forever Hibernian

[bingo70]

Just heard on the radio Paul Kane talking about bid to do similar to the foundation of hearts but attempt to get the fans yo take over 51% of the club. Think the group is called forever Hibernian or Hibernian forever or something along those lines.

I'm surprised there's not been any more mentioned about it on here, did anybody else gear it or am I going bonkers?

Good luck to Kane, regardless of what you think of him or his ideas you can't deny his motives are good and I'm thankfully he's taking the time to explore this option.

[Peevemor]

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/hibs-fans-set-for-takeover-bid-after-farmer-talks-1-3471254

[nribs]

Just heard on the radio Paul Kane talking about bid to do similar to the foundation of hearts but attempt to get the fans yo take over 51% of the club. Think the group is called forever Hibernian or Hibernian forever or something along those lines.

I'm surprised there's not been any more mentioned about it on here, did anybody else gear it or am I going bonkers?

Good luck to Kane, regardless of what you think of him or his ideas you can't deny his motives are good and I'm thankfully he's taking the time to explore this option.
It's on the EEN site I think, read it earlier today

[nribs]

In fact here you go http://m.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/hibs-fans-set-for-takeover-bid-after-farmer-talks-1-3471254

[Peevemor]

OK, so the consensus is that Kano has nothing but the club's best interests at heart, but I find it interesting that has mandate from the "Petrie Out" campaign has now been transferred to the "Forever Hibernian" takeover group, with no mention of RP.

[E10 Rifle]

OK, so the consensus is that Kano has nothing but the club's best interests at heart, but I find it interesting that has mandate from the "Petrie Out" campaign has now been transferred to the "Forever Hibernian" takeover group, with no mention of RP.

He was basically told to 'get tae' with the Petrie Out call by TF, so this I guess is an alternative motion.

[bingo70]

OK, so the consensus is that Kano has nothing but the club's best interests at heart, but I find it interesting that has mandate from the "Petrie Out" campaign has now been transferred to the "Forever Hibernian" takeover group, with no mention of RP.

Not really a contradictory alternative though. The first part of the project was simply for the removal, the second is to offer an alternative, something a lot of people were asking.

[marinello59]

OK, so the consensus is that Kano has nothing but the club's best interests at heart, but I find it interesting that has mandate from the "Petrie Out" campaign has now been transferred to the "Forever Hibernian" takeover group, with no mention of RP.

What mandate? He can't claim one yet. If enough fans are willing to invest then that will be his mandate.

[lord bunberry]

What mandate? He can't claim one yet. If enough fans are willing to invest then that will be his mandate.

He asked for a show of hands at the protest, it was almost unanimous

[marinello59]

He asked for a show of hands at the protest, it was almost unanimous

Apologies, I didn't realise this had already been voted on by some fans. To be honest it's the first I have heard of it. What did he actually say at the protest then?

[bigwheel]

Unlike Hearts who had to come together as one to save their club , there isn't the urgent "burning platform" for us . As a result it will be hard to create a mass movement to commit funding in the way Hearts did.

[lord bunberry]

Apologies, I didn't realise this had already been voted on by some fans. To be honest it's the first I have heard of it. What did he actually say at the protest then?

I can't remember what he said exactly but it was along the lines of "there's been a lot of talk about stage 2 of our plan, stage 2 is to have the fans running the club" he then asked for a show of hands. I'm sure others who were there will be able to say exactly what was said, my memory isn't what it used to be :greengrin

[Keith_M]

“We are now drawing up a proposal for a Newco Hibernian Fans Co-Operative to own the club and the stadium,” explained the retired midfielder, who made almost 300 appearances for the club."

“The key point is the fans will own a 51 per cent majority shareholding through a membership scheme and we will attract finance for the other 49 per cent."

“We have already talked to potential investors in the business community who are Hibs supporters as well as other potential investors."



Sounds a reasonable idea, if they can convince enough people to put money into it.

If they do, I hope they decide to go with the Stubbs/Dempster revolution and don't get any daft ideas about putting somebody else in charge.

[bigwheel]

“We are now drawing up a proposal for a Newco Hibernian Fans Co-Operative to own the club and the stadium,” explained the retired midfielder, who made almost 300 appearances for the club."

“The key point is the fans will own a 51 per cent majority shareholding through a membership scheme and we will attract finance for the other 49 per cent."

“We have already talked to potential investors in the business community who are Hibs supporters as well as other potential investors."



Sounds a reasonable idea, if they can convince enough people to put money into it.

If they do, I hope they decide to go with the Stubbs/Dempster revolution and don't get any daft ideas about putting somebody else in charge.

Interesting to note the training academy isn't mentioned ...

[marinello59]

I can't remember what he said exactly but it was along the lines of "there's been a lot of talk about stage 2 of our plan, stage 2 is to have the fans running the club" he then asked for a show of hands. I'm sure others who were there will be able to say exactly what was said, my memory isn't what it used to be :greengrin

Thanks
I fully support the idea that Petrie should leave the club. I am less sure about Farmer out. I believe Dempster when she says that she is the one in control and am willing to give her a chance to see how things go.

[Keith_M]

Thanks
I fully support the idea that Petrie should leave the club. I am less sure about Farmer out. I believe Dempster when she says that she is the one in control and am willing to give her a chance to see how things go.


He has to go eventually. No one lives forever and the guy is already 73.

There needs to be some plan in place to pass ownership on.

[lord bunberry]

Thanks
I fully support the idea that Petrie should leave the club. I am less sure about Farmer out. I believe Dempster when she says that she is the one in control and am willing to give her a chance to see how things go.

Farmer out is a hard one, there's no doubt in my mind that he provides a safety net for us, but I don't think it helps having an owner who doesn't have a real passion for the club. If Dempster proves to be a success there's no reason why she wouldn't be kept on under any new regime.

[Iggy Pope]

He asked for a show of hands at the protest, it was almost unanimous

I wasn't there. It might look a bit less than unanimous if everybody with an interest had been.
How could you describe this as a mandate?
Do you have the details of the attendees? Shareholders? Season ticket holders? Hibernians? Hibs.netters?????. Place could have been crawling with Yams and Huns for all you know (admittedly, the showing of hands might have been a height challenge for some of them).

[marinello59]

He has to go eventually. No one lives forever and the guy is already 73.

There needs to be some plan in place to pass ownership on.

Of course there does. my assumption was that he had one in place or was a long way down the road to having one in place. Paul Kane's idea might be the way forward, I am dismissing nothing without any detail. It's the idea he has a mandate at present that I find strange but it's no big thing really.

[lord bunberry]

I wasn't there. It might look a bit less than unanimous if everybody with an interest had been.
How could you describe this as a mandate?
Do you have the details of the attendees? Shareholders? Season ticket holders? Hibernians? Hibs.netters?????. Place could have been crawling with Yams and Huns for all you know (admittedly, the showing of hands might have been a height challenge for some of them).

He is only representing the people who were there, he isn't speaking for anyone else

[Hibs90]

I'm out. Don't think it would work.

[Iggy Pope]

He is only representing the people who were there, he isn't speaking for anyone else

Not a mandate then. At least not one with any structure or cohesion.

[NW]

Let's let the group present properly before any conclusions are jumped too.
It's clear STF wants out and he needs to be given options.

[Ozyhibby]

It's an idea I think that can work and the fact is that we need a succession plan for STF.
What we need to know is how much needs to be raised and is STF a willing seller?

[Peevemor]

He asked for a show of hands at the protest, it was almost unanimous

Even if the main players remain the same, "Forever Hibernian" should be viewed as a different movement from "Petrie Out" (which wasn't called "Farmer Out" after all). I hope that Kano, their spokesman, is honest enough to be clear about this.

[marinello59]

Let's let the group present properly before any conclusions are jumped too.
It's clear STF wants out and he needs to be given options.

I agree totally.
It's a pity that the press have tried to portray this as a mass fans movement with Paul Kane acting as the spokesperson. I bet he has made no such claim himself. Early days yet.

[Elephant Stone]

No thanks.

[Ozyhibby]

No thanks.

Any particular reason or do you just think we should carry on as we are?

[bingo70]

Any particular reason or do you just think we should carry on as we are?

Forever.....

Farmer won't be here forever and hearts have shown there's an appetite for fan investment.

[easty]

Any particular reason or do you just think we should carry on as we are?

It doesnt have to be black or white, heads or tails. You can still think change might be a good thing, but not fancy the Paul Kane revolution.

[bighairyfaeleith]

not enough info to make a decision either way at this point. I don't have much time for the fans reps at hibs to be honest but I would certainly have an open mind until I had all the details and if it can work then I would get behind it. My concern at the moment is that fan ownership is very much in it's infancy in this country and I am far from convinced the financials stack up if problems hit.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

No thanks.

Why not?

Are you one of the many sheep we have who will follow this dead end owner forever?

Makes 100% sense to me to do this but of course let's see the full facts first.

[GGTTH07]

Intriguing. Could work IMO

[bingo70]

It doesnt have to be black or white, heads or tails. You can still think change might be a good thing, but not fancy the Paul Kane revolution.

It's not really a Paul Kane revolution though. He's just the one giving up his time to get the ball rolling.

We need to plan for life after farmer because he won't be here forever.

Unless there's another person out there you know of wanting to take over then asking the fans to buy out some of the shares seems the sensible option imo.

[easty]

Why not?

Are you one of the many sheep we have who will follow this dead end owner forever?

Makes 100% sense to me to do this but of course let's see the full facts first.

You think something you've been told almost nothing about makes 100% sense to you? Who's the sheep?

[TowerHibs]

No thanks.

Not sure you can say this without a single bit of information out in the public.

Like saying no thanks to a bag full of £1million because you dont like the idea of taking a bag.

Again, and i have said this on a number of threads about different issues, is this how you live your day to day life. Instant dismisal of any ideas without solid basis.

[TowerHibs]

You think something you've been told almost nothing about makes 100% sense to you? Who's the sheep?

to be fair - he did say lets see the facts first

[Elephant Stone]

Why not?

Are you one of the many sheep we have who will follow this dead end owner forever?

Makes 100% sense to me to do this but of course let's see the full facts first.

Sheep? You need to be a sheep to be cautious about a takeover? It's a 'no' from me for lots of reasons. Aside from the fact that Hibs fans have mostly supported the decisions of the ownership as it stands anyway, I think that there's enough change happening at the moment to see through before thinking about something as extensive as this.

[Charnley 4]

Personally I just cannot see past the 'too many cooks in the kitchen' type scenario with a fan ownership system. Guys with a bit of wedge seeing the opportunity for a voice and striving for personal gain.

[TowerHibs]

Sheep? You need to be a sheep to be cautious about a takeover? It's a 'no' from me for lots of reasons. Aside from the fact that Hibs fans have mostly supported the decisions of the ownership as it stands anyway, I think that there's enough change happening at the moment to see through before thinking about something as extensive as this.

No one said that this change is immediate. Thins could take 4/5 years to implement. We are not bogged down with fan buy outs like Hearts/Pars that needed to happen or the club would fold. We have the luxury of getting the fine details correct and properly discussed....could take 4/5 years but could be done properly.

