014, 11:03 PM
Yep, maybe they wouldn't be playing in a higher league than ours if they were better players :rolleyes:

You clearly don't understand the concept of man management. Leave the discussion to those of us who do and go and read a book about it. Let's face it, Butchers man management was so, so excellent he took a team that were comfortably mid table and relegated them.

Get lost you patronising so and so.

All you've probably done is hear about how much man management is needed in the premiership because the tables have turned. Players can buy and sell managers nowadays so they don't listen to anyone who speaks down to them. That isn't the case in lower leagues and things are on a more even footing. When someone like terry Butcher speaks and you are playing in the SPL you listen.

Why don't you go and read a dictionary so you will be able to use words to describe your feelings that don't make you out to be rather immature.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 11:06 PM
Get lost you patronising so and so.


Why don't you go and read a dictionary so you will be able to use words to describe your feelings that don't make you out to be rather immature.

What? You're saying you don't feel more motivated to write better posts after being patronised or belittled?

Pete
10-12-2014, 11:06 PM
Right enough, we should be grateful for Saint Butcher coming to a mid table team, belittling players then wanting them to play for the team, relegating us, subjecting us to awful football and drawing a wage because he once managed Inverness. If Stubbsy ever hopes to emulate the great man then he should start laying into our players or get out.

How any self respecting Hibs fan can back Butcher is unreal. The man took a perfectly decent team, showed horrific man management style, relegated us and now still draws a pay packet from us whilst withdrawing from the running for other management processes. I detest the man far, far more than I did Calderwood and nobody call tell me that I'm being unreasonable - him drawing a wage from us after what he did is a ****ing pisstake and I hope the man fails everywhere he goes.

You detest him do you? Anyone who disagrees with you has no self-respect?

I'd say calling you unreasonable was an understatement.

Pete
10-12-2014, 11:10 PM
What? You're saying you don't feel more motivated to write better posts after being patronised or belittled?

Sometimes. It depends who's doing it.

Northernhibee
10-12-2014, 11:11 PM
You detest him do you? Anyone who disagrees with you has no self-respect?

I'd say calling you unreasonable was an understatement.

I do detest him milking us considering how awful a job he did with us. And I appreciate people who disagree with me - I however fail to understand why any self respecting Hibs fan would choose to back Butcher and question the same players who have started to play decent football under a half decent manager.

Onion
10-12-2014, 11:13 PM
You don't get the best out of people by making them feel worthless.

:agree: It's one thing for us Hibs fans to talk about this and that player being useless and needing dropped/moved on (that's our privilege) but quite another for a manager. Butcher and his team were beyond naive. He should be utterly ashamed of his time at Hibs, but continues to take £££ from the club - shameful.

blackpoolhibs
10-12-2014, 11:13 PM
What? You're saying you don't feel more motivated to write better posts after being patronised or belittled?

:faf: :top marks

Pete
10-12-2014, 11:18 PM
I do detest him milking us considering how awful a job he did with us. And I appreciate people who disagree with me - I however fail to understand why any self respecting Hibs fan would choose to back Butcher and question the same players who have started to play decent football under a half decent manager.

That's fair enough. I understand people not being happy with Butcher and I agree the football side was like shoving round pegs into square holes. However, that football and these mismatches didn't exist at Inverness and in my eyes they never got the chance (for a multitude of reasons) to replicate what they did there.

It's just annoying looking at what might of been when you look at that team. If Stubbs gets us playing with the heart and energy that they have he will have done very well.

It would be a dull world if we all agreed on everything.

Stevie Reid
10-12-2014, 11:27 PM
Some unbelievable posts on this thread - Butcher didn't stand a chance at Hibs?!

He didn't stand a chance coming into a club in the top 6 of the SPL with no Rangers and Hearts relegated from the start, and a taking over a side with 15 points from 11 games?

Not to mention being at a club with one of the biggest budgets in the league (if he had chosen to use it rather than loaning awful players and alienating the then current playing staff) or a support that turned out in numbers of 16K+ for the Malmo game, and over 20,000 for the New Year derby. He didn't stand a chance?!

In 25 SPL games Butcher accumulated 5 more points than Fenlon did in 11. We won 43% of our SPL points tally under Fenlon in those 11 matches. Butcher was brought in to make us better and made us much, much worse, turning an average team into the worst in the league.

Fenlon's squad was deficient in quite a few ways, but it is impossible to overstate just how bad Butcher was. I'm astonished that there's even a semblance of debate about it.

Thecat23
10-12-2014, 11:40 PM
No argument that Stubbs is a better "man manager" but Butcher and Malpas's strengths lay in getting the best out of players who buy into their ideas completely.

It was the wrong time for them in my opinion and I wouldn't class leaving players out that he didn't like and telling them they had no future as "horror stories". If you have what it takes, you turn that into a positive, driving force. You don't go into your shell or bleat about how hard done by you've been.

