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lyonhibs
27-01-2013, 06:07 PM
I think all of the above are relatively valid (ish) topics of debate, but I think a more underlying fundamental problem plagues this squad, that being that a lot of the players - whilst being decent professionals etc - just aren't very good at football. By "football" I mean, maintaining possession and creating chances through the seemingly lost art of penetrative passing to your own team.

We have players who can finish chances, prevent chances, make headers, block shots etc etc, but we have no-one with the ability to get their foot on the ball and play a defence splitting (or even troubling) pass on the deck with any regularity.

Until that is resolved, then - being as Fenlon has - IMO - got his priorities right by making us hard to beat before trying to play "The Hibs Way" - I think we can expect more fairly aesthetically grim football matches.

Contrary to the popular romantic belief of gin soaked memories from the early 70's, we don't have a divine right to swashbuckling sexy football. With the current squad - Wotherspoon (today) and Kuqi (pretty much every time I've seen him play) apart - we get effort and commitment pretty much week in, week out, which is night and day vs last season.

Hopefully, Craig, Robertson and/or Wylde (although 2 of those remain paper talk) will bring us the speed and creativity. I think we've got a goalkeeper, a defence, the defensive side of midfield and a finisher pretty much covered. Last season, we had effectively none of these.

Progress has been made, but there's plenty more to make in the attacking/creating sense. I'm sure Fenlon knows this.

A trip to Hampden and a top 6 (top 4 if I'm being greedy) finish this season would be extraordinary considering what our "starting point" was after the end of last season.

blackpoolhibs
27-01-2013, 06:13 PM
I think all of the above are relatively valid (ish) topics of debate, but I think a more underlying fundamental problem plagues this squad, that being that a lot of the players - whilst being decent professionals etc - just aren't very good at football. By "football" I mean, maintaining possession and creating chances through the seemingly lost art of penetrative passing to your own team.

We have players who can finish chances, prevent chances, make headers, block shots etc etc, but we have no-one with the ability to get their foot on the ball and play a defence splitting (or even troubling) pass on the deck with any regularity.

Until that is resolved, then - being as Fenlon has - IMO - got his priorities right by making us hard to beat before trying to play "The Hibs Way" - I think we can expect more fairly aesthetically grim football matches.

Contrary to the popular romantic belief of gin soaked memories from the early 70's, we don't have a divine right to swashbuckling sexy football. With the current squad - Wotherspoon (today) and Kuqi (pretty much every time I've seen him play) apart - we get effort and commitment pretty much week in, week out, which is night and day vs last season.

Hopefully, Craig, Robertson and/or Wylde (although 2 of those remain paper talk) will bring us the speed and creativity. I think we've got a goalkeeper, a defence, the defensive side of midfield and a finisher pretty much covered. Last season, we had effectively none of these.

Progress has been made, but there's plenty more to make in the attacking/creating sense. I'm sure Fenlon knows this.

A trip to Hampden and a top 6 (top 4 if I'm being greedy) finish this season would be extraordinary considering what our "starting point" was after the end of last season.

Get yer tin hat on, this could be a rough ride? :agree:

Northernhibee
27-01-2013, 06:19 PM
Fenlon is IMO a very fair man; Booth, Kujabi, O'Hanlon etc. got opportunities in the QOTS cup game to prove they could still do a job and when they didn't they were punted, put out on loan or just didn't make the team.

Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case today with Kuqi's start.

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 06:20 PM
Fair points well made, however 8 of the team were signed by the current manager (9 if you count Griffiths being re-signed by way of extending a loan). On this basis do you trust him to bring in better footballers ? Not a loaded question just curious.

blackpoolhibs
27-01-2013, 06:24 PM
Fair points well made, however 8 of the team were signed by the current manager (9 if you count Griffiths being re-signed by way of extending a loan). On this basis do you trust him to bring in better footballers ? Not a loaded question just curious.

I do, he's brought in players that have progressed us from relegation candidates to top 6. It might mean one or two of his signings will leave at the end of this season,Kuqi definetly, Kujabi too, Claros maybe, Deegan maybe and different types brought in to progress us on again?