Still, you've already said no

[marinello59]

Why not?

Are you one of the many sheep we have who will follow this dead end owner forever?

Makes 100% sense to me to do this but of course let's see the full facts first.

No real need for that really is there? Surely we can debate this without resorting to stuff like that.

[easty]

It's not really a Paul Kane revolution though. He's just the one giving up his time to get the ball rolling.

We need to plan for life after farmer because he won't be here forever.

Unless there's another person out there you know of wanting to take over then asking the fans to buy out some of the shares seems the sensible option imo.

Perhaps he can share some of the details with the rest of us, cos owning 51% of the club while 'finance' owns the other 49% means absolutely nothing to me. What 'finance', who is putting up the money? This isnt a plan for life, its barely even a plan. We've heard nothing for weeks and the best he can come back with is this?

Secondly, as has been pointed out previously, Paul Kane was acting as a spokesman of sorts for Get Petrie Out, now he's Forever Hibernian. How about a bit of transparency from the start about whats to be achieved. What will it be next month? Bring Griffiths Home?

And, I'm sorry, but me not knowing someone who is happy to throw a bit of cash away by investing in Hibs has no relevance to not being happy about this set-up.

[easty]

Sheep? You need to be a sheep to be cautious about a takeover? It's a 'no' from me for lots of reasons. Aside from the fact that Hibs fans have mostly supported the decisions of the ownership as it stands anyway, I think that there's enough change happening at the moment to see through before thinking about something as extensive as this.

:agree:

[TowerHibs]

People would be unhappy about anything.

"I dont know about this therefore i am unhappy". Boring beige people

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Sorry for any offence. :wink:

Saying "sheep" I simply meant I find far too many fans posting on here wanting mediocrity all the time.

We have to change the track here at some point so why not now?

We need to toughen up and make sure this clubs moves forward, I obviously want to know all the facts as I say but we need to get Petrie out, fast and to do that we must make STF a good and sound offer, he like us all will want to know the full story.

[Iggy Pope]

People would be unhappy about anything.

"I dont know about this therefore i am unhappy". Boring beige people

If you replace unhappy with cautious does it still mean beige, rebel that you are?

[Geo_1875]

I'm amazed at the number of posters who are unhappy with the current regime and unhappy with the movement for change and don't put forward any alternative strategies.

[easty]

I'm amazed at the number of posters who are unhappy with the current regime and unhappy with the movement for change and don't put forward any alternative strategies.

I'm not unhappy with our current regime, I like the changes that have been implemented, so I'm not a victim of your wee rant, regardless of how little sense it makes as a point :na na:

[GloryGlory]

Perhaps he can share some of the details with the rest of us, cos owning 51% of the club while 'finance' owns the other 49% means absolutely nothing to me. What 'finance', who is putting up the money? This isnt a plan for life, its barely even a plan. We've heard nothing for weeks and the best he can come back with is this?

Secondly, as has been pointed out previously, Paul Kane was acting as a spokesman of sorts for Get Petrie Out, now he's Forever Hibernian. How about a bit of transparency from the start about whats to be achieved. What will it be next month? Bring Griffiths Home?

And, I'm sorry, but me not knowing someone who is happy to throw a bit of cash away by investing in Hibs has no relevance to not being happy about this set-up.

With, no doubt, "finance" having a security over ER and EM.

[TowerHibs]

If you replace unhappy with cautious does it still mean beige, rebel that you are?

not at all. Cautious i would say is understandable. Posts saying a flat "no" is just plain daft. And then the name calling on both side (with no information to support either) is a reason why this would take a long time for Hibs fans to do anything. Hearts had no choice.

[Dave-O]

With, no doubt, "finance" having a security over ER and EM.


That's exactly what will happen and that scares me sh**less, I would much rather see the ground and east mains going into a trust where no one can sell or borrow against these assets and maybe a fans co-operative for the club, I think something has to be worked out for the long term future of the club and now could be that time.

[CropleyWasGod]

With, no doubt, "finance" having a security over ER and EM.

If it's finance to buy 49% of the shares, that's a bad road to go down. (cf Man U.)

However, I read it as 49% of the shares being owned by non-mainstream fans.

[jacomo]

“We are now drawing up a proposal for a Newco Hibernian Fans Co-Operative to own the club and the stadium,” explained the retired midfielder, who made almost 300 appearances for the club."

“The key point is the fans will own a 51 per cent majority shareholding through a membership scheme and we will attract finance for the other 49 per cent."

“We have already talked to potential investors in the business community who are Hibs supporters as well as other potential investors."



Sounds a reasonable idea, if they can convince enough people to put money into it.

If they do, I hope they decide to go with the Stubbs/Dempster revolution and don't get any daft ideas about putting somebody else in charge.

As I've just asked on the takeover thread, what do they mean by this? Newco??

Sorry to raise alarm bells, but mentioning Newco in connection with Hibs is either extremely naive or just very clumsy. Or very worrying.

[Global Hibby]

With, no doubt, "finance" having a security over ER and EM.

The bank already have "security " and its strongly arguable that the bank debt has exposure based on valuations at other clubs. The debts that are owed are shown in the accounts and will be in the latest accounts which will be published in next few months.

[Ozyhibby]

That's much better. People asking real questions instead of instantly dismissing or accepting the idea.
There will be a lot more questions to be asked and answered before the final plan takes shape.

[jacomo]

In fact here you go http://m.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/hibs-fans-set-for-takeover-bid-after-farmer-talks-1-3471254

I've now read this and consider it a joke, to be honest.

1. Why describe it as a Newco? PK can't possibly mean that, unless he is mental.
2. Why 51% fan ownership? Why not 100%? Why would you want to finance (i.e. borrow) 49% of the value of the company if you could buy it outright?
3. It all depends on how much Hibs is valued at. And there is no indication here as to what that figure might be.

I'm not at all opposed to the idea of fan ownership. I think you could make it work. But we're not off to a good start here.

[Ozyhibby]

As I've just asked on the takeover thread, what do they mean by this? Newco??

Sorry to raise alarm bells, but mentioning Newco in connection with Hibs is either extremely naive or just very clumsy. Or very worrying.

He means the will be setting up a separate company to collect the D/D's, much the same as FoH is a newco which is purchasing Hearts. It is no threat to our history.

[jacomo]

?? Do you know what 'Newco' means?

Yes. In a Scottish football context (do let me know if this should be better understood in any other context) it means an entirely new company being formed in order to operate a football club, rather than acquiring an existing, trading company either by a straight negotiation or administration.

In the case of Rangers, it meant reapplying to join the Scottish Football League in the lowest tier, which has surely set a precedent for any subsequent Newco.

Now we've cleared that up, what was the point of your post?

[Ozyhibby]

I've now read this and consider it a joke, to be honest.

1. Why describe it as a Newco? PK can't possibly mean that, unless he is mental.
2. Why 51% fan ownership? Why not 100%? Why would you want to finance (i.e. borrow) 49% of the value of the company if you could buy it outright?
3. It all depends on how much Hibs is valued at. And there is no indication here as to what that figure might be.

I'm not at all opposed to the idea of fan ownership. I think you could make it work. But we're not off to a good start here.

I agree with you on question 2. We need to know what the plan is for the other 49%.
Q3 is the most important, we need to know how much the asking price is.

[jacomo]

He means the will be setting up a separate company to collect the D/D's, much the same as FoH is a newco which is purchasing Hearts. It is no threat to our history.

Sorry, it's a very dumb way of describing such a set up, due to the association with Rangers and what happened there. That was a Newco.

[Iggy Pope]

not at all. Cautious i would say is understandable. Posts saying a flat "no" is just plain daft. And then the name calling on both side (with no information to support either) is a reason why this would take a long time for Hibs fans to do anything. Hearts had no choice.

Agreed.

And that Avatar. Man, I took a German Hibby to that game and it was out of this world. He still talks about 'Hibz' emptying Ibrox. didn't understand what I meant when I told him that they sat on our mantelpiece anyway......

[Ozyhibby]

Sorry, it's a very dumb way of describing such a set up, due to the association with Rangers and what happened there. That was a Newco.

Maybe a poor choice of words but not a game changer, something we can move on from.

[Weir7]

If it's finance to buy 49% of the shares, that's a bad road to go down. (cf Man U.)

However, I read it as 49% of the shares being owned by non-mainstream fans.

Total opposite. Will be fans / well known local business men with substantial capital to invest as apposed to fans who wish to commit a small amount. So there is opportunities for all

[Weir7]

Personally I just cannot see past the 'too many cooks in the kitchen' type scenario with a fan ownership system. Guys with a bit of wedge seeing the opportunity for a voice and striving for personal gain.

Hahaha personal gain buying shares in hibs. Total opposite.

[Charnley 4]

Hahaha personal gain buying shares in hibs. Total opposite. I don't mean a financial gain directly from Hibs. I just mean personal exposure for people who might not necessarily be suitable guys to be around Hibs.

[CropleyWasGod]

Total opposite. Will be fans / well known local business men with substantial capital to invest as apposed to fans who wish to commit a small amount. So there is opportunities for all

Opposite to what?

What you describe is what I read it as.

[Jack]

If Kanos first plan/option was to get Petrie out and if that was successful maybe he wouldn't have seen the need for a phase 2 and this subsequent move might never have been needed.

He did say whatever came after Petrie out he would come back to the fans, his mantra is 'the fans will decide'.

I think its all very interesting and wait for more details, from Kano or the club, before jumping to any conclusions.

[DarlingtonHibee]

Total opposite. Will be fans / well known local business men with substantial capital to invest as apposed to fans who wish to commit a small amount. So there is opportunities for all

Where have these guys been for 20 years, they must be nuts to think of investing in Hibs at present, or are they hoping to buy us on the cheap, as I've said before Kano, Reilly cannot be trusted with our football club, and no doubt Simon is getting a few quid for his media pals for the story - what happened to the confidentially clause they were quoting ?
-

[Ozyhibby]

If Kanos first plan/option was to get Petrie out and if that was successful maybe he wouldn't have seen the need for a phase 2 and this subsequent move might never have been needed.

He did say whatever came after Petrie out he would come back to the fans, his mantra is 'the fans will decide'.

I think its all very interesting and wait for more details, from Kano or the club, before jumping to any conclusions.

We should not wait for Paul to come up with a complete plan. It should be done as a discussion with all the Hibs fans. We don't need glorious leaders like other clubs, we need to start getting our hands dirty ourselves (metaphorically).

[jacomo]

Maybe a poor choice of words but not a game changer, something we can move on from.

Alongside the total lack of detail, it does not fill me with confidence I'm afraid.

I am not even sure what the point of today's announcement is, other than to let us know that he's had an approach rebuffed by STF but that he's now working on another one.

[Ozyhibby]

Where have these guys been for 20 years, they must be nuts to think of investing in Hibs at present, or are they hoping to buy us on the cheap, as I've said before Kano, Reilly cannot be trusted with our football club, and no doubt Simon is getting a few quid for his media pals for the story - what happened to the confidentially clause they were quoting ?
-

They are not getting the club, the proposal is for the fans to own it.
What specifically makes you think they are not to be trusted?

[NW]

Tbf to Paul he was getting stick for being quiet and now he is getting stick for speaking up. I am sure the details and a proper thought out plan will be forthcoming soon. The people involved are all Hibs men and know there is no money to be made. This is about Hibernian. Our club

[DarlingtonHibee]

They are not getting the club, the proposal is for the fans to own it.
What specifically makes you think they are not to be trusted?
So who is paying the 7m mortgage on the stands that we owe, and with what guarantee ?

Running a business with a 7-8 million turnover is slightly different from running a local pub, or a supporters club

[marinello59]

Tbf to Paul he was getting stick for being quiet and now he is getting stick for speaking up. I am sure the details and a proper thought out plan will be forthcoming soon. The people involved are all Hibs men and know there is no money to be made. This is about Hibernian. Our club

Perhaps yourself and GlobalHibby could fill us in then as I assume its not coincidence that you have both appeared on this thread.

[Weir7]

Opposite to what?

What you describe is what I read it as.

Nothing like man u. Don't know why people need to speculate. Id wait until facts of proposal comes out. It will be hibs fans buying club and stadium and east mains. A trust will be set up. Trustees will need to be appointed etc

[DarlingtonHibee]

Nothing like man u. Don't know why people need to speculate. Id wait until facts of proposal comes out. It will be hibs fans buying club and stadium and east mains. A trust will be set up. Trustees will need to be appointed etc

Just so I'm right here, Kano has got people lined up to invest in a club that is losing revenue in a football league that has little brand, or sponsors ?

Cant wait to find out who they are.

[CropleyWasGod]

Nothing like man u. Don't know why people need to speculate. Id wait until facts of proposal comes out. It will be hibs fans buying club and stadium and east mains. A trust will be set up. Trustees will need to be appointed etc

Aren't you speculating?

[Weir7]

Where have these guys been for 20 years, they must be nuts to think of investing in Hibs at present, or are they hoping to buy us on the cheap, as I've said before Kano, Reilly cannot be trusted with our football club, and no doubt Simon is getting a few quid for his media pals for the story - what happened to the confidentially clause they were quoting ?
-
Season tickets watching hibs.farmer now wants to sell up. He wants the fans involved. Your more than welcome to present a proposal.

[Weir7]

Aren't you speculating?

Wait and see

[jacomo]

Perhaps yourself and GlobalHibby could fill us in then as I assume its not coincidence that you have both appeared on this thread.

Is Global Hibby back? We're saved! Or are we?

:wink:

[Ozyhibby]

So who is paying the 7m mortgage on the stands that we owe, and with what guarantee ?

Running a business with a 7-8 million turnover is slightly different from running a local pub, or a supporters club

Same people who are paying it now. Us. The Fans.
Last year we reduced our debt by nearly £1m.
Repaying the debt will need to be done from revenues generated by the club as it is under the current regime.

[CropleyWasGod]

Wait and see

Wait and see if you're speculating?

:cb

[Keith_M]

Tbf to Paul he was getting stick for being quiet and now he is getting stick for speaking up. I am sure the details and a proper thought out plan will be forthcoming soon. The people involved are all Hibs men and know there is no money to be made. This is about Hibernian. Our club


:agree:


I'm a little worried that this development will turn into yet another DotNet witch hunt.

Kane has announced that talks are in place but I'd imagine some of the detail is still confidential or up for discussion. I think some people are just so impatient that if they don't hear everything straight away, they make a snap judgement or throw their toys out of the pram.

[marinello59]

:agree:


I'm a little worried that this development will turn into yet another DotNet witch hunt.

Kane has announced that talks are in place but I'd imagine some of the detail is still confidential or up for discussion. I think some people are just so impatient that if they don't hear everything straight away, they make a snap judgement or throw their toys out of the pram.

I haven't seen any toys being flung out of the pram. Several posters have said they will reserve judgement until there is more detail. I'm in that camp, this might well be the way forward. But all we have so far is a press release suggesting this is a fans lead initiative with Paul Kane as spokesperson. Only the vast majority of the fans know nothing about it so surely people are entitled to question it.

[Jack]

We should not wait for Paul to come up with a complete plan. It should be done as a discussion with all the Hibs fans. We don't need glorious leaders like other clubs, we need to start getting our hands dirty ourselves (metaphorically).

The only thing we all agree on is Hibs.

Hibs play in green, I doubt we'd agree on which shade of green ;-)

[Stonewall]

Better to say nothing if you want to keep speculation to a minimum.

Not been impressed with Kane and his cronies so far, but remain open minded as to any proposals to take the club over. Some people will speculate but more importantly others will ask pertinent questions. Don't see any sign of a witch hunt.

[Keith_M]

I haven't seen any toys being flung out of the pram. Several posters have said they will reserve judgement until there is more detail. I'm in that camp, this might well be the way forward. But all we have so far is a press release suggesting this is a fans lead initiative with Paul Kane as spokesperson. Only the vast majority of the fans know nothing about it so surely people are entitled to question it.


It hasn't got too bad yet on this thread but we've already had it described as a 'joke' and a rather pointed remark about where these 'investors' have been for the last 20 years.

I'm actually in the camp you mentioned, of waiting to see the details before deciding, but I'm worried that some people have already made up their minds or others that think we should just wait on some plan that STF may or may not have for succession of ownership instead.

[lord bunberry]

I haven't seen any toys being flung out of the pram. Several posters have said they will reserve judgement until there is more detail. I'm in that camp, this might well be the way forward. But all we have so far is a press release suggesting this is a fans lead initiative with Paul Kane as spokesperson. Only the vast majority of the fans know nothing about it so surely people are entitled to question it.

It's not the questioning of this that's the problem, it's the downright derision from some posters that I find strange. We've not heard the details yet so most of us will reserve judgement till then. Just to be clear I'm not accusing you of being unreasonable.

[marinello59]

It's not the questioning of this that's the problem, it's the downright derision from some posters that I find strange. We've not heard the details yet so most of us will reserve judgement till then. Just to be clear I'm not accusing you of being unreasonable.

Mrs M59 says I am totally unreasonable most of the time.:greengrin

[BH Hibs]

Not keen on the fan ownership model as theres not been an example of one working out positively in this country that I can think if

[Iggy Pope]

:agree:


I'm a little worried that this development will turn into yet another DotNet witch hunt.

Kane has announced that talks are in place but I'd imagine some of the detail is still confidential or up for discussion. I think some people are just so impatient that if they don't hear everything straight away, they make a snap judgement or throw their toys out of the pram.

I hope there's no witch hunt.
Don't know if you have ever met Paul Kane but I have and like loads of others I love him to shreds.
Wouldn't trust him with my bike though and he probably knows that most of his mates feel the same!

Patience and time.

[CB_NO3]

Ok, here we go. This is complete guesswork. How much would it cost to buy 51% of the club? My guess is 4 million. How do we raise 4 million? Monthly DDs till we reach that amount, then once the money is made, do Hibernian Forever make a bid? Or does Kano and co get the money from other investors and we pay them back at a later time e.g. Anne Budge (don't fancy that route). Who do we trust to run the club, surely not the 'Petrie out' campaign? Who holds the other 49% of the club? Farmers son? Or would Hibernian Forever be obliged to make an offer for the rest of the shares?

We have had a problem at Hibs but its not that bad, off the pitch at least in order to gamble with our future. I for one am happy to see Petrie take a step down and let Dempster run things and if fans want to contribute then buy tickets for games.

[NW]

Ok, here we go. This is complete guesswork. How much would it cost to buy 51% of the club? My guess is 4 million. How do we raise 4 million? Monthly DDs till we reach that amount, then once the money is made, do Hibernian Forever make a bid? Or does Kano and co get the money from other investors and we pay them back at a later time e.g. Anne Budge (don't fancy that route). Who do we trust to run the club, surely not the 'Petrie out' campaign? Who holds the other 49% of the club? Farmers son? Or would Hibernian Forever be obliged to make an offer for the rest of the shares?

We have had a problem at Hibs but its not that bad, off the pitch at least in order to gamble with our future. I for one am happy to see Petrie take a step down and let Dempster run things and if fans want to contribute then buy tickets for games.

You seem to forgetting that STF is keen to move on

[easty]

You seem to forgetting that STF is keen to move on

Has he actually said that? I've seen it on here a few times.

[CB_NO3]

You seem to forgetting that STF is keen to move on
Well if its Farmers proposal then it would make more sense, but from what I have heard around pubs and so on, is Farmers son will take control of his shares when the time comes for Sir Tom to hand them over.

[NW]

Has he actually said that? I've seen it on here a few times.

He is engaging with a number of parties. Are we not best having some control

[Weir7]

Well if its Farmers proposal then it would make more sense, but from what I have heard around pubs and so on, is Farmers son will take control of his shares when the time comes for Sir Tom to hand them over.

He wants out. Talking to different groups. Wants punters involved. Only one group that wants fans to own the club and stadium etc

[Weir7]

Ok, here we go. This is complete guesswork. How much would it cost to buy 51% of the club? My guess is 4 million. How do we raise 4 million? Monthly DDs till we reach that amount, then once the money is made, do Hibernian Forever make a bid? Or does Kano and co get the money from other investors and we pay them back at a later time e.g. Anne Budge (don't fancy that route). Who do we trust to run the club, surely not the 'Petrie out' campaign? Who holds the other 49% of the club? Farmers son? Or would Hibernian Forever be obliged to make an offer for the rest of the shares?

We have had a problem at Hibs but its not that bad, off the pitch at least in order to gamble with our future. I for one am happy to see Petrie take a step down and let Dempster run things and if fans want to contribute then buy tickets for games.

Club is skint. Budgets slashed. But PR machine says premeir league prices. But players and wages we are offering ain't premier league.

Lets see when club accounts if farmer had to bail out tge club with loans due to petries mis management.

Also inreresting how much of season ticket money has been spent

[CB_NO3]

He wants out. Talking to different groups. Wants punters involved. Only one group that wants fans to own the club and stadium etc
Well if that is the case I would happily get behind Kano's plan then. Would rather the club be in the hands of the fans and not some oversea investor who could potentially ruin us.

Suppose it will all come out eventually.

[Golden Bear]

He wants out. Talking to different groups. Wants punters involved. Only one group that wants fans to own the club and stadium etc


It would be good to see a statement to that effect issued by STF himself.

[Weir7]

Well if that is the case I would happily get behind Kano's plan then. Would rather the club be in the hands of the fans and not some oversea investor who could potentially ruin us.

Suppose it will all come out eventually.

Im with you. It will take time for fine details to come out. Im sure we'll get some information soon.

But it's reliant on farmer being happy.

But key aim hibs trust owns stadium etc so we'll always have our ground.

[blackpoolhibs]

Just so I'm right here, Kano has got people lined up to invest in a club that is losing revenue in a football league that has little brand, or sponsors ?

Cant wait to find out who they are.

Me too, as under the current owner we are in the 2nd tier of Scottish football, losing fans hand over fist and have a new manager and team every 18 months or so.

Even i could manage the club this badly.

[Hibernia Na Eir]

He was basically told to 'get tae' with the Petrie Out call by TF, so this I guess is an alternative motion.

.....would that be one of TF's son's rather than TF himself? ;-)

[Keith_M]

Me too, as under the current owner we are in the 2nd tier of Scottish football, losing fans hand over fist and have a new manager and team every 18 months or so.

Even i could manage the club this badly.


Nobody in their right mind would consider an investment in Hibs to be a good business move but that doesn't mean that nobody would be willing to buy shares in the club. I think the people he has spoken to will be Hibs supporting Businessmen, with an emotional instead of financial reason for investment.

Yes, the club has been managed badly but maybe potential investors agree with that and want to manage it differently. Is that so hard to imagine?

[Weir7]

Just so I'm right here, Kano has got people lined up to invest in a club that is losing revenue in a football league that has little brand, or sponsors ?

Cant wait to find out who they are.

This is hard work.

Target is hibs fans to own club. Hibs business people are lined up to invest. Other ways to invest are monthly direct debit scheme. Rank and fike fans will own 51%. Club and stadium will be in safe hands. Professional buisness people will run club day to day chief exec finance director.

End of day if it proceeds you will have opportunity to invest. If you don't wantto thats your pperogative.

For me its not a financial investment its an emotional one.i want my team to be owned by hibs fans.

If a rich business man wants to sick in £500k or . £20 a month its all good.

Hopefully changes for supporter branches, Internet groups, hibs club will get opportunity to invest a lump sum into the trust /^ community model which is set up.

[blackpoolhibs]

Nobody in their right mind would consider an investment in Hibs to be a good business move but that doesn't mean that nobody would be willing to buy shares in the club. I think the people he has spoken to will be Hibs supporting Businessmen, with an emotional instead of financial reason for investment.

Yes, the club has been managed badly but maybe potential investors agree with that and want to manage it differently. Is that so hard to imagine?

Not at all, i think any new owner would want to run it differently and hopefully much better too? :confused:

[marti1875]

I was just looking at a website mainly for footie betting but has threads on other sports too. The guy who runs it writes for the Daily Rantic.
One of the posters who seems to be there constantly is a Yam called Raaljica or something weird like that and his avatar is their badge and never stops going on about them...basically a pain as he's as totally arrogant and deluded as they come and i see some other posters seem to take his word as gospel (as we would expect anyway i guess :greengrin)

I think if he is wrong he's leaving himself or even herself? wide open to action being taken judging by the nature of his post against the individual he has named.

I don't post on the site, i just look to see if there are any decent tips but here's what he was slavering today...now i have no idea if he does know something or not but i just thought i'd show what he posted on the site earlier today if anyone is interested......maybe no-one is bothered at all but anyway this is his post below if anyone is interested:

"Hibs are in negotiations about a takeover bid. It is being ‘bankrolled’ by Property Developer and Licensed Trade Magnet Kevin Doyle. If it happens then I am pretty sure I will be in a position to give some ‘exclusives’ about Mr Doyle that many newspapers would like. Myself and Doyle go back a long way and there is no love lost Tick Tock Doyle"

[marinello59]

He is engaging with a number of parties. Are we not best having some control

I'll ask again. I assume the fact that you and Global Hibby have appeared on here is no coincidence. Perhaps one of you could provide a little more detail.

[Weir7]

I'll ask again. I assume the fact that you and Global Hibby have appeared on here is no coincidence. Perhaps one of you could provide a little more detail.

Its up to the other groups to come out. Or farmer comes out and tells the punters his plans and how much he wants.

Then he can be judged if he done this for the community which is his agm strap line when hes getting stick

[NW]

I'll ask again. I assume the fact that you and Global Hibby have appeared on here is no coincidence. Perhaps one of you could provide a little more detail.

I appear on many threads and have done for many years. The details will come out as soon as ready, I have never spoken to not met Paul Kane

[NW]

I'll ask again. I assume the fact that you and Global Hibby have appeared on here is no coincidence. Perhaps one of you could provide a little more detail.

There is little evidence of alternative to fan/community ownership going forward and that is what is being investigated.

[marinello59]

I appear on many threads and have done for many years. The details will come out as soon as ready, I have never spoken to not met Paul Kane

But you have been working with Global Hibby who hasn't posted here since his last couple of nonsense threads. So it isn't really a coincidence is it?

[NW]

But you have been working with Global Hibby who hasn't posted here since his last couple of nonsense threads. So it isn't really a coincidence is it?

How do you know who and what I work with? Struggling to see what your gripe is. A number of people are putting their own time, effort and skills in to see if they can help the club. If that doesn't please you then maybe offer your own kind of help

[Jonnyboy]

Interesting thread :agree:

Think I'll just slip into wait and see mode :wink:

[marinello59]

How do you know who and what I work with? Struggling to see what your gripe is. A number of people are putting their own time, effort and skills in to see if they can help the club. If that doesn't please you then maybe offer your own kind of help

You told us yourself on Global Hibby's buy out thread. :confused:
No gripe, just a request for info. Given the nonsense Global subjected us to here the last time is that really so unreasonable?
I'll leave it though, this could be a genuinely exciting development. I'll await the details with interest.

[Conrad Gray]

But you have been working with Global Hibby who hasn't posted here since his last couple of nonsense threads. So it isn't really a coincidence is it?

Why would they post if they are going to get shot down by people on here, irrespective of what they say.

There are well intentioned people giving up their time and money to hopefully benefit all of us. Let's give them a chance to progress this rather just writing it off as nonsense.

[Benny Brazil]

Interesting thread :agree:

Think I'll just slip into wait and see mode :wink:

Good choice Jonny - think that's where I am at with it all - not enough info to go on just now to get hot under the collar about.

[Golden Bear]

No thanks.

I'll second your no thanks.

[Caversham Green]

Something that concerns me is the apparent separation of club and stadium - and presumably training centre as well. At the moment the club owns these, so if you buy the club the stadium comes in the package and there's no need to talk about them separately. While the concept of a 'property' company renting the stadium to the club could work to my mind it's fraught with unnecessary difficulties and alarm bells really start to ring when it's coupled with talk of 'business' people 'investing'. In these circumstances I think it would be essential for the property company to be a community interest company with restrictions on the sale of the property.

Anyway, like Jonnyboy I'm in wait and see mode.

[marinello59]

Why would they post if they are going to get shot down by people on here, irrespective of what they say.

There are well intentioned people giving up their time and money to hopefully benefit all of us. Let's give them a chance to progress this rather just writing it off as nonsense.

OK I will bow out after I answer this.
I am not writing this off as nonsense. And I will say again, this may well turn out to be the best way forward. Perhaps if those who are in the know here about this shared a little more info rather than nods and winks a real feel good momentum could be built up around this. Just an idea.

[Ozyhibby]

Something that concerns me is the apparent separation of club and stadium - and presumably training centre as well. At the moment the club owns these, so if you buy the club the stadium comes in the package and there's no need to talk about them separately. While the concept of a 'property' company renting the stadium to the club could work to my mind it's fraught with unnecessary difficulties and alarm bells really start to ring when it's coupled with talk of 'business' people 'investing'. In these circumstances I think it would be essential for the property company to be a community interest company with restrictions on the sale of the property.

Anyway, like Jonnyboy I'm in wait and see mode.

Where is there anything about separating the club from the property? I would be dead against such a proposal.

[NW]

Something that concerns me is the apparent separation of club and stadium - and presumably training centre as well. At the moment the club owns these, so if you buy the club the stadium comes in the package and there's no need to talk about them separately. While the concept of a 'property' company renting the stadium to the club could work to my mind it's fraught with unnecessary difficulties and alarm bells really start to ring when it's coupled with talk of 'business' people 'investing'. In these circumstances I think it would be essential for the property company to be a community interest company with restrictions on the sale of the property.

Anyway, like Jonnyboy I'm in wait and see mode.

Totally agree , the CIC model is very good

[weecounty hibby]

Not enough info for me. Not enough proof that fan ownership would work. The hearts fans HAD to do it to save their club, i still fully expect the DDs to drop substantially. I belive STF has to step down for the good of the club but i also believe that he will do what is best for the club and i think that may be why he is still there at the moment. If he thinks PKs proposal ifs good, worksble and most importantly sustainable for future generations of Hibbies then i'm sure he will not he too difficult to deal with. All IMHO and totally without being ITK!!

[Caversham Green]

Where is there anything about separating the club from the property? I would be dead against such a proposal.

It's just the wording in the Scotsman article. I might be reading too much into it but I wonder why they feel the need to say 'club and stadium' when they are one and the same.

Like you, I'm by no means a fan of the idea and would be dead against it if the holding company was not a CIC.

[Ozyhibby]

Not enough info for me. Not enough proof that fan ownership would work. The hearts fans HAD to do it to save their club, i still fully expect the DDs to drop substantially. I belive STF has to step down for the good of the club but i also believe that he will do what is best for the club and i think that may be why he is still there at the moment. If he thinks PKs proposal ifs good, worksble and most importantly sustainable for future generations of Hibbies then i'm sure he will not he too difficult to deal with. All IMHO and totally without being ITK!!

I don't think there is enough information for anyone yet, which is why I'm surprised that people are ruling it in or out already.
What I do know is that our current owner is failing and we are in the championship. I would think that would enough for most fans to give them a fair hearing?

[Ozyhibby]

It's just the wording in the Scotsman article. I might be reading too much into it but I wonder why they feel the need to say 'club and stadium' when they are one and the same.

Like you, I'm by no means a fan of the idea and would be dead against it if the holding company was not a CIC.

Ah, good, I thought I had missed something.
I think the time has come for Paul Kane to start talking to more of the Hibs fans and start laying out his proposals.

[weecounty hibby]

I don't think there is enough information for anyone yet, which is why I'm surprised that people are ruling it in or out already.
What I do know is that our current owner is failing and we are in the championship. I would think that would enough for most fans to give them a fair hearing?

I haven't ruled anything out and am prepared to give it a chance. While i do agree that STF could be running the club better i still trust him to make the best decision as to who he sells up to and i still trust him to make that decision based on whats best for Hibs long term security.

[GreenLake]

Something that concerns me is the apparent separation of club and stadium - and presumably training centre as well. At the moment the club owns these, so if you buy the club the stadium comes in the package and there's no need to talk about them separately. While the concept of a 'property' company renting the stadium to the club could work to my mind it's fraught with unnecessary difficulties and alarm bells really start to ring when it's coupled with talk of 'business' people 'investing'. In these circumstances I think it would be essential for the property company to be a community interest company with restrictions on the sale of the property.

Anyway, like Jonnyboy I'm in wait and see mode.

I don't like that either. See how it worked out for Coventry who now can't play at the Ricoh Stadium.

[over the line]

It's just the wording in the Scotsman article. I might be reading too much into it but I wonder why they feel the need to say 'club and stadium' when they are one and the same.