Both shouldn't be involved in the game ever again. Grabbing players by the throat, MM screaming at players in training and both telling the players they were *****!!

MM is a roaster of a man and an arrogant tit who's not very well liked. TB is just simply an awful manager and his record speaks for itself. Can't believe I actually wanted him here. The ones who didn't were spot on and after hearing from the players how aggressive they were and how training was baffling at times and wouldn't have a school kid fit I'm delighted he's no where near Hibs.

Thecat23
10-12-2014, 11:42 PM
Some unbelievable posts on this thread - Butcher didn't stand a chance at Hibs?!

He didn't stand a chance coming into a club in the top 6 of the SPL with no Rangers and Hearts relegated from the start, and a taking over a side with 15 points from 11 games?

Not to mention being at a club with one of the biggest budgets in the league (if he had chosen to use it rather than loaning awful players and alienating the then current playing staff) or a support that turned out in numbers of 16K+ for the Malmo game, and over 20,000 for the New Year derby. He didn't stand a chance?!

In 25 SPL games Butcher accumulated 5 more points than Fenlon did in 11. We won 43% of our SPL points tally under Fenlon in those 11 matches. Butcher was brought in to make us better and made us much, much worse, turning an average team into the worst in the league.

Fenlon's squad was deficient in quite a few ways, but it is impossible to overstate just how bad Butcher was. I'm astonished that there's even a semblance of debate about it.

Great post.

Thecat23
10-12-2014, 11:45 PM
That's fair enough. I understand people not being happy with Butcher and I agree the football side was like shoving round pegs into square holes. However, that football and these mismatches didn't exist at Inverness and in my eyes they never got the chance (for a multitude of reasons) to replicate what they did there.

It's just annoying looking at what might of been when you look at that team. If Stubbs gets us playing with the heart and energy that they have he will have done very well.

It would be a dull world if we all agreed on everything.

Not forgetting the amazing goalkeeper/scout/fat******* Marsella. Who on one occasion refused to warm the keeper up. He could barely move and we binned Thompson for this clown. They were so unprofessional it was scary.

Pete
10-12-2014, 11:49 PM
Both shouldn't be involved in the game ever again. Grabbing players by the throat, MM screaming at players in training and both telling the players they were *****!!
.

Consider yourself lucky that you never had any inside knowledge of what went on during one of Jim McLeans, Brain Cloughs or Alex Ferguson's early management tenures.:wink::greengrin

I'll give you the goalie thing though. That was wierd and smacked of trying to bring something down from ICT which was unnecessary. Marsella should have been the scout and that was it.

Thecat23
10-12-2014, 11:55 PM
Consider yourself lucky that you never had any inside knowledge of what went on during one of Jim McLeans, Brain Cloughs or Alex Ferguson's early management tenures.:wink::greengrin

I'll give you the goalie thing though. That was wierd and smacked of trying to bring something down from ICT which was unnecessary.

I've heard a few stories about those managers, Clough was meant to be a great guy outside football as well.

Yeah I just think he wanted a bigger wage so said he was a scout as well as goalkeeper coach. He couldn't even walk right he was huge! Stubbs said when he came in he couldn't believe a professional club could be managed that badly. When told of some of Butchers way of training and man management he was stunned!!

I really like Stubbs he's an honest hard working manager who's inherited a team that had no balance at all in it. I think if he had the money other managers spent we would be top 4 in the top division! Of course that's only my opinion, I just think he's going to do well in the game.


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Pete
11-12-2014, 12:13 AM
I've heard a few stories about those managers, Clough was meant to be a great guy outside football as well.

Yeah I just think he wanted a bigger wage so said he was a scout as well as goalkeeper coach. He couldn't even walk right he was huge! Stubbs said when he came in he couldn't believe a professional club could be managed that badly. When told of some of Butchers way of training and man management he was stunned!!

I really like Stubbs he's an honest hard working manager who's inherited a team that had no balance at all in it. I think if he had the money other managers spent we would be top 4 in the top division! Of course that's only my opinion, I just think he's going to do well in the game.


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Agree with what you say about Stubbs. You could tell he was "new school" from the off when he said that his door was open to everyone and that they are all in it together. He's been at some big, progressive clubs so he must have picked up a few things.

I'm not looking for an argument but there has been a lot of criticism regarding the way Butcher did things at Hibs. However, why do you think these methods worked so well at Inverness and why were there no complaints or players coming out and moaning? They would run through brick walls.

Thecat23
11-12-2014, 12:17 AM
Agree with what you say about Stubbs. You could tell he was "new school" from the off when he said that his door was open to everyone and that they are all in it together. He's been at some big, progressive clubs so he must have picked up a few things.

