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Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:01 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

AugustaHibs
28-01-2013, 01:03 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

you should get that knee checked out, seemed like a bad jerk

danhibees1875
28-01-2013, 01:06 AM
So because we were unlucky with those two games and could have been 2nd, rather than 2nd bottom like last year that is a sign of the lack of progress at the club?

littleplum
28-01-2013, 01:10 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

You seem to be contradicting yourself a wee bit there. You point out that but for two poor second half perfomances we would be in 2nd. Last year we were in serious danger of being relegated.

No-one doubts that there's still a lot to do and we're obviously not where we want to be yet but if you don't think that's progress then I'd get a new dictionary if I were you.

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:11 AM
So because we were unlucky with those two games and could have been 2nd, rather than 2nd bottom like last year that is a sign of the lack of progress at the club?

Failing to win at home when you're 2 goals up in the first half isn't unlucky.

We seem to have this false idea in our support that we're simply an unlucky club and that god just happens to hate us.

We're not unlucky. We create our own problems then blame it on everything else, when we should be tackling the root problem.

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:14 AM
You seem to be contradicting yourself a wee bit there. You point out that but for two poor second half perfomances we would be in 2nd. Last year we were in serious danger of being relegated.

No-one doubts that there's still a lot to do and we're obviously not where we want to be yet but if you don't think that's progress then I'd get a new dictionary if I were you.

Fans seem to have very short memories. I recall we got off to a great start when John Hughes became manager. Then over time, the players just seem to lose interest and not try as hard as they were at the beginning.

Well that exact same thing is happening again now and people who don't notice this are blind.

The overall attitude at the club is rank rotten, but too many people are willing to turn a blind eye to this.

danhibees1875
28-01-2013, 01:15 AM
Failing to win at home when you're 2 goals up in the first half isn't unlucky.

We seem to have this false idea in our support that we're simply an unlucky club and that god just happens to hate us.

We're not unlucky. We create our own problems then blame it on everything else, when we should be tackling the root problem.

Okay, unlucky wasn't the best choice of word there.

Because we failed to hold on to the points in the two aforementioned games and subsequently aren't 2nd in the league it's not progress?

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:20 AM
Okay, unlucky wasn't the best choice of word there.

Because we failed to hold on to the points in the two aforementioned games and subsequently aren't 2nd in the league it's not progress?

We seem to do all the hard work, but then screw up when we're down easy street. Other clubs don't seem to screw things up quite as spectacularly as we do.

It's almost like we do our best to trip up at the last hurdle.

danhibees1875
28-01-2013, 01:26 AM
We seem to do all the hard work, but then screw up when we're down easy street. Other clubs don't seem to screw things up quite as spectacularly as we do.

It's almost like we do our best to trip up at the last hurdle.

Dundee united? Celtic? 2 games where of grafted hard and held on to the 3 points.

We have much more exposure to our disappointments than other teams on a regular basis. I imagine Celtic fans could be thinking Kilmarnock, hearts and now st Mirren... We always trip up at the last hurdle.

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:29 AM
Most people don't like what I have to post on here and that's fair enough.

But I'm a genuine fan who believes we're capable of much more than we accept as a fanbase.

We're Hibernian FC FFS. We should be ripping these teams a new one. We beat all the big clubs, then let ourselves down by letting the smaller clubs walk all over us like we're nothing.

If we just had the character to grab games by the scruff of the neck, instead of being walked over by teams that simply put a better shift in, then we'd be stick ons for 2nd place.

That's no disrespect to the other clubs in the league, but we have enough quality and resources to top them all.

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:32 AM
Dundee united? Celtic? 2 games where of grafted hard and held on to the 3 points.

We have much more exposure to our disappointments than other teams on a regular basis. I imagine Celtic fans could be thinking Kilmarnock, hearts and now st Mirren... We always trip up at the last hurdle.

We win games on the big occasions, but don't look anywhere near scoring a goal against teams who aren't considered as much of a threat.

We should be playing every team in the league as if they were Celtic we were playing. We shouldn't be holding back against anyone. Yet we continue to hold back against teams that we should be brushing aside.

It's not good enough and we shouldn't accept this.

Hibercelona
28-01-2013, 01:45 AM
Out of the bottom 3 sides Ross county, St Mirren & Dundee. We've taken 10 points out of a possible 21 so far.

We've taken 4 points out of 9 against Dundee which is totally inexcusable.

If we're going to finish 2nd place, we're going to have to win these type of games. Getting results in the big games alone isn't enough.

We have enough quality there, but we still lack that extra character that we need to make every game count.

We're capable, but just not showing our full potential, which seems to be the usual story.

basehibby
28-01-2013, 02:35 AM
We win games on the big occasions, but don't look anywhere near scoring a goal against teams who aren't considered as much of a threat.

We should be playing every team in the league as if they were Celtic we were playing. We shouldn't be holding back against anyone. Yet we continue to hold back against teams that we should be brushing aside.

It's not good enough and we shouldn't accept this.

I understand and share your desire to see Hibs brushing aside opposition left right and centre but have to let reality intervene when assessing the progress of my team. It's arrogant and cock eyed to assume we're "holding back" when there's 11 other guys out there on the pitch (ie the opposition) trying their darndest to make sure we don't get things our own way.

For example we recently beat Celtic with a 5 man midfield whereas a few days previously we struggled to break down Ross County doing exactly the same to us. RC got a bit lucky with about their only attempt on goal that day while Hibs played well vs Celtic, but the tactical battles and the resulting upsets were strikingly similar.

But, according to your logic, Hibs had no right to beat Celtic who should automatically have swept us aside and we should equally have wiped the floor with RC. Well it didn't work out like that but the points yielded were exactly the same :cb

edinburghhibee
28-01-2013, 02:37 AM
Everyone is beating everyone, no team has been great this season butcher was said to be one game away from the sack until they turned the corner. Us and Aberdeen seem to be picking up points here and there. Motherwell are the same.

Well have lost one of their main strikers.

IMHO ICT won't finish second, I think they will drop points towards the end of the campaign.

Aberdeen haven't strengthened and have one player scoring all their goals (as we have)

My point is that the league is so tight this season, and we have managed to stay in the fight at the top all season. We are doing well considering the performances of the last few seasons and we are strengthening when others can't.

Be patient and take the gun away from your head, your alright!

Iain G
28-01-2013, 03:49 AM
Some seem to think progress is an instant thing in football and the waving of a magic wand will transform the underperforming yellow team into Barcelona overnight, it's evolution not revolution :wink:

Fenlon has come in and so far has managed to get enough out of the existing team and a bunch of short term signings to keep us in the league, progress stage 1 achieved, tick!

