PDA

View Full Version : An Alternate View On Liam Craig



SDavey1992
18-08-2014, 09:59 AM
I know i will probably get hounded for this but, penalty aside, i thought Craig played well again yesterday. In the first half his passing was good, got very stuck in and filled in well at CB (making a great tackle in our box in the progress) while Nelson was off. In the 2nd half he was still full of energy and appetite and although he did not have as much of an influence, was better than the rest of the misfield in that time. Also, i though his delivery was first class all game. The first 2 games this season i have thought he was been very good. And i'm pretty sure if he had scored that penalty, we would be hearing a hell of a lot less negativity towards him. I mean, yes, it was a bad penalty, but that doesn't really accurately depict his performance yesterday, let alone the rest of the season.
I think he will have a big part to play for us if we are to do well this season.

Diclonius
18-08-2014, 10:01 AM
Whilst Liam Craig's miss was bad, we were bound to miss one in derbies eventually. We've scored the last few (including one that Craig himself took) and we were very unfortunate that this one missed. He's been much improved from last season and I would fully support him remaining our main penalty taker.

Forza Fred
18-08-2014, 10:10 AM
I thought he played ok in the first half.

As far as penalties go, anybody is capable of missing them, but I'd prefer someone who has a bit power deliver them.

MWHIBBIES
18-08-2014, 10:10 AM
Indeed. Better players than Liam Craig have missed much bigger penalties, the abuse he has been given for it has been embarrassing. He was very good vs Livi and hopefully will continue it and lead us back up.

Green Fish
18-08-2014, 10:17 AM
Indeed. Better players than Liam Craig have missed much bigger penalties, the abuse he has been given for it has been embarrassing. He was very good vs Livi and hopefully will continue it and lead us back up.

Totally agree. He has his faults but he got stuck in yesterday, not his fault the rest of our mf was largely anonymous

PeterboroHibee
18-08-2014, 10:22 AM
I also thought Craig had a good game. The penalty miss was bad and I think it dented his confidence (along with that of the whole team), but other than that I have no complaints. His passing was good, he wanted the ball and I actually thought he looked to move it quickly, which is important for the way Stubbs wanted to play. It makes such a difference when you have a reasonably composed player looking to pick up the ball from deep and get things moving. He was also putting in decent balls at set pieces, and there was a few times we should have done a lot better from it.

Pete
18-08-2014, 10:25 AM
He'll bounce back next week.

People who call him a coward don't know what they're talking about.

Callum_62
18-08-2014, 10:30 AM
I agree- easily the best if our midfielders yesterday
Something just doest click with him and robbo though.
Is allen more an attacking midfielder, or sit in?
Either way, could work with these 2 in the midfield



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TowerHibs
18-08-2014, 10:30 AM
He'll bounce back next week.

People who call him a coward don't know what they're talking about.

I agree. Wouldn't call him a coward to his face. He doesn't deserve this kind of abuse

Marty-Hibee
18-08-2014, 10:36 AM
I wasn't impressed with him yesterday if I'm honest, that said he's definitely improved from last season. I'm not keen on him being captain though, he just seems to lose the rag constantly when things don't go his way. Of course a vocal captain is good, but he just seems to mouth off all the time. I'd prefer to seem him where Handling has been when he's played, the link up between midfield and forward. He's a good finisher and I'd rather see him in and around the box rather than sitting deeper. I'm not sure what Scott Allan is best at, but maybe with him where Craig is asked to play just now, and moving Craig further forward.

Obviously AS isn't going to look at my posts for tactical advice, but that's where I reckon Craig's strengths lie

portyhibernian
18-08-2014, 10:46 AM
Nobody can deny it was a bad miss but he isn't the first and won't be the last player to miss a big chance. He proved he was a good player at St Johnstone and it's early days under the new management but there was points of the Livi game and yesterday where I thought he looked somewhere near that player again. I think over the course of the season he'll prove to be one of the better players in this division.

Lago
18-08-2014, 10:51 AM
He is an ok kind of player, but certainly after the penalty he went right off his game, the thing that bugged me was the amount of time he spent pulling his socks uo over his knees, whats that all about.

