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DaveF
10-05-2014, 06:53 PM
I think most of us thought today's line up was a fairly attack minded setup - Yet it drew another blank and created few chances from open play.

So what's the plan for the play offs to bring us the goals?

Let's be having you :greengrin

skipster7
10-05-2014, 06:56 PM
Play OTJ up front and just do as we've done each week :greengrin

Famous Fiver
10-05-2014, 07:02 PM
McPake,Nelson or Foster at centre forward if we continue with hoofball. Otherwise change the tactics but with KT injured that is a long shot.

Sir David Gray
10-05-2014, 08:58 PM
I think we should go with a 0-0-10 formation in both legs, really take them by surprise.

We still might not score but at least it would be fun to watch!

MacGruber
10-05-2014, 09:08 PM
Heffernan & Cummings up top and Thomson back in midfield. Thomson will feed both Heff to feet and the wide men better than the service today. Robertson also takes up better positions when Thomson plays as he holds his position better than Craig in that role.

Mr White
10-05-2014, 09:08 PM
Whoever is played wide (watmore harris craig or Stevenson) to get in behind the defence, hit the byeline and cross for collins with heff there to mop up any rebounds.

snooky
10-05-2014, 09:31 PM
Get Duncan & Alex to hit the bye line and cut the ball back.
A novel idea.

Craig_in_Prague
10-05-2014, 09:35 PM
Gie the baw to Reilly
:(

wookie70
10-05-2014, 09:56 PM
I posted this in the Stats thread but it works here too.

Kris Boyd 22 League Goals
Every Hibs Forward Thinking Player - Collins(6), Craig(6), Heffernan(4), Stanton(2), Watmore(1), Robertson(1), Haynes(1), Cairney(1), Harris(0), Handling(0), Cummings(0), Zoubir(0) = 22 League Goals

There is no-one at the club that has done well in front of goal this year. Heffernan has done the best imo. He has scored 4 from 12 starts and 6 subs appearances. He looks most likely to me and I would pair him with Cummings as Jason does have a good eye for goal and is due a bit of luck. Either way the critical thing is to get the ball delivered from wide far closer to the bye line. Get the oppositions defense facing their own goal for a change. Play football not percentages

silverhibee
10-05-2014, 09:59 PM
I think most of us thought today's line up was a fairly attack minded setup - Yet it drew another blank and created few chances from open play.

So what's the plan for the play offs to bring us the goals?

Let's be having you :greengrin


Caldwell is back but don't know if we can play him. :greengrin

neil7908
10-05-2014, 10:04 PM
I'm honestly not sure. Like you say I thought todays line up was the most attacking I'd seen under Butcher and was probably about right. And look where that got us.

I feel like whoever plays is probably just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic but this is what I would go with (presuming everyone is fully fit):

Williams

Maybury Forster McPake Stevenson

Cairney Stanton Thomson Harris/Watmore

Stanton

Heffernan

gegs70
10-05-2014, 10:27 PM
I'm honestly not sure. Like you say I thought todays line up was the most attacking I'd seen under Butcher and was probably about right. And look where that got us.

I feel like whoever plays is probably just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic but this is what I would go with (presuming everyone is fully fit):

Williams

Maybury Forster McPake Stevenson

Cairney Stanton Thomson Harris/Watmore

Stanton

Heffernan

Could we play Cairney in front of heffernan.and Stanton on the right.....I think Cairney would have better close control..a sort of lately role?

Bishop Hibee
10-05-2014, 10:30 PM
Put Watmore and Harris on the wings, get Stevenson and Forster at full-back and tell them to push forward, play Heffernan and Cummings up front and play the ball on the deck.

No chance of Butcher doing this.

AL-Qaholik
10-05-2014, 10:31 PM
We don't.

Jdawg
10-05-2014, 10:33 PM
we hit balls into the box in pure hope which can be misconstrued as we have had no luck or the ball just wont fall. Id love to see a wee one-two, clean through, goal. No luck required just quality football

ehf
10-05-2014, 10:38 PM
Put Watmore and Harris on the wings, get Stevenson and Forster at full-back and tell them to push forward, play Heffernan and Cummings up front and play the ball on .

Or just stick to the tactic of McGivern curling long balls to the back post from 10 yards into the opposition half?

edinburghhibee
10-05-2014, 10:38 PM
I said it on another thread but between now and the play offs id arrange a few closed door games against weak opposition and get heff Collins and Cummings in and get their confidence back by hammering a few teams. No disrespect to the teams in the lower leagues but EoS sides and decent lowland league sides and go out to hammer them. Granted tho it risks injuries but I'd do this in an attempt to get the confidence back in front of goal

iwasthere1972
10-05-2014, 10:40 PM
Free kicks, crosses and corner kicks. I can't believe that we don't put them in the penalty box with a bit more pace. Who knows we may just get lucky. Even if it came off James Collins backside or an own goal. Too many wishy washy high balls collected easily be the opposition goalkeeper or, because there's no pace on the ball, headed weakly towards the target and easily dealt with.

Shoot on target as well. We lose the ball too easily trying to pass the ball into the penalty area.

Green Reaper
10-05-2014, 10:41 PM
Practice diving in the box
Shoot all the time, from anywhere, might get a bit lucky or deflection or goalie error.

That's probably 2 more 'ideas' than TB has, unrealistic as they are. :-)

Shore Thing
10-05-2014, 10:42 PM
Spend the next 10 days training on the Easter Road pitch, 9-5, every player practising taking shots from every position on the pitch until they can score every time even, with their eyes shut

Sir David Gray
10-05-2014, 10:44 PM
I said it on another thread but between now and the play offs id arrange a few closed door games against weak opposition and get heff Collins and Cummings in and get their confidence back by hammering a few teams. No disrespect to the teams in the lower leagues but EoS sides and decent lowland league sides and go out to hammer them. Granted tho it risks injuries but I'd do this in an attempt to get the confidence back in front of goal

It also risks denting an already fragile confidence amongst the team if we don't go out and hammer these teams.

Makaveli
10-05-2014, 10:57 PM
Probably just stop basing our attacks on crosses from 30 yards out.

edinburghhibee
10-05-2014, 11:04 PM
It also risks denting an already fragile confidence amongst the team if we don't go out and hammer these teams.

It does your right but we need to give these strikers some form of confidence before the play off cos what TB is doing just now isn't doing it.

snooky
11-05-2014, 10:50 AM
Strangely enough I noted during the pre-start warm up, our players were practising the one-two and shooting from just inside the box. Nobody seemed to be scoring. Shots were either saved half-heartedly by the keeper or went wide. In fact I think more balls hit the back of the net during the half-time kick-about with the kids.

AndySOL1875
11-05-2014, 11:20 AM
Around Xmas time when we were scoring we were getting the ball out to the flanks and getting as many crosses in as possible and it worked to an extent. I know a lot of our goals around then came from corners but if I remember rightly we created a hell of a lot more chances than we are now.

ballengeich
11-05-2014, 12:59 PM
Around Xmas time when we were scoring we were getting the ball out to the flanks and getting as many crosses in as possible and it worked to an extent. I know a lot of our goals around then came from corners but if I remember rightly we created a hell of a lot more chances than we are now.

I think you're right. Forster's goal against Hearts is the type we should be aiming to produce more often. Watmore was beating people in midfield yesterday, but didn't get to the byeline to make crosses for forwards and midfielders to attack. The forwards aren't scoring goals, but it's not entirely their fault when they aren't getting good service to work on.

The two best attacking performances under TB came when we scored three against Killie and Motherwell. I thought Cairney was crucial in both these games, but he seems totally out of favour now.

silverhibee
11-05-2014, 02:58 PM
When was the last time we had a striker who didn't hit double figures in a season.?

Sir David Gray
11-05-2014, 03:03 PM
When was the last time we had a striker who didn't hit double figures in a season.?

1997/98 - last time we went down.

eastterrace
11-05-2014, 03:11 PM
I think you're right. Forster's goal against Hearts is the type we should be aiming to produce more often. Watmore was beating people in midfield yesterday, but didn't get to the byeline to make crosses for forwards and midfielders to attack. The forwards aren't scoring goals, but it's not entirely their fault when they aren't getting good service to work on.

The two best attacking performances under TB came when we scored three against Killie and Motherwell. I thought Cairney was crucial in both these games, but he seems totally out of favour now.

cairney off to dundee united so dont think he will be to fussed if he plays or not.

erin go bragh
11-05-2014, 03:21 PM
Booth to take Mcgiverns place . Harris to take Watmores .
Anybody to take Collins place . ( yes he done plenty running and closing down yesterday but looks like he could play for ever without scoring )

Ggtth

truehibernian
11-05-2014, 03:28 PM
For me, and it's been my consistent opinion this last three months, you have to introduce some of the high performing U20's who have been consistently GOOD all season albeit at a level below.

We, Hibs, play a centre half at right back, a 'retired and now coaching' player at right back, a left midfielder at left back, a left back at centre half......we play a central midfielder left, we play a striker in midfield or out right.........it goes on and on and on.

My advice is - play a energetic, football playing, up and down the flank right back - ANDREW BLACK

Play a left back who has terrific set piece delivery, a bit of arrogance about him, gets up the pitch and plays on the deck - RYAN BAPTIE

Play a midfielder who has the heart of a lion depsite his stature, can get forward and ping a shot and normally hit the target and offers a goal threat from midfield - DEAN HORRIBINE

These lads have what it takes and are BETTER than McGivern, Maybury and Craig. I'd actually move Maybury into centre half with Forster as he is a top pro, can talk and encourage through a game and is composed.

Persist with Jason Cummings too - the lad offers energy and drive. The goals will come he just needs a wee break. I'd play him alongside Daniel Handling in a 4-4-2. If Booth was available, I'd play him at left midfield. My side, which has energy, drive and experience in the spine.....

Williams

Black Maybury Forster Baptie

Thommo

Horribine Robbo Booth/Watmore (if Boothy not available)

Cummings Handling

Subs - Heffernan, Harris, Stanton, Stevenson, Euan Smith, Boateng/OTJ

weonlywon6-2
11-05-2014, 03:31 PM
I have a chocolate lab called Ruby who has better ball control than james collins,maybe she could play upfront

If we stay up next season,break the bank and get leigh back,celtic looking at getting hooper back again which would knock leigh down the pecking order

BOB MARLEYS DUG
11-05-2014, 03:41 PM
Hate to say it but I don't think we will win the play-offs, I really don't. :boo hoo:

silverhibee
11-05-2014, 04:02 PM
1997/98 - last time we went down.

Oh FFS i wish i had never asked. :greengrin

DaveF
11-05-2014, 04:14 PM
Strangely enough I noted during the pre-start warm up, our players were practising the one-two and shooting from just inside the box. Nobody seemed to be scoring. Shots were either saved half-heartedly by the keeper or went wide. In fact I think more balls hit the back of the net during the half-time kick-about with the kids.

It was exactly the same at Dingwall when watching the shooting practice!

Danderhall Hibs
11-05-2014, 05:06 PM
Strangely enough I noted during the pre-start warm up, our players were practising the one-two and shooting from just inside the box. Nobody seemed to be scoring. Shots were either saved half-heartedly by the keeper or went wide. In fact I think more balls hit the back of the net during the half-time kick-about with the kids.

Yesterday? You sure? I watched it as well and came out with a completely different recollection!

emerald green
11-05-2014, 05:10 PM
I don't think we can persist any longer with James Collins. Never a footballer IMHO. Touch like an elephant. Poor in the air. Runs about like a headless chicken to no avail possibly to make it look like he's doing something? No confidence either. Did I hear correctly that Watmore was away after yesterday's game?

bandylegs_jLeighton
11-05-2014, 05:37 PM
It's already been said, but with the strikers we have at our disposal there is no point in crossing the ball into the box 30 yards out. Long high diagonal balls are meat and drink to most centre halves. If we insist on trying to cross the ball, it needs to be from near the byline. That would be a start...

Magnifique
11-05-2014, 05:47 PM
I think most of us thought today's line up was a fairly attack minded setup - Yet it drew another blank and created few chances from open play.

So what's the plan for the play offs to bring us the goals?

Let's be having you :greengrin

IF I'm reading things right, get on the phone sharpish to Kenny Miller.

Beg him to come play the 2 games and sign him for next year, then he can have the holiday he needs.

Simplezz

coco22
11-05-2014, 05:54 PM
Heffernan has a great first touch. As someone else mentioned - ball into his feet with Stanton, Harris, (Cairney), Robertson making penetrating forward runs from the midfield and KT holding. FWIW I would have Cummings up there too. Wishful thinking and obviously too attacking for us at the moment but we can only hope.

PeeJay
11-05-2014, 05:54 PM
For me, and it's been my consistent opinion this last three months, you have to introduce some of the high performing U20's who have been consistently GOOD all season albeit at a level below.

We, Hibs, play a centre half at right back, a 'retired and now coaching' player at right back, a left midfielder at left back, a left back at centre half......we play a central midfielder left, we play a striker in midfield or out right.........it goes on and on and on.

My advice is - play a energetic, football playing, up and down the flank right back - ANDREW BLACK

Play a left back who has terrific set piece delivery, a bit of arrogance about him, gets up the pitch and plays on the deck - RYAN BAPTIE

Play a midfielder who has the heart of a lion depsite his stature, can get forward and ping a shot and normally hit the target and offers a goal threat from midfield - DEAN HORRIBINE

These lads have what it takes and are BETTER than McGivern, Maybury and Craig. I'd actually move Maybury into centre half with Forster as he is a top pro, can talk and encourage through a game and is composed.

Persist with Jason Cummings too - the lad offers energy and drive. The goals will come he just needs a wee break. I'd play him alongside Daniel Handling in a 4-4-2. If Booth was available, I'd play him at left midfield. My side, which has energy, drive and experience in the spine.....

Williams

Black Maybury Forster Baptie

Thommo

Horribine Robbo Booth/Watmore (if Boothy not available)

Cummings Handling

Subs - Heffernan, Harris, Stanton, Stevenson, Euan Smith, Boateng/OTJ


Disagree with you - don't see it as a good idea to bring in the young guys as you suggest - not in this climate, and the step up would surely be too much for them - the baying fans at ER wouldn't exactly be the best introduction to 1st team duty either. Don't see any positives to be gained from your proposal - the team you line up isn't actually a "team", it's just a bunch of names grouped together - never played together have they? - Who in their right mind would lump them all together just before two of our most important games this season: why?

eastterrace
11-05-2014, 06:11 PM
For me, and it's been my consistent opinion this last three months, you have to introduce some of the high performing U20's who have been consistently GOOD all season albeit at a level below.

We, Hibs, play a centre half at right back, a 'retired and now coaching' player at right back, a left midfielder at left back, a left back at centre half......we play a central midfielder left, we play a striker in midfield or out right.........it goes on and on and on.

My advice is - play a energetic, football playing, up and down the flank right back - ANDREW BLACK

Play a left back who has terrific set piece delivery, a bit of arrogance about him, gets up the pitch and plays on the deck - RYAN BAPTIE

Play a midfielder who has the heart of a lion depsite his stature, can get forward and ping a shot and normally hit the target and offers a goal threat from midfield - DEAN HORRIBINE

These lads have what it takes and are BETTER than McGivern, Maybury and Craig. I'd actually move Maybury into centre half with Forster as he is a top pro, can talk and encourage through a game and is composed.

Persist with Jason Cummings too - the lad offers energy and drive. The goals will come he just needs a wee break. I'd play him alongside Daniel Handling in a 4-4-2. If Booth was available, I'd play him at left midfield. My side, which has energy, drive and experience in the spine.....

Williams

Black Maybury Forster Baptie

Thommo

Horribine Robbo Booth/Watmore (if Boothy not available)

Cummings Handling

Subs - Heffernan, Harris, Stanton, Stevenson, Euan Smith, Boateng/OTJ

horribine is getting freed, danny handling scored about two goals , cummings aint scored any. you want to put the future of hibs in their hands for the two play off games , you must be having a laugh.

Seveno
11-05-2014, 06:13 PM
Get Duncan & Alex to hit the bye line and cut the ball back.
A novel idea.

Are you trying to say that McGivern hoofing it to the back post from just beyond the halfway line isn't working?

GreenLake
11-05-2014, 06:43 PM
I just watched a load of Hamilton and Falkirk videos from youtube. Looks like both these teams can score and some of their forwards like to beat a man or two. I can only hope the teams they were up against in the Championship are pish else we are going to be in for a tough test.

Allan45
11-05-2014, 06:52 PM
It's going to be very tough indeed to find goals.

TB will have to change his way of thinking.
we need luck by first getting hrs defence set out without any injuries and have the possible back 4 for the play offs.

next, is to get Heff fit and sharp, and play a partnership with Cummings. Play a 4-4-2 throughout training and work towards passing ball to the 2 strikers from wings and from the centre of the pitch.

if Heff is fit and Cummings can have more confidence, then we will score for sure.

butcher has certainly lost the dressing room, but I feel we can do it and scrape through by 1 goal, then give TB a chance to make Hibs a much better team when we start next season.:cb

flash
11-05-2014, 08:32 PM
It's going to be very tough indeed to find goals.

TB will have to change his way of thinking.
we need luck by first getting hrs defence set out without any injuries and have the possible back 4 for the play offs.

next, is to get Heff fit and sharp, and play a partnership with Cummings. Play a 4-4-2 throughout training and work towards passing ball to the 2 strikers from wings and from the centre of the pitch.

if Heff is fit and Cummings can have more confidence, then we will score for sure.

butcher has certainly lost the dressing room, but I feel we can do it and scrape through by 1 goal, then give TB a chance to make Hibs a much better team when we start next season.:cb

How has he "lost the dressing room" whatever that actually means?

Ronniekirk
11-05-2014, 08:39 PM
1997/98 - last time we went down.
Oh well there s an omen if ever there was one . Although if Collins gets a brace in each tie that will kill two birds with one stone Sorted :wink:

Borderhibbie76
11-05-2014, 09:11 PM
horribine is getting freed, danny handling scored about two goals , cummings aint scored any. you want to put the future of hibs in their hands for the two play off games , you must be having a laugh.

My heart missed a beat at maybury at centre half alongside Forster...jeeezo... And FWIW I dont rate Danny Handling. ..contributes square root of nada almost every time he plays....poor poor players nowhere near spl level

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

silverhibee
11-05-2014, 11:00 PM
It was exactly the same at Dingwall when watching the shooting practice!

I feared for the old dude standing at the back of the stand when the players were having shots in to the stand, they were aiming for the stands and not the white posts with the nets on them. I would add a smiley but it wasn't funny at all watching them on Tuesday night at shooting practice.

truehibernian
12-05-2014, 12:04 AM
Disagree with you - don't see it as a good idea to bring in the young guys as you suggest - not in this climate, and the step up would surely be too much for them - the baying fans at ER wouldn't exactly be the best introduction to 1st team duty either. Don't see any positives to be gained from your proposal - the team you line up isn't actually a "team", it's just a bunch of names grouped together - never played together have they? - Who in their right mind would lump them all together just before two of our most important games this season: why?


Easy....the ones who have been 'lumped together' in the previous 19 games have won 1 is it ?

We've played Forster (CB), Maybury and Boateng at right back in that time. We have played McGivern and Stevenson at left back. We have played a combination of McGivern, Forster and Nelson at centre half. We have played all our midfielders in combinations.

I've added three debutants in my side, all of whom come from a successful season and all of whom are good football players. I've added experience in Williams, Maybury, Robbo, and Thomson.

I've added players who have played a number of games already this year (and last).

There is also experience on the bench. First game will be away where our fans give far more positive support in my opinion and we will no doubt outnumber the oppo fans. Hence the younger players making debuts would get far more 'support'.

I've watched them all and they are better than the players playing in the positions currently. Cummings did nothing to deserve being dropped on Saturday - he was one of the few shining lights bar scoring.

I'm not 'having a laugh' as another poster put it - just putting a footballing perspective on it. I have absolutely no faith in Craig, Nelson, Heffernan or Collins......no faith at all. They have all given up the ghost. My faith is always in youth - they play with no fear and are better than those I've mentioned.

PeeJay
12-05-2014, 06:46 AM
Easy....the ones who have been 'lumped together' in the previous 19 games have won 1 is it ?

We've played Forster (CB), Maybury and Boateng at right back in that time. We have played McGivern and Stevenson at left back. We have played a combination of McGivern, Forster and Nelson at centre half. We have played all our midfielders in combinations.

I've added three debutants in my side, all of whom come from a successful season and all of whom are good football players. I've added experience in Williams, Maybury, Robbo, and Thomson.

I've added players who have played a number of games already this year (and last).

There is also experience on the bench. First game will be away where our fans give far more positive support in my opinion and we will no doubt outnumber the oppo fans. Hence the younger players making debuts would get far more 'support'.

I've watched them all and they are better than the players playing in the positions currently. Cummings did nothing to deserve being dropped on Saturday - he was one of the few shining lights bar scoring.

I'm not 'having a laugh' as another poster put it - just putting a footballing perspective on it. I have absolutely no faith in Craig, Nelson, Heffernan or Collins......no faith at all. They have all given up the ghost. My faith is always in youth - they play with no fear and are better than those I've mentioned.

You make some fair points, difficult to disagree with most of them, I just find myself wondering why the young guys have not made the step up, after all - as you rightly point out - Butcher has been trying out every possible permutation: all to no avail. He could have opted to introduce them at any time, why didn't he? We had a youth team/reserve team a few seasons back that won the double, but most of them failed to make the grade - or they were not given the chance (?) - no problems with letting youth have its day - especially if the guys are as good as you suggest - just not convinced that now is a good time to do it. Could we as a club afford to take that risk?

Gettin' Auld
12-05-2014, 08:00 AM
For me, and it's been my consistent opinion this last three months, you have to introduce some of the high performing U20's who have been consistently GOOD all season albeit at a level below.

We, Hibs, play a centre half at right back, a 'retired and now coaching' player at right back, a left midfielder at left back, a left back at centre half......we play a central midfielder left, we play a striker in midfield or out right.........it goes on and on and on.

My advice is - play a energetic, football playing, up and down the flank right back - ANDREW BLACK

Play a left back who has terrific set piece delivery, a bit of arrogance about him, gets up the pitch and plays on the deck - RYAN BAPTIE

Play a midfielder who has the heart of a lion depsite his stature, can get forward and ping a shot and normally hit the target and offers a goal threat from midfield - DEAN HORRIBINE

These lads have what it takes and are BETTER than McGivern, Maybury and Craig. I'd actually move Maybury into centre half with Forster as he is a top pro, can talk and encourage through a game and is composed.

Persist with Jason Cummings too - the lad offers energy and drive. The goals will come he just needs a wee break. I'd play him alongside Daniel Handling in a 4-4-2. If Booth was available, I'd play him at left midfield. My side, which has energy, drive and experience in the spine.....

Williams

Black Maybury Forster Baptie

Thommo

Horribine Robbo Booth/Watmore (if Boothy not available)

Cummings Handling

Subs - Heffernan, Harris, Stanton, Stevenson, Euan Smith, Boateng/OTJ

You're complaining about players being played out of position, then want us to play Maybury at centre half?

Craig_in_Prague
12-05-2014, 10:52 AM
Would these help?

12574

truehibernian
12-05-2014, 11:02 AM
You're complaining about players being played out of position, then want us to play Maybury at centre half?

Yes - it's the only adjustment however Alan played a lot of games in that very position this year for the 20's.

What you also get is a good talker and a calm influence, which we will need in the play off's. Watch Nelson during a game - hardly talks, does little organising, a lot of pointing.

Alan at the weekend - at set pieces he is the one who drops back as last man. Twice on Saturday he put in potentially goal saving tackles, impeccably well timed, one in particular on Boyd that if he had got wrong he was off. I'm also putting him there because of his distribution and he looks for a pass. His positional sense is decent in comparison to Forster and Nelson together. Killie got little joy down Alan's side on Saturday.

We need energy in the full back areas, energy that sees our player get by an opponent and feel the need to either cut inside and pass square or launch it - what our full backs do at present. Black and Baptie play together, read the line together well and have similar energy levels. Ryan can fairly whip in a ball and is so accurate with set pieces it's nice to see at times.

Its only my opinion - nothing more.

silverhibee
12-05-2014, 11:44 AM
How has he "lost the dressing room" whatever that actually means?

It would seem the players were in it when he lost it as they haven't turned up for months now.

Hopefully he finds it sometime this week.

silverhibee
12-05-2014, 11:47 AM
Would these help?

12574

Probably not, think corner flag and out the stand, that's where most of the shots end up.

Hibiza
12-05-2014, 02:22 PM
Heff and Nelson. :flag:

HibbyDave
12-05-2014, 03:27 PM
May as well add my bit....... Phone Deek! Can we play any out of contract players? if so Kenny Miller for a wedge of cash and used as a trialist?