He then identifies the key weaknesses he has inherited, including being soft, having no leadership or desire or fight, during the summer he improved our backbone and certainly improved our ability to put up some kind of a fight, based on the previous year I'd say he has moved us forward another stage, so another tick there.

This window we have kept Griffiths and McGivern and look set to add Robertson and hopefully one other and already have Liam Craig lined up for next year, I'd call this effective progress!

His next stage of evolving the team is to improve consistancy and implement a more pleasing brand of football, while still retaining that fight and desire.

Small steps but so far so good :thumbsup:

hibeequinn
28-01-2013, 04:08 AM
What are you expecting from a team that finished 11th and lost heavily in a scottish cup final?

As said before this is the season that pat needs to rebuild on some areas of the team and the goal is too finish in the top 6 and have a good cup run then next season a would say its make or break for fenlon a think hes done a great job since taking over just needs time. :)

Since90+2
28-01-2013, 04:21 AM
We seem to do all the hard work, but then screw up when we're down easy street. Other clubs don't seem to screw things up quite as spectacularly as we do.

It's almost like we do our best to trip up at the last hurdle.


Stop talking nonsense. Celtic were 2 nil up at Dundee United ealier this season and conceded two goals in the 89th and 91st minutes.

Like someone else has pointed out bar the two bad 2nd half performances we would be second instead of in a relegation dogfight. Progress? Yip.

MWHIBBIES
28-01-2013, 04:27 AM
Your negativity and ignorance is pathetic.

Hiber-nation
28-01-2013, 05:46 AM
Some seem to think progress is an instant thing in football and the waving of a magic wand will transform the underperforming yellow team into Barcelona overnight, it's evolution not revolution :wink:

Fenlon has come in and so far has managed to get enough out of the existing team and a bunch of short term signings to keep us in the league, progress stage 1 achieved, tick!

He then identifies the key weaknesses he has inherited, including being soft, having no leadership or desire or fight, during the summer he improved our backbone and certainly improved our ability to put up some kind of a fight, based on the previous year I'd say he has moved us forward another stage, so another tick there.

This window we have kept Griffiths and McGivern and look set to add Robertson and hopefully one other and already have Liam Craig lined up for next year, I'd call this effective progress!

His next stage of evolving the team is to improve consistancy and implement a more pleasing brand of football, while still retaining that fight and desire.

Small steps but so far so good :thumbsup:

That's the sensible type of post that makes me feel a bit more positive again after watching that pish yesterday!

Iain G
28-01-2013, 06:38 AM
That's the sensible type of post that makes me feel a bit more positive again after watching that pish yesterday!

Well I haven't seen any match highlights yet from the Aberdeen game :wink:

truehibernian
28-01-2013, 06:49 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

Luton Town, Leeds Utd, Oldham, MK Dons, St Mirren - 5 reasons, 5 examples,,5 games this weekend that say bad results are always possible and football is unpredictable - we are 4th with more points than the whole of last season - that my friend is progress, pure and simple.

Gatecrasher
28-01-2013, 06:54 AM
I think you need to cast your mind back to last season when we weren't coming close to competing against most teams, and the league table doesn't lie.

muirhousehibby
28-01-2013, 06:56 AM
Well I haven't seen any match highlights yet from the Aberdeen game :wink:

We're 15 points better off than we were this time last year.

What annoys me the most is you spend £32 for yesterday's ticket and money On your bus and don't forget the 120 miles travel to watch a poor performance away from home again

Liams
28-01-2013, 07:09 AM
Okay 4/9 points against dundee is terrible but these things happen, remember we are unbeating against hearts and celtic this season.. And have 34points.. Wee have a decent goalie and some decent talent in rhe squad compared to last season... But some people cant see real progress while seeeing where we have came from..

Judas Iscariot
28-01-2013, 07:15 AM
Admin peoples, when is this rocket going to get launched?!

LTYF

ALF TUPPER
28-01-2013, 07:39 AM
Dont agree with OP. In comparison to the last few seasons ........ I see progress .


GGTTH

Tricla
28-01-2013, 07:43 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

Pish

NORTHERNHIBBY
28-01-2013, 07:54 AM
last season, the last three games would all have been defeats because we lacked the grit and character to dig points out. Can't believe that people are forgetting, that it was not until the last game against Dunfy that finally kept us up. Would rather be arguing about two chucked away games that stop us being second top, than being chuffed about winning games that meant we were second bottom.

Mikey
28-01-2013, 08:04 AM
Admin peoples, when is this rocket going to get launched?!

LTYF

Unfortunately the rocket is a Hibs fan.

This thread shows just how thick he is though.

ronaldo7
28-01-2013, 08:05 AM
I wish we had Paul Lambert's progress replicated at Hibs.:aok:

Brooster
28-01-2013, 08:06 AM
Hibercelona - stop boring people.

Borderhibbie76
28-01-2013, 08:10 AM
Nobody was more annoyed than me with that performance yest but reality check needed. 3 clean sheets v smeltic and yams, sheep is progress mate and 2 points off second top as opposed to 2nd bottom imo is fantastic progress from pf!!, we also seem to be strengthening whilst others are losing players this window so ffs get a reality check!!

Hiber-nation
28-01-2013, 08:41 AM
Well I haven't seen any match highlights yet from the Aberdeen game :wink:

That's because there are none! Sorry, great penalty save by Williams (just to keep on this positive slant :wink:)

VickMackie
28-01-2013, 08:58 AM
I understand hibscerlona's point but look at what pat has done in a year. I'd be looking for this time next season not to be losing the two goals but other teams will also improve so it may still be the same.

I'd much rather the position we are in now.

Holmesdale Hibs
28-01-2013, 09:27 AM
We've definitely improved from this time last year. Points total, results and league position are all evidence of this. I'm not sure what more we can realistically expect given PF could only bring in a handful of new players on a limited budget.

There's not much between the teams in The SPL now and this year we're part of a very mediocre pack. Last year we weren't good enough and were close to relegation.

This is not emphatic progress but solid progress. As a realist I'm ok with that.

blackpoolhibs
28-01-2013, 09:35 AM
We were absolutely rotten last season and the previous one, two relegation battles and football that made your eyes bleed.

This one we have improved results wise, had the odd fantastic bits of play (sparky's goal against Dundee U) and we have had some great performances, with the support going home delerious, i know this to be the case as i have read it on here.

6 months from 11th to 4th is progress no matter what anyone says, although its not good enough for some, it is for most who realise where we have come from and what the manager wants.

The future looks much better, perhaps if we'd been relegated some folk would be a little happier, as we might be fighting for the championship now?

CraigHibee
28-01-2013, 09:46 AM
if there wasn't progress we would be in the same position as we were last season!

