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CallumLaidlaw
16-12-2013, 07:37 AM
I know that there's still over 15 games till the split, but is Saturday a must win? Or a must not lose? A defeat would leave us 7 points off 6th place st Johnstone who would also have a game in hand.
Surely if we want top 6, we can't afford to fall that far behind.

Islington Hibs
16-12-2013, 07:50 AM
Defeat would make it difficult but this is about getting the team settled and more confident. We are starting to make more chances and eventually that will stick. We have been losing and drawing games that on other days we could easily have won. What ever the result lets give TB our full backing......

Ronniekirk
16-12-2013, 08:22 AM
I know that there's still over 15 games till the split, but is Saturday a must win? Or a must not lose? A defeat would leave us 7 points off 6th place st Johnstone who would also have a game in hand.
Surely if we want top 6, we can't afford to fall that far behind.
For me it's a must win game for a variety of reasons including trying to get into top six.Our best performance of season was when we beat them up there Second half we bossed the game and dictated play but Heff was instrumental in that performance .if we don't win it just underlines where we have fallen to over the past few years and reminds us why we brought in new management team .Home form has been an issue so qui her we can win a game there the better for squad morale.but we may need to be a bit more patient and can't see us pushing into top 4 this season 6th or 7th reflects true position at present But we are due a rub of the green I think so will be there and who knows

PeeJay
16-12-2013, 08:33 AM
I know that there's still over 15 games till the split, but is Saturday a must win? Or a must not lose? A defeat would leave us 7 points off 6th place st Johnstone who would also have a game in hand.
Surely if we want top 6, we can't afford to fall that far behind.

Any game at home should be a must win ...

matty_f
16-12-2013, 08:39 AM
We need to win it imho. Our home record is nothing short of appalling this year so getting home wins in the board is a must.
Above that, we can't afford a wide gap between us and the top 6 teams as at the moment we don't look like a team who can put a run of wind together to pull ourselves back up.

Craig_in_Prague
16-12-2013, 08:42 AM
When 1 goal for us, is a good day......It's hard to expect much.

Beefster
16-12-2013, 08:50 AM
Personally, I'd give Butcher until next season before declaring any game a 'must win'.

matty_f
16-12-2013, 09:30 AM
Personally, I'd give Butcher until next season before declaring any game a 'must win'.

I think butcher has enough time to achieve a top 6 finish this season but top do that I think he needs to win games like Saturday's. He's not under pressure to win it so I suppose in that regard you're right, it's not a 'must win' but I do think it's vital we win if we are to avoid another bottom 6 finish.

Hibs Class
16-12-2013, 09:36 AM
If we aspire to finish top six this season, which we should be, then it's a must win.

happiehibbie
16-12-2013, 09:58 AM
YES YES YES

I expect nothing less when we play at home

B.H.F.C
16-12-2013, 10:12 AM
Yes because we've not won in the league for two and a half months. Whilst we are looking up teams like Ross County and Killie are only 5 or 6 points behind us. If we continue to trundle along we could end up in a scrap with them.

I'm confident that come January Butcher will tweak the squad slightly which should help us in terms of goal scoring but before then it's important to try and scrape a couple of wins.

ronaldo7
16-12-2013, 10:38 AM
If we aspire to finish top six this season, which we should be, then it's a must win.

This, This, and This again.

The Sea-gull
16-12-2013, 10:41 AM
All home games are "must wins" in theory but in practice you are not going to win them all. Our trouble has been that in the last 3/4 years we have not won nearly enough at home. We need to start a run and can only do that by winning a game so every game is must win for us right now.

In the context of the season, losing on Saturday is not a season ender but every week that we don't win it just makes achieving our minimum target for the season (top 6) less likely.

At the start of the season I expected us, with the squad we have assembled and it's lack of balance, pace and creativity (cheers Pat) to be either side of the top 6 which is where we currently are. Don't see that changing unless we there are some ins and outs in Jan. Managers can only do so much.

We need to keep within touching distance of at least one of the top 6. Winning on Saturday would enable us to do this, lose and we start to look a bit cut off. Not absolutely must win maybe but definitely comes into to the "could really do with winning" category.

theonlywayisup
16-12-2013, 12:53 PM
All home games are "must wins" in theory but in practice you are not going to win them all. Our trouble has been that in the last 3/4 years we have not won nearly enough at home. We need to start a run and can only do that by winning a game so every game is must win for us right now.

As I wrote in another thread..........

And our record at home has been terrible as shown below. Only two home wins in 2013 and one of these against a relegated Dundee. Five wins and a draw at the start of the 202/13 season is our best run. Next, three home wins in February 2011.

Season 13/14 - one home league win out of eight
Season 12/13 - seven home league wins out of nineteen but all but two were prior to the middle of November (i.e. only wins against Celtic & Dundee after then)
Season 11/12 - two league wins out of nineteen, one in September and one in May (the relegation decider)
Season 10/11 - five league wins out of nineteen
Season 09/10 - nine league wins out of nineteen - was nine in fifteen with only two losses each against the Old Firm.

Also, since the 7th March 2010, we have won 15 games out of 69 games, drawing 24 and losing 30 - i.e. our win % at home is only 22%, whilst our loss % is 44%.

Grim, grim reading. The fact that our support is still there is amazing considering the lack of wins.

Craig_in_Prague
16-12-2013, 12:59 PM
As I wrote in another thread..........

And our record at home has been terrible as shown below. Only two home wins in 2013 and one of these against a relegated Dundee. Five wins and a draw at the start of the 202/13 season is our best run. Next, three home wins in February 2011.

Season 13/14 - one home league win out of eight
Season 12/13 - seven home league wins out of nineteen but all but two were prior to the middle of November (i.e. only wins against Celtic & Dundee after then)
Season 11/12 - two league wins out of nineteen, one in September and one in May (the relegation decider)
Season 10/11 - five league wins out of nineteen
Season 09/10 - nine league wins out of nineteen - was nine in fifteen with only two losses each against the Old Firm.

Also, since the 7th March 2010, we have won 15 games out of 69 games, drawing 24 and losing 30 - i.e. our win % at home is only 22%, whilst our loss % is 44%.

Grim, grim reading. The fact that our support is still there is amazing considering the lack of wins.

Absolutely disgusting record.

But as you said, impressive support considering the keech on show.

lord bunberry
16-12-2013, 01:28 PM
There's no way you can class Saturday as a must win game, there's still plenty time to make up the points if we lose. Putting unnecessary pressure on ourselves at this stage isn't going to do us any favours. It's a home game against a team with a poor away record, but our home form has been awful, it's time for us to start winning home games again. That's how I will be looking at it.

Hibiza
16-12-2013, 01:35 PM
work in progress. :flag:

Lucius Apuleius
16-12-2013, 01:53 PM
Must win game for me is only when we are facing relegation and a win would avoid it. Nice to win, definitely.

Northernhibee
16-12-2013, 02:25 PM
My only expectation this season is that we get better. Better football, better technique, better tactics and this would lead to better results.

hfc rd
16-12-2013, 03:08 PM
I think butcher has enough time to achieve a top 6 finish this season but top do that I think he needs to win games like Saturday's. He's not under pressure to win it so I suppose in that regard you're right, it's not a 'must win' but I do think it's vital we win if we are to avoid another bottom 6 finish.


Agree with this. Need to win this Saturday.

The Sea-gull
16-12-2013, 03:14 PM
Another slant on it is that it is more important that we don't lose than we win.

If we lose we go 7 points behind in "the chase" for the top 6 and it really does create a league of two leagues which will do confidence no favours. Win and we are a point behind Saints which would give confidence a real shot in the arm but I think the damage done by losing would out-weigh anything good done by winning. Draw and we are still four points behind but that gap seems so much smaller than seven points.

Not saying we should ever play for a draw but I am saying that this is one of these occasions where it is maybe marginally more important not to lose than it is to win.

Dashing Bob S
16-12-2013, 03:19 PM
I don't think we should be concerned with wins at this stage of the season. After all, what is a 'win'? Is it really that important? I'd like to see the team get into a positive head space through using advanced meditation techniques, accompanied with vegetarian diets and hallucinogens provided by a Brazilian Shamen, who should be at TB's side in the dressing room every home game.

It's only a poxy league game against St Johnstone. About time we got some proper (psychedelic) perspectives on this season.

greenlex
16-12-2013, 03:45 PM
No but it would be nice.

yeezus.
16-12-2013, 04:01 PM
I know that there's still over 15 games till the split, but is Saturday a must win? Or a must not lose? A defeat would leave us 7 points off 6th place st Johnstone who would also have a game in hand.
Surely if we want top 6, we can't afford to fall that far behind.

I agree completely. St. Johnstone haven't looked anything too special this season, apart from when they trashed Inverness. I think we must win this and take 3 points from Ross County.

Pete
16-12-2013, 05:01 PM
A must win?

Absolutely no need to add pressure in this manner. Just chill out :-)

CallumLaidlaw
16-12-2013, 05:40 PM
A must win?

Absolutely no need to add pressure in this manner. Just chill out :-)

No pressure being added. Just asking a question to see what others were thinking.

To me, a win would be nice, but we probably can't afford to lose if we have any top 6 aspirations.

NAE NOOKIE
16-12-2013, 08:44 PM
As I wrote in another thread..........

And our record at home has been terrible as shown below. Only two home wins in 2013 and one of these against a relegated Dundee. Five wins and a draw at the start of the 202/13 season is our best run. Next, three home wins in February 2011.

Season 13/14 - one home league win out of eight
Season 12/13 - seven home league wins out of nineteen but all but two were prior to the middle of November (i.e. only wins against Celtic & Dundee after then)
Season 11/12 - two league wins out of nineteen, one in September and one in May (the relegation decider)
Season 10/11 - five league wins out of nineteen
Season 09/10 - nine league wins out of nineteen - was nine in fifteen with only two losses each against the Old Firm.

Also, since the 7th March 2010, we have won 15 games out of 69 games, drawing 24 and losing 30 - i.e. our win % at home is only 22%, whilst our loss % is 44%.

Grim, grim reading. The fact that our support is still there is amazing considering the lack of wins.

That is nothing short of shocking. No amount of hand wringing about the nasty home fans shouting at players and all that stuff can excuse a record like that. To go what will be 5 consecutive seasons with a less than 50% win ratio at home in each season is just sad. Every home game should be a must win.