Pray4Marc
18-08-2014, 10:54 AM
You cant question Liam Craigs commitment. ALWAYS wanting to get stuck in, if the penalty had went in he would be a hero on here.

heretoday
18-08-2014, 10:57 AM
Nobody could say Craig wasn't involved in the game! Or Robertson for that matter.

Purehibee_MYB
18-08-2014, 11:01 AM
I wasn't impressed with him yesterday if I'm honest, that said he's definitely improved from last season. I'm not keen on him being captain though, he just seems to lose the rag constantly when things don't go his way. Of course a vocal captain is good, but he just seems to mouth off all the time. I'd prefer to seem him where Handling has been when he's played, the link up between midfield and forward. He's a good finisher and I'd rather see him in and around the box rather than sitting deeper. I'm not sure what Scott Allan is best at, but maybe with him where Craig is asked to play just now, and moving Craig further forward.

Obviously AS isn't going to look at my posts for tactical advice, but that's where I reckon Craig's strengths lie

Allan has been criticised in the past by other clubs for not providing enough defensive cover, so he's hardly going to be the best player to have as a holding midfielder.

woody0-7
18-08-2014, 11:12 AM
I would like him pushed higher up the park , Tudor jones must have more in his locker than what he's shown sit him in front of the defender mopping up and giving the ball to likes of Craig and Allen . I think when we play with 2 holding midfielders we are far to slow to get up the park into attacking areas let's play with 5 attack minded players ie a
4 1 3 2 formation

ahibby
18-08-2014, 11:18 AM
I am not a fan. I think he is a numpty and isn't good enough to captain Hibs or play for Hibs for that matter. Having said that this league is probably about his level imo. He can't score against Hearts kid goalkeeper in a penalty even putting that aside I said last season I'd pay for his bus fair back to Perth and nothing has changed my mind. LC is part of why Hibs are still soft. I am more comfortable with our young players playing for us than him and he is supposed to be the experienced one. That's my view on him.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2014, 11:59 AM
I agree- easily the best if our midfielders yesterday
Something just doest click with him and robbo though.
Is allen more an attacking midfielder, or sit in?
Either way, could work with these 2 in the midfield



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Okay I will agree he was the best of the midfilelders lets look at the competition-
Roberston = Woeful
Stanton = Won the Hide and seek award.
Harris = He played for 10 minutes no where near enough influence on the game.

So he was the best and needs to do much better Holt for them looked busier and he got the hook

Marty-Hibee
18-08-2014, 12:02 PM
Allan has been criticised in the past by other clubs for not providing enough defensive cover, so he's hardly going to be the best player to have as a holding midfielder.


Hence why I said I'm not sure where he plays best, and that maybe it's an option.

Dashing Bob S
18-08-2014, 12:09 PM
Craig's unfortunate penalty miss was the money shot for the damned 'ham shankers' who've been poised over their keyboard to 'batter one off' to a ginger minge mistake all summer. Didn't play that badly, in a poor game between two pretty shabby teams.

Callum_62
18-08-2014, 12:13 PM
Okay I will agree he was the best of the midfilelders lets look at the competition-
Roberston = Woeful
Stanton = Won the Hide and seek award.
Harris = He played for 10 minutes no where near enough influence on the game.

So he was the best and needs to do much better Holt for them looked busier and he got the hook

And yet there's a thread asking for him to be hanged

I cant remember Holt doing anything of note

Just_Jimmy
18-08-2014, 12:15 PM
I think everything that is wrong with Hibs is evident in Liam Craig.

He has no winners mentality, he is soft as ****.
He looks to hide and shift blame when things go wrong.
He will be aggressive to a ref or other players but won't stick the boot in a 50/50.
He doesn't lift the performance of anyone around him.
The fans don't trust him.
He has no relationship or connection to the support.

He is a terrible captain and piss poor standard of competitor, technically he may be decent, but everything else over rides that.

Pedantic_Hibee
18-08-2014, 12:18 PM
The only thing I'd criticise Craig for is his floated crosses. He should be fizzing them in.

Pretty Boy
18-08-2014, 12:19 PM
I thought he played very well for the 1st half hour or so, more so because his partner was having a nightmare. I'd go as far as to say he was the best midfielder on the park up to that point.

The penalty miss killed his fragile confidence though and he totally faded. That miss was horrible timing as he has played well thus far this season and that has made him public enemy number 1 amongst the fans again.

Boyle89
18-08-2014, 12:22 PM
I thought he was good until the miss. Thought his head went down after that and he stood off people after that. We needed someone who would drive the team on as captain and that's not Craig IMO.

PeeJay
18-08-2014, 12:24 PM
The guy really shouldn't be at the club any longer (along with a few others). To take a penalty and not even hit the target in the derby - unforgivable! In the 1st half (before the penalty) we had a corner and the ball came to Craig just outside the D - he then turned around and passed the ball all the way back to the goalkeeper ... why is he still here?

Pretty Boy
18-08-2014, 12:31 PM
The guy really shouldn't be at the club any longer (along with a few others). To take a penalty and not even hit the target in the derby - unforgivable! In the 1st half (before the penalty) we had a corner and the ball came to Craig just outside the D - he then turned around and passed the ball all the way back to the goalkeeper ... why is he still here?

In fairness to Craig in the incident when he passed it back to the keeper, he had his back to the Hearts goal and they had 10 players back for the corner, he had no idea what was behind him and after he passed it back Stubbs went nuts at at least 3 players for not telling him he had time to turn.

Poor communication from others as much as poor play by Craig imo.

Smartie
18-08-2014, 12:37 PM
The whole balance of the midfield is wrong but Craig individually wasn't that bad.

I actually thought he was outstanding until the penalty and even after that he did fine although the miss had clearly affected him.

He was next to Robertson (who was having a 'mare) and behind the powderpuff 3 of Harris, Handling and Stanton who weren't at the races and I thought he was the "least bad" of the bunch.

Midfield needs sorted big time. All faces that we had last year and my main gripe last year was that we didn't seem to have a striker that could play up there by themself and no centre midfield combo that would allow us to play as a 4. El Alagui looked superb but could have done with someone up there with him - which would have left us woefully short in the middle.

I don't know how to sort it but I think it may be with a big name casualty, Robertson probably the prime candidate after yesterday.

spike220
19-08-2014, 08:49 AM
It is always good to have one ginger hair player in the team, they bring us luck!

MWHIBBIES
19-08-2014, 09:01 AM
I think everything that is wrong with Hibs is evident in Liam Craig.

He has no winners mentality, he is soft as ****.
He looks to hide and shift blame when things go wrong.
He will be aggressive to a ref or other players but won't stick the boot in a 50/50.
He doesn't lift the performance of anyone around him.
The fans don't trust him.
He has no relationship or connection to the support.

He is a terrible captain and piss poor standard of competitor, technically he may be decent, but everything else over rides that.Why would he when they make up ***** like that about him?

truehibernian
19-08-2014, 09:21 AM
In fairness to Craig in the incident when he passed it back to the keeper, he had his back to the Hearts goal and they had 10 players back for the corner, he had no idea what was behind him and after he passed it back Stubbs went nuts at at least 3 players for not telling him he had time to turn.

Poor communication from others as much as poor play by Craig imo.

Good post - players in the squad need to puff out chests and bark, shout and communicate - an ex Hibs player I see every week commented on how, last season, particularly our young players didn't appear to have a voice in games. He cited examples where there'd be a stray pass from say Craig or one of the more experienced players and the recipient (young player) would meekly raise his hand in 'apology' - basically said our players collectively need to remind all teammates to raise their game and cut out errors.

What I've noticed this season, games in, the players are actually listening to instructions and there appears to be a respect towards Stubbs that wasn't present under TB or Pat - I watched players 'turn a deefy' to Pat during games, literally looking at him in derision, and also seen players verbally abuse Malpas (sometimes rightly) from the pitch.

The footprint emerging is very much like Tony Mowbray's time here - Tony didn't quite hit the ground running but the feelings around the place were positive - in fact if I recall we took a right humping at Tynie his first derby despite starting the game very very brightly.

This side still has a certain fragility but that's to be expected given we are only a few months after relegation - but we are back to trying to play passing football - just need a couple of really creative players for me, and perhaps a workday wise head - really surprised we didn't go for McFadden to be honest - perfect player for where we are and what our Stanton's and Harris' need to learn from.

Just_Jimmy
19-08-2014, 10:24 AM
Why would he when they make up ***** like that about him?


Ok. What is made up?