Northernhibee
27-01-2013, 06:30 PM
Fair points well made, however 8 of the team were signed by the current manager (9 if you count Griffiths being re-signed by way of extending a loan). On this basis do you trust him to bring in better footballers ? Not a loaded question just curious.

I trust him, the more quality players you have in a team the easier it is to attract further quality players. Nobody wants to sign to a team where they'll be made to look **** by the likes we've had in recent years.

lyonhibs
27-01-2013, 06:32 PM
Fair points well made, however 8 of the team were signed by the current manager (9 if you count Griffiths being re-signed by way of extending a loan). On this basis do you trust him to bring in better footballers ? Not a loaded question just curious.

I hasten to add, I very firmly believe that this IS Fenlon's team, and no more of this "he really needs next summer before we can judge him" pish. I just think Fenlon has looked at the squad he had at the end of last season and gone "FFS, what is a) most lacking (everything) and b) most crucial to improving next season"

Defence, a goalkeeper and the overall attitude of the squad were clearly top of his list.

These days in football, you can only do so much in 1 summer when a complete overhaul is required. Pace and creativity from midfield are crucial if we are to play a game that is a better balance between "stodgy and difficult to beat", which is what we have now, and "Brazil 1970" which is what a few on here think we should be getting treated to.

The truth will hopefully be somewhere in the middle, and I'm sure that's what we will start to see more of if and when these new midfielder(s) come in this month or in the summer.

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 06:34 PM
I trust him, the more quality players you have in a team the easier it is to attract further quality players. Nobody wants to sign to a team where they'll be made to look **** by the likes we've had in recent years.

Garbage. Moolah is the major consideration.

blackpoolhibs
27-01-2013, 06:43 PM
Garbage. Moolah is the major consideration.

Not as simple as that, if we offered 1k a week last season and Dundee Utd offered the same, why would anyone come to a struggling club like we were, when they could sign for a club like them or Motherwell when they are fighting for champions league football or Europe?

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 06:44 PM
Not as simple as that, if we offered 1k a week last season and Dundee Utd offered the same, why would anyone come to a struggling club like we were, when they could sign for a club like them or Motherwell when they are fighting for champions league football or Europe?

The subject was quality players.

blackpoolhibs
27-01-2013, 06:46 PM
The subject was quality players.

Do those clubs not have any, ones we'd have at easter road in a minute? :confused:

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 06:56 PM
Do those clubs not have any, ones we'd have at easter road in a minute? :confused:

So let me get this straight. A player is moving clubs, checks Wiki to see the various merits of the players on the staff and decides to go there before making any decision regarding the financial aspect of the deal.:faf:

lyonhibs
27-01-2013, 07:02 PM
Not as simple as that, if we offered 1k a week last season and Dundee Utd offered the same, why would anyone come to a struggling club like we were, when they could sign for a club like them or Motherwell when they are fighting for champions league football or Europe?


So let me get this straight. A player is moving clubs, checks Wiki to see the various merits of the players on the staff and decides to go there before making any decision regarding the financial aspect of the deal.:faf:

I think what BH was saying, albeit in a very furtive, hard to understand way, was that if the financial aspect of any given deal offered to player A by Hibs and, say, Motherwell or Dundee United, was the same then there's a good chance that player A would have gone to Dundee United or Motherwell.

People like to think that players get as dewy eyed as we do about the Famous 5, Turnbull's Tornadoes, our great European exploits back in the day etc etc, and thus "should" choose us over "smaller" teams offering similar money.

This is, patently, baws. League table and the ££££ on offer are what count these days. We are now much better placed - quite literally looking at the league table - to attract players of the type of quality we'd like to see as supporters. Fenlon - rightly IMO - focused most of his summer window budget on defensive players with a bit of bite and grit.

Malthibby
27-01-2013, 07:06 PM
Dunno what's wrong with gin soaked memories of the 70's, I like them.
GG

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 07:10 PM
I think what BH was saying, albeit in a very furtive, hard to understand way, was that if the financial aspect of any given deal offered to player A by Hibs and, say, Motherwell or Dundee United, was the same then there's a good chance that player A would have gone to Dundee United or Motherwell.