I'm not looking for an argument but there has been a lot of criticism regarding the way Butcher did things at Hibs. However, why do you think these methods worked so well at Inverness and why were there no complaints or players coming out and moaning? They would run through brick walls.

I'm not arguing bud, interesting that you kind of think he may have done better over time. There was one or two up there who weren't that keen on him. But granted for some reason the ICT were alright. But only for a short period as he also sent them down too. He's failed at every club he's been at mate because he's a terrible manager in my book. Appreciate you don't agree and as you say if we did agree on everything the world would be a dull place.

[emoji106]


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Smartie
11-12-2014, 12:19 AM
I do detest him milking us considering how awful a job he did with us. And I appreciate people who disagree with me - I however fail to understand why any self respecting Hibs fan would choose to back Butcher and question the same players who have started to play decent football under a half decent manager.

I'm not really trying to back Butcher - I can't defend the indefensible. But it appears that I thought we were in worse shape when he took over than most others do. He took an awful squad with multiple problems and somehow managed to make it worse. I don't harbour any more animosity towards him than any of the other characters I mentioned.

To be honest Calderwood still grates with me the most. As p!sh as Butcher was at least he wanted to be here, unlike him.

Smartie
11-12-2014, 12:24 AM
I've heard a few stories about those managers, Clough was meant to be a great guy outside football as well.

Yeah I just think he wanted a bigger wage so said he was a scout as well as goalkeeper coach. He couldn't even walk right he was huge! Stubbs said when he came in he couldn't believe a professional club could be managed that badly. When told of some of Butchers way of training and man management he was stunned!!

I really like Stubbs he's an honest hard working manager who's inherited a team that had no balance at all in it. I think if he had the money other managers spent we would be top 4 in the top division! Of course that's only my opinion, I just think he's going to do well in the game.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree re Stubbs and I hope/ think he will go far. But I think that we could prove to be the toughest gig he ever takes on. He's already making good progress imo. Now he inherited a quite spectacular shambles and I hope he doesn't get hounded out for not progressing back fast enough from what was imo the worst state we've ever been in.

Thecat23
11-12-2014, 12:26 AM
I agree re Stubbs and I hope/ think he will go far. But I think that we could prove to be the toughest gig he ever takes on. He's already making good progress imo. Now he inherited a quite spectacular shambles and I hope he doesn't get hounded out for not progressing back fast enough from what was imo the worst state we've ever been in.

Exactly, for a guy who's never managed before to where he's at now, granted still off the pace but playing better looking fitter and with his own players will do well.


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Cameron1875
11-12-2014, 07:23 AM
It gets me absolutely seething that anyone could try and defend Terry Butcher. Look what he did to our club!

We should have sacked him after the St Mirren 2-0 game in Paisley when he said "at least the fact we conceded meant we didn't have to worry about conceding" or something along those lines.
But hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Absolutely despise the man. Hun ****

Ronniekirk
11-12-2014, 08:55 AM
On the radio this morning that Motherwell are disappointed Terry Butcher withdrew from the process and no explanation given .That must indicate he was a serious contender .Hibs should stop paying him money as he is clearly not trying to find employment If I was on the bru and did that my benefits would be stopped . he is a malingerer now and taking the piss .Fair enough at the beginning when he would of been not expecting to be sacked and needed some time to get his head together and think what he wanted to do next .
I know it's coming au to the season of goodwill to all men ,but he is seriously starting g to piss me off

southsider
11-12-2014, 08:59 AM
If you are on the dole and refuse a job you may get your money stopped. If Butcher did turn the Motherwell job down can we not stop his wages ? Inho my should have just sacked him and fought his "unfair" dismissal claim in court.A Hibby judge would have laughed him out of court.

erin go bragh
11-12-2014, 09:12 AM
Hopefully he has the St Mudden gig . A hole of a man .

Ggtth

hibeesjoe
11-12-2014, 09:57 AM
We can mump all we want about Butcher drawing a wage but it's in his contract.

I blame the chump that never put a clause in his contract saying that if he takes a top 6 team and relegates them then the option is there too sack them with no compensation.

AndyM_1875
11-12-2014, 10:25 AM
Some unbelievable posts on this thread - Butcher didn't stand a chance at Hibs?!

He didn't stand a chance coming into a club in the top 6 of the SPL with no Rangers and Hearts relegated from the start, and a taking over a side with 15 points from 11 games?

Not to mention being at a club with one of the biggest budgets in the league (if he had chosen to use it rather than loaning awful players and alienating the then current playing staff) or a support that turned out in numbers of 16K+ for the Malmo game, and over 20,000 for the New Year derby. He didn't stand a chance?!

In 25 SPL games Butcher accumulated 5 more points than Fenlon did in 11. We won 43% of our SPL points tally under Fenlon in those 11 matches. Butcher was brought in to make us better and made us much, much worse, turning an average team into the worst in the league.

