Pace and urgency to get forward

[JCHibby]

Two things that need addressed, think we have solid enough squad now where we know what we are getting most weeks, someone with electric pace will certainly help take us forward.

Thought Deegan had a very good game today.

[ancient hibee]

Like 2 goal Ivan Sproule you mean?

[matty_f]

We are soooo slow getting forward to support. We kept playing the ball out wide but never really got players into the box to get on the end of crosses.


We took the game to Dundee at the start of the second half and looked good for a while. Quite why we never played with that urgency the rest of the match, I don't know.

[LeighLoyal]

Should get the boy Humphrey from M'Well.

[leithsansiro]

Should get the boy Humphrey from M'Well.

He would be good for us, but I would think that he's looking to move up from the SPL. Liam Craig isn't going to give us much pace when he arrives in the summer, and I'd agree it's something we badly lack now.

[JollyGreenGiant]

The thing is the whole team started so slowly this afternoon, and we definitely can't keep giving teams a goal of a start. You look to the bench for some inspiration, but nothing - definitely need to sign more flair players now that we are more solid at the back.

[Comiston Hibee]

we are desperately short
those around me in the east were in agreement that we had nothing on the bench to change the game

we may not have a pat mcginley type box to box player but i get the impression that they must be drilled to hold and not support; too many times today we had 1 in support of Griffiths and Doyle, but by the time the 1 had got up to support the front 2 they had 5 or 6 back

[Jonnyboy]

Two things that need addressed, think we have solid enough squad now where we know what we are getting most weeks, someone with electric pace will certainly help take us forward.

Thought Deegan had a very good game today.

Deegan was slow and caught in possession too often :greengrin Apart fae that he wisnae bad

[Dinkydoo]

I think we missed Cairney's creativity down the left today (though I thought McGivern did well getting forward). I would quite like to see Handling or Caldwell start instead of Doyle up front, Doyle has good movement and ball control but he's never a striker at this level IMO. I'd much rather see him on the left, Cairney in the middle with Deegan and one of the young ones up front with Leigh.

Wotherspoon had another good game today which included a lovely piece of skill; looks like he's playing with confidence.

[HibeeN]

I would quite like to see Handling or Caldwell start instead of Doyle up front, Doyle has good movement and ball control but he's never a striker at this level IMO. I'd much rather see him on the left, Cairney in the middle with Deegan and one of the young ones up front with Leigh.

Do his 8 goals so far this season not suggest otherwise? :dunno: I thought his form at the start of the season was excellent - it's true that he has gone off the boil in the past few weeks but so have others - Cairney and Griffiths haven't maintained their earlier level of performances either. Something is not quite clicking with the team as a whole - it might be that our game-plan from earlier in the season has been "found out" and we don't have an alternative way to create chances.

It might be good for Doyle to face some competition for his place by throwing in Caldwell or Handling to see if they can take their chance, but I wouldn't write him off completely as a striker - he's an intelligent player and capable of scoring goals.

[NAE NOOKIE]

FFS ...... !!!

How often does it need to be said ...... we have 3 midfield players who NEVER run past the man with the ball.

Thats why we continue to play the ball back the way or across the park ... if the man in posession only has Griffiths and Doyle in front of him the opposition back 4 know exactly what to do. If just one player could make a forward run to put pressure on the back 4 it would free up the front 2 to make runs or get into good positions.

The coaches at ER need to get a grip ..... do they know what they are doing? I am really beginning to wonder.

Game after game after game its the same.

If anybody wants to disagree check out our midfields apalling scoring record and get back to me.

[Dinkydoo]

Do his 8 goals so far this season not suggest otherwise? :dunno: I thought his form at the start of the season was excellent - it's true that he has gone off the boil in the past few weeks but so have others - Cairney and Griffiths haven't maintained their earlier level of performances either. Something is not quite clicking with the team as a whole - it might be that our game-plan from earlier in the season has been "found out" and we don't have an alternative way to create chances.

It might be good for Doyle to face some competition for his place by throwing in Caldwell or Handling to see if they can take their chance, but I wouldn't write him off completely as a striker - he's an intelligent player and capable of scoring goals.

Don't get me wrong, I rate Doyle as a good attacking player for SPL level, but his attempts today pretty much confirmed what I've been thinking for a while, that he's not an 'out and out' striker. He'll have the odd game where he puts away good but difficult chances but in the main, his purpose seems to be to create space for other players like Griffiths and Wotherspoon - and I feel he could probably do that just as well from the left, whilst leaving space for Handling or Caldwell to play up front with Leigh.

For what it's worth (which maybe supports your point about the team not clicking), I think that we have also missed McPake's leadership qualities from the beginning of this, and the end of last season - he seems like a different player; not as solid at the back and not trying to drive us forward at every opportunity.

[AFKA5814_Hibs]

we are desperately short
those around me in the east were in agreement that we had nothing on the bench to change the game

This was something my mate and i said in the pub before the game when we seen todays bench from the twitter feed. We needed the 11 starting players to win the game cause there was nobody on the bench who would make a difference.

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

I was dissapointed in Doyle today. Seemed to almost hold the play up and his first instinct seemed to be to play the ball back. Nothing wrong with playing with your back to goal, but inside the box, not on the halfway line.

[lucky]

FFS ...... !!!

How often does it need to be said ...... we have 3 midfield players who NEVER run past the man with the ball.

Thats why we continue to play the ball back the way or across the park ... if the man in posession only has Griffiths and Doyle in front of him the opposition back 4 know exactly what to do. If just one player could make a forward run to put pressure on the back 4 it would free up the front 2 to make runs or get into good positions.

The coaches at ER need to get a grip ..... do they know what they are doing? I am really beginning to wonder.

Game after game after game its the same.

If anybody wants to disagree check out our midfields apalling scoring record and get back to me.

Got to agree. Problem lies with too many same type of midfielder who refuse to make a attacking run. I can't recall any of our midfielders having a shot at goal yesterday

[neil7908]

FFS ...... !!!

How often does it need to be said ...... we have 3 midfield players who NEVER run past the man with the ball.

Thats why we continue to play the ball back the way or across the park ... if the man in posession only has Griffiths and Doyle in front of him the opposition back 4 know exactly what to do. If just one player could make a forward run to put pressure on the back 4 it would free up the front 2 to make runs or get into good positions.

The coaches at ER need to get a grip ..... do they know what they are doing? I am really beginning to wonder.

Game after game after game its the same.

If anybody wants to disagree check out our midfields apalling scoring record and get back to me.

Totally agree with the first part I've highlighted - Stevenson, Claros, Taiwo and Deegan will be lucky to contribute a couple of goals between them this season and offer nothing in the final third. This needs to be addressed if we are to kick on as a team.

However, I think Fenlon realises this. We've already secured Craig who will definitely provide more of a threat going forward and players we are being linked with (however true all the rumours are) like Erskine and Santos all seem to be attacked minded midfielders so I think Pat knows where the problem lies but with budget constraints its tough for him to bring anyone in now.

Lets be honest, Claros will either go now or in the summer as we cant afford to sign him. With Kuqi, Galbraith and Kujabi all surely out the door in the summer that will free up wages (there may be other departures, for good or bad). If we can bring in another attacking midfielder, a winger and another forward I think we'll see a different and much improved side next year.

[fit o' the walk]

Fenlon says in todays papers "We didn't start with any tempo" ..pretty hard to do that when the whole team is one paced,desp.need a fast,direct winger and a midfielder with skill who can drive FORWARD,surely Pat can see this too..or can he ?

[neil7908]

Fenlon says in todays papers "We didn't start with any tempo" ..pretty hard to do that when the whole team is one paced,desp.need a fast,direct winger and a midfielder with skill who can drive FORWARD,surely Pat can see this too..or can he ?

I think he can. Already signed Liam Craig who will definitelty provide a decent threat going forward - he has scored about a goal every 5.5 games for the Saint so the guy is proven SPL quality. If you look at who we are being linked with - Erskine, Santos etc then I think you can see Pat knows where the problem lies.

As every Hibee demanded, the board made signing up Griffiths and McGiven a priority. Nows thats done, where's the money going to come from for further additions in January? We cant pay tranfers fees, Fenlons made that clear so how will we sign anyone this month?

Games like the Ross County defeat and yesterday are frustrating but I would be genuinely worried if Pat was coming out with post match comments trying to play up poor performances like Levein did with Scotland or blaming the ref, claiming we were unlucky etc etc. But he's not, from all I've read he's admitted when we were poor and I'm sure if he could we would see Kuaji, Galbraith and Kuqi all shown the door now and others brought in it would be happening.

I think that will have to wait for summer unfortunately. I really think we will see a true Fenlon team next season and I'm hopeful we will be a must better unit than we are now.

[Tyler Durden]

Two things that need addressed, think we have solid enough squad now where we know what we are getting most weeks, someone with electric pace will certainly help take us forward.

Thought Deegan had a very good game today.

Agree that we showed no urgency but for me, Deegan is one of the worst culprits for this. He slows the game down at every turn. At times Hanlon or McPake were on the ball and ready to move forward, Deegan is determined to drop back and take possession. Simply allows the opposition to regroup and slows the game down. He should be finding space further forward.

Not to mention his passing was woeful.

As has been pointed out however, the fact we have so many central midfielders in the same mould doesn't help.

As for people saying we had nothing on the bench to change the game - how can we be sure of this when Fenlon never gives any of them a chance until 80-85 minute mark. Would the lad Harris have been any worse than the midfield who started?

Or as we're playing so many long balls anyway, why not throw on Kuqi and let Doyle and Griffiths run off him. It was so poor that any type of change was worth a shot. Maybe no Kuqi but.....

[blackpoolhibs]

Of course we lack pace in the midfield, we dont have anyone at the club with any? Pat will remedy this in the next few windows, but as usual we want everything now.

We have the luxury now of searching out the right players, relegation is not an issue now and there is not a lot wrong with our team that a couple of astute signings wont fix.

With the right players brought in for a couple of positions, we'd go from being ponderous to dangerous, and have more creativity from midfield. Two wide players coming in better than what we have, also releases Cairney to play more central.

Then we look to have a stronger bench too, patience folks, a little more patience.

[Tyler Durden]

Of course we lack pace in the midfield, we dont have anyone at the club with any? Pat will remedy this in the next few windows, but as usual we want everything now.

We have the luxury now of searching out the right players, relegation is not an issue now and there is not a lot wrong with our team that a couple of astute signings wont fix.

With the right players brought in for a couple of positions, we'd go from being ponderous to dangerous, and have more creativity from midfield. Two wide players coming in better than what we have, also releases Cairney to play more central.

Then we look to have a stronger bench too, patience folks, a little more patience.

Far too sensible post!

[blackpoolhibs]

Far too sensible post!

Probably a first for me? :greengrin

[Ozyhibby]

I'm beginning to think that maybe letting Claros go will free up a wage to bring in an attacking midfielder. In an ideal world he would stay but if finance is an issue then sacrifices have to be made. Deegan and Toawie are both very similar players to Claros. We someone who runs at the other team and creates and take chances.

[number9dream]

I'm old enough to remember a sprint coach being brought in to sharpen up Gordon Durie. Worked out alright for him...
Deegan looks like he's trotting through quicksand.
Could our players be fitter? Stan Warwinka went toe-to-toe with Djokovic for five hours. And Djoko will be at it again in a couple of days.
Agree with those saying Handling should have been on earlier and what about the kid Harris - is he ready for the first team? Is he quick?

[sahib]

Deegan is just the type of player everybody on here seemed to be wanting - tough ball-winning midfielder. He played a few bad passes, usually when he was trying to get the ball forward, but overall I would have him in the team every week. Claros might be played further up the pitch but he puts in some great defensive work.
I thought we had one or two nice passing moves yesterday and far from being the worst display in recent seasons.

[Andy74]

Deegan is just the type of player everybody on here seemed to be wanting - tough ball-winning midfielder. He played a few bad passes, usually when he was trying to get the ball forward, but overall I would have him in the team every week. Claros might be played further up the pitch but he puts in some great defensive work.
I thought we had one or two nice passing moves, yesterday and far from being the worst display in recent seasons.

Some don't know what we have in Deegan I think.

[Broken Gnome]

Some don't know what we have in Deegan I think.

Someone who would look a lot better with a different type of player beside him.

Don't think anyone underestimates the importance of his role generally, but even though much of the problem is what's around him, some of his contributions have been greatly overstated.

[blackpoolhibs]

Some don't know what we have in Deegan I think.

If only we had a quick direct winger to compliment him, someone like Alan O'Brien maybe? :wink:

[Green Fish]

Two things that need addressed, think we have solid enough squad now where we know what we are getting most weeks, someone with electric pace will certainly help take us forward.

Thought Deegan had a very good game today.

Was I at the same game, I thought Deegan was woeful today - which to be fair is unusual.

[inglisavhibs]

FFS ...... !!!

How often does it need to be said ...... we have 3 midfield players who NEVER run past the man with the ball.

Thats why we continue to play the ball back the way or across the park ... if the man in posession only has Griffiths and Doyle in front of him the opposition back 4 know exactly what to do. If just one player could make a forward run to put pressure on the back 4 it would free up the front 2 to make runs or get into good positions.

The coaches at ER need to get a grip ..... do they know what they are doing? I am really beginning to wonder.

Game after game after game its the same.

If anybody wants to disagree check out our midfields apalling scoring record and get back to me.

Spot on mate, and incredibly yesterday we replace Deegan with another player who will never score and can't make forward runs. Dundee were knackered and surely we could have brought on young Harris wide left to see if we could actually get behind Dundee. The current method of playing will drive more fans away.

[brog]

FFS ...... !!!

How often does it need to be said ...... we have 3 midfield players who NEVER run past the man with the ball.

Thats why we continue to play the ball back the way or across the park ... if the man in posession only has Griffiths and Doyle in front of him the opposition back 4 know exactly what to do. If just one player could make a forward run to put pressure on the back 4 it would free up the front 2 to make runs or get into good positions.

The coaches at ER need to get a grip ..... do they know what they are doing? I am really beginning to wonder.

Game after game after game its the same.

If anybody wants to disagree check out our midfields apalling scoring record and get back to me.

I agree pretty much with this but I thought Deegan was decent yesterday.. He did his defensive duties well & tried to get forward a lot. He's not a natural attacking player but his attitude is excellent & unlike Claros he was looking for the ball at every opportunity. I was however very exasperated by the tendency of so many of our players to automatically look backwards when at times there was a lot of space to run forward into. We also need to pass the ball in front of players, not to feet or behind which slows everything up.