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View Full Version : Interesting couple of Tweets from our former Chief Scout over the weekend...



Winston Ingram
28-04-2014, 09:43 PM
These are from David Henderson, our former chief scout. I tweeted him about the first one asking if it was TB & MM he was talking about and he favourited my tweet.


The fact that bullying is still an accepted form of management in the football industry is probably why depression in the game is on the up

&


Making your players do 20 push ups if they Question a decision in training is hardly the best way of improving your record of one win in 16

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:48 PM
Why and when did he leave Hibs? What's he doing now?

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 09:49 PM
Strange that we didn't hear any of those problems coming out of ICT.

Or am I reading this wrongly.

For a couple of thousand pounds a week I would do 50 press ups.

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:51 PM
Strange that we didn't hear any of those problems coming out of ICT.

Or am I reading this wrongly.

For a couple of thousand pounds a week I would do 50 press ups.

Would you only question them 2 and a half times do you think?

Gatecrasher
28-04-2014, 09:51 PM
20 whole push ups?

:rolleyes:

I dont know if it's just me but I'm sick of these snidey comments from former players or staff if they have something to say just say it FFS. Personally I think the players have had it far too easy at our club and it's about time someone booted them up the arse.

flash
28-04-2014, 09:52 PM
These are from David Henderson, our former chief scout. I tweeted him about the first one asking if it was TB & MM he was talking about and he favourited my tweet.



&

Stir, stir, stir. It's relentless.

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 09:53 PM
Would you only question them 2 and a half times do you think?

Okay to make it easy. 60 push ups.

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 09:54 PM
Favourited my tweet.

Let me off this planet please.

Winston Ingram
28-04-2014, 09:54 PM
Why and when did he leave Hibs? What's he doing now?

He walked out in December. I think he's doing stuff for the FAI now.

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:54 PM
Okay to make it easy. 60 push ups.

:hilarious in a oner? Gone are those days.

Is that me up to 80 now?

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:55 PM
He walked out in December. I think he's doing stuff for the FAI now.

Why did he walk out?

matty_f
28-04-2014, 09:56 PM
Isn't that kind of thing very common in football? I can remember similar when I played at kids level!

MyJo
28-04-2014, 09:56 PM
poor wee lambs, maybe they will take the huff and go moaning to Petrie about the big bad man at east mains making them work too hard.

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:57 PM
Isn't that kind of thing very common in football? I can remember similar when I played at kids level!

Who are you to challenge? Down for 20 son.

Ronniekirk
28-04-2014, 09:57 PM
Strange that we didn't hear any of those problems coming out of ICT.

Or am I reading this wrongly.

For a couple of thousand pounds a week I would do 50 press ups.
Remember when Collins first came in and he could do more push ups than players and they were up in arms then The bullying issue is more of a worry as something went badly wrong after Dundee United game and there was speculation players suddenly saw a different side to Butcher .Not saying players shouldn't have to work hard in training and they need to know who is in charge but would rather he was drilling them how to keep a clean sheet or getting players to shoot at goal .Being able to do press ups won't solve either of these two issues .

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 09:57 PM
:hilarious in a oner? Gone are those days.

Is that me up to 80 now?

No not in a oner. Over a season. I'm not as young as I used to be. :greengrin

eggbamyasi
28-04-2014, 09:57 PM
20 whole push ups?

:rolleyes:

I dont know if it's just me but I'm sick of these snidey comments from former players or staff if they have something to say just say it FFS. Personally I think the players have had it far too easy at our club and it's about time someone booted them up the arse.

Totally agree . Bloody 20 push ups lol hardly the cane . Been part of our problem for years players think there untouchable .

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 09:59 PM
Remember when Collins first came in and he could do more push ups than players and they were up in arms then The bullying issue is more of a worry as something went badly wrong after Dundee United game and there was speculation players suddenly saw a different side to Butcher .Not saying players shouldn't have to work hard in training and they need to know who is in charge but would rather he was drilling them how to keep a clean sheet or getting players to shoot at goal .Being able to do press ups won't solve either of these two issues .

Do you think they're not working on that and doing press ups instead?

Pretty Boy
28-04-2014, 10:00 PM
Is depression really on the rise in football or are people just more willing to acknowledge it?

Was 'bullying' not far more accepted in days gone by than it is today so surely it ahould have been worse back then.

Maybe Butcher and Malpas are a bit old school, maybe they do need to mellow a little bit but this kind of stuff is relentless at the moment and it only seems to have appeared since this poor run started. I don't recall hearing anything about it at ICT.

MyJo
28-04-2014, 10:00 PM
Isn't that kind of thing very common in football? I can remember similar when I played at kids level!

That kind of management doesn't work on modern football players, i can't think of any manager who has a reputation for losing his temper and giving players "hairdryer" treatment in the dressing room acheiving anything at the highest levels. :dunno:

Viva_Palmeiras
28-04-2014, 10:02 PM
12490

MyJo
28-04-2014, 10:02 PM
If this "former chief scout" had anything to do with us signing James Collins i think he should probably wind his neck in forthwith.

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 10:03 PM
Right guys we've had a laugh lets just quit it with the casual homophobia now.

Heisenberg
28-04-2014, 10:04 PM
Why would he feel the need to stir it up like that? A wee bit bitter that he was replaced aye?

sleeping giant
28-04-2014, 10:05 PM
Favourited my tweet.

Let me off this planet please.

:faf:

:agree:

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 10:05 PM
20 whole push ups?

:rolleyes:

I dont know if it's just me but I'm sick of these snidey comments from former players or staff if they have something to say just say it FFS. Personally I think the players have had it far too easy at our club and it's about time someone booted them up the arse.

They like to think that they know something worth knowing and feed you with crumbs. Twitter has a lot to answer for and strangely some folk believe everything they read on it. Personally I never go on Twitter and have no desire to. Spend enough time on here as it us.

East Mains was built as a holiday camp. Well at least I don't think it was. Anyway I'm away to do some push ups before bed.

Heisenberg
28-04-2014, 10:06 PM
If this "former chief scout" had anything to do with us signing James Collins i think he should probably wind his neck in forthwith.

:agree:

Hermit Crab
28-04-2014, 10:08 PM
Bullying is unacceptable in any workplace no matter who you and what your grade is.

TheReg!
28-04-2014, 10:08 PM
To me doing press-ups for punishment is a way to install discipline, i have no problem with this what so ever as long as it is the same for every player. Its a winning attitude what is missing from the players they need to buy into the way TB wants them to play right or wrong!!!

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 10:09 PM
If James Collins had been doing his push ups when that ball flew in his direction against Hearts then he would no doubt have tucked it away with his head.

Kato
28-04-2014, 10:09 PM
These are from David Henderson, our former chief scout. I tweeted him about the first one asking if it was TB & MM he was talking about and he favourited my tweet.



&

I'm glad he's no longer at the club.

Who is he to be any kind of authority on anything.

If he's got something to say he should just say it. Hiding behind twitter is so 2009.

CB_NO3
28-04-2014, 10:10 PM
Yet we are still one of the weakest and slowest teams in the league.

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 10:10 PM
Bullying is unacceptable in any workplace no matter who you and what your grade is.

But can we agree that getting athletes to do press ups isn't necessarily bullying?

Ronniekirk
28-04-2014, 10:13 PM
Is depression really on the rise in football or are people just more willing to acknowledge it?

Was 'bullying' not far more accepted in days gone by than it is today so surely it ahould have been worse back then.

Maybe Butcher and Malpas are a bit old school, maybe they do need to mellow a little bit but this kind of stuff is relentless at the moment and it only seems to have appeared since this poor run started. I don't recall hearing anything about it at ICT.
There was some talk of ICT players saying in lead up to cup final the atmosphere was more relaxed under Yogi but that could be be for a variety if different reasons .That's only time I have heard anything said that might indicate something .But who knows

weonlywon6-2
28-04-2014, 10:13 PM
Of all the tv clips of east mains and countless managers ive never seen any sit ups being done,only football and training sessions.

When the chips are down everyone loves to put the boot in.

This is possibly one disgruntled player who has bumped.his gums to the bloke.

