Official Site: Bigger Crowds, Bigger Kitty

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Help strengthen your team



More... (http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20121219/bigger-crowds-bigger-kitty_2262950_3014279)

[Mikey]

Light blue touchpaper.

Retreat.

[Keith_M]

Bigger Kitty?



I always imagined Rod as Blofeld from the Bond films and this finally confirms it. :greengrin

[blackpoolhibs]

We wont get anywhere near the 17k we got against Ayr in 1973.

[Beefster]

I thought their marketing was unimaginative before Rodders took charge again. Eventually, they'll realise emotional blackmail isn't going to work on a lot of stayaways this time.

[Gatecrasher]

I thought their marketing was unimaginative before Rodders took charge again. Eventually, they'll realise emotional blackmail isn't going to work on a lot of stayaways this time.
The truth isn't blackmail.

[JohnStephens91]

Going to the shops for beer and snacks, this could be good :greengrin

[Beefster]

The truth isn't blackmail.

It can be when it's your only tactic to get folk to part with their cash.

[Mikey]

Going to the shops for beer and snacks, this could be good :greengrin

Yep. A lot of Hibs supporters take great offence when the club asks for their support :agree:

[Gatecrasher]

It can be when it's your only tactic to get folk to part with their cash.
The club are just telling it how it is, there isn't anything wrong with that. Infact it should be encouraged.

[Keith_M]

I really can't be bothered reading the article but I take it the sales of Half Season Tickets aren't great.


TBH, that's a shame but you can't judge someone for not deciding to invest their money.

[mikethehibee69]

So we fill the stadium and we sign Messi? :wink:

Agree that we need a better support, but the product has to be worth watching!!!! And before anyone shoots me down:tin hat: I'm a season ticket holder, team need to believe again and start playing for the strip, the fans, the manager and stop thinking they just have to turn up. Show some steel and desire and hopefully 3 points on Saturday. Apologies for the rant, I've been cleaning our oven and its the fumes :wink:

[marinello59]

Light blue touchpaper.

Retreat.

Aye, no doubt some will use this statement to give the club another kicking. The only thing they could be found guilty of here is stating the bleeding obvious. It's OUR club, it really is up to us how much Pat Fenlon has to play with in the transfer window. I look forward to several posts using the oh so predictable emotional blackmail line.

[Beefster]

The club are just telling it how it is, there isn't anything wrong with that. Infact it should be encouraged.

That would be valid if there were other initiatives to get folk to buy tickets. There aren't.

[Spike Mandela]

It can be when it's your only tactic to get folk to part with their cash.

Ultimately, is that not one of the main objectives of the Hibs board?

[Stevie Reid]

Infinitely better than begging for cash any which way you can to stop your club being liquidated, creating a share issue and lying about what the funds are for, only raising half your target for said share issue and making threats of a dire future, but still talking about signing players in January. As another club recently did.

[Beefster]

Ultimately, is that not one of the main objectives of the Hibs board?

Yup. I think you've misunderstood what I'm objecting to.

[Gatecrasher]

That would be valid if there were other initiatives to get folk to buy tickets. There aren't.
You buy a ticket, attend the game and the money goes into trying to improving the team. That's how it works and has done all around the world for a long time. Ticket initiatives and marketing are completely different to what that statement tells us. Hibs are asking for our support if you don't want to then don't its not blackmail.

[scoopyboy]

You buy a ticket, attend the game and the money goes into trying to improving the team. That's how it works and has done all around the world for a long time. Ticket initiatives and marketing are completely different to what that statement tells us. Hibs are asking for our support if you don't want to then don't its not blackmail.

How about a slight revamp.

Improve the team, sell more tickets, get more money in.

It's the same slant all the time.

How about them thanking the fans for the cup turn out, the great uptake of slates/tiles and the reward is they are going to improve the team on the strength of recent financial income.

[Beefster]

You buy a ticket, attend the game and the money goes into trying to improving the team. That's how it works and has done all around the world for a long time. Ticket initiatives and marketing are completely different to what that statement tells us. Hibs are asking for our support if you don't want to then don't its not blackmail.

You're right, I do. Every year.

Thanks for the permission not to, if I should choose, though.

[Gatecrasher]

How about a slight revamp.

Improve the team, sell more tickets, get more money in.

It's the same slant all the time.

How about them thanking the fans for the cup turn out, the great uptake of slates/tiles and the reward is they are going to improve the team on the strength of recent financial income.
Of course, there is no doubt in my mind thats what Hibs have been doing since the start of the season.


You're right, I do. Every year.

Thanks for the permission not to, if I should choose, though.
:rolleyes:

[Big_Franck]

I try to be as positive as possible with all things Hibs (hard at times i'm sure you'll agree), but I am getting a bit sick of these almost weekly pleas for fans to buy tickets. Is this what we should expect before every home game now?

At the end of the day we all know that the more tickets we sell, the more money Fenlon will have to spend in January. However, the reality is that people will attend games if they can afford to, and if they want to, not because of messages like these on the official site.

I can appreciate why they do it, but I just dont want to see the club begging more people to attend every time I visit the official site.

[Ozyhibby]

Can't see much wrong with the statement. I'm actually quite pleased that the club appear to be considering some activity during the window.
Certainly better than the out and out begging going on at the PBS.

[Hibercelona]

I think fans would be more eager to part with their cash if they were confident that it would be well spent. This hasn't been the case in recent years.

Fans can't be blamed for their lack of trust towards the board. They don't exactly fill many of us with great confidence.

[Iain G]

I try to be as positive as possible with all things Hibs (hard at times i'm sure you'll agree), but I am getting a bit sick of these almost weekly pleas for fans to buy tickets. Is this what we should expect before every home game now?

At the end of the day we all know that the more tickets we sell, the more money Fenlon will have to spend in January. However, the reality is that people will attend games if they can afford to, and if they want to, not because of messages like these on the official site.

I can appreciate why they do it, but I just dont want to see the club begging more people to attend every time I visit the official site.

Well quit visiting the official site then ;-)

[Iain G]

Can't see much wrong with the statement. I'm actually quite pleased that the club appear to be considering some activity during the window.
Certainly better than the out and out begging going on at the PBS.

It is a little bit stating the obvious i suppose but they are really only re-emphasising what they have already told us and i dont see any major issues with the statement. Got tickets for both games now so doing my wee bit when home, just hope that the catering has improved since my last visit or I will no be happy ;-)

[blackpoolhibs]

I think fans would be more eager to part with their cash if they were confident that it would be well spent. This hasn't been the case in recent years.

Fans can't be blamed for their lack of trust towards the board. They don't exactly fill many of us with great confidence.

Well this manager has us sitting 4th, we have been top too. Fenlon has shown in a short time he can change a club from 2nd bottom to top 4, the board have backed every manager we have had, they have spent the money on dross, its time for us to back Pats team.

[Hibercelona]

Well this manager has us sitting 4th, we have been top too. Fenlon has shown in a short time he can change a club from 2nd bottom to top 4, the board have backed every manager we have had, they have spent the money on dross, its time for us to back Pats team.

He hasn't proven anything yet, the season is far from over and could still end in a flop.

It's easy to say "lets back the team this time", but it's been the same story for every manager that has came in to the club. A lot of people just don't have anything left to give.

Its about time the board start showing their worth and make do with the money that does come in, because they still get far more coming in than most clubs in the SPL.

There's no excuse for being bellow teams like Inverness and Motherwell. Even a low Hibs crowd is generally a much bigger crowd than the average ICT or Motherwell crowd.

[HibbyDave]

Maybe Hibs should try to arrange a glamour match designed exclusively to raise transfer funds?

I know there would be costs involved to invite a big club, especially at festive season. The european comps are on the back burner till Feb though so maybe a one off tie with a larger English/ European club could be arranged? What size of crowd would Liverpool/Man city/ Man utd attract? Also, what would that cost? I don't know but I also don't know if our board even look at other ways to get people through the doors at ER.

I never renewed season ticket, in fact I have not been back to ER since "that day" in May. I think that I and many others, need something different to tempt fans back. A one-off match to raise real funds for PF would be of interest.
Maybe ask Huddersfield to come to ER since we went there at the start of the season? Perhaps Rapid Bucharest could fulfill the friendly they couldn't make at the start of the season?

Any thoughts?

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

Nothing new to see here.
Sometimes, if you have **** all to say, then it is best to say **** all.
This is like a party political broadcast but to a demographic that has no floating floaters.
You have either bought into this and you will, or haven't and you won't.

[Saorsa]

Maybe Hibs should try to arrange a glamour match designed exclusively to raise transfer funds?

I know there would be costs involved to invite a big club, especially at festive season. The european comps are on the back burner till Feb though so maybe a one off tie with a larger English/ European club could be arranged? What size of crowd would Liverpool/Man city/ Man utd attract? Also, what would that cost? I don't know but I also don't know if our board even look at other ways to get people through the doors at ER.

I never renewed season ticket, in fact I have not been back to ER since "that day" in May. I think that I and many others, need something different to tempt fans back. A one-off match to raise real funds for PF would be of interest.

Any thoughts?So you'd rather go and watch the team play a meaningless friendly than back them in competitive matches? Personally I cannae really be bothered with friendlies, usually get dragged along as part of the day out with the lads but I can live without them.

[Iain G]

Maybe Hibs should try to arrange a glamour match designed exclusively to raise transfer funds?

I know there would be costs involved to invite a big club, especially at festive season. The european comps are on the back burner till Feb though so maybe a one off tie with a larger English/ European club could be arranged? What size of crowd would Liverpool/Man city/ Man utd attract? Also, what would that cost? I don't know but I also don't know if our board even look at other ways to get people through the doors at ER.

I never renewed season ticket, in fact I have not been back to ER since "that day" in May. I think that I and many others, need something different to tempt fans back. A one-off match to raise real funds for PF would be of interest.

Any thoughts?

Crowds are slowly rising this season most likely due to a winning team, no Rangers and us being near the top of the league, personally if I was lapsed fan and in Edinburgh I would be buying a half season ticket based on the turnaround from last season. I think the issue is still cost for a lot of people given the financial uncertainty that is still foremost in the minds of many people and our fanbase will reach a critical mass of season ticket holders who can and will pay for that and those who pick and choose games for whatever reasons. The club need to convert these walk ups to half seasons or encourage those back who have completely fallen out of love with our club; this isnt easy but they are trying and being fairly open with suporters at present as to how we can all play out part!

It is swings and roundabouts, winning team means bigger crowds means more money means better players means more certainty of good performances means bigger crowds etc...would the club signing Leigh at themoment on a full time deal attract the crowds back, can they afford to take that gamble or can they afford not to gamble as it could affect our upward spiral? Its a hell of a dilema for them either way given the current state of Scottish football finances....

[blackpoolhibs]

He hasn't proven anything yet, the season is far from over and could still end in a flop.

Superb, lets look at how bad it could get, even though we are doing well NOW? :rolleyes:

It's easy to say "lets back the team this time", but it's been the same story for every manager that has came in to the club. A lot of people just don't have anything left to give.

You are right, sorry everyone keep your money and whatever you do dont give any of it to Hibs.

Its about time the board start showing their worth and make do with the money that does come in, because they still get far more coming in than most clubs in the SPL.

And they give the manager whoever it is more than most, its those managers who have brought the dross, not the board?

There's no excuse for being bellow teams like Inverness and Motherwell. Even a low Hibs crowd is generally a much bigger crowd than the average ICT or Motherwell crowd.

Yet now we have a team up there fighting for a european place, and in among those teams, you would rather we kept quiet and told people to keep their money. Pat needs to get rid and replace a few of those fringe players, thats only done by letting their contracts run down or keeping them.

Do you think the team we currently have is good enough to finish 2nd 3rd or 4th?

[Captain Trips]

Unfortunatly the board can state this forever the point is the 2k-4k floating fans (My opinion of the numbers), Will not pay money and wait for a team to be built rightly or wrongly that is it.

The manager therefore has to simply find players on next to nothing in order for us to improve to win matches and get folk back, therefore you need a top drawer manager or the best we can afford in order to do this and carry a bit of luck IMO PF isnt able to do this task.

[Iain G]

Unfortunatly the board can state this forever the point is the 2k-4k floating fans (My opinion of the numbers), Will not pay money and wait for a team to be built rightly or wrongly that is it.

The manager therefore has to simply find players on next to nothing in order for us to improve to win matches and get folk back, therefore you need a top drawer manager or the best we can afford in order to do this and carry a bit of luck IMO PF isnt able to do this task.

He seems to be more able than most of his recent predecesors!!

[Captain Trips]

Crowds are slowly rising this season most likely due to a winning team, no Rangers and us being near the top of the league, personally if I was lapsed fan and in Edinburgh I would be buying a half season ticket based on the turnaround from last season. I think the issue is still cost for a lot of people given the financial uncertainty that is still foremost in the minds of many people and our fanbase will reach a critical mass of season ticket holders who can and will pay for that and those who pick and choose games for whatever reasons. The club need to convert these walk ups to half seasons or encourage those back who have completely fallen out of love with our club; this isnt easy but they are trying and being fairly open with suporters at present as to how we can all play out part!

It is swings and roundabouts, winning team means bigger crowds means more money means better players means more certainty of good performances means bigger crowds etc...would the club signing Leigh at themoment on a full time deal attract the crowds back, can they afford to take that gamble or can they afford not to gamble as it could affect our upward spiral? Its a hell of a dilema for them either way given the current state of Scottish football finances....

I think its a tough job, signing LG would be great but wouldnt add any more onto the gate imo as folk are used to him now, I have no idea where they are but to make a dent on the crowds based simply on a signing you need a Sauzee and a Latapy with a Zitelli in January and that is a near impossible task.

[Hibercelona]

Yet now we have a team up there fighting for a european place, and in among those teams, you would rather we kept quiet and told people to keep their money. Pat needs to get rid and replace a few of those fringe players, thats only done by letting their contracts run down or keeping them.

Do you think the team we currently have is good enough to finish 2nd 3rd or 4th?

Why are you making things up?

I never said anything about fans holding onto their money. I simply stated that a lot of fans just don't have the money there to give in the first place.

The board appoint the managers. If a manager isn't doing a good enough job, then the board have to take responsibility for appointing them in the first place.

The club has said repeatedly that they need 11,000 fans to turn up to each game in order to break even. How many fans would be required to break even, if they weren't still paying off duds that they made the mistake of hiring in the first place?

The club are struggling because of poor decisions the board have made. Putting fans on a guilt trip isn't going to win them back.

The board already have a financial advantage over most clubs in the league. They should be using that advantage, instead of requesting even more money.

[Captain Trips]

He seems to be more able than most of his recent predecesors!!

More able yes, but not able enough IMO.

[Iain G]

Why are you making things up?

I never said anything about fans holding onto their money. I simply stated that a lot of fans just don't have the money there to give in the first place.

The board appoint the managers. If a manager isn't doing a good enough job, then the board have to take responsibility for appointing them in the first place.

The club has said repeatedly that they need 11,000 fans to turn up to each game in order to break even. How many fans would be required to break even, if they weren't still paying off duds that they made the mistake of hiring in the first place?

The club are struggling because of poor decisions the board have made. Putting fans on a guilt trip isn't going to win them back.

The board already have a financial advantage over most clubs in the league. They should be using that advantage, instead of requesting even more money.

Its doesnt read like a guilt trip to me, they are just stating the bleeding obvious!!

[Billy Whizz]

I'll think we'll get a decent crowd against County on Boxing Day

[blackpoolhibs]

Why are you making things up?

I never said anything about fans holding onto their money. I simply stated that a lot of fans just don't have the money there to give in the first place.

The board appoint the managers. If a manager isn't doing a good enough job, then the board have to take responsibility for appointing them in the first place.

The club has said repeatedly that they need 11,000 fans to turn up to each game in order to break even. How many fans would be required to break even, if they weren't still paying off duds that they made the mistake of hiring in the first place?

The club are struggling because of poor decisions the board have made. Putting fans on a guilt trip isn't going to win them back.

The board already have a financial advantage over most clubs in the league. They should be using that advantage, instead of requesting even more money.

You started it, you keep going on about how we will have a slump? I have read the same piece you have, and i dont read it as a guilt trip, can you point me to where its saying that?

We all know how bad we have been, yet now we are getting better we have folk like you who cant let the past go?

Why when we are on the up are you focusing on the past, do you enjoy being miserable? I only ask as that question was asked of me when i moaned about just how bad we were, but now its better i have no need to moan, no need to look back. I suppose its each to their own?

[HibbyDave]

So you'd rather go and watch the team play a meaningless friendly than back them in competitive matches? Personally I cannae really be bothered with friendlies, usually get dragged along as part of the day out with the lads but I can live without them.


Not what I am saying at all. I simply suggested an initiative to help give funds to PF. Personally, I have had enough of the SP hell and the proposed variants being touted (revised leagues etc etc). So as far as SP Hell games go I'm out for the foreseeable future.

As a one-off concept though, I think a glamour match or mini tournament has some merit.

Instead of attacking ideas such as mine, maybe you could suggest something that hibs could do to generate cash?

[Iain G]

You started it, you keep going on about how we will have a slump? I have read the same piece you have, and i dont read it as a guilt trip, can you point me to where its saying that?

We all know how bad we have been, yet now we are getting better we have folk like you who cant let the past go?

Why when we are on the up are you focusing on the past, do you enjoy being miserable? I only ask as that question was asked of me when i moaned about just how bad we were, but now its better i have no need to moan, no need to look back. I suppose its each to their own?

Mayb only those with a guilty conscience see it as a guilt trip ;-)

[Saorsa]

Not what I am saying at all. I simply suggested an initiative to help give funds to PF. Personally, I have had enough of the SP hell and the proposed variants being touted (revised leagues etc etc). So as far as SP Hell games go I'm out for the foreseeable future.

As a one-off concept though, I think a glamour match or mini tournament has some merit.

Instead of attacking ideas such as mine, maybe you could suggest something that hibs could do to generate cash?In your first post you propose a game as something tae tempt fans back then in this one you say you're no going back anyway. I think we have enough games and few enough players without risking injury tae them in friendlies in the middle of the season.

[HibbyDave]

Just thought we could add ideas to help Hibs raise funds for transfer/wages ONLY.

I thought it could become a positve ideas generator to list things here? Never knew you can only post ideas if you are fully commited to attend every game.....things must have changed after 40 plus years of watching hibs.

What I said was that as far as SPL goes I am out.



Share issue anyone?

[Beefster]

I have read the same piece you have, and i dont read it as a guilt trip, can you point me to where its saying that?

It's a guilt trip IMHO because it implies that if folk don't buy tickets, it'll be their fault if Hibs cannot strengthen or keep players in January. The fact that this is the only marketing strategy coming out of ER these days also fails to recognise why a lot of people are staying away and address the issues.

There's a reason why, in the main, marketing folk don't just resort to "buy our stuff or nice things won't happen"-type stuff in adverts.

[Stevie Reid]

Unfortunatly the board can state this forever the point is the 2k-4k floating fans (My opinion of the numbers), Will not pay money and wait for a team to be built rightly or wrongly that is it.

The manager therefore has to simply find players on next to nothing in order for us to improve to win matches and get folk back, therefore you need a top drawer manager or the best we can afford in order to do this and carry a bit of luck IMO PF isnt able to do this task.

So even though this season so far has shown that he is capable of it, you don't think he is?

[scoopyboy]

Its doesnt read like a guilt trip to me, they are just stating the bleeding obvious!!

They are, again and again and again.

[blackpoolhibs]

It's a guilt trip IMHO because it implies that if folk don't buy tickets, it'll be their fault if Hibs cannot strengthen or keep players in January. The fact that this is the only marketing strategy coming out of ER these days also fails to recognise why a lot of people are staying away and address the issues.

There's a reason why, in the main, marketing folk don't just resort to "buy our stuff or nice things won't happen"-type stuff in adverts.

Just read in in full again, it says no such thing?

[lord bunberry]

He hasn't proven anything yet, the season is far from over and could still end in a flop.

It's easy to say "lets back the team this time", but it's been the same story for every manager that has came in to the club. A lot of people just don't have anything left to give.

Its about time the board start showing their worth and make do with the money that does come in, because they still get far more coming in than most clubs in the SPL.

There's no excuse for being bellow teams like Inverness and Motherwell. Even a low Hibs crowd is generally a much bigger crowd than the average ICT or Motherwell crowd.

Your saying on one hand that we have achieved nothing so far this season then later your saying we should never be below teams like inverness or motherwell when surely the end of the season is the time to judge both. Tbh i doubt you will ever be happy

[Stevie Reid]

This thread would be hilarious if it wasn't so depressing. People on here laugh at the predicament that Hearts are in and the empty promises and thinly veiled threats that Fedotovas has delivered lately, yet our board gets slaughtered for a perfectly reasonable statement like that one.

We have improved hugely thus far, and are doing well at the moment, yet folk are having a go because we were crap, and could be again. Happy days...

[lyonhibs]

Just read in in full again, it says no such thing?

That's the difference between overtly stating something, and implicitly implying it.

[3pm]

I don't think it's that bad.

However, it is an expensive time and there are certain fans that won't find that extra £25 until they aren't convinced real progress has been made.