I realise the point that was being made but in these situations people use ridiculous hypotheticals to help make their points. Very few, if any deals are a like-for-like salary issue and the player just has to decide which is the better club, playing style or area to live for him. Just look across the city and see why players set up camp there. Zaliukaus,Kingston, Skacel anyone ?

Iggy Pope
27-01-2013, 07:20 PM
I think all of the above are relatively valid (ish) topics of debate, but I think a more underlying fundamental problem plagues this squad, that being that a lot of the players - whilst being decent professionals etc - just aren't very good at football. By "football" I mean, maintaining possession and creating chances through the seemingly lost art of penetrative passing to your own team.

We have players who can finish chances, prevent chances, make headers, block shots etc etc, but we have no-one with the ability to get their foot on the ball and play a defence splitting (or even troubling) pass on the deck with any regularity.

Until that is resolved, then - being as Fenlon has - IMO - got his priorities right by making us hard to beat before trying to play "The Hibs Way" - I think we can expect more fairly aesthetically grim football matches.

Contrary to the popular romantic belief of gin soaked memories from the early 70's, we don't have a divine right to swashbuckling sexy football. With the current squad - Wotherspoon (today) and Kuqi (pretty much every time I've seen him play) apart - we get effort and commitment pretty much week in, week out, which is night and day vs last season.

Hopefully, Craig, Robertson and/or Wylde (although 2 of those remain paper talk) will bring us the speed and creativity. I think we've got a goalkeeper, a defence, the defensive side of midfield and a finisher pretty much covered. Last season, we had effectively none of these.

Progress has been made, but there's plenty more to make in the attacking/creating sense. I'm sure Fenlon knows this.

A trip to Hampden and a top 6 (top 4 if I'm being greedy) finish this season would be extraordinary considering what our "starting point" was after the end of last season.

Amazed that we are so far up ourselves as Hibbies, that we have amongst us, those who think that these players we have at ER right now are somehow, 'not very good' at football.
:faf:
All pro players who have either worked their way up at one of the oldest and established senior sides that the country has to offer, or having plied their trade at other well respected sides.

But not very good at football.

Should have been playing with the lassies at playtime the lot of them.

Kuqi has seen better days no doubt, but is capped and has made a lot of appearances at a level higher than the one he is at now. Him and his team mate Wotherspoon would lose you in caps and medals along with 100% of the tactical experts posting here.

The bit in bold - we have a side that are not very good at football, but it sounds like we might only need one player and we will be barry! That right?

lyonhibs
27-01-2013, 07:29 PM
I think all of the above are relatively valid (ish) topics of debate, but I think a more underlying fundamental problem plagues this squad, that being that a lot of the players - whilst being decent professionals etc - just aren't very good at football. By "football" I mean, maintaining possession and creating chances through the seemingly lost art of penetrative passing to your own team.

We have players who can finish chances, prevent chances, make headers, block shots etc etc, but we have no-one with the ability to get their foot on the ball and play a defence splitting (or even troubling) pass on the deck with any regularity.

Until that is resolved, then - being as Fenlon has - IMO - got his priorities right by making us hard to beat before trying to play "The Hibs Way" - I think we can expect more fairly aesthetically grim football matches.

Contrary to the popular romantic belief of gin soaked memories from the early 70's, we don't have a divine right to swashbuckling sexy football. With the current squad - Wotherspoon (today) and Kuqi (pretty much every time I've seen him play) apart - we get effort and commitment pretty much week in, week out, which is night and day vs last season.

Hopefully, Craig, Robertson and/or Wylde (although 2 of those remain paper talk) will bring us the speed and creativity. I think we've got a goalkeeper, a defence, the defensive side of midfield and a finisher pretty much covered. Last season, we had effectively none of these.

Progress has been made, but there's plenty more to make in the attacking/creating sense. I'm sure Fenlon knows this.

A trip to Hampden and a top 6 (top 4 if I'm being greedy) finish this season would be extraordinary considering what our "starting point" was after the end of last season.


Amazed that we are so far up ourselves as Hibbies, that we have amongst us, those who think that these players we have at ER right now are somehow, 'not very good' at football.
:faf:
All pro players who have either worked their way up at one of the oldest and established senior sides that the country has to offer, or having plied their trade at other well respected sides.

But not very good at football.

