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View Full Version : What we need is an arse kicker.



madabouthibs
01-11-2013, 09:53 PM
We have a good squad of decent players that are seriously under performing, including some proven SPL players that have performed reasonably well for other SPL teams.
We seem to be a free meal ticket to a decent wage and mediocre mid table acceptability.
We need a hardman that won't accept any crap.

Nope, I can't think of anyone either.......... :rolleyes:

Wotherspiniesta
01-11-2013, 10:03 PM
I've always hard that threatening your staff brings the best out of them.

Ozyhibby
01-11-2013, 10:07 PM
Collins tried that, didn't work.

tamig
01-11-2013, 10:14 PM
I'd settle for a decent manager myself.

One Day Soon
01-11-2013, 10:16 PM
If you want the best out of your players you need to get inside their heads, find out what makes them tick and then motivate them.

Mowbray was the best at this by a mile and the players loved him. He got poor players to be average, average players to be good and good players to be excellent.

I'd be amazed if he even considered us.

Steven_Hibs
01-11-2013, 10:17 PM
I'd say bring in someone like Di Canio, but it would be John Collins all over again :rolleyes: We need someone who knows the game, knows how the basics work. Someone with a european background?

Glory Lurker
01-11-2013, 10:17 PM
I think whoever takes over has a good squad to work with. They don't need hairdryered to perform, just deployed so that they can fulfill their potential. A screamer is not needed.

Aside from the unfortunate fact that there is a lot of managers out there without jobs, I genuinely think there will be a lot of attraction in the Hibs job because of the potential that the squad has. I think we might be pleasantly surprised by some of the folk that put their CVs forward.

The Harp
01-11-2013, 10:30 PM
We have a good squad of decent players that are seriously under performing, including some proven SPL players that have performed reasonably well for other SPL teams.
We seem to be a free meal ticket to a decent wage and mediocre mid table acceptability.
We need a hardman that won't accept any crap.

Nope, I can't think of anyone either.......... :rolleyes:

I'd hope the new incumbent has more in his locker than the ability to swing a size 12 at the playing staff.
Besides, didn't we have one in Yogi?!?:hmmm:

hibee_kane96
01-11-2013, 10:41 PM
Think the days of these types of managers are fading. The unrest at Sunderland under Di Canio shows the bad atmosphere that can possibly arise from having this sort of manager. The manager has to get to know his players and build a strong rapport with them. Ultimately if the players don't get along with the manager you're not going to see the best possible results on the park (ie the end of Collins' tenure).

Waxy
01-11-2013, 10:50 PM
Going are the days when hothead bosses with god complexes stamp their little authorities on whoever they feel like.
Do we want Hibs players to be treated like this?

gorgie greens
01-11-2013, 11:18 PM
sure everyone would love a Alex Ferguson manager,think Yogi kicked ***** when he was here,id like someone with a football brain who likes to play the ball on the ground ,the way Fenlon had us tear in about Celtic was great or me,i cant stand guys not giving less than 100% and the team gave that against Celtic,i would like O'Neill for me or i would take Butcher,never want Harry Potter in a million years,id rather take Mark Venus than Mowbary,
Now over to you Petrie,please pick the right one as this has got to be the weakest league for the next year or so and i would love us to be doing something rather than just make up the numbers in the league

blackpoolhibs
01-11-2013, 11:24 PM
A manager who knows how to spend his budget properly, and sets a team up thats balanced and entertains a little more than the drivel Fenlon and Calderclown have done will do for starters.

gorgie greens
01-11-2013, 11:32 PM
A manager who knows how to spend his budget properly, and sets a team up thats balanced and entertains a little more than the drivel Fenlon and Calderclown have done will do for starters.

agree Gary ,the only manager to spend money on a player and look who we got,and a good tip is trying to play guys in there natural position,every week you get people comming on here and saying its not Lewis's fault he's playing out of position,we need to play guys like Zoubir and get some width and Harris on the other side will in my opinion put bums on seats

rcarter1
02-11-2013, 09:56 AM
If you want the best out of your players you need to get inside their heads, find out what makes them tick and then motivate them.

Mowbray was the best at this by a mile and the players loved him. He got poor players to be average, average players to be good and good players to be excellent.

I'd be amazed if he even considered us.

Not the case at Celtic. He isnt a winner, but he is an entertainer.

neil7908
02-11-2013, 11:30 AM
What we need is a good manager, one that understands tactics and motivating players, who sets there team out to play football.God knows who that man will be but after watching how Di Canio got on at Sunderland I'm not sure just having a manager who is a disciplinarian is really enough.Of all the criticism I would level at Fenlon I've never felt that his teams are unprofessional or look like their not trying on the pitch.

Danderhall Hibs
02-11-2013, 11:36 AM
I've always hard that threatening your staff brings the best out of them.

Depends on how the individual reacts. Some folk need a kick up the arse.

Supermac
02-11-2013, 11:41 AM
I thought Tommy Gemmell had retired years ago. :wink:

Only the oldies on here will understand that one!

NORTHERNHIBBY
02-11-2013, 11:54 AM
Pertrie will appoint a licker long before he will appoint a kicker so it may not be all that easy.

TheReg!
02-11-2013, 11:58 AM
Arse kicker=Greame Souness.

Elephant Stone
02-11-2013, 12:02 PM
If it wasn't already obvious then you should read the thoughts of Paulo Di Canio's players to see that bullying and shouting at players doesn't work. If we ended up with someone like him or Dundee's John Brown then I think I'd need to sit this one out.

Hibernia&Alba
02-11-2013, 12:07 PM
Someone with a strong, winning mentality, certainly. Someone who will nurture a collective pugnacity. We're Scottish football's softest touch. Even the Yams know that regardless of how bad things get for them, Hibs are around to cheer them up. This must change if we're ever to be taken seriously and achieve anything.

Supermac
02-11-2013, 12:21 PM
Tommy Gemmell:greengrin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsCOydsjBmg

Hibernia&Alba
02-11-2013, 12:25 PM
Tommy Gemmell:greengrin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsCOydsjBmg
A superb example of a Scottish toe up the hole. The German literally went through the air :top marks

The Leith Dutch
02-11-2013, 12:39 PM
The only point of an arse kicker is that you clearly want more from the players.

Why not get that by him having their respect through good man management and making them part of a winning team?

We don't need a nutbag - we need someone who can get the decent (by SPFL standards) squad we have playing proper, attacking passing football.

That John Collins interview someone posted where he was berating coaches for not following what they were taught sums it up:

When your keeper has the ball you have possession. Why do you want to lump it forward into an, at best 50/50 chance of retaining the ball?

Why are our defenders pinging 50 yard balls forward when we latch on to maybe 1 in 40 or 50?

i want a manager in who understands pass and move football where you find another Hibs player with a shortish pass and then move in to space.

It's not hard and we can play a good brand of it with the guys we have properly managed.

snooky
02-11-2013, 12:42 PM
Good managers play players to their strengths.
Simples.
Bad managers do the opposite.

Jones28
02-11-2013, 03:46 PM
The thing is that these days players have a much bigger influence than they did. They can get out easily if they don't like the treatment they are getting off the manager.

We don't need an arse-kicker, we need someone who can inspire us as fans, who can motivate and instil passion and self belief in his players, and who can organise a team to play the right way.

Danderhall Hibs
02-11-2013, 03:51 PM
Motivating players may include arse kicking.

lucky
02-11-2013, 03:56 PM
I'd say bring in someone like Di Canio, but it would be John Collins all over again :rolleyes: We need someone who knows the game, knows how the basics work. Someone with a european background?
Why would you want a fascist at Hibernian? Di Canio has caused bedlam at every club he has been at. He is the last person I would want at Hibs

Gerard
02-11-2013, 05:01 PM
Why would you want a fascist at Hibernian? Di Canio has caused bedlam at every club he has been at. He is the last person I would want at Hibs
I would accept a communist if it makes Hibs a better team. The manger's political opinion is his or hers private business.

NAE NOOKIE
02-11-2013, 05:13 PM
The days of the arse kicker are gone.

What we need is a manager with a strong personality who knows how to set up a decent team who know when to attack and how to defend.

These days a manager needs respect, not fear.

Who that guy is goodness knows ... Butcher could be the man.

NAE NOOKIE
02-11-2013, 05:18 PM
I would accept a communist if it makes Hibs a better team. The manger's political opinion is his or hers private business.

Correct ..... However, giving Nazi salutes in front of the most fascist fans in world football ( Lazio ) is not keeping your politics your private business.

Cracker
02-11-2013, 06:16 PM
The days of the arse kicker are gone.

What we need is a manager with a strong personality who knows how to set up a decent team who know when to attack and how to defend.

These days a manager needs respect, not fear.

Who that guy is goodness knows ... Butcher could be the man.

How about Gordon Strachan?

Hibrandenburg
02-11-2013, 06:27 PM
And what happens when the players go greetin their wee eyes oot tae Rod that the big nasty man is working them too hard? Been there, seen it and we're still suffering the consequences.

blackpoolhibs
02-11-2013, 06:32 PM
And what happens when the players go greetin their wee eyes oot tae Rod that the big nasty man is working them too hard? Been there, seen it and we're still suffering the consequences.

:faf: Who's left from that team, Stevenson? And he's supposed to be the model professional?

If we are playing that game, i blame Celtic for stealing all our players well over 100 years ago.

Bishop Hibee
02-11-2013, 06:46 PM
We need a tactically astute good man manager, not someone from the 'hard man' school. Medieval thinking.

hibeeleicester
02-11-2013, 06:48 PM
:faf: Who's left from that team, Stevenson? And he's supposed to be the model professional?

If we are playing that game, i blame Celtic for stealing all our players well over 100 years ago.

:agree:

Time for the board to grow some balls and not appoint another arse licker.

Hibrandenburg
02-11-2013, 06:48 PM
:faf: Who's left from that team, Stevenson? And he's supposed to be the model professional?

If we are playing that game, i blame Celtic for stealing all our players well over 100 years ago.

Again you've completely missed the point! :doh:

blackpoolhibs
02-11-2013, 06:52 PM
Again you've completely missed the point! :doh:


What is your point, because as you say i am missing it completely?:confused:

Hibrandenburg
02-11-2013, 07:06 PM
The point is no manager at Hibs can have any credibility with the playing staff until we stop launching them everytime we have a bad season or two. This is not just about Pat Fenlon, 9 managers in 11 years FFS. Would you as an employee pay any attention to a boss who'll be out the door before your contract runs out and is one of a whole line of bosses that have come and gone like Easter? Course you wouldn't. This cycle has to end before any manager has a chance at winning over the playing staff.

blackpoolhibs
02-11-2013, 07:19 PM
The point is no manager at Hibs can have any credibility with the playing staff until we stop launching them everytime we have a bad season or two. This is not just about Pat Fenlon, 9 managers in 11 years FFS. Would you as an employee pay any attention to a boss who'll be out the door before your contract runs out and is one of a whole line of bosses that have come and gone like Easter? Course you wouldn't. This cycle has to end before any manager has a chance at winning over the playing staff.

When you employ someone who keeps bringing in the wrong managers, then they need sacked, just like Petrie does.

And i don't believe any player who signs for us ignores the manager, because he thinks the guys will be booted out the door any minute.

Which players do you have in mind who are not paying attention?

Hibrandenburg
02-11-2013, 07:26 PM
The point is no manager at Hibs can have any credibility with the playing staff until we stop launching them everytime we have a bad season or two. This is not just about Pat Fenlon, 9 managers in 11 years FFS. Would you as an employee pay any attention to a boss who'll be out the door before your contract runs out and is one of a whole line of bosses that have come and gone like Easter? Course you wouldn't. This cycle has to end before any manager has a chance at winning over the playing staff.

blackpoolhibs
02-11-2013, 08:00 PM
The point is no manager at Hibs can have any credibility with the playing staff until we stop launching them everytime we have a bad season or two. This is not just about Pat Fenlon, 9 managers in 11 years FFS. Would you as an employee pay any attention to a boss who'll be out the door before your contract runs out and is one of a whole line of bosses that have come and gone like Easter? Course you wouldn't. This cycle has to end before any manager has a chance at winning over the playing staff.

I don't believe we have any players who think that?

Hibrandenburg
03-11-2013, 07:35 AM
I don't believe we have any players who think that?

I believe we do and I believe the next manager will face the same problems unless they're addressed properly.

J-C
03-11-2013, 07:53 AM
I don't believe we have any players who think that?

I still think we have a core of lazy arsed prima donna's who don't pull their fingers out enough, yes Fenlon had his faults but a lot of the blame must also lie with these players, all too often we've spoken about how poorly they've played, maybe it's time we get a manager in who'll kick a few butts, tell them to get their fingers oot and the 1st sign of them running to Petrie to complain, they're oot the door.

Onion
03-11-2013, 07:54 AM
The point is no manager at Hibs can have any credibility with the playing staff until we stop launching them everytime we have a bad season or two. This is not just about Pat Fenlon, 9 managers in 11 years FFS. Would you as an employee pay any attention to a boss who'll be out the door before your contract runs out and is one of a whole line of bosses that have come and gone like Easter? Course you wouldn't. This cycle has to end before any manager has a chance at winning over the playing staff.

There was nothing to suggest that Fenlon would have become a better manager given more time. His team set up and lack of tactical awareness (no plan B.. ever) was obvious. Fenlon was found out in big games time and again. We need to change the culture of failure at Hibs, get in some high achievers and set higher standards. Those that cannot live up to that should be shipped out - or better still not allowed near the club in the first place. Unfortunately the person who runs the club has no standards, no plan, no ambition and no time for anyone who challenges him.

Hibrandenburg
03-11-2013, 08:14 AM
There was nothing to suggest that Fenlon would have become a better manager given more time. His team set up and lack of tactical awareness (no plan B.. ever) was obvious. Fenlon was found out in big games time and again. We need to change the culture of failure at Hibs, get in some high achievers and set higher standards. Those that cannot live up to that should be shipped out - or better still not allowed near the club in the first place. Unfortunately the person who runs the club has no standards, no plan, no ambition and no time for anyone who challenges him.

I agree with almost all you're saying Onion. My point is that if Hibs had backed Fenlon until his contract had run out then we might have gone some way to eradicating the culture at Hibs that managers are below the players in the pecking order and thus strengthened the hand of the next man. Imagine the discipline in a company who only employed managers from a Temping Agency?

greenpaper55
03-11-2013, 08:26 AM
I agree with almost all you're saying Onion. My point is that if Hibs had backed Fenlon until his contract had run out then we might have gone some way to eradicating the culture at Hibs that managers are below the players in the pecking order and thus strengthened the hand of the next man. Imagine the discipline in a company who only employed managers from a Temping Agency?

Backing Fenlon till the end of the season would have been madness, the fact that we have had nine mangers in whatever is down to bad chairmanship rather than anything else. Keeping bad managers just for the sake of continuity and in so doing driving away punters is a sure way to financial oblivion. I don't get your point that managers are below players in the pecking order, Fenlon brought in most of the players in the first team !.

Hibrandenburg
03-11-2013, 08:42 AM
Backing Fenlon till the end of the season would have been madness, the fact that we have had nine mangers in whatever is down to bad chairmanship rather than anything else. Keeping bad managers just for the sake of continuity and in so doing driving away punters is a sure way to financial oblivion. I don't get your point that managers are below players in the pecking order, Fenlon brought in most of the players in the first team !.

Aye, Fenlon brought in most of the players in the first team who soon after puting pen to paper realised that they'd still be at ER long after Fenlon was gone no matter how serious they take training or perform on the pitch. It's like being the Stand in Teacher, good luck getting the class to actually listen to you.

ALF TUPPER
03-11-2013, 08:54 AM
I thought Tommy Gemmell had retired years ago. :wink:

Only the oldies on here will understand that one!


I got it :cool2:

ALF TUPPER
03-11-2013, 09:00 AM
I think whoever takes over has a good squad to work with. They don't need hairdryered to perform, just deployed so that they can fulfill their potential. A screamer is not needed.

Aside from the unfortunate fact that there is a lot of managers out there without jobs, I genuinely think there will be a lot of attraction in the Hibs job because of the potential that the squad has. I think we might be pleasantly surprised by some of the folk that put their CVs forward.

Agree with all this :agree:.
Hope we don't go for the cheapest option tho

Hermit Crab
03-11-2013, 09:02 AM
How about Gordon Strachan?

I believe if he was not involved with Scotland at this time he'd be interested.

God Petrie
03-11-2013, 09:06 AM
We have a good squad of decent players that are seriously under performing, including some proven SPL players that have performed reasonably well for other SPL teams.
We seem to be a free meal ticket to a decent wage and mediocre mid table acceptability.
We need a hardman that won't accept any crap.

Nope, I can't think of anyone either.......... :rolleyes:

Aye very good we've had an "arse kicker" for two years and people were moaning about his football but what we need is another negative aggressive clown. No thanks gimme football.

The Falcon
03-11-2013, 09:06 AM
I believe we do and I believe the next manager will face the same problems unless they're addressed properly.

So if we employ a manager with a decent track record who dosent meet our expectations we should still keep him?

Hibrandenburg
03-11-2013, 09:18 AM
So if we employ a manager with a decent track record who dosent meet our expectations we should still keep him?

In short, yes. We all had a laugh at the Yam revolving door manager carousel and asked "Who in their right mind would take on the job"? IMO we're now in a similar boat. What decent manager would want to take over at Hibs knowing he's on a hiding to nothing and borrowed time?

Hermit Crab
03-11-2013, 09:25 AM
So if we employ a manager with a decent track record who dosent meet our expectations we should still keep him?

That's the problem. In reality managers just can't win when it comes to hibs. There must be someone out there who can turn it around and bring success to the club.

Hermit Crab
03-11-2013, 09:25 AM
In short, yes. We all had a laugh at the Yam revolving door manager carousel and asked "Who in their right mind would take on the job"? IMO we're now in a similar boat. What decent manager would want to take over at Hibs knowing he's on a hiding to nothing and borrowed time?

I agree with this.

The Falcon
03-11-2013, 09:28 AM
In short, yes. We all had a laugh at the Yam revolving door manager carousel and asked "Who in their right mind would take on the job"? IMO we're now in a similar boat. What decent manager would want to take over at Hibs knowing he's on a hiding to nothing and borrowed time?


In the modern game Hibs managers are unlikely to last three seasons imo, and lucky to last two. If they are not good enough or dont meet fans expectations they will be gone and if they do well someone will poach them.

Sometimes what appears to be a good appointment doesent work out.

blackpoolhibs
03-11-2013, 09:49 AM
I still think we have a core of lazy arsed prima donna's who don't pull their fingers out enough, yes Fenlon had his faults but a lot of the blame must also lie with these players, all too often we've spoken about how poorly they've played, maybe it's time we get a manager in who'll kick a few butts, tell them to get their fingers oot and the 1st sign of them running to Petrie to complain, they're oot the door.

I disagree, in fact lazy is about the only thing you can't level at Fenlons team in my opinion. I'd go as far as to say, they are all triers, they are one of the best sides we've had for effort in years.

Although if we go along with what you say, then thats another stick to beat the manager with, if we have a team full of lazy prima donna's, then its Fenlons fault as he's signed most of them?

And this quote about running to Petrie, moaning about the training being too hard has to stop, we only have Lewis Stevenson left from that time, and he's supposed to be a model professional?

J-C
03-11-2013, 10:23 AM
I disagree, in fact lazy is about the only thing you can't level at Fenlons team in my opinion. I'd go as far as to say, they are all triers, they are one of the best sides we've had for effort in years.

Although if we go along with what you say, then thats another stick to beat the manager with, if we have a team full of lazy prima donna's, then its Fenlons fault as he's signed most of them?

And this quote about running to Petrie, moaning about the training being too hard has to stop, we only have Lewis Stevenson left from that time, and he's supposed to be a model professional?


TBH Gary, I was just getting a few things off my chest this morning, pretty peeved at the way this squad of players have been playing, I know Fenlon wasn't the best when it came to tactics but these players should still be good enough on their own and to play a lot better no matter what the tactics are. I'm just curious if they've become soft again during Fenlon's tenure, rumours were certain players thought he was out of his depth and I was wondering if these same players were shirking their responsibility with their performances of late.

blackpoolhibs
03-11-2013, 10:36 AM
TBH Gary, I was just getting a few things off my chest this morning, pretty peeved at the way this squad of players have been playing, I know Fenlon wasn't the best when it came to tactics but these players should still be good enough on their own and to play a lot better no matter what the tactics are. I'm just curious if they've become soft again during Fenlon's tenure, rumours were certain players thought he was out of his depth and I was wondering if these same players were shirking their responsibility with their performances of late.

If you look at the squad we have, a decent keeper probably the best we can afford. A back 4 of static cones, easily brushed off the ball and poor on the ball.

A midfield full of central types, no width and no pace. Our star signing up front who might turn out good, but has the touch of a bull. The Heff does look decent and will score goals.

We are easy to play against, we are so ponderous when going forward, they move the ball on far too slowly and because we don't have any pace we don't score or create on the break, which is the way Fenlon sets his team up.

They are a decent bunch of triers in my opinion, but lack quality on the ball.

I don't go with us having the best squad outwith Celtic, in fact with 4 decent signings we could challenge for that position, but i wouldn't have trusted Pat to do this.

Hibernia Na Eir
03-11-2013, 10:37 AM
Collins tried that, didn't work.

my thoughts exactly.

J-C
03-11-2013, 11:13 AM
If you look at the squad we have, a decent keeper probably the best we can afford. A back 4 of static cones, easily brushed off the ball and poor on the ball.

A midfield full of central types, no width and no pace. Our star signing up front who might turn out good, but has the touch of a bull. The Heff does look decent and will score goals.

We are easy to play against, we are so ponderous when going forward, they move the ball on far too slowly and because we don't have any pace we don't score or create on the break, which is the way Fenlon sets his team up.

They are a decent bunch of triers in my opinion, but lack quality on the ball.

I don't go with us having the best squad outwith Celtic, in fact with 4 decent signings we could challenge for that position, but i wouldn't have trusted Pat to do this.

Said in another post that we cried out for width and pace, so Pat goes out and buys Vine, OTJ and only brought in Zoubir last minute due to Harris getting injured.
Played Craig out wide instead of the middle, likewise Robertson to make both ineffectual, played Zoubir through the middle :confused: and bought the slowest DM I've ever seen in OTJ, 3 wages could've been saved and thus allowing Claros to come back. If you going to spend 200k, then spend it on Claros, we got Heff for nowt and it would've allowed Handling and Caldwell extra game time. But what do we know, we're just punters. :wink:

Oh and don't get me started on that shambles of a defence, a defence that collapsed against Stranraer FFS.