He was a HUGE part in the worst Hibs ever.
He blames everyone else around him, his finger pointing and screaming at refs is embarrassing
He had a chance to stop Nicholson before the lad even got to Robertson, he tracked the run for 10-20 yards and never at any point stuck a foot in or took a booking for the team.
Do YOU think he makes players around him better? or can drag a game by the scruff of the neck?
Do YOU think the fans trust Liam Craig to perform when it matters? I don't.
There is a huge percentage of Hibs fans who wanted Craig out the club. Many still feel the same.

In what way is any of that *****? or made up?

The ONLY credit I give Craig is that he stepped up to take the kick at the weekend in the first place.

Mikey09
19-08-2014, 10:24 AM
I think everything that is wrong with Hibs is evident in Liam Craig.

He has no winners mentality, he is soft as ****.
He looks to hide and shift blame when things go wrong.
He will be aggressive to a ref or other players but won't stick the boot in a 50/50.
He doesn't lift the performance of anyone around him.
The fans don't trust him.
He has no relationship or connection to the support.

He is a terrible captain and piss poor standard of competitor, technically he may be decent, but everything else over rides that.


Aye ok..... I think everything that is wrong with Hibs.net is evident in this ridiculous post... :aok:

MWHIBBIES
19-08-2014, 10:39 AM
Ok. What is made up?

He was a HUGE part in the worst Hibs ever.
He blames everyone else around him, his finger pointing and screaming at refs is embarrassing
He had a chance to stop Nicholson before the lad even got to Robertson, he tracked the run for 10-20 yards and never at any point stuck a foot in or took a booking for the team.
Do YOU think he makes players around him better? or can drag a game by the scruff of the neck?
Do YOU think the fans trust Liam Craig to perform when it matters? I don't.
There is a huge percentage of Hibs fans who wanted Craig out the club. Many still feel the same.

In what way is any of that *****? or made up?

The ONLY credit I give Craig is that he stepped up to take the kick at the weekend in the first place.

Aye, 1 player was a HUGE part in us being awful for 5+ years. Just stop before you really embarrass yersel.

woody0-7
19-08-2014, 10:48 AM
Ok. What is made up?

He was a HUGE part in the worst Hibs ever.
He blames everyone else around him, his finger pointing and screaming at refs is embarrassing
He had a chance to stop Nicholson before the lad even got to Robertson, he tracked the run for 10-20 yards and never at any point stuck a foot in or took a booking for the team.
Do YOU think he makes players around him better? or can drag a game by the scruff of the neck?
Do YOU think the fans trust Liam Craig to perform when it matters? I don't.
There is a huge percentage of Hibs fans who wanted Craig out the club. Many still feel the same.

In what way is any of that *****? or made up?

The ONLY credit I give Craig is that he stepped up to take the kick at the weekend in the first place.
He never had a hope in hell of catching Nicholson, he was fronting bauben who plays the ball 10 yards to Nicholson who then nutmegs Robertson and the rest is history also Craig was still trying to close down the shot even tho it wasn't his man watch the highlights again!

JimBHibees
19-08-2014, 11:14 AM
Ok. What is made up?

He was a HUGE part in the worst Hibs ever.
He blames everyone else around him, his finger pointing and screaming at refs is embarrassing
He had a chance to stop Nicholson before the lad even got to Robertson, he tracked the run for 10-20 yards and never at any point stuck a foot in or took a booking for the team.
Do YOU think he makes players around him better? or can drag a game by the scruff of the neck?
Do YOU think the fans trust Liam Craig to perform when it matters? I don't.
There is a huge percentage of Hibs fans who wanted Craig out the club. Many still feel the same.

In what way is any of that *****? or made up?

The ONLY credit I give Craig is that he stepped up to take the kick at the weekend in the first place.

Dear oh dear.

cmcd
19-08-2014, 12:08 PM
Ok. What is made up?

He was a HUGE part in the worst Hibs ever.
He blames everyone else around him, his finger pointing and screaming at refs is embarrassing
He had a chance to stop Nicholson before the lad even got to Robertson, he tracked the run for 10-20 yards and never at any point stuck a foot in or took a booking for the team.
Do YOU think he makes players around him better? or can drag a game by the scruff of the neck?
Do YOU think the fans trust Liam Craig to perform when it matters? I don't.
There is a huge percentage of Hibs fans who wanted Craig out the club. Many still feel the same.

