PDA

View Full Version : What should we be looking for as evidence of improvement in 2013-14?



Hibernia&Alba
02-06-2013, 01:00 PM
2011-12, shocking. Eleventh in the league and a cup final trouncing. 2012-13, up and down. Seventh place finish due to a dramatic loss of form from new year, and a cup final trouncing.

What are we looking for as evidence of improvement next season? In the current SPL format, top six is a must for me. A club of our size and resources should be capable of being amongst the best six teams in the country every year. It all depends upon the team we can field of course, and we don't know if we'll have the Griffiths goals which earned us so many points this season, but we must now push on to top six, particularly as Rangers' absence frees up a place.

A continuation of a more settled and definite best eleven, trying to play the right way, league progress - that's it for me. The cups are always something of a lottery on the day, so I wouldn't say Pat has to win a trophy as proof of success next season. It's consistent performance I'm looking for now; to be able to compete every week. That's where Hibs should be.

Humo
02-06-2013, 01:05 PM
Top 4 for me. Not expecting too far in europe but it will be a fun run. Quarter finals of both cups.

Vault Boy
02-06-2013, 01:05 PM
Top six minimum, top 4 should be the goal. I think we should look to give the league cup a bit more respect and try to take it more seriously, just look at what winning it was like in 2007, and it's a realistic goal. The football should be a bit more enterprising and certainly as identified on another thread, it should be done 'the Hibs' way.' I think we should aim for more derby wins, and another undefeated year would be wonderful. If we keep up the positive involvement and development of young players into the first team and meet some of the other targets domestically next year, we should be in for a good season, and certainly an improved one. :aok:

P.S. Can we beat the highland clubs please!? :greengrin

Stringer
02-06-2013, 01:21 PM
Top 4 - we should really be aiming for second. Hearts are awful and Motherwell are losing half their team.

CIS cup final

Quarters of the Scottish cup

Win the home derby

down-the-slope
02-06-2013, 01:29 PM
Something available thats not overpriced nor on a food nutritionalists banned list from the food kiosks

Beer thats not overpriced and tastes like beer in BTG


Im setting my targets high :rolleyes:

Treadstone
02-06-2013, 01:34 PM
Binning the top 6 mentality its a ruse to accept mediocrity as achievement. It filters to players, look at Arsenal players celebrating 4th place a few weeks ago. Anyone would think Wenger was doing it on a shoestring and not with a stratospheric £100m+ wage bill.

Salisbury Hibby
02-06-2013, 01:35 PM
Top 6 is a minimum. Top 3 should be achievable if we don't have a mid season slump. And Pat, take the League Cup more seriously next year :-)

Hibernia&Alba
02-06-2013, 01:35 PM
Off a pitch, a few sold out matches at ER would be great. A capital city club should be capable of filling twenty thousand seats a few times per season, even in these difficult economic times.

Salisbury Hibby
02-06-2013, 01:36 PM
And let's stick it right up Celtic next time we play them.

The Leith Dutch
02-06-2013, 01:38 PM
Measurable targets should be top 6 as an absolute minimum in the league and, assuming our departures and signings at least match those of Aberdeen and Dundee Utd, top 4 should really be the goal.

In the cups the target should be winning any ties where we're not drawn against a top SPL club (how that would be defined depends on what happens to us and other teams in the transfer window with a modifier for current form). We should under no circumstances be going out to any team outside the SPL - with the budget and the players we have that would represent a massive failure.

Non measurable targets would be -

consistency of performance
playing with energy and commitment in every game for 90 minutes
getting results when we're not playing well and things aren't going our way
rediscovering our attacking edge and having a variety of goal threats
having more than one way to play and more than one game plan


I'd like to see the different bits of the team work better together - Williams commanding his area and coming off his line to allow the defence to play higher up the pitch and closer to the midfield which in turn I'd like to see getting up to support the forward players more often.

And two personal bugbears - one from this season is we need more people who can take a corner (and probably more dead ball experience in general).

The second has been going on for years - I want some urgency and movement at every single throw in we win so that it becomes something we profit from regularly rather than a demonstration of ineptitude.

Hibernia&Alba
02-06-2013, 01:40 PM
Binning the top 6 mentality its a ruse to accept mediocrity as achievement. It filters to players, look at Arsenal players celebrating 4th place a few weeks ago. Anyone would think Wenger was doing it on a shoestring and not with a stratospheric £100m+ wage bill.

I would agree with this, but we must be realistic and look for steady long-term improvement. Next season it represents the minimum required.

Hibernia&Alba
02-06-2013, 01:47 PM
Measurable targets should be top 6 as an absolute minimum in the league and, assuming our departures and signings at least match those of Aberdeen and Dundee Utd, top 4 should really be the goal.

In the cups the target should be winning any ties where we're not drawn against a top SPL club (how that would be defined depends on what happens to us and other teams in the transfer window with a modifier for current form). We should under no circumstances be going out to any team outside the SPL - with the budget and the players we have that would represent a massive failure.

Non measurable targets would be -

consistency of performance
playing with energy and commitment in every game for 90 minutes
getting results when we're not playing well and things aren't going our way
rediscovering our attacking edge and having a variety of goal threats
having more than one way to play and more than one game plan


I'd like to see the different bits of the team work better together - Williams commanding his area and coming off his line to allow the defence to play higher up the pitch and closer to the midfield which in turn I'd like to see getting up to support the forward players more often.

And two personal bugbears - one from this season is we need more people who can take a corner (and probably more dead ball experience in general).

The second has been going on for years - I want some urgency and movement at every single throw in we win so that it becomes something we profit from regularly rather than a demonstration of ineptitude.


A good post. Can't disagree with any of that. Continuous improvement and consistency every week is the key to it.

Alex Trager
02-06-2013, 01:48 PM
For me i would agree with the op, there has to be consistency in the league.
I'd say top three is a reasonable target. However if we missed out to a pair of good teams that would t be too bad.
Looking at the cups, I feel we need to be making the semis of both, preferably winning both haha. Na but seriously, I would definitely say why not have a real go at both?

Beefster
02-06-2013, 01:49 PM
Top 4, more than 50% of points from Hearts and the quarters in both cups.

PeterboroHibee
02-06-2013, 01:57 PM
First and foremost Id like a functioning team on the pitch that isnt as reliant on one player as we have been this season. If we can do that, defend a little better and get some players to chip in with more goals from positions other than the strikers, then who knows what can be achieved with such an even playing field (apart from Celtic).

pontius pilate
02-06-2013, 02:26 PM
Top4 and at least another trip to Hampden along with consistency and the emergence of youth

Hibernia&Alba
02-06-2013, 02:36 PM
Top4 and at least another trip to Hampden along with consistency and the emergence of youth

That's a hell of a lot to ask for in one go, mate. I want the club to have a long term plan for improvement and achievement, getting the basics in place and building from the foundations.

Teapot
02-06-2013, 03:02 PM
I can't see any other club in the league improving their team this summer other than us and Aberdeen. So for me i think we have to be looking at top 5 minimum.
Two personal things for me;

1) is that we play some more exciting football especially during home games.
2) it looks as though we have a team with the potential to go on and challenge for 2nd in the next year.

Maybe I'm being a bit optimistic but surely the aim should be that 2nd spot in the following year whilst Newco are still in a lower league?

muzzhfc
02-06-2013, 03:05 PM
Top 6, 2 good cup runs, winning 2 derbies at home and 1 away and finishing higher in the league (and not being put out of a cup by or before) the ****s. Steady improvement for me.

pontius pilate
02-06-2013, 03:20 PM
That's a hell of a lot to ask for in one go, mate. I want the club to have a long term plan for improvement and achievement, getting the basics in place and building from the foundations.

It may be a lot to ask for the reason why I'm saying it as I have belief in PF to take us into the top 6 and one final. Reasons being

1 we will into belief have a stronger squad given the three signings made to date signals that intent.
2 we showed this year even after having the mid term slump we still finished strong with more points than 5th place.
3 with a decent squad we made the Scottish cup final. As I said previously we in my belief will have a stringer squad so I reckon the league cup is our strongest possibility.
I've not taken into account Europe where I'm not sure we will be strong enough to compete.

All this is what would be nice and I think we can achieve.

Salisbury Hibby
02-06-2013, 03:32 PM
And let's stick it right up Celtic next time we play them.

Salisbury Hibby
02-06-2013, 03:33 PM
Top 6 is a minimum. Top 3 should be achievable if we don't have a mid season slump. And Pat, take the League Cup more seriously next year :-)

Salisbury Hibby
02-06-2013, 03:39 PM
Top 6 is a minimum. Top 3 should be achievable if we don't have a mid season slump. And Pat, take the League Cup more seriously next year :-)
Sorry. I must remember not to use the "back" button on my phone. What an embarrassment.

J-C
02-06-2013, 03:44 PM
Top 4 with 2nd as our main aim, 2 good cup runs, hopefully semi in each.

Better quality football, NO hoofball, a pacey right back and a quality attacking midfielder who can make the team tick ( Craig maybe )

iwasthere1972
02-06-2013, 03:57 PM
Top three and beating the likes of Ross County, Inverness Caley and St Johnstone on a regular basis.

Scottish Cup Final and League Cup Final. Winning one of them.

Oh and a decent cup of tea would be the icing on the cake.

hibsbollah
02-06-2013, 04:09 PM
1. Theres no reason at all why we shouldnt be aiming for second place. I would consider 4th a success if we had another cup(s) run.

2. A continuation of the move away we've already seen under Fenlon from Route One to playing it on the deck. At the moment we only have Harris who can run at and beat a player from the midfield. A signing who can genuinely get us off our seats please.

3. Stretching the unbeaten derby record to 9 games would be nice.

:cheers:

Keith_M
02-06-2013, 04:18 PM
Top four and hump the Hearts at every opportunity.



Oh and sexy cheerleaders.

degenerated
02-06-2013, 04:21 PM
We would have been top six this year if it wasn't for that ****** stumblebum that was running the line in the last derby at ER and uniteds dubious penalty at tannadice. Top four has to be the indication of progress next season.

GlenrothesHibee
02-06-2013, 04:28 PM
Top 6 minimum. Top 4 the target. At least semis of both cups and continue dominance over the pinks

lord bunberry
02-06-2013, 06:08 PM
That's a hell of a lot to ask for in one go, mate. I want the club to have a long term plan for improvement and achievement, getting the basics in place and building from the foundations.

It's not really in one go though, we have been building up to this season for 18 months its time to deliver. I really like fenlon and I think he could turn out to be a good manager for us but he made mistakes last season and he has to show he has learned from them.

Scouse Hibee
02-06-2013, 06:10 PM
The target has to be to finish above every club outside the old firm, so 2nd place for me. A decent run in either cup and an increase on the crowds at ER also.

The Leith Dutch
02-06-2013, 06:19 PM
1. Theres no reason at all why we shouldnt be aiming for second place. I would consider 4th a success if we had another cup(s) run.

2. A continuation of the move away we've already seen under Fenlon from Route One to playing it on the deck. At the moment we only have Harris who can run at and beat a player from the midfield. A signing who can genuinely get us off our seats please.

3. Stretching the unbeaten derby record to 9 games would be nice.

:cheers:

Sounds good although the unbeaten derby record would be 8 games due to us finishing in the top 6 with them in the bottom 6 (again). Unless of course you're factoring in us dumping them out the cup (again) :aok:

Up The Bracket
02-06-2013, 06:21 PM
Top Six, at least one trip to Hampden and hopefully keeping our unbeaten run against THEM.

Sir David Gray
02-06-2013, 06:25 PM
We should be aiming to be in the top four and in contention for second place every year until Sevco come back in and then we should be looking for third place.

The only reason anyone mentions top six is because of the split. If there was no split, there's no way people would be saying that finishing sixth was acceptable.

For me, the split encourages mediocrity and allows people to accept second best (or sixth best as the case may be).

Finishing in the top six of a league like the SPL is really nothing to write home about, particularly for a club like Hibs.

We also need to have a decent run in the cups as well. Getting to the Scottish Cup final again might be too much to ask but we should be looking to avoid a repeat of the League Cup exit to teams like Queen of the South.

NOLA
02-06-2013, 06:28 PM
best of the rest, a hampden final, more than 2 games in europe.

Vini1875
02-06-2013, 07:06 PM
Real improvement for me would be European qualification via league placing. Players coming through to establish themselves as first team players. More fans through door. Finally a Scottish cup win.

Onceinawhile
02-06-2013, 07:07 PM
Next season I would like to see:

More than one tie in Europe.
1/4 finals in both cups.
Top 4.
Bigger crowds at ER.

All achievable IMO.

Eyrie
02-06-2013, 09:36 PM
We should be aiming to qualify for Europe through our league placing (ie second or third), have good runs in both cups and win all three derbies. Anything that happens in Europe is a bonus to me. I also want to see us playing good football and bringing through more talented youngsters.

Waxy
02-06-2013, 09:51 PM
Top 6 a must.
Undefeated in our 3 matches v the yams.(could be the last derbys ever)
Cant expect another Scottish cup final so soon.Are we bothered about the Scottish cup lotto anymore? It HAS TO happen eventually.

NAE NOOKIE
02-06-2013, 10:28 PM
Top 4 finish. 1/4 final and semi final of the cups and hopefully in one game give the Yams a bloody good hiding . More than 1 round in Europe ( though that depends on the draw ) I dont expect us to beat the likes of Rubin Kazan or Utrecht. Mind you I would expect us to give it a bloody good go.

I would like to see us have a lot more threat from the midfield, something thats been missing for ages. Also defend crosses and corners better, we lose most of our goals from crosses.

An average 1000 per game increase in our crowds, which can be done. Its understandable that lots of folk cannot afford season tickets and the like, but it would be a massive help if the folk who manage to turn out for semis and finals could also manage to turn up at ER 3 or 4 times during the regular season.

Section 43 to grow bigger and bigger. What a difference they have made.

KWJ
03-06-2013, 12:29 AM
First and foremost would be continued improvement.

Challenging for Europe.
A strong home record. Beat all the other teams at home and 2nd should be in the bag. Easier said than done unfortunately but it needs to improve, if it does, the crowds will go up.
With Rangers still struggling this is our best chance to win the Scottish Cup, avoid Celtic and we've as good a chance as anyone. Or try to take care of them at ER.

brydekirk
03-06-2013, 05:39 AM
2nd or 3rd place in the league, and a trip to hampden.
Winning all derbies.
If that does'nt put bums on seats what will ?

lucky
03-06-2013, 05:44 AM
To win more than we lose. Sounds simple but only Celtic won more than 50% of there games. Also another season undefeated against them and another trip or 2 to Hampden

Steve-O
03-06-2013, 06:58 AM
Top 6 and a cup final....................WIN? :agree:

Www1875hfc
03-06-2013, 06:59 AM
Win most if not all your home games,anything you take from the road is an added bonus.

Alex Trager
03-06-2013, 07:57 AM
Top 6 a must.
Undefeated in our 3 matches v the yams.(could be the last derbys ever)
Cant expect another Scottish cup final so soon.Are we bothered about the Scottish cup lotto anymore? It HAS TO happen eventually.

I don't think it is unrealistic to ask that of players that have made it twice in a row, reason being, last year especially we managed to get to the final, bar one game, facing all SPL opposition. So our luck in the comp has to take a different route this season surely? Lower league teams would be good. Along with the same attitude we saw up until the final this year, and we should get past teams. I have no doubt pat will once again get the team right up for the cup again, and push them to get to the final again. A nice wee trip to the SC final to face Morton or so etching would be handy as well.
With the league cup I think the exact same approach has to be taken. Want it. Seriously bad.
So, unless we come up against a team above us in the league I expect us to deal with every team in every league. And that is not too much to ask. Anyone who thinks it is has the wrong mentality. We should one hundred percent be beating teams below us. If we get higher teams then lets see how it works out, and we'll deal with them accordingly. I'd also like a Hibs hearts LC final.

Alex Trager
03-06-2013, 07:59 AM
Win most if not all your home games,anything you take from the road is an added bonus.

Oh yeah and I'd say that on top of all I've already said, win most if not all games at home. Make ER a fortress.

So. Win all home games, maybe minus Celtic.
At least the semis of both cups.
Progression from at least the first round of Europe - bonus.

The Leith Dutch
03-06-2013, 08:09 AM
Win most if not all your home games,anything you take from the road is an added bonus.

Was about to comment on a previous poster who said averaging 1000 more bums on seats.
I think that's an excellent target - with a decent team winning games could maybe push even higher.

This season our away support has been brilliant. Combined with low home support for a lot of the opposition (Motherwell had an average gate of 5300 or so for example) we've out done our rival support and that's shown up in the performances - we've had 6 wins and 5 draws compared to 7 wins and 7 draws at home.

Add to that the fact 3 of our away games were at the bus shed and 2 at Darkheid and (especially if you take out the must be addressed highland performances) we've done great on the road.

I feel we've done better as a home support recently than we have for a while but with a better and more vocal home support I think we could push on as the poster says and look to have a lot more points at Easter Road.

twiceinathens
03-06-2013, 08:26 AM
Develop an ability to pick up points when playing north of the Forth

Devilstorment
03-06-2013, 10:32 AM
If I was The Tache I would be expecting 2 core deliverables as a minimum:

SPL - Achieve a minimum of 55 points in the SPL ending the campaign with positive goal difference
Cup - Achieve a Quarter Final of either Scottish or League cup

anything less than that I would consider a failure and we should consider a change of management next season

In terms of what I would consider a successful season the above and:

SPL - Qualify for Europe through league position
-or-
CUP - Win the League Cup

Dream Season

Win the Scottish Cup!!!

basehibby
03-06-2013, 11:31 AM
I'd like to see some flair and creativity added to the greater solidity/character that's been in evidence this last season. We missed out on top 6 by a baw hair and were arguably unlucky to do so, therefore only just making top 6 would not be a great leap forward - would like to see us pushing for (and winning!) a euro spot via league position won by dint of greater attacking prowess throughout the team (ie not just owing to a single player being on fire for the whole season - although I wouldn't complain if that happenned again either :greengrin).

HH81
03-06-2013, 11:35 AM
I would take 7th again with another Cup final attempt v anyone other than Celtic....

:agree:

LancashireHibby
03-06-2013, 11:38 AM
Top five and at least the quarter finals in both domestic cup competitions.

Top 2/3 should really be something we aim for though.

basehibby
03-06-2013, 12:06 PM
I would take 7th again with another Cup final attempt v anyone other than Celtic....

:agree:

Aye but would that be progress :confused:

DH1875
03-06-2013, 12:26 PM
Anything other than top 4 would be failure in my opinion. If the Yams start the season on minus points we should actually be pushing for 2nd/3rd in the league but 4th is an improvement. Do we still only have the one CL spot for the league next year?

HH81
03-06-2013, 01:04 PM
Aye but would that be progress :confused:

Yes as we will win the final......

ScottB
03-06-2013, 01:09 PM
2nd place will offer a Champions League spot once again next season, there is no reason for us to be aiming any lower than that. Decent cup runs would be nice, 3 finals in a row would be impressive consistency, but then Fenlon's record does suggest he might be a bit of a 'cup specialist' in some records.

Failure to reach the top 6 again should see Fenlon get his jotters.

J-C
03-06-2013, 03:16 PM
2nd place will offer a Champions League spot once again next season, there is no reason for us to be aiming any lower than that. Decent cup runs would be nice, 3 finals in a row would be impressive consistency, but then Fenlon's record does suggest he might be a bit of a 'cup specialist' in some records.

Failure to reach the top 6 again should see Fenlon get his jotters.


When did that happen, haven't read anything about it.

ScottB
03-06-2013, 03:23 PM
When did that happen, haven't read anything about it.

I'm sure Celtic's recently improved performances trigged it, but maybe I'm imagining it. Certainly if not next season the season after should see it back surely?

Liams
03-06-2013, 04:10 PM
Some very very high standards are getting set by some users on this, loook at our CURRENT squad we have right now, dont assume we will get a few magic signings. Based on our squad right now i think one target should be top 6, dont think we will gain more points than this season as i seee the league being tighter. Other targets should be keeeping our home form, and being hard to beat/breakdown.

Honestly dont know how people can say 2nd place, two decent cup runs, ect, when we have no real "known" striker. I mean dont get me wrong i love ross and danny but they havnt been tested too much at top level. Im happy to be proved wrong mind you

Treadstone
03-06-2013, 04:26 PM
Some very very high standards are getting set by some users on this, loook at our CURRENT squad we have right now, dont assume we will get a few magic signings. Based on our squad right now i think one target should be top 6, dont think we will gain more points than this season as i seee the league being tighter. Other targets should be keeeping our home form, and being hard to beat/breakdown.

Honestly dont know how people can say 2nd place, two decent cup runs, ect, when we have no real "known" striker. I mean dont get me wrong i love ross and danny but they havnt been tested too much at top level. Im happy to be proved wrong mind you

Two things.

1. Were you aware we had a period where we won only 3 of 22 league games ?

2. St Johnstone finished third with their top league scorer on 7 goals.

Liams
03-06-2013, 04:49 PM
Two things.

1. Were you aware we had a period where we won only 3 of 22 league games ?

2. St Johnstone finished third with their top league scorer on 7 goals.


Fine mate im sorry, lets just assume we are gonnna finish 2nd, reach two finals and dont have a dip in form, and if this is not achieved sack pf and lets start all over again.

I just felt a more achievable target is to just better our league pos than last year as our side spine will be weaker with no claros and sparky

J-C
03-06-2013, 05:00 PM
Fine mate im sorry, lets just assume we are gonnna finish 2nd, reach two finals and dont have a dip in form, and if this is not achieved sack pf and lets start all over again.

I just felt a more achievable target is to just better our league pos than last year as our side spine will be weaker with no claros and sparky

So you think the teams above us apart from Celtic are that much better than us. :confused:

We were sitting comfortably in second in the early part of the season and if we could stop the usual dip in january we'd have a very good shout for second spot.

We've proved we're a decent cup team under Fenlon, he played the lesser players in the league cup and it showed they were not up to our standards, he needs to take that cup more seriously.

Claros may not be back but he has already brought in Tudor-Jones, a tried and tested SPL player, Robertson will benefit from a good pre season, Craig is a goal scoring attacking mid and Griffiths is not done and dusted just yet.

Treadstone
03-06-2013, 05:06 PM
Fine mate im sorry, lets just assume we are gonnna finish 2nd, reach two finals and dont have a dip in form, and if this is not achieved sack pf and lets start all over again.

I just felt a more achievable target is to just better our league pos than last year as our side spine will be weaker with no claros and sparky

Think you should read my post.

Liams
03-06-2013, 06:41 PM
Look im all for pf, i think hes the best man to help us through this and yes we will be a top top side if we stick with him im just saying im not too sure why we are aim soo high as our expectations may not be achievable if certain things happen or not happen (ie getting drawed with celtic at celtic park in one of the first rounds or we dont get our top players inn/back) as this may result in the boo boys being back which wont helpthe side and may result in a sacking

DH1875
03-06-2013, 08:32 PM
IF the yams are hit with a 15 point deduction and there's no rangers in the league then in my opinion anything short of top 6 will be a disgrace and we might as well jack it in. No way should it be acceptable for the likes of Ross County, ICT, ST Johnstone etc... to finish above us again. Fair enough if one of them gets lucky or unearths a gem but all of them, erm NO.