Making Hibs a high-performing football club - What roles and talents do you need?

[RIP]

For the past six or seven years we had a few posters striving to identify the roles required in a high performance Football Club and apply it to Hibs. How's this as a starter for ten - feel free to suggest amendments?

Role 1 - Owner

Shares a strong bond with the history & traditions of the football club
Makes econmic sustainability and security their primary goal
Takes an active interest in the performance of the club
Has a strong track record of business success
Has the financial capital to support the organisation over a long period


Role 2 - Chairman

Displays a real passion for the club
Has a strong track record of business success
Is an excellent leader and communicator
Appoints a strong team of directors with experience of similar organisations
Evidences robust corporate governance
Formulates a rolling 5-year plan
Sets financial targets for club to operate within
Communicates vision to shareholders and supporters at AGM


Role 3 - Managing Director or Chief Executive

Works within the 5-year plan set by the board
Responsible for football success and business results
Dynamic leader and people manager
Displays a passion for the club - develops its history, community and vision
Responsible for the football product and customer satisfaction
Responsible for overall football performance (including academy), squad-building strategy and hiring of coaching teams
Builds a high performance organisation - skills, training, fitness, discipline
Excellent communicator to supporters and wider media


Role 4 - Manager or First-Team Coach

Responsible for first-team squad
Dynamic leader of coaches and players
Displays a passion for the club
Aims to deliver a football style that matches the vision for the club
Responsible for results of the first team
Interacts regularly with supporters and the community
Builds a bond between players and supporters
Excellent communicator


Other competencies to add?

[Humo]

Role 5


Decent players

Strikers with the ability to score
Midfielders who can pass and have a good first touch
Defenders who know what they are doing

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Gogs are you a manager in your own work place?

[ancient hibee]

Strangely enough all the attributes of the people at old Rangers.

[Pete]

Gogs are you a manager in your own work place?

The use of bullet points suggests he is. :-D

As for the subject...I don't have a clue. When did association football become so complicated?

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

In my experience when people constantly hear/read middle management buzzwords they tend to just switch off.

[oregonhibby]

Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business.

In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[RIP]

When did association football become so complicated?

As far as I know every major club in world football has this structure - whether privately or community owned


Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business. In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.

What evidence do you have for that assumption? We don't currently have all 4 roles, although smaller clubs in the SPL do. Since Hyland and Lindsay left I think Rod's tried to make do with 3.

Bullets are the best way to make a list - my teenage son taught me that :greengrin

[oregonhibby]

This is why I said maybe! The symptoms are there and why the LWT are working to find solutions.

It is a hunch having worked in now both large and smaller organisations and on the Boards of similar sized organisations.

I am not sure it was an assumption but more an observation having worked for 35 years in Organisation Design and HR.

[marinello59]

Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business.

In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

You might just have put your finger on it there.
Fitba is a simple game after all.

[truehibernian]

Not thinking reaching finals is 'success'. Only winning them is - that's the issue at Hibs for me. Their (Boards) definition of success doesn't relate to mine.

For example, football success is top 6 minimum for a club our size. I'll wager Rod already sees the possibility of another home derby as cushioning the blow.

We are a club that simply accept mediocrity - even our 'protests' this season were not too dissimilar to our team on the pitch - lacked desire and leadership !

Board needs revamped and refreshed to take it into the modern era - a fresh, vibrant, dynamic face whose energy and visible passion for the game matches Terry's and our team (hopefully).

[Iggy Pope]

In my experience when people constantly hear/read middle management buzzwords they tend to just switch off.

Words like 'buzwords'?

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Never heard them called anything else, feel free to provide an alternative that suits you.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Never heard them called anything else

I suppose I have but, the words would just show up as ****

[Weststandwanab]

Role 5


Decent players

Strikers with the ability to score
Midfielders who can pass and have a good first touch
Defenders who know what they are doingShould that not be role 1 ?


Strangely enough all the attributes of the people at old Rangers.Is that the soon to be old The Rangers ?


In my experience when people constantly hear/read middle management buzzwords they tend to just switch off.I have.


As far as I know every major club in world football has this structure - whether privately or community owned



What evidence do you have for that assumption? We don't currently have all 4 roles, although smaller clubs in the SPL do. Since Hyland and Lindsay left I think Rod's tried to make do with 3.

