Should Butcher be the manager of Hibs?

[GreenCastle]

Yes or No ?

My view...No...today was the final straw.

I wanted him at the time but wow I never thought he would self destruct in the way he has.

Falling out with players - taking a average /poor mid table team and making them worse (loss all confidence/any quality). Making Fenlon now look like Ancelloti.

Winning 2 games in 22.

Pre-historic tactics - making players play a game that doesn't suit them. Making poor team selections and subs. Picking the wrong formation for many games - 4-4-1-1. Setting up to defend today - with a 4-5-1 then changing to a 4-4-2 then going back to a 4-4-1-1 and we lose a goal.

We were wanting to avoid penalties today but we showed no urgency to win the game and looked happy with penalties.

Did we practice penalties? KT first up? Cummings last pen? Did Williams have any inside info on the Hamilton takers?

There is more to blame than Butcher here but the style of football and lack of plan for a professional club is a disgrace.

Terrible times at the club - can't see us being back for close to 3 or 4 years - it could have been avoided - RP / STF I tried to warn people on here for years but too many pro board folk looking fairly stupid now.

[Winston Ingram]

2 votes for yes so far. LTYF

[capitals_finest]

I never wanted Collins to leave, I supported Pat but understood his decision to leave (if only he held on until the end of the season) and I will continue to support Butcher.

Petrie's constant under investment in playing staff and low expectation levels are the main issues we should be targeting and directing the blame towards.

Butcher has made massive mistakes at this club but I still believe we could do and have gone along with a lot worse. Between him and Malpas they must have a good idea about the players worth keeping and the type of player we need to bring in. They have a pretty decent track record and are not stupid men. A new manager would have to start all over again and is more likely to hold on to some of these dummies. Please can we back these guys and direct the anger towards the board for the points mentioned.

[Sir David Gray]

Where's the "don't care unless we can bring in a whole new board" option?

[Gatecrasher]

Now we know he's staying we need to back him, he has a major task in his hands.

[PeachyCarnehan]

He has to go. The club cannot countenance as manager someone who got it relegated.

[GreenCastle]

I find it hard to back anyone I don't believe in.

I don't believe the board can deliver (they have shown that for years)

I haven't seen anything yet and don't believe this manager will change around what he's started - if he does he deserves a medal - massive job and don't think his style of play will get us any where.

Getting relegated from the position he took over in is sackable / he should be resigning.

[Saorsa]

butcher can **** off and take his two stooges with him and these gutless ****in' wage thieves

[GGTTH07]

Take yourself and your rotten tactics so far to **** Terry.

[Broken Gnome]

Sackable offence. Should resign. Shouldn't be sacked though as he randomly might be one of the best available to ship out one squad and get another in.

All a bit of a mess.

[Hermit Crab]

Yes. I'm backing him.

[capitals_finest]

I understand the frustration with the management team but how many more times can we start all over again. I never ever thought we would find ourselves getting relegated when TB came in but who do we bring in now and what do we do in 9 months time if it isn't working out again???

[leggeto]

I'd probably stick with him,I said at the start I wouldn't judge him until he brings in his own team so I should stick by that statement,I said the same about pat when we lost the final

[ionahibby]

I voted yes simply because he is here to stay by the looks if it so we may as well get on with it. I hope the board see sense though if things don't go to plan 4/5 games into the season.

[big gogs]

Nay nay thrice nay

[scuttle]

Yes. I'm backing him.

Can I ask you what you are seeing in him

[Nakedmanoncrack]

That there is even debate on this says it all about how too many fans see us. get him to f***

[HoboHarry]

We have to give him our full support - it has been stated this evening that he is staying and apart form that the policy of firing and re-hiring every 18 months has been a disaster.

As Einstein said - Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

[Captain Trips]

I understand the frustration with the management team but how many more times can we start all over again. I never ever thought we would find ourselves getting relegated when TB came in but who do we bring in now and what do we do in 9 months time if it isn't working out again???

We are starting all over again though already. Best time to change is now.

Sorry best time to change was weeks ago.

[The Harp]

Lots of rumours pre game that he would resign after today's match, but that hasn't materialised. Can't see the Club having the finances to dismiss him, so looks like we're stuck with him. Personally, I have zero faith in his ability to turn things around by changing the playing staff. Sorry to say but I've absolutely no trust in his judgement on any football matter ... and I say that as one of the many fans who thought he just might be the right man for the job. Just shows what I know ...:dunno:

[CB_NO3]

Terry GTF

[shankssaysno]

No from me, his line up today with one up top was naive, cowardly and totally incompetent.

[capitals_finest]

Don't let this turn into another manager witch hunt. This only takes the pressure off the real issue. 90% of the fans were delighted with his appointment!!!

Over the next month or so player budgets and targets will be discussed with RP making the final decisions and steering the club towards our destiny. We need to make it our upmost priority that we invest in the squad and make every effort for promotion next season.

[Stuarty27]

I am all for standing by our manager but it's gone to far.

His style of play makes your eyes bleed
His constant changing of formation indicates he doesn't know what he wants (4-5-1 at home to Hamilton with Danny Haynes starting today!!??)
Picking Liam Craig as club Captain
Freezing out players who are better than what we got. Eg Thomson,a half fit Mcpake is better than both McGivern and nelson put together
His January signings
His substitutions week after week are always a joke. Never changes it when we are losing and takes off the wrong player all the time.
His appointment of Mo Malpas as his assistant.
And the final straw is what he has done to Alex Harris. His confidence which is now shot to bits, should of been taken out the firing line week ago. That's what managers do!

[Pat 0-7]

How anyone can think that Butcher is right for us is beyond me.

His tactics, line-ups, substitutions, man-management and signings have relegated a team that were in the top half of the table when he took over.

