Observations

[SMAXXA]

Heff isn't anywhere near sharp enough to start

mcgiverns marking from set pieces is woeful

we sit far to deep In the closing stages of games, seen it at UTD and again tonight

not going over the top as we are a work I'm progress however these are a couple of things that I have taken from the last couple of games, McGivern aside as he been guilty of this over the whole season

All in my opinion of course :agree:

[Golden Bear]

One corner and only a very rare shot at goal.

Disappointing is my verdict.

[Aldo]

Heff isn't anywhere near sharp enough to start mcgiverns marking from set pieces is woeful we sit far to deep I'm the closing stages of games, seen it at UTD and again tonight not going over the top as we are a work I'm progress however these are a couple of things that I have taken from the last couple of games, McGivern aside as he been guilty of this over the whole season All in my opinion of course :agree:

Spot on re McGivern at times it looked like he was ball watching.

Quality,creativity and pace is missing in the final 3rd and is an absolute must in this transfer window.

Heff looked like he was running in lead lined divers boots the nite.

Fingers crossed Terry and the gang can address these issues

[Tyler Durden]

Heff isn't anywhere near sharp enough to start

mcgiverns marking from set pieces is woeful

we sit far to deep I'm the closing stages of games, seen it at UTD and again tonight

not going over the top as we are a work I'm progress however these are a couple of things that I have taken from the last couple of games, McGivern aside as he been guilty of this over the whole season

All in my opinion of course :agree:

Spot on re McGivern. Motherwells goal at Fir Park, the lad McKays sitter in recent derby, Reynolds tonight, he always seems to lose his man.

Thought he was excellent in first 6 months at Hibs but has been poor for some time now.

[Hibs7]

Spot on re McGivern. Motherwells goal at Fir Park, the lad McKays sitter in recent derby, Reynolds tonight, he always seems to lose his man.

Thought he was excellent in first 6 months at Hibs but has been poor for some time now.

Totally agree and was also behind his man when the young Hearts player brought out a great save from Williams in the first half ..

[B.H.F.C]

Heff isn't anywhere near sharp enough to start

mcgiverns marking from set pieces is woeful

we sit far to deep I'm the closing stages of games, seen it at UTD and again tonight

not going over the top as we are a work I'm progress however these are a couple of things that I have taken from the last couple of games, McGivern aside as he been guilty of this over the whole season

All in my opinion of course :agree:

100% agree on McGivern. I think he's been poor all season.

I still think the wide areas are an issue. Cairney and Stevenson have done well at times but long term I'm not sure they are the answer in wide positions.

The front two need to be better. Agree, Heff looks a bit off the pace. Collins seems to lack composure and isn't threatening enough.

On a positive note, another excellent performance from Paul Hanlon.

[SMAXXA]

100% agree on McGivern. I think he's been poor all season.

I still think true wide areas are an issue. Cairney and Stevenson have done well at times but long term I'm not sure they are the answer in wide positions.

The front two need to be better. Agree, Heff looks a bit off the pace. Collins seems to lack composure and isn't threatening enough.

On a positive note, another excellent performance from Paul Hanlon.

Totally agree with you on Hanlon I think he has been magnificent for the most part this season. Felt he should have done better for the UTD goals but will let that go given his derby performance and other games, take a bow son you deserve it.

also felt we lost the middle of the park tonight when Robo went off. Possibly this resulted in our decision to play so deep, we invite teams onto us and feel we should be more attacking and give them something to think about in the later stages in games. Probably no coincidence we don't do this given we are so lacking up top. We have a striker who's not match fit and another who runs his balls off all game and is blowing last 10 which is fair enough given the work the lad does.

[GreenLake]

Looks like we train with a different ball. So many passes bounced of chests, knees or feet where they should be brought under control.

[LancsHibs]

Watched the match with a Sunderland fan on the telly, he's not seen Hibs for ages and was impressed with Ryan McGivern, thought he was our MOM. I disagreed, shows how a total neutral watching can have a different prospective.

[3pm]

I have concerns about the two in centre midfield.

[3pm]

Cairney as well. Needs to do better with and without the ball.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Watched the match with a Sunderland fan on the telly, he's not seen Hibs for ages and was impressed with Ryan McGivern, thought he was our MOM. I disagreed, shows how a total neutral watching can have a different prospective.

Was he pished ?

[bingo70]

Mcgivern was fine imo, they had about 14 corners and I can think of one half chance, it wasn't even that actually, abd even then thought he was fouled.