Bullets are the best way to make a list - my teenage son taught me that :greengrin Bullets are the best way to shoot the messenger

[Pete]

As far as I know every major club in world football has this structure - whether privately or community owned

What about the major clubs with a director of football?

If you have the individuals who are capable of making it work using three roles then why have a fourth? Is it not better to use the salary that you would be spending on an unnecessary suit on players instead?

[ronaldo7]

Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business.

In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

:agree:

[Beefster]

In my experience when people constantly hear/read middle management buzzwords they tend to just switch off.

Going forward, I propose that we raise your comment up the flagpole and see who salutes.

[RIP]

What about the major clubs with a director of football?

Role 3

[RIP]

If you have the individuals who are capable of making it work using three roles then why have a fourth?

Is it not better to use the salary that you would be spending on an unnecessary suit on players instead?

So that's the gamble we are taking. How well would you say that's gone in recent years?

As for the unnecessary suit, what do you know about the impact Leean Dempster has had on Motherwell, a club half our size?

[Jack]

28 bullet points and only one mentions the supporters and even then 'with a common touch'.

Hit the nail on the head there with wrong with our club.

The supporter is an afterthought and treated with disdain.

OK that might be a bit tight but that's how it seems all too often.

As you have said often yourself Gogs the club is the supporters and the current owners and such folk transient gatekeepers ... who will be consigned to history while the support will always be current.

[BroxburnHibee]

Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business.

In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

:top marks

[Pete]

So that's the gamble we are taking. How well would you say that's gone in recent years?

As for the unnecessary suit, what do you know about the impact Leean Dempster has had on Motherwell, a club half our size?

I know they've been better than us for a while but I'm not sure how much of that is down to her. Like I said, I'm no expert.

http://www.rafabenitez.com/web/in/blog/football-clubs-structure-rafa-benitezs-view/57/

Rafa uses pictures so newbies like myself can understand a bit better.:greengrin

[Alfred E Newman]

Roll6

Decent fans. :greengrin

[RIP]

I know they've been better than us for a while but I'm not sure how much of that is down to her. Like I said, I'm no expert.

http://www.rafabenitez.com/web/in/blog/football-clubs-structure-rafa-benitezs-view/57/

Rafa uses pictures so newbies like myself can understand a bit better.:greengrin

I read Rafa a lot. Good leadership starts from the top. You could have Sir Alex Ferguson in role 4 but if the management above don't show the same energy, vision and high performance culture he would face an uphill battle.

[Jonnyboy]

Maybe the club has become too corporate. A return to simpler times but with the financial controls might be best. It is only a £5-7m turnover business.

In becoming too corporate it has lost touch with its roots, it's customer base and it's purpose.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

This :agree:

[bobbyhibs1983]

role 5-- hibernian player

should be in great shape both phisyically(sp) and mentally
Will follow managers intructions
will train 5 days a week for 3 hours a day-though if midweek game this should
come down to 3 days per week

will act in a professional manner
will aim to be the best that they can be
A strong desire to be a champion

Very intresting points raised by other memebers,I think what truehibernian said about us accepting mediocrity is spot on and should not in any way shape or form be accpepted

[Purple & Green]

role 5-- hibernian player

should be in great shape both phisyically(sp) and mentally
Will follow managers intructions
will train 5 days a week for 3 hours a day-though if midweek game this should
come down to 3 days per week

will act in a professional manner
will aim to be the best that they can be
A strong desire to be a champion

Very intresting points raised by other memebers,I think what truehibernian said about us accepting mediocrity is spot on and should not in any way shape or form be accpepted

I take some of the points above, but I personally think that Hibs are actually exceptionally well run on most levels. Where we are falling down is (again IMHO) in our player recruitment.

Now, there several layers who interact with the players - Personnel contract them, finance pay them, coaches train them, managers play them. Should it be solely down to the manager to identify players? Probably not - and psychometric testing might reap rewards. Who decides on age group player recruitment - is it a manager who is likely to be here for less than a year?

Thinking back to the AGM Rod Petrie was mocked for stating Hibs aim at the start of every season was to win every game. I've just finished a book by Steve Peters who is taking over as Psychologist for the England Football Team, and I think I now understand where Rod's coming from. If we can get the players right...

[FranckSuzy]

Making Hibs a high-performing football club - What roles and talents do you need?
1) Knowing when to walk away.

[bobbyhibs1983]

I take some of the points above, but I personally think that Hibs are actually exceptionally well run on most levels. Where we are falling down is (again IMHO) in our player recruitment.

Now, there several layers who interact with the players - Personnel contract them, finance pay them, coaches train them, managers play them. Should it be solely down to the manager to identify players? Probably not - and psychometric testing might reap rewards. Who decides on age group player recruitment - is it a manager who is likely to be here for less than a year?

Thinking back to the AGM Rod Petrie was mocked for stating Hibs aim at the start of every season was to win every game. I've just finished a book by Steve Peters who is taking over as Psychologist for the England Football Team, and I think I now understand where Rod's coming from. If we can get the players right...


I agree with quite a few points you have made.AS a club , we are extreamly well run as you have stated.
As i had missed and i think you have touched on is the players mindset.Im unsure how you would test,go about it though, as you say england have a Psychologist helping them, do we hire someone like that?
I tihnk it is both the chairmen(or women if it ever happens) and the manager who should maybe say to whoever player coming in, this is our aim and this is what we expect.If the char person and manager feel,think they cant get what they want from the player then the deal should not happen

I wasn't at the agm but may i ask why rod petrie was mocked for wanting hibs to win every game ?
and whom did the mocking?

surely every hibs players, manager,coach, hibs fan wants to win every game?
I tihnk sometimes as a whole, maybe some people within the club and maybe some of us, as fans have been guilty of going into a game thinking or feeling we will lose or we would be *happy* with a point(one of my most hated phrases i may add).

I guess it is something that needs to be addressed asap imo of course

[ancient hibee]

At the AGM Rod was attacked from the floor for a lack of ambition.So he asked the questioner what we should be aiming for -to be told we should be going for second place.Rod asked him-why not go for first-which floored the guy who then laughed-which showed who had the lack of ambition.Rod then said that the desire was to win every game what else should it be?People who were ready to criticise him were then muttering about a ridiculous ambition!

[bobbyhibs1983]

At the AGM Rod was attacked from the floor for a lack of ambition.So he asked the questioner what we should be aiming for -to be told we should be going for second place.Rod asked him-why not go for first-which floored the guy who then laughed-which showed who had the lack of ambition.Rod then said that the desire was to win every game what else should it be?People who were ready to criticise him were then muttering about a ridiculous ambition!


if it was a repsonse to a question i had asked in my post then thank you for taking the time to let me know!

I tihnk that should be the aim for hibs though(though i think maybe 3 other teams would be in the same mindset), win every game, win the league and the cups,i know unlikely but i would rather have a go and winning everytihng than not having a go and winning nothing

[MurrayfieldHibs]

At the AGM Rod was attacked from the floor for a lack of ambition.So he asked the questioner what we should be aiming for -to be told we should be going for second place.Rod asked him-why not go for first-which floored the guy who then laughed-which showed who had the lack of ambition.Rod then said that the desire was to win every game what else should it be?People who were ready to criticise him were then muttering about a ridiculous ambition!

Chucking back a question like “why not first” is a typical bluster defence tactic. It is totally unrealistic from where Hibs are now and have been for a number of years.
Rod did a great job of stabilising Hibs and building a platform for the future by capitalising on footballing assets (Brown, Thomson, Whittaker etc) at the right time. Unfortunately he has stayed on several years past his “use by date”.
We need a new Chairman with a different leadership style to take the club to the next level. Rod’s focus is a typical accountants approach (apologies to accountants reading this) focussed on the books and balance sheet. What we need is someone with more of an entrepreneurial flair who understands that football is more than P&L it is about emotion, belonging, camaraderie, success, celebration, bragging rights.
The Leader of the organisation develops the vision and provides the focus and drive to achieve that vision. I do not get the feeling that Rod feels the way we do about the club, I do not believe he has the same emotional attachment to the club and our results. It is time for Rod to announce a successor so our great club can flourish.

:hibees

[Nailrod]

<snip> It is time for Rod to announce a successor so our great club can flourish.

Would your preference be for Scott Lindsay or Fyfe Hyland?

No? Well how about that beancounty woman? Or the other guy - wotsisname.

[smurf]

Keep reading that we are a well run club. How are we if we are consistently underachieving?

[marinello59]

Keep reading that we are a well run club. How are we if we are consistently underachieving?

We could claim to be well run in that we have good solid foundations in place. But you are right, we have lost our way over the past few years when it comes to the primary purpose of a football club.

[green day]

We could claim to be well run in that we have good solid foundations in place. But you are right, we have lost our way over the past few years when it comes to the primary purpose of a football club.

Score goals, Entertain, Win games

.....Would be a good starting point for us

[Saorsa]

We could claim to be well run in that we have good solid foundations in place. But you are right, we have lost our way over the past few years when it comes to the primary purpose of a football club.Lost our way! That's being kind.

There's little point tae the rest of it if naebody wants tae watch it and the numbers continue tae decline.

[marinello59]

Lost our way! That's being kind.

There's little point tae the rest of it if naebody wants tae watch it and the numbers continue tae decline.

I know. I'm feeling mellow this morning. :greengrin

[oregonhibby]

The Club is a well run business in that it has a solid financial footing and is managed prudently.

The football side has consistently under performed.


There is no to low elasticity of demand as the customers (supporters) won't go elsewhere and the Club relies on this and benefits from our patience while we wait for the messiah to come and give us the football we want.


Quite a nice business model. The strategy of changing the manager and players every 18 months keeps us keen and coming back. Providing the seasons don't drop below a key number and the overall gates maintain a reasonable average, we are distracted by events elsewhere, we have to put up with the dross we are getting.


Every now and again a manager gets something to work and we are satisfied for a short time, which feeds the expectation that it could happen again!!


Don't expect the model to change soon. Mediocrity at all levels means stability and that is all that is required at our Club. We do not judge our Club as a business unless we laugh at the neighbours or one of the infirm. Being the 2nd most successful business that pays its bills merely hides the fact that we have been a crap fitba team for too long.


The question is what needs to change to make that better. We change the team and the manager and it seldom helps.

[Saorsa]

I know. I'm feeling mellow this morning. :greengrinHave you predicted todays score yet on the PM board? :greengrin

[Saorsa]

The question is what needs to change to make that better. We change the team and the manager and it seldom helps.:hmmm: Change something else then :wink:

[Onion]

Chucking back a question like “why not first” is a typical bluster defence tactic. It is totally unrealistic from where Hibs are now and have been for a number of years.
Rod did a great job of stabilising Hibs and building a platform for the future by capitalising on footballing assets (Brown, Thomson, Whittaker etc) at the right time. Unfortunately he has stayed on several years past his “use by date”.
We need a new Chairman with a different leadership style to take the club to the next level. Rod’s focus is a typical accountants approach (apologies to accountants reading this) focussed on the books and balance sheet. What we need is someone with more of an entrepreneurial flair who understands that football is more than P&L it is about emotion, belonging, camaraderie, success, celebration, bragging rights.
The Leader of the organisation develops the vision and provides the focus and drive to achieve that vision. I do not get the feeling that Rod feels the way we do about the club, I do not believe he has the same emotional attachment to the club and our results. It is time for Rod to announce a successor so our great club can flourish.

:hibees

I was with you right up to the last point. No way should Rod Petrie be involved in selecting or even announcing his replacement. I wouldn't trust him to hire a cleaner.

[Weststandwanab]

The Club is a well run business in that it has a solid financial footing and is managed prudently.

The football side has consistently under performed.


There is no to low elasticity of demand as the customers (supporters) won't go elsewhere and the Club relies on this and benefits from our patience while we wait for the messiah to come and give us the football we want.


Quite a nice business model. The strategy of changing the manager and players every 18 months keeps us keen and coming back. Providing the seasons don't drop below a key number and the overall gates maintain a reasonable average, we are distracted by events elsewhere, we have to put up with the dross we are getting.


Every now and again a manager gets something to work and we are satisfied for a short time, which feeds the expectation that it could happen again!!


Don't expect the model to change soon. Mediocrity at all levels means stability and that is all that is required at our Club. We do not judge our Club as a business unless we laugh at the neighbours or one of the infirm. Being the 2nd most successful business that pays its bills merely hides the fact that we have been a crap fitba team for too long.


The question is what needs to change to make that better. We change the team and the manager and it seldom helps.
That is a great post which I have to agree with.