Should have been playing with the lassies at playtime the lot of them.

Kuqi has seen better days no doubt, but is capped and has made a lot of appearances at a level higher than the one he is at now. Him and his team mate Wotherspoon would lose you in caps and medals along with 100% of the tactical experts posting here.

The bit in bold - we have a side that are not very good at football, but it sounds like we might only need one player and we will be barry! That right?

Did you read the highlighted part of the OP?

Our defence and defensive midfielders are good at what they do, but they aren't the players to get this side "playing football" as I understand the phrase. Unless you see creative attributes in McPake, Hanlon, Taiwo et al that I - and almost everyone else - seems to be missing.

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 07:29 PM
Amazed that we are so far up ourselves as Hibbies, that we have amongst us, those who think that these players we have at ER right now are somehow, 'not very good' at football.
:faf:
All pro players who have either worked their way up at one of the oldest and established senior sides that the country has to offer, or having plied their trade at other well respected sides.

But not very good at football.

Should have been playing with the lassies at playtime the lot of them.

Kuqi has seen better days no doubt, but is capped and has made a lot of appearances at a level higher than the one he is at now. Him and his team mate Wotherspoon would lose you in caps and medals along with 100% of the tactical experts posting here.

The bit in bold - we have a side that are not very good at football, but it sounds like we might only need one player and we will be barry! That right?

So by that token, regardless of current ability, which we should be judging players by, Lawrie Reilly would never have needed to retire and criteria needed to play would be to be better than the fans.

Terrific logic there.:crazy:

Just Alf
27-01-2013, 07:41 PM
Whilst understanding the sentiment, I do feel a wee bit sorry for Kookie! He was standing in front of an open goal early in the season and (I can't remember!) "whoever" had run in on the left had the goalie and the only defender in front of them and instead of popping the ball sideways he Tried a shot which the goalie pushed wide.... We might have a (slightly) different view if he had a goal against his name :-)


Mind you everything else said about him is probably bang on ( including the value he adds to the young ladies in training)

Iggy Pope
27-01-2013, 07:42 PM
So by that token, regardless of current ability, which we should be judging players by, Lawrie Reilly would never have needed to retire and criteria needed to play would be to be better than the fans.

Terrific logic there.:crazy:

If logic is coming into play why cite a man that retired over five decades ago?
:crazy:

You think we employ players who are 'not very good at football' as well as the OP?
:crazy:

By and large the criteria must be to be 'better than the fans'. That's why they eke out a living from us. Otherwise we could just cobble a side together and give them a take-on. Maybe a 10-21 in the backies.

Just Alf
27-01-2013, 07:42 PM
Laddies!


Bloody spel chequers !

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 07:51 PM
If logic is coming into play why cite a man that retired over five decades ago?
:crazy:

You think we employ players who are 'not very good at football' as well as the OP?
:crazy:

By and large the criteria must be to be 'better than the fans'. That's why they eke out a living from us. Otherwise we could just cobble a side together and give them a take-on. Maybe a 10-21 in the backies.

1. Well he played at a higher standard than Kuqi.

2. Relative to the standard of a decent pro footballer ? Yes.

3. Plenty junior players are better than the fans maybe we should get them in the team!

:faf:

Iggy Pope
27-01-2013, 07:59 PM
1. Well he played at a higher standard than Kuqi.

2. Relative to the standard of a decent pro footballer ? Yes.

3. Plenty junior players are better than the fans maybe we should get them in the team!

:faf:

See, I thought the debate was about the current squad, not the past, this is why I questioned your, er, logic.

Points two and three? Cannot find a smiley daft enough to equal that pish. You've lost it. Must be your G****e location.

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 08:02 PM
See, I thought the debate was about the current squad, not the past, this is why I questioned your, er, logic.

Points two and three? Cannot find a smiley daft enough to equal that pish. You've lost it. Must be your G****e location.

You should maybe google logic as you think Kuqi was worthy of his place by virtue that he is "capped and has made a lot of appearances at a level higher than the one he is at now".

Iggy Pope
27-01-2013, 08:07 PM
You should maybe google logic as you think Kuqi was worthy of his place by virtue that he is "capped and has made a lot of appearances at a level higher than the one he is at now".

Listen now. My only question was whether he was any 'good at football'. And he would run rings around you, I know this. Now bugger off back to Luckies.

Treadstone
27-01-2013, 08:12 PM
Listen now. My only question was whether he was any 'good at football'. And he would run rings around you, I know this. Now bugger off back to Luckies.

So for that reason he gets in the team ? I know you're stuck in '77 but football has evolved and can't really see the get it in the mixer for the big man mentality coming back for sides who genuinely want to be successful.

Oh I see I stay in Gorgie so I must go to Luckies.

hibby72
27-01-2013, 09:09 PM
HOW DID KUQI PLAY TODAY??? feel sorry for the big man:flag::confused:

PJ IronHIbee
27-01-2013, 09:13 PM
HOW DID KUQI PLAY TODAY??? feel sorry for the big man:flag::confused:
Unfortunately he didn't - he was not the only one though!

SkintHibby
27-01-2013, 09:13 PM
HOW DID KUQI PLAY TODAY??? feel sorry for the big man:flag::confused:

lol

blaikie
27-01-2013, 09:14 PM
Held the ball up well for about 20 seconds ..... Needs emptied ASAP.

SaulGoodman
27-01-2013, 09:15 PM
What was the score today?

There's your answer.

Vault Boy
27-01-2013, 09:15 PM
Tried to put himself about but was pretty non existent. Put a good ball in to Sparky early in the second half, but in fairness to him he didn't get enough of the right service. Hibs were poor at getting the ball forward today, Kuqi got caught in that. I don't think Doyle did much more when he came on to be honest.

Dinkydoo
27-01-2013, 09:22 PM
Garbage. Moolah is the major consideration.

What about Jim Goodwin last season?

Sure I read somewhere that amongst all the claims of the 'loyalty' he was wanting to show St Mirren that he wasn't keen on joining a club that might not have been playing in the SPL the following season. Which of course was a byproduct of us having **** players.

In addition to this I watched an interview with James McPake on Alba during the showing of the Dundee game. He talked about signing a new contract and talking over with Fenlon what his vision for the club was, and he said "there was no way I was going to come back to be involved in another relegation battle."

All these things are interrelated and will influence a players decision once way or another.

Alfred E Newman
27-01-2013, 09:23 PM
He was hopeless though Messi would have toiled in front of that midfield.

Wotherspiniesta
27-01-2013, 09:31 PM
Kuqi was absolutely horrific. As expected.

Get a more mobile frontman in and get this huddy off the books pronto.

Dr Jimmy
27-01-2013, 10:56 PM
Kuqi was absolutely horrific. As expected.

Get a more mobile frontman in and get this huddy off the books pronto.

More mobile front man? You could put a strip on a settee. Leave it in the centre circle and it would be a more mobile frontman!

blackpoolhibs
27-01-2013, 11:07 PM
I realise the point that was being made but in these situations people use ridiculous hypotheticals to help make their points. Very few, if any deals are a like-for-like salary issue and the player just has to decide which is the better club, playing style or area to live for him. Just look across the city and see why players set up camp there. Zaliukaus,Kingston, Skacel anyone ?

Of course they went there for the money, jeez. Look i will make it simple, player A is wanted by Leeds United, they offer him £15k a week. He's also wanted by Wigan at £15k a week, a much smaller club but doing so much better just now than Leeds. Wigan get their man 9 times out of 10.

The same thing happens even in Scotland. :rolleyes:

Forza Fred
27-01-2013, 11:18 PM
Held the ball up well for about 20 seconds ..... Needs emptied ASAP.

My viewing was that he did not so much hold the ball up, but merely used his chest on numerous occasions to try and propel the ball to a another player.

Usually it ws an Aberdeen player who was the beneficiary, as teh ball bounced off hsi chest in teh driection obviously he was facing at the time..

I simply dont see what he hás to offer, and he would not have got a game for 70's side Carlton HIbs on this form.

Hibee Ryan
28-01-2013, 12:17 AM
My viewing was that he did not so much hold the ball up, but merely used his chest on numerous occasions to try and propel the ball to a another player.

Usually it ws an Aberdeen player who was the beneficiary, as teh ball bounced off hsi chest in teh driection obviously he was facing at the time..

I simply dont see what he hás to offer, and he would not have got a game for 70's side Carlton HIbs on this form.

THIS.

Kuqi was winning the ball but he didn't care where it was going. He was just letting it hit him and it was just down to luck if it went to a hibs player. He was a very good player but sadly for us he is past it now and has lost his touch. Time for retirement big man

LeighLoyal
28-01-2013, 12:18 AM
Fenlon should give up his salary until Kuqi is off the books, total mystery why he signed such an obvious donkey. Who did he sound out on that one? Even Calderwood wouldn't have signed such a stick.

Hibee Ryan
28-01-2013, 12:22 AM
Fenlon should give up his salary until Kuqi is off the books, total mystery why he signed such an obvious donkey. Who did he sound out on that one? Even Calderwood wouldn't have signed such a stick.

I think it was a panic buy. Fenlon knew we needed another striker for back up and obviously kuqi played at quite a high level and even last season scored a few goals so signed him without much thought but I don't think anyone saw him being this bad

Forza Fred
28-01-2013, 02:31 AM
I think it was a panic buy. Fenlon knew we needed another striker for back up and obviously kuqi played at quite a high level and even last season scored a few goals so signed him without much thought but I don't think anyone saw him being this bad

In all fairness it is always a bit of a gamble when a manger signs a player

Every manager has signed the odd dud.

Alex Ferguson once signed Ralph Milne for Man United..so Fenlon shouldnt be drawn and quartered for this one - most o'f his others have been ok.

EdinMike
28-01-2013, 03:42 AM
I think I'de show more commitment and passion than Kuqi did today. And I could probably win a header as well. And I could finish better than him too !!

I play Right Back...

JohnStephens91
28-01-2013, 08:13 AM
I actually thought Kuqi had a decent game. Don't know where all the people are coming from by saying he was pish :confused:

marinello59
28-01-2013, 08:19 AM
I actually thought Kuqi had a decent game. Don't know where all the people are coming from by saying he was pish :confused:

He used his bulk brilliantly to shepherd the ball out for a corner. Apart from that he was very poor. It's a shame, I really wanted him to do well on his first league start. I thought he changed things for the better when he came on at Dingwall for Doyle but yesterday just didn't work out for him.

JohnStephens91
28-01-2013, 08:32 AM
He used his bulk brilliantly to shepherd the ball out for a corner. Apart from that he was very poor. It's a shame, I really wanted him to do well on his first league start. I thought he changed things for the better when he came on at Dingwall for Doyle but yesterday just didn't work out for him.

He won a good few headers and played an excellent pass to Griffiths too. He showed that he still has the ability to perform which is the important thing, I'd like to see him start against the physical Ross County defence and rough up their new Canadian defender.

jacomo
28-01-2013, 11:30 AM
The OP makes a good point :agree:

Even in his prime Kuqi was not a touch player but recognised as an effective battering ram. Sadly he seems very far from his prime now.

We don't have many players with decent touch and technique - maybe Claros at best? Compare this to when we had Boozy, Murphy etc - players who could control the ball with one touch and find a team mate with the next. I don't know a great deal about Robertson but he's hardly been touted as a playmaker.

I dont blame PF for this - he had a thousand problems to fix and I think he's got his priorities about right. But I would love us to sign someone with genuine quality and composure.

Hamish
28-01-2013, 11:46 AM
The OP makes a good point :agree:

Even in his prime Kuqi was not a touch player but recognised as an effective battering ram. Sadly he seems very far from his prime now.

We don't have many players with decent touch and technique - maybe Claros at best? Compare this to when we had Boozy, Murphy etc - players who could control the ball with one touch and find a team mate with the next. I don't know a great deal about Robertson but he's hardly been touted as a playmaker.

I dont blame PF for this - he had a thousand problems to fix and I think he's got his priorities about right. But I would love us to sign someone with genuine quality and composure.

Exactly, he's trying to make us hard to beat and this is proving fairly successful.

I would also love him to sign someone in the mould of your last sentence, but any player with these qualities probably won't have Hibernian as his first choice of clubs.

MB62
28-01-2013, 12:15 PM
The OP makes a good point :agree:

Even in his prime Kuqi was not a touch player but recognised as an effective battering ram. Sadly he seems very far from his prime now.
We don't have many players with decent touch and technique - maybe Claros at best? Compare this to when we had Boozy, Murphy etc - players who could control the ball with one touch and find a team mate with the next. I don't know a great deal about Robertson but he's hardly been touted as a playmaker.

I dont blame PF for this - he had a thousand problems to fix and I think he's got his priorities about right. But I would love us to sign someone with genuine quality and composure.

Which is why we need to sign another striker as Doyle is not good enough either. However, our strikers are always going to be toiling as the service they receive is terrible and mostly with their back to goal as we have nobody who can get down the wings and put crosses in, something Kuqi might benefit from.
Hopefully Wilde will sign and the striker problem will be next on the agenda for Pat during the summer.
One piece of the jigsaw at a time maybe.

blaikie
28-01-2013, 01:22 PM
My viewing was that he did not so much hold the ball up, but merely used his chest on numerous occasions to try and propel the ball to a another player.

Usually it ws an Aberdeen player who was the beneficiary, as teh ball bounced off hsi chest in teh driection obviously he was facing at the time..

I simply dont see what he hás to offer, and he would not have got a game for 70's side Carlton HIbs on this form.
Looked a decent signing on paper, but he needs to go elsewhere or hang up his boots and take a coaching role if he's good with the younger players. On a positive note about yesterday was Handling's through ball to Griffiths near the end. I would start with Handling if Doyle isn't fit.

Treadstone
28-01-2013, 01:54 PM
Of course they went there for the money, jeez. Look i will make it simple, player A is wanted by Leeds United, they offer him £15k a week. He's also wanted by Wigan at £15k a week, a much smaller club but doing so much better just now than Leeds. Wigan get their man 9 times out of 10.

The same thing happens even in Scotland. :rolleyes:

I'll keep it simple for you read my post instead of just commenting on it.

The scenario you use to justify your point is fantasy and you know it, it was effectively made redundant by the abolishing of the maximum wage in 1961. Players and agents use interest of competing clubs as bargaining tools to increase salary and/or signing on fees against each other.

To suggest players get exactly the same offer is laughable and quite frankly absurd. Here is a link for further reading:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jan/18/qpr-loic-remy

Do you think he went there for the 'project' ?

blackpoolhibs
28-01-2013, 02:13 PM
nonsense, players in Scotland do not get hugely different wages from each other in the SPL unless its Celtic or heart's. and if I'm a player who is offered roughly the same wage by 2 clubs I'd go to the one doing the best, not one continually in a relegation fight.

Treadstone
28-01-2013, 02:18 PM
You believe what you want to and I will believe what I want to.

JimBHibees
28-01-2013, 02:19 PM
nonsense, players in Scotland do not get hugely different wages from each other in the SPL unless its Celtic or heart's. and if I'm a player who is offered roughly the same wage by 2 clubs I'd go to the one doing the best, not one continually in a relegation fight.

Agree also more chance of getting win bonuses in better team.

SMAXXA
28-01-2013, 02:35 PM
He won a good few headers and played an excellent pass to Griffiths too. He showed that he still has the ability to perform which is the important thing, I'd like to see him start against the physical Ross County defence and rough up their new Canadian defender.

I agree, his physical presence would give them something to deal with, however we could try playing through them and playing more football, mind saying that they coped well with that at ER last time.

Would like to see Doyle come in for Wotherspoon, he was honking yesterday aswell

jacomo
28-01-2013, 05:34 PM
Exactly, he's trying to make us hard to beat and this is proving fairly successful.

I would also love him to sign someone in the mould of your last sentence, but any player with these qualities probably won't have Hibernian as his first choice of clubs.

This is to do with footballing culture as much as money, though. I bet there are Eastern European clubs on a fraction of our budget who could pass us off the park.

Ok, Scottish weather hardly helps pretty football either but once PF has hard-wired a more professional, hard-working ethos (no small feat, given how far we had fallen) I hope we actively target players with good technical ability. I also hope our academy does the same.

blackpoolhibs
28-01-2013, 08:09 PM
You believe what you want to and I will believe what I want to.

I bet you also believe in the tooth fairy?