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View Full Version : Do Hibs do enough to encourage New supporters to games?



gegs70
07-01-2013, 08:56 AM
Quite a number of weeks ago Hearts had visited my Sons School"while they were in the cup" with okayers and the Scottish cup. They gave away free tickets for a hearts game for the kids and their family. I was speaking to a few of the Dads and asked them why they hadnt gone to a Hibs game a lot said they had and it had been boring. Now I think it was a little to do with how we played over the last 2-3 seasons and the lack of atmisphere at the smaller games. So the question is do hibs do enough to encourage neutral supporters to come to games, ps cost of games was an issue mentioned when talking to other families.

ronaldo7
07-01-2013, 09:03 AM
If they're happy to take their family along to listen to 1000's of fans singing sectarian songs, and watch them abuse the opposition then so be it.

Hearts financial model is the one we must all copy:wink:

Prawn Sandwich
07-01-2013, 09:32 AM
Quite a number of weeks ago Hearts had visited my Sons School"while they were in the cup" with okayers and the Scottish cup. They gave away free tickets for a hearts game for the kids and their family. I was speaking to a few of the Dads and asked them why they hadnt gone to a Hibs game a lot said they had and it had been boring. Now I think it was a little to do with how we played over the last 2-3 seasons and the lack of atmisphere at the smaller games. So the question is do hibs do enough to encourage neutral supporters to come to games, ps cost of games was an issue mentioned when talking to other families.

No they don't do enough from Corporate support to walking up supporters. What are Motherwell doing right? They are run on a shoe string budget, they have had as many changes in Management as us and they have out performed Hibs for several seasons. We have a much bigger support base and located in the capital city with a larger population. Petrie is a very good accountant, but doesn't have a clue how to market and promote the club. It starts from the top and works down. Start with new signings having a clause in their contract about having to do a few hours a week or per month community work, like visiting schools, etc.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 09:48 AM
No they don't do enough from Corporate support to walking up supporters. What are Motherwell doing right? They are run on a shoe string budget, they have had as many changes in Management as us and they have out performed Hibs for several seasons. We have a much bigger support base and located in the capital city with a larger population. Petrie is a very good accountant, but doesn't have a clue how to market and promote the club. It starts from the top and works down. Start with new signings having a clause in their contract about having to do a few hours a week or per month community work, like visiting schools, etc.

Yep agree

Even helping Kids football clubs with training, going to PE classes, or even a kids youth football tournament?

Mikey
07-01-2013, 10:31 AM
Quite a number of weeks ago Hearts had visited my Sons School"while they were in the cup" with okayers and the Scottish cup. They gave away free tickets for a hearts game for the kids and their family. I was speaking to a few of the Dads and asked them why they hadnt gone to a Hibs game a lot said they had and it had been boring. Now I think it was a little to do with how we played over the last 2-3 seasons and the lack of atmisphere at the smaller games. So the question is do hibs do enough to encourage neutral supporters to come to games, ps cost of games was an issue mentioned when talking to other families.

Do supporters do enough for Hibs? Or is it a one way street?

Thecat23
07-01-2013, 10:35 AM
Do supporters do enough for Hibs? Or is it a one way street?

Some do some don't. I try to encourage fellow Hibs supporters to the games. Got a few back but others simply can't afford it. The board could look at other ideas regarding pricing next season and that may help. Would you agree?

Heedersnvolleys
07-01-2013, 10:38 AM
I don't think so, I am a "club member" and I have not had one piece of correspondence from the club email or otherwise since I signed up this time last year. I really was expecting something around the season ticket renewal date along the lines of "Why don't you upgrade to a full season ticket member etc......" Not a thing! Costs nothing to put a weekly/monthly email together for all registered members.

Chuck Rhoades
07-01-2013, 10:42 AM
Do supporters do enough for Hibs? Or is it a one way street?

Mikey, I usually agree with this type of post; however I would say our core support have done more than enough over the last three years, especially since 19 May 2012.

We have stuck by Hibs in our thousands and have actually increased our average attendance when everyone feared the worst.

What more can we do? This is about Hibs attracting new supporters. The ones who already actively support Hibs have done enough already IMO by simply sticking by their club in their thousands both home and away after three seasons of poor performance and an unacceptable SCF result.

On top of that, I believe our support is far more patient, vocal and supportive than previous seasons.

My question would be, what else can we do?

Thecat23
07-01-2013, 10:44 AM
Mikey, I usually agree with this type of post; however I would say our core support have done more than enough over the last three years, especially since 19 May 2012.

We have stuck by Hibs in our thousands and have actually increased our average attendance when everyone feared the worst.

What more can we do? This is about Hibs attracting new supporters. The ones who already actively support Hibs have done enough already IMO by simply sticking by their club in their thousands both home and away after three seasons of poor performance and an unacceptable SCF result.

On top of that, I believe our support is far more patient, vocal and supportive than previous seasons.

My question would be, what else can we do?

Pretty much agree with all this. Good post!

Mikey
07-01-2013, 10:45 AM
Some do some don't. I try to encourage fellow Hibs supporters to the games. Got a few back but others simply can't afford it. The board could look at other ideas regarding pricing next season and that may help. Would you agree?

Only if the players agree to take a pay cut, or the supporters are happy to have players of lower quality than we have now.

Other than that we need to maximise income. Letting people in for free (as per the example in the opening post) doesn't do that.

Mikey
07-01-2013, 10:46 AM
My question would be, what else can we do?

That's an easy one. Go to games.

Chuck Rhoades
07-01-2013, 10:48 AM
That's an easy one. Go to games.

But we already do? And we have increased our average attendance for this season compared to previous seasons. Our core support of what, 10-11k, have been doing this.

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 10:52 AM
My daughter also had Hearts players at her primary school last year, doing traditional 'community outreach' type work. They did some coaching and had a five a side game with the kids. It'd be good to see Hibs really take this kind of thing seriously on a consistent basis.

Mikey
07-01-2013, 10:52 AM
But we already do? And we have increased our average attendance for this season compared to previous seasons. Our core support of what, 10-11k, have been doing this.

We do. You and me. But you won't have to look too far on here to find folk who can afford to go but don't. Yet they're happy to come and and tell us how bad things are.

Again and again and again and again and again.

If they were to come out of their Hibs huff we'd be looking at 12-13k a game and that's a big difference financially.

GoldenEagle
07-01-2013, 10:55 AM
We do. You and me. But you won't have to look too far on here to find folk who can afford to go but don't. Yet they're happy to come and and tell us how bad things are.

Again and again and again and again and again.

If they were to come out of their Hibs huff we'd be looking at 12-13k a game and that's a big difference financially.

Just wait for the "If Petrie had shown some ambition and kept Leigh then I might have thought about attending more games" posts

Thecat23
07-01-2013, 10:58 AM
Only if the players agree to take a pay cut, or the supporters are happy to have players of lower quality than we have now.

Other than that we need to maximise income. Letting people in for free (as per the example in the opening post) doesn't do that.

Not so much letting folk in for free, I don't think Hibs should do that. But more dropping the price by at least £5. I think in doing so more fans would attend. That's just my opinion of course and i do realise the board must try and get as much as they can for the club. But there are other ways they could do things better like in every business I just hope they maybe look into these things.

blackpoolhibs
07-01-2013, 10:58 AM
Are we now saying that having a team who have been top of the league, and now sitting nicely in 4th place is not enough to get folk through the doors, they now need a personal visit to persuade them to come back?

What the **** next, do their washing up?

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 11:04 AM
Are we now saying that having a team who have been top of the league, and now sitting nicely in 4th place is not enough to get folk through the doors, they now need a personal visit to persuade them to come back?

What the **** next, do their washing up?

:greengrin

I see your point. I took the OP to mean 'new' supporters, not 'lapsed supporters who've turned their back on the club'. If we're talking about potential new supporters like school kids, the immigrant community in Edinburgh, or similar groups that have never been to Easter Road, I'd say No, the club isn't doing enough, and could do more.

Hiber-nation
07-01-2013, 11:08 AM
We do. You and me. But you won't have to look too far on here to find folk who can afford to go but don't. Yet they're happy to come and and tell us how bad things are.

Again and again and again and again and again.

If they were to come out of their Hibs huff we'd be looking at 12-13k a game and that's a big difference financially.

But you know and I know that they won't come back until the standard of football improves and that constantly moaning about them won't make one bit of difference!

blackpoolhibs
07-01-2013, 11:09 AM
:greengrin

I see your point. I took the OP to mean 'new' supporters, not 'lapsed supporters who've turned their back on the club'. If we're talking about potential new supporters like school kids, the immigrant community in Edinburgh, or similar groups that have never been to Easter Road, I'd say No, the club isn't doing enough, and could do more.

:greengrin Living so far away, i dont know what the club do regarding School visits and the likes? Although i did see a tv clip over xmas with the players visiting a hospital, i'm sure we do other things too, but unlike the merricks we dont broadcast it to all and sundry.

In case you dont know, they won a world war on their own.

matty_f
07-01-2013, 11:14 AM
The club could do more and are trying to do more. Over the last couple of seasons we've had initiatives were people could bring someone for free, in fact as recently as our last home game the club gave out thousands of free tickets to early bird season ticket holders. The Hibs Kids get four or five free games per season. The Kicks for Kids initiative allows many more people access to the games where they wouldn't normally get it.
We've also seen reduced prices for cup games over the last few seasons too.
If you look at the Hibernian Community Foundation site, you can see the extent of the work Hibs do in the community. It's not just about getting a photo in the paper or dishing out tickets to schoolkids but about trying to make a tangible difference in the community and engaging with it in a meaningful way.

We still have many empty seats though, so there is more that needs to be done and I do know that Hibs are looking at as many ideas as possible.

One thing I'd love to see us do is try to take advantage of our location and tap into the people most likely to come to Easter Road - local Hibs fans.
I think the club could do a lot worse than send out people (players, even) to knock on doors around Easter Road and the surrounding area, inviting people to a game. Maybe even giving them a special offer to tempt them.
These are the people that are likely to return if they like what they see.

I would say though, that there will be people on here waiting for a reason to go. Don't wait, the club needs your support now so if you can go, then do so.

hibee_girl
07-01-2013, 11:20 AM
Hibs do give tickets to schools, the p6 and p7 kids at my sons school got them a while back.

JohnStephens91
07-01-2013, 11:20 AM
But you know and I know that they won't come back until the standard of football improves and that constantly moaning about them won't make one bit of difference!

So they want to see a better standard of football but are only willing to jump on the bandwagon once the success starts rolling rather than helping and supporting the team to the quality they would like? Even if Hibs were Barcelona our fans would find something to moan about.

We all need to pitch in and pull together, it is a massive step in the right direction to see a team capable of holding their own on the football pitch and having 32 points already this season compared to the 33 we had last season indicates that we are moving in the right direction. To continue doing this the fans need to show up, the ones who are lapsed or the ones who have potentially never actually been to Easter Road.

The football standard is actually better, some of our goals have been of very high quality such as the goals against Dundee United and our first half against Inverness at Easter Road were both highlights. To say our standard of football is poor is to fly in the face of reality, it is actually very good, but sometimes it isn't at the height of the Mowbray/Collins era.

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 11:24 AM
The club could do more and are trying to do more. Over the last couple of seasons we've had initiatives were people could bring someone for free, in fact as recently as our last home game the club gave out thousands of free tickets to early bird season ticket holders. The Hibs Kids get four or five free games per season. The Kicks for Kids initiative allows many more people access to the games where they wouldn't normally get it.
We've also seen reduced prices for cup games over the last few seasons too.
If you look at the Hibernian Community Foundation site, you can see the extent of the work Hibs do in the community. It's not just about getting a photo in the paper or dishing out tickets to schoolkids but about trying to make a tangible difference in the community and engaging with it in a meaningful way.

We still have many empty seats though, so there is more that needs to be done and I do know that Hibs are looking at as many ideas as possible.

One thing I'd love to see us do is try to take advantage of our location and tap into the people most likely to come to Easter Road - local Hibs fans.
I think the club could do a lot worse than send out people (players, even) to knock on doors around Easter Road and the surrounding area, inviting people to a game. Maybe even giving them a special offer to tempt them.
These are the people that are likely to return if they like what they see.

I would say though, that there will be people on here waiting for a reason to go. Don't wait, the club needs your support now so if you can go, then do so.

I think we discussed this before Matty, and I think it went into some early drafts for the LWT Visioning work as well, but in my opinion the 'missing link' in our Community Engagement work is physically getting the players into the schools. I agree that the HCF does some good work, i know Stewart and hes done wonders with that learning initiatives programme, but I've seen the impact that a player can make with kids in a school environment, especially when they're as engaging as McPake or similar.

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 11:25 AM
You have to factor in that Hibs, along with everyone else, are trying to sell a third rate product and because of that, new customers are like hens teeth.

truehibernian
07-01-2013, 11:27 AM
Only if the players agree to take a pay cut, or the supporters are happy to have players of lower quality than we have now.

Other than that we need to maximise income. Letting people in for free (as per the example in the opening post) doesn't do that.

Mikey, the case for the fans defence would like to present -

Junior Agogo, Valdas Trakys, yon lanky Czech keeper with the braw missus, Ed De Graaf, Alan O'Brien, Patrick Nouboussie, Matt Thornhill, Michael Hart, Graeme Smith, Francis Dickoh, Daryl Duffy, Paddy Cregg, Kevin McBride, Joe Keenan, Steven Pinau, Thicot, etc etc

The above players, none of whom I would describe as being 'quality', absorbed a horrendous amount of fans money in the form of salaries and pay offs.

The only quality signings, again for me (and only opinion), that Hibs have made this last 4 seasons were Bamba, Riordan, Stokes, Liam Miller - I nearly added Vic Palsson but I think we got him at the wrong stage of his career, where he felt he had already made it - there is definite potential in that guy, he just needs to find a work ethic.

The quality players before that came via the youth system and then little gems like Jones, Zemmama and an in-form Benji.

The calibre of player brought to Hibs especially by Hughes and Calderwood was simply awful and to be honest bordering on neglect for me.

Fenlon looks to be going about his business the right way, doing homework on players, investigating the lower leagues, using a better scouting network - that means that players will come to Hibs as a step up and perhaps not be demanding a great deal on money anyway (given their previous salaries). Add the youth system into the mix and you have what I think is the perfect approach for a team like Hibs to be adopting. You then can always utilise the Bosman ruling and snag a wee gem end of the window or beyond when thousands of players just want to play.

The supporters have been magnificent last season and this in my opinion - especially last season under a very very challenging season of poor results, the final, and Calderwood's manipulation of the club right at the beginning.

The board and players, again in my opinion, need to be far more visible in the community and Hibs marketing should extend to way beyond the matchday experience, but try to ingrain and incorporate Hibernian Football Club into a young fans life. Schools, colleges, youth clubs, community centres, libraries, shopping centres, you name it - every penny counts and we need to do more as a club to invest in people. (sorry to use corporate speak at the end there - but you get the jist hopefully).

lord bunberry
07-01-2013, 11:28 AM
I think the board do a pretty poor job of promoting the club if you look at this season we have been top were still fourth and have a realistic chance of finishing second and we are still in the cup. There always seems to be a slightly negative outlook to the statements they release for example they will release a statement saying if we want better players more people need to come to the games and while this is the truth a more positive spin needs to be put on it. It would also help if the players and management helped by not constantly playing down our chances. If you look at other sports they promote themselves much better, boxers always tell everyone that they will soon be world champion and every film is promoted as a classic. I think we need to get away from the attend games or we will have crap players line and go for a more positive approach

IWasThere2016
07-01-2013, 11:28 AM
Are we now saying that having a team who have been top of the league, and now sitting nicely in 4th place is not enough to get folk through the doors, they now need a personal visit to persuade them to come back?

What the **** next, do their washing up?

What aboot a car wash/valet - that would get my vote! :cb

Mikey
07-01-2013, 11:29 AM
Hibs do give tickets to schools, the p6 and p7 kids at my sons school got them a while back.

Yep. And while Hearts let everyone know about it on the back page of the EEN, Hibs just get on and do it.

Whether that's right or wrong is a different matter.

marinello59
07-01-2013, 11:32 AM
My daughter also had Hearts players at her primary school last year, doing traditional 'community outreach' type work. They did some coaching and had a five a side game with the kids. It'd be good to see Hibs really take this kind of thing seriously on a consistent basis.

Is she going to Tynecastle now then?

Hiber-nation
07-01-2013, 11:34 AM
So they want to see a better standard of football but are only willing to jump on the bandwagon once the success starts rolling rather than helping and supporting the team to the quality they would like? Even if Hibs were Barcelona our fans would find something to moan about.

We all need to pitch in and pull together, it is a massive step in the right direction to see a team capable of holding their own on the football pitch and having 32 points already this season compared to the 33 we had last season indicates that we are moving in the right direction. To continue doing this the fans need to show up, the ones who are lapsed or the ones who have potentially never actually been to Easter Road.

The football standard is actually better, some of our goals have been of very high quality such as the goals against Dundee United and our first half against Inverness at Easter Road were both highlights. To say our standard of football is poor is to fly in the face of reality, it is actually very good, but sometimes it isn't at the height of the Mowbray/Collins era.

Of course, how do you think we managed to increase average attendances by about 4-5,000 from the end of the Blobby years through to JC's last season? Results, performances. I'm not speaking for myself by the way, but on behalf of plenty folk I know.

jonty
07-01-2013, 11:35 AM
Heated seats, free bovril, a big cosy jacket and driven from home to the match. :greengrin


Subsidised travel for out of towners?

truehibernian
07-01-2013, 11:36 AM
Yep. And while Hearts let everyone know about it on the back page of the EEN, Hibs just get on and do it.

Whether that's right or wrong is a different matter.

Surely that's part of promoting a product and the club ? I don't see it as a negative if a club and its player are photographed in a local school, hospital, or wherever, handing out tickets or turning up for a sports event ?

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 11:37 AM
To say our standard of football is poor is to fly in the face of reality, it is actually very good, but sometimes it isn't at the height of the Mowbray/Collins era.

Sorry, S&S, but the standard is woeful.

Did you watch the derby? Players who are being paid thousands of pounds a week were trapping the ball further than I can kick it.

There was virtually no football played unless we count hoofball and few chances were created.

It was exciting for those fans with an allegiance, but for the neutrals watching on TV, it must have been a borefest.

The second half against Motherwell was another shocker. After a decent first half, we get over run, and despite going 2 up against the run of play, we aren't skilled enough to hang on to a point.

Almost every English game I watch, and not necessarily just the EPL, has a higher skill level than we see in Scotland.

The games may not all be exciting because I don't have a vested interest, but they all know how to control a ball and pass it.

Sometimes even forwards!

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 11:37 AM
Is she going to Tynecastle now then?

:grr: no danger :greengrin

It's central Edinburgh, probably equidistant from both grounds.

Mikey
07-01-2013, 11:38 AM
Almost every English game I watch, and not necessarily just the EPL, has a higher skill level than we see in Scotland.



Sky TV has a lot to answer for there.

marinello59
07-01-2013, 11:39 AM
Where are the massive numbers of neutral fans?
Given the vast amount of press, radio and TV coverage given to SPL football the sport is hardly invisible is it? If existing Hibs fans can't be bothered going along to support the team they claim to love how much do we think would need to spend to make any real impact on attendances?

Beefster
07-01-2013, 11:41 AM
Only if the players agree to take a pay cut, or the supporters are happy to have players of lower quality than we have now.

Not necessarily. There are SPL clubs that seem to have players of a similar quality on a smaller budget.

The club doesn't do enough to attract new supporters but it's improved slightly (e.g. free OF tickets) from a couple of years back when they did absolutely hee-haw.

blackpoolhibs
07-01-2013, 11:44 AM
Not necessarily. There are SPL clubs that seem to have players of a similar quality on a smaller budget.

The club doesn't do enough to attract new supporters but it's improved slightly (e.g. free OF tickets) from a couple of years back when they did absolutely hee-haw.

:agree: The club seem to have started to address both points, long may it continue. :top marks

IWasThere2016
07-01-2013, 11:48 AM
Sorry, S&S, but the standard is woeful.

Did you watch the derby? Players who are being paid thousands of pounds a week were trapping the ball further than I can kick it.

There was virtually no football played unless we count hoofball and few chances were created.

It was exciting for those fans with an allegiance, but for the neutrals watching on TV, it must have been a borefest.

The second half against Motherwell was another shocker. After a decent first half, we get over run, and despite going 2 up against the run of play, we aren't skilled enough to hang on to a point.

Almost every English game I watch, and not necessarily just the EPL, has a higher skill level than we see in Scotland.

The games may not all be exciting because I don't have a vested interest, but they all know how to control a ball and pass it.

Sometimes even forwards!

This. If it wasn't the Hibs, I would have given up after 15-20 minutes. It was truly God awful!

JohnStephens91
07-01-2013, 11:56 AM
Sorry, S&S, but the standard is woeful.

Did you watch the derby? Players who are being paid thousands of pounds a week were trapping the ball further than I can kick it.

There was virtually no football played unless we count hoofball and few chances were created.

It was exciting for those fans with an allegiance, but for the neutrals watching on TV, it must have been a borefest.

The second half against Motherwell was another shocker. After a decent first half, we get over run, and despite going 2 up against the run of play, we aren't skilled enough to hang on to a point.

Almost every English game I watch, and not necessarily just the EPL, has a higher skill level than we see in Scotland.

The games may not all be exciting because I don't have a vested interest, but they all know how to control a ball and pass it.

Sometimes even forwards!

I was at the derby and yes it wasn't pretty, what I was getting at though was that the standard of football is better than people are giving it credit for. I know how painstakingly awful the last two derbies have been for quality, but we do play some pretty good football and I think people tend to forget that. It isn't as good as the Mowbray or Collins standard of play but it is a step in the right direction. St Mirren home and away, Inverness at ER, Dundee United at ER, Dundee at ER, Aberdeen at home are all games where I think Hibs have played well and not just punted the ball up the park. I know people hate the phrase 'work in progress' but that is what we are and I think making us harder to beat gives us a better platform to improve from for next season.

I also think Motherwell at Easter Road was down to a poor choice of substitutions rather than quality of player.

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 12:06 PM
Sky TV has a lot to answer for there.

You're not wrong.

I'd just about recovered from watching Hibs draw 0 - 0 against St Johnstone - a game which was so boring, my mate started doing the Scotsman Sudoku during it - and I'd settled down at home in front of the TV for the Barca v Real Madrid game, interested to see the latest instalment of Ronaldo v Messi and Mourinho v his old employers.

It was the worst thing I could have done.

Barcelona won 5 - 0 with the most breathtaking performance I have ever seen. I was literally shouting at the TV in disbelief at the movement and passing.

My view of the kick and (sometimes) run we get in Scotland was seriously damaged.

Of course, Hibs are in my blood and I'll still support them and go to various games, but my eyes have been opened about what is actually on offer.

And back to your point, because of TV, the chances of Hibs or anyone else attracting neutrals to support them is minuscule, imo.

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 12:12 PM
I was at the derby and yes it wasn't pretty, what I was getting at though was that the standard of football is better than people are giving it credit for. I know how painstakingly awful the last two derbies have been for quality, but we do play some pretty good football and I think people tend to forget that. It isn't as good as the Mowbray or Collins standard of play but it is a step in the right direction. St Mirren home and away, Inverness at ER, Dundee United at ER, Dundee at ER, Aberdeen at home are all games where I think Hibs have played well and not just punted the ball up the park. I know people hate the phrase 'work in progress' but that is what we are and I think making us harder to beat gives us a better platform to improve from for next season.

I also think Motherwell at Easter Road was down to a poor choice of substitutions rather than quality of player.

I accept that we're better than we've been, but that wasn't asking much.

I do agree that we're progressing, but despite some unrealistic expectations expressed on this MB, if we ever see a final product, it will be in some years.

Motherwell were all over us from the start of the second half, well before the substitutions, by the way. I don't think they were the cause.

Bristolhibby
07-01-2013, 12:20 PM
Yep agree

Even helping Kids football clubs with training, going to PE classes, or even a kids youth football tournament?

I went to school in Bath, and we have the Bath Rugby players in at least twice a year taking a training session. We regularly got free tickets for some of the smaller games also.

And this was in a one team town!

Had Andy Nichol taking a session, which was good as he was the Scotland and Bath captain at the time and a nice guy to boot.

J

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 01:04 PM
Is she going to Tynecastle now then?

I've just realised you mean 'is she now going to Hearts games?' not 'is she now going to Tynecastle School?'

Assuming this is a bit of sarcasm on your behalf, are you sceptical about footballers doing school outreach work? Do you think it's ineffective? :dunno:

marinello59
07-01-2013, 01:52 PM
I've just realised you mean 'is she now going to Hearts games?' not 'is she now going to Tynecastle School?'

Assuming this is a bit of sarcasm on your behalf, are you sceptical about footballers doing school outreach work? Do you think it's ineffective? :dunno:

It was an attempt to make a point in a light hearted manner rather than being sarcastic...............but I have to concede it did look sarcastic.

I am sceptical about players visiting schools. There have been possibly two visits to my sons school from Aberdeen players since he started there (P7 now) and I don't think that it had any impact in terms of attendances at Pittodrie. My wee lad and others that supported other teams were distinctly underwhelmed whilst very few of the Aberdeen supporting boys in his class actually go to games at all. Even at primary school age kids have their allegiances sorted already and no amount of player appearances will change that. . If players are going in to schools I would rather it was to encourage the kids to play the game more than anything else. A visit from the Glasgow pro-Basketball team went down exceptionally well with the kids and introduced them to a new activity.

marinello59
07-01-2013, 02:03 PM
You're not wrong.

I'd just about recovered from watching Hibs draw 0 - 0 against St Johnstone - a game which was so boring, my mate started doing the Scotsman Sudoku during it - and I'd settled down at home in front of the TV for the Barca v Real Madrid game, interested to see the latest instalment of Ronaldo v Messi and Mourinho v his old employers.

It was the worst thing I could have done.

Barcelona won 5 - 0 with the most breathtaking performance I have ever seen. I was literally shouting at the TV in disbelief at the movement and passing.

My view of the kick and (sometimes) run we get in Scotland was seriously damaged.

Of course, Hibs are in my blood and I'll still support them and go to various games, but my eyes have been opened about what is actually on offer.

And back to your point, because of TV, the chances of Hibs or anyone else attracting neutrals to support them is minuscule, imo.

It's more than the TV money alone though. Those of us who suggested that trying to improve the standard of the SPL by happily sending one or both of the strongest teams to play in England was madness were shouted down. Rangers got what they deserved but to players the SPL must look much less attractive to play in than it did a year ago. Move to a Scottish club and do well and there were two big clubs ready to snap you up and pay you a fortune. Now there is just one and they just don't need to buy so aggressively for the next few years. The rebuttall was always, ''Who cares if standards slip a bit, the league will be more competitive .'' Well it is and it still ain't pretty.

DevonLoch
07-01-2013, 02:04 PM
I think it has improved in the last couple of years but still has a long way to go. The problem of attracting new fans is widespread and there is plenty 'best practice' out there which other clubs in other leagues have used and have published the methods and the results. I know we have very limited resources but we should have someone in the club tasked with monitoring and tapping in to this and prioritising schemes which have proven effective elsewhere. Is there anyone who does this? A few ideas in just one publication below...

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B94cve6hT-Vbb2NBeHQ2Slp5STg (https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B94cve6hT-Vbb2NBeHQ2Slp5STg)

Also I think we could improve revenue generation from fans who can't make it to Easter Road each week e.g. a virtual season ticket bundle incorporating club membership, prepaid ticket/vouchers for 3 or 4 games, Hibs TV, digital match day programme and priority for 'A' games/cup tickets.

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 02:13 PM
It was an attempt to make a point in a light hearted manner rather than being sarcastic...............but I have to concede it did look sarcastic.

I am sceptical about players visiting schools. There have been possibly two visits to my sons school from Aberdeen players since he started there (P7 now) and I don't think that it had any impact in terms of attendances at Pittodrie. My wee lad and others that supported other teams were distinctly underwhelmed whilst very few of the Aberdeen supporting boys in his class actually go to games at all. Even at primary school age kids have their allegiances sorted already and no amount of player appearances will change that. . If players are going in to schools I would rather it was to encourage the kids to play the game more than anything else. A visit from the Glasgow pro-Basketball team went down exceptionally well with the kids and introduced them to a new activity.

Fair enough.

Obviously she is not attending Tynecastle because she is a rabid Hibs Kid and would rather eat sprouts than do such a thing. But there are over 600 other kids at her school though and there might be a few more 'floating voters' out there who might be swayed by a players personal appearance. Even as a mad Hibby she grudgingly admitted the Hearts players 'seemed nice', they enjoyed the game and she wished it could have been Hibs players doing it.

I know how star struck she was when she met McPake and Mark Brown and when chatting to her made her feel part of the club in a way that's impossible to get otherwise IMO. It won't happen overnight but getting out there generates awareness of a football club as part of a city. I wouldn't expect attendances to immediately go up on the back of school outreach work, (im not sure any direct cause and effect is possible to be measured anyway) so your sons class experience in Aberdeen doesn't surprise me, but it's a gradual process and I'm sure it's effective. Even if I'm wrong, it's quite a cost neutral thing to do and it's unlikely to harm attendances or 'brand awareness'.

Jones28
07-01-2013, 02:15 PM
I think Hibs do quite a lot in the community. When I was at primary Scott brown and grant brebner came down and handed out free tickets and signed autographs for everyone. Kids who's parents were hearts fans went to the game. When it gets done it makes a difference

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 02:16 PM
It's more than the TV money alone though. Those of us who suggested that trying to improve the standard of the SPL by happily sending one or both of the strongest teams to play in England was madness were shouted down. Rangers got what they deserved but to players the SPL must look much less attractive to play in than it did a year ago. Move to a Scottish club and do well and there were two big clubs ready to snap you up and pay you a fortune. Now there is just one and they just don't need to buy so aggressively for the next few years. The rebuttall was always, ''Who cares if standards slip a bit, the league will be more competitive .'' Well it is and it still ain't pretty.

I thought about making a similar point, but decided not to start the OFGTF debate on this thread, but seeing as you've started it... :greengrin

It's very significant to see that although Rangers are not in the EPL, only the pishy 3rd division, playing teams who attract a TV audience of 3 exiles in Corby and someone's great grandson in Ontario, their games are still broadcast every week and they are still pocketing all that dosh.

Imagine where the TV money currently spent in Scotland would go if Celtic and Rangers ever did reach the EPL and were playing teams who attracted big audiences in Scotland, not to mention around the world.

However, that's for another day. :wink:

gegs70
07-01-2013, 02:24 PM
Only if the players agree to take a pay cut, or the supporters are happy to have players of lower quality than we have now.

Other than that we need to maximise income. Letting people in for free (as per the example in the opening post) doesn't do that.

Agreed but screwing money out of the existing support isnt the answer either. The free ticket hives those who wouldnt normally go to games an oportunity to experience what clubs offer. My friends family enjoyed their day out at hearts that thy did go back. We once had a poster in the ff stand when mowbray was their stating it was exciting brand of football .... havent been able to say that for some time really.

marinello59
07-01-2013, 02:31 PM
Fair enough.

Obviously she is not attending Tynecastle because she is a rabid Hibs Kid and would rather eat sprouts than do such a thing. But there are over 600 other kids at her school though and there might be a few more 'floating voters' out there who might be swayed by a players personal appearance. Even as a mad Hibby she grudgingly admitted the Hearts players 'seemed nice', they enjoyed the game and she wished it could have been Hibs players doing it.

I know how star struck she was when she met McPake and Mark Brown and when chatting to her made her feel part of the club in a way that's impossible to get otherwise IMO. It won't happen overnight but getting out there generates awareness of a football club as part of a city. I wouldn't expect attendances to immediately go up on the back of school outreach work, (im not sure any direct cause and effect is possible to be measured anyway) so your sons class experience in Aberdeen doesn't surprise me, but it's a gradual process and I'm sure it's effective. Even if I'm wrong, it's quite a cost neutral thing to do and it's unlikely to harm attendances or 'brand awareness'.

Agreed.
I may be prejudiced as I do have concerns that football has become a monster of sorts which is seen as the one and only sport by far too many parents at the expense of participation in other sports or activities.. (Ask for parent volunteers up here to help with football training and you will have to turn people away. Ask for help running a youth group and everybody is far too busy.) That may just be a problem unique to the city I live in but I would be surprised if it was.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 02:31 PM
Where are the massive numbers of neutral fans?
Given the vast amount of press, radio and TV coverage given to SPL football the sport is hardly invisible is it? If existing Hibs fans can't be bothered going along to support the team they claim to love how much do we think would need to spend to make any real impact on attendances?

I think there are kids that have never been to a game before andif you offered them a ticket their muns and dads would take them. Then its up to hibs to convince them its exciting enough to comebvk again and again.

jonty
07-01-2013, 03:10 PM
If Hibs wants to encourage 'brand loyalty' in community schools then the players and staff should be visiting on a more frequent basis than once a year.
They could take a football class, or participate in gym work.

The players might learn something too.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 03:29 PM
If you asked your kids or grandkids what would make them want to go to watch hibs everyweek what would they say?

How much would you pay to watch hibs in any gam

blackpoolhibs
07-01-2013, 05:48 PM
If you asked your kids or grandkids what would make them want to go to watch hibs everyweek what would they say?

How much would you pay to watch hibs in any gam

Depends on who the women are? :greengrin

gegs70
07-01-2013, 05:52 PM
Depends on who the women are? :greengrin

Oops!

Pedantic_Hibee
07-01-2013, 06:13 PM
Floppy-breasted cheerleaders. Nap.

Moon unit
07-01-2013, 07:10 PM
But we already do? And we have increased our average attendance for this season compared to previous seasons. Our core support of what, 10-11k, have been doing this.
Maybe the Tache and other board members could do a ......Bake Sale! They could sell them outside the ground to passing randoms and entice them in on match day! I'm sure no other club would come up with this idea?...

gegs70
07-01-2013, 07:35 PM
Maybe the Tache and other board members could do a ......Bake Sale! They could sell them outside the ground to passing randoms and entice them in on match day! I'm sure no other club would come up with this idea?...

The tache makes exceedingly good cakes!!

Hibeesforever
07-01-2013, 07:45 PM
:greengrin

I see your point. I took the OP to mean 'new' supporters, not 'lapsed supporters who've turned their back on the club'. If we're talking about potential new supporters like school kids, the immigrant community in Edinburgh, or similar groups that have never been to Easter Road, I'd say No, the club isn't doing enough, and could do more.

Yes, agreed. Club probably feels that it has more humility than hawking itself on the radio and via blitz marketing campaigns in Princes Street. However, that is exactly what is required. Need to create a buzz, convince new supporters that they need to watch matches in person and ensure that, on game day, everybody that is in Princes Street knows that there is a game on that they are missing.
There is no cost to the club to offer discounted tickets if the alternative is that a seat remains empty.
Season ticket holders should then be offerred more community /player engagement opportunities. End of season party / Season ticket member nights etc. as a differential to paying slightly more.
I think we are getting there but as a poster said, there does seem to be a view that Rod is a steady hand financially but not dynamic enough on the marketing side.
A couple of loan re-signings or new additions would also help.

:flag:

PatHead
07-01-2013, 07:56 PM
In answer to the OP's question. Apart from giving free tickets at the Celtic game, free tickets at the forthcoming Dundee game and discounted tickets for the Aberdeen game how much else would you like the board to give away without affecting the playing budget?

At the risk of sounding like an apologist for the board they have got a number of initiatives in the pipeline and underway to raise funds
which will improve the team and in turn make supporters return. It won't happen overnight.

Gatecrasher
07-01-2013, 08:08 PM
I was at school when Meadowbank moved to livi and the amount of free tickets, coaching sessions free scarfs we got to promote the new club I cant think of 1 person who became a regular fan of the club. We had our clubs set in our minds by the time primary school started. Sure its nice to hear about coaching sessions for schools and things like that but i dont think it makes as big of an impact as some think.

Hibrandenburg
07-01-2013, 08:23 PM
The life blood and future of any club depends on the fans being involved at an early age. If you don't get them young then chances are you won't get them at all. Bearing that in mind you have to create an environment that parents are willing to expose their kids to. There's various threads on the main board at the moment (smoking, Gorgie Billy Boys, spitting on ball boys etc.) that put doubt in my mind that ER is a place to take my boy. If Hibs can address some of these problems, then we'll be on the right tracks to encourage new fans to the games.

Scouse Hibee
07-01-2013, 08:51 PM
The life blood and future of any club depends on the fans being involved at an early age. If you don't get them young then chances are you won't get them at all. Bearing that in mind you have to create an environment that parents are willing to expose their kids to. There's various threads on the main board at the moment (smoking, Gorgie Billy Boys, spitting on ball boys etc.) that put doubt in my mind that ER is a place to take my boy. If Hibs can address some of these problems, then we'll be on the right tracks to encourage new fans to the games.

With all due respect if you want to take your boy to football matches in this country then unless you wrap him in cotton wool and make him wear a pair of earplugs he will unfortunately have to experience some of what society has to offer. I say society because unfortunately that's what you're up against and there's nothing Hibs or any club can do to protect youngsters from it. Hibs have already done plenty to attract families to Easter Road, not quite sure what else they can do to be honest. Your boy like mine and many others will know better than the behaviour he sees on offer from some of the lunatics at the football and that's because of you, nothing to do with Hibs.

marinello59
07-01-2013, 08:56 PM
The life blood and future of any club depends on the fans being involved at an early age. If you don't get them young then chances are you won't get them at all. Bearing that in mind you have to create an environment that parents are willing to expose their kids to. There's various threads on the main board at the moment (smoking, Gorgie Billy Boys, spitting on ball boys etc.) that put doubt in my mind that ER is a place to take my boy. If Hibs can address some of these problems, then we'll be on the right tracks to encourage new fans to the games.

That's actually a very good point and one that is too easily ignored. . The future lies in making the game attractive to the entire family as a day out. Until our grounds are genuinely family friendly that is going to be difficult. And before anybody trots out the tired old 'it's a working mans game etc'' guff times have changed, the game has to adapt to the reality of how most families spend their leisure time.

Scouse Hibee
07-01-2013, 09:00 PM
That's actually a very good point and one that is too easily ignored. . The future lies in making the game attractive to the entire family as a day out. Until our grounds are genuinely family friendly that is going to be difficult. And before anybody trots out the tired old 'it's a working mans game etc'' guff times have changed, the game has to adapt to the reality of how most families spend their leisure time.

WHOA! If the day ever comes that the Missus wants to attend the footy with me and the laddie then it's game over for me :greengrin

hibsbollah
07-01-2013, 09:21 PM
The life blood and future of any club depends on the fans being involved at an early age. If you don't get them young then chances are you won't get them at all. Bearing that in mind you have to create an environment that parents are willing to expose their kids to. There's various threads on the main board at the moment (smoking, Gorgie Billy Boys, spitting on ball boys etc.) that put doubt in my mind that ER is a place to take my boy. If Hibs can address some of these problems, then we'll be on the right tracks to encourage new fans to the games.

Its an interesting dilemma for a football supporting parent. My nine year old is Hibs daft but she doesn't want to go to derbies anymore, and I don't really want to take her. 'daddy, what's a refugee?':rolleyes: She'll go to the majority of home games and a few away games with me too, but until the derby doesn't make her uncomfortable she won't be getting a season ticket again.

On the other hand, her first game was the derby where Kevin Kyle (and a good section of the lower East Stand) got pelted with coins, pitch invasions by Hertz fans and smoke bombs, and she loved every minute of it. You don't want to take the adrenaline out of derby day either. It's a fine balance.

NAE NOOKIE
07-01-2013, 09:23 PM
The missing fans from Scottish football in general is not just down to what we are not doing but as much to do with what we cant control.

The truth is that a lot of supporters have been lost to TV .... They are fed a never ending diet of super club football from around Europe and think that football should always be like that. Its bollocks !!!

The truth is that if Scotland ever had a golden age when everybody played like Barcelona it was before I ever started going to watch. Yes from time to time a team really worth watching pops up ... since the start of the 70s Dundee Utd, Aberdeen and Hibs have all had teams worth paying to see. But its the exception ..... not the rule.

The reason that some leagues around Europe are much better to watch than the SPL is because teams in those leagues can pay eye watering money to attract the best players ... you get what you pay for. To compare us to them is bloody unfair. Yes there is room for improvement .... but its never going to be brilliant and hardly ever has been.

Then we move on to the modern consumer of entertainment ..... Compared to, lets say the 70s, kids and quite a lot of adults would rather sit on their ar5e at home watching Man Utd on the box than sit in the cold and rain at ER or Tannadice or St Mirren Park ... If you pass a kid today and he is telling his mate that he did a brilliant spin to turn a defender and sent a rocket into the top corner it was on his X Box .... not while playing for the school team.

Where I live you are more likely to see a kid in a Liverpool, Chelsea, Man Utd or Barcelona top than a Hibs or Yams top .... Its not surprising really when you consider that even compared to a couple of decades ago they are saturated with coverage of these clubs, with their games being shown live all the time .... no wonder kids feel that they can justify supporting these clubs rather than the local teams.

It sure doesnt help when all around them their bloody football expert parents ( who have probably never been to an SPL game ) go on and on about how crap our game is ..... even folk on here who are supposed to be fans of Scottish football ( as well as Hibs ) go on far too much about how crap our game is. No wonder folk stop going and no wonder its hard to attract new or lapsed fans to games.

I would say that around Europe, with the possible exception of Germany, crowds appear to be dropping especially in the likes of Italy. Have a look at the FA cup crowds this weekend ... some pretty poor efforts in some of those games.

Blah Blah Blah ... hell I'm boring myself.

Anyway ... can Scottish football do more to attract fans and make the product more appealing to supporters? Totally yes and it wouldnt even involve having better football on the park.

McD
07-01-2013, 09:37 PM
In terms of potentially increasing long term supporters/next generation, couldn't we turn the several thousand empty seats into a positive, by grouping them together into a large area and giving out free tickets to schools for say primary 6 and 7 kids, and create a kind of school boy enclosure.

i can't imagine (could be wrong though lol) that a lot of kids would need too much in the way of stewarding, or if Hibs felt they could then we could adapt the idea to be parent plus child for free/£5 say.

The seats are empty now, we get no income from them. Whilst there would be no income still, there would be an uptake in food and possibly in the club store as well, not to mention the positive PR generated.

this could be tied to players doing visits to the schools for coaching sessions on a regular basis, meet and greet for the kids before matches with one or two players (particularly injured/suspended ones).

Devilstorment
07-01-2013, 09:47 PM
I can honestly say, i have never spoken to someone who has not actively supported any football team who then went on to support a team (any team, not just the hibs) I seriously don't think Football in Scotland attracts new support. It seems to survive on a hereditary basis! (which seems to be trending backwards as would be expected if this was the case)

We also model our pricing structure on English clubs, but offering a lower quality of football.

I am not sure what the answer is, if there is one.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 09:48 PM
We reached a point under Mowbray where it was entertaining and exciting but didnt win anything. Then won the cup with JC, Im sure Petrie wanted to take hibs to the next level, but unfirtunately while we had a good young team that was as good as it got. Many people just got fed up watching below average players, this season is better but not brilliant....in some ways we still have the same problems. If we had 500 extra supporters would it make a difference?

People pay for success but will not pay for a dull product, that is overpriced and offers very little. Even giving away tickets wont work or the celtic game would have been a sell out. What you needis to bring the youth pkayers through give them time and if they do well we sell them then bring on the next star
Or find a millionaire who wantd to lose a load of cash but have fun in the process and realise my dreams!!!!

Greendub
07-01-2013, 09:52 PM
They could drop the price to say £15.

I would rather have a full stadium paying £15 than half the stadium paying £23

Away fans have to pay double :-)

gegs70
07-01-2013, 09:53 PM
I can honestly say, i have never spoken to someone who has not actively supported any football team who then went on to support a team (any team, not just the hibs) I seriously don't think Football in Scotland attracts new support. It seems to survive on a hereditary basis! (which seems to be trending backwards as would be expected if this was the case)

We also model our pricing structure on English clubs, but offering a lower quality of football.

I am not sure what the answer is, if there is one.

I had friend whom the dad was originally from durham whos son is 7 and recently started playing football, he had taken his son to a hibs game but was the calderwood years said it was a poor game and no atmosphere. Got a free ticket for Hearts at the School bumped into a liad of friends and enjoyed it. Has been back 2-3 times since. I just feel we missed an oportunity...and I have had ithrrs who supported hibs while up here for uni or people who have moved here.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 09:58 PM
They could drop the price to say £15.

I would rather have a full stadium paying £15 than half the stadium paying £23

Away fans have to pay double :-)

Need to do something with the cost, 200-250 for sesson ticket wouldnt be a bad price. Try to get more through the door, get more into bars etc, food, get more products , kids area in the bar area for others kids to meet up and make friends other than just a beer playground for dads. Maybe it neds to be mire than just a football game!

blackpoolhibs
07-01-2013, 10:54 PM
The missing fans from Scottish football in general is not just down to what we are not doing but as much to do with what we cant control.

The truth is that a lot of supporters have been lost to TV .... They are fed a never ending diet of super club football from around Europe and think that football should always be like that. Its bollocks !!!

The truth is that if Scotland ever had a golden age when everybody played like Barcelona it was before I ever started going to watch. Yes from time to time a team really worth watching pops up ... since the start of the 70s Dundee Utd, Aberdeen and Hibs have all had teams worth paying to see. But its the exception ..... not the rule.

The reason that some leagues around Europe are much better to watch than the SPL is because teams in those leagues can pay eye watering money to attract the best players ... you get what you pay for. To compare us to them is bloody unfair. Yes there is room for improvement .... but its never going to be brilliant and hardly ever has been.

Then we move on to the modern consumer of entertainment ..... Compared to, lets say the 70s, kids and quite a lot of adults would rather sit on their ar5e at home watching Man Utd on the box than sit in the cold and rain at ER or Tannadice or St Mirren Park ... If you pass a kid today and he is telling his mate that he did a brilliant spin to turn a defender and sent a rocket into the top corner it was on his X Box .... not while playing for the school team.

Where I live you are more likely to see a kid in a Liverpool, Chelsea, Man Utd or Barcelona top than a Hibs or Yams top .... Its not surprising really when you consider that even compared to a couple of decades ago they are saturated with coverage of these clubs, with their games being shown live all the time .... no wonder kids feel that they can justify supporting these clubs rather than the local teams.

It sure doesnt help when all around them their bloody football expert parents ( who have probably never been to an SPL game ) go on and on about how crap our game is ..... even folk on here who are supposed to be fans of Scottish football ( as well as Hibs ) go on far too much about how crap our game is. No wonder folk stop going and no wonder its hard to attract new or lapsed fans to games.

I would say that around Europe, with the possible exception of Germany, crowds appear to be dropping especially in the likes of Italy. Have a look at the FA cup crowds this weekend ... some pretty poor efforts in some of those games.

Blah Blah Blah ... hell I'm boring myself.

Anyway ... can Scottish football do more to attract fans and make the product more appealing to supporters? Totally yes and it wouldnt even involve having better football on the park.

:top marks :agree:

Hibrandenburg
07-01-2013, 11:11 PM
With all due respect if you want to take your boy to football matches in this country then unless you wrap him in cotton wool and make him wear a pair of earplugs he will unfortunately have to experience some of what society has to offer. I say society because unfortunately that's what you're up against and there's nothing Hibs or any club can do to protect youngsters from it. Hibs have already done plenty to attract families to Easter Road, not quite sure what else they can do to be honest. Your boy like mine and many others will know better than the behaviour he sees on offer from some of the lunatics at the football and that's because of you, nothing to do with Hibs.

All very good points and I find it hard to contradict any of them. Maybe my situation is slightly different to others in that I live in Berlin and want the wee man to follow the Hibee tradition.

I got hooked on Hibs long before I ever went to a game, my old man saw to that by making sure I was kitted out with Hibs gear and always promising me that he'd take me when I was BIG enough. That finally happened in 72 when I was 7 and at 7 I was old enough to understand that not all adults were nice and my Hibbiness had already been achieved.

At school there were 2 or 3 other Hibbies (Wallyford) and all the rest were Yams/Infirm fans, therefore I could feel a real substance in my Hibby identity. For my wee man I need to get him hooked before he starts school otherwise the Hibs thing will be too abstract and the chances are I'll be dragging him along to see Hertha and that is a scary thought. His first game (Calderwood's last) was when he was 3 and he loved every minute of it, soaking up all that was going on around him and singing Sunshine on Leith. However I'm still very apprehensive of taking him due to him not quite understanding what's normal behaviour and what's not.

Sorry if this post is a bit inconsistent but I'm sure other parents will understand the conflict of interests between trying to be a good parent and securing the Hibees line.

Hibbyradge
07-01-2013, 11:27 PM
They could drop the price to say £15.

I would rather have a full stadium paying £15 than half the stadium paying £23

Away fans have to pay double :-)

We've had low prices several times but it hasn't increased the attendance.

gegs70
07-01-2013, 11:48 PM
We've had low prices several times but it hasn't increased the attendance.

Thats probably because we've lowered the prices because we were sh#t. If you lower the prices and we were playing attractive fitba....no point flogging a dead horse!

aazza91
08-01-2013, 12:39 AM
I'm not sure if it is something that has been mentioned before but should the club maybe look at being able to buy a season type thing which will let you choose 9 home games throughout the season to attend. I know you get half seasons but I can't commit to every game due to changing shifts and it would be good to get some sort of discount for committing to the club where I can.

Thoughts?

Hibercelona
08-01-2013, 12:52 AM
A cut in wages shouldn't reduce the quality of our squad.

Other clubs in the league spent less on their squad and have a higher quality of squad than ours overall.

FifeHibernian
08-01-2013, 01:32 AM
I can honestly say, i have never spoken to someone who has not actively supported any football team who then went on to support a team (any team, not just the hibs) I seriously don't think Football in Scotland attracts new support. It seems to survive on a hereditary basis! (which seems to be trending backwards as would be expected if this was the case)

We also model our pricing structure on English clubs, but offering a lower quality of football.

I am not sure what the answer is, if there is one.

I'm one but I reckon I'm an exception.

500miles
08-01-2013, 02:45 AM
Attendances are attendances, almost entirely regardless of price. When we were playing well under TM and JC, we were getting high gates, even when paying full whack. You'd be lucky if you add much more than 1,000 on to the gate with lower prices, and Hibs would lose a fortune.

lord bunberry
08-01-2013, 07:56 AM
The life blood and future of any club depends on the fans being involved at an early age. If you don't get them young then chances are you won't get them at all. Bearing that in mind you have to create an environment that parents are willing to expose their kids to. There's various threads on the main board at the moment (smoking, Gorgie Billy Boys, spitting on ball boys etc.) that put doubt in my mind that ER is a place to take my boy. If Hibs can address some of these problems, then we'll be on the right tracks to encourage new fans to the games.

As a parent myself i agree with you but what i would.say is attending a match witht kids now is a hundred times better than it was when my dad first took me to a game in the 80s i think thee clubs do a pretty good job of making it a more family oriented day out

Jack
08-01-2013, 08:48 AM
Hibs haven't increased their prices for about 4 or 5 years so in effect have lowered the cost of going to football matches during that time. So 4 or 5 years ago was the most expensive football we have been subject to recently and it coincides with the biggest crowds (14k 07/08; 11k now).

As the real cost of football has come down so have the attendances.

I would put it to you ladies and gentlemen of the jury that lower costs to the individual have no direct effect of attendances.

I don’t think we should be doing much more around the schools, IMO we do enough and kids have no money.

We need to get slackers back and new blood in; folk with money now, because now is when we need it.

Carry on with the schools but lets get stuck into businesses in and around Edinburgh; the Scottish Government and other government departments; the NHS; the banks and insurance companies, the shops (for staff). In a lot of these places there's a core of staff Scottish born and bred but there's also a large number of interlopers, don’t tell me none have their own clubs ‘back home’ and just need tipped a bit in the direction of ER to spark an interest.

And don’t get me started on the 100,000+ students in Edinburgh's further education colleges and universities.

I’d imagine most of these folk also live in rented accommodation … lets get have a friendly word with letting agents.

Scouse Hibee
08-01-2013, 08:54 AM
All very good points and I find it hard to contradict any of them. Maybe my situation is slightly different to others in that I live in Berlin and want the wee man to follow the Hibee tradition.

I got hooked on Hibs long before I ever went to a game, my old man saw to that by making sure I was kitted out with Hibs gear and always promising me that he'd take me when I was BIG enough. That finally happened in 72 when I was 7 and at 7 I was old enough to understand that not all adults were nice and my Hibbiness had already been achieved.

At school there were 2 or 3 other Hibbies (Wallyford) and all the rest were Yams/Infirm fans, therefore I could feel a real substance in my Hibby identity. For my wee man I need to get him hooked before he starts school otherwise the Hibs thing will be too abstract and the chances are I'll be dragging him along to see Hertha and that is a scary thought. His first game (Calderwood's last) was when he was 3 and he loved every minute of it, soaking up all that was going on around him and singing Sunshine on Leith. However I'm still very apprehensive of taking him due to him not quite understanding what's normal behaviour and what's not.

Sorry if this post is a bit inconsistent but I'm sure other parents will understand the conflict of interests between trying to be a good parent and securing the Hibees line.

Living in Berlin certainly makes it more of a challenge but I'm sure you'll get the wee man round to your preferred way of thinking. :greengrin

I didn't take my laddie until he was seven and even then I was a bit over concerned of what was being spouted around him by some mindless idiots, the good thing is I know he has learnt better and they haven't that's the positive I take from it.

blackpoolhibs
08-01-2013, 09:08 AM
Thats probably because we've lowered the prices because we were sh#t. If you lower the prices and we were playing attractive fitba....no point flogging a dead horse!

So folk are complaining that the footballs not good enough for them to go and watch Hibs, and you suggest cutting the price which means cutting Fenlons budget, and then expect better football? :confused:

In case its escaped you, folk have been having a pop at the standard of football IN SCOTLAND for many years now, although i do agree football IS too expensive and its priced itself out for a lot of people.

Folk are not coming now because the standards dropped, can you explain to me how having less to spend will increase the standard we see now, and get those people back? :confused:

gegs70
08-01-2013, 10:21 AM
So folk are complaining that the footballs not good enough for them to go and watch Hibs, and you suggest cutting the price which means cutting Fenlons budget, and then expect better football? :confused:

In case its escaped you, folk have been having a pop at the standard of football IN SCOTLAND for many years now, although i do agree football IS too expensive and its priced itself out for a lot of people.

Folk are not coming now because the standards dropped, can you explain to me how having less to spend will increase the standard we see now, and get those people back? :confused:

I doubt they fans will come back to be honest. I think the only way forward is to bring through youth players.

Re cutting prices, Im not sure what the answer is but I know the product price is too much for what I have seen. The Derby game cost £28 - £30 for a poor game.

JimBHibees
08-01-2013, 10:28 AM
I doubt they fans will come back to be honest. I think the only way forward is to bring through youth players.

Re cutting prices, Im not sure what the answer is but I know the product price is too much for what I have seen. The Derby game cost £28 - £30 for a poor game.

There are poor games everywhere. Some of the EPL matches can be unwatchable.

Peevemor
08-01-2013, 10:38 AM
The easiest way to get people to part with their money (and thereby potentially increase attendances) is if they don't notice that it's happening. There has also been a lot of gnashing of teeth on here about ST payment plans and whether buying a ST represents a good 'deal'.

So why not set something up where people pay an amount to the club in advance, ie. you set up a monthly direct debit or standing order for your chosen amount. This goes into your 'club account' where it can be used for STs, individual tickets or in the club shop with an automatic discount of say 10 - 15% (as a reward for paying in advance).

For example;

An existing ST holder starts paying £30/month in March. At the end of June he'll have a balance of £120. He uses this toward renewing his ST at a discounted price (paying the balance of course) and in the meantime he continues his £30 payments. A year later when he comes to renew his ST, it'll be more or less paid for (minus any discounted tops, etc. he's bought in the Hibs shop).

I used £30/month as an example, but the amount could be chosen by the individual. It could also be structured so that no payments are taken in December and January (for example).

The system would have to be flexible so people could change their level of payment or even opt out whenever they wish. It could also be that discounts are only offered after, say, 3 or 4 months payment to avoid people taking advantage then opting out straight away.

I think this could increase attendances because if people have already paid (with money that they haven't really missed anyway) then they'll end up going.

blackpoolhibs
08-01-2013, 10:53 AM
I doubt they fans will come back to be honest. I think the only way forward is to bring through youth players.

Re cutting prices, Im not sure what the answer is but I know the product price is too much for what I have seen. The Derby game cost £28 - £30 for a poor game.

I agree the price in my opinion is the main reason all clubs are struggling to attract new support, and even keep some of the old ones.

Cutting the price just does not work if we want to keep the current standard of players, just imagine what it would be like if we cut prices?

If we go down that route and cut prices, we'd have to go down the youth route. Can you imagine our crowds if we did that, and results went pear shaped? Never mind the abuse those kids would get from the terraces, that would not be good to watch?

PatHead
08-01-2013, 11:04 AM
I know there are various incentives being discussed and looked at by Hibs. If you want to find out about them come to the LWT meetings and get a feel for what is being talked about.

I personally think that Hibs should offer a lower price if the ticket is purchased before matchday. We all know people who have pulled out of going on the day of the match through bad weather, hangover, can't be bothered or something cropping up. The irony is it actually costs you more (through the booking fee/post) if you commit to going early. Wouldn't need to be much even just a pound but I bet it would increase sales.

Green Fish
09-01-2013, 09:57 AM
In terms of potentially increasing long term supporters/next generation, couldn't we turn the several thousand empty seats into a positive, by grouping them together into a large area and giving out free tickets to schools for say primary 6 and 7 kids, and create a kind of school boy enclosure.

i can't imagine (could be wrong though lol) that a lot of kids would need too much in the way of stewarding, or if Hibs felt they could then we could adapt the idea to be parent plus child for free/£5 say.

The seats are empty now, we get no income from them. Whilst there would be no income still, there would be an uptake in food and possibly in the club store as well, not to mention the positive PR generated.

this could be tied to players doing visits to the schools for coaching sessions on a regular basis, meet and greet for the kids before matches with one or two players (particularly injured/suspended ones).

Spot on. Not enough is done to get new folk, young and old through the turnstiles. I have posted this on previous threads and been shot down. Yes there is good pricing on ST's but new people won't come and immediately sign up for ST's.

If you get a larger fan base then people will come back more and more frequently - once the kids are in the shop is a gold mine.

Father and son ticket for say £20 is a great idea for certain games.

I'm not saying the club are doing nothing because they clearly are but more could be done. My laddie was a mascot earleir in the season, he's hibs crazy and completely hooked - wish we could see more and more kids as enthusiastic as him.
I will not take him to another derby til his older, the atmosphere is poisonous and agree that kids section is a must. GG

gegs70
09-01-2013, 02:37 PM
Spot on. Not enough is done to get new folk, young and old through the turnstiles. I have posted this on previous threads and been shot down. Yes there is good pricing on ST's but new people won't come and immediately sign up for ST's.

If you get a larger fan base then people will come back more and more frequently - once the kids are in the shop is a gold mine.

Father and son ticket for say £20 is a great idea for certain games.

I'm not saying the club are doing nothing because they clearly are but more could be done. My laddie was a mascot earleir in the season, he's hibs crazy and completely hooked - wish we could see more and more kids as enthusiastic as him.
I will not take him to another derby til his older, the atmosphere is poisonous and agree that kids section is a must. GG

I agree we shouldnt always look at everything and say we are doing enough
When I went to my first match I thought, thtat was brilliant Im going to go to more often. And if we can get people to go to one or 2 matches perhaps they will enjoy the occasion. Perhaps invite fmilues to behind the goals for a drink pre-match make it an exciting day rather than judt 90minutes.

If we can get tge product better on the park build a better atmosphere (by the way section 43 do a fantastic job) then it will make a difference. The cost / price needs to be good too though.

blackpoolhibs
09-01-2013, 03:12 PM
Spot on. Not enough is done to get new folk, young and old through the turnstiles. I have posted this on previous threads and been shot down. Yes there is good pricing on ST's but new people won't come and immediately sign up for ST's.

If you get a larger fan base then people will come back more and more frequently - once the kids are in the shop is a gold mine.

Father and son ticket for say £20 is a great idea for certain games.

I'm not saying the club are doing nothing because they clearly are but more could be done. My laddie was a mascot earleir in the season, he's hibs crazy and completely hooked - wish we could see more and more kids as enthusiastic as him.
I will not take him to another derby til his older, the atmosphere is poisonous and agree that kids section is a must. GG

The club have done this, in fact they have given free tickets away? Just how much does a season ticket need to be diluted, before they say **** it, i will just become a pay at the gate fan now, its much cheaper?

marinello59
09-01-2013, 03:28 PM
The club have done this, in fact they have given free tickets away? Just how much does a season ticket need to be diluted, before they say **** it, i will just become a pay at the gate fan now, its much cheaper?

It doesn't matter how much you try and point out just how much the club has actually done, you will still get people posting over and over again that they do nothing....FACT. My Mum used to call it opening your mouth and letting yer belly grumble.

blackpoolhibs
09-01-2013, 03:38 PM
It doesn't matter how much you try and point out just how much the club has actually done, you will still get people posting over and over again that they do nothing....FACT. My Mum used to call it opening your mouth and letting yer belly grumble.

:agree:
My mum said rumble? :greengrin

Green Fish
09-01-2013, 07:34 PM
The club have done this, in fact they have given free tickets away? Just how much does a season ticket need to be diluted, before they say **** it, i will just become a pay at the gate fan now, its much cheaper?

I take your point but new people through the doors are possibly ST holders next season and beyond.

Green Fish
09-01-2013, 07:40 PM
The club have done this, in fact they have given free tickets away? Just how much does a season ticket need to be diluted, before they say **** it, i will just become a pay at the gate fan now, its much cheaper?

take your point but surely its a good thing to get new supporters who may turn out to be ST holdres in years to come??

Scouse Hibee
09-01-2013, 07:44 PM
The easiest way to get people to part with their money (and thereby potentially increase attendances) is if they don't notice that it's happening. There has also been a lot of gnashing of teeth on here about ST payment plans and whether buying a ST represents a good 'deal'.

So why not set something up where people pay an amount to the club in advance, ie. you set up a monthly direct debit or standing order for your chosen amount. This goes into your 'club account' where it can be used for STs, individual tickets or in the club shop with an automatic discount of say 10 - 15% (as a reward for paying in advance).

For example;

An existing ST holder starts paying £30/month in March. At the end of June he'll have a balance of £120. He uses this toward renewing his ST at a discounted price (paying the balance of course) and in the meantime he continues his £30 payments. A year later when he comes to renew his ST, it'll be more or less paid for (minus any discounted tops, etc. he's bought in the Hibs shop).

I used £30/month as an example, but the amount could be chosen by the individual. It could also be structured so that no payments are taken in December and January (for example).

The system would have to be flexible so people could change their level of payment or even opt out whenever they wish. It could also be that discounts are only offered after, say, 3 or 4 months payment to avoid people taking advantage then opting out straight away.

I think this could increase attendances because if people have already paid (with money that they haven't really missed anyway) then they'll end up going.

I paid my first instalment for my ST last year in April anyway!

Scouse Hibee
09-01-2013, 07:48 PM
I know there are various incentives being discussed and looked at by Hibs. If you want to find out about them come to the LWT meetings and get a feel for what is being talked about.

I personally think that Hibs should offer a lower price if the ticket is purchased before matchday. We all know people who have pulled out of going on the day of the match through bad weather, hangover, can't be bothered or something cropping up. The irony is it actually costs you more (through the booking fee/post) if you commit to going early. Wouldn't need to be much even just a pound but I bet it would increase sales.


Fully pre paid non refundable advance bookings just like hotels where you save yourself a fortune booking this way.

blackpoolhibs
09-01-2013, 08:23 PM
take your point but surely its a good thing to get new supporters who may turn out to be ST holdres in years to come??

Of course its a good thing to get new supporters, but its not a good thing to repeatedly piss off the ones that are actually going now, and paying FULL PRICE?

Green Fish
09-01-2013, 10:07 PM
Of course its a good thing to get new supporters, but its not a good thing to repeatedly piss off the ones that are actually going now, and paying FULL PRICE?

Again take your point - so whats the answer - not a simple resolution it would seem!! I like you pay the full price but would love to see a fuller ground week in week out.

gegs70
09-01-2013, 10:46 PM
The more fans we can pack into ER the better the atmosphere the more I and my 9 yr old will enjoy it. Plus the more food, merchandise we sell. Plus the players may get a boost from a bigger crowd.

blackpoolhibs
09-01-2013, 11:00 PM
Again take your point - so whats the answer - not a simple resolution it would seem!! I like you pay the full price but would love to see a fuller ground week in week out.

I'd like to see a fuller ground but if it becomes so obvious its much cheaper to patg less will be sold defeating the object.

gegs70
14-01-2013, 03:52 AM
Again take your point - so whats the answer - not a simple resolution it would seem!! I like you pay the full price but would love to see a fuller ground week in week out.

The answer for the future is to keep groups coming to ER, kids with their friens, families, groups who play foorball together. Then gi for drinks or food or coffee, we need to attract groups of people and make it great value for money. We need to think about future too!

Keith_M
14-01-2013, 05:54 PM
...............

At school there were 2 or 3 other Hibbies (Wallyford) and all the rest were Yams/Infirm fans, therefore I could feel a real substance in my Hibby identity. .


.....and you were just a part-timer, ya Radge :na na:

shetlandhibee
14-01-2013, 06:09 PM
Not so much letting folk in for free, I don't think Hibs should do that. But more dropping the price by at least £5. I think in doing so more fans would attend. That's just my opinion of course and i do realise the board must try and get as much as they can for the club. But there are other ways they could do things better like in every business I just hope they maybe look into these things.

at least for one game for an experiment:aok:

marinello59
14-01-2013, 06:14 PM
at least for one game for an experiment:aok:

So dropping the the cost by less than the cost of a couple of pints will have folk pouring in to the ground in large enough numbers to cover the cost of the 'experiment.' Which has already been proved not to work elsewhere.

Gatecrasher
14-01-2013, 06:29 PM
http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20130114/first-foot-us_2262950_3041362


The first game of 2013 is a Hibs Kids game and we are also encouraging supporters to bring a child along to their first Hibs match. This weekend, under-11s can get in for a fiver when accompanied by a full paying adult. The offer is available to all Hibernian supporters and tickets need to be purchased in advance and collected by 5pm on Friday 18 January at the Ticket Desk within the Hibernian Clubstore (opening hours, 10am-5pm, Monday to Saturday).

Bring a Kid for a Fiver

3pm
14-01-2013, 06:30 PM
If we'd attacked Hearts on 3 Jan we might have won the game and attracted a few back.

Hibrandenburg
14-01-2013, 06:37 PM
.....and you were just a part-timer, ya Radge :na na:

Oi, I'll have you know I was going to Easter Road while you were still blonde ya Bam :na na:

CREESE
14-01-2013, 08:25 PM
I don't think so, I am a "club member" and I have not had one piece of correspondence from the club email or otherwise since I signed up this time last year. I really was expecting something around the season ticket renewal date along the lines of "Why don't you upgrade to a full season ticket member etc......" Not a thing! Costs nothing to put a weekly/monthly email together for all registered members.

I recently bought two tickets for my Dad and I using our club membership cards - I was able to purchase the tickets and add them to the cards, but when we got to the game, they didn't work. Took 30 mins to sort out at ticket office. Response from club was that they had expire, however, we have had no communication from the club regarding renewing these and there is absolutely nothing of the official club website about how to do this or take out a new club membership.

Baldy Foghorn
14-01-2013, 08:35 PM
So dropping the the cost by less than the cost of a couple of pints will have folk pouring in to the ground in large enough numbers to cover the cost of the 'experiment.' Which has already been proved not to work elsewhere.

Exactly, is there any correlation (provided with facts and figures) that shows increased crowds due to reduced pricing??? As Gary (BH) has already said, we can't continue dropping pricing to effectively render the buying of a season ticket meaningless......Season Ticket sales are vitally important for PF's budget, and diluting their worth should not occur IMO