[marinello59]

Have you predicted todays score yet on the PM board? :greengrin

I just have but I am breaking with tradition and will get this one right. Maybe. :greengrin

[Saorsa]

I just have but I am breaking with tradition and will get this one right. Maybe. :greengrinI was hoping maybe you were going tae pick us tae lose today. :wink: :greengrin

[Saorsa]

I was with you right up to the last point. No way should Rod Petrie be involved in selecting or even announcing his replacement. I wouldn't trust him to hire a cleaner.C'mon, be fair, He'd only have tae go through about 6 or 7 tae maybe get it right.

[marinello59]

The Club is a well run business in that it has a solid financial footing and is managed prudently.

The football side has consistently under performed.


There is no to low elasticity of demand as the customers (supporters) won't go elsewhere and the Club relies on this and benefits from our patience while we wait for the messiah to come and give us the football we want.


Quite a nice business model. The strategy of changing the manager and players every 18 months keeps us keen and coming back. Providing the seasons don't drop below a key number and the overall gates maintain a reasonable average, we are distracted by events elsewhere, we have to put up with the dross we are getting.


Every now and again a manager gets something to work and we are satisfied for a short time, which feeds the expectation that it could happen again!!


Don't expect the model to change soon. Mediocrity at all levels means stability and that is all that is required at our Club. We do not judge our Club as a business unless we laugh at the neighbours or one of the infirm. Being the 2nd most successful business that pays its bills merely hides the fact that we have been a crap fitba team for too long.


The question is what needs to change to make that better. We change the team and the manager and it seldom helps.

What needs to change? Attitude.
Being the second most successful business in our league should mean nothing compared to what is happening on the pitch. Anybody here read Moneyball by Michael Lewis? He describes how the Oakland Athletics attempted to produce a competitive side despite the sport being dominated by a handful of financial heavyweights. There is one passage which jumped out at me, quoted below.
''Of course, no one in pro sports ever admits to quitting. But at the same time it was perfectly acceptable to abandon all hope of winning and at the same time show up every week for work to collect a paycheck. Professional sports had a word for this. Rebuilding.''

That's where we seem to be. Constantly rebuilding, to survive as a business is enough, success on the field is secondary.

[matty_f]

What needs to change? Attitude.
Being the second most successful business in our league should mean nothing compared to what is happening on the pitch. Anybody here read Moneyball by Michael Lewis? He describes how the Oakland Athletics attempted to produce a competitive side despite the sport being dominated by a handful of financial heavyweights. There is one passage which jumped out at me, quoted below.
''Of course, no one in pro sports ever admits to quitting. But at the same time it was perfectly acceptable to abandon all hope of winning and at the same time show up every week for work to collect a paycheck. Professional sports had a word for this. Rebuilding.''

That's where we seem to be. Constantly rebuilding, to survive as a business is enough, success on the field is secondary.

I've made this point directly to the board before, it's not enough just to survive, as noble as that sentiment is given the history of the club being on the brink of extinction.
The attitude does have to change, flippant remarks about winning every game aren't going to change things. As unrealistic as it may be, and with the risk of putting yourself up there to be ridiculed, there should be an ambition and target to be the best team, and you work back from the ambition to work out what needs to happen to realise the ambition.
I don't think we are in that space as a club. I genuinely do think the board care about results and where we are in the league, the suggestion otherwise in the thread earlier that they don't is just ridiculous. We wouldn't go through the managerial changes if they didn't. I just don't see that there is a solid enough plan to achieve what the support want to achieve, and there is an acceptance of where we are which is a potentially big club that's not likely to get relegated and won't trouble the top of the League. There's no expectation that success should come to us, or targets of good cup runs and as high up the League as we can don't stretch anyone.

I would like to see a fresh face in charge at the top, someone who is completely driven to make Hibernian a team that is known throughout Europe again.

[Bobby's Cinema]

We surely need a change at the top.

Correct me if it is misplaced, but all I feel at the minute is absolute resentment at the way we have been managed as a club for the last few years and how the vast vast amounts of money has been spent.

We do not win football matches at Easter Road. It's not apathy from me It's anger. Another season in the bottom six after this one is unthinkable and our board need accountability.

[Saorsa]

We surely need a change at the top.

Correct me if it is misplaced, but all I feel at the minute is absolute resentment at the way we have been managed as a club for the last few years and how the vast vast amounts of money has been spent.

We do not win football matches at Easter Road. It's not apathy from me It's anger. Another season in the bottom six after this one is unthinkable and our board need accountability.unfortunately there is none and if it does happen again it will be somebody/something else's fault as usual.

[lyonhibs]

Is it just me, or are there some folk on this thread making fitba an awfully complex game??

[matty_f]

Is it just me, or are there some folk on this thread making fitba an awfully complex game??

I don't think so, we're not in the days of jumpers for goalposts, we live in an era where there are loads of demands on a football club that aren't just about what happens on the pitch.

The question at the start is (imho) about asking what roles a club of our size needs and, I suppose by implication, whether or not we have it right just now.

[Onion]

At the AGM Rod was attacked from the floor for a lack of ambition.So he asked the questioner what we should be aiming for -to be told we should be going for second place.Rod asked him-why not go for first-which floored the guy who then laughed-which showed who had the lack of ambition.Rod then said that the desire was to win every game what else should it be?People who were ready to criticise him were then muttering about a ridiculous ambition!

What a complete horses-arse Rod Petrie is. It is absolutely typical of an arrogant megalomaniac to turn the question onto the person asking the question. No less than a form of bullying.

And aiming for 2nd place in the current set up (with no Huns or Hearts) is a wholly realistic target, given the club's size, turnover and world class infrastructure :wink: Petrie's crass comment about taking each game as it comes is a cop out and sums up our Great Leader perfectly.

[Speedway]

The footballing 'side' to the 'business' is the only 'side'. Everything else is ancillary in supporting and funding 'sporting success'.

[matty_f]

The footballing 'side' to the 'business' is the only 'side'. Everything else is ancillary in supporting and funding 'sporting success'.

:agree:

[Jonnyboy]

With all respect to the OP and all of those involved in LWT who give of their time in an effort to improve things for us all, I've seen it all before and I've seen it all fall on deaf ears before. I venture to suggest that the vast majority of Hibs fans care little for balance sheets, mission statements and the like and only really care about what we watch on a Saturday afternoon (and all the other crazy kick off times). Of course we have to have financial stability but as paying customers we deserve to see our team give of its best. "We must live within our means" is often declared and I'd wager that no Hibs fan wants the club to incur unmanageable debt but a loosening of the purse strings to bring in better quality players would see improved performances and might just tempt some fans back to watch.

I commend the LWT fans because they are trying to help the club but the onus should not be on them alone to move us forward

[Hibercelona]

With all respect to the OP and all of those involved in LWT who give of their time in an effort to improve things for us all, I've seen it all before and I've seen it all fall on deaf ears before. I venture to suggest that the vast majority of Hibs fans care little for balance sheets, mission statements and the like and only really care about what we watch on a Saturday afternoon (and all the other crazy kick off times). Of course we have to have financial stability but as paying customers we deserve to see our team give of its best. "We must live within our means" is often declared and I'd wager that no Hibs fan wants the club to incur unmanageable debt but a loosening of the purse strings to bring in better quality players would see improved performances and might just tempt some fans back to watch.

I commend the LWT fans because they are trying to help the club but the onus should not be on them alone to move us forward

The thing is JB, with the amount of money that we spend on the squad already, we should already be sitting comfortably in the top 6, so there should be no need to loosen the purse strings.

Money isn't the key issue here.

[oregonhibby]

John

I am reminded of your Einstein quote.

Corporate governance can only be swallowed for so long. We want goals and glory.

Simple

[Jonnyboy]

The thing is JB, with the amount of money that we spend on the squad already, we should already be sitting comfortably in the top 6, so there should be no need to loosen the purse strings.

Money isn't the key issue here.

Not sure I agree! We're spending that money on poor players and we could pay them double but they'd still be poor :wink:


John

I am reminded of your Einstein quote.

Corporate governance can only be swallowed for so long. We want goals and glory.

Simple

:agree:

[down-the-slope]

With all respect to the OP and all of those involved in LWT who give of their time in an effort to improve things for us all, I've seen it all before and I've seen it all fall on deaf ears before. I venture to suggest that the vast majority of Hibs fans care little for balance sheets, mission statements and the like and only really care about what we watch on a Saturday afternoon (and all the other crazy kick off times). Of course we have to have financial stability but as paying customers we deserve to see our team give of its best. "We must live within our means" is often declared and I'd wager that no Hibs fan wants the club to incur unmanageable debt but a loosening of the purse strings to bring in better quality players would see improved performances and might just tempt some fans back to watch.

I commend the LWT fans because they are trying to help the club but the onus should not be on them alone to move us forward

Jonny - the assumption you (and may others with this viewpoint) are making is that there is in fact anything in the purse. The only money we have is what supporters and sponsors put in.

We as a club do not even have a bank overdraft facility (that's partly choice and partly how poorly banks view football) and cash flow ourselves from ST sales.

We have made large trading loses past couple of years - there is no more money.

The issue is how can we use what we do have better (or who can)

[Hibercelona]

Not sure I agree! We're spending that money on poor players and we could pay them double but they'd still be poor :wink:

That's exactly the point i'm making. :greengrin

Moneys not the issue here, it's the decision making that's the issue. We already spend somewhere in the region of 2-3x of that of most other clubs in the league. We shouldn't need to outspend them by an even greater margin, just to keep up with them.

[Jonnyboy]

Jonny - the assumption you (and may others with this viewpoint) are making is that there is in fact anything in the purse. The only money we have is what supporters and sponsors put in.

We as a club do not even have a bank overdraft facility (that's partly choice and partly how poorly banks view football) and cash flow ourselves from ST sales.

We have made large trading loses past couple of years - there is no more money.

The issue is how can we use what we do have better (or who can)

Sponsorship, SPFL monies, TV monies, sales of merchandise. Where's that money going then?

[The Falcon]

Folk do realise they can step forward at any time to buy the club, or form a group and buy the club, and then run it as they see fit solving all our problems in the process.

[Jonnyboy]

Folk do realise they can step forward at any time to buy the club, or form a group and buy the club, and then run it as they see fit solving all our problems in the process.

You can only buy it if the owner wants to sell. STF is on record as saying he'll only sell to a purchaser he approves of so I can't see it happening anytime soon

[Hibercelona]

Folk do realise they can step forward at any time to buy the club, or form a group and buy the club, and then run it as they see fit solving all our problems in the process.

Unless 10,000 fans are willing to cough up a couple of grand each, I can't see anything like this happening anytime soon.

[The Falcon]

You can only buy it if the owner wants to sell. STF is on record as saying he'll only sell to a purchaser he approves of so I can't see it happening anytime soon

If the offer was good enough the person would get public backing with their plans for Hibs.

[Phil D. Rolls]

I'd love to see Lorne Sausage rolls at the kiosks. :greengrin

[weonlywon6-2]

lots of money and fans that dont shout bad words at players

[RIP]

With all respect to the OP and all of those involved in LWT who give of their time in an effort to improve things for us all, I've seen it all before and I've seen it all fall on deaf ears before. I venture to suggest that the vast majority of Hibs fans care little for balance sheets, mission statements and the like and only really care about what we watch on a Saturday afternoon (and all the other crazy kick off times). Of course we have to have financial stability but as paying customers we deserve to see our team give of its best. "We must live within our means" is often declared and I'd wager that no Hibs fan wants the club to incur unmanageable debt but a loosening of the purse strings to bring in better quality players would see improved performances and might just tempt some fans back to watch.

I commend the LWT fans because they are trying to help the club but the onus should not be on them alone to move us forward

There are no LWT fans JC only Hibs supporters. LWT is a Gateway where Hibs organisations meet. Board, management, Hibernian Supporters Association, Community Foundation, Historical Trust, Former Players Association, Hibernians, Erin Trust, Dnipro Charity, Leith Links, nonaffiliated branches, Disabled Supporters.

Individual supporters are welcome too. Whoever wants to do something about improving our football club. Nothing is off limits.

[Jonnyboy]

There are no LWT fans JC only Hibs supporters. LWT is a Gateway where Hibs organisations meet. Board, management, Hibernian Supporters Association, Community Foundation, Historical Trust, Former Players Association, Hibernians, Erin Trust, Dnipro Charity, Leith Links, nonaffiliated branches, Disabled Supporters.

Individual supporters are welcome too. Whoever wants to do something about improving our football club. Nothing is off limits.

Like I said G, every respect to those giving their time

[Bostonhibby]

Sponsorship, SPFL monies, TV monies, sales of merchandise. Where's that money going then?

Over the last 4 seasons? Paying off sundry gash players and the managers who signed them?