SPL clubs pursue plan for two divisions of 12 teams

[SteveHFC]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20581620

So that's the rangers back in the spl soon then :rolleyes:

[Liberal Hibby]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20581620

So that's the rangers back in the spl soon then :rolleyes:

How so - they're not in the top 24?

[jdships]

How so - they're not in the top 24?

:agree:
Don't fancy two leagues of twelve .
Top league of sixteen is a must surely ?

:rolleyes:

[Hibbyradge]

:agree:
Don't fancy two leagues of twelve .
Top league of sixteen is a must surely ?

:rolleyes:

Could we exist on just 15 home games?

[CropleyWasGod]

:agree:
Don't fancy two leagues of twelve .
Top league of sixteen is a must surely ?

:rolleyes:

Not any more.

It's 2 leagues of 12, then 3 of 8.

[Hibercelona]

Not any more.

It's 2 leagues of 12, then 3 of 8.

I'm sure the clubs who aren't in the 2 big leagues will be real chuffed about playing each other 5 or so times a season...

[Big-Si-1875]

Throbbers- Doncaster GTF

[CropleyWasGod]

I'm sure the clubs who aren't in the 2 big leagues will be real chuffed about playing each other 5 or so times a season...

It's a maximum of 4 times a season.

Home and away in the 12, then home and away in the 8. 36 games.

[Hibercelona]

There are 11 other teams in the first round.... therefore 22 games.

There are 7 other teams in the second round..... 14 games.

22 plus 14 = 36.

I know mate.

Sorry, I was reading it differently. :embarrass

[Mikey]

If Hibs are kicking around 2nd or 3rd spot regularly I don't think too many will complain about the format. And there's absolutely no reason to believe that Rangers will get right back in, even to SPL 2.

[Bostonhibby]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20581620

So that's the rangers back in the spl soon then :rolleyes:

Really looking forward to the consultation with the fans on this one, surely they won't forget us this time? especially those of the clubs who exist legally at the time and occupy 1st to 24th position in what we have always recognised as a league structure.

If not I can feel another protest coming on - popping out for some cake mix.

[CropleyWasGod]

Really looking forward to the consultation with the fans on this one, surely they won't forget us this time? especially those of the clubs who exist legally at the time and occupy 1st to 24th position in what we have always recognised as a league structure.

If not I can feel another protest coming on - popping out for some cake mix.

"The SPL would invite clubs to enter the league, determined by their league positions prior to the start of any re-organised season. "

In other words, there will be no immediate entry to Rangers. Seems fair.

[Bostonhibby]

"The SPL would invite clubs to enter the league, determined by their league positions prior to the start of any re-organised season. "

In other words, there will be no immediate entry to Rangers. Seems fair.

:agree: Watch this space though, lot of lobbying time between now and then.

My nominations for top influencing personalities between now and then are cheeky Charlie " the Hun " Green closely followed by whoever is trying to get the Council tax payer to fund Zombie Yam's automatic entry to this fortunately timed "opportunity". Mind you I could be wrong as I have been awake for 30 hours :greengrin

[dangermouse]

"The SPL would invite clubs to enter the league, determined by their league positions prior to the start of any re-organised season. "

In other words, there will be no immediate entry to Rangers. Seems fair.

I would assume that if The Rangers win SFL3 then by the time this is implemented they will be top of SFL2 thus gaining entry to SPL2. If they wait another season they would be top of SFL1 and get entry to SPL1 but its still a long road back. Here's hoping there are still a few twists to the tale before it ends. I also thought CG didn't want to play in the SPL so will they remain permanently in the third tier of Scottish football if the re construction goes ahead? :greengrin

[Eyrie]

Excellent news about a sensible proposal.

The 24-18 model should assist in merging the SPL and SFL and also opens the way for a pyramid structure below the 18-team lower league.

[jdships]

Could we exist on just 15 home games?

Could/Can we exist with the present boring playing each other four time a year ? :confused:
I am underwhelmed with that set up
Simply bores me to think with League Cup/Scottish Cup ( including possible replays) you could possibly play say Motherwell six time in a season - WOWEE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Surely they can include a League Cup ,or similar , including teams outside the sixteen to make up the games required

Game has completely lost its way in Scotland especially with Doncaster at the helm
We surely need a single legislative body to take the game forward

[VickMackie]

Erm, what's changed?

Top division of 12 teams still the same. I see no mention of playoffs, fairer distribution of money etc.

It's just the SFL rejigged.

[CropleyWasGod]

Erm, what's changed?

Top division of 12 teams still the same. I see no mention of playoffs, fairer distribution of money etc.

It's just the SFL rejigged.

There's a split after 22 games into 3 leagues of 8.

[jdships]

There's a split after 22 games into 3 leagues of 8.

That's going to make things really exciting !!
What is the obsession with playing each other four times a season ?
:confused:

[CropleyWasGod]

That's going to make things really exciting !!
What is the obsession with playing each other four times a season ?
:confused:

As I understand it, everybody starts from scratch in the second league.... which keeps everyone's interest alive after Christmas.

[lord bunberry]

As I understand it, everybody starts from scratch in the second league.... which keeps everyone's interest alive after Christmas.

is that definately going to be the case because if it is i quite like the idea but i have my doubts that it will happen like that

[CropleyWasGod]

is that definately going to be the case because if it is i quite like the idea but i have my doubts that it will happen like that

I think that is the proposal, but of course it needs SFL support as well.

I am not sure, either, if UEFA would need to approve it. In essence, there will be two separate competitions in the same season, and that might not be looked upon favourably.

I'm with you, though. I think it has the potential to keep the season going longer for everyone.

[VickMackie]

I think that is the proposal, but of course it needs SFL support as well.

I am not sure, either, if UEFA would need to approve it. In essence, there will be two separate competitions in the same season, and that might not be looked upon favourably.

I'm with you, though. I think it has the potential to keep the season going longer for everyone.

The top 6 gives plenty meaningful games. Adding a playoff to 10th and 11th would ensure everything was meaningful.

[lord bunberry]

I think that is the proposal, but of course it needs SFL support as well.

I am not sure, either, if UEFA would need to approve it. In essence, there will be two separate competitions in the same season, and that might not be looked upon favourably.

I'm with you, though. I think it has the potential to keep the season going longer for everyone.

i think they do something similar in holland and also in belgium but im not sure if its exactly the same. if they zero the points after 22 games it must make the chances of someone other than the of winning the league much higher

[kentao]

To make the league more competitive we have to play Rangers and celtic twice. at worst all teams will lose 12 points whereas now we all lose 24 points if they win. We must push for a bigger league setup of 18 - 20. and play each other twice. Prize money must be shared equally instead of league positions. The ones who qualify for Champs League and Europe gain a cash advantage from their league success.

The next couple of seasons will be the most interesting as anyone can beat anyone but once der hun get back into the SPL normal service will resume and we will all be atleast 20 points a drift. Things must be changed so im all for a larger league.

[CropleyWasGod]

To make the league more competitive we have to play Rangers and celtic twice. at worst all teams will lose 12 points whereas now we all lose 24 points if they win. We must push for a bigger league setup of 18 - 20. and play each other twice. Prize money must be shared equally instead of league positions. The ones who qualify for Champs League and Europe gain a cash advantage from their league success.

The next couple of seasons will be the most interesting as anyone can beat anyone but once der hun get back into the SPL normal service will resume and we will all be atleast 20 points a drift. Things must be changed so im all for a larger league.

In the proposed league, though, we won't be losing 24 points. We will be losing a maximum of 12 points in the first league, and then starting from scratch for the second league.

[Liberal Hibby]

The top 6 gives plenty meaningful games. Adding a playoff to 10th and 11th would ensure everything was meaningful.

Yes but you split after three games - meaning an uneven amount of home and away games. This proposal gives an even amount of games.

It's similar to the Swiss (or maybe Austrian) league - so I assume the top mini league carry forward their points and the lower mini leagues start afresh for promotion/relegation. If combined with a pyramid and single governing body it will have my support.

[woody47]

This is still a crock of cr@p.

Playing the same teams a minimum four times each season is one of the reasons fans are being driven away as they are just bored.

Will they ever listen, AND, act on what the people who actually pay their over inflated wages? I doubt it.

Lets get rid of the suits in Glasgow first. Then get rid of this two tier system and go back to having ONE body in charge of Scottish football. No more elitism.

Then have a top league of 16. Play home and away once only. Cup games on Saturdays. No midweek games where possible as this is a definite way of reducing crowds - unless they are European nights.

[kentao]

In the proposed league, though, we won't be losing 24 points. We will be losing a maximum of 12 points in the first league, and then starting from scratch for the second league.

Can you see Celtic or Rangers agreeing to this when after the first run of games are completed and they are running away from the pack.

If thats the option id rather we just let them have a league of 2 and let the rest of us fight it out.

:D

[CropleyWasGod]

Can you see Celtic or Rangers agreeing to this when after the first run of games are completed and they are running away from the pack.

If thats the option id rather we just let them have a league of 2 and let the rest of us fight it out.

:D

Celtic have already agreed, as members of the SPL.

Rangers will have a vote, as members of the SFL, along with everyone else.

[SMAXXA]

Is it just me or does this not add up? How can you wipe the points back to zero for the bottom teams at a certain point in the season? So in effect a team could play terrible or say use their youth team for say 22 games get cuffed and save on wages then go out in january and sign x amount of players to stay in the league? Not saying that would happen but doesn't feel right if the first part of the season is meaningless?

[CropleyWasGod]

Is it just me or does this not add up? How can you wipe the points back to zero for the bottom teams at a certain point in the season? So in effect a team could play terrible or say use their youth team for say 22 games get cuffed and save on wages then go out in january and sign x amount of players to stay in the league? Not saying that would happen but doesn't feel right if the first part of the season is meaningless?

If they got cuffed in the first 22 games, then they would be in the second group of 8.

[offshorehibby]

My understanding is that the top 8 would keep the same points. The middle 8 would start from scratch and the bottom 8 would keep the same points.

[SMAXXA]

My understanding is that the top 8 would keep the same points. The middle 8 would start from scratch and the bottom 8 would keep the same points.

That would make sense

[Steviie]

Can anyone tell me if this means the two lowest team I. The lowest division will get relegated allowing non league teams to come through ?

[ronaldo7]

My understanding is that the top 8 would keep the same points. The middle 8 would start from scratch and the bottom 8 would keep the same points.

:agree:

[lord bunberry]

My understanding is that the top 8 would keep the same points. The middle 8 would start from scratch and the bottom 8 would keep the same points.

if thats correct then its a non starter for me they have to zero the points in all three leagues to make it work

[Eyrie]

To make the league more competitive we have to play Rangers and celtic twice. at worst all teams will lose 12 points whereas now we all lose 24 points if they win. We must push for a bigger league setup of 18 - 20. and play each other twice. Prize money must be shared equally instead of league positions. The ones who qualify for Champs League and Europe gain a cash advantage from their league success.
Problem with a top league of 18 or 20 is that there aren't enough decent teams in Scottish football. There would be too many one-sided games and later in the season a lot of meaningless matches for teams that are out of European contention but safe from relegation.


This is still a crock of cr@p.

Playing the same teams a minimum four times each season is one of the reasons fans are being driven away as they are just bored.

Will they ever listen, AND, act on what the people who actually pay their over inflated wages? I doubt it.

Lets get rid of the suits in Glasgow first. Then get rid of this two tier system and go back to having ONE body in charge of Scottish football. No more elitism.

Then have a top league of 16. Play home and away once only. Cup games on Saturdays. No midweek games where possible as this is a definite way of reducing crowds - unless they are European nights.
16 teams means 15 home matches rather than 19 - a massive drop in income and one which would affect Hibs badly given Petrie's statement that we rely on gate money for most of our income. And what do the other 26 clubs do? This 24-18 proposal addresses everyone and will allow the SPL and SFL to merge.

Playing each other four times isn't ideal, but at least the matches will be between teams of a similar standard with something to play for.


if thats correct then its a non starter for me they have to zero the points in all three leagues to make it work
Both the top eight and the bottom eight will have played the same opponents in the first half of the season, so it can make sense to carry the points forward. I agree though that it would make the second half of the season more exciting if the points were zeroed - maybe a compromise whereby you carry forward one point for a win and nothing for a draw? Would encourage attacking football in the first part of the season.

[Spike Mandela]

What a pile of crap.

If you are in 9th after a mere 22 games even if on level points with teams above then you are excluded from challenging for Europe? If your 8th after 22 games you can't get relegated. Look how tight the league is this year, anyone could go on a run and make Europe this year or a slump towards relegation.

It's change for changes sake.

[ScottB]

Might make season tickets difficult for the clubs?

For example, one season we could be in the top group, lets say with the Old Firm and Hearts, so that's 6 Cat A home games in a season. If we end up in one of the other groups then we'd be down to just 3 in a season. So the ST is suddenly not as good value. I could see half seasons being much more popular?

Secondly of course getting stuck in the middle league in January, cup runs depending, would leave a pretty miserable few months to end a season!

[Gerard]

Might make season tickets difficult for the clubs?

For example, one season we could be in the top group, lets say with the Old Firm and Hearts, so that's 6 Cat A home games in a season. If we end up in one of the other groups then we'd be down to just 3 in a season. So the ST is suddenly not as good value. I could see half seasons being much more popular?

Secondly of course getting stuck in the middle league in January, cup runs depending, would leave a pretty miserable few months to end a season!

The majority of fans do not want this proposal. I can not see anything that will make the SPL a better football product and to make it more competitive. I want a 16 league division. The League Cup could be changed to allow teams to play in a Europa League type of competition to give the SPL clubs more games to compensate for the reduced games in the league.

[StevieC]

So how does a team win an SPL2 title???

[Diclonius]

So how does a team win an SPL2 title???

By winning the middle 8? :dunno:

[jgl07]

Problem with a top league of 18 or 20 is that there aren't enough decent teams in Scottish football. There would be too many one-sided games and later in the season a lot of meaningless matches for teams that are out of European contention but safe from relegation.

Scotland hasn't got enough decent teams for 12-team top division. There is not that much difference between the likes of St Mirren, Dundee and any niumber of First Division teams such as Morton, Falkirk, Hamilton etc. I would prefere an 18-team top League but it will not happen.


16 teams means 15 home matches rather than 19 - a massive drop in income and one which would affect Hibs badly given Petrie's statement that we rely on gate money for most of our income. And what do the other 26 clubs do? This 24-18 proposal addresses everyone and will allow the SPL and SFL to merge.


A 16-team top League would require extra fixtures from somewhere perhaps from League Cup group stages. That will not happen either.

[Lucius Apuleius]

I don't, and never have, got this argument against 18 teams because there will be meningless games. Does that not happen in every league in the world that has 18/20/22 teams?

[1two]

Ridiculously ***** setup to replace a ***** setup.

18 team spl
1 x home 1 x away
3 relegated (2 via a playoff v 2 from next.Division)
Play off at end of season

12 team 2nd tier
2 home 2 away
3 promotions (2via a playof with spl)
3 relegations (2via a playoff with next division)

12 team 3rd tier
3 promotions (2 via playoff with 2nd tier)


No splits
All leagues competitive
Prize money pro-rata based on position but equally divided based on points with bonus for winners.

It's ****ing simple stuff
It's what the successful European leagues play
Why complicate it to make it less interesting?

[kentao]

we all have a season full of meaningless games the only ones who dont are rangers and celtic. id prefer a league without the old firm but we know thats never going to happen.

[offshorehibby]

Off topic slightly but there was a we snippet in one of the papers today saying the voting structure also changed at yesterdays SPL meeting. It did not say what the voting structure had been changed to and i can't find info anywhere. The bit was in the daily hun so the news might not be spot on.
Anybody hear anything.

[MyJo]

So how does a team win an SPL2 title???

The league title will be awarded after the first round of 22 games, the second round of 14 games will essentially be a play-off league

[lord bunberry]

The league title will be awarded after the first round of 22 games, the second round of 14 games will essentially be a play-off league

So does that mean a team could be spl2 champions but not get promoted

[GreenCastle]

Did they not send out a survey a few days ago to get fans opinions?

This proposal seems too complicated and the basics of it are - you want a competitive league - as seen this season in the SPL fans are more interested.

Ideally you don't want to play each other x4 a season - could be pushing 6 if you play in the cup / replays etc.

The SFL / SPL should merge - that has to be the main priority as there is too much of a split already.

The money should be more evenly distributed as right now the gap is growing.

[StevieC]

The league title will be awarded after the first round of 22 games, the second round of 14 games will essentially be a play-off league

Isn't there a Uefa rule somewhere about a team needing to play a minimum number of games to win a title (30?)??