In what way is any of that *****? or made up?

The ONLY credit I give Craig is that he stepped up to take the kick at the weekend in the first place.
Worst Hibs ever You cant have watched Hibs for long Lets just let the manager get on with the job Posters quoting stupid comments on the net does not help Have faith in AS to take us where we want to be

stewpot
19-08-2014, 05:21 PM
I think everything that is wrong with Hibs is evident in Liam Craig.

He has no winners mentality, he is soft as ****.
He looks to hide and shift blame when things go wrong.
He will be aggressive to a ref or other players but won't stick the boot in a 50/50.
He doesn't lift the performance of anyone around him.
The fans don't trust him.
He has no relationship or connection to the support.

He is a terrible captain and piss poor standard of competitor, technically he may be decent, but everything else over rides that.

Totally agree mate.......

No ambition either.. No leadership qualities.... Hides at every opertunity unless we are winning... No motivation

Capt Mainwaring
19-08-2014, 08:12 PM
I think everything that is wrong with Hibs is evident in Liam Craig.

He has no winners mentality, he is soft as ****.
He looks to hide and shift blame when things go wrong.
He will be aggressive to a ref or other players but won't stick the boot in a 50/50.
He doesn't lift the performance of anyone around him.
The fans don't trust him.
He has no relationship or connection to the support.

He is a terrible captain and piss poor standard of competitor, technically he may be decent, but everything else over rides that.

Well everyone is entitled to their opinion - that's what a forum is all about. Here's my opinion for what it's worth - your taking p@sh.

whiskyhibby
19-08-2014, 08:27 PM
Well everyone is entitled to their opinion - that's what a forum is all about. Here's my opinion for what it's worth - your taking p@sh.

Couldn't agree more :-))))

jacomo
21-08-2014, 11:22 PM
Good post - players in the squad need to puff out chests and bark, shout and communicate - an ex Hibs player I see every week commented on how, last season, particularly our young players didn't appear to have a voice in games. He cited examples where there'd be a stray pass from say Craig or one of the more experienced players and the recipient (young player) would meekly raise his hand in 'apology' - basically said our players collectively need to remind all teammates to raise their game and cut out errors.

What I've noticed this season, games in, the players are actually listening to instructions and there appears to be a respect towards Stubbs that wasn't present under TB or Pat - I watched players 'turn a deefy' to Pat during games, literally looking at him in derision, and also seen players verbally abuse Malpas (sometimes rightly) from the pitch.

The footprint emerging is very much like Tony Mowbray's time here - Tony didn't quite hit the ground running but the feelings around the place were positive - in fact if I recall we took a right humping at Tynie his first derby despite starting the game very very brightly.

This side still has a certain fragility but that's to be expected given we are only a few months after relegation - but we are back to trying to play passing football - just need a couple of really creative players for me, and perhaps a workday wise head - really surprised we didn't go for McFadden to be honest - perfect player for where we are and what our Stanton's and Harris' need to learn from.

Great post.

Just wondering if Allan is going to play as our No.10.

Midfield still looks a little powderpuff though, maybe AS wants to replace OTJ.

Cameron1875
22-08-2014, 02:37 AM
Interesting but not surprising that posters slaughtering the Just_Jimmy post don't actually say why they disagree with him.

MWHIBBIES
22-08-2014, 06:16 AM
Interesting but not surprising that posters slaughtering the Just_Jimmy post don't actually say why they disagree with him.Aye, shame on them for supporting our players.

Smartie
22-08-2014, 07:42 AM
Interesting but not surprising that posters slaughtering the Just_Jimmy post don't actually say why they disagree with him.

I disagree with every point he raises.

Mikey09
22-08-2014, 10:01 AM
Interesting but not surprising that posters slaughtering the Just_Jimmy post don't actually say why they disagree with him.


Ok.... I disagree with everything he said. Sorry but these kind of posts slagging players, there characters are in general complete bull****. Liam Craig wasn't the only player on the pitch on Sunday to make a mistake. But don't football fans just love a scapegoat....

WeeRussell
22-08-2014, 11:56 AM
Interesting but not surprising that posters slaughtering the Just_Jimmy post don't actually say why they disagree with him.

Most people don't see the need to give reasons why they disagree with genocide either.

The only reasonable point was that a large percentage of Hibs fans didn't want him at the club. That's not a feature of Liam Craig's personality or character.. it's another pointer towards the 'knowledge' and nature of many of our 'supporters'.

Gustavo Fring
22-08-2014, 12:29 PM
Aye ok..... I think everything that is wrong with Hibs.net is evident in this ridiculous post... :aok:

more like everything thats wrong with hibs.net is evident in your smart ass response and the 3 of the 4 responses that follow it :not worth

oh i forgot your only allowed an opinion on here if it conforms to the views of the 'establishment'

marinello59
22-08-2014, 12:44 PM
more like everything thats wrong with hibs.net is evident in your smart ass response and the 3 of the 4 responses that follow it :not worth

oh i forgot your only allowed an opinion on here if it conforms to the views of the 'establishment'

Establishment? Care to expand?

Gustavo Fring
22-08-2014, 12:54 PM
Establishment? Care to expand?

The Establishment is a term generally used to refer to a dominant group or elite that holds power or authority in a nation or organization.

The term suggests a closed social group which selects its own members (as opposed to selection by merit or election)

marinello59
22-08-2014, 12:59 PM
The Establishment is a term generally used to refer to a dominant group or elite that holds power or authority in a nation or organization.

The term suggests a closed social group which selects its own members (as opposed to selection by merit or election)

Very good. :rolleyes:
Another definition could be those who simply disagree with you on here. :greengrin

Stevie Reid
22-08-2014, 02:42 PM
Good post - players in the squad need to puff out chests and bark, shout and communicate - an ex Hibs player I see every week commented on how, last season, particularly our young players didn't appear to have a voice in games. He cited examples where there'd be a stray pass from say Craig or one of the more experienced players and the recipient (young player) would meekly raise his hand in 'apology' - basically said our players collectively need to remind all teammates to raise their game and cut out errors.

What I've noticed this season, games in, the players are actually listening to instructions and there appears to be a respect towards Stubbs that wasn't present under TB or Pat - I watched players 'turn a deefy' to Pat during games, literally looking at him in derision, and also seen players verbally abuse Malpas (sometimes rightly) from the pitch.

The footprint emerging is very much like Tony Mowbray's time here - Tony didn't quite hit the ground running but the feelings around the place were positive - in fact if I recall we took a right humping at Tynie his first derby despite starting the game very very brightly.

This side still has a certain fragility but that's to be expected given we are only a few months after relegation - but we are back to trying to play passing football - just need a couple of really creative players for me, and perhaps a workday wise head - really surprised we didn't go for McFadden to be honest - perfect player for where we are and what our Stanton's and Harris' need to learn from.

Actually Mowbray's first derby was incredibly similar to Stubbs' - a tousy, 2-1 defeat where we probably deserved a draw, and a superb Riordan volley gave us a sniff of a chance in injury time after being 2-0 down.

Definitely agree that the positive vibes round ER are reminiscent of TM's time. I feel quite relaxed at the moment, and am looking forward to an entertaining game at ER tomorrow.

Just_Jimmy
22-08-2014, 03:59 PM
Well, it kicked off didn't it?

Firstly, folk can agree or disagree. I posted MY opinion because that is what the forum is for. It is that, my opinion. I don't care if anyone agrees or not, I'm not that fragile. I certainly don't give a toss about so called 'establishment' views, and i certainly don't agree that one even exists. Folk will agree or not based on their opinions.

I did not attack Craig's ability at any point. He has plenty. My points were on how he conducts himself as captain towards refs and other players, and based on how I, and many others perceive his attributes and attitude towards the game.

It wasn't based purely on the derby as someone suggested. My point regarding his relationship with the fans was based on the fact he has done nothing as a player so far to win the trust of the fans and even those who rate him cannot 100% say they trust him to turn up when it counts.

I feel it's important a Hibs captain has a bond with the fans, take Jones or even McPake when he arrived. Craig doesn't have that. He doesn't make the players around him better and he doesn't drag a game by the scruff of the neck either.

My opinion is purely that Craig has ability, he's shown that at other clubs but he hasn't shown me that he has a true winners mentality. I think that is beyond dispute. I think most on here would agree that the current squads mentality is still fragile. Last season is wasn't even as tough as that.

