If Butcher takes us into the playoffs does he keep his job?

[Winston Ingram]

If we don't win on Sat he will not have won in 17 games, the longest run I can remember as a Hibs fan.

Do we honestly think this guy is going to get a result in the play off games?

[Sir David Gray]

I really don't know what the answer is any more.

I'm just totally stunned by what's happening to the club.

I know Leeann Dempster is arriving next month as CEO but if Butcher goes over the next few months, Petrie and the rest of the existing board needs to go.

[SneakersO'Toole]

Regardless of the outcome on Saturday, he has to go come the end of the season.

One club wonder who has been found out bigtime. I dont think I can remember a worse run of form in my lifetime. Wholly unacceptable

[Nutmegged]

Butcher took Caley Thistle down after taking over in his first season, plenty of Hibs fans acknowledged this last year, he took one (huge) step back to make 3/4 steps forward.

I'm not a fan of Terry, never have been but the same fans I spIke to last year who used this as a marker for how sticking with him and buying into his long term stratagy can't then use the possibility of Relegation as the stick to beat him with.

Maybe Leeann Demspter should bring Stuart McCall with her.

[Winston Ingram]

Butcher took Caley Thistle down after taking over in his first season, plenty of Hibs fans acknowledged this last year, he took one (huge) step back to make 3/4 steps forward.

I'm not a fan of Terry, never have been but the same fans I spIke to last year who used this as a marker for how sticking with him and buying into his long term stratagy can't then use the possibility of Relegation as the stick to beat him with.

Maybe Leeann Demspter should bring Stuart McCall with her.

He also finished bottom in his first season at Motherwell. Looks like Hearts points deduction has saved him from an impressive hatrick

[Ronniekirk]

I really don't know what the answer is any more.

I'm just totally stunned by what's happening to the club.

I know Leeann Dempster is arriving next month as CEO but if Butcher goes over the next few months, Petrie and the rest of the existing board needs to go.

I am gutted but not stunned ,as writing has been on the wall for a long time now and free fall seems to be a hibs speciality which I am pissed off with . Petrie must have seen this coming hence appointing Leanne Wonder if she is having second thoughts ? Petries changes must be predicated on us staying up so going into playoffs could put other changes on hold .
Really is a difficult time for club just now and think crowd v Killie will reflect apathy that is around just now .

[Pretty Boy]

If we go down he has to go imo.

If we win the play off he should get the start of next season.

[Greenblood70]

Get him tae **** now.


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[SouthamptonHibs]

No if he takes us to the play offs he should walk. We must have a relegation / play off clause in contract

[James70]

When Butcher came Hibs were contenders for a top six slot. Thanks to him there is now a very strong chance of relegation. No manager should keep his job in those circumstances and I doubt very much if he would be the man to get Hibs promoted again quickly given his achievements so far.

We did not expect miracles when he came and most supporters would have been more than happy to finish 6th. It is now patently obvious that his tactics have not suited the players at his disposal but rather than admit to that he has persisted with the same tactics all the same.

Hibs I would doubt are in any position to sack him and have to pay him off. All we have to look forward to is an extended stay in the lower leagues.

We have certainly felt the loss of Hanlon much more than some would care to admit but any team which cannot score goals for toffee are already halfway to being doomed.

As the old joke goes, we should just change our name to Hibsnil.

[ehf]

Get him tae **** now.


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:agree: the only chance we have of beating Killie is to punt Butcher, Mental Malpas and whatever the supposed "super scout" is called first thing tomorrow and put KT in charge.

[Northernhibee]

:agree: the only chance we have of beating Killie is to punt Butcher, Mental Malpas and whatever the supposed "super scout" is called first thing tomorrow and put KT in charge.

The most ludicrous post on .net ever?

[Greenblood70]

The most ludicrous post on .net ever?

I think your fan hating Fenlon rants trump it personally


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[Northernhibee]

I think your fan hating Fenlon rants trump it personally


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I'll await your apology when I'm proven right (again).

[IberianHibernian]

If we`re relegated I presume he`ll resign and if he doesn`t surely even the press will start to question him ? In any other club , big decisonmaker(s) would then decide to support him or make a change ( usually latter ) at perfect time before season starts but Petrie seems to have decided to have avoided difficult decisión by appointing successor and I fear we`ll stagger on like now whatever happens . We`re in a bad situation but have advantage that summer is great time to make changes whatever happens in next few weeks .

[yeezus.]

I'll be honest I haven't been convinced by Butcher since day 1. I haven't been shouting my mouth off calling for him to leave but if we get relegated I think he has to go.

[majorhibs]

If we don't win on Sat he will not have won in 17 games, the longest run I can remember as a Hibs fan.

Do we honestly think this guy is going to get a result in the play off games?

Sorry but have to reply with eff off with such a stoopid question. In the pre social media days, afore all the internet geniuses wi solutions that solve nothing, in the good old days, a manager as clueless & cack as this would have been shouted out in the only way how then, on a saturday, cos his record is shocking & the fact he CANNOT change it in so many games is worse, but, after 2nd/3rd plus cack appointments of cack managers in a guffy easy league missing main competitors, the chairman would DEFO be getting it. No questions. Why dont they? This is a shocking, terrible run by a team with much more than most around. Who is responsible? & why are they allowed to still be there? This current underachievement should not be overlooked. It makes them untenable imo. Who could have done a WORSE job in Scotland with Hibs & Hibs resources against what they've faced this season?

[truehibernian]

If we go down he has to go imo.

If we win the play off he should get the start of next season.

He'll be sacked if we go down - I'm sure of it.

[Heisenberg]

Every big club he's been at has been a disaster and his reign over in a matter of months. Guys clueless.

[Thecat23]

The lot should walk. Been a disaster from the start. Also the board should now leave with Petrie leading. No more side stepping just get the **** away from our club.

[Coco Bryce]

I honestly think he's going out of his way to get sacked. He's not up to the job and want out IMO

[truehibernian]

The lot should walk. Been a disaster from the start. Also the board should now leave with Petrie leading. No more side stepping just get the **** away from our club.

Petrie showed his colours last week - sees the writings on the wall, employs Dempster, wriggles away yet still is the puppet master.

For me Nid's interview on Beeb was enlightening - reluctant to commit to Sons - says to me that something is on the back burner TC.

[Greenblood70]

I'll await your apology when I'm proven right (again).

Ha ha, you've got some blinkers for old paddy boy I'll give you that! You've already been proved wrong (again) tho as he walked cos he knew he didn't have the ability to put the club where it should be. You can argue the reasons for that but he certainly brought in a shed load of players and really only Griffiths made any lasting contribution papering over the cracks of a very poor side (IMO).

It's my opinion Butchers current record at ER is a hanging offence, let alone a sacking one! I didn't think it was possible for the current crop to play any worse but somehow the chuckle bros have plumbed hitherto unforeseen levels of sheeeityness. It really is no mean feat.


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[Jim44]

I really don't know what the answer is any more.

I'm just totally stunned by what's happening to the club.

I know Leeann Dempster is arriving next month as CEO but if Butcher goes over the next few months, Petrie and the rest of the existing board needs to go.

I wonder if she has a cooling-off clause in her contract. As negotiations were on-going for quite some time, she surely had no idea that she was about to take the reins at the laughing stock of Scottish Football.

[majorhibs]

He'll be sacked if we go down - I'm sure of it.

That makes me feel so much better. How could it be thought of, in this season of all seasons, that Hibs COULD go down? Nae huns & inbreds -15? What does petrie plan for us when these halfwits fi the wrong side o Edinburgh & the swamps of govan are actually back in the top league?

[BOB MARLEYS DUG]

Butcher took Caley Thistle down after taking over in his first season, plenty of Hibs fans acknowledged this last year, he took one (huge) step back to make 3/4 steps forward.

I'm not a fan of Terry, never have been but the same fans I spIke to last year who used this as a marker for how sticking with him and buying into his long term stratagy can't then use the possibility of Relegation as the stick to beat him with.

Maybe Leeann Demspter should bring Stuart McCall with her.

"McCall has no intention of taking the Hibs job because our fans moan like hell at our own players". Or something along they lines Is what someone posted a week or so ago.