If this was the way it was sam stanton wouldnt be signing a long term contract,not unless hes sadistic

Danderhall Hibs
28-04-2014, 10:13 PM
There was some talk of ICT players saying in lead up to cup final the atmosphere was more relaxed under Yogi but that could be be for a variety if different reasons .That's only time I have heard anything said that might indicate something .But who knows

The relaxed attitudes working a treat for them.

Ronniekirk
28-04-2014, 10:14 PM
Yet we are still one of the weakest and slowest teams in the league.
But if it was a press up completion we would win Hands Down :wink:

stoneyburn hibs
28-04-2014, 10:17 PM
Its the "lets have a pop at Hibs" fortnight and quite a few on here love any snippet of gossip, even if they have been telt to do press ups, so what.

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 10:18 PM
But if it was a press up completion we would win Hands Down :wink:

What the ex chief forgot to say was that it was press ups on the wii.

RIP
28-04-2014, 10:20 PM
I was playing seven a side at McDiarmid on Thursday with the FFIT (Fat) fans. Our coach Danny Griffin blew a whistle every few mins and we had to do squats, star jumps whatever. Son Cammy said his amateur coach does same when players miss shots in training.

Teaches us discipline. At pro level it reduces the amount of needless yellows for dissent.

portycabbage
28-04-2014, 10:20 PM
What the ex chief forgot to say was that it was press ups on the wii.

Gary Locke likes the sound of that.

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 10:21 PM
Gary Locke likes the sound of that.

:greengrin

CallumLaidlaw
28-04-2014, 10:24 PM
There was some talk of ICT players saying in lead up to cup final the atmosphere was more relaxed under Yogi but that could be be for a variety if different reasons .That's only time I have heard anything said that might indicate something .But who knows

More relaxed, and I wonder why they've slipped from clear 2nd to 5th, and will possibly finish 6th

Sir David Gray
28-04-2014, 10:27 PM
I'm quite sure Butcher and Malpas aren't doing anything with us that they weren't doing whilst at Inverness and there was never any suggestion of bullying of any sort going on in the five years that they were up there.

I would love to know some more details about the exact nature of this "bullying" before commenting any further.

SaulGoodman
28-04-2014, 10:30 PM
Getting all of these people who aren't happy at doing 20 push ups out of the club is the first step I'm getting rid of this pushover attitude with players that think they're bigger than the club.

matty_f
28-04-2014, 10:32 PM
Getting all of these people who aren't happy at doing 20 push ups out of the club is the first step I'm getting rid of this pushover attitude with players that think they're bigger than the club.

And it'll make them stronger. Win/Win situation imho.

davhibby
28-04-2014, 10:33 PM
At ICT all the players loved training and it was great. I would guess that the training at Hibs will be no different so why didn't we hear of the Caley players getting "bullied". People just trying to pick away at TB and MM

iwasthere1972
28-04-2014, 10:36 PM
Give me the old days before T'internet and other social media when we weren't bombarded with all this guff and managers and players being asked to comment on all the boring day to day crap. Players tweeting all day long in their self importance. Got to have their daily fix and bore us stupid with it. I don't need to know what the players are having for breakfast etc etc etc.

Yours old fart.

Sir David Gray
28-04-2014, 10:47 PM
More relaxed, and I wonder why they've slipped from clear 2nd to 5th, and will possibly finish 6th

:agree: Their league record this season prior to Butcher's departure;

P-11
W-7
D-1
L-3
Win percentage-63%

Their league record since Hughes took over;

P-22
W-6
D-7
L-9
Win percentage-27%

silverhibee
28-04-2014, 11:03 PM
There was some talk of ICT players saying in lead up to cup final the atmosphere was more relaxed under Yogi but that could be be for a variety if different reasons .That's only time I have heard anything said that might indicate something .But who knows

Yep, pretty sure i heard a ICT player say something along the lines, and i think he was saying it in a joke way, but he said "Yogi isn't kicking down doors or slapping us on the head, things have been better since he became manager here" it was just the way he said it that made you wonder what happened in the changing room at ICT.

As for there coaching i heard how they were a few years back, think it is pretty well known in football circles that Malpas isn't in the game to make friends, you take him how he comes because that's how he is and i doubt he is going to start changing his ways now, but they are far from bullies on the training pitch, they are in your face type of folk and if you back chat them don't expect them to be nice back, that's there style and it seemed to work at ICT and i'm hoping it works here as well, but it won't with these wasters(excluding the young players) so lets hope he gets the right players in the summer and rid of the wasters we have just now.

Kaiserclem
29-04-2014, 12:07 AM
Remember when Collins first came in and he could do more push ups than players and they were up in arms then The bullying issue is more of a worry as something went badly wrong after Dundee United game and there was speculation players suddenly saw a different side to Butcher .Not saying players shouldn't have to work hard in training and they need to know who is in charge but would rather he was drilling them how to keep a clean sheet or getting players to shoot at goal .Being able to do press ups won't solve either of these two issues .

Current first team player told me weeks ago that the bullying tactics in training from Butcher, and in particular Malpas, has resulted in them losing the support of most of the squad. I agree they shouldn't be so soft as probably deserve a kick up the arse for being so bad but also told me. Boateng in particular is treated shockingly in training from Malpas.

Pete
29-04-2014, 01:43 AM
Give me the old days before T'internet and other social media when we weren't bombarded with all this guff and managers and players being asked to comment on all the boring day to day crap. Players tweeting all day long in their self importance. Got to have their daily fix and bore us stupid with it. I don't need to know what the players are having for breakfast etc etc etc.

Yours old fart.

...with over 15,000 posts.

:greengrin

greenlex
29-04-2014, 02:16 AM
I wonder what Jim Mc Lean and Alex Ferguson would make of this?

Centre Hawf
29-04-2014, 04:05 AM
The players need a swift boot up the backside, but then again respect is earned. Players and Managers are no different to normal working colleague relationships.

H18Y GW
29-04-2014, 05:13 AM
Bullying is unacceptable in any workplace no matter who you and what your grade is.


Discipline is though and it comes in many forms.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 05:44 AM
Mind how yogi used to be a bully when we were losing as well?

Walter
29-04-2014, 05:51 AM
20 press ups was the standard punishment for any indiscretion in training for my work. I always treated it with a wry smile....I knew the score...it was my fault if I had to do them....did us no harm

Hibrandenburg
29-04-2014, 05:56 AM
Jeez! 20 press ups. East Mains sounds a lot like Guantanamo, maybe it's time we got Amnesty involved.

(Liegestützen macht Frei)

scoopyboy
29-04-2014, 06:00 AM
Why did he walk out?

Petrie wouldn't pay for the taxi.:greengrin

Geo_1875
29-04-2014, 06:01 AM
Ex-employee with patchy performance record (who did he scout for us?) has a dig on social media. I'm not bothered much.

AndyM_1875
29-04-2014, 06:09 AM
I wonder what Jim Mc Lean and Alex Ferguson would make of this?

Or Eddie Turnbull?!?! :greengrin

Scooter
29-04-2014, 06:20 AM
Or Eddie Turnbull?!?! :greengrin

This push up thing is Malpas

bawheid
29-04-2014, 06:22 AM
Malpas eh? I would never have guessed it. The swine is killing the club from within!!!!

matty_f
29-04-2014, 06:54 AM
All joking aside, it surely has to be a concern if an ex-employee is raising the issue of bullying at the club, no?
The press ups aren't bullying, but he might not have been referring to that alone as bullying.
That said, if he genuinely feels that there is bullying then he should have raised it at board level rather than sniping with a spurious and ambiguous tweet.

My own opinion is that if they genuinely were bullies they would have been found out at ICT. I am more inclined to think that they are trying to demand higher standards and are using a bit of tough love to get there.

Mr White
29-04-2014, 06:56 AM
After ict beat us 2 nil at easter road in november with butcher in the stand and Malpas in their dugout, MM said after the game "we whip these players and that's how they respond" to describe their discipline and fitness. It may not be a method to everyone's taste but we all saw how effective it can be. If they can identify players in the summer who buy into and can cope with their ways then maybe Butcher and Malpas will have us playing fast, direct, effective football at the top end of the league.

BOB MARLEYS DUG
29-04-2014, 06:57 AM
20 push ups:faf:

East Mains, A.K.A Pure Gym. Hope the players are being provided with individual protein shakes. If not, Petrie, Butcher and Malpas GTF:greengrin

JimBHibees
29-04-2014, 07:00 AM
Stir, stir, stir. It's relentless.

Agree I think some people wont be happy until we are relegated and Rod is hanging from a tree somewhere. :rolleyes:

lapsedhibee
29-04-2014, 07:03 AM
Malpas eh? I would never have guessed it. The swine is killing the club from within!!!!

Finally - finally - we know what Malpas was thinking about when he was looking into his teacup at HT on Sun. The ******, *******, **** was planning press-ups, and possibly other physical activities, for the week ahead. Shirley it's time to get the SSPF involved?

Kaiser1962
29-04-2014, 07:04 AM
Or Eddie Turnbull?!?! :greengrin

Exactly. I'm thinking Jim Telfer might yet get the jail. :cb

bawheid
29-04-2014, 07:05 AM
I think one day we'll erect a statue of Sir Maurice Malpas outside the west stand.

'Mon the Malpas. Whip these slackers into shape.

matty_f
29-04-2014, 07:15 AM
I think people need to keep in mind that football management isn't like office management. Butcher and Malpas have to get the players to do what they're told and don't have the luxury of putting someone on a 6 month action plan to bring their performance levels up to scratch.
They need to get a level of discipline quickly and though some may not agree with the methods they disagree froma position where their job isn't on the line if the players don't follow instructions.

s.a.m
29-04-2014, 07:26 AM
Jeez! 20 press ups. East Mains sounds a lot like Guantanamo, maybe it's time we got Amnesty involved.

(Liegestützen macht Frei)


:greengrin
Are Liegestützen press-ups?

Bostonhibby
29-04-2014, 09:32 AM
Ex-employee with patchy performance record (who did he scout for us?) has a dig on social media. I'm not bothered much.

:agree: I was thinking the same thing.

Was going to tweet him and suggest he just **** off and leave us alone then I realised he already had.

flash
29-04-2014, 09:48 AM
Not sure why you would even be following him on Twitter unless he is a mate.........

Geo_1875
29-04-2014, 09:52 AM
Not sure why you would even be following him on Twitter unless he is a mate.........

Maybe he sees him as a potential mate?

Hibercelona
29-04-2014, 09:56 AM
20 push ups is nothing. But a player should have the right to question something if they don't feel that it's benefiting them or the team, which appears to be the case at the moment.

green day
29-04-2014, 10:00 AM
Nobody on here, and I mean nobody will give a monkeys chuff if (a) we beat the drop and (b) are fitter, more skillful, more aggressive in the tackle, win games and compete next year.

So dry your eyes, ex scout and anyone else who is worried.

Utter nonsense thread, we are potentially doing down the tubes and people wringing their hands about guys who work 3 hours per day - if they are lucky?

jonty
29-04-2014, 10:14 AM
12490

:top marks

We all know that its Petries fault.

Its funny. Ex-employee comments on manager = disgruntled.
ex-employee negative comment on Petrie = fact.

The truth will probably be somewhere inbetween and i guess we'll never truly know.

Brightside
29-04-2014, 10:17 AM
20 push ups is nothing. But a player should have the right to question something if they don't feel that it's benefiting them or the team, which appears to be the case at the moment.

Rubbish. a player should shut up and do as he is told. Do you honestly think players questioned Ferguson, or Jose? There seems to be a mental idea that we are running a Co-Op at Easter Rd.

Hibercelona
29-04-2014, 10:21 AM
Rubbish. a player should shut up and do as he is told. Do you honestly think players questioned Ferguson, or Jose? There seems to be a mental idea that we are running a Co-Op at Easter Rd.

We don't have a Fergie or Jose though do we? We have a manager who is still in the process of learning the trade.

The players aren't exactly performing well at the moment and they may feel that the current training regime, isn't getting the best out of them.

Taking away a players right to ask questions is ridiculous. It's a game of football, not an army training camp.

Brightside
29-04-2014, 10:25 AM
Its not a game of football. Its a business and these players have contracts. Do you really think Terry is learning his trade?? He's been managing this trade for about 20 yrs!

Keith_M
29-04-2014, 10:26 AM
I was playing seven a side at McDiarmid on Thursday with the FFIT (Fat) fans. Our coach Danny Griffin blew a whistle every few mins and we had to do squats, star jumps whatever. Son Cammy said his amateur coach does same when players miss shots in training.

Teaches us discipline. At pro level it reduces the amount of needless yellows for dissent.


Are you available for the game against Thistle, Gogs?

Kato
29-04-2014, 10:32 AM
20 push ups is nothing. But a player should have the right to question something if they don't feel that it's benefiting them or the team, which appears to be the case at the moment.

Maybe it's because they are asking questions that they aren't performing.

That said I've yet to see anything from you that would say you have any right to any kind of opinion on what it would take to help Hibs.

Hibercelona
29-04-2014, 10:37 AM
Its not a game of football. Its a business and these players have contracts. Do you really think Terry is learning his trade?? He's been managing this trade for about 20 yrs!

His overall managerial record has been quite poor and it's easy to see why.

Getting your players to work hard is one thing, but respecting them is equally as important. With respect comes communication and understanding, which includes the right to ask questions.

Telling a player to keep their mouth shut and not to question anything is very bad for the game. Sometimes you have to ask questions to get the information you need, it's how people learn.

rcarter1
29-04-2014, 10:51 AM
I believe that if we survive relegation TB and co will be able to recruit folk that can work to their philosophy, and if so, bonus, cause they will be the kind of tough nuts that win derbies and so on. But Im no longer surprised that with the current bunch we've gone on such a slump.

Winston Ingram
29-04-2014, 10:52 AM
We don't have a Fergie or Jose though do we? We have a manager who is still in the process of learning the trade.

The players aren't exactly performing well at the moment and they may feel that the current training regime, isn't getting the best out of them.

Taking away a players right to ask questions is ridiculous. It's a game of football, not an army training camp.

Ssh! We cannae have people asking sensible questions on here. Focus on the number of press ups.:wink:

Winston Ingram
29-04-2014, 10:55 AM
Its not a game of football. Its a business and these players have contracts. Do you really think Terry is learning his trade?? He's been managing this trade for about 20 yrs!

Judging by his track record he is.

Ricky Bobby
29-04-2014, 11:07 AM
Not interested in anything this group of players have to say.
Shape up or ship out, simple

GreenLake
29-04-2014, 11:20 AM
His overall managerial record has been quite poor and it's easy to see why.

Getting your players to work hard is one thing, but respecting them is equally as important. With respect comes communication and understanding, which includes the right to ask questions.

Telling a player to keep their mouth shut and not to question anything is very bad for the game. Sometimes you have to ask questions to get the information you need, it's how people learn.

You are suggesting the player in discussion was asking a question in the manner of trying to discover something. This is not what the tweeter was suggesting in my view. The "questioning" was in the order of "what the heck are we doing this for, it's bovine excrement?". Being ordered to do some hard training as an incentive to keep their trap shut and their focus on following the bosses direction during a training session with a large group is quite reasonable. Should any player have a suggestion which is in conflict with the training program of the day he should bring it up in a one to one with the manager or coach at the next opportunity.

Hopefully this type of management will get rid of players who are less willing to follow the coaches directions. Hibs have had years of players doing their own thing on the pitch and look where it got us. Making this bunch unhappy is a good way of emptying them.

I really hope TB and MM are measured on the results they get after getting rid of players and bringing in new ones. A more committed and willing squad of "can do" kind of personalities might get us back to winning ways.

As for this former Hibs chief scout, I doubt he could find a decent player at a Barcelona FC BBQ.

Winston Ingram
29-04-2014, 11:25 AM
You are suggesting the player in discussion was asking a question in the manner of trying to discover something. This is not what the tweeter was suggesting in my view. The "questioning" was in the order of "what the heck are we doing this for, it's bovine excrement?". Being ordered to do some hard training as an incentive to keep their trap shut and their focus on following the bosses direction during a training session with a large group is quite reasonable. Should any player have a suggestion which is in conflict with the training program of the day he should bring it up in a one to one with the manager or coach at the next opportunity.

Hopefully this type of management will get rid of players who are less willing to follow the coaches directions. Hibs have had years of players doing their own thing on the pitch and look where it got us. Making this bunch unhappy is a good way of emptying them.

I really hope TB and MM are measured on the results they get after getting rid of players and bringing in new ones. A more committed and willing squad of "can do" kind of personalities might get us back to winning ways.

As for this former Hibs chief scout, I doubt he could find a decent player at a Barcelona FC BBQ.


Making your players do 20 push ups if they Question a decision in training is hardly the best way of improving your record of one win in 16


Does it?:confused:

Kaff
29-04-2014, 11:28 AM
Yep, pretty sure i heard a ICT player say something along the lines, and i think he was saying it in a joke way, but he said "Yogi isn't kicking down doors or slapping us on the head, things have been better since he became manager here" it was just the way he said it that made you wonder what happened in the changing room at ICT.

As for there coaching i heard how they were a few years back, think it is pretty well known in football circles that Malpas isn't in the game to make friends, you take him how he comes because that's how he is and i doubt he is going to start changing his ways now, but they are far from bullies on the training pitch, they are in your face type of folk and if you back chat them don't expect them to be nice back, that's there style and it seemed to work at ICT and i'm hoping it works here as well, but it won't with these wasters(excluding the young players) so lets hope he gets the right players in the summer and rid of the wasters we have just now.

SH, my recollection was roughly this;
Richie Foran was interviewed before the final and after being asked what if any difference there was with Yogi to Butcher he laughed as he said (something like) 'well there's no one been pinned up against the wall and the doors are all intact'
He also said that the group of players were all self motivated and had to be forced OFF the training ground as they continually wanted to improve themselves. Foran followed TB from Motherwell to ICT for more punishment and I hope he follows him here too as I think he would be a great skipper.

confused
29-04-2014, 11:35 AM
What a joke , some bam tweets some trash because he's on the dole and now we have bullying in the workplace ? maybe time to get the domino's out or the crib board ,

stevejordan
29-04-2014, 11:36 AM
His overall managerial record has been quite poor and it's easy to see why.

Getting your players to work hard is one thing, but respecting them is equally as important. With respect comes communication and understanding, which includes the right to ask questions.

Telling a player to keep their mouth shut and not to question anything is very bad for the game. Sometimes you have to ask questions to get the information you need, it's how people learn.


This type of bully boy management is old school modern football Managers have to deal with players earning more than them and it is all about gaining the players respect who in turm will perform.

Bronson
29-04-2014, 11:37 AM
Hibs have been a soft touch for as long as I can remember, it's about time someone like Butcher and Malpas came in and put their foot down IMO.

To describe 20 push ups as bullying is a gross exaggeration from what sounds like a bitter man.

StevieC
29-04-2014, 11:42 AM
But a player should have the right to question something if they don't feel that it's benefiting them or the team

Totally disagree. It's a players place to do EXACTLY what the manager tells him to do. It's the managers job that is on the line if he doesn't. If he has a genuine grievance then I'm sure he can speak to the club captain, who in turn can speak with (if he deems it necessary) the management team.


Do you honestly think players questioned Ferguson, or Jose?

Beckham did :wink: .. and got a football boot to the head and out the door quicker than David Moyes.* :greengrin


*this may or may not be factually correct :wink:

Golden Bear
29-04-2014, 11:45 AM
Did our former Chief Scout actually manage to scout anyone??

sesoim
29-04-2014, 11:48 AM
These are from David Henderson, our former chief scout. I tweeted him about the first one asking if it was TB & MM he was talking about and he favourited my tweet.



&


Was he the chief scout while we were attracting all these great players under Fenlon? If so, his opinion doesn't count for much.

J-C
29-04-2014, 11:48 AM
Nothing wrong with shouting at players when it's justified, making then do extra sit up/star jumps etc has been done for years in all sports, jeez when I was personal training a few years back I was making people do them for £35 an hour. :greengrin

It's when the bullying becomes personal or against weaker individuals that's not right, there were rumours of bullying by Yogi against the youngsters as he was seen to be like of of the lads instead of the manager. Some people can take too much shouting and swearing and see it as bullying, when in fact it's just the way some coaches are, personally I think Malpas is too old school and he think that bawling at everyone is his way of getting his point over.

StevieC
29-04-2014, 11:49 AM
This type of bully boy management is old school, modern football Managers have to deal with players earning more than them and it is all about gaining the players respect who in turm will perform.

Tony Pulis doesn't strike me as a "modern football" manager .. and yet .. :hmmm:

Football managers rise and fall on their results. If a manager gets better results by kicking backsides than by pampering then that is the style he will adopt, his job depends on it. If a player does not respond to his managerial techniques then that player will be replaced by one that will. This is why managers need time to assemble a team that will respond to the manager and play the way that he wants them to.

easty
29-04-2014, 11:54 AM
This type of bully boy management is old school modern football Managers have to deal with players earning more than them and it is all about gaining the players respect who in turm will perform.

Nah you have that the wrong way around.

I'm not believing for a second that Lennon, McInnes, McNamara or McCall do their job with a mentality that says 'I better earn their respect so they do what I ask', they'll be saying 'go out and earn MY respect by doing your ****ing job'.

GreenLake
29-04-2014, 11:54 AM
Does it?:confused:

It suggests they don't agree with a decision made by the boss and are interrupting training to voice their dissent. The time for questioning is afterwards to the boss.

Brightside
29-04-2014, 11:59 AM
I will say that the warm up drills are very very basic. Exact same drills we do with Under 9 players! But that perhaps says more about the players?

The goalie
29-04-2014, 11:59 AM
Boozy, does various "games" with the young players at East Mains, losers always do press ups and it works to motivate the players and lighten the mood.

easty
29-04-2014, 12:13 PM
I will say that the warm up drills are very very basic. Exact same drills we do with Under 9 players! But that perhaps says more about the players?

Maybe we adhere to the Pirlo stance on warm-ups?


One part of my job I’ll never learn to love is the pre-match warm-up. I hate it with every fibre of my being. It actually disgusts me. It’s nothing but masturbation for conditioning coaches

JimBHibees
29-04-2014, 12:15 PM
I do find it slightly odd that the subs arent out warming up at half time. Seems Terry wants them in the dressing room listening to the team talk.

Unseen work
29-04-2014, 12:34 PM
Bullying?? Does he take there lunch money?

Butcher and malpas are men that demand respect but even more so demand high standards, it will be frustrating for the that the players are playing so had and it's not the team they want, if the players are making stupid careless mistakes or not doing as there told then right so if the get a bollockig

Pretty Boy
29-04-2014, 12:45 PM
Did our former Chief Scout actually manage to scout anyone??

Roy O'Donovan and Jakub Divis didn't find themselves.

Brightside
29-04-2014, 12:45 PM
I do find it slightly odd that the subs arent out warming up at half time. Seems Terry wants them in the dressing room listening to the team talk.

and then not put them on! Absurd that subs don't warm up at half time...every other team does this.

Northern Hibby
29-04-2014, 01:17 PM
After ict beat us 2 nil at easter road in november with butcher in the stand and Malpas in their dugout, MM said after the game "we whip these players and that's how they respond" to describe their discipline and fitness. It may not be a method to everyone's taste but we all saw how effective it can be. If they can identify players in the summer who buy into and can cope with their ways then maybe Butcher and Malpas will have us playing fast, direct, effective football at the top end of the league.

Agree 100% also having a common enemy (the Boss/management team) helps players bond, maybe enemy is to strong but I think the direct quote is
"Nothing unites people like a common enemy"

JimBHibees
29-04-2014, 01:26 PM
and then not put them on! Absurd that subs don't warm up at half time...every other team does this.

Agree it is the one time they can get a touch of the ball during a game. Saw the footage on the tv of the derby half time talk and all 5 were sitting in the changing room. Seems a little odd just even in terms of as I said getting a touch, a bit of warming up and a few shots etc.

Northern Hibby
29-04-2014, 01:31 PM
http://youtu.be/aJYOKhluskI

Shocking footage of the Butcher of East Mains, spreading his brand of bully boy tactics :hmmm:

easty
29-04-2014, 01:34 PM
Agree it is the one time they can get a touch of the ball during a game. Saw the footage on the tv of the derby half time talk and all 5 were sitting in the changing room. Seems a little odd just even in terms of as I said getting a touch, a bit of warming up and a few shots etc.