If Craig proves me wrong this season then I will be the first to congratulate him. It appears he will be around and he will play a part so for Hib's sake, I hope he does prove me wrong.

Lastly, we've played 3 games. We've lost to both our biggest rivals, one in the league and we won by a flukey goal at home to livingston. Stubbs has made some positive changes, the performance at Ibrox was pleasing dispite the result. We played reasonably well against livingston and deserved to win. However, last weekend we never threatened and after the penalty miss we looked happy to play for a draw. I didn't agree with Stubbs assessment at all. We only scored when it was too little too late. There is still PLENTY to do.

Gustavo Fring
22-08-2014, 08:32 PM
Very good. :rolleyes:
Another definition could be those who simply disagree with you on here. :greengrin

i did not make any comment to be agreed or disagreed on , it was someone else that posted an opinion and got hit with 3 or 4 moronic smart ass comments . my point is it seems to be perfectly acceptable for certain people to make these snide comments but its a bootable offence for others

hence the 'establishment'

Pretty Boy
22-08-2014, 08:34 PM
i did not make any comment to be agreed or disagreed on , it was someone else that posted an opinion and got hit with 3 or 4 moronic smart ass comments . my point is it seems to be perfectly acceptable for certain people to make these snide comments but its a bootable offence for others

hence the 'establishment'

You could always have reported the snide comments you took exception to rather than making one of your own.

P.S You do realise Mikey09 and Mikey aren't the same person?

Gustavo Fring
22-08-2014, 08:42 PM
You could always have reported the snide comments you took exception too rather than making one of your own.

P.S You do realise Mikey09 and Mikey aren't the same person?

im not reporting anything or anyone , i didnt take exception to any of the comments . just the fact that some folk are allowed to make them and other folk are not

marinello59
22-08-2014, 08:49 PM
im not reporting anything or anyone , i didnt take exception to any of the comments . just the fact that some folk are allowed to make them and other folk are not

Really? If somebody, no matter who it is, makes offensive and abusive comments it will be dealt with. If we have missed something it's because nobody has reported it.

Caversham Green
22-08-2014, 08:51 PM
im not reporting anything or anyone , i didnt take exception to any of the comments . just the fact that some folk are allowed to make them and other folk are not



are you on rod petries payroll

:hmmm:

Mikey
22-08-2014, 08:52 PM
im not reporting anything or anyone , i didnt take exception to any of the comments . just the fact that some folk are allowed to make them and other folk are not

Bad news. You're wasting our time and we've all got better things to do on a Friday night than run around after you.

Sort yourself out, sharpish.

Mibbes Aye
22-08-2014, 09:03 PM
The Establishment is a term generally used to refer to a dominant group or elite that holds power or authority in a nation or organization.

The term suggests a closed social group which selects its own members (as opposed to selection by merit or election)

Two things IMO.

Quoting Wikipedia is pretty lame at the best of times, not even acknowledging you're quoting it is even worse.

As a choice of metaphor, claiming there is an 'establishment' doesn't work. By your definition, it would mean that all the posters who were criticising Just Jimmy's post had been invited to join a grouping where it was expected that they would criticise the post, if they were to be members of this 'elite' group.

I think what you maybe meant was that there may be a 'conformist' approach, whereby posters gravitate towards a certain kind of response, as it seems to fit in accepted behaviour or norms. That in itself is pretty patronising, given I'm guessing you don't know the posters you are referencing.

I hate a lazy metaphor, just saying like :greengrin

Gustavo Fring
22-08-2014, 09:03 PM
Bad news. You're wasting our time and we've all got better things to do on a Friday night than run around after you.

Sort yourself out, sharpish.

what are you on about ? run around after me , aye ok then - go and grab me a beer will you and make it snappy

West hamBERNIAN
22-08-2014, 09:49 PM
I played Liam a few times when we were kids and he was awesome even though he was a couple of years younger than me, not proper
Games but over the park, keepers the ref stuff. I was a pretty good player for my age at that point, he completely blew me away. I'm delighted he's now playing for hibs and I just hope he gets his confidence back.

Mr White
22-08-2014, 10:02 PM
what are you on about ? run around after me , aye ok then - go and grab me a beer will you and make it snappy

Ting ting ting... could that be hector salamanca's bell ringing for a final time?