Fenlon's squad was deficient in quite a few ways, but it is impossible to overstate just how bad Butcher was. I'm astonished that there's even a semblance of debate about it.

Well said Stevie.
Butcher was disliked by the players and many of the other staff at Easter Road/East Mains because of his attitude and the frankly appalling behavior of Malpas.
His tactics were abysmal (kick it into the corners) and his management skills were non existent as far as I'm concerned. You cannot alienate your players and as other have said you get nothing from constantly screaming at players and displaying nothing but aggression.

Sir Alex Ferguson would bawl him players out but he was also the best in the business at picking them up off the floor after a bad result and telling them how bloody good they were and should be. His players would run through brick walls for him. Butcher's just wanted to run away from him.

From what I was told Leeann Dempster went through Butcher like a dose of salts and ripped him apart in their meeting. She asked him what his plans were and how he would turn Hibs around after relegation. She got no coherent answers, a ridiculous list of sub standard Conference level signing targets and was not impressed, dismissing him and Malpas pretty much straight after.

Mathias Jack
11-12-2014, 10:40 AM
On the radio this morning that Motherwell are disappointed Terry Butcher withdrew from the process and no explanation given .That must indicate he was a serious contender .Hibs should stop paying him money as he is clearly not trying to find employment If I was on the bru and did that my benefits would be stopped . he is a malingerer now and taking the piss .Fair enough at the beginning when he would of been not expecting to be sacked and needed some time to get his head together and think what he wanted to do next .
I know it's coming au to the season of goodwill to all men ,but he is seriously starting g to piss me off

Couldn't have said it better myself Ronnie, I will add this though...Terry Butcher, you are a **** of a man.

Hibiza
11-12-2014, 02:39 PM
butcher jist a pure fud.

ancient hibee
11-12-2014, 07:03 PM
Suspect Butcher's ego won't allow him to risk relegation two seasons in a row with different clubs.

sleeping giant
11-12-2014, 07:09 PM
butcher jist a pure fud.

Yes. I like this comment.

Bell end of a man.

silverhibee
12-12-2014, 04:23 PM
Well said Stevie.
Butcher was disliked by the players and many of the other staff at Easter Road/East Mains because of his attitude and the frankly appalling behavior of Malpas.
His tactics were abysmal (kick it into the corners) and his management skills were non existent as far as I'm concerned. You cannot alienate your players and as other have said you get nothing from constantly screaming at players and displaying nothing but aggression.

Sir Alex Ferguson would bawl him players out but he was also the best in the business at picking them up off the floor after a bad result and telling them how bloody good they were and should be. His players would run through brick walls for him. Butcher's just wanted to run away from him.

From what I was told Leeann Dempster went through Butcher like a dose of salts and ripped him apart in their meeting. She asked him what his plans were and how he would turn Hibs around after relegation. She got no coherent answers, a ridiculous list of sub standard Conference level signing targets and was not impressed, dismissing him and Malpas pretty much straight after.

Butcher always came across as the big tough guy, it was no secret in Scottish football, as for Malpas, still to hear anyone say a good word about him, players who were trained by him at Scotland squads thought he was a f***ing nutter and not a nice guy, once again it was no secret in Scottish football, how Petrie thought this pair would be good for Hibs i just don't no.

Petrie should have been booted by STF right after they got rid of Butcher, or put on gardening leave as well for bringing the three amigos to ER, and they have cost us a small fortune from signing them to still paying them while they tend to the garden, and are still taking money from the club.

southsider
12-12-2014, 07:07 PM
So did Butcher turn down the Motherwell job as he has been promised Newco in January when they refinance and have money to payoff Sally. ????

Golden Bear
12-12-2014, 07:21 PM
Butcher and McCall are to be the new huns dream team I'm hearing.

Weststandwanab
12-12-2014, 07:25 PM
My dream team would by Jennifer Aniston and Kylie - not going to happen though !

McCulloch will get the gig if they lose tonight.

Swedish hibee
12-12-2014, 07:47 PM
It is beyond amazement that folk on here DON'T think Butcher is a 'Harry Hunt'.
I hate the man full stop. We don't miss him, and Inverness caley thistle certainly don't either.

Kaff
12-12-2014, 08:20 PM
Can't see McCall going there after the way he described the treatment McCoist had received and how he felt Greig, Walter Smith and Jardine had felt the need to 'walk away'.
Butcher being mentioned on BBC website and they would be able to offer more than his Hibs salary.

Someone did state on here sometime ago that if you're on gardening leave that you have to actively seek employment similar to the position you held previously, so turning down the Motherwell job (if he did) would hopefully contravene this and should mean he has a job lined up? Fingers crossed!

21.05.2016
13-12-2014, 07:29 PM
GTF Butcher you absolutely shameless clown.