[hibs4thecup1988]

My take on it at the end of the day is that Petrie knows there are 13k fans kicking around. He will also be aware how many are on the database.

What we should be doing is sending out a mail shot asking why the people are not coming to ER. Do some real marketing for once.

Posts on the official site don't matter a jot. The AGM was on the monday before the Motherwell game and we got our lowest crowd of the season. That was after Petries last request.

We have found that it doesn't matter if we ask people to come out cause they won't just do it when asked. The team have to do it on the park and there would have been a lot of people waiting till about now for the half season tickets. And let's be honest the last few weeks have been dire. No surprise that the half seasons haven't been selling well.

Oh and btw I go home and away!

[Keith_M]

That's the difference between overtly stating something, and implicitly implying it.


Surely one of those words is redundant?



Anyway, can we PLEASE get back to the actual point of the thread!!! Is there any news on what breed of cat it is? Maybe the colour?

[marinello59]

Unfortunatly the board can state this forever the point is the 2k-4k floating fans (My opinion of the numbers), Will not pay money and wait for a team to be built rightly or wrongly that is it.

The manager therefore has to simply find players on next to nothing in order for us to improve to win matches and get folk back, therefore you need a top drawer manager or the best we can afford in order to do this and carry a bit of luck IMO PF isnt able to do this task.

It takes a special kind of whinger to use that statement as an excuse to attack the manager. Well done. :thumbsup:

[Antifa Hibs]

Do people still actually still goto the fitba for the actual fitba? :faf:

For me, for seasons its about getting pished, and Leith's great for that :cb

The bigger crowds at ER years back would obviously been made up of neutrals/"fair weather" fans who have now sadly been priced out. Had a "Celtic fan" and "Newcastle fan" ask about getting them tickets for the Derby, both died of laughter when I told them it'll be about £32. Massive fitba fans but not into any team.

Unless your mad into a team, who the **** is gonna pay the money they are asking for the fitba we see? Not like you can stand on the terraces with a smoke and a beer and have the banter that comes with it.

The older generation of Hibbys are slowly moving on, leaves you with your "mid generation 60-30 year olds" and a small amount of under 30 year olds. The younger generation under 25 say don't give a flying **** about the game, for all clubs. More interested in snorting ching in a local pub or playing CoD or watching Man Utd. With the youngsters not coming through the gates to replace and add to the oldies along with the nuetrals/part-timers, Scottish fitba is slowly finding its levels. Every club is the same. No amount of marketing campaigns are gonna change that.

[FranckSuzy]

IMHO, the thread below provided the ideal opportunity for those who do not wish (for whatever reason) to buy a ST for themselves but who still wished to contribute to the club in some way. There have been other threads suggesting that a fund to be set-up to provide funds for the manager to spend directly on players. The question is, who is going to put their money where their mouth is, like some supporters have done?

http://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?250572-**Kicks-For-Kids-Half-Season-Tickets-33-ST-s-Purchased-(Closing-Mon-17th)

[Ray_]

I try to be as positive as possible with all things Hibs (hard at times i'm sure you'll agree), but I am getting a bit sick of these almost weekly pleas for fans to buy tickets. Is this what we should expect before every home game now?

At the end of the day we all know that the more tickets we sell, the more money Fenlon will have to spend in January. However, the reality is that people will attend games if they can afford to, and if they want to, not because of messages like these on the official site.

I can appreciate why they do it, but I just dont want to see the club begging more people to attend every time I visit the official site.

It was exactly the same tactic by Petrie when McLeish was in charge, all the money raised through tickets was going to be spent on the team, this was the same time as he was saying "we do not need to sell Miller" & just after KM was sold, it was we have a massive debt and need to cut back. The last statement being the only one that resembled anything like the truth.

[Ray_]

This thread would be hilarious if it wasn't so depressing. People on here laugh at the predicament that Hearts are in and the empty promises and thinly veiled threats that Fedotovas has delivered lately, yet our board gets slaughtered for a perfectly reasonable statement like that one.

We have improved hugely thus far, and are doing well at the moment, yet folk are having a go because we were crap, and could be again. Happy days...

We are crap, just not as crap as we were before, that's why we are struggling for crowds.

[Stevie Reid]

I'm going to post this in more than one thread as it's relevant in more than one thread. I have said a few times recently that some of the football we have played has been the best since the early days of Collins, and that I believe that Fenlon has just signed more good players and significantly improved us more in one summer transfer window than any manager since Mowbray, which got me thinking.

Mowbray took over when we were at a real low ebb after the Williamson era and the League Cup Final defeat to Livi - ok it wasn't exactly narrowly missing out on relegation and being hammered 5-1 in the Scottish Cup Final by Hearts, but it was a bad time and outwith 4-0 and 5-1, that 2-0 defeat to Livingston was the worst I had ever felt as a Hibbie.

Given that we had finished in 8th place the previous season and had lots of promising youngsters coming through, you can certainly argue that Mowbray came into a better situation than Fenlon did when he came in last year, and after the Cup Final - both had similar financial restraints that had come about because of the a financial situation caused by the collapse of SPL TV, and the Rangers situation, respectively.

Now after 18 games of this season we are sitting on 27 points from 8 wins, 3 draws and 7 losses. After the first 18 league games of Mowbray's tenure we had 30 points, coming from 9 wins, 3 draws and 6 losses. I think Fenlon has been as much of a breath of fresh air as Mowbray was in terms of the transformation of how enjoyable the match day experience is, what he has to say as a manager, and how I feel as a Hibs season ticket holder compared to a few months earlier.

Whilst the football isn't as good as it was under Mowbray (who had a better starting point), one of the biggest criticisms of Mowbray's team was that it was soft, easily bullied, and couldn't dig in at times - this season we have a good amount of football in us, but have also demonstrated a harder, more physical edge to us, and have won games when we have been under the cosh (another thing that many stated that TM's team was incapable of doing). Playing well and losing has shown to be a possibility with both teams thus far.

My Dad compared the game on Saturday to the 4-4 draw with Dundee at the start of the Mowbray season, when we were 4-1 up with less than half an hour to go, in that although the final result was disappointing, you could see enough to feel very confident that better results weren't far away (in many ways the Aberdeen home defeat was similar to the 1-0 home defeat we suffered against Killie on the opening day of the TM season IMO), and I think that is a very good and very valid comparison.

We have made giant strides this season, just like we had by 18 games into the Mowbray season, and I see much cause for optimism, just like I did back then - one big difference is that with no Rangers this season, the SPL is more exciting and more unpredictable than it's ever been. I truly cannot understand the negativity that comes from so many on here at the moment, especially when reacting to a simple statement of a simple fact from the board.

After the disater that was last season, many people stated that they would be happy to see a gradual improvement in us, as long as the signs of progress were there - many also wanted a more physical, street smart team that was more resilient and wouldn't buckle easily. Well Fenlon has brought much of that in a much quicker timescale than many of us thought possible, and the signs are very much there that he can continue to improve us.

Yes, recent results (and some performances) have been very disappointing, and there is a long way to go, but all the good that he has done hasn't just evaporated in the last 6 games (in which we have just enjoyed one of our most satisfying victories ever over Hearts and made them shortest reigning SC champions ever). I'm loving this season, and am optimistic that that will continue.

[blackpoolhibs]

We are crap, just not as crap as we were before, that's why we are struggling for crowds.

And going on about it does what exactly?

Why did i stand in 6-8k crowds watching the tornadoes?

[Beefster]

Just read in in full again, it says no such thing?

Yeah, that's why I said 'implies'.

[blackpoolhibs]

Yeah, that's why I said 'implies'.

It asks us to come and watch football at easter road, would you prefer it if it asked us to stay away?

Its stating facts, we all know them. The more bums on seats the more the manager has to spend, i really dont see what the club have done wrong here? :confused:

[HiBremian]

Do people still actually still goto the fitba for the actual fitba? :faf:

For me, for seasons its about getting pished, and Leith's great for that :cb

The bigger crowds at ER years back would obviously been made up of neutrals/"fair weather" fans who have now sadly been priced out. Had a "Celtic fan" and "Newcastle fan" ask about getting them tickets for the Derby, both died of laughter when I told them it'll be about £32. Massive fitba fans but not into any team.

Unless your mad into a team, who the **** is gonna pay the money they are asking for the fitba we see? Not like you can stand on the terraces with a smoke and a beer and have the banter that comes with it.

The older generation of Hibbys are slowly moving on, leaves you with your "mid generation 60-30 year olds" and a small amount of under 30 year olds. The younger generation under 25 say don't give a flying **** about the game, for all clubs. More interested in snorting ching in a local pub or playing CoD or watching Man Utd. With the youngsters not coming through the gates to replace and add to the oldies along with the nuetrals/part-timers, Scottish fitba is slowly finding its levels. Every club is the same. No amount of marketing campaigns are gonna change that.

Pretty fair analysis there, Antifa.:wink: To which I'd add that if you want bigger crowds, just look at the countries where that's happening (like here in germany) - entrance prices are way lower. To which I'd also add that it ain't rocket science to understand why - private wealth has rocketed over the last 10 years, but 99% of it is in the hands of the mega-rich. We ordinary folk have been financially f***ed. Which leads to the last FACT. If you want people to cough up more cash, best ask the 1% of the population that now have all the disposable income to cough up in the first place.:cb

[Ray_]

Do people still actually still goto the fitba for the actual fitba? :faf:

For me, for seasons its about getting pished, and Leith's great for that :cb

The bigger crowds at ER years back would obviously been made up of neutrals/"fair weather" fans who have now sadly been priced out. Had a "Celtic fan" and "Newcastle fan" ask about getting them tickets for the Derby, both died of laughter when I told them it'll be about £32. Massive fitba fans but not into any team.

Unless your mad into a team, who the **** is gonna pay the money they are asking for the fitba we see? Not like you can stand on the terraces with a smoke and a beer and have the banter that comes with it.

The older generation of Hibbys are slowly moving on, leaves you with your "mid generation 60-30 year olds" and a small amount of under 30 year olds. The younger generation under 25 say don't give a flying **** about the game, for all clubs. More interested in snorting ching in a local pub or playing CoD or watching Man Utd. With the youngsters not coming through the gates to replace and add to the oldies along with the nuetrals/part-timers, Scottish fitba is slowly finding its levels. Every club is the same. No amount of marketing campaigns are gonna change that.

The late sixties onwards, the bigger crowds came out when there was big games, otherwise they were even worse than today. I remember the East Fife game in 73 when 17,000 turned up, that was a massive crowd for a league match against such opposition in January, but see what the team had to do to attract such a bumper crowd. The season's average was always boosted by the games against the infirm, hearts and cup & European games.

It was always good the early season games because peoples expectations were usually higher at that stage and if Hibs became mediocre, then so would the crowds, six and seven thousand were anything but unheard of.

[Greendub]

Me and my brother have tickets for both, so just get them signed tache eh

[Stevie Reid]

We are crap, just not as crap as we were before, that's why we are struggling for crowds.

Deary me.

[.Sean.]

And going on about it does what exactly?

Why did i stand in 6-8k crowds watching the tornadoes?
Why were crowds as low as that?

[Ray_]

And going on about it does what exactly?

Why did i stand in 6-8k crowds watching the tornadoes?

See above for the TT's. What is the point of going on about something that is never going to happen? You and I both know that people don't show unless there's something they want to see. No amount of bating and badgering will change that.

Petrie was unsuccessfully using the same tactic as today, twelve years ago & it was a far better team, but to be fair, he lost the crowd then for other reason's. Rather than pursue something that isn't going to work, why not try something that might, a number of good ideas have come out on here for instance.

[hibsbollah]

I'm going to post this in more than one thread as it's relevant in more than one thread. I have said a few times recently that some of the football we have played has been the best since the early days of Collins, and that I believe that Fenlon has just signed more good players and significantly improved us more in one summer transfer window than any manager since Mowbray, which got me thinking.

Mowbray took over when we were at a real low ebb after the Williamson era and the League Cup Final defeat to Livi - ok it wasn't exactly narrowly missing out on relegation and being hammered 5-1 in the Scottish Cup Final by Hearts, but it was a bad time and outwith 4-0 and 5-1, that 2-0 defeat to Livingston was the worst I had ever felt as a Hibbie.

Given that we had finished in 8th place the previous season and had lots of promising youngsters coming through, you can certainly argue that Mowbray came into a better situation than Fenlon did when he came in last year, and after the Cup Final - both had similar financial restraints that had come about because of the a financial situation caused by the collapse of SPL TV, and the Rangers situation, respectively.

Now after 18 games of this season we are sitting on 27 points from 8 wins, 3 draws and 7 losses. After the first 18 league games of Mowbray's tenure we had 30 points, coming from 9 wins, 3 draws and 6 losses. I think Fenlon has been as much of a breath of fresh air as Mowbray was in terms of the transformation of how enjoyable the match day experience is, what he has to say as a manager, and how I feel as a Hibs season ticket holder compared to a few months earlier.

Whilst the football isn't as good as it was under Mowbray (who had a better starting point), one of the biggest criticisms of Mowbray's team was that it was soft, easily bullied, and couldn't dig in at times - this season we have a good amount of football in us, but have also demonstrated a harder, more physical edge to us, and have won games when we have been under the cosh (another thing that many stated that TM's team was incapable of doing). Playing well and losing has shown to be a possibility with both teams thus far.

My Dad compared the game on Saturday to the 4-4 draw with Dundee at the start of the Mowbray season, when we were 4-1 up with less than half an hour to go, in that although the final result was disappointing, you could see enough to feel very confident that better results weren't far away (in many ways the Aberdeen home defeat was similar to the 1-0 home defeat we suffered against Killie on the opening day of the TM season IMO), and I think that is a very good and very valid comparison.

We have made giant strides this season, just like we had by 18 games into the Mowbray season, and I see much cause for optimism, just like I did back then - one big difference is that with no Rangers this season, the SPL is more exciting and more unpredictable than it's ever been. I truly cannot understand the negativity that comes from so many on here at the moment, especially when reacting to a simple statement of a simple fact from the board.

After the disater that was last season, many people stated that they would be happy to see a gradual improvement in us, as long as the signs of progress were there - many also wanted a more physical, street smart team that was more resilient and wouldn't buckle easily. Well Fenlon has brought much of that in a much quicker timescale than many of us thought possible, and the signs are very much there that he can continue to improve us.

Yes, recent results (and some performances) have been very disappointing, and there is a long way to go, but all the good that he has done hasn't just evaporated in the last 6 games (in which we have just enjoyed one of our most satisfying victories ever over Hearts and made them shortest reigning SC champions ever). I'm loving this season, and am optimistic that that will continue.

I'd agree with that, good post :agree:

[Ray_]

Deary me.

What, do you want lies?

[Pedantic_Hibee]

Fenlon's record in the transfer market would suggest our money would be spent wisely.

[lord bunberry]

We are crap, just not as crap as we were before, that's why we are struggling for crowds.

That's just nonsense. While i would say we have not been pretty to watch at times this season we were never going to go from the dross of last season to playing total football in such a short space of time but what we are doing is getting better and will hopefully strengthen in January and keep the momentum going

[Stevie Reid]

What, do you want lies?

I know what I have seen at Easter Road this season, and it is far from a crap team. It's really quite a good one actually, and I've been hugely entertained at the games, including the two defeats, and seen us play some lovely football and score some great goals. All of that is down to the fact that we have quite a few good players, nearly all of them brought here by Fenlon.

[HiBremian]

Why were crowds as low as that?

Maybe there were some meaningless games against boring opposition. According to the stats (http://www.fitbastats.com/hibs/club_records_league_attendance.php), the average home crowd in 1972/3 was 16,100. The biggest was 45,433, the lowest 7,344. But you can't just compare then and now. Football was a big social thing then, today it's just one more option among hundreds.

[blackpoolhibs]

See below for the TT's. What is the point of going on about something that is never going to happen? You and I both know that people don't show unless there's something they want to see. No amount of bating and badgering will change that.

Petrie was unsuccessfully using the same tactic as today, twelve years ago & it was a far better team, but to be fair, he lost the crowd then for other reason's. Rather than pursue something that isn't going to work, why not try something that might, a number of good ideas have come out on here for instance.

Our crowds have been going up every week, why is that? You have made your mind up we are crap, you have said so. Well give me this kind of crap every season, with the promise of better.

You are stuck in a time warp, football has changed beyond all recognition from the 70s. We cant even compete with English 3rd tier teams for players these days, if you want better than what we are achieving at the moment, then give the guys some encouragement?

If as i suspect you are quite happy moaning about just how crap you think we really are, then wire in, get back in your tardis and fill yer boots. :rolleyes:

[blackpoolhibs]

I know what I have seen at Easter Road this season, and it is far from a crap team. It's really quite a good one actually, and I've been hugely entertained at the games, including the two defeats, and seen us play some lovely football and score some great goals.

Yip i agree, some of the stuff has been very good and i have enjoyed going to the games again. :agree:

[truehibernian]

Fenlon's record in the transfer market would suggest our money would be spent wisely.

I'd agree with that - he's also scouting players first hand, seeing targets a few times. The experienced players he's brought in have also brought balance and calm to the squad. Maybury for example might not be the best full back in the SPL, but you get the impression he gets respect and also gives guidance to the younger ones - but he does so in a very quietly efficient manner.

[Ray_]

Why were crowds as low as that?

I don't remember the TT's crowds ever being that low, they certainly were leading up to them. At the end of the 71/2 season we took 50k fans to the cup final & we would attract large crowds to big games, in a time when football was a lot cheaper.

That's part of the reason I'm baffled about the hysteria over the size of our crowds, when compared to what the football on offer. Sure we had a lot of fans wanting to go to the final, that has never changed, it doesn't all of a sudden turn a large percentage of them in to die hards, especially after what happened & I think the crowds would have been worse it it wasn't for the season's cup final deal.

[Stevie Reid]

I'm going to post this in more than one thread as it's relevant in more than one thread. I have said a few times recently that some of the football we have played has been the best since the early days of Collins, and that I believe that Fenlon has just signed more good players and significantly improved us more in one summer transfer window than any manager since Mowbray, which got me thinking.

Mowbray took over when we were at a real low ebb after the Williamson era and the League Cup Final defeat to Livi - ok it wasn't exactly narrowly missing out on relegation and being hammered 5-1 in the Scottish Cup Final by Hearts, but it was a bad time and outwith 4-0 and 5-1, that 2-0 defeat to Livingston was the worst I had ever felt as a Hibbie.

Given that we had finished in 8th place the previous season and had lots of promising youngsters coming through, you can certainly argue that Mowbray came into a better situation than Fenlon did when he came in last year, and after the Cup Final - both had similar financial restraints that had come about because of the a financial situation caused by the collapse of SPL TV, and the Rangers situation, respectively.

Now after 18 games of this season we are sitting on 27 points from 8 wins, 3 draws and 7 losses. After the first 18 league games of Mowbray's tenure we had 30 points, coming from 9 wins, 3 draws and 6 losses. I think Fenlon has been as much of a breath of fresh air as Mowbray was in terms of the transformation of how enjoyable the match day experience is, what he has to say as a manager, and how I feel as a Hibs season ticket holder compared to a few months earlier.

Whilst the football isn't as good as it was under Mowbray (who had a better starting point), one of the biggest criticisms of Mowbray's team was that it was soft, easily bullied, and couldn't dig in at times - this season we have a good amount of football in us, but have also demonstrated a harder, more physical edge to us, and have won games when we have been under the cosh (another thing that many stated that TM's team was incapable of doing). Playing well and losing has shown to be a possibility with both teams thus far.

My Dad compared the game on Saturday to the 4-4 draw with Dundee at the start of the Mowbray season, when we were 4-1 up with less than half an hour to go, in that although the final result was disappointing, you could see enough to feel very confident that better results weren't far away (in many ways the Aberdeen home defeat was similar to the 1-0 home defeat we suffered against Killie on the opening day of the TM season IMO), and I think that is a very good and very valid comparison.

We have made giant strides this season, just like we had by 18 games into the Mowbray season, and I see much cause for optimism, just like I did back then - one big difference is that with no Rangers this season, the SPL is more exciting and more unpredictable than it's ever been. I truly cannot understand the negativity that comes from so many on here at the moment, especially when reacting to a simple statement of a simple fact from the board.

After the disater that was last season, many people stated that they would be happy to see a gradual improvement in us, as long as the signs of progress were there - many also wanted a more physical, street smart team that was more resilient and wouldn't buckle easily. Well Fenlon has brought much of that in a much quicker timescale than many of us thought possible, and the signs are very much there that he can continue to improve us.

Yes, recent results (and some performances) have been very disappointing, and there is a long way to go, but all the good that he has done hasn't just evaporated in the last 6 games (in which we have just enjoyed one of our most satisfying victories ever over Hearts and made them shortest reigning SC champions ever). I'm loving this season, and am optimistic that that will continue.

I also meant to add when talking about the SPL without Rangers is that when Mowbray took over, Hearts were just starting to shed their big earners and up sticks to Murrayfield - we were hugely unlucky that Romanov arrived when he did, as their financial state and our finishing 8 points ahead of them in TM's first year suggested that we were set for a period of dominance over them.

We are already 5 points ahead of them and have knocked them out of the Scottish and they must surely lose all their quality sooner rather than later - our financial state is a world away from theirs, and there looks like there may well be an opportunity for us to continue to move forward as they fall back majorly. If people don't believe in what is happening at Hibs at the moment then that is up to them, but there is really no need to have a go at the board for reminding lapsed supporters where their ticket money will go - especially given where the share money has gone over Tynie way.

The SPL is a different place this year and is all the better for it. Loving it so far.

[Ray_]

Our crowds have been going up every week, why is that? You have made your mind up we are crap, you have said so. Well give me this kind of crap every season, with the promise of better.

You are stuck in a time warp, football has changed beyond all recognition from the 70s. We cant even compete with English 3rd tier teams for players these days, if you want better than what we are achieving at the moment, then give the guys some encouragement?

If as i suspect you are quite happy moaning about just how crap you think we really are, then wire in, get back in your tardis and fill yer boots. :rolleyes:

I recognised that on another thread & the last few weeks, when it hasn't been that good, there was a drop, totally expected, so why all the bull on here about it.

Getting stuck in to me is not going to help the issue with attendances is it? There are quite a few thousand more who are not fighting over each other to get back in to watching the fare on offer, in fact, if everything was as wonderful as your suggesting, there wouldn't be any threads about supporters not attending.

[Big_Franck]

It asks us to come and watch football at easter road, would you prefer it if it asked us to stay away?

Its stating facts, we all know them. The more bums on seats the more the manager has to spend, i really dont see what the club have done wrong here? :confused:

I can't speak for others but what I object to is the club sending the same message out again, and again, and again in a short space of time. Especially when the attendance at the Motherwell game showed it has no impact on attendances. It's just tiresome now.

[Ray_]

I know what I have seen at Easter Road this season, and it is far from a crap team. It's really quite a good one actually, and I've been hugely entertained at the games, including the two defeats, and seen us play some lovely football and score some great goals. All of that is down to the fact that we have quite a few good players, nearly all of them brought here by Fenlon.

So there must be another reason for the missing thousands?

[The Modfather]

We are murder to watch, as are most of the league. £24 odd to watch what's on offer, not for me.

We certainly don't get the team that we pay for. Start playing some football with a homegrown team, or reduce prices to a level that represents value for money, £15, and I'll return again.

Grinding out results and doing better than previous seasons isn't necessarily what will get me back. Value for money and entertainment is.

[blackpoolhibs]

I can't speak for others but what I object to is the club sending the same message out again, and again, and again in a short space of time. Especially when the attendance at the Motherwell game showed it has no impact on attendances. It's just tiresome now.

Did everyone see all these messages, or was it just you? Do you feel tiresome when the club have constant messages about the new season tickets every year?

I have to say, and maybe its just me, but when the club have a statement to make or give out a news story, the LAST thing i get is tiresome over it? I read some, i dont read them all they are not that important to me.

[HiBremian]

So there must be another reason for the missing thousands?

Just read some of the other posts.

Why this desperate desire to believe that attendances are directly and only related to the team performances? History shows there are many other reasons.

The team under PF is evolving pretty well. It will add a few % to the attendances now and then. But no more.

[Stevie Reid]

Did everyone see all these messages, or was it just you? Do you feel tiresome when the club have constant messages about the new season tickets every year?

I have to say, and maybe its just me, but when the club have a statement to make or give out a news story, the LAST thing i get is tiresome over it? I read some, i dont read them all they are not that important to me.

I agree, totally perplexing.

[Ray_]

Just read some of the other posts.

Why this desperate desire to believe that attendances are directly and only related to the team performances? History shows there are many other reasons.

The team under PF is evolving pretty well. It will add a few % to the attendances now and then. But no more.

Right enough, lots of factors, however, what is the usually the main reason, both currently and historically, for both this club and the other ones as well?

[Twa Cairpets]

So there must be another reason for the missing thousands?

You dinnae half spout p!sh.

If I remember correctly from last season, you haven't been to a game in what was it 2 years? But you still get your mail order top so that justifies all the doom laden, "we are crap" stuff.

Crowds are down for any number of reasons, partly due to form, partly due to the economic climate, partly due to to population demographics , partly due to the its a different f****** society to what it was in the days of the tornadoes, and people have more leisure choice. It's also partly due to sideline snipers like you and half a dozen others on this thread and others going all Gerald Ratner on a product you seldom see, creating an atmosphere of self fulfilling negativity.

As someone else posted somewhere, .net after a defeat or two is like the self help group for self flagellators and those who get their jollies trolling or from wallowing in the projection of their own inadequacy as evidenced by the team on the pitch. It f****** does my nut.

The clubs post is true. If more people go, there will be more money. If people don't go then fine, but don't carp about quality we cant afford to put on the park.

[Stevie Reid]

So there must be another reason for the missing thousands?

What missing thousands?

Here is the comparison between corresponding fixtures in 2011-12 and 2012-13:

Hibs v Aberdeen

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,972; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 12,007

Hibs v Dundee Utd

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 9,360; this season (early kick off on a Sunday) 10,596

Hibs v St. Johnstone

Last season (Wed night) 8,323; this season (Saturday 3pm) 9,639

Hibs v Motherwell

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,518; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,817

I've been at all of them and the difference between last year and this is like night and day (the 0-0 with Aberdeen last year was possibly the worst game I have ever witnessed).

Football is better, results are better, and crowds are up - the board are simply stating that the more fans come, the more money Fenlon will have, and hopefully things may continue to improve - they'll certainly have more chance of improving (though we know there are no guarantees).

Why so many people have an issue with that is beyond me.

[yeezus.]

What missing thousands?

Here is the comparison between corresponding fixtures in 2011-12 and 2012-13:

Hibs v Aberdeen

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,972; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 12,007

Hibs v Dundee Utd

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 9,360; this season (early kick off on a Sunday) 10,596

Hibs v St. Johnstone

Last season (Wed night) 8,323; this season (Saturday 3pm) 9,639

Hibs v Motherwell

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,518; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,817

I've been at all of them and the difference between last year and this is like night and day (the 0-0 with Aberdeen last year was possibly the worst game I have ever witnessed).

Football is better, results are better, and crowds are up - the board are simply stating that the more fans come, the more money Fenlon will have, and hopefully things may continue to improve - they'll certainly have more chance of improving (though we know there are no guarantees).

Why so many people have an issue with that is beyond me.

I've been to Stranraer games on a Tuesday night that completely blew that game out of the water.

[Stevie Reid]

I've been to Stranraer games on a Tuesday night that completely blew that game out of the water.

:greengrin

[Cameron1875]

Another plea for tickets eh? Money invested from fans goes to team etc etc.

So many examples of renewing season ticket in the summer and fans get screwed over so why should we trust that the money is being spent to buy new players. The summer we lost Whittaker and Brown we ended up replacing them with Kevin McCann and Brian kerr. Is that investing in the team Rod?

Edit: The 250k we got for Sol Bamba never got re-invested either. Instead we ended up with Sean O'hanlon 6 months later :boo hoo:

[3pm]

Who would you have replaced Whittaker and Brown with? £6.4m for the pair by the way.

Kevin McCann was a good player, just ****ed by injuries.

[theonlywayisup]

Another plea for tickets eh? Money invested from fans goes to team etc etc.

So many examples of renewing season ticket in the summer and fans get screwed over so why should we trust that the money is being spent to buy new players. The summer we lost Whittaker and Brown we ended up replacing them with Kevin McCann and Brian kerr. Is that investing in the team Rod?

Edit: The 250k we got for Sol Bamba never got re-invested either. Instead we ended up with Sean O'hanlon 6 months later :boo hoo:

But surely that is the manager's fault, not the chairman's. We had a transfer budget that was well in excess of other SPL teams that would come to Easter Road and play us off the park. Even today, our wages spent on players is well above many SPL teams. Rod gives the manager more than what other managers have to play with, yet our past managers have spent it unwisely (e.g. O'Brien, O'Hanlon, Gathuessi, Kerr etc etc it is a long long list of under-achievers). Now, we seem to have a manager who appears to have made better use of the money he has been given to date (apart from Kuqi, Pa Kujabi).

You mention Kevin McCann and Brian Kerr, but equally for the same money or less, our manager could have got a Billy McKay or an Andrew Shinnie.

[Sir David Gray]

I think the club has to realise that what happened in May has put a lot of people off and it will take a long time for those bad memories to fade for a lot of those fans.

We didn't just lose a Scottish Cup final. We were hammered and humiliated in the biggest match in the club's history against our biggest rivals. For many, it was the straw that broke the camel's back. Some of them may never be back, others will be back but it's going to need a big turnaround in our fortunes before they're going to be persuaded to return.

It's a pity because in Pat Fenlon I believe that we finally have a man in charge that's actually worth supporting and who will deliver the goods if he's given the time and support to do this.

I hope we see big crowds at the next two home games but sadly, whilst we may get around 13-14,000 against Celtic, I don't see the game against Ross County attracting much more than the number that turned up against Motherwell last week.

[theonlywayisup]

What missing thousands?

Here is the comparison between corresponding fixtures in 2011-12 and 2012-13:

Hibs v Aberdeen

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,972; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 12,007

Hibs v Dundee Utd

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 9,360; this season (early kick off on a Sunday) 10,596

Hibs v St. Johnstone

Last season (Wed night) 8,323; this season (Saturday 3pm) 9,639

Hibs v Motherwell

Last season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,518; this season (3pm on a Saturday) 8,817

I've been at all of them and the difference between last year and this is like night and day (the 0-0 with Aberdeen last year was possibly the worst game I have ever witnessed).

Football is better, results are better, and crowds are up - the board are simply stating that the more fans come, the more money Fenlon will have, and hopefully things may continue to improve - they'll certainly have more chance of improving (though we know there are no guarantees).

Why so many people have an issue with that is beyond me.

Why let facts get in the way of a gripe?:coffee:

[blackpoolhibs]

But surely that is the manager's fault, not the chairman's. We had a transfer budget that was well in excess of other SPL teams that would come to Easter Road and play us off the park. Even today, our wages spent on players is well above many SPL teams. Rod gives the manager more than what other managers have to play with, yet our past managers have spent it unwisely (e.g. O'Brien, O'Hanlon, Gathuessi, Kerr etc etc it is a long long list of under-achievers). Now, we seem to have a manager who appears to have made better use of the money he has been given to date (apart from Kuqi, Pa Kujabi).

You mention Kevin McCann and Brian Kerr, but equally for the same money or less, our manager could have got a Billy McKay or an Andrew Shinnie.

:agree: I believe Petrie should have been punted for his appointments, not how he backed them. I'd imagine he was in the last chance saloon with a lot off the support, but it thankfully appears he's got the right man in Fenlon at last?

[theonlywayisup]

I think the club has to realise that what happened in May has put a lot of people off and it will take a long time for those bad memories to fade for a lot of those fans.

We didn't just lose a Scottish Cup final. We were hammered and humiliated in the biggest match in the club's history against our biggest rivals. For many, it was the straw that broke the camel's back. Some of them may never be back, others will be back but it's going to need a big turnaround in our fortunes before they're going to be persuaded to return.

It's a pity because in Pat Fenlon I believe that we finally have a man in charge that's actually worth supporting and who will deliver the goods if he's given the time and support to do this.

I hope we see big crowds at the next two home games but sadly, whilst we may get around 13-14,000 against Celtic, I don't see the game against Ross County attracting much more than the number that turned up against Motherwell last week.

I don't disagree with what you say.

The sad thing to me is that, like you, I think we have a manager to right the past wrongs, at a time when there is no The Rangers, a soon to be weakened Hertz, plus other teams that will need to cutback as they are showing reductions in turnover. Pity, but let's hope that Fenlon continues to move us forward. I do believe that next season will be better than this season, which is obviously much better than last season.

[Lucius Apuleius]

Feckn bedwetters out in force again. Chairman makes a statement implying he would like more people to go to games? Well blow me down with the proverbial feather. See, here is a message for all you guys that said you would go back if the hun were thrown out of the league, here is a message to all you guys that say it is far too expensive for the product on show (not aimed at family guys who cannot affird it, different ballgame), here is a message to all you guys who say you won't be back until we have a winning team, here is a message to all you guys who say you won't be back until we have real entertainment back, here is a message to all you guys still complaining about a game last May who would obviously have preferred we never reached a cup final in the first place, here is a message to all these people who go on and on and on about how feckn good it was under Mowbray, Turnbull, Miller, Yogi, Mixu or whofecknever (it wasn't always by the way), just **** off will you. You are never going to be supporters of Hibernian in anything except name. The majority of you are even posted missing from this board until there is a negative spin to put on things. Thank **** you don't appear in the pubs at ER before games. We would all be going along singing doom doom doom and gloom to some odious tune. And as for the German model? Look at the real stats as pointed out numerous times for the real prices of tickets, add in their TV money and then tell me we are playing on a level field. A bit of bloody positivity eh? We are playing decent football, well worth what we pay for it. Near the top of the league, been top and still we have the same complaints. Mental.

[3pm]

:agree: I believe Petrie should have been punted for his appointments, not how he backed them. I'd imagine he was in the last chance saloon with a lot off the support, but it thankfully appears he's got the right man in Fenlon at last?

When I see the decisions of Saturday I am still unsure. I do accept that the team is not finished either and progress has been made.

However, he is a clear improvement on what we have had and shows a mentality that has bern missing for too long.

[Winston Ingram]

Some of the responses on this thread are unbelievable.

'emotional blackmail'. How the **** stating a fact is emotional blackmail I have no idea.

Then there's the 'I'm not going back until the product improves!'. Sorry, but is that not an oxymoron? How do people expect us to get better quickly without investment? The product has improved spectacularly since last season and one thing is for certain if we lose McGivern & Griffiths it'll get worse. For people who say they aren't going back for this reason can I ask why you are even on here?

There's been the I'm not going back after what happened in May. Again, if that is the case why do you come on here? If you've binned the club why bother coming on here to talk about it?

Then there's the 'what missing thousands?' On Saturday there was 000's missing compared to our previous 2 league games.

All that's happened is that the club has come out and asked us to attend a game or 2 so that we can get a bigger budget to sign players. To me that's a fairly simple question which people have a choice to say yes or no to. To come on here and attack it is ridiculous

[Judas Iscariot]

Does anyone know the combined annual salary of our board?!

[Mikey]

why you are even on here?

If you've binned the club why bother coming on here to talk about it?


I wonder that myself. There are clearly a number of people on here who used to support the club but don't any more, yet they're on here sticking the boot in.

[Lucius Apuleius]

Does anyone know the combined annual salary of our board?!

Quite a lot of people I would imagine. It would have been in the accounts, no? Any particular reason?

[Winston Ingram]

Quite a lot of people I would imagine. It would have been in the accounts, no? Any particular reason?

I suspect that it'll lead to some pishy reason about them taking a pay cut.

[Judas Iscariot]

Quite a lot of people I would imagine. It would have been in the accounts, no? Any particular reason?

Just curious really...

Have we been consitent over the last few years with how many directors/board members we have that are paid?

[Lucius Apuleius]

Just curious really...

Have we been consitent over the last few years with how many directors/board members we have that are paid?

Reduced as far as I am aware.

[Captain Trips]

It takes a special kind of whinger to use that statement as an excuse to attack the manager. Well done. :thumbsup:

It also takes one to use the term "attack the manager" which is ridiculous. The chairmen of the club should always be asking for more folk to go I have no problem with that it is part of the job, if we have 15,000 turning up I want him asking for 16,000.

The point is folk will only turn up in bigger numbers if on that given day they feel they will get value the floaters are not going to go week in week out so in 6mths time they see their money getting used. It is clear a lot of folk are still unsure and if we are talking about extra fans going it is my opinion that PF based on the crowds now budget will have to find 2/3 players that are perhaps bargains od the Sauzee type, that IMO will see folk return if he can find them, I think it requires a great scout network lots of contacts, and a great deal of luck, I simply think it would be a difficult job for any manager and that goes for PF I just do not feel he has the contacts. Thats not an attack thats stating something I think is true based on who he has signed on loan or permanent from day 1.

So if you do not think we will win a given match are you attacking him then?

On a side I have no time for RP and think he should have walked right behind CC if not earlier and regardless of PF he should still go but I totally think in his role he has to ask fans to go as its a business so I think its harsh to moan at him for that.

[Keith_M]

OK, I've been doing some digging and I have it on good authority from the Fish Man (and he should know) that it's a Persian Blue.

[blackpoolhibs]

It also takes one to use the term "attack the manager" which is ridiculous. The chairmen of the club should always be asking for more folk to go I have no problem with that it is part of the job, if we have 15,000 turning up I want him asking for 16,000.

The point is folk will only turn up in bigger numbers if on that given day they feel they will get value the floaters are not going to go week in week out so in 6mths time they see their money getting used. It is clear a lot of folk are still unsure and if we are talking about extra fans going it is my opinion that PF based on the crowds now budget will have to find 2/3 players that are perhaps bargains od the Sauzee type, that IMO will see folk return if he can find them, I think it requires a great scout network lots of contacts, and a great deal of luck, I simply think it would be a difficult job for any manager and that goes for PF I just do not feel he has the contacts. Thats not an attack thats stating something I think is true based on who he has signed on loan or permanent from day 1.

So if you do not think we will win a given match are you attacking him then?

I agree with that, we should be badgering every last Hibs fan to come to easter road. Personally in my opinion a Sauzee type signing wont happen soon, we just cant afford those types of wages?

If the rumour of us signing Liam Craig is true, then i like this kind of signing. We tried to get Goodwin from the Saints, signing other SPL teams better players is something we have not done for a long time.

This is a slow process, but i believe its definitely going in the right direction under Fenlon, and while i dont think we will finish 2nd, we can make a European place. And that is where we should be every season, or at least fighting for a place.

A Hibs team thats in and around 4th place regularly, WILL attract more support. This is the first aim in my opinion, and we are on course.

[Captain Trips]

I agree with that, we should be badgering every last Hibs fan to come to easter road. Personally in my opinion a Sauzee type signing wont happen soon, we just cant afford those types of wages?

If the rumour of us signing Liam Craig is true, then i like this kind of signing. We tried to get Goodwin from the Saints, signing other SPL teams better players is something we have not done for a long time.

This is a slow process, but i believe its definitely going in the right direction under Fenlon, and while i dont think we will finish 2nd, we can make a European place. And that is where we should be every season, or at least fighting for a place.

A Hibs team thats in and around 4th place regularly, WILL attract more support. This is the first aim in my opinion, and we are on course.


I agree a Sauzee is unlikely but I see no other way that the support will increase dramatically unless we go on some sort of run of gubbing folk. Before any Sauzee's is LG and trying to keep him and the pity is keeping him would be fantastic but wouldnt really add any more appeal to folk thinking of going yet if we lost him folk might drift.

[Sergio sledge]

It also takes one to use the term "attack the manager" which is ridiculous. The chairmen of the club should always be asking for more folk to go I have no problem with that it is part of the job, if we have 15,000 turning up I want him asking for 16,000.

The point is folk will only turn up in bigger numbers if on that given day they feel they will get value the floaters are not going to go week in week out so in 6mths time they see their money getting used. It is clear a lot of folk are still unsure and if we are talking about extra fans going it is my opinion that PF based on the crowds now budget will have to find 2/3 players that are perhaps bargains od the Sauzee type, that IMO will see folk return if he can find them, I think it requires a great scout network lots of contacts, and a great deal of luck, I simply think it would be a difficult job for any manager and that goes for PF I just do not feel he has the contacts. Thats not an attack thats stating something I think is true based on who he has signed on loan or permanent from day 1.

So if you do not think we will win a given match are you attacking him then?

On a side I have no time for RP and think he should have walked right behind CC if not earlier and regardless of PF he should still go but I totally think in his role he has to ask fans to go as its a business so I think its harsh to moan at him for that.

I think that PF knows that his contacts aren't going to be as wide as someone who has played a long career over a number of clubs and I think he know's the importance of a wide network of scouting, which is why he is currently overhauling the scouting system at the club. This is something which urgently needed doing IMHO, we haven't been doing any scouting (in a proper sense) since John Park left. Successive managers have signed players based on their previous clubs, DVD's and week long trials after agents have phoned them up. I think that the signings on loan in the January transfer window last season were the last signings of the previous scouting regime and the quality of the players signed, whilst just good enough to help us avoid relegation, showed PF that the scouting needed to change.

Williams (Colchester)
Murdoch (Accrington)
Clancy (Motherwell)
McGivern (Man City)
Maybury (St Johnstone)
Deegan (Coventry)
Cairney (Partick)
Taiwo (Carlisle)
Kuqi (Oldham)

You can see from the players signed in the summer that there is an improvement in quality and character already and we can only hope this improves further. IMHO, Kuqi and Murdoch are the only signings which aren't any better than what we had, but to be fair to both players they haven't had much opportunity and certainly when the Kuqi signing was made there was a big play on the experience he would bring and pass onto the younger players, so perhaps he was brought in to have as much influence on the training pitch as the playing pitch. With any overhaul, it is going to take time to get up and running, especially since the old system would pretty much have had to be ripped up and started from scratch. We are undergoing a major overhaul in the club, from top to bottom, and PF is still managing to get some good results and improved performances out of a team which was pretty much built from scratch in one transfer window.

This is why it is important that PF is given time to complete the task, even if the results take a turn for the worse.

This is why it is important that the fans continue to back the club even through difficult periods and this is why the club have to continue to make these calls.

Whatever we think of RP, he has delivered the 3rd biggest (sustainable) budget in Scottish football and I think PF is up to the task of using that budget to transform the club for the better, for me the signs are there that he is and I hope you are proved wrong in your opinion of him. :greengrin

[Stevie Reid]

Then there's the 'what missing thousands?' On Saturday there was 000's missing compared to our previous 2 league games.


That's me that you're referring to there, and that post, along with every other one I've posted on here, was being positive about the improvement of the team under Fenlon, and every other one has defended the board statement.

Home crowds are up this season, I was pointing that out as a positive, that's why I asked "what missing thousands?" - yes, from the Aberdeen game to the Motherwell game there was a 3190 drop in attendance, but much of that is down to the size of the away support.

To put things in a bit of perspective, in Mowbray's first season we played Aberdeen at ER on 11 December and Dunfermline (who finished 4th the previous season and would have had a big support) the following week - the drop in attendance from one week to the next was from 13,503 to 9,859; a drop of 3644. Incidentally we won both games, the Dunfermline game being our 10th win from 19 games at the start of that season, and were playing superb football. Incidentally, a mate mentioned to me after Saturday that Talk Sport had stated at the weekend that that stage in December was statistically the worst of the season to have a home game.

My post about attendances was just to highlight the overreaction on here to everything recently - results, performances, attendances - none of those factors are as bad as people are making out, all are really quite good actually, especially when compared to last season, and in the context of the rest of the SPL. More money is vital for the club and an increase in attendances is the best way to generate more money for the manager, hence the reason I have defended the statement throughout this thread.

[Part/Time Supporter]

Does anyone know the combined annual salary of our board?!

Note 5 of the annual accounts (a link is in the vault forum).

£291,908 in the year to 31 July 2012, down from £408,068 in the year to 31 July 2011.

I guess it will go down again this year because Scott Lindsay left and hasn't been replaced by anyone new.

[Stevie Reid]

I think that PF knows that his contacts aren't going to be as wide as someone who has played a long career over a number of clubs and I think he know's the importance of a wide network of scouting, which is why he is currently overhauling the scouting system at the club. This is something which urgently needed doing IMHO, we haven't been doing any scouting (in a proper sense) since John Park left. Successive managers have signed players based on their previous clubs, DVD's and week long trials after agents have phoned them up. I think that the signings on loan in the January transfer window last season were the last signings of the previous scouting regime and the quality of the players signed, whilst just good enough to help us avoid relegation, showed PF that the scouting needed to change.

Williams (Colchester)
Murdoch (Accrington)
Clancy (Motherwell)
McGivern (Man City)
Maybury (St Johnstone)
Deegan (Coventry)
Cairney (Partick)
Taiwo (Carlisle)
Kuqi (Oldham)

You can see from the players signed in the summer that there is an improvement in quality and character already and we can only hope this improves further. IMHO, Kuqi and Murdoch are the only signings which aren't any better than what we had, but to be fair to both players they haven't had much opportunity and certainly when the Kuqi signing was made there was a big play on the experience he would bring and pass onto the younger players, so perhaps he was brought in to have as much influence on the training pitch as the playing pitch. With any overhaul, it is going to take time to get up and running, especially since the old system would pretty much have had to be ripped up and started from scratch. We are undergoing a major overhaul in the club, from top to bottom, and PF is still managing to get some good results and improved performances out of a team which was pretty much built from scratch in one transfer window.

This is why it is important that PF is given time to complete the task, even if the results take a turn for the worse.

This is why it is important that the fans continue to back the club even through difficult periods and this is why the club have to continue to make these calls.

Whatever we think of RP, he has delivered the 3rd biggest (sustainable) budget in Scottish football and I think PF is up to the task of using that budget to transform the club for the better, for me the signs are there that he is and I hope you are proved wrong in your opinion of him. :greengrin

Good post. I'd just like to point out though that the only reason that Murdoch was signed was to allow Callum Antell to continue to gain first team experience - at 19, he has now started 43 games in the lower leagues, which is excellent for a player of his age, especially a goalkeeper.

[Jones28]

So there must be another reason for the missing thousands?

The cost for a start? I went to the Hearts game with my dad. £50 on tickets, £30 on trains and probably another £30 on top of that. £110 on a day out is just not something I can justify every week. This is the case for most people.

I've been doing my bit this season, bought 3 tickets for games, took along 3 others, one of whom had never been to a Scottish match before. I'm sure this is the case with most Hibs fans. They've gone to a few games and spent cash in the shop.

I think the time has come where they're saying they want to see the product before buying it. It's been the reverse the last few seasons.

[blackpoolhibs]

Cost, choice, the TV, yet crowds are rising.

[Judas Iscariot]

Note 5 of the annual accounts (a link is in the vault forum).

£291,908 in the year to 31 July 2012, down from £408,068 in the year to 31 July 2011.

I guess it will go down again this year because Scott Lindsay left and hasn't been replaced by anyone new.

Cheers :aok:

[JimBHibees]

Dont really understand what all the angst is about the statement seems a decently upbeat message trying to encourage fans to two home games around the festive period commonly when people are looking for things to do.

Stating that increased crowds will help the manager in strengthening the squad seems to be pretty obvious. Bottom line is you cant force people to go to games however trying to encourage even a small percentage of undecided to attend more games can only be a positive for the club IMO. I would imagine most seeming to have a problem with it probably were never going to go anyway so no loss really.

[Captain Trips]

I think that PF knows that his contacts aren't going to be as wide as someone who has played a long career over a number of clubs and I think he know's the importance of a wide network of scouting, which is why he is currently overhauling the scouting system at the club. This is something which urgently needed doing IMHO, we haven't been doing any scouting (in a proper sense) since John Park left. Successive managers have signed players based on their previous clubs, DVD's and week long trials after agents have phoned them up. I think that the signings on loan in the January transfer window last season were the last signings of the previous scouting regime and the quality of the players signed, whilst just good enough to help us avoid relegation, showed PF that the scouting needed to change.

Williams (Colchester)
Murdoch (Accrington)
Clancy (Motherwell)
McGivern (Man City)
Maybury (St Johnstone)
Deegan (Coventry)
Cairney (Partick)
Taiwo (Carlisle)
Kuqi (Oldham)

You can see from the players signed in the summer that there is an improvement in quality and character already and we can only hope this improves further. IMHO, Kuqi and Murdoch are the only signings which aren't any better than what we had, but to be fair to both players they haven't had much opportunity and certainly when the Kuqi signing was made there was a big play on the experience he would bring and pass onto the younger players, so perhaps he was brought in to have as much influence on the training pitch as the playing pitch. With any overhaul, it is going to take time to get up and running, especially since the old system would pretty much have had to be ripped up and started from scratch. We are undergoing a major overhaul in the club, from top to bottom, and PF is still managing to get some good results and improved performances out of a team which was pretty much built from scratch in one transfer window.

This is why it is important that PF is given time to complete the task, even if the results take a turn for the worse.

This is why it is important that the fans continue to back the club even through difficult periods and this is why the club have to continue to make these calls.

Whatever we think of RP, he has delivered the 3rd biggest (sustainable) budget in Scottish football and I think PF is up to the task of using that budget to transform the club for the better, for me the signs are there that he is and I hope you are proved wrong in your opinion of him. :greengrin

That is a fair response though the bit in bold I cant agree with, forget the floating support if results do take a bad run that has us in lower half the more loyal ones will call it also, depending on the scale of a bad run if it was 10+ games would that not show he has had his time? He has been here a year things cannot get worse to get better he had that when he took over he cannot have it again. I agree with the sentiment but it will not work that way.

On the whole he has made improvements that will allow for a few defeats but he is eating into them and hopefully next match we will be better. Clubs have been relegated and got themselves sorted quicker than us, he should be well into us being greatly improved if he is right and I will say there has been improvement but as I say I cannot accept things not going well for a while as acceptable in any shape or form.

[JimBHibees]

I don't remember the TT's crowds ever being that low, they certainly were leading up to them. At the end of the 71/2 season we took 50k fans to the cup final & we would attract large crowds to big games, in a time when football was a lot cheaper.

That's part of the reason I'm baffled about the hysteria over the size of our crowds, when compared to what the football on offer. Sure we had a lot of fans wanting to go to the final, that has never changed, it doesn't all of a sudden turn a large percentage of them in to die hards, especially after what happened & I think the crowds would have been worse it it wasn't for the season's cup final deal.

There is IMO no way that Hibs would have had 50k out of 106k at that final.

[silverhibee]

Some of the responses on this thread are unbelievable.

'emotional blackmail'. How the **** stating a fact is emotional blackmail I have no idea.

Then there's the 'I'm not going back until the product improves!'. Sorry, but is that not an oxymoron? How do people expect us to get better quickly without investment? The product has improved spectacularly since last season and one thing is for certain if we lose McGivern & Griffiths it'll get worse. For people who say they aren't going back for this reason can I ask why you are even on here?

There's been the I'm not going back after what happened in May. Again, if that is the case why do you come on here? If you've binned the club why bother coming on here to talk about it?

Then there's the 'what missing thousands?' On Saturday there was 000's missing compared to our previous 2 league games.

All that's happened is that the club has come out and asked us to attend a game or 2 so that we can get a bigger budget to sign players. To me that's a fairly simple question which people have a choice to say yes or no to. To come on here and attack it is ridiculous



So in your eyes if you don't go to games then you shouldn't be on .net. :aok: :rolleyes:

[silverhibee]

I wonder that myself. There are clearly a number of people on here who used to support the club but don't any more, yet they're on here sticking the boot in.


I am sure they still support the team but have there reasons for not coming back Mikey, that day in May, relegation battle last season, and then there is the stand up and be counted/ early bird/ buy in April get free cup top ups/ etc etc, folk can only take so much, why do the fans always have to pay for the board/managers mistakes and then the chairman think its just okay to say sorry at the AGM and think that's it, the idiots have bought that old one again, suckers, and it seems like the board have ran out of ideas on how to get more revenue in to the club, there only strategy nowadays seems to be asking fans who have stayed away for what ever reason to come back and spend there hard earned money on a team that still seems a little fragile at times, still, i won't say they are trying to use blackmail to get fans back, but it seems there only tactic just now, its every couple of months now that we hear" we need more fans through the door to keep players at the club this window", that is obviously true, but if the board/owner really cared about the club like they tell us then maybe they could dig deep as well like they are asking the fans to do, did STF not say last year at the AGM that he may be willing to put more money in to the club if it needed it, maybe now is the time to do that and show the fans that have decided to not come back that they are committed along with the 8000 ST holders in putting there money in to the club to keep players at the club, it may or may not encourage folk who no longer come back but its a chance the board/owner need to take this window imo.

Where we are sitting in the league i would have thought the fans would be starting to come back and realise that we have come on leaps and bounds from last season just by looking at our league position, the manager has improved the team a lot since last season, we have had a wee dip in our league form lately, injuries/ Griffiths of the boil a bit, maybe the cause of that, but the injured players are back and the team/squad will be stronger again, and if Sparky starts finding the back of the net again then happy days for us that turn up and watch the team on matchdays.

We need contracts for Griffiths and Claros, and hopefully extend McGiverns loan deal until the end of the season. Where the money comes from i don't know but it has to come from somewhere, fans are fickle at times, but if Sparky leaves in January there will be only one person the fans will blame. And it won't be PF.

[Baldy Foghorn]

The Board put out a statement asking more fans to return, don't see the problem to be honest. Some have clearly stopped going, and start making noises about "guilt trips" and "emotional blackmail"......

The way I see it, IF you are a Hib's "Supporter", you back the Club whenever you can financially.....The same guys who moan at the factual statements put out by the Board, will be out in force lambasting the Club if we can't keep hold of certain players....They can't have it both ways....

Where are all the Cup Final boys and girls???

[Saorsa]

The Board put out a statement asking more fans to return, don't see the problem to be honest. Some have clearly stopped going, and start making noises about "guilt trips" and "emotional blackmail"......

The way I see it, IF you are a Hib's "Supporter", you back the Club whenever you can financially.....The same guys who moan at the factual statements put out by the Board, will be out in force lambasting the Club if we can't keep hold of certain players....They can't have it both ways....

Where are all the Cup Final boys and girls???Unfortunately that is still being used as an excuse by people no tae turn up.

[silverhibee]

The Board put out a statement asking more fans to return, don't see the problem to be honest. Some have clearly stopped going, and start making noises about "guilt trips" and "emotional blackmail"......

The way I see it, IF you are a Hib's "Supporter", you back the Club whenever you can financially.....The same guys who moan at the factual statements put out by the Board, will be out in force lambasting the Club if we can't keep hold of certain players....They can't have it both ways....

Where are all the Cup Final boys and girls???


Waiting for the next final to come along.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Waiting for the next final to come along.

We should be cute about this.....We should say that walk ups should keep their stubs from now on. If we reach Final again, then walk ups would get preference prior to public sale. The more stubs are retained by an idividual, allows them to purchase tickets earlier, so if someone keeps 10 different stubs they would get preference over someone with two stubs.....

[Iggy Pope]

So in your eyes if you don't go to games then you shouldn't be on .net. :aok: :rolleyes:

Alternatively, is not going to games a good reason to be on .net?

[basehibby]

It's a guilt trip IMHO because it implies that if folk don't buy tickets, it'll be their fault if Hibs cannot strengthen or keep players in January. The fact that this is the only marketing strategy coming out of ER these days also fails to recognise why a lot of people are staying away and address the issues.

There's a reason why, in the main, marketing folk don't just resort to "buy our stuff or nice things won't happen"-type stuff in adverts.

.....which is 100% correct - Hibs, like every other SPL club rely on fans turning up to pay the wages. If the attendances are 20% down then eventually that's what'll happen to the squad budget. So, I would say that if people who call themselves supporters don't actively support the club then there's no use them moaning when the playing squad gets cut because it WILL be their fault.

Anyway, you are obviously choosing to see the staement in a negative way - the way I tend to see it is that it's reminding us in a POSITIVE way that every penny that comes through the turnstyles will be spent on the team.

[number 27]

While the statement is obviously factually correct I do worry that constantly bashing out the same appeal is becoming counter-productive.

Sevconian elements in the press love this kind of stuff cos it allows them to wheel out the "SPL clubs cash crisis" guff again and I think it just creates an impression that we are saying we cant afford to improve our team and it might even get worse.

If I was a lapsed fan considering coming back I think this would be more likely to put me off rather than get me rushing down to the ticket office.

[Captain Trips]

.....which is 100% correct - Hibs, like every other SPL club rely on fans turning up to pay the wages. If the attendances are 20% down then eventually that's what'll happen to the squad budget. So, I would say that if people who call themselves supporters don't actively support the club then there's no use them moaning when the playing squad gets cut because it WILL be their fault.

Anyway, you are obviously choosing to see the staement in a negative way - the way I tend to see it is that it's reminding us in a POSITIVE way that every penny that comes through the turnstyles will be spent on the team.

The club are at fault also, yes it is fans fault if do not go but the club has failed to deliver a lot for what it has spent and alot of money has been wasted. The statement is not negative but its not that dynamic it hasnt really worked in past and I doubt it will now, I am not surprised that this is all the board have left in locker as IMO they are to blame for the crowds every bit as much as the folk turning their back.

[Danderhall Hibs]

It's a guilt trip IMHO because it implies that if folk don't buy tickets, it'll be their fault if Hibs cannot strengthen or keep players in January. The fact that this is the only marketing strategy coming out of ER these days also fails to recognise why a lot of people are staying away and address the issues.

There's a reason why, in the main, marketing folk don't just resort to "buy our stuff or nice things won't happen"-type stuff in adverts.

My mate was involved in the feedback sessions at the start of the season - surprisingly a lot of the feedback for non-renewal was down to performance and not the cost. Presumably because of this the board think the pricing's right and what they need to do is keep asking everyone to come back.

It was a surprise to me that so many think the current pricing is reasonable/affordable.

[BEEJ]

While the statement is obviously factually correct I do worry that constantly bashing out the same appeal is becoming counter-productive.

If I was a lapsed fan considering coming back I think this would be more likely to put me off rather than get me rushing down to the ticket office.
So what message from the Board would have lapsed fans rushing down to the ticket office - ignoring any false promises to spend money that we don't currently have during the January transfer window?

:confused:

[Gerard]

So what message from the Board would have lapsed fans rushing down to the ticket office - ignoring any false promises to spend money that we don't currently have during the January transfer window?

:confused:

Good post
:top marks

[blackpoolhibs]

So what message from the Board would have lapsed fans rushing down to the ticket office - ignoring any false promises to spend money that we don't currently have during the January transfer window?

:confused:

Free tickets, free pies and free bovril plus free entry to BTG and a free pint. Throw in a free programme and i'd imagine we might get a full house?

Although you'd then get folk complaining we were bribing the support, and watering down the season ticket making it worthless.

[Winston Ingram]

So in your eyes if you don't go to games then you shouldn't be on .net. :aok: :rolleyes:

Where did i say that?

[Mikey]

So.......... I take it we're all agreed that if you can afford it, and if you're free on those days, you should be going to these games?

That was easy :greengrin

[Ray_]

There is IMO no way that Hibs would have had 50k out of 106k at that final.

Well we sold 50,000 tickets, Celtic's support in normal league games wasn't as big as it has been in recent season's & a final against Hibs wouldn't have meant as much to their support as it would have if it had been Ranger's they were playing.

[Judas Iscariot]

So.......... I take it we're all agreed that if you can afford it, and if you're free on those days, you should be going to these games?

That was easy :greengrin

100% definately!!!

My take on it though is certain people want something from the board to "temp them/convince them" that parting with their cash is worthwhile...

I'd wager that if we'd agreed to sign up LG permanently by now we'd have sold a fair few more HST's than what we have up till now...

[Ray_]

I am sure they still support the team but have there reasons for not coming back Mikey, that day in May, relegation battle last season, and then there is the stand up and be counted/ early bird/ buy in April get free cup top ups/ etc etc, folk can only take so much, why do the fans always have to pay for the board/managers mistakes and then the chairman think its just okay to say sorry at the AGM and think that's it, the idiots have bought that old one again, suckers, and it seems like the board have ran out of ideas on how to get more revenue in to the club, there only strategy nowadays seems to be asking fans who have stayed away for what ever reason to come back and spend there hard earned money on a team that still seems a little fragile at times, still, i won't say they are trying to use blackmail to get fans back, but it seems there only tactic just now, its every couple of months now that we hear" we need more fans through the door to keep players at the club this window", that is obviously true, but if the board/owner really cared about the club like they tell us then maybe they could dig deep as well like they are asking the fans to do, did STF not say last year at the AGM that he may be willing to put more money in to the club if it needed it, maybe now is the time to do that and show the fans that have decided to not come back that they are committed along with the 8000 ST holders in putting there money in to the club to keep players at the club, it may or may not encourage folk who no longer come back but its a chance the board/owner need to take this window imo.

Where we are sitting in the league i would have thought the fans would be starting to come back and realise that we have come on leaps and bounds from last season just by looking at our league position, the manager has improved the team a lot since last season, we have had a wee dip in our league form lately, injuries/ Griffiths of the boil a bit, maybe the cause of that, but the injured players are back and the team/squad will be stronger again, and if Sparky starts finding the back of the net again then happy days for us that turn up and watch the team on matchdays.

We need contracts for Griffiths and Claros, and hopefully extend McGiverns loan deal until the end of the season. Where the money comes from i don't know but it has to come from somewhere, fans are fickle at times, but if Sparky leaves in January there will be only one person the fans will blame. And it won't be PF.

:top marks

[scoopyboy]

Well we sold 50,000 tickets, Celtic's support in normal league games wasn't as big as it has been in recent season's & a final against Hibs wouldn't have meant as much to their support as it would have if it had been Ranger's they were playing.

Was it really all ticket?

From memory I thought it was just the seats that were ticketed.

[Sudds_1]

Aye, no doubt some will use this statement to give the club another kicking. The only thing they could be found guilty of here is stating the bleeding obvious. It's OUR club, it really is up to us how much Pat Fenlon has to play with in the transfer window. I look forward to several posts using the oh so predictable emotional blackmail line.Don't see it as emotional or any other kind of blackmail..................................its just not a very imaginative pitch to the supporters!

[JimBHibees]

Well we sold 50,000 tickets, Celtic's support in normal league games wasn't as big as it has been in recent season's & a final against Hibs wouldn't have meant as much to their support as it would have if it had been Ranger's they were playing.

No tickets cash gates in 1972 and Celtic had a massive support. Probably a split of about 75k 25k may even have been more for Celtic. Can remember when Alan Gordon scoring how quiet the crowd was.

[JimBHibees]

Was it really all ticket?

From memory I thought it was just the seats that were ticketed.

Absolutely was cash at gates.