Gerry Adams Freed!

[Hibbyradge]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-27278039

The PCNI have just made another massive rod for their own back. What a cock-up.

[Hibbyradge]

The story has just changed.

Adams is to be freed, but a file will be sent to the public prosecution service.

:hmmm:

[Betty Boop]

Ugly scenes outside Antrim Police Station, where a Loyalist mob gathered in protest. Sinn Fein threatening to withdraw their support for the PSNI, could have devastating consequences for the Peace Process. Worrying times in Northern Ireland.

[marinello59]

Ugly scenes outside Antrim Police Station, where a Loyalist mob gathered in protest. Sinn Fein threatening to withdraw their support for the PSNI, could have devastating consequences for the Peace Process. Worrying times in Northern Ireland.

Kid gloves required here rather than big boots. As painful as it is sometimes things just have to be left alone. When you look at the much bigger picture I fail to see what chasing Adams up on this one will achieve.

[Hibrandenburg]

Kid gloves required here rather than big boots. As painful as it is sometimes things just have to be left alone. When you look at the much bigger picture I fail to see what chasing Adams up on this one will achieve.

Justice? :dunno:

[marinello59]

Justice? :dunno:

I get what you are saying but the 'war' is over for most of those who engaged in it. If we put Adams on trial then the pressure to put the Paras who took part in the Bloody Sunday ops will increase. Truth and reconciliation rather than retribution for me.

[hibsbollah]

I get what you are saying but the 'war' is over for most of those who engaged in it. If we put Adams on trial then the pressure to put the Paras who took part in the Bloody Sunday ops will increase. Truth and reconciliation rather than retribution for me.

:agree: The South African experience should teach us a thing or two.

[Pretty Boy]

I get what you are saying but the 'war' is over for most of those who engaged in it. If we put Adams on trial then the pressure to put the Paras who took part in the Bloody Sunday ops will increase. Truth and reconciliation rather than retribution for me.

This for me.

I can understand some peoples frustrations if they feel justice hasn't been done but Gerry Adams going on trial opens a can of worms that could be difficult to control.

[Steve-O]

Usually on this site people can't wait to hang murderers too! Even alleged ones :wink:

[Alex Trager]

Who is Gerry Adams and what is Sinn Fein?

Excuse the ignorance I'm too young to remember the troubles. I could have looked it up but I haven't

[Pretty Boy]

Who is Gerry Adams and what is Sinn Fein?

Excuse the ignorance I'm too young to remember the troubles. I could have looked it up but I haven't

Sinn Fein is the more 'extreme' of the 2 big Republican parties in Northern Ireland. Gerry Adams is the president of the party although he currently sits in the Eire parliament.

They were often seen as the political wing of the IRA and for many years followed a policy of abstention, where they would contest elections but refuse to take seats in Stormont, Westminster (they now have offices there but still don't sit in the house) or Dublin. In recent years they have taken a softer line and have followed a policy of dialogue and politics over war. They played a key part in the reconvening of the Stormont parliament and the peace process as well as the IRAs long running ceasefire and weapon decomissioning.

Gerry Adams is rumoured to have been a commander in the IRA although neither himself, Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever officially confirmed this.

[hibsbollah]

Everyone I have spoken to assumes he is probably guilty of ordering this innocent woman to be murdered, yet there's no appetite for him to be charged either. Which is interesting, morally speaking.

Leaving the retribution vs reconciliation argument to one side, I wonder if we are all so attuned these days to hearing of daily suicide bombings in Baghdad and elsewhere where 50, 60, 70 die in a day, that the IRA seem restrained by comparison?

[Sir David Gray]

Justice? :dunno:

:agree: That's it for me, in a nutshell.

I have no doubts at all that man knows a lot more than he's letting on from his past and it's only right that it should be investigated thoroughly and if he's guilty then he should be put away.

[yeezus.]

Sinn Fein is the more 'extreme' of the 2 big Republican parties in Northern Ireland. Gerry Adams is the president of the party although he currently sits in the Eire parliament.

They were often seen as the political wing of the IRA and for many years followed a policy of abstention, where they would contest elections but refuse to take seats in Stormont, Westminster (they now have offices there but still don't sit in the house) or Dublin. In recent years they have taken a softer line and have followed a policy of dialogue and politics over war. They played a key part in the reconvening of the Stormont parliament and the peace process as well as the IRAs long running ceasefire and weapon decomissioning.

Gerry Adams is rumoured to have been a commander in the IRA although neither himself, Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever officially confirmed this.

I would argue Republican Sinn Fein are more extreme if you consider them a political party? They don't stand in elections north or south as far as I am aware but there are a few nutters knocking about there it's fair to be said.

[Hibrandenburg]

I get what you are saying but the 'war' is over for most of those who engaged in it. If we put Adams on trial then the pressure to put the Paras who took part in the Bloody Sunday ops will increase. Truth and reconciliation rather than retribution for me.

Me too, but it's easy for me to say. My mother wasn't dragged away in front of me, murdered and then buried in an anonymous grave.

[yeezus.]

Sinn Fein is the more 'extreme' of the 2 big Republican parties in Northern Ireland. Gerry Adams is the president of the party although he currently sits in the Eire parliament.

They were often seen as the political wing of the IRA and for many years followed a policy of abstention, where they would contest elections but refuse to take seats in Stormont, Westminster (they now have offices there but still don't sit in the house) or Dublin. In recent years they have taken a softer line and have followed a policy of dialogue and politics over war. They played a key part in the reconvening of the Stormont parliament and the peace process as well as the IRAs long running ceasefire and weapon decomissioning.

Gerry Adams is rumoured to have been a commander in the IRA although neither himself, Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever officially confirmed this.

Also, I'd be highly surprised if the SDLP even branded themselves "republican"...

[easty]

Me too, but it's easy for me to say. My mother wasn't dragged away in front of me, murdered and then buried in an anonymous grave.

That's my thoughts too.

Also, I know its not the same, but there seems to be a huge public desire for the Stewart Halls and Max Clifford's to be charged for their past crimes, but with Gerry Adams? No....we don't want to open a can of worms.

I don't like it at all.

[steakbake]

He's been released without charge, presumably because they don't have the level of proof that he was involved. In other words, he's innocent until proven guilty.

He may well be thought to "know things" about the past, but that's not enough for any old charges to stick, or at least shouldn't be.

The Stuart Hall/Max Clifford comparison: there was evidence, witnesses and due process.

[Newry Hibs]

Also, I'd be highly surprised if the SDLP even branded themselves "republican"...

I think they would class themselves as Nationalist. Not sure there's an 'official' difference, but the accepted difference is that 'Nationalist' want a united Ireland of sorts - but in a peaceful way. Republicans are / were 'OK' with a bit of force - though even Sinn Fein recognise they need for the ballot box.

Similary Unionist and Loyalist have a different feeling about them.

I've simplified the above.

Most (if not all) of the splinter IRA groups have a 'political wing' - be it Republican Sinn Fein; 32 County Sovereign Committee; and some Gaelic name I can't even hope to pronounce.

It all gets a bit confusing. At Easter time there are separate gatherings at the Republican plot in a Newry cemetary for 3 different groups. All reported in the local paper.

[DaveF]

It seems to centre around these Boston tapes and allegations from those who gave them implicating Adams. These tapes were never supposed to see the light of day until those gave them had died, but legal challenges have brought some into the open.

Also noticed that some news bulletins were going down the angle about possible charges of IRA membership? If that's the case, then why hasn't McGuiness been arrested and charged as he openly admitted being an IRA commander in (London) Derry during the early 70s? Pretty sure there are bound to be a few Loyalist people involved in the political process now who were members of the UDA\UVF in days gone by too so bring them in .....

It's potentially opening a whole new can of worms. A (nationlist) commentator was on the radio yesterday talking about it and mentioned that he saw a tweet about 'justice for Joan'. He thought it should have read 'Jean' but dug deeper and it was about a mother of 7 shot by the para's in the 70's. Where is the publicity around her story. Is she less deserving of justice? The thousands of others who died?

Move on. As difficult and distasteful as it might be.....

[easty]

The Stuart Hall/Max Clifford comparison: there was evidence, witnesses and due process.

That's true, my point, though, is that there seems to be a desire not to even look into any evidence in the case of Gerry Adams. Wether or not anyone was meant to hear the Boston tapes or not, they do exist, and they do (apparently- I've not heard or read the actual accusation) implicate him.

[HKhibby]

Usually on this site people can't wait to hang murderers too! Even alleged ones :wink:

And Gerry Adams is certainly not an alleged one!....he is one / was one, whatever way you look at it....he is ****!

[Sylar]

Sinn Fein attempting to politicise this is disgusting IMO, particularly their threat to withdraw their support for the PSNI (central to the peace process).

If there's evidence to suggest he was involved (or indeed guilty altogether), it should be looked at regardless of what potential can of worms it might open.

Forgetting and moving on from murder is not something that should EVER happen.

[DaveF]

Sinn Fein attempting to politicise this is disgusting IMO, particularly their threat to withdraw their support for the PSNI (central to the peace process).

If there's evidence to suggest he was involved (or indeed guilty altogether), it should be looked at regardless of what potential can of worms it might open.

Forgetting and moving on from murder is not something that should EVER happen.

Isn't that what they did in South Africa and it's helped them move on?

Go after Adams, then you can be sure that focus will fall right onto the bloody sunday soldiers to have them named, shamed and sentenced. What good is that for NI's future.

[HKhibby]

:agree: The South African experience should teach us a thing or two.

The south African experience taught alot of people alot of things!....but i fail to understand how anyone could compare the likes of Adams to Mandela!

[DaveF]

The south African experience taught alot of people alot of things!....but i fail to understand how anyone could compare the likes of Adams to Mandela!

That'll be because no one is actually comparing them eh?

NI can either move forward or back. Blame or forgive.

[steakbake]

Isn't that what they did in South Africa and it's helped them move on?

Go after Adams, then you can be sure that focus will fall right onto the bloody sunday soldiers to have them named, shamed and sentenced. What good is that for NI's future.

Agreed - it's a pandora's box situation.

There was widespread and persistent allegations of police/army collusion with unionist terrorists in NI during the troubles - so I think Bloody Sunday would be the tip of the iceberg.

Similarly, senior figures in the republican movement must have known about or been involved in certain operations.

The pre-Good Friday approach was that the Republicans were viewed simply as criminal elements by the British government and any move to treat them as military prisoners (as would be in a war situation), was strenuously avoided (e.g., Bobby Sands and the Longkesh protests etc).

Overall, I think the approach has to be to recognise that whole period of history as a war, not a period of civil unrest and criminality. That will obviously create some significant and justified upset, but by far not as much as would be if civil justice was pursued now to root out absolutely everyone that was involved in paramilitary activities during a very complex period of history. The situation is still too potentially volatile to handle that kind of scenario without significant, wider damage being done to civil society in NI.

The parallels with South Africa are, I think, completely valid - nothing to do with comparing Adams to Mandela. You could equally compare him to the SAfrican Police Officers who murdered dozens at Sharpesville.

The comparison is only unpalatable to people here, because they're generally conditioned to have a binary view on the NI situation: that the Republicans were by general definition the enemy and the Unionists were on 'our' side.

[JeMeSouviens]

It seems to centre around these Boston tapes and allegations from those who gave them implicating Adams. These tapes were never supposed to see the light of day until those gave them had died, but legal challenges have brought some into the open.

Also noticed that some news bulletins were going down the angle about possible charges of IRA membership? If that's the case, then why hasn't McGuiness been arrested and charged as he openly admitted being an IRA commander in (London) Derry during the early 70s? Pretty sure there are bound to be a few Loyalist people involved in the political process now who were members of the UDA\UVF in days gone by too so bring them in .....

It's potentially opening a whole new can of worms. A (nationlist) commentator was on the radio yesterday talking about it and mentioned that he saw a tweet about 'justice for Joan'. He thought it should have read 'Jean' but dug deeper and it was about a mother of 7 shot by the para's in the 70's. Where is the publicity around her story. Is she less deserving of justice? The thousands of others who died?

Move on. As difficult and distasteful as it might be.....

McGuinness was convicted in the Irish Republic in the 70s so he can openly admit membership before then. He claims he left the IRA in 1974.

I think this is a horse that left the stable a long time ago, so no point bolting the door now. The decision was made at the IRA's 2nd ceasefire and subsequent negotiating period to the GFA that Adams, McGuinness etc had to be negotiated with and their past put to one side. It's inconceivable that Adams wasn't involved in the Belfast IRA's leadership and didn't know about the disappeared, about Bloody Friday, etc etc. but everyone in NI already knows and accepts or has at least had to put up with that.