Hibs Playing Style

[Jdawg]

Seems to be a lot of comments on here regarding our style ie: long ball. Whilst there has been some of that I think it's more direct than long.

Perhaps TB and MM adopting a certain style due to the players at his disposal?

From seeing the odd Inverness game and highlights TB has them playing some excellent football.

Once he gets the players he wants (and needs) into hibs I think we will have a more fluid style to our play while still being direct.

[J-C]

Seems to be a lot of comments on here regarding our style ie: long ball. Whilst there has been some of that I think it's more direct than long.

Perhaps BB and MM adopting a certain style due to the players at his disposal?

From seeing the odd Inverness game and highlights BB has them playing some excellent football.

Once he gets the players he wants (and needs) into hibs I think we will have a more fluid style to our play while still being direct.

Who's BB, think you mean TB :greengrin

[livi hibs 1875]

Hope your not calling big Tell a name like billy butcher , please no no no

[easty]

If it's a winning style I couldn't really care less right now.

[fat freddy]

I have never bought into this 'Hibs style' football myth. We played good stylish football for a brief spell in the early seventies then were dross until 1991 when we were pretty good on the eye until 94. Dross again until McLeish took over and then dross again until the golden generation broke through. In the forty odd years I've been watching Hibs there has been two types of football, winning football and losing football (or under Bertie Auld, drawing football)....I know which i prefer and i dont care what the style is as long as we stick the ball in the net.

edit.. apologies to the 85-88 team when the durie/kano/weir/collins generation broke through, they were good too.

[Andy74]

Seems to be a lot of comments on here regarding our style ie: long ball. Whilst there has been some of that I think it's more direct than long.

Perhaps BB and MM adopting a certain style due to the players at his disposal?

From seeing the odd Inverness game and highlights BB has them playing some excellent football.

Once he gets the players he wants (and needs) into hibs I think we will have a more fluid style to our play while still being direct.

One or two games I think we did begin just to launch balls forward but other than that I can see what he is doing - we are aiming to get the ball in the other half and begin our passing there and making sure that when we get the chance we get the ball in the box or have a shot.

Not sure it will work in all situations - sometimes you need to be able to hang onto the ball but for where we are now it is creating us opportunities.

[Stevie Reid]

In brief, we try to get the ball forward as quickly as possible and put teams under pressure as much as we can - there is some nice stuff being played in the final 3rd (and some other areas at times), but it doesn't look very pretty when the initial ball forward is poor.

However, it's certainly working for now. Whilst I do believe we played some nice stuff under Fenlon last season, there's no denying that latterly we were far too easy to play against, with the laboured and slow passing and no movement meaning that teams were always in their right shape and formation when we had the ball - the current way we are doing all we can to pull defences around the park and get in behind them as often as possible.

I do believe that it will get more refined over time as personnel changes, but at the moment it is pretty watchable, and is certainly leading to more excitement and more chances created.

[down-the-slope]

One or two games I think we did begin just to launch balls forward but other than that I can see what he is doing - we are aiming to get the ball in the other half and begin our passing there and making sure that when we get the chance we get the ball in the box or have a shot.

Not sure it will work in all situations - sometimes you need to be able to hang onto the ball but for where we are now it is creating us opportunities.

:agree: If the ball is no where near our goal and opposition are on back foot they are not going to score. His way here and else where has been to move the ball with pace..get it wide and get crosses into the box.
Take Nelson as an example - very good defender...but his distribution is like his defending ...batter it :greengrin so this can make things look a bit long ball ish ... in time there will be more refinement in the pace game...but that will take 2/3 changes in personnel

[Geo_1875]

I have never bought into this 'Hibs style' football myth. We played good stylish football for a brief spell in the early seventies then were dross until 1991 when we were pretty good on the eye until 94. Dross again until McLeish took over and then dross again until the golden generation broke through. In the forty odd years I've been watching Hibs there has been two types of football, winning football and losing football (or under Bertie Auld, drawing football)....I know which i prefer and i dont care what the style is as long as we stick the ball in the net.

edit.. apologies to the 85-88 team when the durie/kano/weir/collins generation broke through, they were good too.

Hibs have always been easier on the eye when they have had wingers getting at full-backs, hitting the byeline and crossing for forwards and attacking midfielders. It also helps when midfield have chipped in with goals from outside the box. It's no coincidence that the teams you mention had both.

[Brightside]

Anyone who thinks we are playing long ball is not watching the game....

[Jdawg]

Hope your not calling big Tell a name like billy butcher , please no no no Must have been thinking of Butchers Boys haha. OP now edited!!!!

[Jdawg]

One or two games I think we did begin just to launch balls forward but other than that I can see what he is doing - we are aiming to get the ball in the other half and begin our passing there and making sure that when we get the chance we get the ball in the box or have a shot.

Not sure it will work in all situations - sometimes you need to be able to hang onto the ball but for where we are now it is creating us opportunities.

Dundee Utd games sprngs to mind. 2-0 up, keep the ball. We shouldnt have lost the ball. Very encouraging to be 2-0 up though.

[Jdawg]

Hibs have always been easier on the eye when they have had wingers getting at full-backs, hitting the byeline and crossing forwards and attacking midfielders. It also helps when midfield have chipped in with goals from outside the box. It's no coincidence that the teams you mention had both.
it also helps not playing a left footed midfielder at RB and 4 CM across midfield. Butcher has players playing in their natural position. Hopefully Harris can offer the pace we lack. We shouldnt rely on him as still to ge back to match fitness and he is still young. The way Mowbray introduced Fletcher was excellent.

[Jdawg]

Anyone who thinks we are playing long ball is not watching the game.... Agreed and thats what my post was aimed at. Man Utd under ferguson were direct. Attacked and counter attacked with extreme pace (giggs.ronaldo, etc)

[The Sea-gull]

Couldn't care less what style we played as long as we get the right results. Have had enough of hearing about all this "Hibs way" stuff over the years as I think I have seen as much rubbish football as I have seen good stuff. Find the "Hibs way" chat a bit cringe worthy given in my 25 years plus of supporting Hibs we have largely under achieved in the park.

Obviously I would like to see us play good football and win more games than we lose but if we can't have both then I'd go for the winning every time. If Terry decides that we have to play a certain way to get results and we get these results then that is fine by me. Since he came in, while not still not great, our goal scoring has improved while our defensive strength has been maintained.

I prefer what I am seeing now to what I was seeing a couple of months ago and if Terry's teams are going to be a wee bit more direct then so be it. It will not be hard to improve the largely poor results and guff football endured for the majority of Fenlon's tenure and hopefully Terry will have us at least in the top half of the table by this time next year at the latest rather than fighting a relegation battle or aimlessly rattle about the dizzy heights of the top end of the bottom 6.

[jacomo]

One or two games I think we did begin just to launch balls forward but other than that I can see what he is doing - we are aiming to get the ball in the other half and begin our passing there and making sure that when we get the chance we get the ball in the box or have a shot.

Not sure it will work in all situations - sometimes you need to be able to hang onto the ball but for where we are now it is creating us opportunities.

:agree:

I hope that over time we will be more composed and play keep ball at times - this up and at 'em approach is fine but surely not always the right plan.

However, they do seem to have lifted the morale of the squad and the players are making themselves available, pressing and - most noticeably - competing for second balls. This is all very welcome.

[GreenCastle]

Since Butcher has come in we are more direct - and we have seen our results improve. More goals, shots on goal, corners and playing the game in the oppositions half more often.

I want Hibs to win - how they do that - I am not that bothered about - if we are direct and fast then I like that. If we pass the ball as well as Barcelona and win I will like that also.

The simple analysis is that in modern football to win and be more successful - usually you need to keep the ball and posses it with purpose more than your opposition.

ICT are one of the best teams I've seen at ER this season and I have faith TB will mould us into something similar but better over time.

[Andy74]

Since Butcher has come in we are more direct - and we have seen our results improve. More goals, shots on goal, corners and playing the game in the oppositions half more often.

I want Hibs to win - how they do that - I am not that bothered about - if we are direct and fast then I like that. If we pass the ball as well as Barcelona and win I will like that also.

The simple analysis is that in modern football to win and be more successful - usually you need to keep the ball and posses it with purpose more than your opposition.

ICT are one of the best teams I've seen at ER this season and I have faith TB will mould us into something similar but better over time.

The bit in bold - have we though? I think we are doing far better at giving the impression that we are doing more to win games and you would think on average when you get more shots and more crosses and more chances you will win more games.

We went through basiscally a whole cycle again (home and away differnces of course but they largely balance out to an extent) and we picked up less points than we did first time round against those teams.

Theres's more than one way to win football matches of course and people prefer the up and at them style, me included, but at this stage it's not actually winning us more football games. I think we should see that improve over the coming weeks though. We did beat St Mirren pretty easily last time out at ER too of course...

[Brightside]

This is getting silly now.

[Marty-Hibee]

I would say it's quite a decent, attractive style. Playing balls out to wide players from defense isn't long ball by all means and that's what I see us doing. Width is definitely our key at the moment, and support. Support over all area's has been differently class. When a full back goes forward, someone is there to sit. Craig and especially Robertson burst a gut to get in the final third and support the front two.

It's maybe not quite tiki taka along the lines of Mowbray's era, but I've been on my feet more times in the games Butcher has been in more than the the games I've been at in the last 5 years collectively. Long may it continue!

[Hibstrooper]

The bit in bold - have we though? I think we are doing far better at giving the impression that we are doing more to win games and you would think on average when you get more shots and more crosses and more chances you will win more games.

We went through basiscally a whole cycle again (home and away differnces of course but they largely balance out to an extent) and we picked up less points than we did first time round against those teams.

Theres's more than one way to win football matches of course and people prefer the up and at them style, me included, but at this stage it's not actually winning us more football games. I think we should see that improve over the coming weeks though. We did beat St Mirren pretty easily last time out at ER too of course...

How you calculating that? Not done it in cycles but looking at points per game pre & post Butchers appointment and I make it:

1.07 PPG Pre Butcher
1.44 PPG Post Butcher

So yes, we are picking up more points and 99% of the fans say they are more entertained, which is reflected in growing crowds. For some reason though there is 1% who'd rather try and numb any positivity and reminisce about Fenlon's tenure anytime anyone praises Butcher which is baffling.

[Andy74]

How you calculating that? Not done it in cycles but looking at points per game pre & post Butchers appointment and I make it:

1.07 PPG Pre Butcher
1.44 PPG Post Butcher

So yes, we are picking up more points and 99% of the fans say they are more entertained, which is reflected in growing crowds. For some reason though there is 1% who'd rather try and numb any positivity and reminisce about Fenlon's tenure anytime anyone praises Butcher which is baffling.

Nowt complex, just rhe league games Butcher has played so far against the league results the last time we played the same team.

It's not exactly scientific but there is a perception that we are improving results recently. In abpout the nearest direct way you can find to look at that we aren't really so far.

Thatr's fine though, I think we have more scope to improve.

Your last paragraph isn't really the case. I can't see any criticism of Butcher at all or reminiscing about Fenlon, there's just a lot being said which just isn't right. It keeps getting repeated so fair enough to point out?

So what I meant was Butcher has played:

St Mirren away, draw, we won the corresponding home fixture last time
Partick at home, we won the corresponding away fixture
Celtic away, lost, drew the home fixture
St Johnstone home, drew, won the away fixture
Ross C away, won, drew the home fixture
Killie home, won, won the away game too
Hearts gome, won, lost the away game
Dundee Utd away, drew, drew the home game too
Aberdeen away, lost, also lost the home game.

On those games Butcher got 13 points, 15 points last time round.

As you say the games played brings out a slightly different stat due to Fenlon having played additional games which were lost to Motherwell and Inverness. Jimy Nic lost those corresponding games.

Butcher also got us through the cup game and we lost the league cup game v Hearts having beaten Stranraer. Though having to to the last two Scottish Cup finals progression was possible! :greengrin

Again, this is no slight on Butcher at all, it's just some perspective on the argument that we are much better now. Maybe to watch but we need to turn that into more wins which I think we will.

[GreenCastle]

The bit in bold - have we though? I think we are doing far better at giving the impression that we are doing more to win games and you would think on average when you get more shots and more crosses and more chances you will win more games.

We went through basiscally a whole cycle again (home and away differnces of course but they largely balance out to an extent) and we picked up less points than we did first time round against those teams.

Theres's more than one way to win football matches of course and people prefer the up and at them style, me included, but at this stage it's not actually winning us more football games. I think we should see that improve over the coming weeks though. We did beat St Mirren pretty easily last time out at ER too of course...

The results don't always reflect the games played - the performances in every Butchers game have at least looked like there was a plan and the players were trying - several times previously we lacked ideas, rarely got a shot on goal and were pretty boring to watch.

If we continue to perform like we have been in the short space of time we will win and claim more points longer term than Fenlon and other previous managers. Butcher is also using past managers players - allow him to do his own thing then judge his stats and compare.

I personally prefer the passing game more to the up and at him style but I think that will take time to get there. In the meantime I have liked the change in our style plus we look better at areas such as corners such we haven't done well for years!

[EskbankHibee]

The results don't always reflect the games played - the performances in every Butchers game have at least looked like there was a plan and the players were trying - several times previously we lacked ideas, rarely got a shot on goal and were pretty boring to watch.

If we continue to perform like we have been in the short space of time we will win and claim more points longer term than Fenlon and other previous managers. Butcher is also using past managers players - allow him to do his own thing then judge his stats and compare.

I personally prefer the passing game more to the up and at him style but I think that will take time to get there. In the meantime I have liked the change in our still plus we look better at areas such as corners such we haven't done well for years!

So now results don't matter? What was the plan against Aberdeen again?

[GreenCastle]

So now results don't matter? What was the plan against Aberdeen again?

When did I see results don't matter?

Plan against Aberdeen was similar to previous games - defend properly - limit shots on goal - full backs get forward when possible. The tactics were fine - the lack of quality meant we couldn't score and lost to a long range wonder strike.

[Andy74]

The results don't always reflect the games played - the performances in every Butchers game have at least looked like there was a plan and the players were trying - several times previously we lacked ideas, rarely got a shot on goal and were pretty boring to watch.

If we continue to perform like we have been in the short space of time we will win and claim more points longer term than Fenlon and other previous managers. Butcher is also using past managers players - allow him to do his own thing then judge his stats and compare.

I personally prefer the passing game more to the up and at him style but I think that will take time to get there. In the meantime I have liked the change in our still plus we look better at areas such as corners such we haven't done well for years!

Agree with all that :agree:

[heretoday]

There's nothing wrong with route one football provided you have the personnel in place to carry it off.

We need at least one big rangy chap to hold it up or knock it back and a sharp striker to bang it in.

Collins and Heffernan are a long way from fulfilling those requirements.

I'm a bit concerned that TB seems happy not to splash the cash this winter. I'd say front men are urgently needed.

[GreenCastle]

There's nothing wrong with route one football provided you have the personnel in place to carry it off.

We need at least one big rangy chap to hold it up or knock it back and a sharp striker to bang it in.

Collins and Heffernan are a long way from fulfilling those requirements.

I'm a bit concerned that TB seems happy not to splash the cash this winter. I'd say front men are urgently needed.

Since Butcher has been in Scotland he has only ever spent 8K on players.

Cash doesn't always bring you quality - though it can help.

If money is tight I would rather get the right players in and if that's summer so be it.

This season we are playing to get into top 6 and how far we get in Scottish. Apart from that it's pretty much a write off.

January I do think is a time to get loan signings in though - but rarely permanent deals - that applies to all of the UK.

[Saorsa]

Anyone who thinks we are playing long ball is not watching the game....:agree: and that ends the discussion for me, it's nothing of the sort.

[EskbankHibee]

:agree: and that ends the discussion for me, it's nothing of the sort.

Are the people who say they don't care about our style of play the same fans who called for Mixu's head?

[Andy74]

:agree: and that ends the discussion for me, it's nothing of the sort.

Yeah it's direct, but it's not long ball. The odd thing launched as there always will be but I don't believe it's the plan just to hoof it and chase after it which is proper long ball tactics.

[Saorsa]

Are the people who say they don't care about our style of play the same fans who called for Mixu's head?Why are you asking me? Where did I say I dinae care about our style of play? That's the 2nd post you've quoted where you've read in tae it something that isnae there.


Somebody else disnae care about results, I dinnae care about the style of play, where are you reading this stuff?

[Kato]

There's nothing wrong with route one football provided you have the personnel in place to carry it off.



...and the point is from those who actually watch games, dunno what eskbank is watching -t he inside of his own bleeding eyelids apparently, we're not playing the long ball and certainly not route one.

Which renders all of this ....


We need at least one big rangy chap to hold it up or knock it back and a sharp striker to bang it in.

Collins and Heffernan are a long way from fulfilling those requirements.

I'm a bit concerned that TB seems happy not to splash the cash this winter. I'd say front men are urgently needed.

.....redundant.

[EskbankHibee]

Why are you asking me? Where did I say I dinae care about our style of play? That's the 2nd post you've quoted where you've read in tae it something that isnae there.


Somebody else disnae care about results, I dinnae care about the style of play, where are you reading this stuff?

Didn't mean to quote you there soz

[Scouse Hibee]

I can't remember us playing with style for any length of time but I can remember plenty of crap so anything that wins games will do.