Something that struck me tonight was how bad cairneys first touch is, was always bobbling about all over the place.

[NorthNorfolkHFC]

Heff isn't anywhere near sharp enough to start

mcgiverns marking from set pieces is woeful

we sit far to deep In the closing stages of games, seen it at UTD and again tonight

not going over the top as we are a work I'm progress however these are a couple of things that I have taken from the last couple of games, McGivern aside as he been guilty of this over the whole season

All in my opinion of course :agree:

Terry has done wonders but we have been shown up for an average middle of the road SPL team. Absolutely no criticism of our team, just realism.

This group of players will not go down (under Terry) but we are not going to do anything exemplary.

We need some new players and once we have them we may see a change in tactics but we are probably overachieving as it is.

[leggeto]

Butcher out smaxxa in ;-)

[B.H.F.C]

I have concerns about the two in centre midfield.

Agree. Think they are a bit similar. We really need someone to show a bit more composure on the ball at times. I know we have been going back to front at times and playing of second balls but there are still plenty times where the ball is at their feet, you only need to look at the number of times hey gave it away tonight.

[marinello59]

Watched the match with a Sunderland fan on the telly, he's not seen Hibs for ages and was impressed with Ryan McGivern, thought he was our MOM. I disagreed, shows how a total neutral watching can have a different prospective.

I thought McGivern was alright tonight as well.
We were shot shy tonight which is really what cost us the points.

[allmodcons]

1 defeat (in what is it 8 games?) away to a form team and, according to this thread, we need a new left back a whole new midfield 4 and 2 new forwards.

Friday night is comedy night on hibs.net

[Badabing]

Watched it on telly and I thought the main problems were Robertson and Craig. Similar to the second half against the **** we need somebody in the centre of midfield who can exercise some control of the game. It pains me to say it but I think our best option in that regard is KT.

[SMAXXA]

Butcher out smaxxa in ;-)

Director of Football, where do I sign up :greengrin

[One Day Soon]

1 defeat (in what is it 8 games?) away to a form team and, according to this thread, we need a new left back a whole new midfield 4 and 2 new forwards.

Friday night is comedy night on hibs.net

I think, AMC, that this will be the first time we have ever been in complete agreement?

[Jonnyboy]

Disappointing but not depressing is my verdict. Things just didn't work for us tonight. First twenty we were fine but once they got control of the midfield, we struggled. Cairney very poor,as was the Heff who looked knackered from the off.

Onwards and upwards though :aok:

[DAVE1875]

How come our subs didn't warm up during half time?



Collins has the balance of a new born fawn.

Good performance from the defence (minus McGivern), Nelson in particular. Was resigned to a 0 - 0 draw then Uncle Fester pops up with a screamer

[allmodcons]

I think, AMC, that this will be the first time we have ever been in complete agreement?

I think you might be right ODS!

[weonlywon6-2]

1 defeat (in what is it 8 games?) away to a form team and, according to this thread, we need a new left back a whole new midfield 4 and 2 new forwards.

Friday night is comedy night on hibs.net


Quite.funny really isnt it,according to the bbc we had more shots on target than aberdeen yet we are shot shy ???

We aint gonna change over night be we have come.a long way in the last few weeks.

[SMAXXA]

How come our subs didn't warm up during half time?



Collins has the balance of a new born fawn.

Good performance from the defence (minus McGivern), Nelson in particular. Was resigned to a 0 - 0 draw then Uncle Fester pops up with a screamer

They never do, must be a TB changes but I noticed it against UTD

[allmodcons]

Quite.funny really isnt it,according to the bbc we had more shots on target than aberdeen yet we are shot shy ???

We aint gonna change over night be we have come.a long way in the last few weeks.

A poor game where we were undone by a cracking strike.

[RIP Bestie]

Thought the back 4 were solid. Hanlon strolled through the game. Forster and McGivern are not full backs IMO, and we should be looking to bring players in who are moreatural in that position. That's not to say they haven't done ok. Thought we lost a bit in the middle of the park when Robertson went off and Robson started to put his foot on the ball. As for the front two in Heffernan and Collins, there were too many hopeful balls played over the top which isn't their strength IMO.

[Heedersnvolleys]

Thought the back 4 were solid. Hanlon strolled through the game. Forster and McGivern are not full backs IMO, and we should be looking to bring players in who are moreatural in that position. That's not to say they haven't done ok. Thought we lost a bit in the middle of the park when Robertson went off and Robson started to put his foot on the ball. As for the front two in Heffernan and Collins, there were too many hopeful balls played over the top which isn't their strength IMO.
Yip my thoughts as well, Robertson kept at there midfield all night not giving them a minutes peace, he goes off and they have a bit more time to pick there passes. I think tonight showed that TB wants us to play the same way home and away which commendable but I just felt in a game like tonight we could have done with someone like KT so we kept the ball for longer periods.

[GreenOnions]

Disappointing to lose tonight. Although Aberdeen looked the better team I thought we competed well.

Main plusses for me were that we continue to really look like a team as opposed to a group of individuals; we defended well and restricted the sheep to very few opportunities; we tried to play and win the ball as far up the pitch as possible (apart from late on); we moved the ball quickly and always looked like we wanted to get forward and win the game.

I agree with comments re Paul Hanlon. He looks increasingly like a really accomplished defender to me. I also like Forster a lot and, although I'd prefer him in beside Hanlon, I've been impressed with his attitude and performances at right back. I think that McGivern is struggling at the moment and we could do with another option there. I'd love to see Callum Booth return and show that the defensive side of his game has improved.

It was good to see Harris return and I always think that Sam Stanton looks like a player when I see him. He didn't do that much tonight but he's certainly got ability and is comfortable on the ball. He seems to me to have grown quite a bit. Anyone else think that? Maybe Terry just needs to find out where to play him to get the best out of him?

Robertson and Craig are good players and I'm happy to see Terry build a team with them in it.

Overall - it's clear we've moved forward a significant amount and I think we'll continue to improve. Playing against a good side tonight highlighted our problems going forward - there was very little threat from our wide areas (although I thought Stevenson's and Cairney's general play was okay) and Collins and Heffernan couldn't hold the ball up enough or offer enough of a goal threat.

[Willis1875]

Watched it on telly and I thought the main problems were Robertson and Craig. Similar to the second half against the **** we need somebody in the centre of midfield who can exercise some control of the game. It pains me to say it but I think our best option in that regard is KT.

Just back and feel the Aberdeen midfield waltzed past these guys with ease tonight

[GreenOnions]

Watched it on telly and I thought the main problems were Robertson and Craig. Similar to the second half against the **** we need somebody in the centre of midfield who can exercise some control of the game. It pains me to say it but I think our best option in that regard is KT.

Change "is" to "was" I'm afraid :-(

[spike220]

Watched the match with a Sunderland fan on the telly, he's not seen Hibs for ages and was impressed with Ryan McGivern, thought he was our MOM. I disagreed, shows how a total neutral watching can have a different prospective.

I have to agree I was starting to think Ryan had gone off the boil a wee bit and was starting to lose in him, but I thought he was terrific and was a real thorn in their side going forward. Also did his in defense without much bothering him.

[IWasThere2016]

We need pace wide and upfront.

Otherwise I've no real concerns.

We were unlucky as wee Bod will never hit one like that ever again!

Hanlon and Nelson both played well IMHO.

[BSEJVT]

Always interesting how people see the same game differently.

I actually thought that Robson's influence on the game waned when Stanton replaced Robertson. Whether that was because Robertson having been booked couldn't risk nibbling away at him or not I don't know.

Stanton was much taller than I recalled also!

I think the difference Between Aberdeen's squad and ours is frightening and nails the lie that we had the second best squad in the league.

IMO we had at least 3 players Forster, McGivern & Stevenson playing out of position.

I like Lewis and recognise he is a midfielder, but not a wide one for me, neither IMO is Cairney as he simply doesn't have the pace to be so.

One of the big problems with this team is that there is no out ball and minimal creativity, no-one we can give the ball to who will retain possession or take it for a run. Whether Harris can do that or not who knows, but Pawlett was great at that and creating things for them.

We bring on 3 subs who haven't 50 first team games between them.

They bring on Anderson, Magennis & Zola, all of whom are seasoned and probably international players at some stage of their careers.

TB has a quite sizeable job on his hands and it will take more than one transfer window to make anything at all of it.

Hibs, a team permanently in transition.

[GreenOnions]

Always interesting how people see the same game differently.

I actually thought that Robson's influence on the game waned when Stanton replaced Robertson. Whether that was because Robertson having been booked couldn't risk nibbling away at him or not I don't know.

Stanton was much taller than I recalled also!

I think the difference Between Aberdeen's squad and ours is frightening and nails the lie that we had the second best squad in the league.

IMO we had at least 3 players Forster, McGivern & Stevenson playing out of position.

I like Lewis and recognise he is a midfielder, but not a wide one for me, neither IMO is Cairney as he simply doesn't have the pace to be so.

One of the big problems with this team is that there is no out ball and minimal creativity, no-one we can give the ball to who will retain possession or take it for a run. Whether Harris can do that or not who knows, but Pawlett was great at that and creating things for them.

We bring on 3 subs who haven't 50 first team games between them.

They bring on Anderson, Magennis & Zola, all of whom are seasoned and probably international players at some stage of their careers.

TB has a quite sizeable job on his hands and it will take more than one transfer window to make anything at all of it.

Hibs, a team permanently in transition.

I agree with most of the points you make but would be more sanguine about our overall situation than the bit in bold above.

You imply (correctly IMO) that Aberdeen have built a good side. However, although they have good attacking players, you couldn't say that we looked in particular trouble against them at their own ground at a time when they are on a confidence high after a very successful run of games. Williams didn't really have much to do I thought.

That tells me that we defended well as a team. My feeling would also be that we didn't do so in a "backs to the wall" way. We did try to get the ball forward and to defend high up the pitch.

I agree that Forster is being played out of position. I think he has the makings of an excellent centre back and am always doubtful about whether a central defender playing at full-back can offer enough of an attacking threat. However - many managers in the past have allowed young centre backs to develop by playing them at full back early on. I think Forster has done well there and I'd be happy for him to continue at right back with the longer term plan to move him in beside Hanlon.

I genuinely don't think TB needs to replace that many players in the squad. As has been well discussed on here - the addition to last night's team of a couple of creative/wide players with a bit of pace and someone who can score goals would make a huge difference to us. Aberdeen themselves are in serious need of a goalscorer too.

I also agree with your point that the Dons have more strength in depth. However, with the return of Harris, the development of Forster and the promise offered by Stanton and Cummings I'd be very interested to see what the addition of two or three quality players in key forward positions can do for us.

[Johnny Clash]

They never do, must be a TB changes but I noticed it against UTD

I noticed that at the Derby.

Its good that TB looks at things differently coz usually the half time warm up consists of just booting the ball to each other.


so maybe TB thinks it's better to have the subs sit in on the team talk?

[Eyrie]

I noticed that at the Derby.

Its good that TB looks at things differently coz usually the half time warm up consists of just booting the ball to each other.


so maybe TB thinks it's better to have the subs sit in on the team talk?

The latter makes sense to me. The subs can have a warm up once the second half starts in case they're needed early but it's more important that they understand the tactics.

[Smartie]

The thing that struck me was how well the centre backs played.

Nelson is slow but his positioning and willingness to attack the ball are top-notch. I think Hanlon looks miles better plating beside him than anyone else. He got away with one for the penalty claim though.

Aberdeen put a lot of decent crosses into the box but we dealt very well with them. I still consider McGivern and Forster to be mainly centre-halves too so it helps having that added height in there. Williams does his bit in this regard too. I've hated how much of a soft touch we've been from crosses in recent years so this makes a huge difference.

As ever, it was the lack of pace and creativity going forward that cost us, I also think we've looked better with Cummings' energy rather than Heffernan recently, although I thought that Heffernan was excellent pre-injury. I wonder sometimes if we might be better with a midfielder playing as a number 10 off Collins rather than 2 up front - Cairney, Craig or Stanton could all do this imo.

I don't think we need to add too much by way of players - remember that we were away to a team who have been playing well this season. We were also at full-strength though so a couple of injuries in key areas and we may struggle again, so having a full squad who we can call upon if reqd would be good.

[patlowe]

My main concern is a lack of composure in central areas. Maybe they are being asked to do it but it is alarming how often Craig and Robertson turn and hoof the ball without looking. I understand that TB is looking to get forward quickly and turn the opposition degence but too often we are just conceding possession needlessly.

Other observations:
We are looking very solid now and Hanlon is looking more and more like a top class centre half.
Cairney plays for himself too often. For example, two nutmegs might have looked good for thr cameras but there was a pass on and he gave the ball away.
Stevenson is our best attacking player at the moment. Always available in support and very rarely gives the ball away in the final third.
Butcher's substitutions caused us to lose our shape IMO. Not a criticism necessarily - they may have been enforced.

[Northernhibee]

I genuinely believe the three best players we have at this club are Hanlon, Stevenson and Williams in that order with Nelson and Craig close behind. All steady, composed and tidy players who work their arse off for the club and it's important we keep them here. Forster and Harris have great potential and we need them to get plenty first team time to reach what they can do.

We need a bit more pace and composure in the final third of the pitch but I don't think we're far away.

[BSEJVT]

I agree with most of the points you make but would be more sanguine about our overall situation than the bit in bold above.

You imply (correctly IMO) that Aberdeen have built a good side. However, although they have good attacking players, you couldn't say that we looked in particular trouble against them at their own ground at a time when they are on a confidence high after a very successful run of games. Williams didn't really have much to do I thought.

That tells me that we defended well as a team. My feeling would also be that we didn't do so in a "backs to the wall" way. We did try to get the ball forward and to defend high up the pitch.

I agree that Forster is being played out of position. I think he has the makings of an excellent centre back and am always doubtful about whether a central defender playing at full-back can offer enough of an attacking threat. However - many managers in the past have allowed young centre backs to develop by playing them at full back early on. I think Forster has done well there and I'd be happy for him to continue at right back with the longer term plan to move him in beside Hanlon.

I genuinely don't think TB needs to replace that many players in the squad. As has been well discussed on here - the addition to last night's team of a couple of creative/wide players with a bit of pace and someone who can score goals would make a huge difference to us. Aberdeen themselves are in serious need of a goalscorer too.

I also agree with your point that the Dons have more strength in depth. However, with the return of Harris, the development of Forster and the promise offered by Stanton and Cummings I'd be very interested to see what the addition of two or three quality players in key forward positions can do for us.

Agree entirely with most of what you say.

My comments weren't meant to be critical quite the reverse.

I think its testimony to the management team that they are managing to get so much more out of the players and the squad than the individual qualities of the players would suggest is possible.

The players also deserve credit for "upping their game" considerably.

I just think there is quite a gap quality and depth wise between the respective squads and that underlines how far we have yet to travel to get where we want to be.

[Billychaotic182]

Simply put we are too slow. The one thing I noticed was when Aberdeen broke no hibs player was able to keep up. We have no pace at all. The balls we were trying to play to Collins and Heff won't work without a fast strong striker. You know that high ball over the defenders looking for the runner. The fact that Stevenson is probably our fastest player last night is worrying. I think if he were to keep our strikers in the box and have fast wingers who can beat a man and can cross the ball well Heff and Collins will score more goals! Biggest problem is a player like what we are needing will cost probably more than we are able to spend!

[hibeedonald]

All players worked incredibly hard, we were solid at the back, Butcher is getting the best he can out of the current squad. Very unlucky not to get a point last night.

[hibeedonald]

The current team with a player like Griffiths would be right near the top of the table.

[hibeedonald]

Simply put we are too slow. The one thing I noticed was when Aberdeen broke no hibs player was able to keep up. We have no pace at all. The balls we were trying to play to Collins and Heff won't work without a fast strong striker. You know that high ball over the defenders looking for the runner. The fact that Stevenson is probably our fastest player last night is worrying. I think if he were to keep our strikers in the box and have fast wingers who can beat a man and can cross the ball well Heff and Collins will score more goals! Biggest problem is a player like what we are needing will cost probably more than we are able to spend!

I agree, hopefully Harris will do this job though so no need to spend. Zoubir needs a chance aswell.

[offshorehibby]

I agree, hopefully Harris will do this job though so no need to spend. Zoubir needs a chance aswell.

Don't think Harris will be back to any sort of form till next season so we shouldn't be relying on him. Zoubir, I bet if TB could punt him back to France. Apart from the odd touch he's done nothing to write home about.

[MB62]

Disappointing but not depressing is my verdict. Things just didn't work for us tonight. First twenty we were fine but once they got control of the midfield, we struggled. Cairney very poor,as was the Heff who looked knackered from the off.

Onwards and upwards though :aok:

Agree with that J.C.
Didn't really think McGivern was as bad as some are making out, although his cross balls in to the box are mostly useless.
As the game went on, Craig in particular IMO, was sitting deeper and deeper and if he sat back any further, would have been sitting in the beach end by the end of the game.

The goal was a cracker, although I thought young Harris could have maybe made a better effort at getting over to Flood a bit quicker to stop the shot, probably just not up to the speed of how Butcher wants the players to play yet after his long lay off.

As it's still early days yet for Butcher, who has done very well so far with what he has inherited, my knickers remain untwisted and I look more forward to next season when he will shirley bring in a few more players over this and the summer transfer windows to START building a team he wants.

Two 1-0 defeats away from home against the teams sitting 1st and 2nd in the league is no disaster, even if it was disappointing to lose on Friday.