Mikey09
22-08-2014, 10:24 PM
Well, it kicked off didn't it?

Firstly, folk can agree or disagree. I posted MY opinion because that is what the forum is for. It is that, my opinion. I don't care if anyone agrees or not, I'm not that fragile. I certainly don't give a toss about so called 'establishment' views, and i certainly don't agree that one even exists. Folk will agree or not based on their opinions.

I did not attack Craig's ability at any point. He has plenty. My points were on how he conducts himself as captain towards refs and other players, and based on how I, and many others perceive his attributes and attitude towards the game.

It wasn't based purely on the derby as someone suggested. My point regarding his relationship with the fans was based on the fact he has done nothing as a player so far to win the trust of the fans and even those who rate him cannot 100% say they trust him to turn up when it counts.

I feel it's important a Hibs captain has a bond with the fans, take Jones or even McPake when he arrived. Craig doesn't have that. He doesn't make the players around him better and he doesn't drag a game by the scruff of the neck either.

My opinion is purely that Craig has ability, he's shown that at other clubs but he hasn't shown me that he has a true winners mentality. I think that is beyond dispute. I think most on here would agree that the current squads mentality is still fragile. Last season is wasn't even as tough as that.

If Craig proves me wrong this season then I will be the first to congratulate him. It appears he will be around and he will play a part so for Hib's sake, I hope he does prove me wrong.

Lastly, we've played 3 games. We've lost to both our biggest rivals, one in the league and we won by a flukey goal at home to livingston. Stubbs has made some positive changes, the performance at Ibrox was pleasing dispite the result. We played reasonably well against livingston and deserved to win. However, last weekend we never threatened and after the penalty miss we looked happy to play for a draw. I didn't agree with Stubbs assessment at all. We only scored when it was too little too late. There is still PLENTY to do.


Well ill you did attack his ability to compete, his ability to lead his team mates. You are more than welcome to your opinion Jimmy but if it's a character assassination of a player and I don't agree with it then I have every right to express my opinion.

Mikey09
22-08-2014, 10:30 PM
more like everything thats wrong with hibs.net is evident in your smart ass response and the 3 of the 4 responses that follow it :not worth

oh i forgot your only allowed an opinion on here if it conforms to the views of the 'establishment'


The establishment?? Really?? Everyone on here is entitled to there opinion. Just don't get paranoid that a certain group are out to force there views on others. It doesn't happen.... Eh no Mikey?? :wink:

Just_Jimmy
22-08-2014, 11:18 PM
Well ill you did attack his ability to compete, his ability to lead his team mates. You are more than welcome to your opinion Jimmy but if it's a character assassination of a player and I don't agree with it then I have every right to express my opinion.

Firstly, I don't think I crossed swords with you directly and I certainly didn't question your right to call me out for what I said or dispute your ability to disagree with me. Further more I never at any point questioned anyone's right to their opinion. I didn't respond to any of the comments which called it 'pish' or simply quoted a post of similar content. Anyone can disagree or agree with what I said, as I said in the post you quoted - indeed I respect that. I don't want Liam Craig to fail at Hibs, and I don't tear into him during games but what I said was my opinion of the player and I stand by it. I don't think Craig lacks technical ability, from what I have seen in his time at Hibs I think he lacks other attributes, I certainly think he doesn't look like a good choice as captain. This is a view shared by many, and voiced by many on here over time in different formats. There was a thread which discussed removing the Captaincy to allow him to 'concentrate on the other aspects of his game' for example.

I fully accept my opinion caused a divide and many disagree, that's fine, I don't at anytime condone in-fighting caused by what I said or accusations of an 'establishment' view or that certain posters have ganged up on me at all. I'm big enough to know what I said was controversial, I don't rate Craig, and I stand by my opinion, I think he'll be remembered as a failure at Hibs more likely than a success but we'll see, I DO HOPE it is the later. I wasn't trying to be controversial deliberately and I want the best for Hibs, which ever players bring that about.

I fully accept you won't or don't agree with my views and I respect that. This forum is here to provide all Hibs fans with a platform to air their views, whatever they are and it's a better place when that happens.

Liam will likely start tomorrow, he'll captain the club, so I hope he has the best game of his career and kicks on to prove me completely wrong. I would take pleasure in that because it will likely mean Hibs have been successful longer term.