Big improvement from last season!

jdships
28-01-2013, 09:46 AM
Failing to win at home when you're 2 goals up in the first half isn't unlucky.

We seem to have this false idea in our support that we're simply an unlucky club and that god just happens to hate us.

We're not unlucky. We create our own problems then blame it on everything else, when we should be tackling the root problem.



Accept it is your opinion and your right to express it
How about giving us a few chosen words on how this 'root problem ' should be addressed ?
All you have done is criticise

Let's be having a positive reply :greengrin

Kato
28-01-2013, 10:45 AM
As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.



Shhust.

Jones28
28-01-2013, 10:49 AM
Very, very bored with this same chat. Progress is evident at Hibs, we are by no means the finished article but we are on the right track.

No doubt the same thread will crop up next week. Yawn.

Macaroon
28-01-2013, 10:54 AM
Some of the points you are making are valid, but to claim that this season is not progress from last season is utterly ludicrous.

Hibrandenburg
28-01-2013, 11:02 AM
Really don't understand what some expect. Watching Hibs the last couple of seasons has been eye bleedingly atrocious. It's still eye bleedingly atrocious but the improvement is there in the results to see.

Hibs don't have the money to build a new team from scratch so Fenlon had to plug the leaks first and foremost, he's done that and is now in the process of getting rid of the rotting timbers and replacing them with new. When that's done we can then give the good ship Hibernian a lick of paint and polish up the brasses.

Give the man a couple of years yet or at least wait until the iceberg is visible on the horizon before you start manning the lifeboats. It could be worse, we could have a submariner at the helm.

Saorsa
28-01-2013, 11:07 AM
Your negativity and ignorance is pathetic.:top marks

Saorsa
28-01-2013, 11:09 AM
Fenlon out, Butcher in. :agree:

Lucius Apuleius
28-01-2013, 11:48 AM
Fenlon out, Butcher in. :agree:

:bitchy: Butcher is soooooooooooooooooooo last week. Fenlon out, Lennon in!!!

Baldy Foghorn
28-01-2013, 11:48 AM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

Sentence in bold is irony at it's best......I shouldn't bite but can't help myself.....

No progress being made although we could have been sitting in second spot????

No progress being made although we have retained 3 loanees who are an integral part of our team, and signed a pretty decent midfielder in robertson...

No progress being made although after 24 matches this term, we have a point more than amassed in the whole of last season......

Really despair at some of the negativity at times, but your post goes beyond that in a seismic scale..........:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Maybe until we win the domestic treble, the Champions league, then the Super Cup, we can really say no progress has been made:cb

danhibees1875
28-01-2013, 11:49 AM
Let's have an objective look at the progress since this time last year:

Points total: 34. Last season: 18. Increase of 16 points
Games won: 9. Last season: 4. Increase of 5 wins
Goals scored: 32. Last season: 24. Increase of 8 goals
Goals conceded: 30. Last season: 45. Decrease of 15 goals

This part is a tad more subjective but I'll let you decide if our team last season was better or worse(I know my answer):

Brown
Hanlon
O'hanlon
McPake
Francomb
Wotherspoon
Soars
Stevenson
Sproule
Osbourne
Doyle

Now, where exactly haven't we made progress?

Ritchie
28-01-2013, 11:51 AM
computer/laptops should have breathalyser's installed.... to be able to log on you have to pass!

Velma Dinkley
28-01-2013, 11:52 AM
Personally, I won't be going back to Easter Road until Hibs win the World Cup

Aldo
28-01-2013, 12:02 PM
No progress??? Your opinion yes but sorry what a lot if Piffle.

4th in league 3 points from 2nd place. Most teams losing players and we've just signed a very good player on 2 and a half year deal.

Kept the loanees and got a player on pre contract. Things take time.

A few steps in right direction and yes long way to go but for me it's keep up the good work paddy.

Baldy Foghorn
28-01-2013, 12:04 PM
Personally, I won't be going back to Easter Road until Hibs win the World Cup

Glory Hunter alert:greengrin

Judas Iscariot
28-01-2013, 12:06 PM
Unfortunately the rocket is a Hibs fan.

This thread shows just how thick he is though.

I don't believe that...

TrinityHibs
28-01-2013, 12:22 PM
Having suffered through the end of Yogi's reign, the clown years and Pats challenge its hard to make any sense of the OP's comments. Funnily enough the end of January is a good time to review progress, or lack of it as thats when we fell off a cliff in 2010.

At the end of January 2010 we had played 22 games, scored 37 goals, let in 19 goals and had amassed 42 points. We finished the season in 4th place despite only securing 12 points from the last 16 games of the season.

Jan 2011 played 23 scored 21 against 42 points 15. End of season 37 points
Jan 2012 played 25 scored 24 against 45 points 18. End of season 33 points
Jan 2013 played 24 scored 32 against 30 points 34. End of season? Better than the last two by a distance.

I know on a strict like for like basis I need to include the Ross County game coming up but right now we have scored 33% more goals, let in 33% less goals and have acquired 89% more points than this time last year. Its gonna take one helluva performance from Ross County on Wednesday for us not to have shown any progress.

One other statistic that would be worthwhile confirming is when was the last time that we got to the end of January without having been beaten by Celtc or Hertz. It isnt the only thing but that is a serious improvement. Last year by this time we had played them 5 times and managed 0 wins 1 draw and 4 losses. This year we are at 2 wins 3 draws 0 losses. Now that is progress

yeezus.
28-01-2013, 12:25 PM
Are you having a laugh? Watching Hibernian last year was a nightmare, losing at home to Dunfermline and St. Mirren at home with Victor Palsson at left back!

Pat Fenlon has steadied us but it will take a bit of time for us to be sitting 2nd in the league.

Enough of the negativity. :flag:

The Modfather
28-01-2013, 12:31 PM
Hibs don't have the money to build a new team from scratch

I thought that was Petrie's master plan a few seasons ago? One of the many bullets he has, inexplicably, managed to dodge.

Diclonius
28-01-2013, 12:46 PM
Having suffered through the end of Yogi's reign, the clown years and Pats challenge its hard to make any sense of the OP's comments. Funnily enough the end of January is a good time to review progress, or lack of it as thats when we fell off a cliff in 2010.

At the end of January 2010 we had played 22 games, scored 37 goals, let in 19 goals and had amassed 42 points. We finished the season in 4th place despite only securing 12 points from the last 16 games of the season.

Jan 2011 played 23 scored 21 against 42 points 15. End of season 37 points
Jan 2012 played 25 scored 24 against 45 points 18. End of season 33 points
Jan 2013 played 24 scored 32 against 30 points 34. End of season? Better than the last two by a distance.

I know on a strict like for like basis I need to include the Ross County game coming up but right now we have scored 33% more goals, let in 33% less goals and have acquired 89% more points than this time last year. Its gonna take one helluva performance from Ross County on Wednesday for us not to have shown any progress.

One other statistic that would be worthwhile confirming is when was the last time that we got to the end of January without having been beaten by Celtc or Hertz. It isnt the only thing but that is a serious improvement. Last year by this time we had played them 5 times and managed 0 wins 1 draw and 4 losses. This year we are at 2 wins 3 draws 0 losses. Now that is progress

1991. We drew all five games.

For the same statistic with winning as well as drawing then you'd have to go back to 1972.

lyonhibs
28-01-2013, 01:03 PM
Most people don't like what I have to post on here and that's fair enough.

But I'm a genuine fan who believes we're capable of much more than we accept as a fanbase.

We're Hibernian FC FFS. We should be ripping these teams a new one. We beat all the big clubs, then let ourselves down by letting the smaller clubs walk all over us like we're nothing.

If we just had the character to grab games by the scruff of the neck, instead of being walked over by teams that simply put a better shift in, then we'd be stick ons for 2nd place.

That's no disrespect to the other clubs in the league, but we have enough quality and resources to top them all.

This line always makes me chuckle - and then you go on to say "no disrespect to the other clubs" :faf:

Oh, and re: "enough quality", no we - currently - don't not in the central midfied (in an attacking sense) or on the wings. As mentioned elsewhere, Fenlon cannae just pluck players oot his ring. He clearly used the summer past to improve the GK, defence and overall attitude of the squad, and with the signing of Robertson, Craig and Wylde (TBC on the last one) he is clearly addressing the remaining deficiencies.

Us losing to "smaller" teams has got a whole lot less to do with the relative "shift" put in by each team than it did last season (hence why, as I'm sure you've noted with glee, we've lost a whole lot less than last season). It's because the ICT and Motherwells of this world (the only 2 teams actually above us bar Celtc obviously) didn't have a total rebuild to do in the summer.

Most SPL teams would kill for Motherwell's wingers, and IIRC, ICT have 3, maybe 4 players who have scored around about 10 or more goals this season already.

rubber mal
28-01-2013, 01:04 PM
Most people don't like what I have to post on here

Funny that.

We have more points already than we got the whole of last season. No one's saying we're the finished article, but that certainly represents progress as I understand the word.

As an aside, I felt Jim Carrey's cameo in the US Office last week was somewhat underwhelming.

smurf
28-01-2013, 01:05 PM
1991. We drew all five games.

For the same statistic with winning as well as drawing then you'd have to go back to 1972.

I have found this season very frustrating at times. And I really do hope we get one or two offensive players in this window.

However, it is ridiculous to suggest that there hasn't been progress. There has. Not as much as I would like but the objective this season is best articulated in the games v The Yams. We set out not to lose. In a transitional season maybe that's correct.

I'm sure Pat knows that next season with four windows under his belt the objective will become more we set out to win.

Dinkydoo
28-01-2013, 01:06 PM
2nd bottom to 4th - not far off 2nd - in the space of under 12 months isn't progress?

:faf:

Hibee Ryan
28-01-2013, 01:18 PM
How is 4th not progress?! I mean we aren't playing beautiful football but how can you expect Fenlon to deliver that after one year? Every team will drop points they shouldn't, if we didn't then we'd be winning the league. We've had to improve more than any other team in the league as we finished 2nd last so were the worst team to not be relegated so to be 4th after half a season is a great achievement and everybody would of been happy with 4th at the beginning of the season so stop complaining that the football isn't brilliant as it will get better!

We needed to be stop losing before we could start playing expansive football

Captain Trips
28-01-2013, 01:22 PM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

Those problems will always be at Hibs, we will throw away 2 goal leads in future as well I am sure we had bad games in our pomp. The key is how often do we play bad? The answer is from last season to now we have had far fewer bad matches.

Our bad matches are costing us 2nd but its what 5/6 games what would we have thought of that in August 2012? , bad games cost us 2nd as well last season then except there were 20+ bad games to me thats progress.

I have high expectations myself of what Hibs can do but even finishing 2nd we will likely have games like you describe, as long as it happens less we will do alright and it is happening less.

Twa Cairpets
28-01-2013, 01:28 PM
If we hadn't thrown 2 goal leads away to the likes of ICT and Motherwell at home, we'd be sitting 2nd right now.

As always, there seems to be a huge lack of character at the club.

People can continue to kid on that things are getting better at the club, but sadly, the root problem is still very much there.

Frankly you're either a yam, a troll or just a little bit "special" in terms of an analytical ability.

Huge lack of character you say? Hmm. Coming back to beat from the cup final humping to beat Hearts in the very next SC game? Beating Celtc with a performance that was heroic all round? A point at Parkhead? no goals conceded at Pittodrie, the Bus shelter or against Celtc?

I presume, as has been said before, that under no circumstance should we lose a game against a structurally smaller club without it being an excuse for you to come on and whine, bleat and get all righteous on the basis of nothing?

Get a grip, or do one.

mjhibby
28-01-2013, 01:49 PM
The situation with some fans on here seems remarkably similar to when mixu was in charge.Not happy at our average results,not flamboyant enough and eventually he left even though we finished 6th iirc. Some people should be careful what they wish for.

Spike Mandela
28-01-2013, 02:02 PM
Yes, progress has been made but the last 3 performances against Hearts, Dundee and Aberdeen have been abject imo despite remaining unbeaten.

These type of performances have to become the rarity rather than the norm if we don't want progress to come to a grinding halt and start regressing. Hopefully some new signings can help us to keep progressing.

Captain Trips
28-01-2013, 02:07 PM
The situation with some fans on here seems remarkably similar to when mixu was in charge.Not happy at our average results,not flamboyant enough and eventually he left even though we finished 6th iirc. Some people should be careful what they wish for.

For me 6th isnt good enough though, we all have our own expectations and 6th is below mine.

VickMackie
28-01-2013, 02:17 PM
We're 15 points better off than we were this time last year.

What annoys me the most is you spend £32 for yesterday's ticket and money On your bus and don't forget the 120 miles travel to watch a poor performance away from home again

What I would say to this is that we would've normally played rangers at least twice by this point in the season aswell which you can usually count for 6-9 points less than the 15 gained.