Like you, I'm by no means a fan of the idea and would be dead against it if the holding company was not a CIC.

You are dead right, separating club and stadium would be disastrous! Without the stadium all you have in effect is people (team and staff). The Bradford Bulls in RL split the club and the stadium, by selling the stadium to the RFL. This resulted in the banks pulling the plug on them as they no longer had anywhere near the same value. They have gone bust twice since then and are ruined. Different sport I know but still think it would apply to Hibs if they went down the same route?

Let's hope it is just the way the article is worded, rather than a real proposal?

[schinkenotto]

Ok, here we go. This is complete guesswork. How much would it cost to buy 51% of the club? My guess is 4 million. How do we raise 4 million? Monthly DDs till we reach that amount, then once the money is made, do Hibernian Forever make a bid? Or does Kano and co get the money from other investors and we pay them back at a later time e.g. Anne Budge (don't fancy that route). Who do we trust to run the club, surely not the 'Petrie out' campaign? Who holds the other 49% of the club? Farmers son? Or would Hibernian Forever be obliged to make an offer for the rest of the shares?

We have had a problem at Hibs but its not that bad, off the pitch at least in order to gamble with our future. I for one am happy to see Petrie take a step down and let Dempster run things and if fans want to contribute then buy tickets for games.

Very sensible post. After the hellishness of the last few years,surely the last few weeks are indications of some progress.I would hate if Ms Dempster's efforts were destroyed by further disruption at this stage and she decided she'd had enough.I want Rod Petrie out as much as anyone but those wanting STF to depart should be careful what they wish for.Without the ultimate backstop of someone of STF's financial clout,Hibs would have been gone years ago and that would be the case in future if some of the "businessmen" mentioned or hinted at in this thread ever got near the club.Although I only joined Hibsnet recently I've been a Season Ticket holder for over 50 years and have renewed again in the hope that matters can move ahead at last,before I die!

[Weir7]

I don't like that either. See how it worked out for Coventry who now can't play at the Ricoh Stadium.

Coventry fans didn't own stadium. Im all for fans owning ER so its in save hands for evermore. No property vulchers could get their hands on it.

[Peevemor]

It's unfortunate how this has been handled IMO. All they're doing with their half statements is causing people to speculate and, in many cases, take sides before any real detail is known. I'm not impressed that Petrie Out has been used as a Trojan horse to open talks about getting STF out. I'm keen to see what the plan is and will be delighted if the key players are credible and have the appropriate financial clout, but the way they've gone about things to date doesn't instill much confidence.

[Weir7]

Something that concerns me is the apparent separation of club and stadium - and presumably training centre as well. At the moment the club owns these, so if you buy the club the stadium comes in the package and there's no need to talk about them separately. While the concept of a 'property' company renting the stadium to the club could work to my mind it's fraught with unnecessary difficulties and alarm bells really start to ring when it's coupled with talk of 'business' people 'investing'. In these circumstances I think it would be essential for the property company to be a community interest company with restrictions on the sale of the property.

Anyway, like Jonnyboy I'm in wait and see mode.

Ground has to be safe. Owned by the rank and file hibs fans under community trust company for me is sensible. The only aim is for the cabbage to play there. Owned by hibs fans they ain't going to do anything to harm the ownership and long term security of the ground

[Weir7]

It's unfortunate how this has been handled IMO. All they're doing with their half statements is causing people to speculate and, in many cases, take sides before any real detail is known. I'm not impressed that Petrie Out has been used as a Trojan horse to open talks about getting STF out. I'm keen to see what the plan is and will be delighted if the key players are credible and have the appropriate financial clout, but the way they've gone about things to date doesn't instill much confidence.
Rubbish. Told everyone at the rally they wanted to get involved in running club. Farmer asked for confidentially.

Simon pia has issued an update on the bounce. Kamo was also on tv tonight. Fans will be major owners. That credible enough for you.

[NW]

Rubbish. Told everyone at the rally they wanted to get involved in running club. Farmer asked for confidentially.

Simon pia has issued an update on the bounce. Kamo was also on tv tonight. Fans will be major owners. That credible enough for you.

W7 I can't see an update, likely being blind though. Where did you find it?

[easty]

Rubbish. Told everyone at the rally they wanted to get involved in running club. Farmer asked for confidentially.

Simon pia has issued an update on the bounce. Kamo was also on tv tonight. Fans will be major owners. That credible enough for you.

It's not rubbish, that's exactly how it's been.

[Brightside]

Is there any kind of bid document that the fans can review? Or at the very least a powerpoint doc with some detail. I'm hoping they haven't just read the online document for fan ownership and pulled out a few ideas.

[Peevemor]

Rubbish. Told everyone at the rally they wanted to get involved in running club. Farmer asked for confidentially.

Simon pia has issued an update on the bounce. Kamo was also on tv tonight. Fans will be major owners. That credible enough for you.

Why all the Petrie Out stuff given that drastic change had already been announced and, more importantly, if the main aim is to take over the running of the club than its likely that the majority (if not all) the board will be changed in any case?

As for the fans being the "major owners", it's impossible to say at this time whether it's credible. There's a lot of convincing to be done in any case.

[Weir7]

W7 I can't see an update, likely being blind though. Where did you find it?

Under hibs fans in takeover talks. Posters name is simon pia. Not sure if its the real Simon pia.

[lord bunberry]

It's unfortunate how this has been handled IMO. All they're doing with their half statements is causing people to speculate and, in many cases, take sides before any real detail is known. I'm not impressed that Petrie Out has been used as a Trojan horse to open talks about getting STF out. I'm keen to see what the plan is and will be delighted if the key players are credible and have the appropriate financial clout, but the way they've gone about things to date doesn't instill much confidence.

You say it's turned into a farmer out campaign, how do we know this doesn't have the support of stf? I would imagine a fan buy out would be his preferred exit strategy given his reasons for getting involved in the first place.

[Weir7]

It's not rubbish, that's exactly how it's been.

Rubbish.

[Caversham Green]

Ground has to be safe. Owned by the rank and file hibs fans under community trust company for me is sensible. The only aim is for the cabbage to play there. Owned by hibs fans they ain't going to do anything to harm the ownership and long term security of the ground

Do you think the plan is to separate the ground from the club?

If so, what would be the motive behind it - why not just have the club owned by the fans and the ground owned by the club?

[Weir7]

You say it's turned into a farmer out campaign, how do we know this doesn't have the support of stf? I would imagine a fan buy out would be his preferred exit strategy given his reasons for getting involved in the first place.

Farmer wants to sell and he wants fans to be heavily involved

[Caversham Green]

It's unfortunate how this has been handled IMO. All they're doing with their half statements is causing people to speculate and, in many cases, take sides before any real detail is known. I'm not impressed that Petrie Out has been used as a Trojan horse to open talks about getting STF out. I'm keen to see what the plan is and will be delighted if the key players are credible and have the appropriate financial clout, but the way they've gone about things to date doesn't instill much confidence.

I have to agree with that - there's a lot of misinformation flying about IMO. That's why I have suspicions about the ground separation.

[Weir7]

Do you think the plan is to separate the ground from the club?

If so, what would be the motive behind it - why not just have the club owned by the fans and the ground owned by the club?

As I said earlier wait til detailed propsal is issued. Why speculate. The model is hibs fans own ground so its it good hands. That sounds simple and easy to understand.

When time comes invest ir don't

[CropleyWasGod]

As I said earlier wait til detailed propsal is issued. Why speculate. The model is hibs fans own ground so its it good hands. That sounds simple and easy to understand.

When time comes invest ir don't

So who owns the club?

[Weir7]

Do you think the plan is to separate the ground from the club?

If so, what would be the motive behind it - why not just have the club owned by the fans and the ground owned by the club?

Pop into the four and ask. Get involved if you've good ideas share them.

Kano has repeatedly said if fans don't back ideas this won't fly.either fans like ut or they don't. And that's vevery fans perogative

[Caversham Green]

As I said earlier wait til detailed propsal is issued. Why speculate. The model is hibs fans own ground so its it good hands. That sounds simple and easy to understand.

When time comes invest ir don't

I won't if the model includes the ground being taken away from the club. That's simple and easy to understand too.

[Peevemor]

You say it's turned into a farmer out campaign, how do we know this doesn't have the support of stf? I would imagine a fan buy out would be his preferred exit strategy given his reasons for getting involved in the first place.

I didn't say that. I'm suggesting that the Petrie Out banner was used to open talks (not start a campaign) to effectively get STF out.

Why didn't they simply arrange to meet STF in a businesslike manner without all the hullabaloo beforehand?

[Weir7]

I didn't say that. I'm suggesting that the Petrie Out banner was used to open talks (not start a campaign) to effectively get STF out.

Why didn't they simply arrange to meet STF in a businesslike manner without all the hullabaloo beforehand?

You choose not to listen

[lord bunberry]

I didn't say that. I'm suggesting that the Petrie Out banner was used to open talks (not start a campaign) to effectively get STF out.

Why didn't they simply arrange to meet STF in a businesslike manner without all the hullabaloo beforehand?

I get the impression that it started as a Petrie out campaign, people then started asking what happens after Petrie goes, we then end up with were we are today stage 2. The sooner we have all the details the better

[easty]

Rubbish.

Who are you? You seem to think you have all the answers, when you appear to give none. It's not rubbish, what's rubbish is a campaign (or whatever you want to call it) that didnt have a clear vision from the start and isn't prepared to share much information at all. Then we have you, expecting us to accept it because you say so.

[easty]

I get the impression that it started as a Petrie out campaign, people then started asking what happens after Petrie goes, we then end up with were we are today stage 2. The sooner we have all the details the better

It doesn't even seem like that to me, it seems to me like the Get Petrie Out campaign were hit with buyout talk at the Get Petrie Out rally out of the blue. At best a poorly organised, spur of the moment scheme, at worst a dirty trick to set up a buyout with "support" from the fans.

[Weir7]

Who are you? You seem to think you have all the answers, when you appear to give none. It's not rubbish, what's rubbish is a campaign (or whatever you want to call it) that didnt have a clear vision from the start and isn't prepared to share much information at all. Then we have you, expecting us to accept it because you say so.

In my opinion its rubbish. Was quite clear at rally what was happening. Not my job to give answers. I just listen to what was said.

[Peevemor]

You choose not to listen

Sorry. I promise I will - when there's something to listen to.

[CropleyWasGod]

In my opinion its rubbish. Was quite clear at rally what was happening. Not my job to give answers. I just listen to what was said.

So where has it been said that "The model is hibs fans own ground so its it good hands" ?

[Weir7]

It doesn't even seem like that to me, it seems to me like the Get Petrie Out campaign were hit with buyout talk at the Get Petrie Out rally out of the blue. At best a poorly organised, spur of the moment scheme, at worst a dirty trick to set up a buyout with "support" from the fans.

A dirty trick that will force punters to sign a direct debit against their will. nothing will get through without support of fans.

[Weir7]

Sorry. I promise I will - when there's something to listen to.

Seems fair. Kano said on tv tonight propsal will come out to see if fans support it. If I like it I'll invest. If I don't i won't.

[Peevemor]

I get the impression that it started as a Petrie out campaign, people then started asking what happens after Petrie goes, we then end up with were we are today stage 2. The sooner we have all the details the better

My own feeling is that the Petrie Out rally was a publicity stunt with the takeover being the real aim. This is only my opinion, but I don't think they could have chosen a worse way to open talks with STF.

[Weir7]

So where has it been said that "The model is hibs fans own ground so its it good hands" ?

Im saying that cause I believe that. Protecting our home from vulchers

[lord bunberry]

It doesn't even seem like that to me, it seems to me like the Get Petrie Out campaign were hit with buyout talk at the Get Petrie Out rally out of the blue. At best a poorly organised, spur of the moment scheme, at worst a dirty trick to set up a buyout with "support" from the fans.

Why would they need to employ dirty tricks to try and set up a fans buyout? If people like their plans they will join in, if they don't they won't. You seem to be trying to find faults when IMO we should be waiting to see what they propose.

[CropleyWasGod]

Im saying that cause I believe that. Protecting our home from vulchers

So, it hasn't actually been said that the fans will own the ground. It's speculation on your part.

Earlier on in the thread, you berated posters for speculating. Yet you are doing the same.

[blackpoolhibs]

I didn't say that. I'm suggesting that the Petrie Out banner was used to open talks (not start a campaign) to effectively get STF out.

Why didn't they simply arrange to meet STF in a businesslike manner without all the hullabaloo beforehand?

Were you not scathing of the petrie out campaign because there was nothing after it, no plan after he went? Perhaps this is part of phase 2, which will include phase 1 too?

[easty]

A dirty trick that will force punters to sign a direct debit against their will. nothing will get through without support of fans.

Of course you're right there, nothing gets through without support of the fans, but the fans don't even know what it is they're supporting as there aren't any answers just now.

And, regardless of whether you have a choice to sign up to direct debits or not, it was still in essence a "dirty trick" to piggy back a STF buyout onto the back of Get Petrie Out. I didn't go to the rally, I posted on here the night before that I wouldn't be going because I didn't think it was at all clear what the plan was, I think it may even have been you (I'm not sure, cant be arsed to go back and check, and if it wasn't then I apologise) that said the aim is solely to get rid of Petrie. Well it wasn't.

[easty]

Why would they need to employ dirty tricks to try and set up a fans buyout? If people like their plans they will join in, if they don't they won't. You seem to be trying to find faults when IMO we should be waiting to see what they propose.

I'm not trying to find faults, I'm pointing out the glaring ones that are right in front of my eyes. If someone wants to kick-start a buyout its up to them to give me reasons why its a good idea, its not up to me to accept it blindly.

[Weir7]

Of course you're right there, nothing gets through without support of the fans, but the fans don't even know what it is they're supporting as there aren't any answers just now.

And, regardless of whether you have a choice to sign up to direct debits or not, it was still in essence a "dirty trick" to piggy back a STF buyout onto the back of Get Petrie Out. I didn't go to the rally, I posted on here the night before that I wouldn't be going but I didn't think it was at all clear what the plan was, I think it may even have been you (I'm not sure, cant be arsed to go back and check, and if it wasn't then I apologise) that said the aim is solely to get rid of Petrie. Well it wasn't.

So you're commenting on something but you weren't there. Punters were asked if they want to get involved etc do you want us to approach farmer. show of hands was uunanimous. Stage one and two were clearly articulated. Farmer said no to stage one. I repeat hes happy to sell and wants punters to be involved.

[Brightside]

So, it hasn't actually been said that the fans will own the ground. It's speculation on your part.

Earlier on in the thread, you berated posters for speculating. Yet you are doing the same.

Nothing has been said.... again. They've had a few weeks - what was the first option (that was knocked back for being dodgy), and what is the details of this one. Anyone can shout out the normal 51% fan owner ship... but what and how?

[Weir7]

I'm not trying to find faults, I'm pointing out the glaring ones that are right in front of my eyes. If someone wants to kick-start a buyout its up to them to give me reasons why its a good idea, its not up to me to accept it blindly.

Nobody asking anybody to accept it blindly. Drama queens springs to mind.

Propasal will come out you like it you invest if you don't you don't

[blackpoolhibs]

So you're commenting on something but you weren't there. Punters were asked if they want to get involved etc do you want us to approach farmer. show of hands was uunanimous. Stage one and two were clearly articulated. Farmer said no to stage one. I repeat hes happy to sell and wants punters to be involved.

Which if done to STF's satisfaction gives the club a new owner or owners and gets rid of Petrie. Win win in my book.

[Weir7]

So, it hasn't actually been said that the fans will own the ground. It's speculation on your part.

Earlier on in the thread, you berated posters for speculating. Yet you are doing the same.

Whatever floats ur boat.

[easty]

So you're commenting on something but you weren't there. Punters were asked if they want to get involved etc do you want us to approach farmer. show of hands was uunanimous. Stage one and two were clearly articulated. Farmer said no to stage one. I repeat hes happy to sell and wants punters to be involved.

Do I have to have been there to know that the Get Petrie Out rally turned into a club buyout?

I want to make one thing clear, I'm not saying I won't back any buyout, I'm saying I don't think this has been handled well. I cant see any reason why this should have appeared in the Evening News today, when there was no actual plan to back it up coming out with it. It leaves people with a load of questions, with nowhere to get the answers.

[Weir7]

Now youre just being a prick.

Thanks

[Peevemor]

Were you not scathing of the petrie out campaign because there was nothing after it, no plan after he went? Perhaps this is part of phase 2, which will include phase 1 too?

Not at all. I basically said that I thought Petrie Out was more divisive than the man himself, especially in his new role. I also asked whether rp was the right target (as opposed to STF) if change was to be achieved.

I was however totally unimpressed with Kano's "can't tell you it's a secret" stuff. He'd have been far better saying nothing at that stage.

[CropleyWasGod]

Whatever floats ur boat.

There's no need for the digs.

Like everyone, I'm trying to get at the truth here. You have suggested that you know more than most, but it appears that, like most of us, you are speculating as well. If you can confirm that, it will help me understand your posts a bit more.

[Benny Brazil]

So you're commenting on something but you weren't there. Punters were asked if they want to get involved etc do you want us to approach farmer. show of hands was uunanimous. Stage one and two were clearly articulated. Farmer said no to stage one. I repeat hes happy to sell and wants punters to be involved.

Just to jump in here - nothing was clearly articulated - stage 1 was lets protest at ER and get Petrie out and there maybe a stage 2 and a stage 3 but we aint telling you - Kano even said as much on the Radio just after it.

[Weir7]

There's no need for the digs.

Like everyone, I'm trying to get at the truth here. You have suggested that you know more than most, but it appears that, like most of us, you are speculating as well. If you can confirm that, it will help me understand your posts a bit more.

Truth will be the proposal. The aim is punters will own 51% to safeguard the ground. Hibs business men will invest bigger amounts.

Key aim is fans will be in control of our destiny and future. No carpet bagger will.be able to get their greedy mits on our ground. And the cabbage will always play at ER.

Negotiations will continue with farmer.

Fans raised £250k for hibs 100. That was just a donation. Fast forward citca 20 years, we could achieve even more

[CropleyWasGod]

Truth will be the proposal. The aim is punters will own 51% to safeguard the ground. Hibs business men will invest bigger amounts.

Key aim is fans will be in control of our destiny and future. No carpet bagger will.be able to get their greedy mits on our ground. And the cabbage will always play at ER.

Negotiations will continue with farmer.

Fans raised £250k for hibs 100. That was just a day a donation. Fast forward citca 20 years, we could achieve even more

Is this speculation, or based on something tangible?

You said earlier that the fans will own the ground. Who would own the club?

[Caversham Green]

I get the impression that it started as a Petrie out campaign, people then started asking what happens after Petrie goes, we then end up with were we are today stage 2. The sooner we have all the details the better

That's the bit that irritates me about both sides of the debate. Nothing much needs to happen if Petrie goes - a new chairman is elected from the remaining 6 or 7 directors and Leeann Dempster gets on with running the club just the same as she would if Petrie stays. His presence is irrelevant to the running of the club.

[Peevemor]

Truth will be the proposal. The aim is punters will own 51% to safeguard the ground. Hibs business men will invest bigger amounts.

Key aim is fans will be in control of our destiny and future. No carpet bagger will.be able to get their greedy mits on our ground. And the cabbage will always play at ER.

Negotiations will continue with farmer.

Fans raised £250k for hibs 100. That was just a donation. Fast forward citca 20 years, we could achieve even more

Who do you think would run the club? The fans? It's the "other" 49‰ that'll have all the clout.

[lucky]

I'm interesting in supporting this sort of thing but not in it's present format. I don't like the idea of fans paying to get 51% as a co op but business men can get their own personal shareholding with their cash. Also club and ground must not be separated

[bighairyfaeleith]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion

[Peevemor]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion

Spot on.

[NW]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion

100%. This should really be everyone's opinion

[Jonnyboy]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion

Which is why I'm in wait and see mode :greengrin

[RIP]

How does Petrie Out turn into an ownership bid?

PK to RP. Will you leave?
RP to PK. No. I need to be chairman so I can protect my shareholding and that of TF.
PK to RP. What would it take for you to exit?
RP to PK. The right offer.

Is that not what we understood had happened?

[NAE NOOKIE]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion

Dunno what your definition of a mob is BHFL .. the folk who were at the protest were as much a cross section of Hibbies as you can get, from young kids to old ladies.

I would not support any move to separate the club and stadium. As for the Petrie out campaign being a Trojan horse or dirty trick to facilitate a takeover I doubt that was the case. It has moved on to that because STF and Petrie have become one and the same. STF supports RP 100% and is not willing to look at on field failure as a failure in a business sense .... if he did IMO Petrie would be gone.

I know its become a cliché but the 51% fan ownership model is standard in Germany.... I see no reason why it couldn't work for us.

We shall see what transpires ..... but for sure anyone who gets involved would have to prove no ulterior motive. To date I have seen no evidence that those involved up to now have anything other than the good of Hibs at heart.

[Peevemor]

How does Petrie Out turn into an ownership bid?

PK to RP. Will you leave?
RP to PK. No. I need to be chairman so I can protect my shareholding and that of TF.
PK to RP. What would it take for you to exit?
RP to PK. The right offer.

Is that not what we understood had happened?

No, because Kano spoke about phases 2 & 3 prior to his meeting with STF & RP.

[bighairyfaeleith]

I don't doubt the sincerity of PK and the other guys but I also am not inspired by them.

I would like it to work so am trying to remain neutral but the lack of clarity from them about there plans from the offset has bothered me.

I would just like to see forever hibernian be a truly open organisation where everything is down in black and white so there can be no ambiguity.

They need time though to pull this together so I think we should be patient. Why are they not discussing it with Leanne though, I would have thought she could be useful here?

[bingo70]

I don't doubt the sincerity of PK and the other guys but I also am not inspired by them.

I would like it to work so am trying to remain neutral but the lack of clarity from them about there plans from the offset has bothered me.

I would just like to see forever hibernian be a truly open organisation where everything is down in black and white so there can be no ambiguity.

They need time though to pull this together so I think we should be patient. Why are they not discussing it with Leanne though, I would have thought she could be useful here?

I'd hope they'd do that in due course, for the time being I hope they leave her to get on with helping Stubbs building a new squad.

[southsider]

Perhaps he can share some of the details with the rest of us, cos owning 51% of the club while 'finance' owns the other 49% means absolutely nothing to me. What 'finance', who is putting up the money? This isnt a plan for life, its barely even a plan. We've heard nothing for weeks and the best he can come back with is this?

Secondly, as has been pointed out previously, Paul Kane was acting as a spokesman of sorts for Get Petrie Out, now he's Forever Hibernian. How about a bit of transparency from the start about whats to be achieved. What will it be next month? Bring Griffiths Home?

And, I'm sorry, but me not knowing someone who is happy to throw a bit of cash away by investing in Hibs has no relevance to not being happy about this set-up.
Like i have been calling for in other threads. Fans who have perhaps done well in business who want to put money into the club. Like a throwback to the Tom Hart days when he and others only wanted what was best for Hibs. Did not need or want a finnancial return but only wanred to help the club. There are still people out there that think like that, believe it or not.

[RIP]

How does Petrie Out turn into an ownership bid?

PK to RP. Will you leave?
RP to PK. No. I need to be chairman so I can protect my shareholding and that of TF.
PK to RP. What would it take for you to exit?
RP to PK. The right offer.

Is that not what we understood had happened?


No, because Kano spoke about phases 2 & 3 prior to his meeting with STF & RP.

When planning a campaign is it not like a game of chess? You work out all the possible permutations and have a plan prepared for each one? There are some astute businessmen in the consortium. I would be disappointed if they hadn't worked out that outcome early on.

What I would have done differently was more supporter consultation earlier to obtain a stronger mandate. As I understand it, the campaign and Farmer talking with interested parties both started to form over the winter.

Transparency is crucial

[Beefster]

Why don't the businessmen/consortium just buy the club and then implement a fan ownership scheme? Would get rid of Rodders/Farmer straight away, achieve the same end result (ownership model) and they'd probably get the relevant amount of their money back.

[Keith_M]

Why don't the businessmen/consortium just buy the club and then implement a fan ownership scheme? Would get rid of Rodders/Farmer straight away, achieve the same end result (ownership model) and they'd probably get the relevant amount of their money back.


Maybe the fans would think at that point the work had been done and there was no point buying the shares off them.

Or maybe they simply don't have enough money without the fans contribution.

[Peevemor]

Why don't the businessmen/consortium just buy the club and then implement a fan ownership scheme? Would get rid of Rodders/Farmer straight away, achieve the same end result (ownership model) and they'd probably get the relevant amount of their money back.

If such a scheme was to go ahead, ideally for me all the negotiation would have been done before anything was made public, then presented at a press conference with all tha major players at the table (including STF). This would have shown a positive, professional and united front instead of having the current undertones/backdrop of confrontation.

[Baldy Foghorn]

If such a scheme was to go ahead, ideally for me all the negotiation would have been done before anything was made public, then presented at a press conference with all tha major players at the table (including STF). This would have shown a positive, professional and united front instead of having the current undertones/backdrop of confrontation.

There has never been a united front, the support has been fed lies and the Board have constantly mis-managed/neglected the football side of things. Is it any wonder there is confrontation at this juncture?

[Peevemor]

There has never been a united front, the support has been fed lies and the Board have constantly mis-managed/neglected the football side of things. Is it any wonder there is confrontation at this juncture?

What lies?

[Baldy Foghorn]

What lies?

I know that there have been lies told to support, from some Board members, however, I won't post them here (Cue a response, saying I am making this up)

[Peevemor]

I know that there have been lies told to support, from some Board members, however, I won't post them here (Cue a response, saying I am making this up)

I'll take your word for it, but they can't be used as a reason for confrontation if (almost) nobody knows about them.

[Baldy Foghorn]

I'll take your word for it, but they can't be used as a reason for confrontation if (almost) nobody knows about them.

Fair point Peevemor......

[Bad Martini]

I have echoes of Ewan McGregor coming to my heid "Mikey Forrester? Russian ****ing sailors?" :greengrin

Two questions:

1) Who is liable for the (not insignificant) debt we still have (and continue to accrue)?
2) Do we just stick up the monthly DD when we want/need a new player or some other **** hits the fan(s)? <<< You see what I Done there? :greengrin

FAN OWNERSHIP - BRILLIANT idea. Seriously. Not taking piss. There is nobody loves the club more than us.

FAN OWNERSHIP requires much thought, preparation and planning. **** it up, and we've got no club. **** it up and we're in a worse position than we are now.

As regards Tom Farmer - he said, from day one. The club is there for anyone with a reasonable offer and (moreover) a solid and sustainable long term plan. He didnt save the club from the FTB just to give it to some other radge (whoever that may be).

We all, as fans love the club.

Thats not up for debate.

HOW we go about reviving the club is. For me, I'm trusting the boy with the £160m in the bank for NOW, until someone can prove that when the hard times come, we dont fold.

Then, I'm right doon the bank with my DD and framing my share certificate on the wall :flag:

GGTTH YA BASS

[schinkenotto]

I have echoes of Ewan McGregor coming to my heid "Mikey Forrester? Russian ****ing sailors?" :greengrin

Two questions:

1) Who is liable for the (not insignificant) debt we still have (and continue to accrue)?
2) Do we just stick up the monthly DD when we want/need a new player or some other **** hits the fan(s)? <<< You see what I Done there? :greengrin

FAN OWNERSHIP - BRILLIANT idea. Seriously. Not taking piss. There is nobody loves the club more than us.

FAN OWNERSHIP requires much thought, preparation and planning. **** it up, and we've got no club. **** it up and we're in a worse position than we are now.

As regards Tom Farmer - he said, from day one. The club is there for anyone with a reasonable offer and (moreover) a solid and sustainable long term plan. He didnt save the club from the FTB just to give it to some other radge (whoever that may be).

We all, as fans love the club.

Thats not up for debate.

HOW we go about reviving the club is. For me, I'm trusting the boy with the £160m in the bank for NOW, until someone can prove that when the hard times come, we dont fold.

Then, I'm right doon the bank with my DD and framing my share certificate on the wall :flag:

GGTTH YA BASS
Total sense!

[Waxy]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion
Me too

[Keith_M]

So, it hasn't actually been said that the fans will own the ground. It's speculation on your part.

Earlier on in the thread, you berated posters for speculating. Yet you are doing the same.


Going purely on what I read in the article....


I thought the intention was to form a company owned at least 51% by the Fans and the rest by larger investors (business people, or fans with loadsa money, if you will) . That company would own the Football Club and Stadium.


or have I over simplified matters?

[CropleyWasGod]

Going purely on what I read in the article....


I thought the intention was to form a company owned at least 51% by the Fans and the rest by larger investors (business people, or fans with loadsa money, if you will) . That company would own the Football Club and Stadium.


or have I over simplified matters?

Simple is often best, in my experience.

The simplest thing, IMO, would be what you suggest. However, there have been a few posters claiming that's not what is proposed. Whether they are speculating, or have inside knowledge, is open to speculation. :cb

[HibbySpurs]

I would support fan ownership but I won't join a mob.

I want my club and stadium to be secure and financially viable.

Give me facts and I will form my opinion


:agree::top marks

Right now the whole thing reeks (IMO).... Sounds like something cobbled together on the bag of a fag packet in a dark corner of an ER boozer....

[Keith_M]

Simple is often best, in my experience.

The simplest thing, IMO, would be what you suggest. However, there have been a few posters claiming that's not what is proposed. Whether they are speculating, or have inside knowledge, is open to speculation. :cb



They're just speculating, as I've yet to read anywhere that the Club and Stadium are to be owned separately.



FWIW, I make no claims to have any Inside Knowledge.

In fact, I could have left out the word 'Inside' from that sentence.

[CropleyWasGod]

They're just speculating, as I've yet to read anywhere that the Club and Stadium are to be owned separately.



FWIW, I make no claims to have any Inside Knowledge.

In fact, I could have left out the word 'Inside' from that sentence.

Are you speculating that you have no knowledge, or is there documentary evidence?

We need to know.

[Keith_M]

Are you speculating that you have no knowledge, or is there documentary evidence?

We need to know.


I have a convincing witness... Mrs Keekaboo.

[CropleyWasGod]

I have a convincing witness... Mrs Keekaboo.

Heard it all. Another faceless, shady character introduced into the story to give it mystique and, by extension, credibility.

No havin it.

[Keith_M]

Heard it all. Another faceless, shady character introduced into the story to give it mystique and, by extension, credibility.

No havin it.


She's East German and grew up not too far away from where Angela Merkel lived.

Does that help?

[Peevemor]

She's East German and grew up not too far away from where Angela Merkel lived.

Does that help?

Does she have a face though?

[Keith_M]

Does she have a face though?


Am I in some surreal dream or is that an ITK joke?


:greengrin


EDIT: Aw, right, faceless character.........

[Peevemor]

Am I in some surreal dream or is that an ITK joke?


:greengrin


EDIT: Aw, right, faceless character.........

Aha! Avoiding the question eh?

[Keith_M]

Aha! Avoiding the question eh?



I've got loads of experience, the Missus was in The Stasi..............

[CropleyWasGod]

I've got loads of experience, the Missus was in The Stasi..............

I saw them at the Liquid Room once.

They were crap, as is your story.

[Keith_M]

:hnetinq:

[Ozyhibby]

I have echoes of Ewan McGregor coming to my heid "Mikey Forrester? Russian ****ing sailors?" :greengrin

Two questions:

1) Who is liable for the (not insignificant) debt we still have (and continue to accrue)?
2) Do we just stick up the monthly DD when we want/need a new player or some other **** hits the fan(s)? <<< You see what I Done there? :greengrin

FAN OWNERSHIP - BRILLIANT idea. Seriously. Not taking piss. There is nobody loves the club more than us.

FAN OWNERSHIP requires much thought, preparation and planning. **** it up, and we've got no club. **** it up and we're in a worse position than we are now.

As regards Tom Farmer - he said, from day one. The club is there for anyone with a reasonable offer and (moreover) a solid and sustainable long term plan. He didnt save the club from the FTB just to give it to some other radge (whoever that may be).

We all, as fans love the club.

Thats not up for debate.

HOW we go about reviving the club is. For me, I'm trusting the boy with the £160m in the bank for NOW, until someone can prove that when the hard times come, we dont fold.

Then, I'm right doon the bank with my DD and framing my share certificate on the wall :flag:

GGTTH YA BASS

I trust STF that we won't go out of business but we are in the championship on his watch.
The current ownership is not working and can not go on forever anyways.
We need to look for alternatives.
The debt will be paid the same way it is being paid just now, from club revenues.

