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hibsbollah
25-08-2013, 05:40 PM
I'm not sure we've given enough credit to Rowan Vine and Lewis Stevenson for two fantastic deliveries which set up both goals. Vine's was undefendable, whipped in perfectly right onto Craig's head, and Lewis' was just as good, perfectly weighted right behind the defence, reminded me a bit of a long ball Zemmama played through for a Stokes volleyed goal against der Hun a few seasons back. The kind of service we've been missing badly in recent seasons, long may it continue:thumbsup:

All SPL goals

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QPfK0jluRx0&feature=m-ch-fea

Stokes v Der Hun
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JMOg0n_rVnA

Northernhibee
25-08-2013, 05:40 PM
Well said.

HibbyAndy
25-08-2013, 06:08 PM
But Stevenson is never a player???!!!.

Apparently.

Keith_M
25-08-2013, 06:09 PM
But Stevenson is never a player???!!!.

Apparently.


I thought that was just at Right Back, or is it in ANY position?


:greengrin

Andy74
25-08-2013, 06:10 PM
But Stevenson is never a player???!!!.

Apparently.

The whingeing about that one went quiet again this week. Same as last week. Quite a few early on in the match update thread.

HibbyAndy
25-08-2013, 06:17 PM
The whingeing about that one went quiet again this week. Same as last week. Quite a few early on in the match update thread.

I like the laddie Andy..I really think some folk just like to bump their gums..When switched to RB against Dundee utd last week he never gave GMS a sniff.

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 06:24 PM
I have stuck up for Stevenson more than most, but call me old fashioned i'd rather we played a right back at right back, and we have 2 available without switching Lewis over.

And the reason i want that is purely for the balance of the team, Stevenson is restricted in how he goes forward and plays the ball forward, which affects the way we go forward and attack as a team.

hibsbollah
25-08-2013, 06:25 PM
I have stuck up for Stevenson more than most, but call me old fashioned i'd rather we played a right back at right back, and we have 2 available without switching Lewis over.

And the reason i want that is purely for the balance of the team, Stevenson is restricted in how he goes forward and plays the ball forward, which affects the way we go forward and attack as a team.

Great ball though eh?

Andy74
25-08-2013, 06:27 PM
I have stuck up for Stevenson more than most, but call me old fashioned i'd rather we played a right back at right back, and we have 2 available without switching Lewis over.

And the reason i want that is purely for the balance of the team, Stevenson is restricted in how he goes forward and plays the ball forward, which affects the way we go forward and attack as a team.

If rather we did too but only of the ones available will do a better job than him. Are the two Mullen and Maybury? Or Forster who seems to have barely played full back in his puff and never at first team level?

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 06:28 PM
Great ball though eh?

It was a decent ball and Craig did well to fight off his man and finish well. What about the rest of my post?

Robinho08
25-08-2013, 06:29 PM
Hopefully Collins isnt far away from his goal then.

Spike Mandela
25-08-2013, 06:31 PM
Great ball though eh?

One man's assist is another man's 'hoof' up the park.:cb

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 06:32 PM
If rather we did too but only of the ones available will do a better job than him. Are the two Mullen and Maybury? Or Forster who seems to have barely played full back in his puff and never at first team level?

Forster and Maybury, Mullen is nowhere near the standard of an SPFL footballer. I'd rather we played our sub keeper at right back than him, or even Stevenson.

Forster is a good player, and someone who looked a fantastic find last season. I believe he'd fit in just nicely at right back, and yes i'd play him there before Maybury, who'd be my 2nd choice at the minute.

hibsbollah
25-08-2013, 06:36 PM
It was a decent ball and Craig did well to fight off his man and finish well. What about the rest of my post?

Prior to the Dundee Utd game I'd have agreed with you about Lewis at RB. The problem is he's actually performing well there in the last two games, he was excellent when Mullen went off and he was switched against Dundee Utd, and did well again yesterday, even the Lewis sceptics seem to agree.

hibbymick
25-08-2013, 06:40 PM
Prior to the Dundee Utd game I'd have agreed with you about Lewis at RB. The problem is he's actually performing well there in the last two games, he was excellent when Mullen went off and he was switched against Dundee Utd, and did well again yesterday, even the Lewis sceptics seem to agree.

He is an average player. Nothing more nothing less, lets no be bummin a player up too much just because they stuck in a decent cross, that's the least they should be able to do on the money they earn.

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 06:40 PM
Prior to the Dundee Utd game I'd have agreed with you about Lewis at RB. The problem is he's actually performing well there in the last two games, he was excellent when Mullen went off and he was switched against Dundee Utd, and did well again yesterday, even the Lewis sceptics seem to agree.

I have not seen the game, only the goals but i'm still not going to sway towards playing a player who unbalances the side as much as he does.

And i firmly believe we'd be better with Forster or even Maybury there, especially going forward.

B.H.F.C
25-08-2013, 06:44 PM
As per the other thread, credit where it's due. It was a good ball through from Stevenson for the second goal. And he's done fairly well at right back last week and yesterday.

The Stevenson argument is an old one that will never go away whilst he is playing with us. The team is where it is from having to play guys like that out of position. A guy that for the best part of a year hasn't been good enough to get a game in his own position.

hibsbollah
25-08-2013, 06:48 PM
He is an average player. Nothing more nothing less, lets no be bummin a player up too much just because they stuck in a decent cross, that's the least they should be able to do on the money they earn.

It wasn't an OP about Lewis, it was about two decent deliveries from Vine and Lewis:confused: so No-ones 'bummin' anyone up, shame credit can't be given when it's due.

Saorsa
25-08-2013, 06:53 PM
Be nice if we could have stuck tae the topic of the thread instead of using it as another player bashing exercise. I'm no keen on Stevenson at RB, sometimes it has worked, sometimes it hasnae, when it works great, when it disnae it's hardly his fault, he's playing there because he's being asked tae. If there's a problem with that, it lies elsewhere, no with him, he never gives less than 100%. .

I agree with the OP :thumbsup:

Hibernia&Alba
25-08-2013, 06:54 PM
Two very good balls through. Vine's cross was perfect - Craig didn't have to move a muscle to direct it in. Credit to Killie's goal also. What a volley.

Holmesdale Hibs
25-08-2013, 07:00 PM
Good OP. Haven't seen the highlights yet but well done to Vine as well by the sounds of it. He's been slaughtered lately and was getting 2/10 etc in the player rating threads. His CV suggests he is potentially a good signing so hopefully this is something he can build on.

macca70
25-08-2013, 07:11 PM
I'm not sure we've given enough credit to Rowan Vine and Lewis Stevenson for two fantastic deliveries which set up both goals. Vine's was undefendable, whipped in perfectly right onto Craig's head, and Lewis' was just as good, perfectly weighted right behind the defence, reminded me a bit of a long ball Zemmama played through for a Stokes volleyed goal against der Hun a few seasons back. The kind of service we've been missing badly in recent seasons, long may it continue:thumbsup:

All SPL goals

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QPfK0jluRx0&feature=m-ch-fea

Stokes v Der Hun
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JMOg0n_rVnA

And there goal started from.....................A HIBS THROWN IN.

We have always been dreadful at retaining possession from Thow Ins.

Really good build up to the 1st goal, brilliant passing and movement.

Wonder how many refs would have blown for a free kick with our winner?

Wotherspiniesta
25-08-2013, 07:20 PM
Never get tired watching that Stokes goal. Wonderful skill.

hibsbollah
25-08-2013, 07:22 PM
Never get tired watching that Stokes goal. Wonderful skill.

Shame about Zemmama's hoofball spoiling it :greengrin

J-C
25-08-2013, 07:29 PM
I have stuck up for Stevenson more than most, but call me old fashioned i'd rather we played a right back at right back, and we have 2 available without switching Lewis over.

And the reason i want that is purely for the balance of the team, Stevenson is restricted in how he goes forward and plays the ball forward, which affects the way we go forward and attack as a team.


Aye Gary, just think what might actually happen if Lewis is played at left midfield where he belongs, might even allow Craig to play his more natural central attacking midfield position, the position he found himself scoring both goals. :agree:

YehButNoBut
25-08-2013, 07:34 PM
Hopefully Collins isnt far away from his goal then.

I'm convinced Collins will come good his touch is good & he links well with other players, was involved in the moves for the first goal yesterday & also the great move for the Vine finish ruled offside.

He'll deffo score a few this season but will also contribute greatly in helping create others, he's a young lad who is still settling in but will be a great asset to Hibs.

Let's not forget that Griifiths only scored 8 from 30 games in his first season with Hibs & Stokes didn't score his first for Hibs until Sept 19th (5 games I think).

greenpaper55
25-08-2013, 07:41 PM
Darren Barr ....ha ha , paid back slightly for the lucky cup final goal.

ancient hibee
25-08-2013, 08:16 PM
Two goals scored after play out wide instead of just battering it through the middle-who would ever thought of that as a tactic-will it catch on?

SMAXXA
25-08-2013, 08:21 PM
Forster and Maybury, Mullen is nowhere near the standard of an SPFL footballer. I'd rather we played our sub keeper at right back than him, or even Stevenson.

Forster is a good player, and someone who looked a fantastic find last season. I believe he'd fit in just nicely at right back, and yes i'd play him there before Maybury, who'd be my 2nd choice at the minute.

But wouldn't that be laying a ch at rb? Wat have you seen from him that would have you pick him over 3 fullbacks?

--------
25-08-2013, 08:49 PM
The Vine cross for our first was perfection - totally unplayable from the defence's point of view.

Lewis's ball into the box for the second didn't look like a hoof up the park to me; it was well-directed and well-weighted and put Barr in a lot of trouble when Craig arrived. I'm pretty sure Lewis could see Liam and played the ball in accordingly.

We all know that lots of people don't rate Lewis - I do, and in this instance credit is due and should be given.

Like the OP says ...

down-the-slope
25-08-2013, 09:15 PM
Forster and Maybury, Mullen is nowhere near the standard of an SPFL footballer. I'd rather we played our sub keeper at right back than him, or even Stevenson.

Forster is a good player, and someone who looked a fantastic find last season. I believe he'd fit in just nicely at right back, and yes i'd play him there before Maybury, who'd be my 2nd choice at the minute.


:tsk tsk: you said on another thread you had never seen Forster play RB but had heard from others he had and was decent....

Imagine if a manager picked on that basis :rolleyes:

He has never played RB at senior level and has only played a handful (well though) at CB. Lewis has this season played well twice at RB and while its far from perfect its the best option we have that's proven.

The press were pretty unanimous that we were comfortable in defence (and lacking middle to front) lets just enjoy modest progress and hope that we get clancy back fit soon while signing a couple for the real problem areas - out wide and CF

Billy Whizz
25-08-2013, 09:30 PM
:tsk tsk: you said on another thread you had never seen Forster play RB but had heard from others he had and was decent....

Imagine if a manager picked on that basis :rolleyes:

He has never played RB at senior level and has only played a handful (well though) at CB. Lewis has this season played well twice at RB and while its far from perfect its the best option we have that's proven.

The press were pretty unanimous that we were comfortable in defence (and lacking middle to front) lets just enjoy modest progress and hope that we get clancy back fit soon while signing a couple for the real problem areas - out wide and CF

I've been to the last 2 Hibs under 20 games and Forster has played centre half. Surely if the Hibs management fancied him as a right back, they would have played him there, to get him ready for the 1st team.

Jonnyboy
25-08-2013, 10:01 PM
I have stuck up for Stevenson more than most, but call me old fashioned i'd rather we played a right back at right back, and we have 2 available without switching Lewis over.

And the reason i want that is purely for the balance of the team, Stevenson is restricted in how he goes forward and plays the ball forward, which affects the way we go forward and attack as a team.

........... but not as much as me :greengrin

The comparison with the Stokes goal is a good shout but of course there will be those who insist Zouma's through ball was beautifully crafted and weighted while the pass from Lewis was a hoof into nowhere and only because he was facing that way.

The truth of the matter and there's TV evidence to back this one up :wink: is that Lewis took possession of the ball, looked up and saw Craig was going to run into space and so he delivered the ball there :agree:

Stantons Angel
25-08-2013, 11:10 PM
It took long enough for someone to start a thread on how well the lad played yesterday. Yet reading through this i see that there are still doubters and i suppose there always will be.

For once it would be good to see those who immediately take to their keyboards after a bad game to pick out Lewis, give him some credit where its due.

Or are You frightened you choke by saying "well done Lewis"

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 11:21 PM
:tsk tsk: you said on another thread you had never seen Forster play RB but had heard from others he had and was decent....

Imagine if a manager picked on that basis :rolleyes:

He has never played RB at senior level and has only played a handful (well though) at CB. Lewis has this season played well twice at RB and while its far from perfect its the best option we have that's proven.

The press were pretty unanimous that we were comfortable in defence (and lacking middle to front) lets just enjoy modest progress and hope that we get clancy back fit soon while signing a couple for the real problem areas - out wide and CF

Well he picked a right back that got slaughtered so often he had to take him off twice before he came out for the 2nd half, he also played Stevenson right back when he WAS getting slaughtered. I dont think Fenlon knows a decent player or how to set a team up properly anyway, so i'm not sure what point you are making regarding Fenlons team selection.

blackpoolhibs
25-08-2013, 11:23 PM
I've been to the last 2 Hibs under 20 games and Forster has played centre half. Surely if the Hibs management fancied him as a right back, they would have played him there, to get him ready for the 1st team.

Aye you'd think so, but he'd rather play Mullen who is completely out his depth, and a left back who unbalances the whole back four.

I'd get a chimp in before letting Fenlon pick the team.

SaulGoodman
26-08-2013, 01:15 AM
Aye you'd think so, but he'd rather play Mullen who is completely out his depth, and a left back who unbalances the whole back four.

I'd get a chimp in before letting Fenlon pick the team.

Who are you talking about here?

Fergus52
26-08-2013, 06:41 AM
Aye Gary, just think what might actually happen if Lewis is played at left midfield where he belongs, might even allow Craig to play his more natural central attacking midfield position, the position he found himself scoring both goals. :agree:

Do you honestly think Stevenson is a better winger than a centre-mid or fullback?

As much as I like him, he's nowhere near creative enough to play out-wide for us. He's much better putting in a shift at defensive mid or fullback.

Thecat23
26-08-2013, 06:48 AM
I'd have Stevenson in my team every week, but he's never a RB in his life. I'd play Mullen as his delivery into the box and free kicks are excellent. Couple more games I think he'll be fine. Think the lad has Prob over tried because of the Hearts connection.

Fergus52
26-08-2013, 06:49 AM
I'd have Stevenson in my team every week, but he's never a RB in his life. I'd play Mullen as his delivery into the box and free kicks are excellent. Couple more games I think he'll be fine. Think the lad has Prob over tried because of the Hearts connection.

Mullen seems decent going forward.

But his positioning and marking defensively is pretty awful, don't think he's good enough to start for us (yet) from what I've seen so far.

Thecat23
26-08-2013, 07:08 AM
Mullen seems decent going forward.

But his positioning and marking defensively is pretty awful, don't think he's good enough to start for us (yet) from what I've seen so far.

I see what your saying, but if you watched Maybury as well, Fenlon likes to play us narrow and deal with the cross balls. It's a dangerous game to play. But I do agree Mullen can get caught out, but like I say few more starts I think he'll be alright.

J-C
26-08-2013, 07:58 AM
Do you honestly think Stevenson is a better winger than a centre-mid or fullback?

As much as I like him, he's nowhere near creative enough to play out-wide for us. He's much better putting in a shift at defensive mid or fullback.

At no time did I say left winger I said left midfield, there's a big difference, when he's played in front of McGivern, he allows McGivern to go forward while covering at FB, they work well together, he does what a good left sided midfielder should do.

He's not going to be creative in the sense you're talking about, because he isn't a winger, he's a left sided midfielder, in the same sense as Craig is a left sided midfielder and Craig is certainly no winger either.

By moving him to the left of midfield would allow Craig a more free role in the middle and balance the team.

Tyler Durden
26-08-2013, 09:02 AM
I'm not sure we've given enough credit to Rowan Vine and Lewis Stevenson for two fantastic deliveries which set up both goals. Vine's was undefendable, whipped in perfectly right onto Craig's head, and Lewis' was just as good, perfectly weighted right behind the defence, reminded me a bit of a long ball Zemmama played through for a Stokes volleyed goal against der Hun a few seasons back. The kind of service we've been missing badly in recent seasons, long may it continue:thumbsup:

All SPL goals

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QPfK0jluRx0&feature=m-ch-fea

Stokes v Der Hun
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JMOg0n_rVnA

Great ball by Vine yes.

Stevensons was a decent pass which most centre halves would have mopped up 9 times out of 10 - total blunder by Barr.

This fascination some people have with defending/praising Stevenson is as bad as the other lot who continually slate him. My tuppence worth is that Lewis is a good squad player. Great back up for LB or defensive midfield. It's a joke that our manager has signed 3 right backs in the last 2 years and yet Stevenson is playing there. That's crazy for me, he slows down play and will constantly have to cut infield. On Saturday that happened to benefit us on this one occasion when the Killie defence made a big error.

Andy74 and a few others will use this as proof that Fenlon is right to play him there. Never in a month of Sundays. Give me a team where our full backs regularly hit the byeline please, not Fenlons brand of football.

blackpoolhibs
26-08-2013, 09:04 AM
Great ball by Vine yes.

Stevensons was a decent pass which most centre halves would have mopped up 9 times out of 10 - total blunder by Barr.

This fascination some people have with defending/praising Stevenson is as bad as the other lot who continually slate him. My tuppence worth is that Lewis is a good squad player. Great back up for LB or defensive midfield. It's a joke that our manager has signed 3 right backs in the last 2 years and yet Stevenson is playing there. That's crazy for me, he slows down play and will constantly have to cut infield. On Saturday that happened to benefit us on this one occasion when the Killie defence made a big error.

Andy74 and a few others will use this as proof that Fenlon is right to play him there. Never in a month of Sundays. Give me a team where our full backs regularly hit the byeline please, not Fenlons brand of football.

This 100%. :top marks

SMAXXA
26-08-2013, 09:09 AM
Well he picked a right back that got slaughtered so often he had to take him off twice before he came out for the 2nd half, he also played Stevenson right back when he WAS getting slaughtered. I dont think Fenlon knows a decent player or how to set a team up properly anyway, so i'm not sure what point you are making regarding Fenlons team selection.

I still don't see where you have rationalised why you would play a young ch at right back (foster) yet you have such a problem with playing Stevenson there? Contrary to belief, Foster is a CH, just cause he's played at RB in youth games on occasion makes him no more credible a choice than someone like Lewis IMO

blackpoolhibs
26-08-2013, 09:15 AM
I still don't see where you have rationalised why you would play a young ch at right back (foster) yet you have such a problem with playing Stevenson there? Contrary to belief, Foster is a CH, just cause he's played at RB in youth games on occasion makes him no more credible a choice than someone like Lewis IMO

Is it too much to ask for a good young mobile central defender who's right footed and has decent pace and has played right back to play there?

I'd say its no worse than playing someone who is so left footed as Stevenson on the right.

ancient hibee
26-08-2013, 09:16 AM
I still don't see where you have rationalised why you would play a young ch at right back (foster) yet you have such a problem with playing Stevenson there? Contrary to belief, Foster is a CH, just cause he's played at RB in youth games on occasion makes him no more credible a choice than someone like Lewis IMO


It's interesting that the people who want Forster at right back are the same people who complain about Stevenson being played out of position.

Billy Whizz
26-08-2013, 09:18 AM
It's interesting that the people who want Forster at right back are the same people who complain about Stevenson being played out of position.

I think Forster would make a good defensive midfielder

SMAXXA
26-08-2013, 09:20 AM
Is it too much to ask for a good young mobile central defender who's right footed and has decent pace and has played right back to play there?

I'd say its no worse than playing someone who is so left footed as Stevenson on the right.

Im sure if this was indeed a serious option he would have been in by now. Lets be honest, things have been tough as its been a difficult start, imagine putting a young CH who's played a handful of senior games into the team and he got slaughtered, would be terrible for him and the management team would get pelters also. I believe he's went with Lewis as he's an experienced player / fullback, granted not on the right but I think people can look too much into wether a guy is left footed or not. I'm right footed and played left back for a few years, wasnt a problem so professionals should be able to deal with it, which to be fair I think Lewis has done ok.

blackpoolhibs
26-08-2013, 09:22 AM
It's interesting that the people who want Forster at right back are the same people who complain about Stevenson being played out of position.

Its all about balance for me, i'd say playing Forster would be much more comfortable and Maybury even more. The team would go forward better too imo. We have no need to play someone so predominantly left footed on the right.

blackpoolhibs
26-08-2013, 09:25 AM
Im sure if this was indeed a serious option he would have been in by now. Lets be honest, things have been tough as its been a difficult start, imagine putting a young CH who's played a handful of senior games into the team and he got slaughtered, would be terrible for him and the management team would get pelters also. I believe he's went with Lewis as he's an experienced player / fullback, granted not on the right but I think people can look too much into wether a guy is left footed or not. I'm right footed and played left back for a few years, wasnt a problem so professionals should be able to deal with it, which to be fair I think Lewis has done ok.

He pitched him in for his debut at tynecastle, he was not worried about him being slaughtered then?

We are not going to agree on this.

SMAXXA
26-08-2013, 09:27 AM
He pitched him in for his debut at tynecastle, he was not worried about him being slaughtered then?

We are not going to agree on this.

Aye but in his natural position mate?

didnt we play Ian Murray at right back on occasion and don't remember him doing so bad and taking stick? Or am I making this up :wink:

blackpoolhibs
26-08-2013, 09:31 AM
Aye but in his natural position mate?

didnt we play Ian Murray at right back on occasion and don't remember him doing so bad and taking stick? Or am I making this up :wink:

Ian Murray was equally as bad in both positions,:wink: he was one player who could play both positions as he was not predominantly as one footed as Lewis?

Fergus52
26-08-2013, 10:56 AM
At no time did I say left winger I said left midfield, there's a big difference, when he's played in front of McGivern, he allows McGivern to go forward while covering at FB, they work well together, he does what a good left sided midfielder should do.

He's not going to be creative in the sense you're talking about, because he isn't a winger, he's a left sided midfielder, in the same sense as Craig is a left sided midfielder and Craig is certainly no winger either.

By moving him to the left of midfield would allow Craig a more free role in the middle and balance the team.

Well do you mean left sided midfielder as in left midfield in a 442, or t he left side of a central three?

Stevie Reid
26-08-2013, 10:59 AM
It was a very well weighted, long pass from Lewis - yes, Barr could have dealt with it better, but it gave Craig an opportunity and put the centre half under pressure, which forced the error.

A good assist.

Andy74
26-08-2013, 11:40 AM
Great ball by Vine yes.

Stevensons was a decent pass which most centre halves would have mopped up 9 times out of 10 - total blunder by Barr.

This fascination some people have with defending/praising Stevenson is as bad as the other lot who continually slate him. My tuppence worth is that Lewis is a good squad player. Great back up for LB or defensive midfield. It's a joke that our manager has signed 3 right backs in the last 2 years and yet Stevenson is playing there. That's crazy for me, he slows down play and will constantly have to cut infield. On Saturday that happened to benefit us on this one occasion when the Killie defence made a big error.

Andy74 and a few others will use this as proof that Fenlon is right to play him there. Never in a month of Sundays. Give me a team where our full backs regularly hit the byeline please, not Fenlons brand of football.

With the players we have available and Stevenson's form, yes, it's right to play him there when needed.

LioNeilMessi
26-08-2013, 11:57 AM
I think Forster would make a good defensive midfielder


:agree: I heard defensive midfield is the next step for Ross Caldwell too.

ian cruise
26-08-2013, 12:07 PM
:agree: I heard defensive midfield is the next step for Ross Caldwell too.

I think that's where young Danny is meant be playing, but he keeps drifting out wide which is why he now finds himself on the bench.

J-C
26-08-2013, 12:48 PM
Well do you mean left sided midfielder as in left midfield in a 442, or t he left side of a central three?


Does it really make any difference what formation is played, the fact of the matter is I never said winger in any post re Stevenson, he's a midfielder who plays better on the left hand side, whatever the formation, he's not a whippet up the line banging crosses in but more defensive, ball holding, simple passing midfielder.

If after this post you still don't understand what I mean, then I'm sorry but I can't help you any further.

truehibernian
26-08-2013, 01:03 PM
Ian Murray was equally as bad in both positions,:wink: he was one player who could play both positions as he was not predominantly as one footed as Lewis?

Not early in his career though BH - Nid was a very quick, strong player before injury blighted him and he is one of a few players who genuinely could play a few positions in his early days. It's quite funny because a more unassuming man you won't meet, but what strength he had and not many players wanted to mix it with him. Very like Jordon Forster in the sense that JF will stick his nut on a brick lobbed over Easter Road just to clear it out the box !!

Wouldn't even contemplate putting JF at right back - he's the best centre half we have at the club FFS (in my opinion), let alone waste him out at right back. If Clancy's back training I wonder if we'll now see a little 'playing streak' from him now he is in the final year of his contract though :cb One thing's for sure, he needs to start playing better than he did before injury - he was very poor. The one thing we may notice however on his return - throw in's will improve 100% as he's quite good with them ! One thing at this early stage of the season I've noticed is how poor the central pairings are at most teams, especially Celtic and Hearts (although Hearts haven't been properly punished through opposition profligacy). A good, long throw in is catching teams out centrally - Celtic are dreadful at the back when a ball is dropped in there.

So Tim - get back to full fitness, play some games, and make the RB slot your own please - we've waited long enough !!

Future17
26-08-2013, 02:19 PM
I like Stevenson. I'm not keen on Vine thus far.

However, I didn't think either delivery was particularly great, just very poorly defended. I thought Craig took both very well though and it helps that Craig Samson is the worst goalkeeper to ever play in Scottish football (and that includes all of ours).

Jonnyboy
26-08-2013, 02:24 PM
Great ball by Vine yes.

Stevensons was a decent pass which most centre halves would have mopped up 9 times out of 10 - total blunder by Barr.

This fascination some people have with defending/praising Stevenson is as bad as the other lot who continually slate him. My tuppence worth is that Lewis is a good squad player. Great back up for LB or defensive midfield. It's a joke that our manager has signed 3 right backs in the last 2 years and yet Stevenson is playing there. That's crazy for me, he slows down play and will constantly have to cut infield. On Saturday that happened to benefit us on this one occasion when the Killie defence made a big error.

Andy74 and a few others will use this as proof that Fenlon is right to play him there. Never in a month of Sundays. Give me a team where our full backs regularly hit the byeline please, not Fenlons brand of football.


This 100%. :top marks

This is the 'problem' about having a fan messageboard for people to state their views. It's chicken and egg. For every Lewis doubter there is a praiser and for every Lewis praiser there is a doubter. It causes us all to post :wink:

Stevie Reid
26-08-2013, 03:16 PM
I like Stevenson. I'm not keen on Vine thus far.

However, I didn't think either delivery was particularly great, just very poorly defended. I thought Craig took both very well though and it helps that Craig Samson is the worst goalkeeper to ever play in Scottish football (and that includes all of ours).

Both goals were better deliveries than the ones that led to the goals we conceded against Motherwell and Dundee Utd, respectively. Other teams benefit from our crap defending, I don't see it being an issue when we capitalise on other team's incompetencies - I wish we did it more often.

Future17
26-08-2013, 04:17 PM
Both goals were better deliveries than the ones that led to the goals we conceded against Motherwell and Dundee Utd, respectively. Other teams benefit from our crap defending, I don't see it being an issue when we capitalise on other team's incompetencies - I wish we did it more often.

I agree with that in relation to the Motherwell goal, which wasn't even a delivery really, more a headed clearance. However, I think the quality of the ball for the United goal was better than either of ours on Saturday.

In any event, I totally agree it isn't a bad thing to benefit from the weaknesses of our opponents and, I may be doing us a disservice by suggesting we weren't deliberately exploiting those. At the same time, however, let's not talk ourselves up unduly as the deliveries on Saturday wouldn't have troubled the average Scot Prem defence.

Franck Stanton
26-08-2013, 05:19 PM
I like Stevenson. I'm not keen on Vine thus far.

However, I didn't think either delivery was particularly great, just very poorly defended. I thought Craig took both very well though and it helps that Craig Samson is the worst goalkeeper to ever play in Scottish football (and that includes all of ours).

Really ?

Stevie Reid
26-08-2013, 06:06 PM
I agree with that in relation to the Motherwell goal, which wasn't even a delivery really, more a headed clearance. However, I think the quality of the ball for the United goal was better than either of ours on Saturday.

In any event, I totally agree it isn't a bad thing to benefit from the weaknesses of our opponents and, I may be doing us a disservice by suggesting we weren't deliberately exploiting those. At the same time, however, let's not talk ourselves up unduly as the deliveries on Saturday wouldn't have troubled the average Scot Prem defence.

I'm not talking us up unduly, but I would argue that Killie's back four, and Darren Barr himself, could be described as average SPL standard.

neil7908
26-08-2013, 06:26 PM
I thought Vine's cross was well hit. What I've taken from his performances for Hibs and his time at St Johnstone is that he looks better as an attacking wide player rather than an out and out forward.


When the Saints beat us 1-3 at ER last season he scored by cutting in from the wing and it doesn't surprise me that his assist came from out wide as well.I don't think he'll score 15-20 goals for us this season so I'd like to see him used as a winger, or cover for centre forward and bring in another striker to compliment Collins.


I dont see Vine and Collins as a duo if I'm honest and we need someone that can operate out wide.Bring in another quality forward and a winger and use Vine where needed. That would make us a better team IMO.

Future17
26-08-2013, 10:19 PM
Really ?[/B]

I've seen him concede more poor goals than any of our guys. I mean, what is he doing for our 2nd on Saturday?


I'm not talking us up unduly, but I would argue that Killie's back four, and Darren Barr himself, could be described as average SPL standard.

Fair play. I think that, unless Boyd has a fantastic season, Killie will be in the bottom three come May, but I suppose that doesn't necessarily mean the defence is of that level.

KWJ
27-08-2013, 08:56 AM
Craig Samson is nothing special and a poor replacement for Cammy Bell but I'd have him over Zibby, Simon Brown, Yves and probably McNeil and Graeme Smith.

Vine's cross was a belter, perfectly placed with great pace. He took it early too which helped.

Stevenson's ball was hopeful and asking a question of Barr which, with Craig's persistence, he couldn't answer.

Vine's was far better but Stevenson's proved crucial too.

:thumbsup:

jacomo
27-08-2013, 04:18 PM
Craig Samson is nothing special and a poor replacement for Cammy Bell but I'd have him over Zibby, Simon Brown, Yves and probably McNeil and Graeme Smith.

Vine's cross was a belter, perfectly placed with great pace. He took it early too which helped.

Stevenson's ball was hopeful and asking a question of Barr which, with Craig's persistence, he couldn't answer.

Vine's was far better but Stevenson's proved crucial too.

:thumbsup:

I'd take a traffic cone over Simon Brown - just as useful, and less of a disruptive influence.

Fergus52
27-08-2013, 05:02 PM
I'd take a traffic cone over Simon Brown - just as useful, and less of a disruptive influence.

Pretty harsh.

Without Brown there's no way we would have won the 3-0 cup game at Ibrox.

He played a blinder that match.

ancient hibee
27-08-2013, 05:39 PM
The important fact about the goals was that a midfielder was getting himself in position to do something positive.