Aldo
28-01-2013, 02:21 PM
We have no Devine right to beat anyone and we should play against every team like it was Smellic or the Yams etc. up for everything.... This I know cannot be achieved with the players on show however we HAVE made progress and good progress at that. I do know there is a long way to go but come on Barca.... You expectations are far and beyond this teams means ( at the moment anyway)

Twa Cairpets
28-01-2013, 02:22 PM
What I would say to this is that we would've normally played rangers at least twice by this point in the season aswell which you can usually count for 6-9 points less than the 15 gained.

Except that Dundee took ther place, and we're on 4 out of 9 against them, so that argument doesn't wash. You could even argue that we're relatively worse off as other teams have taken full points against the 'dee...

RIP
28-01-2013, 02:56 PM
I got similarly treated when I started an 'Easybeats' thread. Wee Hibee (now aka Hibercelona) is neither a Yam or a troll.

My son Cammy told me at the weekend that over the last 11 games, we are second worst in the SPL. Thanks to Pat and the boys for the good start over the first quarter.

However, if you build a team from the back, I reckon Fenlon knows what he's doing. Our back 5 are the best in the SPL for my money. In front of that it's all a bit lightweight. The signings of Craig and Robertson are part of our midfield rebuild. Strikers next with hopefully chances for Ross and Danny before much longer.

It takes a new manager more than 3 windows to rebuild a team on our budget

Pete
28-01-2013, 03:08 PM
The only thing I agree about is our inconsistency. There are times when it looks like we are reverting back to the old ways but when you step back and see the bigger picture it becomes obvious that we have improved massively. If you're a sinking ship the first thing you do is plug the gaps. People expecting more at this stage should be patient and have probably been watching too much football on sky.

I think a lot of these negative threads are down to a general bad vibe about hearts getting to the final. It's time for some people to dry their eyes, look at what we actually have and realise that whatever they to has no effect on us. Forget arguments about wether some of their players should be playing for them or not, their team was full of kids for the semi and they showed bottle and resilience when it mattered throughout the tournament. They, along with st mirren, deserve to be there and that should be it.
Cup fever has gripped one half of the city and it's time for us to get to Hampden too. No more negative guff. Lets start getting excited about the sheep because remember, we are a match for anyone on our day!

SMAXXA
28-01-2013, 03:37 PM
I got similarly treated when I started an 'Easybeats' thread. Wee Hibee (now aka Hibercelona) is neither a Yam or a troll.

My son Cammy told me at the weekend that over the last 11 games, we are second worst in the SPL. Thanks to Pat and the boys for the good start over the first quarter.

However, if you build a team from the back, I reckon Fenlon knows what he's doing. Our back 5 are the best in the SPL for my money. In front of that it's all a bit lightweight. The signings of Craig and Robertson are part of our midfield rebuild. Strikers next with hopefully chances for Ross and Danny before much longer.

It takes a new manager more than 3 windows to rebuild a team on our budget

Was that the thread you got slaughtered for? :wink: If so, I remember thinking it was one of the biggest slatings id seen on here lol

Admittidley we havent played our best stuff the last half a dozen games but we are still up there and picking up good points. I believe PF has his vision and is still at the very early stages of realising this. May take another 2-3 windows IMO

Captain Trips
28-01-2013, 04:02 PM
Except that Dundee took ther place, and we're on 4 out of 9 against them, so that argument doesn't wash. You could even argue that we're relatively worse off as other teams have taken full points against the 'dee...

And teams that took more points off Dundee than us might have taken less than we have from say Celtic or Motherwell, Dundee are not a standard and it is our points total that counts. Im sure when we have finished 3rd teams took more points off certain teams than us.

Hibtastic
28-01-2013, 04:29 PM
OP is exactly the sort of "fan" we do not need!!

Hank Schrader
28-01-2013, 04:46 PM
Frankly you're either a yam, a troll or just a little bit "special" in terms of an analytical ability.

Huge lack of character you say? Hmm. Coming back to beat from the cup final humping to beat Hearts in the very next SC game? Beating Celtc with a performance that was heroic all round? A point at Parkhead? no goals conceded at Pittodrie, the Bus shelter or against Celtc?

I presume, as has been said before, that under no circumstance should we lose a game against a structurally smaller club without it being an excuse for you to come on and whine, bleat and get all righteous on the basis of nothing?

Get a grip, or do one.

Impossible to better this post.:top marks

Sergio sledge
28-01-2013, 04:49 PM
I got similarly treated when I started an 'Easybeats' thread. Wee Hibee (now aka Hibercelona) is neither a Yam or a troll.

My son Cammy told me at the weekend that over the last 11 games, we are second worst in the SPL. Thanks to Pat and the boys for the good start over the first quarter.

However, if you build a team from the back, I reckon Fenlon knows what he's doing. Our back 5 are the best in the SPL for my money. In front of that it's all a bit lightweight. The signings of Craig and Robertson are part of our midfield rebuild. Strikers next with hopefully chances for Ross and Danny before much longer.

It takes a new manager more than 3 windows to rebuild a team on our budget

:agree: Agree with the bit in bold especially. I keep hearing that Butcher has turned the ICT squad around in a short space of time, but if you look at the ICT squad that played in the semi final, 62.5% were signed pre-Jan 2012 transfer window (> 2 windows ago), 37.5% signed since.31% of the squad have been at the club since before the summer 2011 transfer window (>3 windows ago).

In contrast, the Hibs squad from the Aberdeen game had 33.3% signed pre-Jan 2012 transfer window (> 2 windows ago, Hanlon, Wotherspoon, Stevenson, Handling, Caldwell and Griffiths), 66.6% of our squad was signed in the last 2 transfer windows. (You'd have to assume that if Claros had been fit he would have taken the place of Handling or Caldwell and so would have changed the percentages to 27.5% pre-Jan 2012 and 72.5% signed in the last 2 transfer windows.) Only 16.6% of the squad were signed pre-Summer 2011 transfer window (>3 windows ago), Hanlon, Wotherspoon and Stevenson.

VickMackie
28-01-2013, 05:16 PM
Except that Dundee took ther place, and we're on 4 out of 9 against them, so that argument doesn't wash. You could even argue that we're relatively worse off as other teams have taken full points against the 'dee...

So in hypothetical world we are 11 points better off :greengrin

Twa Cairpets
28-01-2013, 05:31 PM
So in hypothetical world we are 11 points better off :greengrin

I think your maths are wrong, but that works for me... :greengrin

EuanH78
28-01-2013, 05:35 PM
Sentence in bold is irony at it's best......I shouldn't bite but can't help myself.....

No progress being made although we could have been sitting in second spot????

No progress being made although we have retained 3 loanees who are an integral part of our team, and signed a pretty decent midfielder in robertson...

No progress being made although after 24 matches this term, we have a point more than amassed in the whole of last season......

Really despair at some of the negativity at times, but your post goes beyond that in a seismic scale..........:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Maybe until we win the domestic treble, the Champions league, then the Super Cup, we can really say no progress has been made:cb

Steady, we're not Hearts you know. :greengrin

Mikeystewart
28-01-2013, 05:40 PM
I could not be bothered reading the 3 pages of posts but here is my pennys worth anyway.

I get the feeling that the OP could have an argument about Hibs in an empty cupboard.

I am also not really sure what it is he is actually complaining about.

Taking into account the size of the club compared to the rest of the league. I would say that 2nd or 3rd is our long term expectation.

So to be sitting in 4th after the past 2 season we've had and considering Fenlon practically built a squad from nothing and having only the 4th highest budget in the league, to be sitting in 4th is fine by me for the moment.

lEXO
28-01-2013, 06:21 PM
Progress? If sitting 4th in the league,not getting battered by teams away from home regularly and being solid is not progress from the last few years i dont know what is. I want us to play more expansive football and be entertained, of course i do. I was up at Aberdeen yesterday and it was woeful. I was also at Parkhead when we played well and fought back to get a deserved draw and Motherwell when we played and won very well. I would rather we fought out tough away draws than roll over like we have done in the past. Dunno what some folk expect like?

SouthamptonHibs
28-01-2013, 07:32 PM
Out of the bottom 3 sides Ross county, St Mirren & Dundee. We've taken 10 points out of a possible 21 so far.

We've taken 4 points out of 9 against Dundee which is totally inexcusable.

If we're going to finish 2nd place, we're going to have to win these type of games. Getting results in the big games alone isn't enough.

We have enough quality there, but we still lack that extra character that we need to make every game count.

We're capable, but just not showing our full potential, which seems to be the usual story.

Totally agree with you on this, 0 out of 6 points taken from RC, 4 out of 9 v Dundee is poor going IMO. I think we should play Celtic every week 4 out of 6 Hail Hail

ronaldo7
29-01-2013, 09:54 PM
I wish we had Paul Lambert's progress replicated at Hibs.:aok:

That Progress just keeps on coming:greengrin

Russell The Dug
29-01-2013, 10:01 PM
Lets see how we travel up North tomorrow when measuring progress.

I do see good players coming into the club though.

ronaldo7
29-01-2013, 10:05 PM
Lets see how we travel up North tomorrow when measuring progress.

I do see good players coming into the club though.

I'd rather gauge any progress over a whole season thanks, and not just if we get travel sickness when going up north.:wink:

blackpoolhibs
29-01-2013, 10:07 PM
Lets see how we travel up North tomorrow when measuring progress.

I do see good players coming into the club though.

Christ i'm worried, before we can tell if we are any better or not, its all boiled down to one away game in the highlands?

gegs70
29-01-2013, 10:23 PM
I think we just sometimes play like a bunch if unduviduals.

We have some decent players, some of which are loanees. If Im being honest would prefer to do what we did some years ago when bown, whitaker, etc came through just gave them time and a few decent professionals to learn them their trade. Thats the way forward rather than picking up average players! Or giving other clubs U 21s game time....

Badabing
29-01-2013, 10:27 PM
I'm sorry to say this but I don't think we're much better than last year, harder to beat I'll agree our improved results are more to do with other teams performances more than our own.

Danderhall Hibs
29-01-2013, 10:31 PM
We're definitely better. Noone can argue that.

Having said that I'm hoping it's going to get better - it's a bit sore on the eyes just now - no creativity and fairly negative. I'm just hoping it's down to Fenlon building from the back - he's done that now so hopefully the signings of Robertson and Craig are a sign he's onto the next stage of the rebuild.

ronaldo7
29-01-2013, 10:32 PM
I'm sorry to say this but I don't think we're much better than last year, harder to beat I'll agree our improved results are more to do with other teams performances more than our own.


Points make prizes.

Just go through the teams from this year to last and make an assessment for yourself.

I'll give you a start............Ben Williams v Mark Brown:wink:

monktonharp
29-01-2013, 10:41 PM
Progress? If sitting 4th in the league,not getting battered by teams away from home regularly and being solid is not progress from the last few years i dont know what is. I want us to play more expansive football and be entertained, of course i do. I was up at Aberdeen yesterday and it was woeful. I was also at Parkhead when we played well and fought back to get a deserved draw and Motherwell when we played and won very well. I would rather we fought out tough away draws than roll over like we have done in the past. Dunno what some folk expect like?there is definate signs of progress, but i agree to a certain " degree" with the OP. why do we have a way of turning in some atrocious performances, usually when much better is expected? the last game is one, for certain. having the big auld guy on at the start(or even at the club) has got me puzzled. and having watched the performance of Witherspoon in the same game, my god that was an horific performance and everyone and their dug could see that he hardly tried a leg. 2 passengers throughout the whole of the first half...........just not good enough . one couldnae try, and the other didnae try. there were one or two others that did not actually inspire me but running wi' as good as 2 men short is pathetic. there has been some of the same in other games, and the end result was nae points, or 1 point. still not good.

monktonharp
29-01-2013, 10:43 PM
on paper, we have as good as most in the league. Fenlon, get some of them to up their work rate or punt them.

allezsauzee
29-01-2013, 10:58 PM
While I am aware of the irony that I am adding to this thread, I can't believe such a ridiculous opening post has generated 90 odd responses.

Scouse Hibee
29-01-2013, 11:20 PM
Most people don't like what I have to post on here and that's fair enough.

But I'm a genuine fan who believes we're capable of much more than we accept as a fanbase.

We're Hibernian FC FFS. We should be ripping these teams a new one. We beat all the big clubs, then let ourselves down by letting the smaller clubs walk all over us like we're nothing.

If we just had the character to grab games by the scruff of the neck, instead of being walked over by teams that simply put a better shift in, then we'd be stick ons for 2nd place.

That's no disrespect to the other clubs in the league, but we have enough quality and resources to top them all.


And yet another one! A ridiculous statement and one that is made far too often on here.

HUTCHYHIBBY
30-01-2013, 01:22 AM
Dinnae worry, the infrastructure is all in place now!

Onion
30-01-2013, 06:47 AM
Progress was never going to be a straight line or instantaneous. Fenlon took over a club in absolute turmoil, with a whole team of players who were either never good enough or with bad attitudes. He's spent the last year and bit weeding out the worst and backfilling as best he can.

IMHO Hibs are still very much a 'work in progress' under Fenlon and always likely to win/lose matches without explanation. But there are definite signs that Fenlon knows where he's going with the team and that he's got plenty more to do and give. Despite some of the performances/tactics, I've been impressed with the way he's gone about his business, and confident that we'll see a much more rounded and solid Hibs team from beginning of next season.

Hainan Hibs
30-01-2013, 07:01 AM
There is a tendency to go to either extreme on this board, posters who criticise are hounded but just as bad is the orgasmic reactions to not being in a relegation battle.

IMO no one can argue that 4th at this stage of the season is not progress from recent seasons. Fenon has managed to get a team together that is (most of the time) very hard to beat and willing to and able to do a backs to the wall job when required. Coupled with a very decent keeper we have picked up many a point in games where last season we would've been soundly beaten in.

However the frustration seeps in when you see just how eye bleeding the football we play is at times. Its not just boring football, its the inability of players to string more than a few passes together, inability to retain possession for more than 5 seconds and reluctance to run at and take on a man.

Again however I know that Fenlon can't build the team we all want in the time he has had. Stage one was to make us hard to beat and install fight and desire which was lacking and he has done this. Next stage will hopefully to get wingers and a playmaker who will be willing to take on a man and add, dare I say it, flare to our Saturday viewings.

Kato
30-01-2013, 07:48 AM
our improved results are more to do with other teams performances more than our own.

Badaboom

hibsbollah
30-01-2013, 07:54 AM
There is a tendency to go to either extreme on this board, posters who criticise are hounded but just as bad is the orgasmic reactions to not being in a relegation battle.

IMO no one can argue that 4th at this stage of the season is not progress from recent seasons. Fenon has managed to get a team together that is (most of the time) very hard to beat and willing to and able to do a backs to the wall job when required. Coupled with a very decent keeper we have picked up many a point in games where last season we would've been soundly beaten in.

However the frustration seeps in when you see just how eye bleeding the football we play is at times. Its not just boring football, its the inability of players to string more than a few passes together, inability to retain possession for more than 5 seconds and reluctance to run at and take on a man.

Again however I know that Fenlon can't build the team we all want in the time he has had. Stage one was to make us hard to beat and install fight and desire which was lacking and he has done this. Next stage will hopefully to get wingers and a playmaker who will be willing to take on a man and add, dare I say it, flare to our Saturday viewings.

Sense at last.

ronaldo7
30-01-2013, 08:58 AM
There is a tendency to go to either extreme on this board, posters who criticise are hounded but just as bad is the orgasmic reactions to not being in a relegation battle.

IMO no one can argue that 4th at this stage of the season is not progress from recent seasons. Fenon has managed to get a team together that is (most of the time) very hard to beat and willing to and able to do a backs to the wall job when required. Coupled with a very decent keeper we have picked up many a point in games where last season we would've been soundly beaten in.

However the frustration seeps in when you see just how eye bleeding the football we play is at times. Its not just boring football, its the inability of players to string more than a few passes together, inability to retain possession for more than 5 seconds and reluctance to run at and take on a man.

Again however I know that Fenlon can't build the team we all want in the time he has had. Stage one was to make us hard to beat and install fight and desire which was lacking and he has done this. Next stage will hopefully to get wingers and a playmaker who will be willing to take on a man and add, dare I say it, flare to our Saturday viewings.


You were doing so well too.:wink:

Good post.

HUTCHYHIBBY
31-01-2013, 12:43 AM
Have we really progressed this season? or have a few teams got worse? We are harder to beat, but, still cack.

hibiedude
31-01-2013, 05:47 AM
There's to many happy clappers that follow Hibs...their take being things are improving with is a load of nonsense...we are rank rotten and have been for some time apart from the odd game when we actually pull our finger out....a scottish cup game win against hearts has this place in meltdown which explains it all really..

Steve20
31-01-2013, 06:13 AM
Have we really progressed this season? or have a few teams got worse? We are harder to beat, but, still cack.

We have progressed but only slightly. We'll see how much we've progressed at the end of the season but I suspect we'll finish about 8th or 9th.

Iain G
31-01-2013, 06:32 AM
There's to many happy clappers that follow Hibs...their take being things are improving with is a load of nonsense...we are rank rotten and have been for some time apart from the odd game when we actually pull our finger out....a scottish cup game win against hearts has this place in meltdown which explains it all really..

And here come the Positivity Police :greengrin Excuse me for trying to be positive and happy about my football team :na na:

Lucius Apuleius
31-01-2013, 06:36 AM
There's to many happy clappers that follow Hibs...their take being things are improving with is a load of nonsense...we are rank rotten and have been for some time apart from the odd game when we actually pull our finger out....a scottish cup game win against hearts has this place in meltdown which explains it all really..

Guess I need to just hand in my ST then. Far too positive a person.


And here come the Positivity Police :greengrin Excuse me for trying to be positive and happy about my football team :na na:

:agree::wink:

Since90+2
31-01-2013, 09:17 AM
Have we really progressed this season? or have a few teams got worse? We are harder to beat, but, still cack.

Surely by being harder to beat and thus picking up more points we have progressed no?

Saorsa
31-01-2013, 09:23 AM
a scottish cup game win against hearts has this place in meltdown which explains it all really..Really? This place is never busier than when there's something for folk tae bump their gums about about! Then they all appear again.

Lucius Apuleius
31-01-2013, 09:53 AM
Really? This place is never busier than when there's something for folk tae bump their gums about about! Then they all appear again.

Absolutely. The number of people that appear on here after a defeat who are never on for anything else bloody well amazes me.

stanton10
31-01-2013, 01:27 PM
Absolutely. The number of people that appear on here after a defeat who are never on for anything else bloody well amazes me.

Thats, what this forum is for, opinions what worrys me is Fenlon keeps playing players out of position and as for starting kuji, well that leaves a lot to be desired desperation that backfired , poor management IMO.

clerriehibs
31-01-2013, 01:34 PM
And here come the Positivity Police :greengrin Excuse me for trying to be positive and happy about my football team :na na:

You be happy all you like about our current *****ness. Fill your boots.

Hibercelona
31-01-2013, 01:51 PM
Right now, we're more or less relying on 1 player in our entire squad to be on form in order to snatch goals. When he isn't on form, we don't win games.

Other clubs have more attacking options up front and in midfield. Yes, we defend well, but only because we have everybody (with the exception of the 1 or 2 strikers up front) sitting behind the ball. We have no outlet, so when the ball gets cleared, it just comes straight back at us.

Call my comments "negative" all you want, but they aren't wrong.

HUTCHYHIBBY
31-01-2013, 02:38 PM
Surely by being harder to beat and thus picking up more points we have progressed no?

Its Alex Milleresque football though, maybe that means a cup win will be along soon!

Golden Bear
31-01-2013, 02:42 PM
Right now, we're more or less relying on 1 player in our entire squad to be on form in order to snatch goals. When he isn't on form, we don't win games.

Other clubs have more attacking options up front and in midfield. Yes, we defend well, but only because we have everybody (with the exception of the 1 or 2 strikers up front) sitting behind the ball. We have no outlet, so when the ball gets cleared, it just comes straight back at us.

Call my comments "negative" all you want, but they aren't wrong.

Correct.

The truth hurts at times but nevertheless it is the truth.

steviehibsleith
31-01-2013, 03:03 PM
On paper we have assembled under Pat Fenlon what I think is a reasonable squad- easily one that should be performing to a much higher level than we are over the last few games.

I was recently up at EM on a Saturday watching a youth game - At half time we noticed the first team squad training on adjacent pitch and 25 minutes later they were done with the majorty of players not even in a sweat. Before everyone jumps and says one session I can also state that John Rankin when he left Hibs was at his local gym almost every afternoon because Hibs level of fitness was below par. John Collins said it and how many others think the same. On Saturday I watched like many the Aberdeen game on telly while on Hibs.net to find many posters saying the pitch is heavy etc - same for both teams and we looked knackered.

With the demise across the city and The Rangers playing in the 3rd division - Hibs will have the 2nd highest wage bill in the premier league but are not performing.

Its not the squad thats the problem we still have a hard work issue at easter road.

Golden Bear
31-01-2013, 03:51 PM
On paper we have assembled under Pat Fenlon what I think is a reasonable squad- easily one that should be performing to a much higher level than we are over the last few games.

I was recently up at EM on a Saturday watching a youth game - At half time we noticed the first team squad training on adjacent pitch and 25 minutes later they were done with the majorty of players not even in a sweat. Before everyone jumps and says one session I can also state that John Rankin when he left Hibs was at his local gym almost every afternoon because Hibs level of fitness was below par. John Collins said it and how many others think the same. On Saturday I watched like many the Aberdeen game on telly while on Hibs.net to find many posters saying the pitch is heavy etc - same for both teams and we looked knackered.

With the demise across the city and The Rangers playing in the 3rd division - Hibs will have the 2nd highest wage bill in the premier league but are not performing.

Its not the squad thats the problem we still have a hard work issue at easter road.

I'm not sure if lack of fitness is an issue or not but if it is, then it's worrying that over the last 6/7 years umpteen playing squads have been involved and a succession of Managers have failed to resolve the problem(s). East Mains itself is not the problem but the way the training centre is utilised could be.

Andy74
31-01-2013, 04:01 PM
I'm not sure if lack of fitness is an issue or not but if it is, then it's worrying that over the last 6/7 years umpteen playing squads have been involved and a succession of Managers have failed to resolve the problem(s). East Mains itself is not the problem but the way the training centre is utilised could be.

Or maybe it's just a daft excuse that some fans have made up? It might have been the case with one or two managers but I think we have now confused players that haven't been good enough to think and play quickly enough and being classed as 'unfit'.

Pat was asked about training at one of the meetings and he said they were worked as hard as they could be and they had to factor in rest and recovery but they had, as you would expect, expert advice on that front.

Golden Bear
31-01-2013, 04:04 PM
Or maybe it's just a daft excuse that some fans have made up? It might have been the case with one or two managers but I think we have now confused players that haven't been good enough to think and play quickly enough and being classed as 'unfit'.

Pat was asked about training at one of the meetings and he said they were worked as hard as they could be and they had to factor in rest and recovery but they had, as you would expect, expert advice on that front.

:agree:

I'll go with one.

francobaresi
31-01-2013, 07:27 PM
Fans seem to have very short memories. I recall we got off to a great start when John Hughes became manager. Then over time, the players just seem to lose interest and not try as hard as they were at the beginning.

Well that exact same thing is happening again now and people who don't notice this are blind.

The overall attitude at the club is rank rotten, but too many people are willing to turn a blind eye to this.

I agree that the attitude is rotten and for a while has been. Having been supporting the club for 40 years now I'm well aware and have met with too many heartaches that we are always going to be this way. It's an attitude that IS accepted barring the odd fluctuation in our history. We will never be a great team only a team that has a history. That too will soon be little to hang onto and then we'll be in trouble. We're more of a social club to catch up with our friends and the football is the reason. But like most football supporters we live in the false hope that one day we may meet that holy grail. Sad but true.

Hibs For The Cup
:wink:

blackpoolhibs
31-01-2013, 07:39 PM
I agree that the attitude is rotten and for a while has been. Having been supporting the club for 40 years now I'm well aware and have met with too many heartaches that we are always going to be this way. It's an attitude that IS accepted barring the odd fluctuation in our history. We will never be a great team only a team that has a history. That too will soon be little to hang onto and then we'll be in trouble. We're more of a social club to catch up with our friends and the football is the reason. But like most football supporters we live in the false hope that one day we may meet that holy grail. Sad but true.

Hibs For The Cup
:wink:

Can you tell me a bit more about this rotten attitude please? :confused:

Chibs
31-01-2013, 08:41 PM
I agree that the attitude is rotten and for a while has been. Having been supporting the club for 40 years now I'm well aware and have met with too many heartaches that we are always going to be this way. It's an attitude that IS accepted barring the odd fluctuation in our history. We will never be a great team only a team that has a history. That too will soon be little to hang onto and then we'll be in trouble. We're more of a social club to catch up with our friends and the football is the reason. But like most football supporters we live in the false hope that one day we may meet that holy grail. Sad but true.

Hibs For The Cup
:wink:
That's a very strange post from a Hibby.
Why don't you just stop supporting Hibs and try giving your undeniable loyalty to another club.
Homofc may be a good choice for you.
On the plus side they are in the diddy cup final as they call it.
On the minus it's extremely unlikely you will be able to support them for more than 40 weeks.

jabis
31-01-2013, 10:13 PM
Right now, we're more or less relying on 1 player in our entire squad to be on form in order to snatch goals. When he isn't on form, we don't win games.

Other clubs have more attacking options up front and in midfield. Yes, we defend well, but only because we have everybody (with the exception of the 1 or 2 strikers up front) sitting behind the ball. We have no outlet, so when the ball gets cleared, it just comes straight back at us.

Call my comments "negative" all you want, but they aren't wrong.

:tree..................:xtree2

Lucius Apuleius
01-02-2013, 06:53 AM
Thats, what this forum is for, opinions what worrys me is Fenlon keeps playing players out of position and as for starting kuji, well that leaves a lot to be desired desperation that backfired , poor management IMO.

The forum is for all people to have their opinions, absolutely correct. My point is that there are people who only come on here after a defeat, never see them at any other time. Now that in itself is OK too, just glad I don't live in their heads. Not sure why the rest of your post is aimed at me though.