PDA

View Full Version : Fenlons signings



Treadstone
06-08-2012, 11:47 AM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough . Off the top of my head his signings :

McPake - If they had all been this standard things would be OK.
Claros - 'Rangers' dodged a bullet here . Terrible .
Kujabi - Such a liability especially when faced with even mediocre pace .
Doyle - Unlikely to score ten all season never mind 20.
Doherty - Patchy at best , some disastrous perfomances (M'well and that game)
Francomb - Couldn't displace Doherty says it all . Though terrific delivery from dead ball .
O'Donovan - Scored less than Doyle .
Soares - Non tackling midfielder .
Clancy - To early to judge . Poor debut .
Cairney - Outnumbered in debut . May be a few months before he settles from SFL fitba .

SMAXXA
06-08-2012, 11:59 AM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough . Off the top of my head his signings :

McPake - If they had all been this standard things would be OK.
Claros - 'Rangers' dodged a bullet here . Terrible .
Kujabi - Such a liability especially when faced with even mediocre pace .
Doyle - Unlikely to score ten all season never mind 20.
Doherty - Patchy at best , some disastrous perfomances (M'well and that game)
Francomb - Couldn't displace Doherty says it all . Though terrific delivery from dead ball .
O'Donovan - Scored less than Doyle .
Soares - Non tackling midfielder .
Clancy - To early to judge . Poor debut .
Cairney - Outnumbered in debut . May be a few months before he settles from SFL fitba .


Williams????

R'Albin
06-08-2012, 12:04 PM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough . Off the top of my head his signings :

McPake - If they had all been this standard things would be OK.
Claros - 'Rangers' dodged a bullet here . Terrible .
Kujabi - Such a liability especially when faced with even mediocre pace .
Doyle - Unlikely to score ten all season never mind 20.
Doherty - Patchy at best , some disastrous perfomances (M'well and that game)
Francomb - Couldn't displace Doherty says it all . Though terrific delivery from dead ball .
O'Donovan - Scored less than Doyle .
Soares - Non tackling midfielder .
Clancy - To early to judge . Poor debut .
Cairney - Outnumbered in debut . May be a few months before he settles from SFL fitba .

+ Williams and the re-signing of Leigh.

McPake - Fantastic signing.
Claros - Uninspiring to say the least.
Kujabi - Utter gash, took away any slim chance we had of winning May 19th
Doyle - Jury is still out. I'm not particularly excited by a striker who only managed 29 goals in 84 games in the Irish league. Still, time to improve and adapt to the Scottish game I guess, however I'm not holding my breath.
Doherty - Average player, massive twat.
Francombe - Was actually a good player I felt and 100% should've started LB in the final. Did his job well enough and can't remember him having a particularly bad game.
O'Donovan - Pish
Soares - Worst of the lot, such an awful attitude and I'm delighted that I will never have to see that waster play in a Hibs shirt again.
Clancy - Poor first half yesterday but improved as the game went on and got stuck in. Solid, reliable SPL player who I think will turn out to be a good signing.
Cairney - Decent from the very little I have seen, not seen enough to have a proper opinion though.
Griffiths - He extended his loan after an average start with us which turned out to be a very important decision IMO, deserves some credit for this I feel.
Williams - He could be up there with McPake, he has looked very good since signing and the save yesterday was exceptional.
Deegan - N/A

Mixed bag, a lot of the loans were just panic buys and I'm not sure it's fair to judge him on those, it's this season's do look half decent. The issue is what was mentioned on the Stevenson thread which is we have signed players, but in other positions gotten rid of crap and not replaced them and just used even worse players than the ones who left.

Stevie Reid
06-08-2012, 12:25 PM
Doyle - Jury is still out. I'm not particularly excited by a striker who only managed 29 goals in 84 games in the Irish league. Still, time to improve and adapt to the Scottish game I guess, however I'm not holding my breath.


Doyle only played as a centre forward for one season in Ireland, and scored 25 goals. I like the look of him when he's been played up front, I think he finds space well, has a good first touch and some nice tricks - don't fancy him out wide though - FWIW, I reckon he'd be best deployed playing off a big target man.

goosefat
06-08-2012, 12:29 PM
+ Williams and the re-signing of Leigh.

McPake - Fantastic signing.
Claros - Uninspiring to say the least.
Kujabi - Utter gash, took away any slim chance we had of winning May 19th
Doyle - Jury is still out. I'm not particularly excited by a striker who only managed 29 goals in 84 games in the Irish league. Still, time to improve and adapt to the Scottish game I guess, however I'm not holding my breath.
Doherty - Average player, massive twat.
Francombe - Was actually a good player I felt and 100% should've started LB in the final. Did his job well enough and can't remember him having a particularly bad game.
O'Donovan - Pish
Soares - Worst of the lot, such an awful attitude and I'm delighted that I will never have to see that waster play in a Hibs shirt again.
Clancy - Poor first half yesterday but improved as the game went on and got stuck in. Solid, reliable SPL player who I think will turn out to be a good signing.
Cairney - Decent from the very little I have seen, not seen enough to have a proper opinion though.
Griffiths - He extended his loan after an average start with us which turned out to be a very important decision IMO, deserves some credit for this I feel.
Williams - He could be up there with McPake, he has looked very good since signing and the save yesterday was exceptional.
Deegan - N/A

Mixed bag, a lot of the loans were just panic buys and I'm not sure it's fair to judge him on those, it's this season's do look half decent. The issue is what was mentioned on the Stevenson thread which is we have signed players, but in other positions gotten rid of crap and not replaced them and just used even worse players than the ones who left.

Like a wizards sleeve? I had no idea you knew him this well.

frazeHFC
06-08-2012, 12:33 PM
Doyle only played as a centre forward for one season in Ireland, and scored 25 goals. I like the look of him when he's been played up front, I think he finds space well, has a good first touch and some nice tricks - don't fancy him out wide though - FWIW, I reckon he'd be best deployed playing off a big target man.

:agree:

I like him, but i bet even in Ireland he had wingers and centre mids giving him the chance to score goals. We signed a midfielder who had 15 odd goals last season, and he was positioned like a holding midfielder yesterday.

The_Horde
06-08-2012, 12:34 PM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough . Off the top of my head his signings :

McPake - If they had all been this standard things would be OK.
Claros - 'Rangers' dodged a bullet here . Terrible .
Kujabi - Such a liability especially when faced with even mediocre pace .
Doyle - Unlikely to score ten all season never mind 20.
Doherty - Patchy at best , some disastrous perfomances (M'well and that game)
Francomb - Couldn't displace Doherty says it all . Though terrific delivery from dead ball .
O'Donovan - Scored less than Doyle .
Soares - Non tackling midfielder .
Clancy - To early to judge . Poor debut .
Cairney - Outnumbered in debut . May be a few months before he settles from SFL fitba .

All (with the exception of Doyle and Mcpake) brought in short term to keep us in the SPL. Kujabi will be away when his deal runs out at the end of this season and Claros will be away in January. ROD scored us crucial goals against Killie and in the SC quarter final and Soares also gave us some much needed height in midfield and scored us a couple of good goals against Killie. Francomb and Doherty were okay players, better than anything we had in there at the time.

Compare with signings this season.

Clancy - Comes with a good reputation from a club who finished above us last season
Cairney - Again comes with a good reputation and looked one of our only bright spots yesterday, when he gets fit.
Williams - Shown up well so far
Mcpake - Nuff said
Griffiths - Will get us goals
Deegan - Apparently the nasty midfield player we've been crying out for, Fenlon rates him.

A goalie, 2 defenders, 2 midfielders and a striker. Right down the spine of the team basically, It's going to take us a wee while for that to gel and come together and paddy is still looking for more.

R'Albin
06-08-2012, 12:43 PM
Doyle only played as a centre forward for one season in Ireland, and scored 25 goals. I like the look of him when he's been played up front, I think he finds space well, has a good first touch and some nice tricks - don't fancy him out wide though - FWIW, I reckon he'd be best deployed playing off a big target man.

I never knew that, that's actually a very good record. I agree he looks better up front than out wide, he makes some clever forward runs when he plays up top.

fatbloke
06-08-2012, 12:43 PM
;3316078']All (with the exception of Doyle and Mcpake) brought in short term to keep us in the SPL. