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CRAZYHIBBY
11-06-2014, 09:16 AM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

Thecat23
11-06-2014, 09:16 AM
This.

Stevie Reid
11-06-2014, 09:28 AM
We don't know if the job is too big for him, we can't possibly know. Terry Butcher was England captain, Rangers captain, played at World Cups, Euros, managed at various levels over a 20 year period, and the job was too big for him. Tony Mowbray was a young coach at Ipswich who had spent the majority of his career as a no nonsense centre half and decent leader of men - yet he came in and was a revelation. There are lots of other examples either way.

I can completely understand why people don't fancy Ian for the job, but we can't know if the job is too big for him. FWIW, I think he knows exactly what's required here.

jacomo
11-06-2014, 09:36 AM
As well as appointing a new manager we need to put a proper structure in place, supported by good scouting and a consistent approach from youth teams to 1st team.

I think Ian Murray could do it if properly supported, and if he bought into this model and a way of playing football. I really don't know what his ideas on playing the game are.

nribs
11-06-2014, 09:37 AM
Lets go for experience like Butcher or Williamson.

Shaggy
11-06-2014, 10:59 AM
Murray is too young for the Poison Chalice ,
let him grow and suceed somewhere, before getting knocked down here.

This coming year thou, possibly the support will cut back on the booing etc,
We are we are, and its called support,

They deserved abuse last year, this is starting from basics

Spike Mandela
11-06-2014, 11:05 AM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

Too big for him? He is a Championship manager with career on the up and we are a Championship club needing to go up.

sambajustice
11-06-2014, 11:07 AM
I dunno if he is. I'm torn.

On the face of it he looks like he's decent, got Dumbarton playing good football and scoring ridiculous amounts of goals. I think they were top scorers in that league, Hamilton might have overtaken them by scoring 10 in the last match though.

My fear is another decent Hibby "fails". Its not fun to watch.

Sauzee wasn't ready to take the post and should never have been given it. Murray on the otherhand, around the same age as Sauzee was but at least he's cut his teeth in management.

Tough call. If we want Murray, he comes and that's about all there is to it. So the question is, do we take a chance on him? Is it even a chance because of his record?

Waxy
11-06-2014, 11:15 AM
It could go either way. We've picked who we've thought was the best option and it ended in horror. I think we might have peaked at doing low points. Things can only get better.

IWasThere2016
11-06-2014, 11:16 AM
I think LD (and RP) will want someone to excite the fans - as an appointment and also as a brand of football. Hibs need to sell STs (or, the alternative - and highly unlikely - scenario is to get STF to invest).

Will IM excite? Perhaps as he is a Hibby/ex-player. His football at Sons is (IIRC Silver said) a long-ball to Nish.. Is that what we'd get? It's clearly not what most want..

In his favour, IM knows the Chumpionship and has done exceptionally well in a short time there.

Spike Mandela
11-06-2014, 11:21 AM
I think LD (and RP) will want someone to excite the fans - as an appointment and also as a brand of football. Hibs need to sell STs (or, the alternative - and highly unlikely - scenario is to get STF to invest).



Ha ha the 'OPERATION #TBGAWA' season ticket marketing will become a collectors item.:faf:

bingo70
11-06-2014, 11:25 AM
I don't want Murray as manager but it's nothing to do with the experience argument.

Clubs a lot bigger than us have appointed managers with no experience in management, Barcelona, Celtic, the rangers and
Milan and Tottenham spring to mind straight away.

I don't want him though as I've just never been that impressed when I've heard him talk or read his interviews

Waxy
11-06-2014, 11:25 AM
Say no to the long ball. Football on the deck please.

PeeJay
11-06-2014, 11:27 AM
If we opt for the simple fan-pandering solution of installing Murray as manager we will be down for a few seasons: we need to go for a manager who has actually "achieved" something and who not only fancies the challenge of taking us out of the Championship, but who can also achieve that objective ... and do it in the right direction too.

nribs
11-06-2014, 11:27 AM
I think LD (and RP) will want someone to excite the fans - as an appointment and also as a brand of football. Hibs need to sell STs (or, the alternative - and highly unlikely - scenario is to get STF to invest).

Will IM excite? Perhaps as he is a Hibby/ex-player. His football at Sons is (IIRC Silver said) a long-ball to Nish.. Is that what we'd get? It's clearly not what most want..

In his favour, IM knows the Chumpionship and has done exceptionally well in a short time there.

Im pretty sure LD will pick a manager to manage Hibs not to excite the fans, if the manager gets results and plays a brand off football pleasing to the eye then the fans will return.

Btw i have no idea who i would like to be manager of Hibs but im not discounting Murray, my only reservations is that i hear his team don't play the most attractive football

Waxy
11-06-2014, 11:28 AM
Ha ha the 'OPERATION #TBGAWA' season ticket marketing will become a collectors item.:faf:

If Petrie doesnt get an attack of the cringes everytime he sees TBGAWA then he's no human.

nribs
11-06-2014, 11:28 AM
If we opt for the simple fan-pandering solution of installing Murray as manager we will be down for a few seasons: we need to go for a manager who has actually "achieved" something and who not only fancies the challenge of taking us out of the Championship, but who can also achieve that objective ... and do it in the right direction too.

When you say achieve things do you mean won league titles and won cups? might be a hard task

silverhibee
11-06-2014, 11:29 AM
I think LD (and RP) will want someone to excite the fans - as an appointment and also as a brand of football. Hibs need to sell STs (or, the alternative - and highly unlikely - scenario is to get STF to invest).

Will IM excite? Perhaps as he is a Hibby/ex-player. His football at Sons is (IIRC Silver said) a long-ball to Nish.. Is that what we'd get? It's clearly not what most want..

In his favour, IM knows the Chumpionship and has done exceptionally well in a short time there.

That was the style on the 2 occasions i seen them play, it works for them though but it isn't pretty to watch, Murray wouldn't be my choice for the Hibs job but if he is offered it he would take it no doubt, got to remember is that his team may be battling down at the bottom of the league next season and he may just think i will take the gamble and apply for the Hibs job.

IWasThere2016
11-06-2014, 11:34 AM
Ha ha the 'OPERATION #TBGAWA' season ticket marketing will become a collectors item.:faf:


If Petrie doesnt get an attack of the cringes everytime he sees TBGAWA then he's no human.

:greengrin

calder45a
11-06-2014, 11:34 AM
Lets go for experience like Butcher or Williamson.

Sir Alexander Chapman Ferguson is looking for a move up north.

Ozyhibby
11-06-2014, 11:42 AM
Murray is too young for the Poison Chalice ,
let him grow and suceed somewhere, before getting knocked down here.

This coming year thou, possibly the support will cut back on the booing etc,
We are we are, and its called support,

They deserved abuse last year, this is starting from basics

You call the club a poisoned chalice and say let him succeed elsewhere before getting knocked down here.
Then you start on the fans for booing and being negative.
I bet life is a real mystery to you.

bingo70
11-06-2014, 11:45 AM
I don't agree it's a poisoned chalice.

Its a clean slate for someone to bring in their whole squad.

They're likely to get time as well as expectations are lower than they've ever been. Barring a disaster of butcher proportions they'll get at least 2 years to succeed.

joebakerforever
11-06-2014, 11:45 AM
As long as Petrie is still at the club pulling the strings in the background, any newly appointed manager will still be working under the handicap of his financial strictures regarding attracting decent players by offering a realistic remuneration package, commensurate with the marketplace.

IWasThere2016
11-06-2014, 11:46 AM
As long as Petrie is still at the club pulling the strings in the background, any newly appointed manager will still be working under the handicap of his financial strictures regarding attracting decent players by offering a realistic remuneration package, commensurate with the marketplace.

:top marks

Ozyhibby
11-06-2014, 11:48 AM
Provided Murray sets his teams out the right way to play attacking football, which by all accounts he does, then I'm happy for him to be given the job.
The job he has done at Dumbarton has been terrific.
I'm not saying he should get it just that I have no worries if he does.

nribs
11-06-2014, 11:51 AM
Provided Murray sets his teams out the right way to play attacking football, which by all accounts he does, then I'm happy for him to be given the job.
The job he has done at Dumbarton has been terrific.
I'm not saying he should get it just that I have no worries if he does.

I think I agree but i reserve the right to change my mind :greengrin

Stevie Reid
11-06-2014, 11:54 AM
I remember an interview with Ian a couple of years back where he talked about Yogi's time coming to an end when teams worked out how to play against us, and Hughes had no answer. In the same interview he praised Hamilton as the best team in the Championship at the time because he said that they could adapt their formation and playing style several times during a game if necessary, depending on circumstances.

I have no idea how Dumbarton play, but I highly doubt that Ian is doing his A Coaching License in order to spend his managerial career instructing CHs to launch a ball to a bit centre forward. I would imagine that he is rather pragmatic in his style, and will do what is most effective at the time for his side. His success at Dumbarton has been incredible, regardless of how it has been achieved.

erin go bragh
11-06-2014, 11:54 AM
Provided Murray sets his teams out the right way to play attacking football, which by all accounts he does, then I'm happy for him to be given the job.
The job he has done at Dumbarton has been terrific.
I'm not saying he should get it just that I have no worries if he does.

Ive heard they hoof it up to Nish . I think we should let LD get who she thinks is the right man for the job and we should keep our opinions to ourselves .
Petrie out .

Ggtth

Winston Ingram
11-06-2014, 11:58 AM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

This :agree:

Nows not the time for a rookie. We need a steady hand. Let him develop at Dumbarton.


Also is it only at Hibs, fans feel that they should hire ex-hibby's as managers? I'm struggling to think of one that's worked. They pretty much all been disasters.

Brooster
11-06-2014, 12:07 PM
I remember an interview with Ian a couple of years back where he talked about Yogi's time coming to an end when teams worked out how to play against us, and Hughes had no answer. In the same interview he praised Hamilton as the best team in the Championship at the time because he said that they could adapt their formation and playing style several times during a game if necessary, depending on circumstances.

I have no idea how Dumbarton play, but I highly doubt that Ian is doing his A Coaching License in order to spend his managerial career instructing CHs to launch a ball to a bit centre forward. I would imagine that he is rather pragmatic in his style, and will do what is most effective at the time for his side. His success at Dumbarton has been incredible, regardless of how it has been achieved.

I spoke to a championship player last night who has played against Dumbarton, he said Murray sets his teams up 4-1-3-2 and are very adaptable. The midfield 3 get forward very quickly as do the full backs. The ball moves quickly and mostly on the deck. He was amazed at the transformation Murray had overseen in such a short space of time.

Springbank
11-06-2014, 12:09 PM
Not having a pop at the op or any individual but the mentality this thread exposes is what needs to change

You're saying the best thing for a hibby is to manage anyone but Hibs

Let's change the record

The best thing for a hibby is to help Hibs however he/she can!!!!

Hibbyradge
11-06-2014, 12:12 PM
As long as Petrie is still at the club pulling the strings in the background, any newly appointed manager will still be working under the handicap of his financial strictures regarding attracting decent players by offering a realistic remuneration package, commensurate with the marketplace.

What's the alternative to working under a financial structure?

Won't the manager be given a budget to operate within, regardless of whoever is the chairman?

Or have I missed your point? Genuine question.

The_Horde
11-06-2014, 12:59 PM
He'll just go to rangers at first sniff of success anyway..

ALF TUPPER
11-06-2014, 01:00 PM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

I agree, Not Ian's time.

Shaggy
11-06-2014, 01:04 PM
I don't agree it's a poisoned chalice.

Its a clean slate for someone to bring in their whole squad.

They're likely to get time as well as expectations are lower than they've ever been. Barring a disaster of butcher proportions they'll get at least 2 years to succeed.

That would have been a great newspaper headline the day after....
HIBS..... BUTCHERED !!

:greengrin

lord bunberry
11-06-2014, 01:06 PM
Ian Murray isn't a complete novice with no expirience, I would suggest that now is the time for him to come to hibs. If we leave it until he goes elsewhere and has success then we may miss the boat with him. If the board think he's got the potential to be a good manager then we should give him the job now.

jodjam
11-06-2014, 01:09 PM
Ian Murray isn't a complete novice with no expirience, I would suggest that now is the time for him to come to hibs. If we leave it until he goes elsewhere and has success then we may miss the boat with him. If the board think he's got the potential to be a good manager then we should give him the job now.

I agree. He's young and will make mistakes but I think the time is right. A reorganised club right through with IM as manager will do for me.

Shearer
11-06-2014, 01:14 PM
Far bigger clubs than us appoint managers with no experience. Neil Lennon, Pep Guardiola, etc.

It's not really any indication at all of how good a manager would be in a position. Butcher had loads of experience,
Mowbray had none, looked how they both turned out.

jacomo
11-06-2014, 01:42 PM
This :agree:

Nows not the time for a rookie. We need a steady hand. Let him develop at Dumbarton.


Also is it only at Hibs, fans feel that they should hire ex-hibby's as managers? I'm struggling to think of one that's worked. They pretty much all been disasters.

In what world was John Collins a disaster? I do think Yogi and Mixu showed signs of being under extra pressure at Hibs though, like they couldn't switch off from it.

Onion
11-06-2014, 01:45 PM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

Agreed. Hibs at this point will chew him up and spit him out. Maybe one for the future.

Onion
11-06-2014, 01:48 PM
Far bigger clubs than us appoint managers with no experience. Neil Lennon, Pep Guardiola, etc.

It's not really any indication at all of how good a manager would be in a position. Butcher had loads of experience,
Mowbray had none, looked how they both turned out.

Appointing an inexperienced manager is a big risk for Hibs at this stage. We must get this next appoint bang on as they will be tasked with building a complete team to win the Championship. This is not a training ground or dress rehearsal.

joebakerforever
11-06-2014, 05:41 PM
What's the alternative to working under a financial structure?

Won't the manager be given a budget to operate within, regardless of whoever is the chairman?

Or have I missed your point? Genuine question.

You have misread the post - financial stricture is not the same as financial structure.

You could still operate within an overall budget without an imposed wage cap, which allows the flexibility of signing a few quality players on higher wages instead of more mediocre journeymen on lower remuneration.

Paisley Hibby
11-06-2014, 05:48 PM
We don't know if the job is too big for him, we can't possibly know. Terry Butcher was England captain, Rangers captain, played at World Cups, Euros, managed at various levels over a 20 year period, and the job was too big for him. Tony Mowbray was a young coach at Ipswich who had spent the majority of his career as a no nonsense centre half and decent leader of men - yet he came in and was a revelation. There are lots of other examples either way.

I can completely understand why people don't fancy Ian for the job, but we can't know if the job is too big for him. FWIW, I think he knows exactly what's required here.

This.

Paisley Hibby
11-06-2014, 05:53 PM
In what world was John Collins a disaster? I do think Yogi and Mixu showed signs of being under extra pressure at Hibs though, like they couldn't switch off from it.

He won the league cup with what was largely Mowbray's team. He was good on tactics but an absolute nightmare in terms of man management and signings. He has bombed at the clubs he managed or was DoF at since then. If he was to come back to hibs in any capacity other than a host in corporate I'd despair.

Albion Hibs
11-06-2014, 06:04 PM
I don't want Murray as manager but it's nothing to do with the experience argument.

Clubs a lot bigger than us have appointed managers with no experience in management, Barcelona, Celtic, the rangers and
Milan and Tottenham spring to mind straight away.

I don't want him though as I've just never been that impressed when I've heard him talk or read his interviews

Oh dear. I don't think managers saying the right thing should be a prerequisite for the job this time round. We have had plenty that can do an interview that I am sure even you would approve of, but I think we should be basing it on a manger who cab get us outbid this league, and on that basis murray has a very strong CV.

weonlywon6-2
11-06-2014, 06:07 PM
I really hope that murray doesn't get the job...I like murray, hes a good hibby and all that but I think this job is just too big for him at the moment. I reckon he will turn out to be a great manager and hopefully one day will be good enough to take the helm and take hibs forward but now isnt the time

Jackie mcnamara has done ok at utd,must be similar ages,mind you,were miles bigger than utd !!!!

Albion Hibs
11-06-2014, 06:12 PM
Jackie mcnamara has done ok at utd,must be similar ages,mind you,were miles bigger than utd !!!!


Agreed, i don't know why people are under the impression we are such a big club. The majority of the current SpL, and championship, have achieved far more than we have for a number of years. We need to get these delusions of grandure out of our heads. Where would Utd be if they had taken the same approach? If McNamara had continued on the same route there is nothing to say he would jot have gone to a far bigger club right from Partick.

O'Rourke3
11-06-2014, 06:21 PM
Please no. Stop picking managers. We are as bad as Petrie. Must be good Hibbie is first on a lot of fans list. Turnbull the only manager I can remember that did anything. Most other guys too toxic because of association with Hearts Celtic or The Rangers. Only name I've seen so far is Coyle that I could get excited about and I don't think we can afford him. Let the new CEO do her job.....

Sent from my brain via Tapatalk

jdships
11-06-2014, 06:30 PM
In what world was John Collins a disaster? I do think Yogi and Mixu showed signs of being under extra pressure at Hibs though, like they couldn't switch off from it.

The man is completely out of touch as far as man management is concerned !
Evidence of this has been posted many times on this board
Proved by the fact he has never held down a managerial job for any lenghth of time
Only ex player to have any success since WW2 is Ned

:rolleyes:

davhibby
11-06-2014, 06:33 PM
Don't remember Dumbarton playing hoofball in the friendly last summer. Iirc they played nice football on the deck. To be in the playoff race right up to the last day with a part time side is a great achievement considering Ian had to save them from what seemed certain relegation the season before

Albion Hibs
11-06-2014, 06:39 PM
Don't remember Dumbarton playing hoofball in the friendly last summer. Iirc they played nice football on the deck. To be in the playoff race right up to the last day with a part time side is a great achievement considering Ian had to save them from what seemed certain relegation the season before


Agreed, don't know where the hoofball chat comes from, no doubt people that want to appear to be in the know. Considering as a part time team they were the highest scoring in there league it seems like they play some decent attacking football...what does that look like again!

Diclonius
11-06-2014, 06:40 PM
I would be delighted if Ian Murray was our new manager. His time to become a Hibs legend is now. :agree:

Ozyhibby
11-06-2014, 08:44 PM
I'm warming to the idea of Murray getting the job.

Unseen work
11-06-2014, 08:51 PM
http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/ian-murray-is-the-main-man-says-craig-gordon-1-3440125

Gordon talking murray up saying he is the man for the job. Time will see.

Experiance is important but there is plenty of managers out there that have had none and succeeded. The important thing i would base my appointment on is:

What is his vision for the club?
What is his footballing philosophy?
What is his contacts in game?
What is his knowledge of the scottish leagues?
Does he get the respect from players and able to manage them effectively?
What will he bring to the table?

For ian murray i cant see him ticking these boxes the way i would want him too, played in scotland the majority of his career and managed at a lower levels, will have contacts from being around so long and seems like a very likeable respectable guy.

All i know is if it is murray offered the job i will support him 100% Same goes for anyone that gets the job :flag:

truehibernian
11-06-2014, 09:03 PM
'Unfashionable' Dumbarton, a team Ian took over where they were terrible, scored 65 goals last season in a very competitive league. Second top scorers, with Hamilton fleecing Morton for 10 to take that 'title'.

When he took over the Sons, they had won just 1 game in 12, scoring 11 goals.........after he took over they scored 47 goals in 24 games, winning half of them (12). That was league games.

Those stats tell you the kind of manager he is and the style of football - attacking :aok:

Baader
11-06-2014, 09:14 PM
Want Murray as our manager - but not yet. Let him grow as a manager with a big future some more. This season is a massive one for Hibs and not getting up is failure. Wouldn't want him saddled with that extra burden right away and so soon into his career.

Managing Hibs in the SPFL would have been an easier job - bottom six would not have been desirable but so long as relegation was written off early enough he'd be granted time to build and it'd be viewed as a work in progress. Right now, the pressure is immediately on getting us out of a tough league first time of asking for whoever takes over. That's big pressure.

Murray's time is the one after next.

Unseen work
11-06-2014, 09:34 PM
Jackie mcnamara has done ok at utd,must be similar ages,mind you,were miles bigger than utd !!!!


jackie is 40 and ian is 33. For me thats his biggest problem...nelson is probably older than him

Brads Laing
11-06-2014, 09:37 PM
I'm sorry but "the job is too big" is an awful and invalid argument. Who do we think we are? We're a championship club now, not Man Utd. Ian Murray is a young promising coach who has his side playing decent and effective football. Above that, he's a diehard Hibby, something we need around the club. I want Murray, let's get the feel good factor back around ER.

truehibernian
11-06-2014, 09:39 PM
jackie is 40 and ian is 33. For me thats his biggest problem...nelson is probably older than him

Ian even now would be quicker and fitter than Michael Nelson - and he's harder :aok: