In defence of Rod

[Part/Time Supporter]

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/euan-mclean-rod-petrie-way-2677641


Euan McLean: Rod Petrie does it his way and Hibs fans should be glad to have him

EUAN reckons Rod Petrie deserves the backing of Hibs supporters for his solid financial management of the club over the past 10 years.

FAIR to say Rod Petrie isn’t the first guy you’d invite to the pub for a few pints and a good belt on the karaoke. Although if a singer does lurk under that dour exterior I’ll bet he’s a Frank Sinatra man. But I digress.

While Petrie would admit he’s no man of the people I was staggered to hear Hibs fans’ chief Mike Reilly calling for the chairman’s head. The consensus that Pat Fenlon had to vacate the manager’s seat was so widely acknowledged even Fenlon agreed and did the honourable thing.

But for the Hibernian Supporters’ Association to urge Petrie to follow suit shows little recognition for one of the safest pairs of hands in Scottish football. Petrie isn’t here to win personality contests, he’s running one of our biggest clubs – and has done so pretty damned impressively over the last 16 years.

Anyone who doubts that need only look around Scottish football and see the legacy of reckless, ego-driven financial mismanagement. The Rangers boardroom remains in a state of turmoil, Hearts are going down and debt-ridden Kilmarnock are embroiled in a civil war between the club’s chairman and supporters. Ask their rank-and-file fans if they wish their club’s leaders had shown a sliver of Petrie’s financial nous during the SPL’s boom time.

Celtic aside, Hibs are the last club you could imagine following the Gers, Jambos and Dunfermline into administration – all thanks to the solid stewardship of the man at the helm. They have been largely debt free for almost 10 years despite transforming Easter Road into a top-class facility and building a training ground that is the envy of clubs like Aberdeen.

All funded by breeding and then selling on stars such as Scott Brown, Garry O’Connor and Derek Riordan for top dollar. The perfect business model for a club of Hibs’ size. If most clubs had a hand as steady as that on the tiller in this uncertain financial climate they would be desperate to keep him, not hound him out the door.

Some say Rod has lost his touch for picking good managers and should step aside and let somebody else pick the next boss. OK, I’ll give you Colin Calderwood. His appointment was a total disaster and it’s a mystery why Petrie thought Hibs would flourish under a guy with even less charisma than he has.

But Fenlon, despite overseeing the worst results in Hibs’ history, was not a failure in my opinion – and hindsight might yet judge him more kindly. The Irishman dragged a divided dressing room clear of relegation and led the team to consecutive Scottish Cup finals. Yes, they were abject in both but how many Hibs managers have taken the club so close to the bogey trophy that has taken on Holy Grail status in Leith?

The next manager should at least be a more clear-cut appointment with Terry Butcher surely the man Petrie must secure. But if he does get Butcher he’ll be attracted not just by the club’s infrastructure and status, he’ll also know this is a good time to take over Hibs, with much of the hard groundwork already put in place by Fenlon. The Irishman knew he wasn’t the man to take Hibs the next step forward but he knows they are ready to take that step.

The club is on a solid footing and the fans would be wise not to forget it’s Petrie who has been the one keeping them in step with the times.

:duck:

[blackpoolhibs]

Another who thinks paying off manager after manager, who's bought player after player is good financial management.

Just imagine how good a financial position we'd be in had he been able to spot decent managers? :rolleyes:

[deek]

Another who thinks paying off manager after manager, who's bought player after player is good financial management.

Just imagine how good a financial position we'd be in had he been able to spot decent managers? :rolleyes:


I think spotting them and being able to afford them are two different things. I know it's not always down to money, but if we could have kept Mowbray for another year or two, do you think we would have been in a different place from where we are now? I would love to see our trophy room filled with silverware, but not at the price others have paid.

[Islington Hibs]

While this article does acknowledge a number of real positives I think it is time for a fresh face. 16 years at the helm is too long and new ideas are needed. The footballing side would get a C grade, at very best, over that period and it is time for new blood. Very happy and think we are lucky STF as our custodian but we need a more inspirational and clear approach still guided by sensible economics in my view.

[blackpoolhibs]

I think spotting them and being able to afford them are two different things. I know it's not always down to money, but if we could have kept Mowbray for another year or two, do you think we would have been in a different place from where we are now? I would love to see our trophy room filled with silverware, but not at the price others have paid.

We could afford Mowbray, who i think was on less than Calderclown, who was on roughly the same as Fenlon.

Now i know appointing a new manager is a bit of a gamble, but when you get it as wrong as he has over the years, the costs start to mount up.

As i said, manager pay offs, players pay offs, and compensation paid for those managers. Add this all up, and couple it with the poor crowds and low positional finishes, and this financial wizard has not done so good in my opinion.

Then you have the cut backs that have cut virtually everything to the bone, so much so we have supporters calling lapsed season ticket holders up to entice them back.

Has he really been that much of a success?

[Robinho08]

Petrie's biggest mistakes imho were backing the players over JC, hiring CC and not grabbing the reported £300K compo to release him, thus costing us £300K to sack him.

I had high hopes for Yogi and Fenlon. Somehow it didn't work for either of them.

[blackpoolhibs]

Petrie's biggest mistakes imho were backing the players over JC, hiring CC and not grabbing the reported £300K compo to release him, thus costing us £300K to sack him.

I had high hopes for Yogi and Fenlon. Somehow it didn't work for either of them.

You do know if folk like you keep repeating that, it does not become true?

Petrie DID NOT back the players, he did the opposite.

[HFC 0-7]

Did we get top dollar selling Riordan?

[Robinho08]

You do know if folk like you keep repeating that, it does not become true?

Petrie DID NOT back the players, he did the opposite.

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former.

[Saorsa]

We could afford Mowbray, who i think was on less than Calderclown, who was on roughly the same as Fenlon.

Now i know appointing a new manager is a bit of a gamble, but when you get it as wrong as he has over the years, the costs start to mount up.

As i said, managers pay off, players pay offs, and compensation paid for those managers. Add this all up, and couple it with the poor crowds and low positional finishes, and this financial wizard has not done so good in my opinion.

Then you have the cut backs that have cut virtually everything to the bone, so much so we have supporters calling lapsed season ticket holders up to entice them back.

Has he really been that much of a success?Correct, he's the one that lucky, lucky that this club still has so many supporters willing tae watch it efter 6 years of complete dross, lucky there are still so many who have been willing tae pay over 400 quid a season tae watch it. We are a fitba club and if this plum thinks we've been successful at that, maybe he should ask the near 5000 people who dinnae go any mair and who have been lost in the last 6 years. No much point in balancing the books if you're selling a product naebody wants tae watch, this club as been failing at the reason for which it exists and he is responsible for that, books balanced or otherwise.

[deek]

We could afford Mowbray, who i think was on less than Calderclown, who was on roughly the same as Fenlon.

Now i know appointing a new manager is a bit of a gamble, but when you get it as wrong as he has over the years, the costs start to mount up.

As i said, managers pay off, players pay offs, and compensation paid for those managers. Add this all up, and couple it with the poor crowds and low positional finishes, and this financial wizard has not done so good in my opinion.

Then you have the cut backs that have cut virtually everything to the bone, so much so we have supporters calling lapsed season ticket holders up to entice them back.

Has he really been that much of a success?

I see where you are coming from, but if you look at what you are saying, this is what I get out of it. With all those pay off's in compensation etc. and we still are relatively debt free, with a great stadium and training facility, then maybe he has done a good job? The picking of managers I think is not his strong point, but then this is based on hindsight. We just have to get behind who ever gets the job and hope that this is the one to take our team forward.

[blackpoolhibs]

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former.

Well you'd be wrong, Petrie as head of the ship HAD to listen to them. He'd have been neglecting his duties had he just left them standing on his front door.

Its only good manners to invite them in and listen to them and what they had to say. He did this and then told them to have it out with the manager, and backed Collins after it. Its all there if you can use google, although i know this to be true from someone who actually worked at the club at this time.

[Weststandwanab]

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former. Perhaps if BH has the time he could enlighten those of us who were under the impression that your opinion was correct !

[Hibs7]

Hard to disagree with the article financially. What other team in the SPL has built such a good infrastructure over the last 10 years ... None, but and it is a big but, Rod needs an experienced football man to run the football side within Hibs financial limits, without any direct interference from the financial side, there will be areas where they cross but neither should deflect the other from achieving their goals.. Simples !

[Hibrandenburg]

Another who thinks paying off manager after manager, who's bought player after player is good financial management.

Just imagine how good a financial position we'd be in had he been able to spot decent managers? :rolleyes:

So you've been against all his appointments BH?

[Ship Hibs]

If he does get Butcher in he's got the manager most fans want and managed to raise enough cash to afford the second biggest wage bill in the league, he's not all that bad but could have done a few things better but I doubt any of us have never made mistakes.

[Hibrandenburg]

Hard to disagree with the article financially. What other team in the SPL has built such a good infrastructure over the last 10 years ... None, but and it is a big but, Rod needs an experienced football man to run the football side within Hibs financial limits, without any direct interference from the financial side, three will be areas where they cross but neither should deflect the other from achieving their goals.. Simples !

Sensible post.

[Pretty Boy]

Perhaps if BH has the time he could enlighten those of us who were under the impression that your opinion was correct !

The 2 alleged ringleaders of the 'mutiny' were shipped out of ER at the 1st possible opportunity. The manager stayed.

[Hibrandenburg]

If he does get Butcher in he's got the manager most fans want and managed to raise enough cash to afford the second biggest wage bill in the league, he's not all that bad but could have done a few things better but I doubt any of us have never made mistakes.

Unless you have the advantage of commenting in hindsight, then it's easy.

[Mister P]

He can certainly run the financials of the club, no one can argue that. That is why the financial side is doing well whilst the football side is not!
Let Petrie do the money, get a football man in to take care of that side of the business= dream team. Lol

[blackpoolhibs]

I see where you are coming from, but if you look at what you are saying, this is what I get out of it. With all those pay off's in compensation etc. and we still are relatively debt free, with a great stadium and training facility, then maybe he has done a good job? The picking of managers I think is not his strong point, but then this is based on hindsight. We just have to get behind who ever gets the job and hope that this is the one to take our team forward.

I agree, building the ground and training centre is a huge plus. I think we have a terrific stadium now, plus the training centre looks great, and although i have never been everyone says it the dogs bolloxs.

Now building the ground to house 10k fans seems a waste of time, and failed manager after manager has got us to this point.

Income for our club comes mostly through people through the gate, and when we are doing well more folk come through the gate.

Doing well brings success and more income, we all know this. Yet doing well on the park seems to as an outsider as secondary to doing well off the park.

As i said earlier, we are now cutting back so much we need supporters to come in and do work for nothing to entice folk back.

We have cut back so much in my opinion, there's not much more they can cut. Yet this is seen by some as financial prudence, and yet the team have suffered for the best part of 7 years.

This terrific chairman has been at the helm for this, we have been watching some of the worst football in many years under his appointments and guidance.

Forgive me for not agreeing he's that good at his job, when the main reason we all go to Easter Road is to watch Football, and not bank statements or new stands.

We have the infrastructure now, we've had it for a few years now, but he has wasted a fortune too.

Just how much patience does Petrie think folk have?

[Heedersnvolleys]

We could afford Mowbray, who i think was on less than Calderclown, who was on roughly the same as Fenlon.

Now i know appointing a new manager is a bit of a gamble, but when you get it as wrong as he has over the years, the costs start to mount up.

As i said, manager pay offs, players pay offs, and compensation paid for those managers. Add this all up, and couple it with the poor crowds and low positional finishes, and this financial wizard has not done so good in my opinion.

Then you have the cut backs that have cut virtually everything to the bone, so much so we have supporters calling lapsed season ticket holders up to entice them back.

Has he really been that much of a success?

Have to say it would be interesting to know how much all that adds up too. Falling crowds is a hard one as there has been a general fall in crowds all over the league.

[Saorsa]

If he does get Butcher in he's got the manager most fans want and managed to raise enough cash to afford the second biggest wage bill in the league, he's not all that bad but could have done a few things better but I doubt any of us have never made mistakes.When most people make mistakes particularly on the scale he has, they carry the consequences of those mistakes, he on the other hand carries on unscathed tae make the next mistake then the next one, then the next one. Others carry the can and pay for it, the punters, the staff who have lost their jobs in his cut back tae cover losses.

[Leithenhibby]

For me it's, "better the devil you know".... It's not been perfect, far from it, with a few mistakes along the way. I do know what side of the city I'd rather be on when it comes to "club running" :wink:


+, Only room at ER for one Reilly, and it ain't mike :rolleyes:

[deek]

I agree, building the ground and training centre is a huge plus. I think we have a terrific stadium now, plus the training centre looks great, and although i have never been everyone says it the dogs bolloxs.

Now building the ground to house 10k fans seems a waste of time, and failed manager after manager has got us to this point.

Income for our club comes mostly through people through the gate, and when we are doing well more folk come through the gate.

Doing well brings success and more income, we all know this. Yet doing well on the park seems to as an outsider as secondary to doing well off the park.

As i said earlier, we are now cutting back so much we need supporters to come in and do work for nothing to entice folk back.

We have cut back so much in my opinion, there's not much more they can cut. Yet this is seen by some as financial prudence, and yet the team have suffered for the best part of 7 years.

This terrific chairman has been at the helm for this, we have been watching some of the worst football in many years under his appointments and guidance.

Forgive me for not agreeing he's that good at his job, when the main reason we all go to Easter Road is to watch Football, and not bank statements or new stands.

We have the infrastructure now, we've had it for a few years now, but he has wasted a fortune too.

Just how much patience does Petrie think folk have?

For me the answer to your question on patience is easy, I will never stop supporting the Hibs, it's in my blood, like many many others, most likely yourself included. But the frustration is there, that's for sure, but what can be done. He has the purse, there is no one better at using it in my mind, and I think we all agree that the footballing side is not his forte. It's down to a personal choice if you keep putting your hard earned cash into tickets etc.

[Captain Trips]

Petrie is like a player good form in the first few seasons but as time has gone on he has dropped the ball and we have entered the Zibi phase.

Petrie started losing it once we sold all the good players on, he has been found wanting when football is at the fore rather than selling players for millions or building training centres.

[Ozyhibby]

Petrie is far from perfect but I still think he's the best chairman around.

[greenpaper55]

I wonder when the new manager comes in that he will have have a free hand in regards to players budget etc within reason of course, we keep hearing that Rod has maybe to much of a say in who we buy and at what price and there was even a suggestion that a couple of signings ie Sproule and Garry O were his doing.

[Weir7]

Petrie's biggest mistakes imho were backing the players over JC, hiring CC and not grabbing the reported £300K compo to release him, thus costing us £300K to sack him.

I had high hopes for Yogi and Fenlon. Somehow it didn't work for either of them.
I'm no fan of Rod. But he backed JC. And end of meeting he asked players what they wanted, I know the player who said sack JC. They were told no. Get back to working with him. He's your boss.

[lyonhibs]

If someone walked into your living room, did a big steaming *****, took £400 of your money to watch that steaming ***** stinking the place out and then only after 12-18 months of that ***** being a stinking pestilence came in and cleaned it up, would your reaction be "oh, well done for recognizing that that ***** absolutely reeked, here's another £400 of my money"??

I am - clearly - being a tad facile with the above analogy but the point bears considering. Fenlon walked, so I imagine saved us paying off his contract, but - assuming Petrie is in fact the man with the final say on managerial appointments, how many times do we need to go through this 12-18 month cycle before folk start to look to the top of the tree as the source of the problem, and more to the point how many fans have - at least - downgraded from "ST holder" to "go when I want" or - even worse - more or less binned going to ER completely as a result of the past 5-6 years of grinding incompetence??

This next managerial appointment and more specifically how quickly a turnaround in performances is witnessed could be the difference between the answer to the 2nd question being " a few hundred" and "a few thousand"

[Saorsa]

If someone walked into your living room, did a big steaming *****, took £400 of your money to watch that steaming ***** stinking the place out and then only after 12-18 months of that ***** being a stinking pestilence came in and cleaned it up, would your reaction be "oh, well done for recognizing that that ***** absolutely reeked, here's another £400 of my money"??

I am - clearly - being a tad facile with the above analogy but the point bears considering. Fenlon walked, so I imagine saved us paying off his contract, but - assuming Petrie is in fact the man with the final say on managerial appointments, how many times do we need to go through this 12-18 month cycle before (some) folk start to look to the top of the tree as the source of the problem?I've been looking there for years.

[jacomo]

Some good points made on this thread, it is not black and white and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge the position Hibs are in versus most other clubs in the UK, not just Scotland. Having been £17m in debt in 2003 and seriously contemplating leaving Leith, Hibs have invested well and are in a strong financial position. Petrie deserves credit for this.

On the other hand, we have had little stability in terms of the manager or players and the 'Golden Generation' was an extraordinary stroke of luck at precisely the time the club was skint and desperate for income from somewhere. We have also had an owner who has given us time and space to sort out the finances. The creation of a separate 'football department' at East Mains under Scott Lindsay was short-lived and stupid. Oh, and the whole Calderwood episode was a fiasco from start to finish.

I still think there is something not quite right at Hibs and we are punching below our weight. I was a strong supporter of the training centre but why have we not seen more tangible results from it?

As has been said on here many times, this season represented a huge opportunity for this club, and so far we look to have blown it. Petrie cannot escape responsibility for this.

[Saorsa]

Some good points made on this thread, it is not black and white and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge the position Hibs are in versus most other clubs in the UK, not just Scotland. Having been £17m in debt in 2003 and seriously contemplating leaving Leith, Hibs have invested well and are in a strong financial position. Petrie deserves credit for this.

On the other hand, we have had little stability in terms of the manager or players and the 'Golden Generation' was an extraordinary stroke of luck at precisely the time the club was skint and desperate for income from somewhere. We have also had an owner who has given us time and space to sort out the finances. The creation of a separate 'football department' at East Mains under Scott Lindsay was short-lived and stupid. Oh, and the whole Calderwood episode was a fiasco from start to finish.

I still think there is something not quite right at Hibs and we are punching below our weight. I was a strong supporter of the training centre but why have we not seen more tangible results from it?

As has been said on here many times, this season represented a huge opportunity for this club, and so far we look to have blown it. Petrie cannot escape responsibility for this.He will though, put your shirt or even your house on it. It's something/somebody/anybody else's fault

[PatHead]

Petrie's biggest mistakes imho were backing the players over JC, hiring CC and not grabbing the reported £300K compo to release him, thus costing us £300K to sack him.

I had high hopes for Yogi and Fenlon. Somehow it didn't work for either of them.

Despite it being a Hibs.net FACT we were never offered £300,000 for Calderwood. One club enquired about how much Hibs wanted but the amount they were considering was less than we paid to get him in the first place. The other club reported to have made an offer never did. That is the real fact on the matter. Petrie has made mistakes but that was not one of them.

[Saorsa]

Despite it being a Hibs.net FACT we were never offered £300,000 for Calderwood. One club enquired about how much Hibs wanted but the amount they were considering was less than we paid to get him in the first place. The other club reported to have made an offer never did. That is the real fact on the matter. Petrie has made mistakes but that was not one of them.So something was still offered tae get rid of him that would have at least recouped some of the six figure sum wasted on Petrie's 'great coup' in the 1st place, but it was refused? We could even have got rid for nothing with nae pay off but instead Petrie still insisted he was the man for the job (even if most others could see he was a bigger dumplin' than Hughes) only tae empty him a few months later and have tae pay him off wasting mair money.

[Phil D. Rolls]

Some good points made on this thread, it is not black and white and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge the position Hibs are in versus most other clubs in the UK, not just Scotland. Having been £17m in debt in 2003 and seriously contemplating leaving Leith, Hibs have invested well and are in a strong financial position. Petrie deserves credit for this.

On the other hand, we have had little stability in terms of the manager or players and the 'Golden Generation' was an extraordinary stroke of luck at precisely the time the club was skint and desperate for income from somewhere. We have also had an owner who has given us time and space to sort out the finances. The creation of a separate 'football department' at East Mains under Scott Lindsay was short-lived and stupid. Oh, and the whole Calderwood episode was a fiasco from start to finish.

I still think there is something not quite right at Hibs and we are punching below our weight. I was a strong supporter of the training centre but why have we not seen more tangible results from it?

As has been said on here many times, this season represented a huge opportunity for this club, and so far we look to have blown it. Petrie cannot escape responsibility for this.

Is it fair to call The Golden Generation "a stroke of luck"? Is it not the case that, recognising the potential of those players, Petrie appointed the right people to realise their full potential?

[easty]

From speaking to other Hibs fans I know, I appear to be in the minority in not having any problem with Petrie.

Seems that for some folk it's just good luck that we are in a decent position financially, stadium and training ground. If we didnt have the golden generation...blah blah blah. But it's not bad luck that the managerial appointments haven't worked out, it's The Taches fault!

Getting the right manager isn't an easy job. Unless you can afford to go out and get a top top man, like Mourinho or something. At least when you're signing a player you can give him a trial and/or scout them beforehand. With a manager you're looking at thier record, maybe at how they have thier current team playing if they have one, and what they say in an interview.

Fenlon had a decent record in Ireland, then he obviously spoke a good game in the interview. I don't blame RP for the fact that PF was a failure here, that's was Pats own fault.

[jacomo]

Is it fair to call The Golden Generation "a stroke of luck"? Is it not the case that, recognising the potential of those players, Petrie appointed the right people to realise their full potential?

To get so many talented young players coming through at the same time owed a great deal to fortune, yes. Same as at any club, e.g. Man Utd with their crop of players in the 1990s.

Undeniably, credit should go to the scouts and coaches involved, and the club for getting most of the players on long contracts so we could realise the maximum value from them, but luck played its part.

[Liberal Hibby]

I don't blame RP for the fact that PF was a failure here, that's was Pats own fault.

Pat wasn't a failure here. He left the club stronger than he found it.

[Robinho08]

You do know if folk like you keep repeating that, it does not become true?

Petrie DID NOT back the players, he did the opposite.

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former.

[blackpoolhibs]

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former.

Why would you believe the former?

[Phil D. Rolls]

To get so many talented young players coming through at the same time owed a great deal to fortune, yes. Same as at any club, e.g. Man Utd with their crop of players in the 1990s.

Undeniably, credit should go to the scouts and coaches involved, and the club for getting most of the players on long contracts so we could realise the maximum value from them, but luck played its part.

It's not the cards you are dealt, it's the way you play them. But we did get dealt a good hand.

At a time when other clubs saw the OF snaffle their best players for buttons, Petrie was able to get millions for ours.

[jodjam]

From speaking to other Hibs fans I know, I appear to be in the minority in not having any problem with Petrie.

Seems that for some folk it's just good luck that we are in a decent position financially, stadium and training ground. If we didnt have the golden generation...blah blah blah. But it's not bad luck that the managerial appointments haven't worked out, it's The Taches fault!

Getting the right manager isn't an easy job. Unless you can afford to go out and get a top top man, like Mourinho or something. At least when you're signing a player you can give him a trial and/or scout them beforehand. With a manager you're looking at thier record, maybe at how they have thier current team playing if they have one, and what they say in an interview.

Fenlon had a decent record in Ireland, then he obviously spoke a good game in the interview. I don't blame RP for the fact that PF was a failure here, that's was Pats own fault.

Good post

[TrinityHibs]

Some good points made on this thread, it is not black and white and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge the position Hibs are in versus most other clubs in the UK, not just Scotland. Having been £17m in debt in 2003 and seriously contemplating leaving Leith, Hibs have invested well and are in a strong financial position. Petrie deserves credit for this.

On the other hand, we have had little stability in terms of the manager or players and the 'Golden Generation' was an extraordinary stroke of luck at precisely the time the club was skint and desperate for income from somewhere. We have also had an owner who has given us time and space to sort out the finances. The creation of a separate 'football department' at East Mains under Scott Lindsay was short-lived and stupid. Oh, and the whole Calderwood episode was a fiasco from start to finish.

I still think there is something not quite right at Hibs and we are punching below our weight. I was a strong supporter of the training centre but why have we not seen more tangible results from it?

As has been said on here many times, this season represented a huge opportunity for this club, and so far we look to have blown it. Petrie cannot escape responsibility for this.

I agree with everything you say Jacomo but I feel most strongly about your third paragraph. As a club we have failed with youth development since the golden generation. Lewis came through and has been a solid squad player and Hanlon holds down a position. Other than that Alex Harris looks like he might be something and young Forster and Stanton have potential. I then struggle. How much money have Hibs pushed into the youth set up and where are the returns?

[blackpoolhibs]

Fair enough. I wasn't aware of that. Most 'folk' like me believed the former.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-503704/Collins-I-took-Hibs-far-I-could.html



Collins may have ended Hibernian's long wait for trophy success, but he did not have everything his own way in Leith.
Barely a fortnight after the CIS Insurance Cup final victory over Kilmarnock, Collins was facing a rebellion from several first-team players which he managed to see off.
When asked in April whether he could be forced to turn his back on his first managerial job, Collins replied: "Don't be ridiculous."

[Bostonhibby]

From speaking to other Hibs fans I know, I appear to be in the minority in not having any problem with Petrie.

Seems that for some folk it's just good luck that we are in a decent position financially, stadium and training ground. If we didnt have the golden generation...blah blah blah. But it's not bad luck that the managerial appointments haven't worked out, it's The Taches fault!

Getting the right manager isn't an easy job. Unless you can afford to go out and get a top top man, like Mourinho or something. At least when you're signing a player you can give him a trial and/or scout them beforehand. With a manager you're looking at thier record, maybe at how they have thier current team playing if they have one, and what they say in an interview.

Fenlon had a decent record in Ireland, then he obviously spoke a good game in the interview. I don't blame RP for the fact that PF was a failure here, that's was Pats own fault.

Am with you on this part and still feel the off field bit Rod deserves continued credit for............

[brog]

I thought it was a reasonable article & was at least different to read something positive about Hibs for a change. However, some of the stuff re RP ( on this board as well ) being a financial genius is nonsense. It was JC who got us top dollar for the twins, RP was ready to accept £4.4m for both & it was JC who almost held RP down until he broke the budget & got Fletch tied up on a long term contract. That move alone brought us several £m more than we otherwise would have received. Yogi did likewise with the outlay on Stokes though RP having seen the fantastic return on Fletch was more amenable to do the deal.
RP may be good at finance but IMO he's still not particularly good at football finance.
Separately I find it hard to be overly critical of RP re most of his managerial appointments. With the exception of Blobby, IIRC I was reasonably pleased at the time of the appointment & his biggest success, Mowbray, came right out the blue. Hopefully this time we'll have some long-term stability & success.

[Beefster]

So you've been against all his appointments BH?

I think this is a fair point but sort of ignores the role of the club/execs in picking the manager. The feelings of the support shouldn't really be a consideration IMHO (although I'm not stupid enough to think that it isn't a big part)

FWIW, I was chuffed with McLeish, ecstatic about Sauzee, I was happy enough with Williamson and bemused by Mowbray until I heard him speak. I was a bit non-plussed with Collins, Mixu and Hughes, all of whom I thought were the easy option and pandering to the fans. Calderwood, I was initially disappointed that it wasn't Steve Clarke but I thought Calderwood would do a job, and Fenlon I thought was fair enough, primarily based on the fact that Dundee Utd had tried to get him.

[Hibercelona]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

[Liberal Hibby]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

Just because you keep saying it doesn't make it true (see player rebellion thread). What's the evidence for this? How much has been 'squandered'? And how much is our budget this year compared with last year?

[Onion]

Hard to disagree with the article financially. What other team in the SPL has built such a good infrastructure over the last 10 years ... None, but and it is a big but, Rod needs an experienced football man to run the football side within Hibs financial limits, without any direct interference from the financial side, there will be areas where they cross but neither should deflect the other from achieving their goals.. Simples !

The article is a regurge of the same rubbish you get on .net about Petrie's achievements. The fact is money and infrastructure are enablers and not goals in themselves. It's what you DO with the money and how you use the infrastructure to build a successful football team that matters. Football wise, we've massively under performed and appear to have no coherent plan or objectives for the football club.

[Hibercelona]

Just because you keep saying it doesn't make it true (see player rebellion thread). What's the evidence for this? How much has been 'squandered'? And how much is our budget this year compared with last year?

What evidence?

I take it the costs of bringing managers in, paying them off and overhauling the squad several times just never happened?

I take it the letting go of seveal board members in a cost cutting measure to try and accommodate such costs never happened either?

The evidence is right there. You can easily gather evidence simply by looking back on whats been happening over the last few years.

[easty]

Pat wasn't a failure here. He left the club stronger than he found it.

Naw....he didnae.

[Phil D. Rolls]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

Well, that's one theory.

[easty]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

When in Rome...

[Hibercelona]

Well, that's one theory.

Care to put forth an alternative? Because I really can't think of any.

[lyonhibs]

I've been looking there for years.

11253

:greengrin

[Saorsa]

11253

:greengrin:greengrin

[Phil D. Rolls]

Care to put forth an alternative? Because I really can't think of any.

Not really, I don't have access to all the facts.

[Hibercelona]

Not really, I don't have access to all the facts.

So you can't think of any alternative theory? Cool.

[Mikey]

If you strip out the lies, conspiracy theories and misinformation I think you would find that most Hibs fans don't have a problem with him being in charge. Just because a few know how to use Copy and Paste doesn't make him bad :wink:

[allmodcons]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

What nonsense.
Can you please provide some figures to substantiate your argument?
How much, in your opinion, have RP's 'repetitive mistakes' cost Hibs?
Are you talking an average of £100k per annum/£200k per annum during RP's tenure or do you, in truth, not have the figures available to you?
There is no doubt that removing a manager from post before the end of their contract costs the club money but, in the scheme of things (i.e. - against an annual turnover circa £7M - £8M), we're not talking big bucks here.
To suggest that RP is cutting costs to accommodate his own mistakes is just plain ridiculous.

[Phil D. Rolls]

So you can't think of any alternative theory? Cool.

Where are you going with this?


What nonsense.
Can you please provide some figures to substantiate your argument?
How much, in your opinion, have RP's 'repetitive mistakes' cost Hibs?
Are you talking an average of £100k per annum/£200k per annum during RP's tenure or do you, in truth, not have the figures available to you?
There is no doubt that removing a manager from post before the end of their contract costs the club money but, in the scheme of things (i.e. - against an annual turnover circa £7M - £8M), we're not talking big bucks here.
To suggest that RP is cutting costs to accommodate his own mistakes is just plain ridiculous.

And possibly defamatory.

[Captain Trips]

What nonsense.
Can you please provide some figures to substantiate your argument?
How much, in your opinion, have RP's 'repetitive mistakes' cost Hibs?
Are you talking an average of £100k per annum/£200k per annum during RP's tenure or do you, in truth, not have the figures available to you?
There is no doubt that removing a manager from post before the end of their contract costs the club money but, in the scheme of things (i.e. - against an annual turnover circa £7M - £8M), we're not talking big bucks here.
To suggest that RP is cutting costs to accommodate his own mistakes is just plain ridiculous.

Where did the money come from we had to pay CC? How much did we knock back for CC a few months before?. The transfer budgets we have would mean paying even 10k is big.

Paying anyone after sacking them is costly for Hibs.

[Mikey]

The only reason the balance sheets have stayed so steady is because Petrie has been cutting costs to accommodate his repeatitive mistkaes.

It doesn't take a finanical wizard to do this.

If you can't afford a full turkey at chrismas because you've squandered too much cash at the races, you buy a half turkey instead.

The stupidity of your posts never ceases to amaze. Or should that be amuse :hilarious

[allmodcons]

What nonsense.
Can you please provide some figures to substantiate your argument?
How much, in your opinion, have RP's 'repetitive mistakes' cost Hibs?
Are you talking an average of £100k per annum/£200k per annum during RP's tenure or do you, in truth, not have the figures available to you?
There is no doubt that removing a manager from post before the end of their contract costs the club money but, in the scheme of things (i.e. - against an annual turnover circa £7M - £8M), we're not talking big bucks here.
To suggest that RP is cutting costs to accommodate his own mistakes is just plain ridiculous.


Where did the money come from we had to pay CC? How much did we knock back for CC a few months before?. The transfer budgets we have would mean paying even 10k is big.

Paying anyone after sacking them is costly for Hibs.


If you read my post you'll clearly see I'm not disputing the fact that it costs the club money to end a contract mid term.

S**t happens in business, would you rather RP let CC see out his contract or admit to the mistake and get rid?

FWIW, I'm not suggesting RP hasn't made mistakes but, I'll say again, to suggest that RP is cutting costs to accommodate his own mistakes is just plain ridiculous.

Do you honestly believe that cost cutting measures and the balancing of books is centred around accommodating RP's mistakes?

[Blackhall Hibby]

It appears that we all have short memories when it comes to Rod's appointments. I didn't hear too many words of dissent when previous managers were appointed, apart from possibly Tony Mowbray ironically enough, although that was probably down to the fact that it came out of 'left field', and also Bobby Williamson (although he had done a reasonable job at Killie with his hands tied before we got him). Even Calderwood's appointment was treated with cautious optimism. Rod does not have a crystal ball and can only really judge the potential of managers on past records. If they fail to continue that record at Hibs then it is not directly his fault. He has generally picked managers that the support were happy with at the time of appointment, and has given most of them the tools to make a success of it. Importantly, he has also removed them when they have failed. Having said that, the potential appointment of Terry Butcher would appear to get the blessing of most Hibs fans, but his tenures in Australia and down south were not exactly scintillating, so failure is somewhere in his DNA (you have been warned!). However, I for one would welcome this appointment if it were made, but if things don't go as well as we all would like, how long before the dissension begins again, and we start blaming Rod again for another management failure?

I'm afraid that the tendency of looking for someone else to blame when things don't go well is rife in our society, and no different in football, and Rod will continue to get out flack for management failures, regardless of our collective enthusiasm for that appointment at the outset. On the whole, Rod had done a marvellous job, given our income and crowd-base, which actually has a tendency to desert when things don't go well, usually with mutterings about the 'Hibs way' of playing football. To be honest, we have to stop calling for heads. Apart from managers not wanting to take up the Hibs post because it has become a poisoned chalice, players will no longer want to sign for us because the home crowd are always on their backs. They also get personal abuse hurled at them (and if reports were to be believed, also bottles!!), which can only drag down the stature of our club. While Rod has presided over management appointments, given the state of Scottish football and the finances at Hibs (although we are one of the better ones), he (and the Board) can only appoint from a relatively narrow list of candidates and success, as we know, cannot be guaranteed. So rather than berating Rod Petrie, we should applaud him for his efforts in running our team - just have a look around the mess that is Scottish football and be very careful for what you wish for.

[FRes Hibbie]

So you can't think of any alternative theory? Cool.

Can you not just go away? Such a nippy, snidey pseudo-intellectual.

[number 27]

The stupidity of your posts never ceases to amaze. Or should that be amuse :hilarious

I find it quite interesting that there was recently a thread which was closed down on the grounds that you might start taking personal abuse although nobody had actually done anything more than ask a question.

Given that, it does seem strange that you seem so comfortable with personally attacking Hibercelona every time he posts. I notice a number of other posters jumping on the bandwagon too. I certainly don't agree with everything he posts but surely posters can debate with him rather than carrying out what seems a suspiciously organised attempt to drive him away.

[The Sea-gull]

I find it quite interesting that there was recently a thread which was closed down on the grounds that you might start taking personal abuse although nobody had actually done anything more than ask a question.

Given that, it does seem strange that you seem so comfortable with personally attacking Hibercelona every time he posts. I notice a number of other posters jumping on the bandwagon too. I certainly don't agree with everything he posts but surely posters can debate with him rather than carrying out what seems a suspiciously organised attempt to drive him away.

It's Mikey's ball though. He gets to make the rules up and decide who plays.

[Phil D. Rolls]

It appears that we all have short memories when it comes to Rod's appointments. I didn't hear too many words of dissent when previous managers were appointed, apart from possibly Tony Mowbray ironically enough, although that was probably down to the fact that it came out of 'left field', and also Bobby Williamson (although he had done a reasonable job at Killie with his hands tied before we got him). Even Calderwood's appointment was treated with cautious optimism. Rod does not have a crystal ball and can only really judge the potential of managers on past records. If they fail to continue that record at Hibs then it is not directly his fault. He has generally picked managers that the support were happy with at the time of appointment, and has given most of them the tools to make a success of it. Importantly, he has also removed them when they have failed. Having said that, the potential appointment of Terry Butcher would appear to get the blessing of most Hibs fans, but his tenures in Australia and down south were not exactly scintillating, so failure is somewhere in his DNA (you have been warned!). However, I for one would welcome this appointment if it were made, but if things don't go as well as we all would like, how long before the dissension begins again, and we start blaming Rod again for another management failure?

I'm afraid that the tendency of looking for someone else to blame when things don't go well is rife in our society, and no different in football, and Rod will continue to get out flack for management failures, regardless of our collective enthusiasm for that appointment at the outset. On the whole, Rod had done a marvellous job, given our income and crowd-base, which actually has a tendency to desert when things don't go well, usually with mutterings about the 'Hibs way' of playing football. To be honest, we have to stop calling for heads. Apart from managers not wanting to take up the Hibs post because it has become a poisoned chalice, players will no longer want to sign for us because the home crowd are always on their backs. They also get personal abuse hurled at them (and if reports were to be believed, also bottles!!), which can only drag down the stature of our club. While Rod has presided over management appointments, given the state of Scottish football and the finances at Hibs (although we are one of the better ones), he (and the Board) can only appoint from a relatively narrow list of candidates and success, as we know, cannot be guaranteed. So rather than berating Rod Petrie, we should applaud him for his efforts in running our team - just have a look around the mess that is Scottish football and be very careful for what you wish for.

Welcome to the forum! :aok:

[DarlingtonHibee]

The stupidity of your posts never ceases to amaze. Or should that be amuse :hilarious


Mikey - give him a break, he is 22 after all - great at slagging Hibs board and our Chairman, but has no fact's and no clue as to how he would change thing's...

[Phil D. Rolls]

This from ICT Forum

http://caleythistleonline.com/topic/27522-butcher-offski/?p=386214


Hibs are not going to get a big amount from renting out their stadium. Maybe 50k a time that will go into Petrie's pocket. I dont think Terry will go to ER. He'll have spoken to others and will know that Petrie isn't the man to work for. He doesn't give managers a chance. He sells of good players but doesn't buy in suitable replacements. Petrie see's players as a commodity to fund his own lifestyle. Since taking over as chairman he's managed to get through six managers. He raised around £12 million from the sale of players yet failed to put anything into the playing budget. Instead he expects his coaches to bring more youngsters through the academy to be sold off. The guys an accountant and wants to bring cash in but not spend.


Ok, when did Yogi move to Inverness?

[stevejordan]

Correct, he's the one that lucky, lucky that this club still has so many supporters willing tae watch it efter 6 years of complete dross, lucky there are still so many who have been willing tae pay over 400 quid a season tae watch it. We are a fitba club and if this plum thinks we've been successful at that, maybe he should ask the near 5000 people who dinnae go any mair and who have been lost in the last 6 years. No much point in balancing the books if you're selling a product naebody wants tae watch, this club as been failing at the reason for which it exists and he is responsible for that, books balanced or otherwise.

Don Teflon that is funny but true he should have stepped aside after the mess he made with Colin Calderwood.

[RIP]

If you strip out the lies, conspiracy theories and misinformation I think you would find that most Hibs fans don't have a problem with him being in charge. Just because a few know how to use Copy and Paste doesn't make him bad :wink:

Mikey - are you sure our supporters understand what qualities to look for in an executive chairman?

There's a lot more to it than picking a manager and balancing the books

[jakeshibs]

Petrie is far from perfect but I still think he's the best chairman around.

I Agree.

[DarlingtonHibee]

I Agree.

This:top marks

[jakeshibs]

It appears that we all have short memories when it comes to Rod's appointments. I didn't hear too many words of dissent when previous managers were appointed, apart from possibly Tony Mowbray ironically enough, although that was probably down to the fact that it came out of 'left field', and also Bobby Williamson (although he had done a reasonable job at Killie with his hands tied before we got him). Even Calderwood's appointment was treated with cautious optimism. Rod does not have a crystal ball and can only really judge the potential of managers on past records. If they fail to continue that record at Hibs then it is not directly his fault. He has generally picked managers that the support were happy with at the time of appointment, and has given most of them the tools to make a success of it. Importantly, he has also removed them when they have failed. Having said that, the potential appointment of Terry Butcher would appear to get the blessing of most Hibs fans, but his tenures in Australia and down south were not exactly scintillating, so failure is somewhere in his DNA (you have been warned!). However, I for one would welcome this appointment if it were made, but if things don't go as well as we all would like, how long before the dissension begins again, and we start blaming Rod again for another management failure?

I'm afraid that the tendency of looking for someone else to blame when things don't go well is rife in our society, and no different in football, and Rod will continue to get out flack for management failures, regardless of our collective enthusiasm for that appointment at the outset. On the whole, Rod had done a marvellous job, given our income and crowd-base, which actually has a tendency to desert when things don't go well, usually with mutterings about the 'Hibs way' of playing football. To be honest, we have to stop calling for heads. Apart from managers not wanting to take up the Hibs post because it has become a poisoned chalice, players will no longer want to sign for us because the home crowd are always on their backs. They also get personal abuse hurled at them (and if reports were to be believed, also bottles!!), which can only drag down the stature of our club. While Rod has presided over management appointments, given the state of Scottish football and the finances at Hibs (although we are one of the better ones), he (and the Board) can only appoint from a relatively narrow list of candidates and success, as we know, cannot be guaranteed. So rather than berating Rod Petrie, we should applaud him for his efforts in running our team - just have a look around the mess that is Scottish football and be very careful for what you wish for.

I like your post and explains how I feel, football on the pitch, style we play is not his business, making money available and keeping us steady is and I think he does it well, many may disagree but we all have different opinions.

[The Modfather]

The stupidity of your posts never ceases to amaze. Or should that be amuse :hilarious

As others have posted, why not try and bring something to the conversation in relation to Hibcerlona's posts? If you cant do that why not try the ignore button.

He/she may post things I disagree with at times but he/she is at least consistent. There was a thread recently where Andy74 was defending the indefensible (sorry Andy :wink:) and the tone began to turn personal. A few posters, rightly, highlighted this and tried to keep the thread constructive.

Personally I think you are Rod Petrie Mikey :greengrin and it's my opinion that by and large you only cheerlead all things Hibs and evade any of the constructive criticism. However I don't feel the need to belittle your posts because I have vastly different view point than yourself.

[rcarter1]

In defence of Rod:

Mr P has spotted a remarkable inverse relationship between average attendance and likelyhood of top 6 finish.
It goes a bit peat tong for 1st place, but surely the plan is to bore/annoy/depress as many fans as you can to achieve truly sustainable attendances of around 5000. He said he has a five year plan, how many of us will be left by the time we reach our true potential?

:greengrin

[Criswell]

I've never forgiven him for selling our main striker a matter of days before that semi-final

[Jonnyboy]

This from ICT Forum

http://caleythistleonline.com/topic/27522-butcher-offski/?p=386214

Hibs are not going to get a big amount from renting out their stadium. Maybe 50k a time that will go into Petrie's pocket. I dont think Terry will go to ER. He'll have spoken to others and will know that Petrie isn't the man to work for. He doesn't give managers a chance. He sells of good players but doesn't buy in suitable replacements. Petrie see's players as a commodity to fund his own lifestyle. Since taking over as chairman he's managed to get through six managers. He raised around £12 million from the sale of players yet failed to put anything into the playing budget. Instead he expects his coaches to bring more youngsters through the academy to be sold off. The guys an accountant and wants to bring cash in but not spend.



Ok, when did Yogi move to Inverness?

Not even his biggest detractors on here would accuse Rod of this :faf:

[rcarter1]

Not even his biggest detractors on here would accuse Rod of this :faf:

Im strangely comforted by the fact that opposing fans view of our club are even more unreasonable than ours..

[Hibercelona]

Im strangely comforted by the fact that opposing fans view of our club are even more unreasonable than ours..

Or perhaps unblinkered?

[rcarter1]

Or perhaps unblinkered?

At times definitely, but Ive not heard or seen anything to suggest the ICT fans comments were anything other than fabrication.

[brog]

I've never forgiven him for selling our main striker a matter of days before that semi-final

Yep & out with the transfer window! £2m in hand from the Russians outweighed the chance of the Holy Grail!

[jabis]

Another who thinks paying off manager after manager, who's bought player after player is good financial management.

Just imagine how good a financial position we'd be in had he been able to spot decent managers? :rolleyes:

just read the first the first post,it's the jambo :na na:

[The Falcon]

Or perhaps unblinkered?

I'd hate to see your "unblinkered" take on events. :greengrin

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Well you'd be wrong, Petrie as head of the ship HAD to listen to them. He'd have been neglecting his duties had he just left them standing on his front door.

Its only good manners to invite them in and listen to them and what they had to say. He did this and then told them to have it out with the manager, and backed Collins after it. Its all there if you can use google, although i know this to be true from someone who actually worked at the club at this time.

This post along with other myth-busters should appear as a sticky until it penetrates... (unlike our attack at present :) )

[BSEJVT]

Whilst there is no doubt Rod has made some mistakes there doesn't seem to be any acknowledgment that every other chairman in the land has made them too without anything like the same upside he has achieved.

Football is littered with managerial appointments that looked good but failed to work and turning to Pat Fenlon,s tenure there was a clear and widespread understanding that whoever the incoming manager was at that time required time to be given a chance to reform the structure and team.

I wouldn't know the statistic overall, but in my 40 plus years as a Hibs supporter I think only Ned, Miller, Mcleish and Mowbray could be termed relative successes and 2 of them arguably left before being found out and the other 2 arguably long overstayed their welcome!

I think what's failed to be appreciated in all of this is that in the recent past Football Clubs have gone from being Banks poster boys to pariah's in very short order and a lot of the cost cutting and dumbing down of the staff and particularly playing pool has been taken from his hands and mandated by the Bank.

Given STF's ownership I accept many of you will find that hard to believe, but it is nonetheless a fact and many of our competitors have suffered similarly or indeed worse.

There is no question we have underachieved against our peers but in many ways this is typical of larger business cutting costs versus smaller peers.

The disruption and disharmony suffered is greater as they have further to fall from a greater height and employees used to the trappings of greater wealth and success are more dislocated.

You also have longer serving guys on existing big contracts being resented by newer comparatively poorly paid recruits.

There is no chance of Petrie resigning ever, retiring yes one day, resigning never. So much hot air and divisiveness is wasted on this topic when we would all IMO be better setting this aside till we sack the next man! and getting behind the club board manager and team.

[spike220]

Rod is legend, in a few years time he will be proved right. Long standing success does not happen overnight, it may look like it does, but it doesn't. Rod has his eyes set on the prize and I firmly believe he is the man to deliver. Hibs is in good hands. I also believe that Rod will take the losses as hard as any of us and I know he will absolutely despise losing to hearts. Rod is a huge Hibs fan and I am grateful for that. Those that unpick his decisions using 20/20 hindsight are kidding themselves they could do any better. I hold Rod in the highest regard. Let anyone that grow and sustain such a formidable tash be the first ones to cast a stone. GGTTH. P.S. why does the return key not work on these pages anymore??

[Eyrie]

Rod is legend, in a few years time he will be proved right. Long standing success does not happen overnight, it may look like it does, but it doesn't. Rod has his eyes set on the prize and I firmly believe he is the man to deliver. Hibs is in good hands. I also believe that Rod will take the losses as hard as any of us and I know he will absolutely despise losing to hearts. Rod is a huge Hibs fan and I am grateful for that. Those that unpick his decisions using 20/20 hindsight are kidding themselves they could do any better. I hold Rod in the highest regard. Let anyone that grow and sustain such a formidable tash be the first ones to cast a stone. GGTTH. P.S. why does the return key not work on these pages anymore? ?

Click on the button "A/A" at the top left of the various icons when posting and the return key works again.

[HibeeMG]

What I'd like to know is whether Rod has learned from his mistakes. Not the mistakes regarding appointing managers as, by and large, the appointments he made were not seen as bad decisions at the time.

I want to know whether he will carry on in exactly the same manner and hope against hope that the new manager will revolutionize our team and club.

Or will he realise at last that there needs to be better communication between the squad, management, board and fans?

The recent introduction of the fans forums have been welcome but they have been mainly fan led. You get the impression from Rod, when he's been questioned, that he sees them as an unwelcome distraction.

As Albert Einstein said, insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.