He can GTF and take Petrie with him.

[Boyle89]

He got us relegated! Might not have been his players but getting us relegated is the biggest failure from a manager in recent times. Zero faith in him.

[Scouse Hibee]

How anyone can think that Butcher is right for us is beyond me.

His tactics, line-ups, substitutions, man-management and signings have relegated a team that were in the top half of the table when he took over.

He can GTF and take Petrie with him.


Nail on the head for me, he can GTF

[Pretty Boy]

No.

He's been a disaster. And if he starts next season poorly the calls for his head will start. Cue another sacking, another transitional season and repeat.

Best for all of he goes now. I'd say thanka but there's nothing to thank him for.

[Bobby's Cinema]

Absolutely not. No

[hibIBZ]

I wasn't happy in the first place, he had a r poor record on the whole, finishing last with Motherwell and getting ict relegated in the past plus a few sackings down south

[Sammy7nil]

The fact that Petrie thinks butcher can have any sort of future at the club just confirms how out of touch he is.

[Winston Ingram]

Honestly, 32 people want him to stay? Really?

Is it is track record of being pish?

Is it style of football?

Is it the way he converts proven premier league players into semi-pro donkeys?

Anyone willing to stump up a reason? If so what is it you have seen other than his 1 decent season as a manager which suggests he can actually do the job?

[dave62]

I'll be honest I was pleased when Butcher got the job, but one win in twenty odd games plus relegation means his position is untenable.

There has to be some accountability at this club.

[Captain Trips]

Honestly, 32 people want him to stay? Really?

Is it is track record of being pish?

Is it style of football?

Is it the way he converts proven premier league players into semi-pro donkeys?

Anyone willing to stump up a reason? If so what is it you have seen other than his 1 decent season as a manager which suggests he can actually do the job?

There is no reason other than the you can't sack another manager argument. Aye you can sack another manager and this is one that should have been punted weeks ago.

I to am keen to hear other than sheer hope what TB offers us other than what we have seen. Dross total and utter dross.

[HibeeBigFly]

No

[Scottie]

No Butcher should not be the manager of Hibernian football club. but

We CAN'T afford (£) to SACK him.

[WhileTheChief..]

If he stays it's just more hoofball with different players. The man hasn't got a clue.

[hfc rd]

When he took over, we were simply just very mediocre. Now he has turned us bloody totally s****!

[Baader]

Get lost. And don't even think about making the club pay you to leave

[Hermit Crab]

Can I ask you what you are seeing in him


I believe he has what it takes to put a winning a team on the park providing he is given time and money to spend b

[BVB Hibs]

Our whole issue has come about because we booted a management team mid season, giving the new one no chance to establish themselves at the club. I'd prefer we get in a new manager as I don't think Butcher can regain the supports trust, but it needs to be done now. We can't kick him out 10 games in and consign ourselves to yet another year of a manager playing with somebody elses squad. Whoever is in, is in for the season, and has to be backed.

[Allan45]

:aok::confused:
I believe he has what it takes to put a winning a team on the park providing he is given time and money to spend b
Today's disaster and been a disaster from the start of the season, the players in the squad, bar 3-4 of them are not Premiership standard. Don't blame the past 4 months for our free fall.

agree with this post.

butcher can turn this around, it's the players on the park that can't play decent football. He needs a season, we will get there......

[neil7908]

I honestly cant see how anyone could want us to continue with him in charge. In hindsight we should have got rid before the play offs - it seemed laughable at the time but it was clear he was unable get this group of players into any kind of decent shape. Maybe a new manager would not have done any better but he has taken us into freefall.

[Hibernia&Alba]

Out now. Right now!!! No league win since mid February. Clear your desk, you ****ing clown.

[IberianHibernian]

Should never have been appointed and why he was without others being considered is a disgrace . When did Petrie decide he wanted Butcher as manager ? How much money was Fenlon denied for signings in summer to pay for Butcher`s ICT compensation etc ? If he doesn`t leave this week ( resignation or sack ) suggests that Petrie has signed some really silly contract which makes sacking far too expensive to consider .

[Captain Trips]

Should never have been appointed and why he was without others being considered is a disgrace . When did Petrie decide he wanted Butcher as manager ? How much money was Fenlon denied for signings in summer to pay for Butcher`s ICT compensation etc ? If he doesn`t leave this week ( resignation or sack ) suggests that Petrie has signed some really silly contract which makes sacking far too expensive to consider .

How does anyone actually know what it will cost to sack him? has somebody seen the contract? The money made from 2 matches on TV and the extra ticket money from a good crowd yesterday would surely dent any costs. If Rod is in a position even after relegation that we cannot afford to sack him then Rod is an even bigger clown than I thought.

Get him out.

[Thecat23]

HOOOOOOOOOOOOFFFFF

HOOOOOOOOOOOOFFFFF


HOOOOOOOOOOOOFFFFF

No thanks.

[AFKA5814_Hibs]

No, he has to do the hourable thing and resign. He has turned Fenlons tutn worse.

[stoneyburn hibs]

It's absolutely gutting that we are even discussing this yet again.
Manager after manager.

He has to go, his record at this club cannot be defended.

[RIP Bestie]

As much as John Barr should be in charge of a butcher

[eggbamyasi]

Yes think we should keep him . I blame the squad / players 100% for what happened this season .

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[gegs70]

No...his team were set out to frustrate and hold on 1st mistake....he put Harris on then subbed the sub? To me it's dangerous to.set hibs up to defend a 2-0 win....

But let's not forget he brought in Haynes, Watmore and boateng...none have made a huge impact. He also openly slated tge players and publicly SaiD he would empty them. His record is also the worst I have ever seen....is he good enough???

[nribs]

Now we know he's staying we need to back him, he has a major task in his hands.

No we don't??

[Nutmegged]

Absolutely Not, Butcher should never have been given the Hibs job in the first place in my opinion, thats noy with the benefit of hindsight but just because historically the only club he has really been successful with was ICT and even then he took them down against all the odds.

His tactics are God awful and his man management by all accounts is deplorable, for the last couple og Months however I've been of the opinion that we see this Season out and then give him a proper chance because he hasn't had a Summer transfer window, howevet this joker simply doesn't deserve a Summer transfer window.

Terry Butcher can only be described as incompetent at best, the dire form in the Premiership and the 2 home games to lower league opposition in Raith and Hamilton only go to prove just how unorganised we are under him, nothing is ever a gimme in football but Hibs don't have the worst squad in the League yet by all accounts we were the poorest team in it.

Should Butcher get a chance to make it right? As much as I don't want us to keep changing manager I simply don't have any faith in him turning it around, if ever there was a Season to avoid relegation it was this one, we could be down for years.

[HKhibby]

I understand the frustration with the management team but how many more times can we start all over again. I never ever thought we would find ourselves getting relegated when TB came in but who do we bring in now and what do we do in 9 months time if it isn't working out again???

I agree with a lot of what has been said here, i am totally disgusted with how it has all ended up in being relegated!, and still cannot understand how it could have come about really!, TB and MM have a good track record at both ICT and Motherwell....not sure if Malpas was with him at Motherwell, if they had only been at Hibs since say the end of March or beginning of April or something like that i would say keep them, but they have had since November to do something, apart from a short flurry of decent results, but things have just gone from bad to worse! and in the end it looked likely for a while back now that we were candidates for relegation!

If we bring in another manager, who could we attract?...not many want to go to a club who have just been relegated, and like you say if it doesn't work out in 9 or 10 months then who do we bring in or even blame next time?

[sadtom]

There are root and branch changes required but this is specifically about the management staff.
FFS! How in gods name can anyone think this man deserves to continue in the job.
If he had any decency his resignation should already be submitted.
Like everyone else I'm sick of the managerial merry-go-round but we can't be afraid to bin the blatantly incompetent. Sticking with a manager for the sake of it is madness. They at least have to have shown something! Anything! TB/MM have shown NOTHING!
Style/tactics - Apart from a couple of early results by playing percentage fitba and by pumping dead balls into 5/6 6 footers. Its been murder. Rudimentary, basic, agricultural, primitive, predictable.

Media/Comments - Pretty good to start with. But good quite quickly became tiresome, became irritating, became worried for his mental health.

Motivation - listless, soulless and devoid of confidence.

Man management - Between TB & MM they managed to quickly pi$$ of a number of players. No nonsense, kick their backsides, strong willed it was called. Or 'bullying' if it was Yogi. By all accounts made a monumental f*** up by telling several players that they had no future then having to rely on them for half the season. At least Malpas is up for a fight...with the home support!

Shape and substitutions - oh dear! Disjointed, disorganised, baffling.

Signings - We were told about his connections and super scout SM. Rightly got rid of a few imposters and managed to bring in 'Who'? 'Unavailable' and 'flattered to deceive' on loan. Made a bad call getting rid of the keeper coach for SM who is never there and $h1t at it when he is.
Results and outcome - Damning.

The longer you walk in the wrong direction, the longer it will it will take to get on the right path. Every day is a step further away from where we want to be.

Position UNTENABLE

[truehibernian]

Gets paid £300,000 - yes, £300,000..........your season ticket money my friends, if sacked, pays that and more (MM, SM and the years they are on)........an absolute horrendous situation........wait a minute.......negotiated by.................

My angst and e-mails would be directed to Sir Tom and any Hibs minded Arab Sheik you know :greengrin

Rod Petrie - issues a statement and fans are satisfied :agree: Hibs fans would rather count green dots than take actions :cb as slow as our defence and midfield.

[RIP Bestie]

There are root and branch changes required but this is specifically about the management staff.
FFS! How in gods name can anyone think this man deserves to continue in the job.
If he had any decency his resignation should already be submitted.
Like everyone else I'm sick of the managerial merry-go-round but we can't be afraid to bin the blatantly incompetent. Sticking with a manager for the sake of it is madness. They at least have to have shown something! Anything! TB/MM have shown NOTHING!
Style/tactics - Apart from a couple of early results by playing percentage fitba and by pumping dead balls into 5/6 6 footers. Its been murder. Rudimentary, basic, agricultural, primitive, predictable.

Media/Comments - Pretty good to start with. But good quite quickly became tiresome, became irritating, became worried for his mental health.

Motivation - listless, soulless and devoid of confidence.

Man management - Between TB & MM they managed to quickly pi$$ of a number of players. No nonsense, kick their backsides, strong willed it was called. Or 'bullying' if it was Yogi. By all accounts made a monumental f*** up by telling several players that they had no future then having to rely on them for half the season. At least Malpas is up for a fight...with the home support!

Shape and substitutions - oh dear! Disjointed, disorganised, baffling.

Signings - We were told about his connections and super scout SM. Rightly got rid of a few imposters and managed to bring in 'Who'? 'Unavailable' and 'flattered to deceive' on loan. Made a bad call getting rid of the keeper coach for SM who is never there and $h1t at it when he is.
Results and outcome - Damning.

The longer you walk in the wrong direction, the longer it will it will take to get on the right path. Every day is a step further away from where we want to be.

Position UNTENABLE
Ditto

[HoboHarry]

Gets paid £300,000 - yes, £300,000..........your season ticket money my friends, if sacked, pays that and more (MM, SM and the years they are on)........an absolute horrendous situation........wait a minute.......negotiated by.................

My angst and e-mails would be directed to Sir Tom and any Hibs minded Arab Sheik you know :greengrin

Rod Petrie - issues a statement and fans are satisfied :agree: Hibs fans would rather count green dots than take actions :cb as slow as our defence and midfield.
Anyone can be clever in hindsight - there weren't too many complaints on this site when he was appointed. But hey - it's easier to blame RP rather than admit it seemed like a good decision at the time.

[truehibernian]

Anyone can be clever in hindsight - there weren't too many complaints on this site when he was appointed. But hey - it's easier to blame RP rather than admit it seemed like a good decision at the time.

You think an SPFL manager should be paid that much do you ? Outwith Lennon ?

[truehibernian]

Bearing in mind Fenlon was on nowhere near that - not even close.

[Hibee-Wylie]

He's got his last chance for me. Next slip up he's out.


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[Just_Jimmy]

No. Get him to ****

[EdinMike]

Simple answer to a simple question.

No. No confidence in him.

[scuttle]

I believe he has what it takes to put a winning a team on the park providing he is given time and money to spend b
Two things we havnt got unfortunately

[PeeJay]

Not a popular choice, no doubt, yet, personally, I'd give him the chance to get the team back up with his own players, particularly as he has a contract that may be costly to terminate ...he has the experience of bringing a team up from a lower division.

Butcher has to shoulder some of the blame, but our club's problems lie elsewhere, a quick-fix with another manager won't get us back to where we belong ...

[marjoriebanks]

Ian Murray

[Lmc2105]

Given the negative tactics and the way he set up the team at home yesterday GTF now! Made his bed in January telling the players they were not wanted! Got us in to this mess doesn't deserve the chance to mend it!

[GreenLake]

Not a popular choice, no doubt, yet, personally, I'd give him the chance to get the team back up with his own players, particularly as he has a contract that may be costly to terminate ...he has the experience of bringing a team up from a lower division.

Butcher has to shoulder some of the blame, but our club's problems lie elsewhere, a quick-fix with another manager won't get us back to where we belong ...

A hibs.net committee could win the SPFL with the Man City squad.

In the EPL, Mourinho would be relegated before Christmas with the Hibs squad.

But a crap manager won't win the EPL with a trillion pound transfer kitty. There is a contribution by the manager and a contribution by the squad.

In a competitive scenario both need to function well. A Man City squad in the SPFL is levels above therefore a crap manager could succeed. In our case the squad is on the same or lower level and a good manager is essential. There is something wrong because as bad as this squad might be, it is probably a mid table level squad for the SPFL. Something has gone rotten and some of the blame must lie with Butcher. He got into a battle with the squad and they have won. He should have seen out the season with them first.

It's done now and all should get what they deserve.

I'm quite happy for Butcher to go for that failing, but if we fail, as we have done repeatedly, to sign players who are of a reasonable SPFL standard, then our pain continues. We seem to fill up our team with ex- big team players when it might be more interesting to pick promising small team players on the ascendancy. Rejected players from big English clubs probably think they have been unlucky and are disappointed to be playing for us. Maybe we should try to select players who have over exceeded the expectations of a lower league club than players who have failed at big clubs.

[southsider]

It is highly unlikely that we will come right back up given the way the SFA/SPFL will bend over backwards to get the the rangers into the top league. Get Ian Murray in with a 3rd plan to rebuild this once proud club which has been allowed, under Petrie, to become a laughing stock. Do this and i may go back. If the present bunch of clowns, both at board AND management are allowed to continue then that me done until change comes.

[Westie1875]

No way, get him out now!

[Albion Hibs]

If winning the league is the ultimate success the being relegated from it is the ultimate loss, and for this loss he should resign, if he won't the our board should take control and sack him. Hibs have to be the only team this would be acceptable at reference, D. Lennon, G Locke, K Shiels.

[Gettin' Auld]

If we'd stayed up, i'd have given him up until christmas to see what he can achieve with his own players coming in.

Relegation for Hibs should mean instant dismissal for ANY manger, no exceptions - So GTF Butcher.

[LancsHibs]

If he had any honour he would offer his resignation (so would the rest of his team), sadly it looks like he won't do this. Lost all faith and respect for TB

[Elephant Stone]

He's already lost 2 out of 3 games against Championship teams with our Premiership squad, how bad will he be with our Championship squad?

[Hibby_G]

No Butcher Was Meant To Be Good All He Has Done Is Getting In The First Divison

[Gatecrasher]

No we don't??
Suit yersel, I just don't think calling for his head when he's staying us going to do us any good.

[Scorrie]

He has to go. Awful man management. Shocking tactics. Hoof ball. One up front. Can't see what difference next season will bring if that's what we have to look forward to. Suggestions? Have to be realistic with being in the Championship so choice is limited. Danny Lennon ?

[Hiber-nation]

Go now and take your prehistoric brand of long-ball pish with you.

[stubru59]

The manager was given the job on the basis he'd be an improvement on the last incumbent. His stated target was to achieve a top six finish.
He not only failed to deliver on that but managed to get us relegated.

Dress that up any way you like but the management team has failed.

[Elephant Stone]

The manager was given the job on the basis he'd be an improvement on the last incumbent. His stated target was to achieve a top six finish.
He not only failed to deliver on that but managed to get us relegated.

Dress that up any way you like but the management team has failed.

It can't be dressed up, mate. It's a colossal **** up beyond any description.

[ScottM1875]

Look at the positive side. He got ICT relegated then brought back up, challenging for top 4... Not very likely but if he is here to stay let's grasp onto the positives like that and give him our support...

[lord bunberry]

If taking over a club like hibs who were in mid table and taking us down is not a sackable offence what is?

[Islington Hibs]

He should resign I am sorry to say. Relegation is largely his fault but it is more the manner of the play and defeats and his slightly inconsistent and bizarre attitude that has done it for me. H ehas been unable to motivate players and taken a decent defence into a poor one. His psychology is wrong and I think he is a wrongen. However as I have posted elsewhere the bigger issue is the Board and any change has to be in tandem with Rod Petrie's head

[Dr Jimmy]

Get butcher and his entire team as far from hibs as possible. We need a full long term strategy on how we want the club to play, bringing thru youngsters and no more journeymen. The playing style has to be implemented at all age groups throughout the club and based on passing.
It is incredible that we have gone from Mowbray, Collins style of play to what we have now. That rests with previous managers and very much with terry butcher. Sack this clown NOW!!!

[Biggie]

He's taken us from mid table mediocrity to relegation, with awful tactics/team selections/substitutions/man management......in possibly the weakest SPL in history.......sorry but get him tae **** away from our club......now.

[JustSimplyHibs]

Think its time for Butcher to go along with Petrie et al.

My first choice of new manager would be Michael O'Neill, i like the way his teams try to play football. Iain Murray or, Johan Mjallby are ones who may be worth a punt.

[soul_driver]

No. Yesterday's tactics and substitutions were last straw for me.

[Sammy7nil]

I voted yes simply because he is here to stay by the looks if it so we may as well get on with it. I hope the board see sense though if things don't go to plan 4/5 games into the season.

so you voted yes but want him sacked 4 game in to next season dear oh dear

[K.Marx]

beggars belief that 84 hibs fans would actually want that clown to stay :bitchy: can only assume a large proportion of them are jambos on the wind up.

[The Leith Dutch]

I'd probably stick with him,I said at the start I wouldn't judge him until he brings in his own team so I should stick by that statement,I said the same about pat when we lost the final

So this is one of the reasons I would sack him - we've had a habit of changing managers mid season.
By the time they get to a new season they're usually damaged goods in the eyes of a fair percentage of fans.

Put it this way - if it hits October and we're mid table and adrift of Sevco and Nearly Sevco by a fair few points Butcher is a dead man walking.

AGM -> New Manager.

Cue a couple of loan signings to get us through to the end of the season to bring in his own players (because obviously we can't expect a competent manager to take a reasonable playing staff and get them playing as a team).
Seen it all before.

We need a clean slate and a new club going into the Championship - and make no mistake: if we get it right we can be the ones going up and leave the yams and sevco fighting for the play off place.

For me - Petrie goes and Butcher and Malpas with him.
Dempster brings in a manger and sets a budget and targets.

[emerald green]

It's incredible he is still manager after yesterday. Truly incredible. His whole philosophy on how the game should be played is so behind the times it's frightening. He's another one of these people who talks a good game. Oops, sorry! He got lucky at ICT. Apart from that his record is awful.

Yet another failed managerial appointment by a man who knows nothing about football. A man who has never played the game. An accountant, I've read on these threads. Step forward Mr Rod Petrie. Proud owner of an SFA blazer.

[Sammy7nil]

:confused: 93 people want him to stay ! Unbelieveable Geoff :confused:

[OsloHibs]

I logged on expecting to see him gone.. He has to go.

[Zazu62]

He has to go . His record as hibs manager is pathetic, yesterday was a shambles ,tactics,subs just a pure shambles . Hamilton deserved to get promoted

[yeezus.]

The last thing we need is a poor start to the Championship season and then sack Butcher in December. Bring in Simon Grayson I say :greengrin Unless the Twitter rumours are true and we will have Sandy Clark appointed in the next 48 hours :paranoid:

[Greencore]

Keeping this short and sweet.

Yes

Because :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeZWqXf-mHE

No hoof ball by ICT here.
& the second goal is brilliant play.

[#2 Double Tap]

Keeping this short and sweet.

Yes

Because :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeZWqXf-mHE

No hoof ball by ICT here.
& the second goal is brilliant play.

you are remembering that is one of the worst hibs sides ever. our play was honking.

[Malthibby]

cannot believe I want shot of yet another manager but I have absolutely no faith in him and his, and I would rather bite the bullet now. don't know whether we could afford it though.

[Greencore]

you are remembering that is one of the worst hibs sides ever.
And you need to Remember signed by Fenlon. they are not TB'S players. just watch the second goal look at the play. He needs one season or atleast 6 months to get his own players in.

[Hibernia&Alba]

And you need to Remember signed by Fenlon. they are not TB'S players. just watch the second goal look at the play. He needs one season or atleast 6 months to get his own players in.

I disagree. Butcher relegated us from a league with no Sevco and with a decimated and doomed Hearts. He couldn't motivate a team to win a single game during the last three months of the season. He should have resigned or been sacked immediately. There is simply no excuse for what's happened.

[One Day]

If taking over a club like hibs who were in mid table and taking us down is not a sackable offence what is?

This, yes he inherited a pile of sh*t but he then proceeded to make them worse. No excuse he got us relegated and should go

[bigwheel]

2 wins in. 22/23 games. Of course he shouldn't. He has done nothing to earn the right to stay in the job

[#2 Double Tap]

And you need to Remember signed by Fenlon. they are not TB'S players. just watch the second goal look at the play. He needs one season or atleast 6 months to get his own players in.

Not his players, man we have been relegated, its directly his fault, he is the manager - he is responsible for it.

[Swedish hibee]

I am outraged that he is still there. I want him gone. And his "assistants" too.

[WhileTheChief..]

He has to go. No point hanging around for him to screw up the pre-season. The mistake we keep making is changing the manager in Oct/Nov instead of now.

Petrie, if you do nothing else, at least change your mind on this and show that you're not completely out of touch with reality.

Farmer, you can pay for it.

[theonlywayisup]

I am all for giving managers enough time to build a team. However, relegation is a game changer for me. We are not going to get straight back up. So we should go for a young tactically adept manager, who should be given time to build a team. Not Butcher, his approach is old school. Don't know who that is, but there must be many good choices out there. The lad at Hamilton seems to have built a good side, so why can't we find someone like him. Bit of a risk, I admit.

[leithsansiro]

Although I disagree with his tactics, man management and the attitude of his pal Malpas, I've voted for "Yes".

Let's be realistic. We can't afford to sack another manager, or let one walk away. Football people already see Hibs as a poisoned chalice (guys like Stuart McCall have pretty much said so) and our reputation has taken another battering. Who do we really think we're going to get in? It's not going to happen.

We are Hibs, and we need to back OUR club.

[leithsansiro]

you are remembering that is one of the worst hibs sides ever. our play was honking.

But I don't think our play will always be honking. Butcher did with them the only thing he thought he could this season. I think he'll change for next year with his own players in and around him. Quite simply, I don't think he trusted (most) of the current squad and the feeling was mutual. There was no connection between any tactics or game plan. ICT were not a goofball team, and despite his tactics this year, I don't think Hibs will be once there's a change of playing personnel.

[marleyhib]

No, this last 3 months won't be forgotten. As soon as we have another bad run the knives will be out, he has lost the fans.

[Sammy7nil]

But I don't think our play will always be honking. Butcher did with them the only thing he thought he could this season. I think he'll change for next year with his own players in and around him. Quite simply, I don't think he trusted (most) of the current squad and the feeling was mutual. There was no connection between any tactics or game plan. ICT were not a goofball team, and despite his tactics this year, I don't think Hibs will be once there's a change of playing personnel.

LOL 29 games in charge not the slightest hint of any football no idea what they did in training (HOOF) but dont worry his whole ethos will change in a 10 week period when we get in some laddies on the cheap. :greengrin

okay you have convinced me let him stay :faf::faf::ostrich::ostrich:

[IberianHibernian]

Amazed that anyone can even consider keeping him after what`s happened in the last 5 months - terrible results , terrible play , relegation , players hounded out the club ,... if he didn`t have so many pals in the press he`d probably have been sacked before Easter . Main excuse for him continuing seems to be that we can`t afford to sack him but was there no clause in contracts in case of relegation ? If we`ve lined up some players how many of them will want to play in a lower división with a manager who must have a terrible reputation amomg players after way Vine , Clancy and others have been treated . Probably frightening to know how much was spent on TB`s salary and those of his assistants , compensation to Fenlon , ICT , Vine and Clancy and possibly money for pre contracts for players he may have fixed up .

[#2 Double Tap]

But I don't think our play will always be honking. Butcher did with them the only thing he thought he could this season. I think he'll change for next year with his own players in and around him. Quite simply, I don't think he trusted (most) of the current squad and the feeling was mutual. There was no connection between any tactics or game plan. ICT were not a goofball team, and despite his tactics this year, I don't think Hibs will be once there's a change of playing personnel.

How can you say he should stay. He got us relegated. He has caused chaos.

[Rodsterino]

Get Locke in now, shown what he can do with a pile o' p@sh and youths, and he'll have a point to prove against 4-6-0 and the hairbear that replaced him. You know it makes sense. :greengrin

[Hovehibby]

Though he's not been in the job long and stability is sorely needed, for me I'd bin him now. Major mistake in telling half the squad were being released in Jan has contributed to our relegation, and his recent record speaks for itself. Wasn't PF's biggest fan, but personally I don't think we'd be be in this position if he was still in charge.

[marleyhib]

He should be sacked for bringing on Tudor-Jones yesterday.

[Long Time Hibee]

I find it hard to back anyone I don't believe in.

I don't believe the board can deliver (they have shown that for years)

I haven't seen anything yet and don't believe this manager will change around what he's started - if he does he deserves a medal - massive job and don't think his style of play will get us any where.

Getting relegated from the position he took over in is sackable / he should be resigning.

Agreed. Some really terrible management decisions. Telling players when he arrived they'd be off, not selecting KT and now binning him, playing Nelson and McGivern every week, not subbing Alex in the first game when he was having a bad night then dropping him from yesterday and brining him on then subbing him will be just great for his confidence! I really despair and felt physically sick after seeing the result. I got home from my sons cup final absolutely over the moon as they won which was then completely ruined due to the result. My worst feeling as a Hibs fan for over 45 years (as bad as that final v THEM.)

[GreenCastle]

With players leaving daily looks like TB is here to stay then as he must be making the decesions ? :confused:

[SlickShoes]

Thought he was the right man for the job at the time, but him, petrie, farmer and all of the playing staff that contributed to our demise should be out the door. 3 more points they needed to get from 18 games and they couldn't manage. Pathetic.

[hibseleven]

I was happy with his appointment at the time, I thought he was the man for us but now I am of a different opinion.

The argument about whether it's his team or Fenlons team isn't the issue for me.

He has no tactics, his selections are baffling at times and can't make a sub to change the pattern of the game.

[Keith_M]

What about 'don't knows'?

[jakeshibs]

I am still numb, but I really don't think if we had Sir Alex Ferguson he would make a difference.

we have constantly sacked managers paid them off and that has just added to our decline, affected our budgets and buying power. we can all shout about who we want in as next manager but In reality after a couple defeats we will be shouting for his head also and we continue this merry go round and decline of our famous club

I am losing the will and fight myself and having to endure what we have over the past 40 years, I don't blame all these managers. if we had a little stability who knows as hindsight is a wonderful thing,

I just want my money back for my season ticket, I love this club with al my heart have followed them everywhere,more bad times than good,

Butcher ? Collins? Fenlon? hughes? Mixu ?Calderclown, who next is irrelevant!!

really sorry for the negativity finding it hard to come to term with this

[Diclonius]

Whilst Butcher is partly responsible for our relegation - primarily as a result of the ill-timed rant after the 2-3 v St Mirren where he told half the squad they were gone at the end of the season - I have genuine belief in his ability to turn it around, if and only IF he is given the financial backing to get rid of the wasters and bring in players that want to play for him.

Changing managers will do nothing, especially with our current board. In fact, I'd be wary of calling them managers. I think "scapegoat" is a more accurate job description for those Petrie employs.

[The_Exile]

No, he should've walked, the way we played since the Dundee Utd draw at Tannadice has been woeful. 4-5-1....long balls which bypass every single green jersey.....I'm assuming he's told Nelson/McGivern etc to do that and they're not just doing it off their own backs? It's unforgivable that we even ended up anywhere near a playoff never mind lose it.

[erskine-hibby]

I can absolutely understand why people want rid of him, the results have been horrendous culminating in our relegation from the top league. That said, I feel that, and I've said before, that you can only pee with the cock your given, in TBs case he was given fannies. It was always going to be a struggle, though I never thought it would be so bad, this season because of the squad we had. I feel he should be given the chance to rebuild the squad, so because of this I think he should stay.

[The_Exile]

IMO the squad of players were more than capable of top six, obviously we had terrible luck with injuries to key players etc, but even still, they weren't that bad a squad of players.

When a new manager comes in, he looks at the squad, and he develops a stop gap system for them to play based on their strengths, only when he gets his own players in does he change the system to suit his own players and his own style of play. It's as if Terry has come in, looked at the squad, and made them play the way he wanted without ever looking at if they were a) capable or b) comfortable with it. I would genuinely love to assume that's not what happened here and that it was something much less terrifying than a basic lack of management knowledge, but it sure as hell looked like it from up in the stand.

[davcar]

Yes but last chance, need board out and Butcher getting full backing from Dempster to get us up in one go if possible

[GreenCastle]

I really don't understand those who want to him to stay -

"Fenlons players" - he made an average team worse = relegation. The form after his initial honey moon period was horrendous and all he needed was 3 points and we wouldn't have been in the playoffs.

"Last chance" - just like Fenlon after cup final 1. We then got humped by Malmo and continued to be average in a poor league.

"He needs to be backed" - backed? He has been backed - he brought in 3 players and they all failed to contribute - 2 goals in total I think.

"We can't keep changing managers" - to some extent I agree but if you keep picking the wrong one - then you do!

If we actually looked like a team who could play football (Hamilton on Sunday with a bunch of nobodies) then maybe over time we would develop.

If he stays you will be able to tell in his first pre-season game exactly what kind of style of football he aims to play - will we play out from the back or punt it aimlessly up the wings.

The team we had showed they could pass the ball at times but it was obvious the tactics were long quickly and directly = limited coaching by Malpas and terrible management by TB.

[SouthamptonHibs]

100% no he is terrible manager, tactics are shocking team selection shocking.
We can't allow him to waste money and sign players over the summer.
He'll be sacked in Nov when we are mid table struggling in championship 20points behind Rangers

[Booked4Being-Ugly]

IMO the squad of players were more than capable of top six, obviously we had terrible luck with injuries to key players etc, but even still, they weren't that bad a squad of players.

When a new manager comes in, he looks at the squad, and he develops a stop gap system for them to play based on their strengths, only when he gets his own players in does he change the system to suit his own players and his own style of play. It's as if Terry has come in, looked at the squad, and made them play the way he wanted without ever looking at if they were a) capable or b) comfortable with it. I would genuinely love to assume that's not what happened here and that it was something much less terrifying than a basic lack of management knowledge, but it sure as hell looked like it from up in the stand.You're living in some fantasy world, they are/were p!sh, that's why we were relegated.

[Swedish hibee]

Is he not away yet?

I can't believe he has not gone by now... but then I can't believe people voted on him to stay. :confused:

[Hibernia&Alba]

Is he not away yet?

I can't believe he has not gone by now... but then I can't believe people voted on him to stay. :confused:

I'm just in and was about to ask the same question. Laurel & Hardy, a.k.a. Butcher & Malpas, shouldn't be employed by Hibs now.

[The Leith Dutch]

IMO the squad of players were more than capable of top six, obviously we had terrible luck with injuries to key players etc, but even still, they weren't that bad a squad of players.

This is the root of my worries about Butcher.
It's obviously not a great squad of players but it's also not a relegation squad - at least as good as the rest of the bottom 6.
Add to that the fact he had a 4 point lead and a +6 goal difference advantage going in to the last 5 matches.

I think you have to be properly incompetent to take that and get us relegated - particularly with a two leg play off against a lower division team when you take a two goal lead into the second leg.

[The_Exile]

You're living in some fantasy world, they are/were p!sh, that's why we were relegated.

Pish squads don't get to two cup finals in a row. You sound as if you are blaming the players for everything. I take it you were happy with the style of football we've been playing the past 6 months?

[KingFranck]

Get him out before he makes it even worse eg who are we getting to replace the garbage leaving even more garbage cos we can't afford better?

[steakbake]

Yes, I think he can do it but there's something clearly wrong with the club and the number of player casualties probably tells a story that most of us don't know the half of.

Petrie has to go, quite simply and I hope Leanne Dempster's role is to prepare the club for transfer to new ownership, whoever that might be or whatever form it takes. Her job just got much harder. I'm worried though, that if that is her brief, it'll be more about balance sheets, assets and yet more begging letters to the fans under the guise that things are changing, than investment on the pitch to give the fans something to invest in.

The one constant in the demise is Petrie - and behind him, the way the club is owned. Our improbable hit rate of apparently bad managers tells a story, too.

[Big Frank]

Yes or No ?

My view...No...today was the final straw.

I wanted him at the time but wow I never thought he would self destruct in the way he has.

Falling out with players - taking a average /poor mid table team and making them worse (loss all confidence/any quality). Making Fenlon now look like Ancelloti.

Winning 2 games in 22.

Pre-historic tactics - making players play a game that doesn't suit them. Making poor team selections and subs. Picking the wrong formation for many games - 4-4-1-1. Setting up to defend today - with a 4-5-1 then changing to a 4-4-2 then going back to a 4-4-1-1 and we lose a goal.

We were wanting to avoid penalties today but we showed no urgency to win the game and looked happy with penalties.

Did we practice penalties? KT first up? Cummings last pen? Did Williams have any inside info on the Hamilton takers?

There is more to blame than Butcher here but the style of football and lack of plan for a professional club is a disgrace.

Terrible times at the club - can't see us being back for close to 3 or 4 years - it could have been avoided - RP / STF I tried to warn people on here for years but too many pro board folk looking fairly stupid now.

I cannae read all the 5 pages on the thread. Its a no from me.

I actually despair a bit that we, as Hibbys, even ask the question. Butcher, his team, the board are failures at Hibernian.

Thats no' acceptable.

[Sir David Gray]

I would still vote for him to stay but there's not much logic behind it.

Our record over the last five months has been horrific and to go from a position where we were competing for top six only a couple of months ago to where we find ourselves now is just ridiculous and Butcher must shoulder a large proportion of the blame for that.

However this has been on the cards for at least the last two or three years and we've tried changing managers on several occasions in recent years and it's made no difference.

I can't really argue with anyone who says Butcher should go, given how much of a disaster his tenure has been so far but unless we get changes at the top of the club, I don't see that replacing the manager will achieve anything.

[Booked4Being-Ugly]

Pish squads don't get to two cup finals in a row. You sound as if you are blaming the players for everything. I take it you were happy with the style of football we've been playing the past 6 months?

What are you talking about? That was with players like Griffiths, Doyle, Claros, Hanlon, Wotherspoon.... O'Connor even! I don't blame the players for everything but to suggest that there's still decent players in that squad is a joke. FWIW, i would keep the youngters but the rest can GTF for all I care.

[Big Frank]

Pish squads don't get to two cup finals in a row. You sound as if you are blaming the players for everything. I take it you were happy with the style of football we've been playing the past 6 months?


Lucky teams win cups. Fitba' teams win leagues.

[erskine-hibby]

Pish squads don't get to two cup finals in a row. You sound as if you are blaming the players for everything. I take it you were happy with the style of football we've been playing the past 6 months?

Yes they do, ours did.
Short memories fans have. If it wasn't for sparky we would have been relegated last year. Fenlon never replaced Leigh, or built up a squad that would have any impact on the league. I have never seen a more unbalanced squad in all my years watching hibs. This, imho, is the reason we have been relegated, not TB.

[The Leith Dutch]

I'd be interested in knowing the breakdown in the "yes he should stay category" between the following:

Yes - we can't afford to pay the compensation
Yes - the constant changing of manager makes it a less appealing job for future candidates
Yes - think there's a possibility he could do a good job as manager

[SlickShoes]

Pish squads don't get to two cup finals in a row. You sound as if you are blaming the players for everything. I take it you were happy with the style of football we've been playing the past 6 months?

Were you at either of the cup finals? the squads were vastly different.

The 5-1 squad was AWFUL, have a look at the team sheet for that day. Terrible team, bad squad, got to a cup final.

[eggbamyasi]

Yes they do, ours did.
Short memories fans have. If it wasn't for sparky we would have been relegated last year. Fenlon never replaced Leigh, or built up a squad that would have any impact on the league. I have never seen a more unbalanced squad in all my years watching hibs. This, imho, is the reason we have been relegated, not TB.

Agree , loads of fans forget how utter pish we were when he took over . Yes butcher failed to get this set of numpties playing .but imo I blame the players more . Was a poison chalice taking over when he did and he knew it , the reason he hasn't quit yet . Wants chance to clear out and start again . Weather the fans give him that or not is another question . Imo 6 months with another mans squad and a really poor disjointed one at that is not enough . If we dont get promoted next season for me then he has to go . I been thinking too imagine mcleish took over a few months before he did . I think the exact same situation would have taken place I went to every home and away game that season and no matter what he did the players wouldnt respond . I also understand why people want him gone , different opinions I guess . Im just sick of players showing no commitment , fight or desire for our club and the manager getting sacked .I know its part of a managers job but it also falls on players to man up a be counted .

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

[stubru59]

Enough people on this board have mirrored my thoughts on why he should go. Just go.

[heretoday]

Danny Lennon should be manager of Hibs. Cold, hard and uncompromising.

[SlickShoes]

Danny Lennon should be manager of Hibs. Cold, hard and uncompromising.

no thanks.

[SlickShoes]

It was pointed out to me on the thread about the email to the board that those who don't subscribe either don't care or support.
A bit different here as this is a poll but over 11,300 members with over 3000 active members and under 400 want Butcher out.
Or am I reading the figures wrong?

Do you have any idea how statistics work? you can't possibly ask every individual person for their opinion.

You will ask a certain percentage and that will give you an overview of what the overall picture is like, it's not exact but its mostly accurate.

Do you never wonder that when the news quote that 60% of Scots will vote No to independence no one asked you for your opinion so how could they possible know?

[ekhibee]

Just out of interest, if Scotland votes for independence, would Butcher need a visa to work in this country? Apologies if it's a bit off topic.