[IberianHibernian]

Was always against TB appointment and hate to have been proved right but right now we have to stick together and try to stay up whether on Saturday or in play off . Decisión to change manager in November was a huge , expensive mistake especially as other candidates don`t seem to have been interviewed . Petrie seems to have got out before he has to make another decisión and I`m not sure new appointment has enough money , knowledge of Hibernian or guts to make a drastic change in summer .

[truehibernian]

"McCall has no intention of taking the Hibs job because our fans moan like hell at our own players". Or something along they lines Is what someone posted a week or so ago.

Wouldn't stress, it wouldn't be McCall.

[lucky]

Majority of us wanted Butcher and were delighted we got him. Sadly it's not worked out. I would imagine he will be away in summer especially if we go down.

[jacomo]

Regardless of the outcome on Saturday, he has to go come the end of the season.

One club wonder who has been found out bigtime. I dont think I can remember a worse run of form in my lifetime. Wholly unacceptable

If we go down, I hope he walks.

If we stay up, he gets a chance to put it right. I was never wholly convinced by Pat but gave him the same support and I think Butcher deserves that. There has been an underlying malaise at Hibs for a while and I don't underestimate how hard the manager's job is.

[BOB MARLEYS DUG]

Wouldn't stress, it wouldn't be McCall.

The guy who posted it on here said McCall told him this at an SFA coaching course.

[leggeto]

I can't judge him until he brings in his own players,he will see out his contract regardless of what league we are in,the players just can't play his type of football

[majorhibs]

"McCall has no intention of taking the Hibs job because our fans moan like hell at our own players". Or something along they lines Is what someone posted a week or so ago.


Was always against TB appointment and hate to have been proved right but right now we have to stick together and try to stay up whether on Saturday or in play off . Decisión to change manager in November was a huge , expensive mistake especially as other candidates don`t seem to have been interviewed . Petrie seems to have got out before he has to make another decisión and I`m not sure new appointment has enough money , knowledge of Hibernian or guts to make a drastic change in summer .

Ye believe everything ye hear in fitba BMD? Mucho naive! I never fancied Butcher only cos I saw plenty ex players who just couldnae put what they had over tae others & TB from all his previous looked like that, but I still would love to be proved wrong! But hey- where are Hibs- we were mince but safe afore, now we are so many brands o mince- well sorry but I have lost faith. Petrie should never be allowed tae even choose the pair o shoes he puts on each morning, someone else should do it for him! He is that bad!

[truehibernian]

The guy who posted it on here said McCall told him this at an SFA coaching course.

I'm merely saying McCall won't be a Hibs manager. I think if it goes pear shaped it will be Nid.

[Hibernia&Alba]

If we go down he has to go imo.

If we win the play off he should get the start of next season.

This is where I am. He couldn't possibly expect to retain his position, should a run of 17 without a win relegate us. We're talking almost half the season here! If we stay up, I would give him more time, but next season must see a massive improvement.

[TornadoHibby]

I can't judge him until he brings in his own players,he will see out his contract regardless of what league we are in,the players just can't play his type of football

What is his type of football then that is so difficult to play!?

[kaimendhibs]

I was delighted when butcher got the job, now I want rid. Fickle, mibbe, Hibee, always


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[hibIBZ]

If we are relegated he must go, no other option. Wasn't a huge fan of the appointment ( I wanted Ian Murray despite his age) but he can't get anything out of these players, players that are spl standard

[Scottie]

I want Butcher gone as I don't think he has a ****in clue what the ****s going on.

Tonight again he looked like a rabbit trapped in the headlights. :embarrass

The problem is who the **** is going to want the job if we stay up never mind if we do go down and where is the money to pay off this clown and his cronies and bring in a replacement.

[Thecat23]

Petrie showed his colours last week - sees the writings on the wall, employs Dempster, wriggles away yet still is the puppet master.

For me Nid's interview on Beeb was enlightening - reluctant to commit to Sons - says to me that something is on the back burner TC.

Not the only one to mention Murray to me. I'm not sure he's ready for Hibs just yet though. I like him but with things as they are I don't think a guy his age should take charge. Could ruin him if it goes all wrong.

[edinburghhibee]

If we go down then nid might be a great choice he's had a season and a half in that division and has done very well. However if we stay up I think it will be a jump to far at this stage and staying with TB would be my choice.

[#2 Double Tap]

I want Butcher gone as I don't think he has a ****in clue what the ****s going on.

Tonight again he looked like a rabbit trapped in the headlights. :embarrass

The problem is who the **** is going to want the job if we stay up never mind if we do go down and where is the money to pay off this clown and his cronies and bring in a replacement.
loads of people would want to be our manager - look at our set up - its one of the best in the country.

[Nailrod]

I can't judge him until he brings in his own players,he will see out his contract regardless of what league we are in,the players just can't play his type of football
We've been repeating this mantra since Mixu. Isn't it starting to wear a bit thin? What on earth is 'his type of football' and why is it so difficult to play? Why are Hibs unique in Scottish football in that we keep signing special managers with special types of football that the players they have at their disposal can never play, only hey, it always turns out that the players they bring in can't actually play this special type of football either?

Butcher has succeeded in putting together one of the worst runs of results in the club's history. What on earth makes you think he's going to improve the team with a lot less money to spend?

[Hermit Crab]

He stays no matter what. No brainier. Took him a few years at caley, will prob take a similar amount of time at hibs. Thread closed. :aok:

[rossi]

Funny how every time a manager gets hounded out the club/team get's even worse. Remember loads of people screaming for Mixu then Hughes to go when we were 4th or 5th in the league. Just wasn't 'good enough'.

[FitbaFolkKen]

I sometimes feel that because we have given ourselves a reputation for hounding managers out. We almost feel that the manager deserves a shot regardless, he's not had enough time, not got his own players etc.... I am usually one of the most tolerant. I always hoped it would turn for Fenlon but at the end of the day he had a couple of shocking results and was never going to recover.

Looking at the statistics the average EPL manager is only in their job around 18 months, about the same turnover as us. We are not demanding enough, transition isn't really a thing in football now yet we always give time based on they aren't the managers players. You play with the hand you are dealt, and that means improving performances of the current playing staff. Regardless of the players being his or not their should be signs of constant improvement due the the training on offer.

I think a bit of perspective is needed here, Butcher has a win rate of just 18%. Calderwood who was absolutely awful had a win rate of 24%. We as fans knew Calderwood wasn't up to the job in the summer when the bag of sweeties nonsense was going on, I have the same feeling now. I hear Butcher say most of the right things but I don't believe it. It feels like he has lost the dressing room. Even if half the squad leave, the other half will have witnessed him lose control. Very difficult to recover from imo.

If Hibs keep Butcher and Malpas I'll support them, however if Hibs emptied them they could have no complaints as the job they have done up to now is nothing short of terrible.

[FitbaFolkKen]

Funny how every time a manager gets hounded out the club/team get's even worse. Remember loads of people screaming for Mixu then Hughes to go when we were 4th or 5th in the league. Just wasn't 'good enough'.

Just because other managers have been hounded out too soon in your opinion, or were doing a better job than the current management doesn't mean that the job they are currently doing is acceptable. It's not, it's horrific.

[Baader]

He'd get the playoffs I would imagine but, God forbid, if we go down, he'll go. I wouldn't be surprised if he walks even if we do stay up. The whole thing has been a disaster and is clearly not working out.

[Winston Ingram]

He stays no matter what. No brainier. Took him a few years at caley, will prob take a similar amount of time at hibs. Thread closed. :aok:

Took him a few years at Caley to do what? Finish 4th?

Wish you were my boss. 4 years plan which allows you to drag a club with significantly more resources out of the league to reach the heady heights of 4th in 4 yrs.

Brilliant. Can't wait for that:confused:

[PeeJay]

Took him a few years at Caley to do what? Finish 4th?

Wish you were my boss. 4 years plan which allows you to drag a club with significantly more resources out of the league to reach the heady heights of 4th in 4 yrs.

Brilliant. Can't wait for that:confused:

Well, it's not quite what he says is it? Butcher took IC to 4th, which in that particular context (that club and its resources) is a great achievement: with our club, its resources and potential more should be possible - mind you while we used to sack our manager for reaching 4th and Europe, now it would be quite an achievement for us ... :greengrin

[Beefster]

Took him a few years at Caley to do what? Finish 4th?

Wish you were my boss. 4 years plan which allows you to drag a club with significantly more resources out of the league to reach the heady heights of 4th in 4 yrs.

Brilliant. Can't wait for that:confused:

So you've made your mind up about Butcher? You should have said earlier.

[Steve20]

He can't motivate the team. If we finish 11th, he should be emptied before the playoffs.

[NatureBoy]

I honestly don't have a clue what the answer is, genuinely flabbergasted by what goes on at the club! The only thing I can think of is a total clear out of everyone owner, chairman, manager and playing staff. Take the hit and start from scratch because this current set up is on the brink of killing our club as we know it!

[mmmmhibby]

Butchers record at hibs is the worst in my lifetime, 35 years, so GTF now and shut the door on the way out!!!

[mmmmhibby]

He stays no matter what. No brainier. Took him a few years at caley, will prob take a similar amount of time at hibs. Thread closed. :aok:

Wake up and smell the cawfeeeee!!!! Look at his horrendous record at our club!!! The man is tactically inept!!! GTF Terry.

[Winston Ingram]

So you've made your mind up about Butcher? You should have said earlier.

I have but in this case i was just asking a question.

[Winston Ingram]

Butchers record at hibs is the worst in my lifetime, 35 years, so GTF now and shut the door on the way out!!!

As posted on another thread, worse than Sauzee's


Franck
15 games Won 1 Drawn 6 lost 8.

Butcher
(last 18 games)

Won 1 drawn 5 lost 12

[confused]

The big question for me is -----
Can we afford to sack him??
OR
Can we afford to chance keeping him??

[hibeesjoe]

I was over the moon when Butcher arrived. Genuinely thought it would be a changing point at the club and he would kick on and make us challenging in the top half of the season after a few shrewd summer signings. I'm just now starting to wonder if he really is the man too take us forward, he just doesn't seem to have any sort of answers for the state we are in. Out of his 3 loan signings one doesn't get a game, one gets a few minutes now and again and watmore only gets half an hours play. They also insist on punting long balls up too an 18 year old striker that still hasn't scored a first team goal yet. I'm not saying that Butcher won't succeed but we need a bit of luck this weekend and a lot of investment in the team over the summer.

If we do find ourselves in the championship next year I can't see us coming straight back up. How much damage would 2 or 3 seasons out of the premiership cost? Massive game this weekend, bigger than a Scottish cup final in my opinion.

[Beefster]

As posted on another thread, worse than Sauzee's


Franck
15 games Won 1 Drawn 6 lost 8.

Butcher
(last 18 games)

Won 1 drawn 5 lost 12

As I pointed out on the PM board, no it isn't. I picked fifteen random games under Butcher and he had won 5 of them.

[leggeto]

We've been repeating this mantra since Mixu. Isn't it starting to wear a bit thin? What on earth is 'his type of football' and why is it so difficult to play? Why are Hibs unique in Scottish football in that we keep signing special managers with special types of football that the players they have at their disposal can never play, only hey, it always turns out that the players they bring in can't actually play this special type of football either?

Butcher has succeeded in putting together one of the worst runs of results in the club's history. What on earth makes you think he's going to improve the team with a lot less money to spend?

Fenlon liked to play the slow build up game,so many sitting midfielder in the team,butcher likes to get up the wings and punt crosses into the box,they just can't do it,they should be able to being pro footballer's, TB will get his own team in and hopefully there will be a difference, as long as the board is behind him and none of this waiting to deadline day to pick up the rubbish players nobody wants

[PeeJay]

I hope we stay up. If we do I would keep Butcher and ditch the entire playing squad ... no exceptions!

[Winston Ingram]

As I pointed out on the PM board, no it isn't. I picked fifteen random games under Butcher and he had won 5 of them.

After 15 games as Franck got 15. Chucked in PF & CC. Nobody keeps their job for a good start. It's the run of results that leads them to getting canned.

Franck
W1 D6 L8

Terry
W1 D4 L10

Duffy
W1 D3 L11

Fenlon
W5 D3 L7

Calderwood
W3 D5 L7

[Captain Trips]

No. Regardless of playoff or not. He has shown nothing to indicate we will be any better next season. 25 games there should be a few things to look at. His record is indicative of failure ahead.

Looking for footballing reasons and there are none.

[portycabbage]

As I pointed out on the PM board, no it isn't. I picked fifteen random games under Butcher and he had won 5 of them.

You could have picked all 25 of Butcher's games and he would have only won 5 of them!

[Keith_M]

Dear Admins, as one of you totally mucked up MY previous poll on the same subject by merging it with another post that asked completely the opposite question in the title, thereby causing people to vote the wrong way, would it be possible to NOT merge this guy's poll?




Many thanks

:thumbsup:

[Keith_M]

Do we honestly think this guy is going to get a result in the play off games?


No, we're going down.

We have problems with the resouces we have (already limited but also suffering from a number of injured players) and Butcher is unable to make the most of what's at his disposal.

[jacomo]

We've been repeating this mantra since Mixu. Isn't it starting to wear a bit thin? What on earth is 'his type of football' and why is it so difficult to play? Why are Hibs unique in Scottish football in that we keep signing special managers with special types of football that the players they have at their disposal can never play, only hey, it always turns out that the players they bring in can't actually play this special type of football either?

Butcher has succeeded in putting together one of the worst runs of results in the club's history. What on earth makes you think he's going to improve the team with a lot less money to spend?

This is doing my nut too. I get that the plodding, pedestrian play under Fenlon is probably the antithesis of Butcher's 'up and at em' style, but I can't understand how or why he has been so poor in getting performances from this squad.

Having said that, we're being haunted by a bit of bad luck and the lack of a goal scorer. Had we put away just two or three chances over the past few weeks the season would be done and dusted by now.

[PeeJay]

This is doing my nut too. I get that the plodding, pedestrian play under Fenlon is probably the antithesis of Butcher's 'up and at em' style, but I can't understand how or why he has been so poor in getting performances from this squad.

Having said that, we're being haunted by a bit of bad luck and the lack of a goal scorer. Had we put away just two or three chances over the past few weeks the season would be done and dusted by now.

Maybe this is as good as it gets with this squad of players? I'm not convinced that they can actually play any better than they are currently doing, it's the reason we are where we are.

[matty_f]

This is doing my nut too. I get that the plodding, pedestrian play under Fenlon is probably the antithesis of Butcher's 'up and at em' style, but I can't understand how or why he has been so poor in getting performances from this squad.

Having said that, we're being haunted by a bit of bad luck and the lack of a goal scorer. Had we put away just two or three chances over the past few weeks the season would be done and dusted by now.

Injuries haven't helped. I doubt there's another team in the league that's had to deal with the injuries to key players that we have. Any time we looked like settling someone has got injured (or suspended). Two changes to the defence last night and two to the midfield, that has happened all season.

[Winston Ingram]

Players and TB aren't in today btw. 3 days to say our season and they all get a day off.

[cleanyman]

With the players slumping to the ground last night, this team is already down.

[Winston Ingram]

Here's the latest i've got on TB & MM...


They gave up weeks ago. They said you're on your own now, stood back and told them to play games and pick their own teams'

[sadtom]

Apart from a decent start under Yogi we have been in free fall for the last 7 years.
I'm sick to death about hearing how it 'takes time' when managers come in. Utter bloody nonsense.
A good manager/coach can make a difference immediately. Mowbray was proof of that. They can organise and motivate the players who are there, then they can improve as they are able to add their own players as they go on.
Make no mistake. Shape, style, organisation, team selection, tactics, substitutions and motivation can all be achieved with existing players and can be done in a matter of weeks not months - IF the manager/coach knows what they are doing.
All our appointments have failed miserably. Most worryingly most have failed while trying to play the game the 'wrong' way (IMHO). The only one who is excused this criticism is Yogi. I think he tried to play in an entertaining, progressive manner, though ultimately failed too.
The danger is that we start to believe the 'it takes time' drivel and give blatantly hopeless managers/coaches too much time because we become desperate and sick of the 'managerial roundabout'. This became evident under calderclown and even more obvious under Fenlon.
I'm all for sticking with a manager/coach but there has to be some signs that its worthwhile. I really fear we are too scared to see yet another one fail that they are given time they don't deserve.
TB wasn't my 1st choice but he was 1 of 4/5 that I was happy enough to see appointed.
After watching a couple of games and hearing the man speak (and also hearing stories about the instructions given to players at training) I felt that we may do ok but I wasn't particularly going to enjoy the 'style'.
It is interesting to see the contradictions. At the beginning of TB's appointment many fully supported the idea that he was 'no nonsense' and gonna kick some @r$e$. This similar approach by Yogi was blasted as 'bullying' by many.
Anyway 8pts out a possible 51 (throw in a cup defeat to a toiling lower division side) and even more worryingly 1 out a possibly 24 have convinced me that neither TB/MM have what it takes.
However much it may be a pain in the backside or embarrassing to admit, we CANNOT afford to let pride get in the way or let desperation cloud our judgement of what we can see on the park or what is realised on the league table.
If the appointment is not working out then we must cut our losses asap. The current management team have shown NOTHING that warrants being given the chance to spend our hard earned next season.
As frustrating as it is, we cannot be afraid to admit it aint working and swing the axe just because we are fed up of a lack of continuity.
I don't doubt that TB/MM have tried their best, I just don't think they are good enough.
I think we have to accept its, yet another, appointment that hasn't worked and we need to look again.

[heretoday]

Normally I'd say give Butcher the chance to build his own team next season.

However, his failure to rouse the current players to anything approaching acceptable standard leads me to believe his motivational powers are waning.

I say sack him at season end whatever league we are in.

[matty_f]

Players and TB aren't in today btw. 3 days to say our season and they all get a day off.

They're players, not horses. They played in Dingwall last night and would have got home at some ridiculous time. IMHO it would probably have done them more harm than good getting everyone in today.

[Winston Ingram]

They're players, not horses. They played in Dingwall last night and would have got home at some ridiculous time. IMHO it would probably have done them more harm than good getting everyone in today.

Fair point

[FitbaFolkKen]

Normally I'd say give Butcher the chance to build his own team next season.

However, his failure to rouse the current players to anything approaching acceptable standard leads me to believe his motivational powers are waning.

I say sack him at season end whatever league we are in.

This is where I am to be honest, the decline from an average, boring SPFL team to worst team in the league has been startling.

[FitbaFolkKen]

Maybe this is as good as it gets with this squad of players? I'm not convinced that they can actually play any better than they are currently doing, it's the reason we are where we are.

They clearly can play better as at the turn of the year we were sitting comfortably mid table, after more than half the season. Since then he has made a couple of additions and we have plummeted like a stone.

[Coco Bryce]

Here's the latest i've got on TB & MM...



They gave up weeks ago. They said you're on your own now, stood back and told them to play games and pick their own teams'

Is this at training or for league games :greengrin

[PeeJay]

They clearly can play better as at the turn of the year we were sitting comfortably mid table, after more than half the season. Since then he has made a couple of additions and we have plummeted like a stone.

Fair point - I was referring in general to the squad though (not just last night) I don't think these players have played so much better, we maybe had a few luckier breaks, not so many injuries, fewer players suffering from loss of form, fewer motivational issues ... the problems we now are unable to stem, have always been there.

[Cropley10]

Regardless of the outcome on Saturday, he has to go come the end of the season.

One club wonder who has been found out bigtime. I dont think I can remember a worse run of form in my lifetime. Wholly unacceptable

This is what happens when you buy wingers who can't beat a man, midfielders who can't create and strikers who don't score.

Injuries to Robertson, Hanlon and Heffernan have had a huge impact.

This is Pat Fenlon's team - we've fallen away, but we've also been found out. This is what also happens when you have a 'striker' who carries ZERO goal threat.

If we get rid of Butcher/Malpas then there will be EVEN LESS money available to buy new players and we need better players than we have.

Perhaps you could explain who should come in and how they will assess the squad, approach the relevant targets and sign them before pre-season?