If they're not going on immediately after half time I don't see any reason to have them warm up during the break.

JimBHibees
29-04-2014, 01:38 PM
If they're not going on immediately after half time I don't see any reason to have them warm up during the break.

Every other team seems to do it including I am pretty sure Malmo. Just thought it seemed a little odd not to see the subs and sub goalie out knocking a ball about at half time.

easty
29-04-2014, 01:49 PM
Every other team seems to do it including I am pretty sure Malmo. Just thought it seemed a little odd not to see the subs and sub goalie out knocking a ball about at half time.

I know other teams do it, I cant see what benefit there is to warming up, only to go sit back down for 20 mins, then go get warmed up again. I'm not a coach or a physio though, maybe theres a good reason to warm up at half-time.

JimBHibees
29-04-2014, 01:53 PM
I know other teams do it, I cant see what benefit there is to warming up, only to go sit back down for 20 mins, then go get warmed up again. I'm not a coach or a physio though, maybe theres a good reason to warm up at half-time.

I would have thought it would be to get a decent touch on the ball for both outfield players and also the sub goalie.

Lago
29-04-2014, 02:59 PM
You have to wonder why this so called revelation should surface at this time and from a guy who left in Dec. So how long was he involved with the new management team, 1 or 2 months max.
How many on here new we had a chief scout called Henderson, I didn't, who did he bring to the club, no one of note based on the players currently at the club. Could there be just a little suspicion of sour grapes. I don't for a minute think our management team bully the players, but I do think they have been disappointed by the poor quality, poor fitness and poor attitude of our current playing staff and have told them that in simple basic english to which some of the poor dears have taken offence.

erin go bragh
29-04-2014, 03:07 PM
Did our former Chief Scout actually manage to scout anyone??

Griffiths ? Maybe . Does sound a bit like sour grapes .
20 !! Id have them doing 200 on their knuckles after a defeat .

Ggtth

Kato
29-04-2014, 03:09 PM
You have to wonder why this so called revelation should surface at this time and from a guy who left in Dec. So how long was he involved with the new management team, 1 or 2 months max.
How many on here new we had a chief scout called Henderson, I didn't, who did he bring to the club, no one of note based on the players currently at the club. Could there be just a little suspicion of sour grapes. I don't for a minute think our management team bully the players, but I do think they have been disappointed by the poor quality, poor fitness and poor attitude of our current playing staff and have told them that in simple basic english to which some of the poor dears have taken offence.

He re-tweeted an article on depression/bullying in sport just prior to his own posts.

Maybe he saw the chance to have a dig.

Lucius Apuleius
29-04-2014, 03:29 PM
When did the subs start warming up at half time? I remember when they always went in with the starting 11 at half time.

Unseen work
29-04-2014, 03:32 PM
Griffiths ? Maybe . Does sound a bit like sour grapes .
20 !! Id have them doing 200 on their knuckles after a defeat .

Ggtth

Surely couldn't class griffiths as being scouted as he was very well known already. Maybe Claros? Most others were terrible though

scoopyboy
29-04-2014, 09:25 PM
When did the subs start warming up at half time? I remember when they always went in with the starting 11 at half time.

Our subs never really warmed up at half time, they simply pissed about unsupervised for 10 or 15 minutes.

Bronson
29-04-2014, 09:32 PM
Surely couldn't class griffiths as being scouted as he was very well known already. Maybe Claros? Most others were terrible though

Claros had been a Celtic target before he got shot in 2011, then was about to sign for Rangers in 2012 but it didn't go through because the deal offered was described as 'absurd' by Montagua. We signed him later that day as he was already in Scotland.

Golden Bear
29-04-2014, 09:45 PM
There'e a difference between being "scouted" and players who were touted to us by their Agents.
I suspect that the bulk of players whom we've signed in the last couple of seasons fall into the second category.

Bostonhibby
29-04-2014, 09:54 PM
There'e a difference between being "scouted" and players who were touted to us by their Agents.
I suspect that the bulk of players whom we've signed in the last couple of seasons fall into the second category.

:agree: Who "scouted" Kuqi? it didn't need to be Davy Crockett to spot he was finished before he joined us.

sean
29-04-2014, 09:56 PM
Not the first time iv heard of bullying going on at east mains since there arrival and It has nothing to do with press ups.

VivaHiberña
29-04-2014, 09:59 PM
Not the first time iv heard of bullying going on at east mains since there arrival and It has nothing to do with press ups.

I'll bite. Go on...

sean
29-04-2014, 10:07 PM
As I said previously it's not the first iv heard it since these tubes took over.

Malpas is hated in football,no one has a nice word to say about him.

also I heard the players were actually wanting to train longer and the management team wanted to train for short sessions everyday .

Also just reading back through the last few pages , why can't players question things to management ? Why should they be doing exactly as they are told.

This means that no one can moan at McGivern when he shanks it 90 yards forward because that's what he is being told to do ?

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:08 PM
Our subs never really warmed up at half time, they simply pissed about unsupervised for 10 or 15 minutes.

Yip. Remember the complaints on here when yogi was the manager: "they should be doing shuttle runs and that"

SMAXXA
29-04-2014, 10:12 PM
Yip. Remember the complaints on here when yogi was the manager: "they should be doing shuttle runs and that"

I believe the subs should be going through a routine with a coach leading the half time warm up.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:13 PM
I believe the subs should be going through a routine with a coach leading the half time warm up.

I think it's fairly pointless unless they're about to come on.

Heisenberg
29-04-2014, 10:17 PM
As I said previously it's not the first iv heard it since these tubes took over.

Malpas is hated in football,no one has a nice word to say about him.

also I heard the players were actually wanting to train longer and the management team wanted to train for short sessions everyday .

Also just reading back through the last few pages , why can't players question things to management ? Why should they be doing exactly as they are told.

This means that no one can moan at McGivern when he shanks it 90 yards forward because that's what he is being told to do ?

The players are in for longer than they were previously are they not? I'm sure I read/heard that not long after Butcher arrived.

SMAXXA
29-04-2014, 10:18 PM
I think it's fairly pointless unless they're about to come on.

Which they could be called upon a minute into the second half? Wouldn't a proper routine stand them in better stead than piss farting about or actually no staying out at half time no?

Thecat23
29-04-2014, 10:19 PM
I believe the subs should be going through a routine with a coach leading the half time warm up.

Said this many a time, get them out and not only warned up talked how they can impact on the game when on.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:21 PM
Which they could be called upon a minute into the second half? Wouldn't a proper routine stand them in better stead than piss farting about or actually no staying out at half time no?

Shouldn't they constantly be warming up then, just in case they're called upon?

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:22 PM
Said this many a time, get them out and not only warned up talked how they can impact on the game when on.

Seems like the second part is being done, the first part can be done while the game's going on?

SMAXXA
29-04-2014, 10:24 PM
Shouldn't they constantly be warming up then, just in case they're called upon?

There could be an argument for that aye. So you don't believe a set routine would be better than doing nothing?

Thecat23
29-04-2014, 10:29 PM
Seems like the second part is being done, the first part can be done while the game's going on?

See what your saying to be fair, just IMO I'd like to see a coach work with the subs at HT talk them through first half and what they can do to improve when on. Rather than talking during the game when a lot is happening.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:29 PM
There could be an argument for that aye. So you don't believe a set routine would be better than doing nothing?

Depends on what the nothing is - the cats suggesting they're being briefed on tactics and how they can have an impact.

Warming ups important, one of the main parts is to get your "2nd wind" as much as stretching, most managers prefer the 60/70 minute substitution (unless forced otherwise) so the subs would in effect be onto about their 3rd or 4th wind if we chuck a half time runabout in as well.

Out of interest did the ICT subs warm up when they had TB and MM in charge?

SMAXXA
29-04-2014, 10:35 PM
Depends on what the nothing is - the cats suggesting they're being briefed on tactics and how they can have an impact.

Warming ups important, one of the main parts is to get your "2nd wind" as much as stretching, most managers prefer the 60/70 minute substitution (unless forced otherwise) so the subs would in effect be onto about their 3rd or 4th wind if we chuck a half time runabout in as well.

Out of interest did the ICT subs warm up when they had TB and MM in charge?

I disagree that's why managers prefer to use subs for that reason, it's more likely that they want to change the game than for a fitness or second wind perspective. It's like anything there has to be a purpose to what they are doing, I don't know any other team that doesn't have their subs warming up at half time to be fair.

no idea if they did that at inverness, would be interested to know. I will try find out the rational to this though.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:38 PM
I disagree that's why managers prefer to use subs for that reason, it's more likely that they want to change the game than for a fitness or second wind perspective. It's like anything there has to be a purpose to what they are doing, I don't know any other team that doesn't have their subs warming up at half time to be fair.

no idea if they did that at inverness, would be interested to know. I will try find out the rational to this though.

Most teams do seem to send their subs out at ht but generally for a kickabout. Nothing constructive is being done like you and the cat are suggesting we could/should be doing.

Would be interested to hear why we have them all in at ht though.

(((Fergus)))
29-04-2014, 10:42 PM
Strange that we didn't hear any of those problems coming out of ICT.

Or am I reading this wrongly.

For a couple of thousand pounds a week I would do 50 press ups.

Maybe the players at ICT did what they were told?

If players are questioning decisions in training it is only because they do not (yet) trust the manager. Should they trust the manager implicitly? You can't fake trust, it has to be based on something. Are forced press-ups a good basis?

Viva_Palmeiras
29-04-2014, 10:45 PM
As I said previously it's not the first iv heard it since these tubes took over.

Malpas is hated in football,no one has a nice word to say about him.

also I heard the players were actually wanting to train longer and the management team wanted to train for short sessions everyday .

Also just reading back through the last few pages , why can't players question things to management ? Why should they be doing exactly as they are told.

This means that no one can moan at McGivern when he shanks it 90 yards forward because that's what he is being told to do ?

After reading the preceding pages perhaps you should also re-read your post?

I get it you've made your mind up on the management.

So are you about to make a revelation or is what you've heard just that hearsay or perhaps even players with an axe to grind?

"Hated in football" - that's some sweeping statement that shouldn't go unchallenged. Even so one of our best managers wasn't universally liked by the players (albeit from a different era).

Ill say say it again - we need to look beyond this broken record it's all been said before and the record returns to the start of the song an it all goes in like before.

Im im as surprised and gutted (theres footage to prove it) as the next man that TB hasn't sustained the initial impact but we can't keep giving manager 6 months before we lose patience Butcher has no devine right but should come good but for that we have to endure one further transition (amongst 7 years I know) but let's not saddle TB with the failures of past lets have some believe when we get past this season he can make an impression in next seasons SPFL with a new person at the helm.

Thecat23
29-04-2014, 10:45 PM
Most teams do seem to send their subs out at ht but generally for a kickabout. Nothing constructive is being done like you and the cat are suggesting we could/should be doing.

Would be interested to hear why we have them all in at ht though.

I'll find out tomorrow, it's an interesting thing though I'm not a fan of subs just doing keepy uppys and little tricks. This should be a time to reflect and like I say talk about how they would make an impact if and when needed.

Danderhall Hibs
29-04-2014, 10:47 PM
I'll find out tomorrow, it's an interesting thing though I'm not a fan of subs just doing keepy uppys and little tricks. This should be a time to reflect and like I say talk about how they would make an impact if and when needed.

Cheers - hope it's an interesting answer and not just "ehh I don't know" that you get!

Thecat23
29-04-2014, 10:48 PM
After reading the preceding pages perhaps you should also re-read your post?

I get it you've made your mind up on the management.

So are you about to make a revelation or is what you've heard just that hearsay or perhaps even players with an axe to grind?

"Hated in football" - that's some sweeping statement that shouldn't go unchallenged. Even so one of our best managers wasn't universally liked by the players (albeit from a different era).

Ill say say it again - we need to look beyond this broken record it's all been said before and the record returns to the start of the song an it all goes in like before.

Im im as surprised and gutted (theres footage to prove it) as the next man that TB hasn't sustained the initial impact but we can't keep giving manager 6 months before we lose patience Butcher has no devine right but should come good but for that we have to endure one further transition (amongst 7 years I know) but let's not saddle TB with the failures of past lets have some believe when we get past this season he can make an impression in next seasons SPFL with a new person at the helm.

I'm fully behind TB and MM but I have to say MM isn't liked at all by many at Hibs. His attitude isn't great and from what I'm told a few at ICT were happy to see him leave.

Thecat23
29-04-2014, 10:49 PM
Cheers - hope it's an interesting answer and not just "ehh I don't know" that you get!

Should get a proper answer. If not he'll be sent back to ask ;D

Viva_Palmeiras
29-04-2014, 10:56 PM
I'm fully behind TB and MM but I have to say MM isn't liked at all by many at Hibs. His attitude isn't great and from what I'm told a few at ICT were happy to see him leave.

Fair enough Cat/Sean. I think folks can probably agree we've got to break the mould here. Of course there's ways and means of doing it managers by nature are not without flaw but hopefully the plan and their strengths outweight The flaws.

(((Fergus)))
29-04-2014, 11:00 PM
I wonder what Jim Mc Lean and Alex Ferguson would make of this?

Both of these guys earned respect through their results. There are plenty of old-school shouters in football, you need something else (as well) to be successful and earn automatic respect.


Rubbish. a player should shut up and do as he is told. Do you honestly think players questioned Ferguson, or Jose? There seems to be a mental idea that we are running a Co-Op at Easter Rd.

That is a great way to minimise the potential of your players and accelerate your own failure.


Its not a game of football. Its a business and these players have contracts. Do you really think Terry is learning his trade?? He's been managing this trade for about 20 yrs!

It's about time he learned his trade, it would make training that much easier and more focussed on football.


His overall managerial record has been quite poor and it's easy to see why.

Getting your players to work hard is one thing, but respecting them is equally as important. With respect comes communication and understanding, which includes the right to ask questions.

Telling a player to keep their mouth shut and not to question anything is very bad for the game. Sometimes you have to ask questions to get the information you need, it's how people learn.

^^

On the bright side, Leeann will help modernise this club.

The_Horde
29-04-2014, 11:02 PM
I'm fully behind TB and MM but I have to say MM isn't liked at all by many at Hibs. His attitude isn't great and from what I'm told a few at ICT were happy to see him leave.

In that game against hibs where Malpas was in charge the players who were interviewed seemed to be touting Malpas for the managers role?

Kato
29-04-2014, 11:16 PM
After reading the preceding pages perhaps you should also re-read your post?

I get it you've made your mind up on the management.

So are you about to make a revelation or is what you've heard just that hearsay or perhaps even players with an axe to grind?

"Hated in football" - that's some sweeping statement that shouldn't go unchallenged. Even so one of our best managers wasn't universally liked by the players (albeit from a different era).

Ill say say it again - we need to look beyond this broken record it's all been said before and the record returns to the start of the song an it all goes in like before.

Im im as surprised and gutted (theres footage to prove it) as the next man that TB hasn't sustained the initial impact but we can't keep giving manager 6 months before we lose patience Butcher has no devine right but should come good but for that we have to endure one further transition (amongst 7 years I know) but let's not saddle TB with the failures of past lets have some believe when we get past this season he can make an impression in next seasons SPFL with a new person at the helm.

:agree:

matty_f
29-04-2014, 11:53 PM
;3989991']In that game against hibs where Malpas was in charge the players who were interviewed seemed to be touting Malpas for the managers role?

The ICT board offered him the job as well. There was a fair old clamour on here to get him as well.

basehibby
29-04-2014, 11:56 PM
20 whole push ups?

:rolleyes:

I dont know if it's just me but I'm sick of these snidey comments from former players or staff if they have something to say just say it FFS. Personally I think the players have had it far too easy at our club and it's about time someone booted them up the arse.

:agree: Agreed - 20 push ups SHOULD be an utter piece of pish to any one of them - if it's not then they're not fit enough and Maurice should chuck in an extra 20 star jumps for good measure.

Thecat23
30-04-2014, 12:03 AM
Fair enough Cat/Sean. I think folks can probably agree we've got to break the mould here. Of course there's ways and means of doing it managers by nature are not without flaw but hopefully the plan and their strengths outweight The flaws.

Couldn't agree more.

Thecat23
30-04-2014, 12:07 AM
;3989991']In that game against hibs where Malpas was in charge the players who were interviewed seemed to be touting Malpas for the managers role?

I'm not saying they all did. But if any of you know anyone from ICT then you will know a lot didn't like his attitude. For the record I'm backing him and think both TB and MM are the men to take us forward and was delighted we got them.

Also there was no danger he was taking ICT post and the players all knew this so it matters not one jot what they spouted to the press about him. It's what goes on behind the scenes that not everyone sees or here's.

sean
30-04-2014, 06:21 AM
After reading the preceding pages perhaps you should also re-read your post?

I get it you've made your mind up on the management.

So are you about to make a revelation or is what you've heard just that hearsay or perhaps even players with an axe to grind?

"Hated in football" - that's some sweeping statement that shouldn't go unchallenged. Even so one of our best managers wasn't universally liked by the players (albeit from a different era).

Ill say say it again - we need to look beyond this broken record it's all been said before and the record returns to the start of the song an it all goes in like before.

Im im as surprised and gutted (theres footage to prove it) as the next man that TB hasn't sustained the initial impact but we can't keep giving manager 6 months before we lose patience Butcher has no devine right but should come good but for that we have to endure one further transition (amongst 7 years I know) but let's not saddle TB with the failures of past lets have some believe when we get past this season he can make an impression in next seasons SPFL with a new person at the helm.

Yes I have my mind up, the last 16 games have done that!
Why have the wheels come of so badly ?

I'm not saying these guys are all superb players , nothing of the sort but they are shells of the players they were at other clubs.

I'm not in the know either..
Although maybe an interesting development to come in the next week or so..

Viva_Palmeiras
30-04-2014, 06:44 AM
Yes I have my mind up, the last 16 games have done that!
Why have the wheels come of so badly ?

I'm not saying these guys are all superb players , nothing of the sort but they are shells of the players they were at other clubs.

I'm not in the know either..
Although maybe an interesting development to come in the next week or so..

I asked Mickey Weir via twitter why he thought players that had formerly shined elsewhere didn't make it at Hibs and he said he wish he knew but thought it might be due to them not quite realising how big a club Hibs is.

Have the management placed demands on the players that they cannot meet?
Maybe TB is sorting out the players who'll have what's needed to take us forward next season in that sense you can understand why he's changed the team (esp in the absence of results) to see how they cope with the demands. No poin taking passengers into next season if we can at all a our it. Maybe MM is making life difficult for those who are on a contract but on a decent wedge and we want to get shod which is bound to be uncomfortable if folks wanted to settle into the "cocoon" of EM.

Who knows difficult to second guess the management but you have to think they have a plan - albeit one that's probably been revised with the twists and turns recently!

lucky
30-04-2014, 06:56 AM
Hibs players hated JC and went to Rodders
Yogi was accused on here of bullying and having a clique
PF's training was boring as his style football and the players laughed at Liam O'Brien called him a Dublin taxi driver
TB and MM are *******s to the player they won't listen and make the players do push ups


Seems over the years our players don't like very much including winning, staying out trouble, matching the effort of other teams.

I'm sick of reading about players moaning about the management team. The performances under TB have been shocking. But FFS some of our players need to grow up. Apart from KT and BW they are at the biggest clubs of their careers and are about to fine themselves getting emptied from Hibs.

mjhibby
30-04-2014, 07:06 AM
Yet again when things are going badly stories leak out that it's the mangers fault for our troubles. I'm sick to death of hearing this,as in my job as I'm sure we all do in our jobs,have to put up with bosses we don't like. The difference with football players is if they do the business on the park then they will be picked every week. This blaming the manager when it goes wrong is utter nonsense. This excuse that players are being asked to do things they can't doesn't wash either. Do you think. Tb and mm did that at Inverness. The common thing here is the players. How come mixu had us playing turgid stuff then he goes to killie they were great to watch. The revolt behind Collins back. It all points to the players making excuses. Stop running to the press et all and do the business on the park. With the squad we have we shouldn't be where we are and to keep blaming the managers is ridiculous. When will we as a club ever learn. Rant over.

Winston Ingram
30-04-2014, 07:16 AM
:agree: Agreed - 20 push ups SHOULD be an utter piece of pish to any one of them - if it's not then they're not fit enough and Maurice should chuck in an extra 20 star jumps for good measure.

Aye cos the push ups are the issue here. Clearly they're just work shy bassa's and should at least negotiate them down to 10. :rolleyes:

J-C
30-04-2014, 07:28 AM
Hibs players hated JC and went to Rodders
Yogi was accused on here of bullying and having a clique
PF's training was boring as his style football and the players laughed at Liam O'Brien called him a Dublin taxi driver
TB and MM are *******s to the player they won't listen and make the players do push ups


Seems over the years our players don't like very much including winning, staying out trouble, matching the effort of other teams.

I'm sick of reading about players moaning about the management team. The performances under TB have been shocking. But FFS some of our players need to grow up. Apart from KT and BW they are at the biggest clubs of their careers and are about to fine themselves getting emptied from Hibs.


This all happens because we continually change management, usually mid season, so any new manager is left with these same work shy bunch of losers. Unfortunately we can't just get rid if these players in one go, as many are on longer contracts and too dear to pay them off, so the new manager has to work with prior managers players and a few of his own, then the rot sets in again.

Beefster
30-04-2014, 07:29 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.

Sudds_1
30-04-2014, 07:48 AM
Is depression really on the rise in football or are people just more willing to acknowledge it?

Was 'bullying' not far more accepted in days gone by than it is today so surely it ahould have been worse back then.

Maybe Butcher and Malpas are a bit old school, maybe they do need to mellow a little bit but this kind of stuff is relentless at the moment and it only seems to have appeared since this poor run started. I don't recall hearing anything about it at ICT.

Think I might be ok being depressed on 3k a week plus plenty time off.......................:rolleyes:

Gettin' Auld
30-04-2014, 07:54 AM
Bullied?

FFS.......Aye having to do a few press ups at a friggin training session is being bullied. With an attitude like that, neither wonder Hibs are as soft as *****.

I questioned a manager once and spent the rest of the training session sweeping the terracing. It was a maistake i never made a second time.

Those players shouldn't question the manager/coach anyway. Plus some press-ups for doing it is hardly capital punishment.

easty
30-04-2014, 08:01 AM
I'm not in the know either..
Although maybe an interesting development to come in the next week or so..

You're not in the know, but there might be an interesting development in the next weeks?

stantonhibby
30-04-2014, 08:02 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.


Spot On.

Callum_62
30-04-2014, 08:02 AM
Yes I have my mind up, the last 16 games have done that!

Although maybe an interesting development to come in the next week or so..

What might that be??

Paloschi
30-04-2014, 08:02 AM
The 'scout' who must be murder considering the faces we have seen through the door recently must just be bitter. Fenlon too. I imagine Pat as an angry wee man blaming everyone but himself.

I'm also sick of the players moaning about the management every god damn season! Be professional FFS. Too many soft wee babies that get paid to play football and simply don't play football.

Malpas wants them to do push ups, then do it. Simple as that.

On the subject of scouting i've been at a loss as to why we never scout foreign leagues and cast the net wider. Instead we pick up bargain basement English/Irish players from the lower leagues or SPL pros that turn into wee lassies at Hibs.

I'd like to see us looking at the lower divisions in Spain, Italy, Holland, France and even South America/Africa - the cost of subsidising may be high to see the players in action but we would reap the rewards. Benji and Zemmama were hidden gems, De La Cruz a bit less so but these are the type of players we should be looking for. :agree:

IberianHibernian
30-04-2014, 08:20 AM
The 'scout' who must be murder considering the faces we have seen through the door recently must just be bitter. Fenlon too. I imagine Pat as an angry wee man blaming everyone but himself.

I'm also sick of the players moaning about the management every god damn season! Be professional FFS. Too many soft wee babies that get paid to play football and simply don't play football.

Malpas wants them to do push ups, then do it. Simple as that.

On the subject of scouting i've been at a loss as to why we never scout foreign leagues and cast the net wider. Instead we pick up bargain basement English/Irish players from the lower leagues or SPL pros that turn into wee lassies at Hibs.

I'd like to see us looking at the lower divisions in Spain, Italy, Holland, France and even South America/Africa - the cost of subsidising may be high to see the players in action but we would reap the rewards. Benji and Zemmama were hidden gems, De La Cruz a bit less so but these are the type of players we should be looking for. :agree:Agree about casting the net wider with scouting . New policy seems to be to look for gems in lower divisions in England . Not sure how we got Zoubir but suppose his agent will have offered him to clubs for trials . When John Park was at ER we did look further afield but I suppose we had more money and Scottish League had a slightly better reputation than now ( more games televised abroad etc ) . Didn`t scout mentioned in OP join us in autumn so not responsible for signings ? He was part of a longer - term plan to improve scouting so may have good reason to be disappointed at how things worked out .

flash
30-04-2014, 08:20 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.
Correct. This forum stinks of self interest these days.

s.a.m
30-04-2014, 08:26 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.


Exactly how I feel.

Geo_1875
30-04-2014, 08:32 AM
Both of these guys earned respect through their results. There are plenty of old-school shouters in football, you need something else (as well) to be successful and earn automatic respect.

But did they not shout before they achieved success?

bawheid
30-04-2014, 08:37 AM
Bloody Malpas. Hated by everyone at ICT...ehhhh.... Except all the players who wanted him to stay as manager.

matty_f
30-04-2014, 08:37 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.

I posted something similar in the pm board a few days ago. I'm at the point where I'd much rather stand up for my football team than sit and snipe at everything about it.

GlenrothesHibee
30-04-2014, 08:37 AM
And I thought we rid the club of bullying since the naked chicken dance/****** bib days.

matty_f
30-04-2014, 08:38 AM
Bloody Malpas. Hated by everyone at ICT...ehhhh.... Except all the players who wanted him to stay as manager.

And the board there, who offered him first dibs on Butcher's old job.

jonty
30-04-2014, 09:56 AM
I posted something similar in the pm board a few days ago. I'm at the point where I'd much rather stand up for my football team than sit and snipe at everything about it.

Well will you bloody sit down, I cant see whats happening.


(oh for the days when that was the only moan heard in the stands)

Hibrandenburg
30-04-2014, 10:12 AM
This all happens because we continually change management, usually mid season, so any new manager is left with these same work shy bunch of losers. Unfortunately we can't just get rid if these players in one go, as many are on longer contracts and too dear to pay them off, so the new manager has to work with prior managers players and a few of his own, then the rot sets in again.

In a nutshell!

Even if it takes several years to eradicate the the rot, it's a process we need to go through before we can truly move forward.

(((Fergus)))
30-04-2014, 10:51 AM
But did they not shout before they achieved success?

Shouting wasn't the only thing they had in their locker - at any time - and if you have nothing else there then you have nothing to shout about in the first place. People sense that very quickly and that's when the respect you hope to gain through shouting turns to contempt - and rightly so.

blackpoolhibs
30-04-2014, 10:56 AM
This chief scout probably brought us or recommended a lot of the dross we currently see trying to perform each week in a team thats facing its 2nd relegation battle in 3 seasons.


Tweetings for twats, and he's gave us more than our fair share of them.

Lago
30-04-2014, 10:58 AM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.

Totally agree. There is a bitterness about the statements on here and from the fans at ER that I never experienced when I started going to ER in 1971.

.Sean.
30-04-2014, 11:37 AM
The players are a bunch of pansies and the quicker these gutless, spineless imposters are punted the better.

Id keep Robertson, Stevenson, Thomson, Stanton, Cummings, Harris, Forster and Hanlon, the rest can get themselves to ****. Heartless losers.

8 players in the squad I reckon are worth keeping. The rest will find their level in the first division.

GreenLake
30-04-2014, 11:43 AM
Totally agree. There is a bitterness about the statements on here and from the fans at ER that I never experienced when I started going to ER in 1971.

It makes you wonder if some of these statements are from sock puppets of disgruntled players or former staff members. How can anyone think that third rate footballers struggling to perform have a right bestowed upon them to question the coaches appointed by those that pay their wages. I don't see anyone playing at the level of Carlos Tevez to take on that kind of argument. Who in our team would be picked to play in the second rate level of the English Championship? Maybe some of our younger lads in a year or two but I bet it isn't them doing the questioning.

MrSmith
30-04-2014, 11:55 AM
I posted something similar in the pm board a few days ago. I'm at the point where I'd much rather stand up for my football team than sit and snipe at everything about it.

Agree! Seems the whole HMFC episode with their timely escape and our inability to beat them has caused so much angst that some of us are a little confused about what it means to support our team.

Obviously,

things aint great
got some poor players
cannae buy a win
cannea score
cannea beat a crap hearts team
they've escaped liquidation or whatever!
we are staring relegation in the face

How much worse can it get? I've seen it much worse as many others, who stood on the old East Terrace shaking their heads beside me, have too however, TB and MM, I'm sure, will see us through this tough time and improve us next season.

Whilst others are sniping and mocking us, we need to be strong and pull together!

Hibrandenburg
30-04-2014, 12:10 PM
Agree! Seems the whole HMFC episode with their timely escape and our inability to beat them has caused so much angst that some of us are a little confused about what it means to support our team.

Obviously,

things aint great
got some poor players
cannae buy a win
cannea score
cannea beat a crap hearts team
they've escaped liquidation or whatever!
we are staring relegation in the face

How much worse can it get? I've seen it much worse as many others, who stood on the old East Terrace shaking their heads beside me, have too however, TB and MM, I'm sure, will see us through this tough time and improve us next season.

Whilst others are sniping and mocking us, we need to be strong and pull together!

:agree:

Loyalty, unity and positivity is what we need. The downward spiral of negativity has to be stopped. This season can't end quickly enough for me, need to learn from the past but also leave it behind us.

Danderhall Hibs
30-04-2014, 04:15 PM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.

Same here. Good post mate.

Let's bully the negative folk off of here!

hibbysam
30-04-2014, 04:24 PM
The players are a bunch of pansies and the quicker these gutless, spineless imposters are punted the better.

Id keep Robertson, Stevenson, Thomson, Stanton, Cummings, Harris, Forster and Hanlon, the rest can get themselves to ****. Heartless losers.

8 players in the squad I reckon are worth keeping. The rest will find their level in the first division.

The exact same players as I'd have in my squad next season Sean! Add 7 or 8 new faces and promote youth players along with Boothy slotting back in as well!

jeffers
30-04-2014, 04:40 PM
Given the chat from Fenlon and now his scout, I'd like to think that this isn't a conscious thing to try and repair their reputation and trash the club at the same time. Especially from such a 'good guy'™.

However, the number of folk on here that seem to be actively willing Butcher and Malpas (and even Dempster before she's started) to fail is just thoroughly depressing. I thought that Calderwood and Fenlon were useless long before they left but didn't resort to calling them "tubes/twats/fannies/cretins/whatever".

It's incredible but I'm more hacked off with the sniping, cynicism and schadenfreude that goes on on here at almost every opportunity (from a minority) than I am with what I'm having to suffer every game. I'm not known for being the cheeriest ****er about Hibs either but it's been taken to a new level on here recently.

I cannot comment on what David Henderson said nor his motives but you are way off the mark with regards PF. My mate who is also a Hibby hadn't spoken with him for a while. When he did he asked him about his time at Hibs. I found what he said interesting and thought it worth sharing even if I didn't necessarily agree with all of it. PF loved his time at Hibs, loves the club but he admitted he got things wrong and resigned because of it. Your opinion and you are entitled to it, but my opinion is he didn't come across as bitter, wasn't trying to repair his reputation, nor did he say anything, again imo, that trashed the club.

sleeping giant
30-04-2014, 04:46 PM
I posted something similar in the pm board a few days ago. I'm at the point where I'd much rather stand up for my football team than sit and snipe at everything about it.

Super post and I fully agree.
We know where we are and we know what we need.
Mob the Hibs.