[Phil D. Rolls]

So you're commenting on something but you weren't there. Punters were asked if they want to get involved etc do you want us to approach farmer. show of hands was uunanimous. Stage one and two were clearly articulated. Farmer said no to stage one. I repeat hes happy to sell and wants punters to be involved.


Truth will be the proposal. The aim is punters will own 51% to safeguard the ground. Hibs business men will invest bigger amounts.

Key aim is fans will be in control of our destiny and future. No carpet bagger will.be able to get their greedy mits on our ground. And the cabbage will always play at ER.

Negotiations will continue with farmer.

Fans raised £250k for hibs 100. That was just a donation. Fast forward citca 20 years, we could achieve even more

Just a wee tip. If you want people to get involved, and part with their cash, stop calling them punters. It's about as rrelevant to the modern world as Tartan Special, holidays at Butlins, and Brylcreem.

You seek to empower the fans, but talk about them in the most patronising way.

[Weir7]

Just a wee tip. If you want people to get involved, and part with their cash, stop calling them punters. It's about as rrelevant to the modern world as Tartan Special, holidays at Butlins, and Brylcreem.

You seek to empower the fans, but talk about them in the most patronising way.
Just a wee tip. Keep your tips to yourself. I seek to empower nobody.

I'm a punter. My mates are punters.

[Phil D. Rolls]

Just a wee tip. Keep your tips to yourself. I seek to empower nobody.

I'm a punter. My mates are punters.

Ok then. Hope you find enough punters to swallow whatever it is you are trying to persuade them to do, but I don't think you will.

I would be willing to lay money you are out of step with what most Hibs fans think. Your gunboat diplomacy is probably driving more people away from your cause every timer you post.

[easty]

Ok then. Hope you find enough punters to swallow whatever it is you are trying to persuade them to do, but I don't think you will.

I would be willing to lay money you are out of step with what most Hibs fans think. Your gunboat diplomacy is probably driving more people away from your cause every timer you post.

I hope, for the sake of the buy out group, that he's not actually connected to them in any way other than just as a supporter. The guy has all the people skills of a traffic cone.

[Phil D. Rolls]

I hope, for the sake of the buy out group, that he's not actually connected to them in any way other than just as a supporter. The guy has all the people skills of a traffic cone.

I'm sure he means well. Just another bystander at a car crash, wanting to help, but doing all the wrong things. I hope the emergency services arrive soon, or the casualties will be much higher.
.

[Phil D. Rolls]

When the club gets taken over, who will be dealing with agents? One of the positive things about Petrie not being a football man, is that he wasn't part of the self serving clique of old footballers who make a living out of backhanders from clubs.

[CropleyWasGod]

When the club gets taken over, who will be dealing with agents? One of the positive things about Petrie not being a football man, is that he wasn't part of the self serving clique of old footballers who make a living out of backhanders from clubs.

I expect that it would be the same person as now, the Chief Exec.

[Ozyhibby]

When the club gets taken over, who will be dealing with agents? One of the positive things about Petrie not being a football man, is that he wasn't part of the self serving clique of old footballers who make a living out of backhanders from clubs.

How is that working out for us?

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

She's East German and grew up not too far away from where Angela Merkel lived.

Does that help?

Does she own a step ladder though? ;-)

[CropleyWasGod]

Does she own a step ladder though? ;-)

She's a pole vaulter.

Oh no, wait, she's East German..... and your name isn't .....

(c. Chic Murray, 1952)

[Phil D. Rolls]

How is that working out for us?

Not very well anymore. It worked out fine when Rangers were after Scott Brown for 200 k though.

Fair point, Petrie has to be judged by the net result of his dealings. :agree:

[Lucius Apuleius]

Just a wee tip. If you want people to get involved, and part with their cash, stop calling them punters. It's about as rrelevant to the modern world as Tartan Special, holidays at Butlins, and Brylcreem.

You seek to empower the fans, but talk about them in the most patronising way.

:grr::grr::grr::grr::grr::grr::grr::grr:

[blackpoolhibs]

Not very well anymore. It worked out fine when Rangers were after Scott Brown for 200 k though.

Fair point, Petrie has to be judged by the net result of his dealings. :agree:


If we are going to be stupid, why did he not bring in Griffiths for £150k?

[Moon unit]

Seems to be a lot of miserable ******* on here,knocking Kano for trying to do his best .
The guy has the club and fans best interests at heart, unlike many,many others who have watched STANDARDS slip lower and lower and invest less and less...get off the guys back and let's have see some support for the guy!
:flag:

[Phil D. Rolls]

If we are going to be stupid, why did he not bring in Griffiths for £150k?

Because he's a fool. He did well selling, but couldn't see that goals equal money as well. I can't believe Hibs could not afford 150k.

[lord bunberry]

Some people happen to disagree that Kano is the way forward and they are perfectly entitled to that opinion without fellow supporters calling them miserable astrisks.

I'm sure an apology would be accepted thoughif you want to try it.

I'm not sure how anyone can come to the conclusion that Kano isn't the way forward, we've not heard any details of what he's proposing yet. For some reason people have decided that they're not going to support him no matter what he says, personally I'll be keeping an open mind.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Some people need to get it into their heads that Kano is merely the spokesman, as far as I'm aware he has no interest in running Hibs (hopefully this will put a stop to the snidey remarks about him running a local pub).

[ArmadaleHibs]

Seems to be a lot of miserable ******* on here,knocking Kano for trying to do his best .
The guy has the club and fans best interests at heart, unlike many,many others who have watched STANDARDS slip lower and lower and invest less and less...get off the guys back and let's have see some support for the guy!
:flag:

Agree 100%

Were getting worse. Granted it's probably only a minority but it seems that hibs.net is the place to be chastised at the moment.

[marinello59]

Some people need to get it into their heads that Kano is merely the spokesman, as far as I'm aware he has no interest in running Hibs (hopefully this will put a stop to the snidey remarks about him running a local pub).

Aye, really no need for that.
After watching him on Sky yesterday I have to say he did a better job of getting his message across than the piece in the Scotsman did. Basically they were reminding people that they were still there and it would be a few weeks before they can put add any detail to what is a long term plan. That all seems very sensible to me.

[greenginger]

Still think the biggest stumbling block will be the stadium mortgages and the securities on the £ 10 million or so that been borrowed.

Sure a fans group could continue to service the loans by paying the interest and paying down the repayment installments but the lenders are not going to release STF from being the loan guarantor without a similarly minted replacement.

And STF ain't going to hand over control with his name securing the loans.

[blackpoolhibs]

Aye, really no need for that.
After watching him on Sky yesterday I have to say he did a better job of getting his message across than the piece in the Scotsman did. Basically they were reminding people that they were still there and it would be a few weeks before they can put add any detail to what is a long term plan. That all seems very sensible to me.

:agree:

http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/9377334/kane-expects-hibs-progress

[ronaldo7]

I liked what Paul had to say there. Very measured. Looking forward to seeing the detail now. Onwards and upwards.

[Weststandwanab]

The best bit of news I have beard for a while, Paul came across very well.

[blackpoolhibs]

I liked what Paul had to say there. Very measured. Looking forward to seeing the detail now. Onwards and upwards.

Aye but did you see the state of that shirt?

[Ozyhibby]

:agree:

http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/9377334/kane-expects-hibs-progress

Great interview.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Good interview from Paul Kane and doesn't leave much doubt as to what is being proposed by Forever Hibernian. Though no details of how it will be done as yet.

If the end result is fans owning 51% of the club then if done correctly it should remove us from the clutches of any future nutters for ever. The big trick in that scenario is being able to attract guys with big money to invest in the club in the future in the knowledge that they wont own the club outright. That will exclude quite a few folk who have egos to match the size of their wallets.

It will also make the correlation between attracting fans to the club and the clubs success even more of a factor. This isn't a case of getting fans to buy shares, its getting fans to put in on an ongoing basis over and above paying for season tickets or walk up tickets.

What will be of interest is what the fans will be asked for and what they will be offered apart from the knowledge that they are doing something for the good of their club:

I for one am now retired so TBH a fiver a week over and above the purchase of my ST would be about my limit. For some folk it will be even less or nothing. We don't want a situation where we end up with supporters who would like to put in but cant feeling excluded.

For my part I would like to see this run as a membership scheme with the gap between the FF and East filled by a huge members club run by Hibernian FC and the supporters association who could relocate from Sunnyside to the new gaff. Membership of the HSA and the Hibernian membership co - op being one and the same. Non members could gain access to the club by paying a quid at the door or something. If members have a place within the stadium to call their own it would surely draw the fans and club closer. I am thinking of something much bigger, grander and closer to all the fans than the likes of behind the goals or Sunnyside.

I know that infrastructure on the scale I'm talking about costs money and is probably for the future, but I don't see whats wrong with aiming towards something like this ...... IMO it would go a long way to bringing about a situation where in a physical as well as emotional sense the club and its supporters were one and the same.

Note:

For a number of reasons it is a good thing that the club and the HSA are totally separate entities, but in a scenario where the fans in effect own the club I can see no reason why the HSA cant be merged into the membership scheme as part of the club. After all they have successfully run Sunnyside for decades. I can see no reason why their experience couldn't be a huge asset in running this side of our football club.

[southsider]

It is important we attract as many fans as possible. For example a d/d of £25 per month gives one share in Forever Hibernian, £50 2 shares, £100 (my own outlay) gives 4 shares. The can be put in family members names or personal names. If a fan stops the d/d his/her is suspended until they catch up. 4,000 shares at £300 per year brings in £1.2 mill per year, to pay back STF and Petrie. He can do this boys and girls. GGTTH

[big-mo]

Paul Kane flew back from his family holiday to do these interviews, great to show his commitment to the project, he is on BBC Radio Scotland's 'Off the Ball' on Saturday afternoon, 12 noon until 2pm. I think that he give out a few more details of what 'Forever Hibernian' are planning. If you miss it because you are traveling to the game, I guess you may be able to catch it again on BBC's iPlayer.

[capitals_finest]

Great stuff from Paul Kane.

The prospect of the supporters taking control in one form or another puts a smile on my face.

We are Edinburgh people, we are Hibs people.... :flag:

[Hibbyradge]

That was an encouraging interview. Well done Kano.

What should also be applauded is the consistent message from STF and RP that they want Hibs to be in the safest hands for the future.

They could sell out to Vlad MkII if they wanted, but I'm relaxed in the knowledge that they won't.

We should appreciate that. It's a big thing.

[Juice-Terry]

Spoke to Kano tonight. There is NO question that A: He's got the best interest of Hibs at heart, and B: He's got some heavy hitters lined up for the 49% bit, and C: This could really change the fortunes of Hibernian FC for the better.

[Juice-Terry]

Spoke to Kano tonight. There is NO question that A: He's got the best interest of Hibs at heart, and B: He's got some heavy hitters lined up for the 49% bit, and C: This could really change the fortunes of Hibernian FC for the better.

[Hibbyradge]

If you say that every 10 minutes, people will believe you! :wink: