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hibsbollah
03-09-2013, 07:46 PM
It would be good to get a big response to this poll, so we know what kind of support the idea has.

And just as Importantly, is there anyone who currently sits in Famous Five Lower behind the goals who would be unhappy about moving to another area of the ground?

down-the-slope
03-09-2013, 08:00 PM
Not just consider...but would.

it would allow better atmosphere and when there is some eejit shouting stuff I don't appreciate...it would be like the old way...just move...when mates come to the odd match...no problem being together (rather than can't / all have to move from ST seat)


just add in some beer and edible nosh and it might be a bit of an antidote for the football :greengrin

hibsbollah
03-09-2013, 08:00 PM
Just for ultras?

Actually, now I come to think about it, what's an ultra?

Could I be one and not know it?

Section 43 types, those who like flags, singing etc. Call them whatever you like

Mikey
03-09-2013, 08:01 PM
What about the lower west and lower south too?

Hibbyradge
03-09-2013, 08:04 PM
Section 43 types, those who like flags, singing etc. Call them whatever you like

I like flags and I love singing.

I'm a frickin ultra! Yaay!

Whoda thunk it?

:wink:

hibsbollah
03-09-2013, 08:06 PM
What about the lower west and lower south too?
Change the question title if you want :aok: I was just trying to see if the principle had a lot of support.

Billy Whizz
03-09-2013, 08:06 PM
Not for me, but Crystal Palace have an area in their lower section behind the goals (not sure if its standing or not), but what a racket they make for 90 mins

B.H.F.C
03-09-2013, 08:16 PM
Works for them in Germany. I'd like it. Sadly it'll never happen. Authorities wouldn't be open minded enough to let it or even trial it. And there would be cost involved in adapting the ground for it.

Hibbyradge
03-09-2013, 08:27 PM
Being serious, I'm in favour of a standing area although I probably wouldn't use it.

The atmosphere would be better and it might be a bit cheaper for season tickets so it could well be full every week.

I think it should be trialled in one area first to determine popularity.

I don't think standing areas would increase overall attendance though, so we couldn't afford too many of them.

Waxy
03-09-2013, 08:28 PM
Hibs have led the way in the past.
I have a feeling Hibs will lead the way with this.

GreenCastle
03-09-2013, 08:35 PM
Family Section should be lower West.

Famous Five lower should be Supporters Section - Safe standing or not - should be an area where more noise is generated and the East / West will join in as often as possible.

Flags on any empty seats(side blocks) until the section fully grows - move people to the West and make it busier there and the stadium will have a better feel to it.

The only issues are I am more concerned about what's happening on the pitch right now than off it!!!

What happens to Section 43 - as they are doing a good job in the East with the noise currently - at times getting a decent amount of the stand joining in.

Relocating Famous 5 ST holders who may have been there for a while.

RIP
03-09-2013, 08:42 PM
This is a test of supply

Should it not be a test of demand?

My family group have been standing in the East for years. Why do we need a second standing area?

More importantly, who will want to start a second group?

BVB Hibs
03-09-2013, 08:47 PM
Standing would have me a hell of a lot more likely to get to a game. I'm definitely the singy, shouty, jumpy type at a football match and anything that can improve the amount of that at easter road would make me a very happy man.

TheFamous1875
03-09-2013, 08:55 PM
An absolute must. A great opportunity for Hibs to be at the forefront once again. Most importantly, it would help the team receive that extra push in the second half. It's win-win. We'd love it, the players would love it, and the board would look good.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Albanian Hibs
03-09-2013, 08:57 PM
I already stand there along with a few others that sit beside me, as I have a ST in the back row and have no one behind us telling us to sit down.

B.H.F.C
03-09-2013, 09:04 PM
This is a test of supply

Should it not be a test of demand?

My family group have been standing in the East for years. Why do we need a second standing area?

More importantly, who will want to start a second group?

It would be completely different if it was a safe terraced area though.

And we don't need a group for it. It would just essentially be a terraced area in the ground which we don't currently have. Terracing naturally lends to better atmosphere at the football.

That's my take on it anyway.

Moon unit
03-09-2013, 09:12 PM
Go for it!

SquashedFrogg
03-09-2013, 09:25 PM
Why not the east? As I see it, they're the ones putting all the effort in just now.

NAE NOOKIE
03-09-2013, 09:52 PM
This is a no brainer for me.

I voted for the idea, but would probably move to a seat either in the FF upper ( if I could persuade my pal ) or to a seat in the East near the FF coz I'm a bit too long in the tooth now for standing for 90 minutes and a bit too wee for that matter if theres a 6' tall guy standing in front of me. But hopefully would be able to join in with the singing from the FF
:greengrin

But IMO Easter Road really needs this ..... as somebody has said in another thread the increase in size of the East has not done the atmosphere any favours. In big games yes it can be noisy and really good, but for the most part in bog standard matches the size drowns the singing section. Given the fact that time after time a small away support in the South can out noise a bigger or similar sized section in the East ( anybody who was at the Motherwell match will know what I mean ) the evidence is there that this could be a good thing.

As far as I am aware the idea of trialing some standing areas in the SPL was mooted about a year ago and to my recollection Hibs were not against the idea. As I have said before, there is plenty of room in the East to relocate the family section which currently resides in the FF lower. I for one would be happy to move to see this happen.

The, for want of a better term, Ultra's section at ER has been located in many areas, from the north end of the old main stand to the enclosure in front of that area to name but two.

Its time to bring some of the fun and atmosphere back to Easter Road and IMO giving the lower FF over to a singing section ( standing or not ) is the way to go about it. All around the World football clubs have a section of their stadiums given over to the more boisterous and noisy fans in the support .... these fans like to think of that part of the ground as their own. I cant think of many fans who would want to see their 'Ultra's' section squeezed to the side of a huge stand.

Surely its better to have a self contained area of the ground dedicated to this than a wee bit of a huge stand. I never heard anybody at the Scottish Cup ties at Ayr the season before last or Kilmarnock last season complain about not being in a huge stand. The atmosphere created by the Hibs support in both games was as good as I have been part of in any game I've been to since the 70s.

In fact the Killie game was a prime example of what could be achieved at ER given that everybody, including Killie fans and staff, went on about what a great atmosphere it was .... even though the other three sides of the ground were far from full.

I rest my case.

Mikey
03-09-2013, 10:05 PM
Why not the east? .

It's too steep.

Hermit Crab
03-09-2013, 10:07 PM
It's a yes from me. Someone email the club about it and inform them about the support its gaining. Petrie get it sorted. :greengrin

Hermit Crab
03-09-2013, 10:08 PM
Why not the east? As I see it, they're the ones putting all the effort in just now.


Its too big and also only a single tier.

trev the hat
03-09-2013, 10:11 PM
Standing in FF lower would be where I'd be heading if it was an option, must hold close on 2k in there, 500 of us in Malmo sounded bang on & I'd imagine there'd be FULL signs up for the FF lower for most bigger games once fans got a taste of it. Def gets my vote..

tamsonsbairn
03-09-2013, 10:17 PM
this is a no brainer for me.

I voted for the idea, but would probably move to a seat either in the ff upper ( if i could persuade my pal ) or to a seat in the east near the ff coz i'm a bit too long in the tooth now for standing for 90 minutes and a bit too wee for that matter if theres a 6' tall guy standing in front of me. But hopefully would be able to join in with the singing from the ff
:greengrin

but imo easter road really needs this ..... As somebody has said in another thread the increase in size of the east has not done the atmosphere any favours. In big games yes it can be noisy and really good, but for the most part in bog standard matches the size drowns the singing section. Given the fact that time after time a small away support in the south can out noise a bigger or similar sized section in the east ( anybody who was at the motherwell match will know what i mean ) the evidence is there that this could be a good thing.

As far as i am aware the idea of trialing some standing areas in the spl was mooted about a year ago and to my recollection hibs were not against the idea. As i have said before, there is plenty of room in the east to relocate the family section which currently resides in the ff lower. I for one would be happy to move to see this happen.

The, for want of a better term, ultra's section at er has been located in many areas, from the north end of the old main stand to the enclosure in front of that area to name but two.

Its time to bring some of the fun and atmosphere back to easter road and imo giving the lower ff over to a singing section ( standing or not ) is the way to go about it. All around the world football clubs have a section of their stadiums given over to the more boisterous and noisy fans in the support .... These fans like to think of that part of the ground as their own. I cant think of many fans who would want to see their 'ultra's' section squeezed to the side of a huge stand.

Surely its better to have a self contained area of the ground dedicated to this than a wee bit of a huge stand. I never heard anybody at the scottish cup ties at ayr the season before last or kilmarnock last season complain about not being in a huge stand. The atmosphere created by the hibs support in both games was as good as i have been part of in any game i've been to since the 70s.

In fact the killie game was a prime example of what could be achieved at er given that everybody, including killie fans and staff, went on about what a great atmosphere it was .... Even though the other three sides of the ground were far from full.

I rest my case.

this.

TheFamous1875
03-09-2013, 10:18 PM
The Kilmarnock game.. There was part of me at that match that felt that we had A LOT to do with going on to win that game. We galvanised the team because our presence was beyond mega that day. If we had that every Saturday, think of how much better we'd be off...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

monktonharp
03-09-2013, 10:22 PM
Standing would have me a hell of a lot more likely to get to a game. I'm definitely the singy, shouty, jumpy type at a football match and anything that can improve the amount of that at easter road would make me a very happy man.:agree: at the risk of boring some on here:wink: those were the days. loved being able to move about and even f off if you wanted to. but it would create a much much better atmosphere. Mikey mentions the south dunbar end too, but i'd be dead against encouraging opposing fans creating more noise for them/their team. the 3 or 4 busloads of the small teams usually make mair noise than us as it is! would definitely like to see standing re-introduced for US.

sadtom
03-09-2013, 10:33 PM
Totally behind the reintroduction of standing areas.
I'm currently in the FF lower cause I take the kids, though I would never move back to the west lower.
I had a season ticket there for a number of years and hated the fact that there is so little leg room between the seats. Spent the entire 90 mins with knees against the rim of the seat in front. All other sections of the ground are much better.
If there is any part of the ground that could do with having the seats ripped out, its the west lower.

monktonharp
03-09-2013, 10:34 PM
The Kilmarnock game.. There was part of me at that match that felt that we had A LOT to do with going on to win that game. We galvanised the team because our presence was beyond mega that day. If we had that every Saturday, think of how much better we'd be off...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD:agree:heartily agree . was a FANtastic day for us

neilmartinrocks
03-09-2013, 11:03 PM
Totally behind the reintroduction of standing areas.
I'm currently in the FF lower cause I take the kids, though I would never move back to the west lower.
I had a season ticket there for a number of years and hated the fact that there is so little leg room between the seats. Spent the entire 90 mins with knees against the rim of the seat in front. All other sections of the ground are much better.
If there is any part of the ground that could do with having the seats ripped out, its the west lower.

I've only been in the west lower once and hated it for this reason and I'm only 5' 11". Thought I was just pissed off coz my mate got tickets for there instead of the east. Just along from the dug outs.

blackpoolhibs
03-09-2013, 11:08 PM
This is a test of supply

Should it not be a test of demand?

My family group have been standing in the East for years. Why do we need a second standing area?

More importantly, who will want to start a second group?


Nobody would be stopping your family from staying exactly where you are? As someone else said. the group of around 500-600 that went to Malmo made a hell of a racket, the full ends at Ayr and Kilmarnock recently have shown just how we as a support can get behind the team better if we are in a smaller area.

I did sit along from where you are situated, and could hear the opposition support much more than section 43, even if it was Inverness or Ross County's 150 fans.

I know you are against this, and nobody is forcing you to move. I hope it takes off, and we start to fill one end of our ground with boisterous noisy fans, and i feel it will grow much quicker than anything organised in the east, its just too big at the moment.

HFC 0-7
03-09-2013, 11:23 PM
Problem with a standing area in the ff lower would be the impact to the boxes. If folk stood in that stand the people that pay for a box wouldn't be able to see the game

Hibbyradge
03-09-2013, 11:30 PM
Problem with a standing area in the ff lower would be the impact to the boxes. If folk stood in that stand the people that pay for a box wouldn't be able to see the game

http://images.retecool.com/uploads/reet-And_its_gone_original.jpg

monktonharp
03-09-2013, 11:31 PM
Problem with a standing area in the ff lower would be the impact to the boxes. If folk stood in that stand the people that pay for a box wouldn't be able to see the game good, make them into real life fitba' fans or tell them tae bolt.

blackpoolhibs
03-09-2013, 11:33 PM
http://images.retecool.com/uploads/reet-And_its_gone_original.jpg

Not really Dave, just cordon off the top 2 rows or make it the top tier of the FF? If you want something enough you can always find a way around the problem? :wink:

B.H.F.C
03-09-2013, 11:37 PM
Not really Dave, just cordon off the top 2 rows or make it the top tier of the FF? If you want something enough you can always find a way around the problem? :wink:

Problem is the club probably don't want it though.

blackpoolhibs
03-09-2013, 11:40 PM
Problem is the club probably don't want it though.

What have you heard, as i heard different?

monktonharp
03-09-2013, 11:40 PM
Not really Dave, just cordon off the top 2 rows or make it the top tier of the FF? If you want something enough you can always find a way around the problem? :wink: :agree: despite my rather childish reply to the last poster, I do agree. problems are there to be solved. something serious needs to be done, at ER to try and make the day enjoyable again (despite the Board and the inept performances at times on the pitch).

B.H.F.C
03-09-2013, 11:45 PM
What have you heard, as i heard different?

Not heard anything. Just not something I could see happening. Costs involved for the club to get the ground changed for it. Would the current league regulations no need to change as well?

I'd personally love it. Didn't realise there was more to it, if indeed that's the case.

blackpoolhibs
03-09-2013, 11:47 PM
Not heard anything. Just not something I could see happening. Costs involved for the club to get the ground changed for it. Would the current league regulations no need to change as well?

I'd personally love it. Didn't realise there was more to it, if indeed that's the case.

I think cost is a red herring, folk stand in the east why can't they stand in the FF?

B.H.F.C
03-09-2013, 11:56 PM
I think cost is a red herring, folk stand in the east why can't they stand in the FF?

Of course you can do that. From the thread title I just assumed it was more along the lines of a proper safe terraced area as opposed to just another section such as 43 in the east.

Its one of those things that I'd like to see them go the whole way if they were going to do it. I think if they did that it would really take off. It would have more of a novelty factor for people and be more like the old school terracing. If things just remained it as they are just now and the marketed it as they do 43 I'm not convinced it would be that much different

Scott Allan Key
04-09-2013, 02:15 AM
I'm in FF lower. My kids are too wee for standing as yet, but we'd like to be near the noise. My eldest has loved the singing at big away games (e.g. Motherwell) better than the general moany quietness of the FF lower, certainly this season. I'd be happy to move if it created a better, more enjoyable atmosphere as we attack 'down the slope'. Perhaps family section can move to upper FF? Unlikely, but kids enjoy atmosphere as much as the game, me feels.

Moulin Yarns
04-09-2013, 05:44 AM
As an 'older' fan, the return of the Hibs choir to their ancestral home in the north end of the ground must be applauded, remember the 'Cave' before the bench seats were put in.

Chuck Rhoades
04-09-2013, 06:11 AM
Yes please. In FF lower!

Pete
04-09-2013, 06:33 AM
I would be all for this if I didn't have fairly central, back row seats. I wouldn't be too keen on losing them if I didn't get seats that were just as desirable in the new family section as a sweetener.

Brightside
04-09-2013, 07:04 AM
Why behind the goal? I hate watching football from that view point. Could we not have the first 10 rows on middlle of the east standing?

Viva_Palmeiras
04-09-2013, 07:10 AM
Would the test of demand not be a pilot standing in the FF lower without and reconstruction?

Brightside
04-09-2013, 07:18 AM
I think cost is a red herring, folk stand in the east why can't they stand in the FF?

It must be part of the 5 year plan.

IanM
04-09-2013, 07:25 AM
Why behind the goal? I hate watching football from that view point. Could we not have the first 10 rows on middlle of the east standing?


i think the reason is the East is too big to generate the condensed level of racket we're looking for.. if you can imagine behind the goals rammed with nonsense and intimidation of the away goalie and fingering abuse every time they had a corner along with the non stop singing, chanting, banners, drums etc.. would make playing into that very hard for the opposition.. but you've got to remember just because we'd like to pilot this there, it doesn't stop anyone from doing the same from the area of the ground they prefer to sit in.. i also don't think they'd 'terrace' off just a part of the east

I can see this taking off
thats my take on this anyway

offshorehibby
04-09-2013, 07:25 AM
I can't see why part of the east can not be adapted to accommodate safe standing. I would have thought a central area were the atmosphere/noise is generated would be better.

dangermouse
04-09-2013, 07:35 AM
Why not the east? As I see it, they're the ones putting all the effort in just now.


It's too steep.


Its too big and also only a single tier.

I did advocate at the time that building the East as a single tier was the wrong thing to do. Had it been the same as the West then the lower tier would have been suitable for standing. But I don't sit there so it wasn't really my place to argue against those who wanted a single tier.

GreenOnions
04-09-2013, 08:17 AM
I think football has gone to great lengths to broaden its' appeal by improving facilities, safety etc inside grounds. This has been a great step forward. However, perhaps it has actually forgotten that it still also needs to appeal to its' traditional customer.

For many supporters a huge part of the experience of a football game centres around atmosphere as well as the actual game itself. Whilst sitting down does usually improve the view of the pitch I'm sure evidence would show that those things that contribute to atmosphere - noise, singing etc are reduced.

The reduced capacity of all-seated stadia also pushes up ticket prices. The future of football as a healthy business depends on young people becoming interested in watching the game and clubs want them to develop an alliegance. Perhaps safe standing areas might allow clubs to attract more 15-25 year olds to games thereby helping to build a fan base for the future?

It is arguable that football's core customer base is this "traditional customer". TV audiences are fickle and perhaps a significant proportion of armchair subscribers to satellite broadcasters have less loyalty to the sport and less still to a particular club. Their custom could be lost at any time.

Let's be allowed to look after our core customers by allowing them to watch the game as many would like to - in safe standing areas. These people are the long-term lifeblood of the game without whom football will become more and more vulnerable to the whims of broadcasters and armchair fans with a whole host of alternative viewing options.

clerriehibs
04-09-2013, 08:35 AM
Why behind the goal? I hate watching football from that view point. Could we not have the first 10 rows on middlle of the east standing?

No. If you have a "middle" section of a stand on their feet, how do the people who don't want to stand on either side of that see through the standers? I all of the lower FF is standing, there's no impairment of anyone else's view ... other than the box-ers, who could probably be accommodated elsewhere.

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 08:35 AM
Yes please. In FF lower!


From reading some of your posts, am i right in thinking you are currently in section 43?

DanHFC1875
04-09-2013, 08:37 AM
An excellent idea. Anything to help give a better atmosphere within ER is welcome :top marks

We need to improve the match day experience for the fans and cater for all needs:

Whether that is families, OAP's, ''Ultras'' or anyone else we can entice along to ER.


:flag::thumbsup:

clerriehibs
04-09-2013, 08:40 AM
What have you heard, as i heard different?

You've heard the club want a formalised standing area? (Or were you just being 'challenging'?)

Waxy
04-09-2013, 08:48 AM
The FF lower would be perfect.Don't know how many we could fit in but enough to bring a superb atmosphere back to ER.
I hate what all seated stadiums have done to the atmosphere at footie grounds.
We could go two ways, continue is we have it, keep raising prices and in twenty/thirty years it'll be sweetie wrappers and a light round of applause for a jolly good goal.
Or head back to try and get the old footie atmosphere in part of each ground, alot of people would come back for that.

LancashireHibby
04-09-2013, 08:59 AM
If it became a standing only area then I think people would naturally move over there, regardless of being in the East since the year dot etc.

As a trial, I'd actually favour having half of the South Lower allocated to Hibs fans and general radges before we go about displacing season ticket holders etc.

Viva_Palmeiras
04-09-2013, 09:28 AM
I said no for now as I'd pilot (to demonstrate demand/acoustics) it first then decide before spending dosh. We need the team performing on the pitch now IMO but can still satisfy the need (assuming standing in seated areas in FF lower would be tolerated by the stewards/Police)

clerriehibs
04-09-2013, 09:40 AM
I said no for now as I'd pilot (to demonstrate demand/acoustics) it first then decide before spending dosh. We need the team performing on the pitch now IMO but can still satisfy the need (assuming standing in seated areas in FF lower would be tolerated by the stewards/Police)

I don't think the poll necessarily means spend the cash on reformatting the lower FF; it could be piloted without spending anything, which you're in favour of.

Police might have something to say - but they haven't objected to sect43 standing. And the stewards? They wouldn't waste their time obstructing such a proposal, because they have no powers.

lucky
04-09-2013, 10:07 AM
No for me don't think bringing back standing is a way forward for football

Gatecrasher
04-09-2013, 10:32 AM
I think its a great idea, I wouldn't use it myself but would love to see the atmosphere and crowd more spread through out the stadium.

Persevere80
04-09-2013, 11:45 AM
Of course you can do that. From the thread title I just assumed it was more along the lines of a proper safe terraced area as opposed to just another section such as 43 in the east.

Its one of those things that I'd like to see them go the whole way if they were going to do it. I think if they did that it would really take off. It would have more of a novelty factor for people and be more like the old school terracing. If things just remained it as they are just now and the marketed it as they do 43 I'm not convinced it would be that much different

I think this may have come from the thread about the east terracing. The OP had asked other ways how to generate atmosphere at easter road. The ff lower being changed to standing was mentioned and I had made a point that it would be intresting to see a poll.

JIm
04-09-2013, 11:50 AM
No for me don't think bringing back standing is a way forward for football

Out of curiosity why not?

I personally would move in an instant. A specific area of like minded people giving it laldy for 90 minutes, thats what its all about for me. :flag:

Persevere80
04-09-2013, 11:58 AM
You've heard the club want a formalised standing area? (Or were you just being 'challenging'?)


here's a link from a thread a few years back that is worth a wee look.

http://spfl.co.uk/news/article/spl-statement-rule-changes-2011-12-19/

silverhibee
04-09-2013, 12:33 PM
I like flags and I love singing.

I'm a frickin ultra! Yaay!

Whoda thunk it?

:wink:

All you need now is a ST. :cb

clerriehibs
04-09-2013, 12:37 PM
Of course you can do that. From the thread title I just assumed it was more along the lines of a proper safe terraced area as opposed to just another section such as 43 in the east.

Its one of those things that I'd like to see them go the whole way if they were going to do it. I think if they did that it would really take off. It would have more of a novelty factor for people and be more like the old school terracing. If things just remained it as they are just now and the marketed it as they do 43 I'm not convinced it would be that much different

Good points; I'd.probably move if nothing structural happened. I'd def move if there were changes to make it dedicated.

silverhibee
04-09-2013, 12:38 PM
It's too steep.

Unsteep it. :greengrin

LeithBoozy
04-09-2013, 12:43 PM
I would love to see it happen, I'm sure the fans would love it. Perhaps they could start by filling-in the corners beside the FF stand, as a trial for standing. Fully enclosing the roof all round at the FF end, the problem would be the cost of this, but certainly it would create a cauldron of noise. :flag:

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 12:46 PM
I would love to see it happen, I'm sure the fans would love it. Perhaps they could start by filling-in the corners beside the FF stand, as a trial for standing. Fully enclosing the roof all round at the FF end, the problem would be the cost of this, but certainly it would create a cauldron of noise. :flag:


I think you might be getting a wee bit ahead of yourself matey, the helipad should be the first project in our 5 year plan. :greengrin

down-the-slope
04-09-2013, 12:48 PM
Been discussed in LWT groups - although it might need a longer term plan and there are hurdles, I was surprised that management were not against it in principal (this was not an in depth discussion however)

Remember past years - as my user name alludes - when we were 'Down-The-Slope' second half and you could move freely between East and Shed...Second half the shed behind goals would be rammed and rocking

SquashedFrogg
04-09-2013, 01:31 PM
Its too big and also only a single teir.

Anyone who remembers standing in the terracing at tannadice years ago will know what 'steep' was...

Moulin Yarns
04-09-2013, 02:19 PM
Anyone who remembers standing in the terracing at tannadice years ago will know what 'steep' was...

There is steep, dangerous, and then there is this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0BKqjy3uZI)

SquashedFrogg
04-09-2013, 02:28 PM
There is steep, dangerous, and then there is this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0BKqjy3uZI)

Those steps need painting...

Never tire of seeing that video

Hermit Crab
04-09-2013, 02:37 PM
No for me don't think bringing back standing is a way forward for football

You just like to go against the grain.

Bronson
04-09-2013, 03:17 PM
I would certainly be open minded about this, especially if sect43 (or another ultras group if they're not getting back) were to move there.

Scouse Hibee
04-09-2013, 03:19 PM
Have we got to go backwards to move forwards?

Still not convinced that we need standing areas back in football, maybe we should try and enforce sitting before we look at anything else.

K.Marx
04-09-2013, 03:52 PM
Have supported this idea for years :agree: Love the idea of a home "end" like the Kop, Stretford end etc. Hopefully those who do not wish to use the area would be happy for the others to have their fun there. See no reason why all kinds of fans cant be accomodated in a 20,000 seater stadium which is rarely more than half full. Would be great if Hibs led the way with this in Scotland and made some headlines for the right reasons :aok:

LeithBoozy
04-09-2013, 03:54 PM
I think you might be getting a wee bit ahead of yourself matey, the helipad should be the first project in our 5 year plan. :greengrin

Of course, only after the Helipad Blackpool. Anyone bringing up my suggestion to Petrie, better have the smelling salts handy. :greengrin

NAE NOOKIE
04-09-2013, 05:34 PM
I don't think the poll necessarily means spend the cash on reformatting the lower FF; it could be piloted without spending anything, which you're in favour of.

Police might have something to say - but they haven't objected to sect43 standing. And the stewards? They wouldn't waste their time obstructing such a proposal, because they have no powers.


Could be right, but there are football grounds all over the UK and Europe with standing areas. I think the Police would ( or at least should ) have to provide evidence, not just conjecture, that a standing area would cause a problem, which I doubt they could. In fact the evidence post Hillsbrough is that safe and well planned standing areas can work perfectly well.

RIP
04-09-2013, 05:48 PM
Nobody would be stopping your family from staying exactly where you are? As someone else said. the group of around 500-600 that went to Malmo made a hell of a racket, the full ends at Ayr and Kilmarnock

I know you are against this, and nobody is forcing you to move.

Patronising nonsense Gary. Almost every away ground puts visiting supporters behind a goal. We don't get a vote. Its Hobson's choice.

My family loved Malmo away, Ayr away, Killie away. Cup games are special. They are different to bread and butter league games.

I'm for any change that improves our club. We just need more evidence that splitting a hundred singers into two singing areas would work.

Would people give up a great view im the East for a crap view just to stand and sing when they can have both at the moment?

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 06:27 PM
Patronising nonsense Gary. Almost every away ground puts visiting supporters behind a goal. We don't get a vote. Its Hobson's choice.

My family loved Malmo away, Ayr away, Killie away. Cup games are special. They are different to bread and butter league games.

I'm for any change that improves our club. We just need more evidence that splitting a hundred singers into two singing areas would work.

Would people give up a great view im the East for a crap view just to stand and sing when they can have both at the moment?

Where have i patronised you? I have no problem with you sitting wherever you like in the ground, its makes no difference to me whatsoever, but there is a groundswell of fans wanting to move to the FF. And by the comments on this thread, nobody is saying anything about the view just how they think it would be a better option?

What are you frightened of gogs, and what makes you think we'd be splitting the hundred or so fans you mention, maybe most would move and add on to make it much bigger and better?

3pm
04-09-2013, 06:30 PM
Lower west (away end) for the troops in my opinion.

Not that it actually bothers me!

hibsbollah
04-09-2013, 06:38 PM
Would someone mind posting this poll on the Bounce as well?

After 24 hours getting a sample size of 150 Hibs fans is pretty good, but the more the better so I'll leave it here for a bit... So far its over 94% supportive of the idea, with 54% of folk saying they would consider moving to a stand like this. Personally I think those numbers are amazingly positive.

NAE NOOKIE
04-09-2013, 06:44 PM
Patronising nonsense Gary. Almost every away ground puts visiting supporters behind a goal. We don't get a vote. Its Hobson's choice.

My family loved Malmo away, Ayr away, Killie away. Cup games are special. They are different to bread and butter league games.

I'm for any change that improves our club. We just need more evidence that splitting a hundred singers into two singing areas would work.

Would people give up a great view im the East for a crap view just to stand and sing when they can have both at the moment?

I moved from the FF to the new east and then back again. The view from the FF aint that bad and to be honest I always thought the idea of being an 'Ultra' was supporting the team first, getting a good view second. I followed Hibs away for most of the late 70s early 80s and I doubt if I saw 50% of any game I was at. But it didnt matter so long as you could leave the ground talking about how good our backing of the team was.

I dont think anybody has in mind the idea of splitting the singing section in two ... its about moving it lock stock and barrel into the FF. Even better though if the ( hopefully ) few section 43ers still left in the East if this were to be a go-er were to join in with the singing when the FF Ultra's are banging out a tune or two.

Just to be clear .... From my point of view this is not an anti sect 43 or current singing section debate .... this is about making the singing section better and more effective ... not about splitting it or getting rid of it.

RIP
04-09-2013, 06:57 PM
When people call for a discussion on the impact of an idea they are accused of being 'frightened'.

I've asked a straight question and its being dodged.

What do we do with the few hundred radges who will remain standing and singing in the East?

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 07:02 PM
And another thing about the view, i think the view in the east is poor. You either have to wear sunglasses or a cap, or have your hand up to keep the sun out your eyes most of the bloody game.

When i decide to make an appearance back at easter road, it certainly wont be to the east.

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 07:04 PM
When people call for a discussion on the impact of an idea they are accused of being 'frightened'.

I've asked a straight question and its being dodged.

Nothing is being dodged, i and others feel the FF would be a MUCH better place for the ultras/singing section/idiots/boisterous, call them what you like to be.

Albanian Hibs
04-09-2013, 07:11 PM
I don't get this "the view from the ffl is crap"? I sit in the back row at the top right hand side corner (looking onto pitch) and it is a cracking view. Much better than east or west stand IMO.

RIP
04-09-2013, 07:12 PM
Nothing is being dodged, i and others feel the FF would be a MUCH better place for the ultras/singing section/idiots/boisterous, call them what you like to be.

So why not answer my question?

davhibby
04-09-2013, 07:14 PM
I don't get this "the view from the ffl is crap"? I sit in the back row at the top right hand side corner (looking onto pitch) and it is a cracking view. Much better than east or west stand IMO.

I sit in that area a few rows from the back and the view is very good, not sure why some people seem to think the view is so bad

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 07:16 PM
So why not answer my question?

I suppose you are meaning what evidence is there that splitting the support would work? You know i have no evidence at all, just as you have no evidence it wouldnt?

What evidence do you have that it wouldn't work?

Hibernia Na Eir
04-09-2013, 07:18 PM
would be a great idea.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 07:20 PM
I think it's a great idea but it will increase the capacity of the stadium again and if all it does is relocate people from the east to the new and presumably cheaper standing area then it would lose the club money. Any new standing area would have to be able to attract extra supporters to Easter road before it had my full support.

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 07:23 PM
I think it's a great idea but it will increase the capacity of the stadium again and if all it does is relocate people from the east to the new and presumably cheaper standing area then it would lose the club money. Any new standing area would have to be able to attract extra supporters to Easter road before it had my full support.

It would not increase the capacity, and it would not be cheaper. The stadium would remain exactly as it is now, but the family section would have to move.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 07:29 PM
It would not increase the capacity, and it would not be cheaper. The stadium would remain exactly as it is now, but the family section would have to move.

Sorry, I misunderstood what is being proposed then. Is the to be a section with no modifications but you are allowed to stand?
I thought the proposal was to remove the seats and have a safe terracing set up like on the continent. This would of course increase the capacity as more people can stand on a terrace than seats can be fitted.

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 07:42 PM
Sorry, I misunderstood what is being proposed then. Is the to be a section with no modifications but you are allowed to stand?
I thought the proposal was to remove the seats and have a safe terracing set up like on the continent. This would of course increase the capacity as more people can stand on a terrace than seats can be fitted.

Petrie would never spend that kind of money, and to be honest why should he? There is no need for any money to be spent on this, all it needs is arranged properly. Folk are allowed to stand in the east now, even though they get in the way of some folk who sit.

Moving them to the bottom tier of the FF and making it the singing section, and letting anyone who buys a season ticket or a ticket for the section left i no doubt they are in a section that will be boisterous.

In fact i feel it should even be billed as such.

hibsbollah
04-09-2013, 07:43 PM
Sorry, I misunderstood what is being proposed then. Is the to be a section with no modifications but you are allowed to stand?
I thought the proposal was to remove the seats and have a safe terracing set up like on the continent. This would of course increase the capacity as more people can stand on a terrace than seats can be fitted.

Personally, i'd want to see a new development of safe terracing on the German model, which would have a short term cost implication. But if theres a demand for it, the costs could of course be recouped by increased attendances in the long run. Spending money on any capital project has a requirement for short term cost. Feasibility work, engineers report, design, directors jollies to Gelsenkirchen on fact finding missions. Thats just a fact.

But for the purposes of this poll, we're just looking at the idea in principle. Whether its a 'rip out the seats' job or a trial period of relaxing the no-standing rules in the FF in the short term as a trial can be ironed out once we get talking to the club. And my personal opinion is that the board owe us something for what we've had to put up with on the pitch. An imaginative solution for improving the match day experience would be a perfect start.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 08:00 PM
A standing area where everyone just stands in nice little rows in front of their designated seats would be ok for a trial leading to the introduction of a proper terrace. If it was the final solution then it would be waste of time in my opinion.
A proper terrace is a great way to watch football and it was a sad day when they put seats in the east.

semaj64
04-09-2013, 08:00 PM
Yes god idea although I would have preferred if Hibs had built the East with an upper and lower, with the lower being potentially used for standing

hibsbollah
04-09-2013, 08:03 PM
A standing area where everyone just stands in nice little rows in front of their designated seats would be ok for a trial leading to the introduction of a proper terrace. If it was the final solution then it would be waste of time in my opinion.
A proper terrace is a great way to watch football and it was a sad day when they put seats in the east.

I agree with you. But for the purposes of this poll I thought we'd keep it simple :greengrin

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 08:16 PM
146 for 13 against, yes its only a small percentage of the support who have voted, but it is quite a difference in who's for and against.

down-the-slope
04-09-2013, 08:21 PM
Personally, i'd want to see a new development of safe terracing on the German model, which would have a short term cost implication. But if theres a demand for it, the costs could of course be recouped by increased attendances in the long run. Spending money on any capital project has a requirement for short term cost. Feasibility work, engineers report, design, directors jollies to Gelsenkirchen on fact finding missions. Thats just a fact.

But for the purposes of this poll, we're just looking at the idea in principle. Whether its a 'rip out the seats' job or a trial period of relaxing the no-standing rules in the FF in the short term as a trial can be ironed out once we get talking to the club. And my personal opinion is that the board owe us something for what we've had to put up with on the pitch. An imaginative solution for improving the match day experience would be a perfect start.

:agree: was my understanding of reason for poll - I would still pay my full ST cost to get this....and yes it would increase capacity a bit...but SAFE standing would mean restrictions so no old terrace 'sways' could occur

RIP
04-09-2013, 08:21 PM
Can somebody (not Blackpool obviously) explain how you convince the current FF lower people to move out and the singing section to move in.

A thousand people will move seats on the basis of a secret ballot on a messageboard?

Really? Really?

Craig_in_Prague
04-09-2013, 08:22 PM
I only go see my local team because I CAN stand (well, the beer might help too).
I hope this happens at ER, better for those that go along whilst it will also improve overall atmosphere.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 08:42 PM
:agree: was my understanding of reason for poll - I would still pay my full ST cost to get this....and yes it would increase capacity a bit...but SAFE standing would mean restrictions so no old terrace 'sways' could occur

If you don't sprain your ankle at least once a season your not doing it right.
;-)
The old terraces were only unsafe if two many people were crammed in them.
With modern ticketing etc there is no chance of them becoming a hazard.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 08:48 PM
10921

Hermit Crab
04-09-2013, 08:53 PM
146 for 13 against, yes its only a small percentage of the support who have voted, but it is quite a difference in who's for and against.

13 yams voted on this poll. ;)

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 09:08 PM
Can somebody (not Blackpool obviously) explain how you convince the current FF lower people to move out and the singing section to move in.

A thousand people will move seats on the basis of a secret ballot on a messageboard?

Really? Really?

Do all the 1000 people who are in the FF sit there because of the price or the terrible view they get? Moving them to the east at the same price, to a much better seat would be a no brainer, wouldn't you agree?

3pm
04-09-2013, 09:11 PM
Do all the 1000 people who are in the FF sit there because of the price or the terrible view they get? Moving them to the east at the same price, to a much better seat would be a no brainer, wouldn't you agree?

No really.....you watched us lately?! :o)

RIP
04-09-2013, 09:49 PM
Do all the 1000 people who are in the FF sit there because of the price or the terrible view they get? Moving them to the east at the same price, to a much better seat would be a no brainer, wouldn't you agree?

I thought you were moving the singing section out of the East and displacing the people in the FFLower to make room for them?

When are you going to answer my question? Why would all these people choose a seat they like with a view they like then move just because somebody puts a poll on Hibs.Net?

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 09:59 PM
I thought you were moving the singing section out of the East and displacing the people in the FFLower to make room for them?

When are you going to answer my question? Why would all these people choose a seat they like with a view they like then move just because somebody puts a poll on Hibs.Net?

it won't happen because of a poll on Hibs.net. it will happen if a lot of folk want it and the club agree? this is a discussion about it, and I'd imagine it will be asked at the next LWT meeting if its achievable or indeed wanted.

Eyrie
04-09-2013, 10:01 PM
Is anyone suggesting that they should be evicted from s43, or just that the club should encourage the use of the FF lower as a designated area for singing and standing?

If half move and half don't, I'd say that would create a better atmosphere because there would be two places where there are groups to get a song going, and with two parts of the ground singing it will encourage others to join in.

clerriehibs
04-09-2013, 10:04 PM
I thought you were moving the singing section out of the East and displacing the people in the FFLower to make room for them?

When are you going to answer my question? Why would all these people choose a seat they like with a view they like then move just because somebody puts a poll on Hibs.Net?

I don't believe this change would happen during the current season, so they wouldn't move. If it happens, different season, different pricing, different choices - it happens every year.

blackpoolhibs
04-09-2013, 10:27 PM
Is anyone suggesting that they should be evicted from s43, or just that the club should encourage the use of the FF lower as a designated area for singing and standing?

If half move and half don't, I'd say that would create a better atmosphere because there would be two places where there are groups to get a song going, and with two parts of the ground singing it will encourage others to join in.

I'm suggesting its moved to the FF lock stock and barrell, nobody could complain about language, people standing or indeed anything, as that would be the place the folk could stand with the permission of the club.

The east is much too big for this to be a success ever, the bottom tier is perfect for it, and perfect for it to grow without any problems.

If folk want to sing in the east, terrific. If they want to sing in the west, great, but the main hub of our support who want to do the things they do in away ends all over Scotland should be in the FF until such times as thats too small.

Ozyhibby
04-09-2013, 10:33 PM
If the capacity was increased by a terraced famous five stand then maybe they could take out every second row in the west upper so that Busty wenches could bring us oldies beers (change in law required) and other refreshments. :-)

Slicer
05-09-2013, 01:35 AM
I've noticed recently a few teams in England have moved away fans from behind the goals to the corners or side of the pitch. Boro and Leeds are two I think. Even Wembley now. The reasoning behind it... they believe away teams get a boost shooting towards an end packed with their fans behind the goal. The roars when a corner is awarded etc. Now, I've never played the game and I don't know if having a packed FF lower would positively influence our players but I can't see it having a negative impact.

I voted yes, but I have a couple of questions...

Someone already mentioned the boxes in the FF. Do people buy these per game, for the season, or is it just the bar staff from BTG on their break? Corporate money is important to the club and if people/clients/sponsors are paying top dollar for these seats you cant have people standing in front of them. I remember 2005 when The Team Formally Known As Rangers won the league at ER, a few dodgers started celebrating Novo's goal in the box and a some kids stood at the windows to obstruct their view. If some 9 year olds can obstruct your view, how many rows from the back of the bottom tier would have to become redundant to clearly watch the game from the box with 6-foot men standing in front of you?

People are asking 'why would anyone move?' I'm sure most people would move if the Family Section was moved to the first two sections of the East and West Lower. But a father/child ticket is much cheaper behind the goals because of the view. If you shift the section, what's to stop people buying cheap family tickets and shifting along to a premium seat in the West Centre in a half full stand?

Keith_M
05-09-2013, 08:34 AM
I've noticed recently a few teams in England have moved away fans from behind the goals to the corners or side of the pitch. Boro and Leeds are two I think. Even Wembley now. The reasoning behind it... they believe away teams get a boost shooting towards an end packed with their fans behind the goal. The roars when a corner is awarded etc. Now, I've never played the game and I don't know if having a packed FF lower would positively influence our players but I can't see it having a negative impact.

I voted yes, but I have a couple of questions...

Someone already mentioned the boxes in the FF. Do people buy these per game, for the season, or is it just the bar staff from BTG on their break? Corporate money is important to the club and if people/clients/sponsors are paying top dollar for these seats you cant have people standing in front of them. I remember 2005 when The Team Formally Known As Rangers won the league at ER, a few dodgers started celebrating Novo's goal in the box and a some kids stood at the windows to obstruct their view. If some 9 year olds can obstruct your view, how many rows from the back of the bottom tier would have to become redundant to clearly watch the game from the box with 6-foot men standing in front of you?

People are asking 'why would anyone move?' I'm sure most people would move if the Family Section was moved to the first two sections of the East and West Lower. But a father/child ticket is much cheaper behind the goals because of the view. If you shift the section, what's to stop people buying cheap family tickets and shifting along to a premium seat in the West Centre in a half full stand?


If the Family Section was in the West Lower but only in the outer sections (1-3 & 7-9), not in the middle (4-6), they could charge lower prices for that than the 3 middle sections of the West Lower. That would be reasonable as the view is better in the middle sections than at the sides. In fact, when they opened the West Stand, I'm sure that's pretty much how the pricing was done.

clerriehibs
05-09-2013, 08:46 AM
IF it happens ... would it be called "The Cave", "The Cowshed", or "The Lower FF (Standing)" ...:dunno:

green&left
05-09-2013, 08:51 AM
Will happen sooner or later IMO.

The rules on standing have already been relaxed from experience, bar Dundee Utd away I don't think i've ever had an issue standing at an away in a good while, wereas before hand even standing on the back rows you'd get grief from the stewards.

Celtic are in discussion about it with the CSA & GB I believe. A Few championships have voiced they want to explore it. German, Dutch & Swedish clubs have it, joke its still something that hasn't been considered IMO.

Keith_M
05-09-2013, 08:57 AM
IF it happens ... would it be called "The Cave", "The Cowshed", or "The Lower FF (Standing)" ...:dunno:



The Deep End :wink:

blackpoolhibs
05-09-2013, 09:15 AM
The full end. :thumbsup:

Hermit Crab
05-09-2013, 09:42 AM
Have hibs been contacted about this yet? If so so what has their response been?

blackpoolhibs
05-09-2013, 10:12 AM
Have hibs been contacted about this yet? If so so what has their response been?

It has been formally discussed at the LWT meetings in the past, and was not booted straight out by Petrie.

It is a must that a proper investigation is taken by the club, and real dialogue had to see if this is wanted and indeed could be done.

I personally don't see anything wrong in this, and if it is wanted and can be done then lets do it. If its not wanted, then no harm done.

Hermit Crab
05-09-2013, 10:28 AM
It has been formally discussed at the LWT meetings in the past, and was not booted straight out by Petrie.

It is a must that a proper investigation is taken by the club, and real dialogue had to see if this is wanted and indeed could be done.

I personally don't see anything wrong in this, and if it is wanted and can be done then lets do it. If its not wanted, then no harm done.


Agree. The least the club could do is conduct a feasibility study into it.

Persevere80
05-09-2013, 11:32 AM
I like the idea of the singing section being close to the away fans. But to help the atmosphere overall, being in the lower ff standing sounds good to me. I'm a walk up fans so the idea would not affect me to much but we have still not heard much response from section 43 or ff lower.

Mr White
05-09-2013, 11:54 AM
Banners and flags placed along the back 4 or 5 rows of the ff lower would avoid blocking the view from the boxes. My son and I have seasons in ff lower and would have no problem moving in future to accommodate something that could improve the atmosphere and matchday experience.

Moulin Yarns
05-09-2013, 12:14 PM
The Deep End :wink:


The full end. :thumbsup:

of course the South will always be the bellend.

Waxy
05-09-2013, 02:53 PM
Can anyone remember what year it was they put them benches in the cowshed?
Must have been early seventies i guess.
Come on Hibs. Let us stand in the FF.

Keith_M
05-09-2013, 03:18 PM
Can anyone remember what year it was they put them benches in the cowshed?


If you mean the 'Cave', someone mentioned on here before that it was 1974.

clerriehibs
05-09-2013, 03:52 PM
If you mean the 'Cave', someone mentioned on here before that it was 1974.

Was anyone on here around when the roof went up over the north terracing ... and what nickname was it given at that time?

McLeod1875
05-09-2013, 07:54 PM
Its a fact, you can't create a wild/brilliant atmosphere sitting on your erse.... As everyone that was in Malmo or at the CIS Cup Final or any other final or semi or even at any other amazing away game... will know.

This has to be done very soon to bring back fans and bring back the real atmosphere that we used to have at Easter Road!

Finger out Hibs, listen to US for ****ing once!!!!

mca
05-09-2013, 07:54 PM
Where Would Rod and the Prawn Sarnies Sit ???

Couldnt possibly Have 2000 or So maybe All Singing and Dancing and only ever Occasionally- Irate Fans - Even Closer to the Prawns Ears.. :wink:

RIP
05-09-2013, 08:10 PM
Anyone up for leading a working group to look into this a bit further? It's been raised before at LWT so would need 4 or 5 volunteers, a minimum of 2 would need to pitch up to Easter Road, 2nd Wednesday of October to present your findings

blackpoolhibs
05-09-2013, 08:47 PM
Anyone up for leading a working group to look into this a bit further? It's been raised before at LWT so would need 4 or 5 volunteers, a minimum of 2 would need to pitch up to Easter Road, 2nd Wednesday of October to present your findings

Anyone pitching up would have little findings on the subject, apart from the poll on here and their own personal thoughts.

Anyone who brings the subject up should be asking the club their thoughts on it, is it viable or not?

And would they be prepared to ask the question of the support?

hibsbollah
05-09-2013, 09:07 PM
Anyone up for leading a working group to look into this a bit further? It's been raised before at LWT so would need 4 or 5 volunteers, a minimum of 2 would need to pitch up to Easter Road, 2nd Wednesday of October to present your findings

'Leading a working group' has a sound of 'kicking it into the long grass' about it.

It's the job of the club to do some early feasibility work to establish any 'findings'. Obviously a handful of fans working as volunteers arent going to be able to come up with any 'findings' by mid October, thats a job for others.

I'll be PMing and texting anyone I know will be attending the meeting to make sure this gets raised and gets some serious consideration. Theres certainly enough support for the idea. If Rod and the board have any sense they will know it could also represent some good PR for them too.

Bobo
05-09-2013, 09:28 PM
So the East was built as a single tier because a percentage of the support thought it would generate a better atmosphere at games .... now it's been proven that it doesn't, fans now want to relocate to another part of the stadium and have the seats ripped out to accommodate a singing section!!?

If there's to be any future standing areas introduced, consideration should be given to the redevelopment of the North/East corner of the stadium. Development would obviously be costly to the club so better to extend the stadium capacity this way rather than paying to alter the existing structures at the whim of the support.

I'd love to see the return of standing areas but only in addition to the fabric of the stadium we currently already have.... just my opinion.

Hermit Crab
05-09-2013, 09:31 PM
Its a fact, you can't create a wild/brilliant atmosphere sitting on your erse.... As everyone that was in Malmo or at the CIS Cup Final or any other final or semi or even at any other amazing away game... will know.

This has to be done very soon to bring back fans and bring back the real atmosphere that we used to have at Easter Road!

Finger out Hibs, listen to US for ****ing once!!!!

Hear hear.

MichelleHibs
06-09-2013, 06:51 AM
Have sat in ff lower since the stand opened in 94/95ish?! Wouldn't want to move, why can't the lower half of the terracing become the standing area? Closer to pitch, would make it like the old terrace?!

clerriehibs
06-09-2013, 08:13 AM
So the East was built as a single tier because a percentage of the support thought it would generate a better atmosphere at games .... now it's been proven that it doesn't, fans now want to relocate to another part of the stadium and have the seats ripped out to accommodate a singing section!!?

If there's to be any future standing areas introduced, consideration should be given to the redevelopment of the North/East corner of the stadium. Development would obviously be costly to the club so better to extend the stadium capacity this way rather than paying to alter the existing structures at the whim of the support.

I'd love to see the return of standing areas but only in addition to the fabric of the stadium we currently already have.... just my opinion.

The proposal to allow standing in the lower FF can be done at no cost. There is already approval or acknowledgement in place to allow standing in sect 43 (which might well be an irritant to some in sect42 or sect44, who want to remain seated but then have a restricted view). Allowing standing in ALL of the lower FF wouldn't be an irritant to anyone, (other than those who have been sitting there since 1994 and would like to remain sitting there, but all things must change eventually) and the seats could remain in place. Should remain in place, at least for a couple of seasons, to review the success of this or otherwise.

If it's all hunky dory, or even a rip-roaring success, then spend the relatively minor cost of ripping out the existing seats, and adding the convertible seating, which would increase the standing capacity of the lower FF, while maintaining our all-seated capability for Europe (be positive, we WILL become regular qualifiers again).

That relatively minor cost is as compared to filling in the NE corner to allow standing. Construction like that would be far more expensive than converting the lower FF.

blackpoolhibs
06-09-2013, 08:19 AM
The proposal to allow standing in the lower FF can be done at no cost. There is already approval or acknowledgement in place to allow standing in sect 43 (which might well be an irritant to some in sect42 or sect44, who want to remain seated but then have a restricted view). Allowing standing in ALL of the lower FF wouldn't be an irritant to anyone, (other than those who have been sitting there since 1994 and would like to remain sitting there, but all things must change eventually) and the seats could remain in place. Should remain in place, at least for a couple of seasons, to review the success of this or otherwise.

If it's all hunky dory, or even a rip-roaring success, then spend the relatively minor cost of ripping out the existing seats, and adding the convertible seating, which would increase the standing capacity of the lower FF, while maintaining our all-seated capability for Europe (be positive, we WILL become regular qualifiers again).

That relatively minor cost is as compared to filling in the NE corner to allow standing. Construction like that would be far more expensive than converting the lower FF.


This. :top marks

NAE NOOKIE
06-09-2013, 06:18 PM
So the East was built as a single tier because a percentage of the support thought it would generate a better atmosphere at games .... now it's been proven that it doesn't, fans now want to relocate to another part of the stadium and have the seats ripped out to accommodate a singing section!!?

If there's to be any future standing areas introduced, consideration should be given to the redevelopment of the North/East corner of the stadium. Development would obviously be costly to the club so better to extend the stadium capacity this way rather than paying to alter the existing structures at the whim of the support.

I'd love to see the return of standing areas but only in addition to the fabric of the stadium we currently already have.... just my opinion.

Or removed as those of us up for this idea would say.

Whos talking about increasing the stadium capacity? As far as I'm aware the lower FF probably holds about 2,000 and I doubt if converting it to a standing area would increase it by any discernible number. Hell, theres more than enough capacity at ER to create a standing area without increasing the size of the stadium.

down-the-slope
06-09-2013, 08:15 PM
Anyone pitching up would have little findings on the subject, apart from the poll on here and their own personal thoughts.

Anyone who brings the subject up should be asking the club their thoughts on it, is it viable or not?

And would they be prepared to ask the question of the support?

Anyone leading this would have facility to survey wider support in an in depth way - also looking at models working elsewhere etc


'Leading a working group' has a sound of 'kicking it into the long grass' about it.

It's the job of the club to do some early feasibility work to establish any 'findings'. Obviously a handful of fans working as volunteers arent going to be able to come up with any 'findings' by mid October, thats a job for others.

I'll be PMing and texting anyone I know will be attending the meeting to make sure this gets raised and gets some serious consideration. Theres certainly enough support for the idea. If Rod and the board have any sense they will know it could also represent some good PR for them too.

Worked Too long in the public sector I think :agree:

Club has limited resources to be looking at more that the most immediate priorities....one of the reasons LWT was born


So the East was built as a single tier because a percentage of the support thought it would generate a better atmosphere at games .... now it's been proven that it doesn't, fans now want to relocate to another part of the stadium and have the seats ripped out to accommodate a singing section!!?

If there's to be any future standing areas introduced, consideration should be given to the redevelopment of the North/East corner of the stadium. Development would obviously be costly to the club so better to extend the stadium capacity this way rather than paying to alter the existing structures at the whim of the support.

I'd love to see the return of standing areas but only in addition to the fabric of the stadium we currently already have.... just my opinion.


The proposal to allow standing in the lower FF can be done at no cost. There is already approval or acknowledgement in place to allow standing in sect 43 (which might well be an irritant to some in sect42 or sect44, who want to remain seated but then have a restricted view). Allowing standing in ALL of the lower FF wouldn't be an irritant to anyone, (other than those who have been sitting there since 1994 and would like to remain sitting there, but all things must change eventually) and the seats could remain in place. Should remain in place, at least for a couple of seasons, to review the success of this or otherwise.

If it's all hunky dory, or even a rip-roaring success, then spend the relatively minor cost of ripping out the existing seats, and adding the convertible seating, which would increase the standing capacity of the lower FF, while maintaining our all-seated capability for Europe (be positive, we WILL become regular qualifiers again).

That relatively minor cost is as compared to filling in the NE corner to allow standing. Construction like that would be far more expensive than converting the lower FF.

Waste of time doing a half cocked trial - it would be like serving burgers in a restaurant you were trying to prove could be an a la carte restaurant...needs the proper adaptation with either permenant 'boxed' terrace or the Dortmund terrace / pop up seating

blackpoolhibs
06-09-2013, 08:30 PM
Waste of time doing a half cocked trial - it would be like serving burgers in a restaurant you were trying to prove could be an a la carte restaurant...needs the proper adaptation with either permenant 'boxed' terrace or the Dortmund terrace / pop up seating

I disagree, there is no chance at all Petrie would spend any money on adapting the bottom tier of the FF, and i'd agree with that 100%.

What would be the point in it, when at the other end each and every week the opposition fans would be standing in an unadapted end, whether its 350 or 3500?

The time to adapt any standing area would be when we were filling it regularly, and lets be honest here, thats not going to happen for a while.

Bobo
06-09-2013, 08:52 PM
Or removed as those of us up for this idea would say.

Whos talking about increasing the stadium capacity? As far as I'm aware the lower FF probably holds about 2,000 and I doubt if converting it to a standing area would increase it by any discernible number. Hell, theres more than enough capacity at ER to create a standing area without increasing the size of the stadium.

That makes it alright then because a small minority want it, then it should happen, just like the decision to make the East single tier? Really worked with that one .... perfect example of the tail wagging the dog!! :rolleyes:

As I said previously I'm all for bringing back standing areas but not at the expense of making whole scale changes to the stadium just because some poorly conceived ideas, about the East, have come home to roost and bitten a section of the fans on the @rse.

down-the-slope
06-09-2013, 08:54 PM
I disagree, there is no chance at all Petrie would spend any money on adapting the bottom tier of the FF, and i'd agree with that 100%.

What would be the point in it, when at the other end each and every week the opposition fans would be standing in an unadapted end, whether its 350 or 3500?

The time to adapt any standing area would be when we were filling it regularly, and lets be honest here, thats not going to happen for a while.

:aok: debate is what its all about.

I wouldnt move as things stand for your 'vision' of a trial...but would for the full monty...

What if we got enough support to think it was viable and then sought to raise the cash required for a full conversion...another Hibernian first and Rod would not have to risk a coronary....

Waxy
06-09-2013, 09:00 PM
Remember we only put benches into the old east because we HAD to.
If there was a poll back then there would be hardly anyone wanting seats put under the old east.

NAE NOOKIE
07-09-2013, 11:32 AM
That makes it alright then because a small minority want it, then it should happen, just like the decision to make the East single tier? Really worked with that one .... perfect example of the tail wagging the dog!! :rolleyes:

As I said previously I'm all for bringing back standing areas but not at the expense of making whole scale changes to the stadium just because some poorly conceived ideas, about the East, have come home to roost and bitten a section of the fans on the @rse.

As far as I am aware the club were already up for the single tier stand for two reasons. 1 ) it was cheaper to build and 2 ) it is cheaper to police. The mock up of the stand looked the dugs bollocks at the meetings and it was easy to like the idea. The only thing Hibs got wrong was that they made it too big ( 5,500 would have been better ) and the front row is about 10 feet too far from the pitch.

As for "the tail wagging the dog" Certain changes to the stadium are always going to be of more concern to some sections of the support than others. This particular question is of interest to that section of our support probably, but not exclusively, those between the ages of 14 and 50 who think that being able to stand and cheer on the team from a dedicated Ultra's area would be not only good fun, but also perhaps help the team.

As for folk like me over 50 .... Though I'm not in the Ultra's bracket any more I come from the school of thought that over anything like fab seats. big screens, food outlets that sell Lobster & T Bone steak and all that .... the main thing, the most important thing ... the ONLY THING that should be at the forefront of a stadium designers mind is ... how good can I make the atmosphere IMO its everything to a football ground.

At the moment in most games ( in spite of the appreciated and heroic efforts of section 43 and other groups ) the atmosphere at Easter Road is poor .... A lot of fans, if this poll is representative, and theres no reason to think it isnt, feel that everything that can be done to improve things must be done ... the FF standing section sounds like a step in the right direction and with about 13,000 seats available to home fans even after removing seats from the lower FF I for one cant see why this idea cant be at least given a trial. I hardly doubt it could be classed as wholesale change to the stadium as you say.

As a current ST holder in the FF I would be more than happy to decant to the East or West in order to see the current graveyard like atmosphere at ER change for the better.

Just to finish my wee rant. A few years back the Germans sat down and decided to have a root & branch look at their football from top to bottom. It has been hugely successful with crowds way up and a massive on field improvement. Part of that has been to have standing areas, even in brand new state of the art stadiums.

This idea has been proved to work.

twiceinathens
07-09-2013, 12:43 PM
Have now reached the stage in life where I prefer to have the opportunity to have a seated unrestricted view of football, but I recognise the desirability of having an area where the more demonstrative and physically able of supporters should be able to express themselves to the benefit of the team while not antagonising fellow Hibees. I clearly remember the "joys" of standing on an open terracing in the pouring rain avoiding the underfoot flow of more noxious fluids, or being trapped against a crush barrier in a crowd of 135,000 in the old Hampden as the half cut late comers pushed in from the back. On the plus side the atmosphere was certainly far more intense than now. And here lies the key. Any such system has to be tightly controlled to avoid overcrowding. Hillsborough was not a myth. Properly planned the reintroduction of a terracing area would be a positive move.

Keith_M
07-09-2013, 03:45 PM
OK, so far we have 111 people that say they'd be willing to sand in an area that should be able accommodate around 3,000 people. Doesn't sound like it's going to work.



















:greengrin

Keith_M
07-09-2013, 03:48 PM
The only thing Hibs got wrong was that they made it too big ( 5,500 would have been better ) .


Eh, Bovril, that's only 800 seats less than it is now. Do you really think that would have made such a big difference?

NAE NOOKIE
07-09-2013, 05:40 PM
Eh, Bovril, that's only 800 seats less than it is now. Do you really think that would have made such a big difference?

OK then 5,000 :greengrin

I suppose the fact that the new stand near enough doubled the capacity on that side of the ground seems to have worked agains us rather than for us .... the cup game against the Yams notwithstanding when the new East came into its own. Unfortunately we dont get 17,500 at many games.

Keith_M
07-09-2013, 05:44 PM
So the East was built as a single tier because a percentage of the support thought it would generate a better atmosphere at games .... now it's been proven that it doesn't,


Can't possibly agree with that. There have been lots of games where the area designated for the Singing Section has produced a good atmosphere.

I think people are using selective memories when comparing it to the previous East Stand, because there were plenty occasions with that in place where ER was also like a morgue.

IMHO, the fans have just been gradually worn down by years of cr*p football and the atmosphere suffered accordingly.

Keith_M
07-09-2013, 05:45 PM
OK then 5,000 :greengrin

I suppose the fact that the new stand near enough doubled the capacity on that side of the ground seems to have worked agains us rather than for us .... the cup game against the Yams notwithstanding when the new East came into its own. Unfortunately we dont get 17,500 at many games.


:greengrin

kentao
07-09-2013, 05:51 PM
OK, so far we have 111 people that say they'd be willing to sand in an area that should be able accommodate around 3,000 people. Doesn't sound like it's going to work.
:greengrin

The poll only has 210 replies. If you were to multiply these figures to upto the 10k diehards it would equate to 5285 people would sit there.3809 would like the idea but would stay where they are. 809 would leave it how it is and 95 people have no opinion.

These figures would only work if the voting was the continue the same trend. So the demand is there.

clerriehibs
07-09-2013, 05:51 PM
Anyone leading this would have facility to survey wider support in an in depth way - also looking at models working elsewhere etc



Worked Too long in the public sector I think :agree:

Club has limited resources to be looking at more that the most immediate priorities....one of the reasons LWT was born





Waste of time doing a half cocked trial - it would be like serving burgers in a restaurant you were trying to prove could be an a la carte restaurant...needs the proper adaptation with either permenant 'boxed' terrace or the Dortmund terrace / pop up seating

Not sure why you say that, to tell the truth ... the South Stand at the moment with a full complement of celtic/rangers/yams seems to work well enough.

clerriehibs
07-09-2013, 05:56 PM
That makes it alright then because a small minority want it, then it should happen, just like the decision to make the East single tier? Really worked with that one .... perfect example of the tail wagging the dog!! :rolleyes:

As I said previously I'm all for bringing back standing areas but not at the expense of making whole scale changes to the stadium just because some poorly conceived ideas, about the East, have come home to roost and bitten a section of the fans on the @rse.

You can't say that only a small minority want it. There may only be a small minority of the attending support who are discussing it at the moment, but the only data available on the popularity of it is this poll. This poll is in no way representative, but it is indicative; and indications are, that of those who can be bothered to show a flicker of interest in this, one way or the other, there would be a significant majority in favour.

And few are advocating wholesale changes to the stadium a the moment.

Keith_M
07-09-2013, 06:10 PM
The poll only has 210 replies. If you were to multiply these figures to upto the 10k diehards it would equate to 5285 people would sit there.3809 would like the idea but would stay where they are. 809 would leave it how it is and 95 people have no opinion.

These figures would only work if the voting was the continue the same trend. So the demand is there.



Whoosh

hibsbollah
07-09-2013, 06:16 PM
The poll only has 210 replies. If you were to multiply these figures to upto the 10k diehards it would equate to 5285 people would sit there.3809 would like the idea but would stay where they are. 809 would leave it how it is and 95 people have no opinion.

These figures would only work if the voting was the continue the same trend. So the demand is there.

I think keekaboo was being ironic :greengrin

A word about polling and probability; Gallup typically poll between 500-1000 people for their polls on big national political questions, which typically gives them a 3-4% margin on error either way. (I dont have this nonsense in my head all the time, by the way, i went on wiki :greengrin). The probability of big swings back the other direction starts to disappear after you get to between 50-100 responses. (Unless of course you get bloc voting by folk with vested interests or yams taking the pish, which is the danger with online polls). So although 210 responses isnt enough to be totally confident, its enough to give a strong indication of how hibs fans are thinking.

kentao
07-09-2013, 06:22 PM
Hook line and sinker lol :P

RIP
07-09-2013, 07:41 PM
I've sent a dozen posters on here a pm asking them if they want to volunteer to help get this off the ground. One yes, 1 mibbies no so far. 10 replies still to come in?

Anyone else? Please send me a pm

down-the-slope
07-09-2013, 08:15 PM
Not sure why you say that, to tell the truth ... the South Stand at the moment with a full complement of celtic/rangers/yams seems to work well enough.

Maybe you mis understand? - I'm all for a proper standing section. Its just i would not want it failing due to half cocked trial.

Away support have no option of where they are located - home support do


I've sent a dozen posters on here a pm asking them if they want to volunteer to help get this off the ground. One yes, 1 mibbies no so far. 10 replies still to come in?

Anyone else? Please send me a pm

:aok: Its something I want - Hibs should be as always at forefront of innovation.......

Maybe i'm a tad busy though :greengrin what to drop :hmmm:

blackpoolhibs
08-09-2013, 09:00 AM
Not really sure what i can do from 220 miles away?

Keith_M
08-09-2013, 12:21 PM
Not really sure what i can do from 220 miles away?


You could get out your Credit Card and order 2,000 of these (preferably in green)




10935

blackpoolhibs
08-09-2013, 01:30 PM
You could get out your Credit Card and order 2,000 of these (preferably in green)




10935

Consider it done, after all its only mo..............................:wink:

RIP
08-09-2013, 03:40 PM
Not really sure what i can do from 220 miles away?

1. Join a team
2. Conduct research on stadium safety, development of safe standing in Europe etc
3. Use a forum to discuss how to implement it at ER
4. Contact SPFL, Supporters Direct, other clubs who are trialling safe standing, safety department at Council
5. Write a succinct report
6. Submit it to Garry O'Hagan

Other members of your team could meet with Garry to discuss your report

blackpoolhibs
08-09-2013, 03:58 PM
1. Join a team

Again what good would that do when i'm 220 miles away?

2. Conduct research on stadium safety, development of safe standing in Europe etc

We stand safely in section 43, that's all we need to know.

3. Use a forum to discuss how to implement it at ER

You make it sound like its difficult to implement, folk stand now in the east, I suggest they stand in the FF where nobody will have an obstructed view.

4. Contact SPFL, Supporters Direct, other clubs who are trialling safe standing, safety department at Council

Again no need for this, its not rocket science what i'm suggesting, its having a place where we can stand that likeminded folk can do so, just like they do at Tannadice, who did they consult?


5. Write a succinct report
6. Submit it to Garry O'Hagan

Again, WTF?

Other members of your team could meet with Garry to discuss your report

[B]Its all bull****, all the club needs to do is ask the fans if they want it, and do a survey of them. There's no need for all that bull?

marinello59
08-09-2013, 04:03 PM
[B]Its all bull****, all the club needs to do is ask the fans if they want it, and do a survey of them. There's no need for all that bull?

:agree:

Keith_M
08-09-2013, 05:37 PM
Consider it done, after all its only mo..............................:wink:


:thumbsup:

RIP
08-09-2013, 07:15 PM
Five volunteers in 24 hours that should be enough to get this off the ground. This needs to be a fans initiative and we can conduct our own surveys in S43 and FF.

Watch this space, for an update after Wednesdays meeting with management

Persevere80
08-09-2013, 08:15 PM
Five volunteers in 24 hours that should be enough to get this off the ground. This needs to be a fans initiative and we can conduct our own surveys in S43 and FF.

Watch this space, for an update after Wednesdays meeting with management

Sounds good. I think it would be interesting to hear the feedback from section 43 and ff.

TheFamous1875
08-09-2013, 10:31 PM
It really could be a revolutionary step towards making ER a fortress again. I hope we can all do our bit.

blackpoolhibs
09-09-2013, 07:14 AM
Five volunteers in 24 hours that should be enough to get this off the ground. This needs to be a fans initiative and we can conduct our own surveys in S43 and FF.

Watch this space, for an update after Wednesdays meeting with management

Why, and why only those parts of the ground, why not the whole Hibs support?

dangermouse
09-09-2013, 09:32 AM
Not sure why you say that, to tell the truth ... the South Stand at the moment with a full complement of celtic/rangers/yams seems to work well enough.

Two dozen Motherwell fans managed out out sing us this season in the South. They were all standing as well.

Hermit Crab
09-09-2013, 10:20 AM
I've sent a dozen posters on here a pm asking them if they want to volunteer to help get this off the ground. One yes, 1 mibbies no so far. 10 replies still to come in?

Anyone else? Please send me a pm

Not sure I can help. I'm a shift worker and can't commit to meetings as I can't guarantee I can make them.

RIP
09-09-2013, 01:58 PM
Why (a fans initiative)?

Hibs management are maxed out focusing on things to make money right now. It's up to us supporters to do the spadework, prove the business case, to turn the support of 130 voters on an internet poll into a campaign.

[QUOTE=blackpoolhibs;3743874]and why only those parts of the ground, why not the whole Hibs support? Consult with everyone, of course, but unless the people in the FF and singing section are open to the change it won't fly.


Not sure I can help. I'm a shift worker and can't commit to meetings as I can't guarantee I can make them.

To be honest HC, most of the research can be done without getting together. A couple of the volunteers are already working on this so all you guys need is a wee email group or sub-forum. I can help with both.

Getting flag owners like you involved is key. I'll pm you with more details

:hibees

Hermit Crab
09-09-2013, 02:20 PM
[QUOTE=blackpoolhibs;3743874]Why (a fans initiative)?

Hibs management are maxed out focusing on things to make money right now. It's up to us supporters to do the spadework, prove the business case, to turn the support of 130 voters on an internet poll into a campaign.

Consult with everyone, of course, but unless the people in the FF and singing section are open to the change it won't fly.



To be honest HC, most of the research can be done without getting together. A couple of the volunteers are already working on this so all you guys need is a wee email group or sub-forum. I can help with both.

Getting flag owners like you involved is key. I'll pm you with more details

:hibees

Ok. I can't seem to find private messages on my phone for some reason, ever since tapatalk done an update. Will check the next time in on a computer.

Hermit Crab
10-09-2013, 10:57 AM
I have posted a photo on Facebook and asked for people's opinions on it. Hopefully I get responses.

Persevere80
12-09-2013, 03:28 PM
Just out of interest, have you had much response on Facebook?

Hermit Crab
12-09-2013, 06:22 PM
Just out of interest, have you had much response on Facebook?

Yes. Lots of support for and nobody against. Including fans of other clubs. It's what people want.

Hermit Crab
12-09-2013, 07:21 PM
Just out of interest, have you had much response on Facebook?

Even Banderson is for the idea. Tweeted it also.

blackpoolhibs
12-09-2013, 08:09 PM
Yes. Lots of support for and nobody against. Including fans of other clubs. It's what people want.

You got a link?

Hermit Crab
12-09-2013, 08:23 PM
You got a link?

No, it's my own page.

RIP
12-09-2013, 09:25 PM
Not sure I can help. I'm a shift worker and can't commit to meetings as I can't guarantee I can make them.


Why (a fans initiative)? Hibs management are maxed out focusing on things to make money right now. It's up to us supporters to do the spadework, prove the business case, to turn the support of 130 voters on an internet poll into a campaign.
Consult with everyone, of course, but unless the people in the FF and singing section are open to the change it won't fly.

To be honest HC, most of the research can be done without getting together. A couple of the volunteers are already working on this so all you guys need is a wee email group or sub-forum. I can help with both. Getting flag owners like you involved is key. I'll pm you with more details :hibees


Ok. I can't seem to find private messages on my phone for some reason, ever since tapatalk done an update. Will check the next time in on a computer.


Yes. Lots of support for and nobody against. Including fans of other clubs. It's what people want.

Right guys. BOVRIL has started a report and I've added to it. HibsBollah is doing research. I've circulated the report by email to the 6 interested posters and supplied a contact at Supporters Direct. I've mentioned it to Garry O'Hagan who is in charge of the stadium and Ross knows him well and can organise a meeting.

Keep the thread going by all means but the quicker you get that report knocked into shape, the sooner it will get considered by management. There are a few challenges around relocation in the FF and the ticket prices in that area. Has anyone considered using the South instead and moving all but 'Tic and Yams out to a small corner of the West or East? That way less Hibs ST's have to move and we give most of the opposition less chance to be heard.

VivaHiberña
12-09-2013, 09:51 PM
Right guys. BOVRIL has started a report and I've added to it. HibsBollah is doing research. I've circulated the report by email to the 6 interested posters and supplied a contact at Supporters Direct. I've mentioned it to Garry O'Hagan who is in charge of the stadium and Ross knows him well and can organise a meeting.

Keep the thread going by all means but the quicker you get that report knocked into shape, the sooner it will get considered by management. There are a few challenges around relocation in the FF and the ticket prices in that area. Has anyone considered using the South instead and moving all but 'Tic and Yams out to a small corner of the West or East? That way no Hibs ST's have to move and we give most of the opposition less chance to be heard.

Interesting idea, I imagine you saw that article on the BBC last month?

For those who didn't, it was about how more clubs are moving their away sections away from behind the goal due to a perceived psychological lift for teams who play towards a stand full of their own support, to the point that a home advantage becomes negligible.

Given the disproportionate noise that away fans tend to make and the number of folk on here who have said they can't hear S43 but every man and his dog can hear the South Stand, this could be a worthwhile move to consider.

blackpoolhibs
12-09-2013, 10:13 PM
Right guys. BOVRIL has started a report and I've added to it. HibsBollah is doing research. I've circulated the report by email to the 6 interested posters and supplied a contact at Supporters Direct. I've mentioned it to Garry O'Hagan who is in charge of the stadium and Ross knows him well and can organise a meeting.

Keep the thread going by all means but the quicker you get that report knocked into shape, the sooner it will get considered by management. There are a few challenges around relocation in the FF and the ticket prices in that area. Has anyone considered using the South instead and moving all but 'Tic and Yams out to a small corner of the West or East? That way no Hibs ST's have to move and we give most of the opposition less chance to be heard.

We don't have season ticket holders in the corners of the west and east, well you learn something new every day on here?

The reason I want it in the FF is so it can be given the time to grow, and its traditionally the end we shoot into in the 2nd half. I cant imagine it taking off in the south stand, especially when they'd have to move up to 6 times when sevco are back.

Maybe even more with cup games.

RIP
13-09-2013, 04:59 AM
We don't have season ticket holders in the corners of the west

Good spot Gary, I meant less but I put no by mistake. Edit now made

down-the-slope
13-09-2013, 11:33 AM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/24000760

Very interesting bits in this and timing very coincidental

Alloa Athletic chairman Mike Mulraney believes the introduction of safe standing would help Scottish clubs reduce prices and increase crowds.
The Wasps are among the most competitively priced clubs, according to the BBC's Price of Football study.
And Mulraney hopes to see standing areas, like those in Germany, adopted.
"There is great opportunity for value for money but that can only be adopted if we look at that different option," he told BBC Scotland.
"Everyone in football is looking at what's happening in Germany. They've proved that safe standing is not only safe, it allows a whole array of pricing structures to be implemented into football.
"There's a stratified pricing structure that takes you from £12 to £100 for a standard ticket entry.
"By putting in safe standing, the atmosphere improves, the media likes watching it whereas people still go out to the game.
"That can only be adopted by allowing more people into our ground to watch football as they want to watch it, which is standing up, in a safe environment."
Prior to the merger of the Scottish Premier League with the Scottish Football League to form the Scottish Professional Football League, top flight clubs were given the green light to have safe-standing areas within their stadiums. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/16248937)
Terraces were banned following the Hillsborough disaster (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19545126) in 1989 and the issue of allowing some standing areas has been revisited (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20679867) since all-seater stadiums became compulsory in England in 1994.
Scotland is not bound by the law which banned standing areas in top-flight football in England.
SPFL chief executive Neil Doncaster admits the issue of standing at football grounds is an "emotive" one.
"We introduced rules last season that allowed pilot schemes to be introduced for standing areas within grounds," he said.
"It is an area that is certainly a sensitive one but it's an area that we need to discuss.
"The German clubs get huge financial support from local businesses, which effectively subsidises standing tickets.
"There is a different culture there and certainly local companies around German clubs have a long history of having very direct, very substantial involvement in the finances of their local clubs, which effectively makes it cheaper for everyone else who wants to go.
"We need to keep a genuinely open mind about anything which is going to enhance the spectacle and enhance the experience for fans who want to come out and enjoy a day out at their football club."

Alloa have had successive promotions since Mulraney appointed manager Paul Hartley in 2011

Mulraney sees community engagement as a must for clubs looking to build a loyal support.
"The families expect to be entertained and that's one of the big challenges, particularly for lower level Scottish clubs," he added.
"The days of people blindly following us are gone, we've got to give them what they expect in the 21st Century and that means that the clubs have got to improve; clubs like ours have got to improve what we offer.
"It's a massive leap that we've got to make as clubs.
"In Alloa we've spent an enormous amount of money, a significant seven-figure sum on upgrading our stadium because people expect more, and quite rightly.
"Once our community value us, we get what we need, which is that absolute loyalty forever. People don't change their football club once they've got them."

NAE NOOKIE
13-09-2013, 07:29 PM
Right guys. BOVRIL has started a report and I've added to it. HibsBollah is doing research. I've circulated the report by email to the 6 interested posters and supplied a contact at Supporters Direct. I've mentioned it to Garry O'Hagan who is in charge of the stadium and Ross knows him well and can organise a meeting.

Keep the thread going by all means but the quicker you get that report knocked into shape, the sooner it will get considered by management. There are a few challenges around relocation in the FF and the ticket prices in that area. Has anyone considered using the South instead and moving all but 'Tic and Yams out to a small corner of the West or East? That way less Hibs ST's have to move and we give most of the opposition less chance to be heard.

Cant see the advantage in that one Goggs ..... You would obviously want the Ultras section in full swing in the bigger games. Not much point if they have to move from the South when we play the Yams or cellic ... or Sevco when they make the Premiership. As I said in the wee report I did. If we want this to happen then we cant be looking for the club to reduce prices for an FF ( or South for that matter ) standing section. IMO if we try to push that to the club they will back off from the proposal big time. After all, this whole idea is being mooted by supporters who 'prefer' to stand, or by those of us ( like me ) who think a standing section would add to the atmosphere. How can we expect the club to support it if it looks like it could lose them income?

Giving over more than half the East to away support aint going to happen either with Hibbies in the South, which is what would have to happen for big games. It would be a segregation nightmare outside the stadium. No ... for me its the FF or nothing .. not because I have anything against the South idea in principle, I just dont think it would work.

I suppose there may be some FF diehards who may not want to move to make way for an Ultra's section. But I honestly cant see a problem moving the family section to the FF end of the East. The facilities and view are just as good, if not better, than the FF. Anyway it isnt unusual for clubs to move certain sections around their stadiums from time to time for their own ends. Surely an attempt to improve the matchday atmosphere at ER is as good a reason as any other for this to happen.

down-the-slope
13-09-2013, 08:27 PM
[/B]Cant see the advantage in that one Goggs ..... You would obviously want the Ultras section in full swing in the bigger games. Not much point if they have to move from the South when we play the Yams or cellic ... or Sevco when they make the Premiership. As I said in the wee report I did. If we want this to happen then we cant be looking for the club to reduce prices for an FF ( or South for that matter ) standing section. IMO if we try to push that to the club they will back off from the proposal big time. After all, this whole idea is being mooted by supporters who 'prefer' to stand, or by those of us ( like me ) who think a standing section would add to the atmosphere. How can we expect the club to support it if it looks like it could lose them income?

Giving over more than half the East to away support aint going to happen either with Hibbies in the South, which is what would have to happen for big games. It would be a segregation nightmare outside the stadium. No ... for me its the FF or nothing .. not because I have anything against the South idea in principle, I just dont think it would work.

I suppose there may be some FF diehards who may not want to move to make way for an Ultra's section. But I honestly cant see a problem moving the family section to the FF end of the East. The facilities and view are just as good, if not better, than the FF. Anyway it isnt unusual for clubs to move certain sections around their stadiums from time to time for their own ends. Surely an attempt to improve the matchday atmosphere at ER is as good a reason as any other for this to happen.

:agree: you are repeating what I have said argued before - we have to make it added value not taking away from what we have. Going to the football was always more than just the game on the grass..bit by bit those other things have been erroded and so when time on the pitch like now are tough to bear there is little else to keep the commitment / habit going

Keith_M
13-09-2013, 08:55 PM
Has anyone considered using the South instead and moving all but 'Tic and Yams out to a small corner of the West or East? That way less Hibs ST's have to move and we give most of the opposition less chance to be heard.


The East is impractical from a security point of view, as it would mean holding back either those in the South Stand or the away fans in the East after the game for around 15 minutes after the match. Currently, the away fans are pretty much separated after the game, with home and away leaving by different routes. That won't be possible if there are Hibs fans in the South Stand.

RIP
13-09-2013, 08:57 PM
[/B]Cant see the advantage in that one Goggs ..... You would obviously want the Ultras section in full swing in the bigger games. Not much point if they have to move from the South when we play the Yams or cellic ... or Sevco when they make the Premiership. As I said in the wee report I did. If we want this to happen then we cant be looking for the club to reduce prices for an FF ( or South for that matter ) standing section. IMO if we try to push that to the club they will back off from the proposal big time. After all, this whole idea is being mooted by supporters who 'prefer' to stand, or by those of us ( like me ) who think a standing section would add to the atmosphere. How can we expect the club to support it if it looks like it could lose them income?

Giving over more than half the East to away support aint going to happen either with Hibbies in the South, which is what would have to happen for big games. It would be a segregation nightmare outside the stadium. No ... for me its the FF or nothing .. not because I have anything against the South idea in principle, I just dont think it would work.

I suppose there may be some FF diehards who may not want to move to make way for an Ultra's section. But I honestly cant see a problem moving the family section to the FF end of the East. The facilities and view are just as good, if not better, than the FF. Anyway it isnt unusual for clubs to move certain sections around their stadiums from time to time for their own ends. Surely an attempt to improve the matchday atmosphere at ER is as good a reason as any other for this to happen.

Good logic there M. Make sure you put all that in the report. Same with you JB. You need to prove to management you have thought it all through

hibsbollah
14-09-2013, 08:29 PM
This is quite an important link for the work we're proposing.

http://www.safestandingroadshow.co.uk/the-proposal

The Safe Standing Roadshow visited Easter Road in February 2012. I'm not sure what involvement, if any, the club had in this event. To summarise;

Their proposal is for the installation of 'rail seats', widely used in the Bundesliga. The seat size and required stand gradients are explained, none of which are problems for a potential Easter Road installation.

The most interesting element is the standing vs seating spectator ratios. This ratio, and the subsequent financial implications, contradict some of the things posted earlier on this thread. Basically, installing rail seats would allow 72 fans in a section that would hold only 42 seated. (Hoffenheim and Stuttgatt report a 2:1 ratio). The implication of this is an increased capacity and a potential increase in revenue income.

As an example, if 2,000 seated capacity section (like the FF lower) pay £20 a ticket, that= £40, 000.
In the same space, 3,600 standing punters would generate=£72,000.

That represents an increase of £32,000 per game, or £608,000 per league season not including cups. Assuming of course its popular and the new stand can be filled. (The Roadshow are assuming clubs will reduce ticket prices in the standing section AND
still return a profit). I've been more pessimistic but look on the link for their breakdown.

Whatever, there is a calculation to be made between the initial outlay on capital cost of installing the new seats on one hand, and the potential increased revenue income in the form of month on month ticket sales. To make this calculation we need an estimate of the capital work cost. The companies that have carried out this seat installation work in the past are Ehein-Mobel GmbH (Allianz Arena, Zenit St Petersburg Stadium) and Ferco (Feyenoord, Arsenal Emirates). They would require Hibs board to instruct them to prepare an estimate in advance of a survey. Obviously this is all conditional on more evidential work being done and agreement being reached with the club.

Legitimacy
The level of support for the proposal can be gauged by a poll on message board Hibs.net in September 2013. When asked 'do you support the idea of a safe standing section for 'ultras' in the Famous Five Lower?', of 239 respondents, 91.21% supported the proposal, and of these 51.88% said they would consider moving there. This result supports broader polling on a national level. In August 2012 a poll of 4000 supporters across the UK for the Football Supporters' Federation found that 91.1% 'supported the choice to sit or stand'.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19303004

In order to gain a picture specific to Hibs, it would be useful to survey the current residents of Famous Five Lower to get their perspective on a change to that area of the ground. It would also be useful to survey the only organised 'Ultra' group/singing section in Section 43.

Mr White
14-09-2013, 08:46 PM
Re the income increase: surely that only occurs if there is an overall increase in attendance? otherwise you're just moving people from say the east for 22 quid a ticket to the ff lower at say 18 quid to stand, so in practice most likely reducing income, at least initially?

hibsbollah
14-09-2013, 09:17 PM
Re the income increase: surely that only occurs if there is an overall increase in attendance? otherwise your just moving people from say the east for 22 quid a ticket to the ff lower at say 18 quid to stand, so potentially reducing income?

Two things; firstly talking about 'moving people from the East' is premature. Section 43 has broadly agreed to have been a success. We don't know the demand for a new seating area without doing some more polling. It might be there isn't enough demand to justify it, or there might be much more demand than even the poll on this thread indicates. We could have two vibrant and noisy areas in two different parts of the ground.


And secondly, we can only talk with total certainty about an increase in income for the area in question, ie-the FF lower in this example. Personally, I think an increase in income for the club as a whole is almost inevitable, if you look at the current empty spaces in the FF lower, and the interest that would be generated by a second 'Ultra' section, as well as the empirical evidence we've seen in Germany, where further increases to many clubs' standing sections have taken place in the last two-three years to satisfy ever growing demand.

But I'm being impartial for the purposes of this exercise:greengrin If you want to gain a greater understanding of the Roadshow's sums, go on the link.

Mr White
14-09-2013, 09:26 PM
Two things; firstly talking about 'moving people from the East' is premature. Section 43 has broadly agreed to have been a success. We don't know the demand for a new seating area without doing some more polling. It might be there isn't enough demand to justify it, or there might be much more demand than even the poll on this thread indicates. We could have two vibrant and noisy areas in two different parts of the ground. And secondly, we can only talk with total certainty about an increase in income for the area in question, ie-the FF lower in this example. Personally, I think an increase in income for the club as a whole is almost inevitable, if you look at the current spaces in the FF lower, and the interest that would be generated by a second 'Ultra' section. But I'm being impartial for the purposes of this exercise:greengrin
I agree it's a good idea but I'm sceptical that it would pay for itself tbh. My reference of the east wasn't related to sec 43, just meant it as example that extra bodies in the ff would most likely be folk who previously paid more in another part of the stadium, rather than lapsed fans returning due to the appeal of standing again. All the best with the research though, great idea that could really help the atmosphere imo :aok:

Persevere80
24-09-2013, 07:52 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/24232993

Celtic copying us again.

hibsbollah
20-11-2013, 06:49 PM
More very similar polling results, 91% of Arsenal fans support the football supporters federation position.

http://www.blackscarfafc.co.uk/uploads/2/1/1/2/21123492/black_scarf_movement_emirates_stadium_atmosphere_s urvey_2013-14.pdf

barcahibs
20-11-2013, 07:14 PM
Re the income increase: surely that only occurs if there is an overall increase in attendance? otherwise you're just moving people from say the east for 22 quid a ticket to the ff lower at say 18 quid to stand, so in practice most likely reducing income, at least initially?

Why would it be cheaper to stand than sit? If there's a huge demand for people to stand in a limited area then I'd expect it to cost more not less? There's also the fact that establishing a safe standing area would cost money in adapting the stand, I'd expect the people who choose to stand there to pay for those changes - why should it be subsidised by those who are still sitting?

I'm pro introducing safe standing by the way, though I wouldn't move to it myself.

Keith_M
20-11-2013, 07:40 PM
Why would it be cheaper to stand than sit? If there's a huge demand for people to stand in a limited area then I'd expect it to cost more not less? There's also the fact that establishing a safe standing area would cost money in adapting the stand, I'd expect the people who choose to stand there to pay for those changes - why should it be subsidised by those who are still sitting?

I'm pro introducing safe standing by the way, though I wouldn't move to it myself.


Safe Standing in Germany costs €14. The idea is to make it at least some sections of the stadium affordable, in addition to what it brings to the atmosphere.

You can also fit around double the number of people into a standing area than one with seats. It's only logical that you can charge less per head.

MurrayfieldHibs
20-11-2013, 08:02 PM
I think this is a great idea and would improve the atmosphere at games.

If it ties in with the new management team improving the performances on the pitch & winning home games we could get bigger crowds leading to a "positive upward spiral".

Now where did I hear that phrase before.:hmmm::hmmm::hmmm:

Mr White
20-11-2013, 08:18 PM
Why would it be cheaper to stand than sit?
I didnt say it would or should be but the report being discussed assumed prices would be reduced in a standing area.

theonlywayisup
20-11-2013, 09:50 PM
Voted no. Why should I have to move to accommodate a minority of Hibs fans.

down-the-slope
20-11-2013, 09:53 PM
Safe Standing in Germany costs €14. The idea is to make it at least some sections of the stadium affordable, in addition to what it brings to the atmosphere.

You can also fit around double the number of people into a standing area than one with seats. It's only logical that you can charge less per head.

Its not though unless you have full stadia...

Also the constant using mis using of German model to justify is wrong. Top prices in Germany are very high and subsidise the cheaper tickets - (almost every match is priced differently and local derby in best seats can be as much as €250)

different culture and full stadia makes this work...

NadeAteMyLunch!
20-11-2013, 11:08 PM
Read tonight that Aston Villa have completed a survey on safe standing with a selection of supporters. 97.5% in favour!

RIP
20-11-2013, 11:18 PM
It's been a standing agenda item the last 2 LWT meetings and Garry O'Hagan had brought a report to the last one

To date no supporter has pitched up to discuss it but all we need is a couple of people to volunteer and it can get off and running. We have a new contact at Supporters Direct who can help out

It's acknowledged that the idea has support - we just need people now to work with management and take it to the next stage

jgl07
21-11-2013, 01:20 PM
Has anyone attempted to cost out this proposal?

It would certainly cost big money (£1 million?). It's not a question of ripping out the seats. The crash barriers that convert into seats would have to be put in place. That means extensive structural work to anchor the barriers/seats. The Famous Five Stand was designed for seating not standing so this might not be that easy.

OK it would increase capacity but that matters little as Easter Road has not been full since the East Stand was constructed (and maybe not since the West Stand went up). The capacity may even end up being reduced for European matches dependent on the configuration of the barriers/seats.

What revenue would it attract? Zero as I doubt if any extra extra support would come in. If, as some on here seem to expect, the prices were lowered by five to six pounds for the standing areas it will cost the club considerably.

It would annoy the current inhabitants of the Famous Five Lower (the Family Stand) and many might baulk at paying higher prices to be relocated to the East or West Stands. A reduction in prices for this could cost the club again.

This would have to gain a safely certificate and can imagine the police having something to say about this as it could be much easier for a missile thrower or smoke bomb wielder to melt into the crowd in a standing area.

What is to be gained by this? It would result in disruption for those in the Family Stand and cost the club a lot of cash initially and might reduce revenue. This would certainly be diverted from the players budget. All to please a few obsessives who want to stand. They probably stand already so why the changes?

hibsbollah
21-11-2013, 02:21 PM
http://fsf.org.uk/latest-news/view/fans-at-arsenal-and-villa-say-yes-to-safe-standing

Ozyhibby
21-11-2013, 02:33 PM
Has anyone attempted to cost out this proposal?

It would certainly cost big money (£1 million?). It's not a question of ripping out the seats. The crash barriers that convert into seats would have to be put in place. That means extensive structural work to anchor the barriers/seats. The Famous Five Stand was designed for seating not standing so this might not be that easy.

OK it would increase capacity but that matters little as Easter Road has not been full since the East Stand was constructed (and maybe not since the West Stand went up). The capacity may even end up being reduced for European matches dependent on the configuration of the barriers/seats.

What revenue would it attract? Zero as I doubt if any extra extra support would come in. If, as some on here seem to expect, the prices were lowered by five to six pounds for the standing areas it will cost the club considerably.

It would annoy the current inhabitants of the Famous Five Lower (the Family Stand) and many might baulk at paying higher prices to be relocated to the East or West Stands. A reduction in prices for this could cost the club again.

This would have to gain a safely certificate and can imagine the police having something to say about this as it could be much easier for a missile thrower or smoke bomb wielder to melt into the crowd in a standing area.

What is to be gained by this? It would result in disruption for those in the Family Stand and cost the club a lot of cash initially and might reduce revenue. This would certainly be diverted from the players budget. All to please a few obsessives who want to stand. They probably stand already so why the changes?

While I like the idea of a standing area I'm afraid I agree with all of the above.
Why spend a £1m so that 2000 of your customers can stop paying £22 and start paying £12? Of that question can be answered then it's maybe worth pursuing but until then it's a no from me.

TheFamous1875
21-11-2013, 02:45 PM
I think if any changes were to made, it would be in the distant future, as the funds required would be needed for more substantial projects (the first team hopefully). What could be a valid proposition, is gradually moving the singing section to the lower FF, as this would make a much better atmosphere for the match day experience.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

blackpoolhibs
21-11-2013, 03:24 PM
Cant for the life of me understand why we'd pay ANY money to get safe standing in. The lads and lassies stand perfectly safely in section 43, and if they moved to the bottom section of the FF they'd manage to stand upright exactly the same way they do in the east.

southfieldhibby
21-11-2013, 03:53 PM
It's too steep.

I hear the East is too steep for safe standing alot...can anyone point me in the direction of a Health & Safety/Building regs that confirms this please?

Hermit Crab
21-11-2013, 05:04 PM
Cant for the life of me understand why we'd pay ANY money to get safe standing in. The lads and lassies stand perfectly safely in section 43, and if they moved to the bottom section of the FF they'd manage to stand upright exactly the same way they do in the east.

The thing is it's against the rules at the moment to stand in a seated area of the ground. Hibs appear to turn a blind eye to it.

blackpoolhibs
21-11-2013, 05:29 PM
The thing is it's against the rules at the moment to stand in a seated area of the ground. Hibs appear to turn a blind eye to it.

I know this, Dundee United appear to ignore it too for their fans behind the goal. That's roughly what it could look like at Easter road, perhaps even better?

Pete
21-11-2013, 05:46 PM
Cant for the life of me understand why we'd pay ANY money to get safe standing in. The lads and lassies stand perfectly safely in section 43, and if they moved to the bottom section of the FF they'd manage to stand upright exactly the same way they do in the east.

I have to disagree. They certainly don't stand in the same way and if anything it's more dangerous in the east due to the gradient.

Anyway, as far as "safe standing" goes, doesn't the steepness/gradient of the stand become irrelevant anyway? The very purpose of the barrier is to ensure that you don't go flying forward so surely it would work the same in the east as it would in the FF lower. I'm sure there are safe standing areas abroad that work with steep gradients.

It's a nice idea and maybe one for the future but let's get it right on the park first.

Itsnoteasy
21-11-2013, 06:02 PM
Works for them in Germany. I'd like it. Sadly it'll never happen. Authorities wouldn't be open minded enough to let it or even trial it. And there would be cost involved in adapting the ground for it.

Works in Germany as they have very high attendances at most top flight matches. I was in Dusseldorf at the end of last season, relegation battle, and there was 55K there. They also have conductors who orchestrate the crowd. Amazing to see.

TheFamous1875
21-11-2013, 06:04 PM
One of my best ever experiences as a Hibee was behind the goals against Kilmarnock in the quarter final this year, and EVERYONE was standing. The atmosphere was one of the best I've even been in, and I believe that we really did have a big part to play in how Hibs performed that day. The players kept their heads up, despite having an unjust penalty given against us, and went on to score two more great goals.

If a great crowd can play their part like that, it makes such a huge difference to the team. I don't see why Hibs should ever miss a trick.

One of my best times as a Hibby - imagine that every weekend!?!

GGTTH


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

down-the-slope
21-11-2013, 08:39 PM
While I like the idea of a standing area I'm afraid I agree with all of the above.
Why spend a £1m so that 2000 of your customers can stop paying £22 and start paying £12? Of that question can be answered then it's maybe worth pursuing but until then it's a no from me.

Not going to happen - would be same OR MORE for safe standing due to cost involved - £700k ish to remove / continue to pay mortgage on whats ripped out (its not paid for yet) and install the barriers / convertible seats that would be required to allow ground to be UEFA compliant when needed.

Hermit Crab
21-11-2013, 09:03 PM
I know this, Dundee United appear to ignore it too for their fans behind the goal. That's roughly what it could look like at Easter road, perhaps even better?

Yes but that little hitler ******* that usually oversees the away section threatens you with ejection if you don't sit down.

DC_Hibs
21-11-2013, 09:11 PM
Yes but that little hitler ******* that usually oversees the away section threatens you with his erection if you don't sit down.

Sounds like he should be working at the Gorgie Savile Dome with that type of (lewd) behaviour.

Ronniekirk
21-11-2013, 10:18 PM
Am surprised there isn't more support for this.Most games I attend you end up standing anyway so wonder if that's why Atmosphere is self generating when there is a sense of occasion or excitement Adsense of anticipation hence there will be a decent atmosphere in the away end at Paisley on Saturday But for that to last you meted players that excite the fans by there skill and creativity Sadly under Pat that was denied us by the preponderance of central midfielders and defensive formations designed to make us boring but hard to beat but was completely bereft of Excitement. it's like when you eat chocolate it stimulates A chemical reaction and Seratonin creates a feeling of well being ,I am not suggesting we all stand and eat chocolate although there was any a game recently when that has been more rewarding than watching crab football by players paralysed by fear However we need Excitement back and that will help generate Atmosphere Bethere on Saturday and be part of it

Hermit Crab
21-11-2013, 10:47 PM
Sounds like he should be working at the Gorgie Savile Dome with that type of (lewd) behaviour.


Haha very good. :D

Hermit Crab
21-11-2013, 10:49 PM
Am surprised there isn't more support for this.Most games I attend you end up standing anyway so wonder if that's why Atmosphere is self generating when there is a sense of occasion or excitement Adsense of anticipation hence there will be a decent atmosphere in the away end at Paisley on Saturday But for that to last you meted players that excite the fans by there skill and creativity Sadly under Pat that was denied us by the preponderance of central midfielders and defensive formations designed to make us boring but hard to beat but was completely bereft of Excitement. it's like when you eat chocolate it stimulates A chemical reaction and Seratonin creates a feeling of well being ,I am not suggesting we all stand and eat chocolate although there was any a game recently when that has been more rewarding than watching crab football by players paralysed by fear However we need Excitement back and that will help generate Atmosphere Bethere on Saturday and be part of it

I very much support the return of standing areas being brought back. Sooner the better if you ask me.

GreenCastle
21-11-2013, 11:01 PM
While I think there is a place for standing in the future.

The key foe Hibs right now is to leave the infrastructure alone and get a winning team on the pitch :agree: Or at least a team that people want to come and see and not 8,000 empty seats every week.

Plenty of places to stand around ER right now! Section 43 is a prime example - though I believe the singing section should be in the FF lower and family stand be West Lower (closest to FF - but further away from club shop..where the kids like going).

hibsbollah
22-11-2013, 06:19 AM
Am surprised there isn't more support for this
:dunno: Over 89% support the idea. Thats a lot of support.

blackpoolhibs
22-11-2013, 09:27 AM
Yes but that little hitler ******* that usually oversees the away section threatens you with ejection if you don't sit down.

I'm only guessing here, but i dont think he would be in charge if we had standing in the FF at easter road? :wink:

Hermit Crab
22-11-2013, 10:14 AM
I'm only guessing here, but i dont think he would be in charge if we had standing in the FF at easter road? :wink:

Would hope not. The boys a power crazed wannabe member of the third reich. :D

TheFamous1875
02-12-2013, 03:24 PM
What if it was really regulated, and the standing "singing" section was specifically at the back rows of the Famous Five stand, meaning the current sitters views aren't disrupted?

Keep the standing singers at the back and the silent sitters at the front. Everybody more or less wins!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

hibsbollah
15-01-2014, 09:14 AM
http://fsf.org.uk/latest-news/view/safe-standing-fans-must-act-now

Football League Clubs consultation underway...

Hermit Crab
16-02-2014, 10:28 AM
A development down south at Bristol city. Their ground is to become the first in the uk to have safe standing installed during a redevelopment at the end if the season.

Initially the standing would only be used for the rugby matches that take place at the ground but the football league are to Lobby the FA in an attempt to change the rules and allow safe standing for football. It should succeed to be honest.

Paves the way for other clubs to do the same. C'mon hibs be the first scottish club to do this.

Petrie get it sorted :D

Scouse Hibee
16-02-2014, 11:27 AM
Would rather all of our resources were used where it matters.

DC_Hibs
16-02-2014, 11:32 AM
Would rather all of our resources were used where it matters.

Have no fear, Rod isn't about to go to the expense of ripping out seating that is fit for purpose and replace it with new "foldaway" seats that cost three times as much.

Biggest joke is that most think we'd then reduce the prices for that section as well! They believe that the amount we'd lose from reducing some ticket prices will be made up by increased attendances.

Cloud cuckoo land bollox!!!!!!!!!


p.s I'm all for it by the way but it's not gonna happen for us.

NAE NOOKIE
16-02-2014, 11:45 AM
There was a wee debate on Sportsound after Saturdays games in which there was general agreement that this was a good idea .. the Aberdeen manager certainly seemed for it .. he thought it would improve the atmosphere at Pittodrie.

I agree that theres no chance of Hibs spending money on this idea. Especially now that we are out of the cup and must be sweating over ST sales for next year. There is no way at any time that Hibs will reduce prices for a standing area .... but I would hope those who want to stand will be prepared to pay normal prices for the privilege. This is all about improving atmosphere ... not about getting into games on the cheap I presume.

A lower FF standing area would vastly improve the atmosphere at ER there can be no doubt about it .... unfortunately until that happens we will have to put up with our home support being out sung by any team who can manage more than 300 fans in the South lower.

Hermit Crab
16-02-2014, 01:12 PM
I think we should give rail seats a trial and see how we get on.

Keith_M
16-02-2014, 01:27 PM
There was a wee debate on Sportsound after Saturdays games in which there was general agreement that this was a good idea .. the Aberdeen manager certainly seemed for it .. he thought it would improve the atmosphere at Pittodrie.



It would be easier to introduce at Pittodrie as behind one of their goals is basically just an old style terracing with seats bolted on. They would just need to remove the seats and put barriers in place. It would cost a lot more money at ER as all the stands were custom built for seating.


I voted that I would like to see this but recognise that we just don't have the large sums of money it would require. TBH, my ideal would have been if the new East Stand had been built as a full terrace (albeit not so steep as it currently is)....

... but maybe I'm just living in the past :wink:

Dashing Bob S
16-02-2014, 01:31 PM
If it's just going to be about poncey flags, then no. If, however, it heralds a return to 80's values where our game and the reputation of our club were dragged through the mud by the violent, self-Indulgent behaviour of a group of psychotic young thugs, then I would seriously consider it.

Keith_M
16-02-2014, 01:39 PM
If it's just going to be about poncey flags, then no. If, however, it heralds a return to 80's values where our game and the reputation of our club were dragged through the mud by the violent, self-Indulgent behaviour of a group of psychotic young thugs, then I would seriously consider it.

Me too.

I'm away to look for my Boss Jeans* and Benneton jumper in excited expectation



* I make no claims whatsoever that said jeans will still fit my... ehm... now 'curvier' frame.

Dashing Bob S
16-02-2014, 01:55 PM
I'm still a 32 inch waist - it's just the bit that hangs above the waist that's the issue.

NAE NOOKIE
17-02-2014, 03:16 AM
It would be easier to introduce at Pittodrie as behind one of their goals is basically just an old style terracing with seats bolted on. They would just need to remove the seats and put barriers in place. It would cost a lot more money at ER as all the stands were custom built for seating.


I voted that I would like to see this but recognise that we just don't have the large sums of money it would require. TBH, my ideal would have been if the new East Stand had been built as a full terrace (albeit not so steep as it currently is)....

... but maybe I'm just living in the past :wink:

The old terrace at Tannadice was as steep, if not steeper than the East is now .... in fear of your life whenever something happened on the pitch.

BOB MARLEYS DUG
17-02-2014, 03:36 AM
The bottom of the east should be a standing area (the bit right beside the advertising boards, where hardly anyone sits.) If Sect43 moved along down there that would be classic, would be louder, look good on the TV and sound better. Would intimidate oppisition too.! A whole army of Sect43 all the way along the bottom of the East singing their hearts out would be amazing! :thumbsup:

heretoday
17-02-2014, 07:57 AM
You can't go back.

green&left
17-02-2014, 09:48 AM
Here's the company that installed the new rail seating at Ashton Gate (Bristol City) - Ferco seating (http://www.fercoseating.co.uk/)

The RailSeat (http://www.fercoseating.co.uk/rail-seat/RailSeat.html) version that they installed at the above ground. Gallery (http://www.fercoseating.co.uk/railseat-projects.html), Youtube installation video (http://www.fercoseating.co.uk/project-videos.html) & Data Sheet PDF (http://www.fercoseating.co.uk/user/products/railseat/Railseat%20Data%20Sheet.pdf).

Would love Hibs and other Scottish clubs to explore this.

Apparently Celtic are game and have proposed 2500 in the curve opposite where we sit.

FifeHibernian
17-02-2014, 11:02 AM
I would absolutely love it if we did this.

Most people seem to agree with the idea and according to some the club would be behind it. Would price be a problem?

FifeHibernian
17-02-2014, 11:12 AM
Has anyone attempted to cost out this proposal?

It would certainly cost big money (£1 million?). It's not a question of ripping out the seats. The crash barriers that convert into seats would have to be put in place. That means extensive structural work to anchor the barriers/seats. The Famous Five Stand was designed for seating not standing so this might not be that easy.

OK it would increase capacity but that matters little as Easter Road has not been full since the East Stand was constructed (and maybe not since the West Stand went up). The capacity may even end up being reduced for European matches dependent on the configuration of the barriers/seats.

What revenue would it attract? Zero as I doubt if any extra extra support would come in. If, as some on here seem to expect, the prices were lowered by five to six pounds for the standing areas it will cost the club considerably.

It would annoy the current inhabitants of the Famous Five Lower (the Family Stand) and many might baulk at paying higher prices to be relocated to the East or West Stands. A reduction in prices for this could cost the club again.

This would have to gain a safely certificate and can imagine the police having something to say about this as it could be much easier for a missile thrower or smoke bomb wielder to melt into the crowd in a standing area.

What is to be gained by this? It would result in disruption for those in the Family Stand and cost the club a lot of cash initially and might reduce revenue. This would certainly be diverted from the players budget. All to please a few obsessives who want to stand. They probably stand already so why the changes?

Would it really cost this much?

green&left
17-02-2014, 11:49 AM
Would it really cost this much?

jgl07 like alot of folk on this matter just made most of that up.

As you can see from the video I posted about 3 posts up, there is no structual changes needed. Infact as you can see all it takes is a few workies with a couple of drills to change from seating to the revolutionary RailSeats.

theonlywayisup
17-02-2014, 07:54 PM
I would absolutely love it if we did this.

Most people seem to agree with the idea and according to some the club would be behind it. Would price be a problem?

Most!!!

What approx 280 out of a support of 8,000 to 9,000 that usually go to games at ER.

No, no thanks.

marinello59
17-02-2014, 07:59 PM
jgl07 like alot of folk on this matter just made most of that up.

As you can see from the video I posted about 3 posts up, there is no structual changes needed. Infact as you can see all it takes is a few workies with a couple of drills to change from seating to the revolutionary RailSeats.

Do you notice anything different about the steps they were attaching those seats to and the construction of stands at Easter Road?

green&left
17-02-2014, 08:46 PM
Do you notice anything different about the steps they were attaching those seats to and the construction of stands at Easter Road?

Can't say i can? Care to explain?

hibsbollah
17-02-2014, 08:53 PM
Most!!!

What approx 280 out of a support of 8,000 to 9,000 that usually go to games at ER.

No, no thanks.

You clearly don't understand poll samples. It's what the support wants, without a doubt.

Hermit Crab
27-02-2014, 05:45 PM
Bump.

Keith_M
27-02-2014, 07:24 PM
Do you notice anything different about the steps they were attaching those seats to and the construction of stands at Easter Road?


Can't say i can? Care to explain?


I think you need to put them in terracing style steps, meaning two rows of steps per seat.


:dunno:



e.g. this


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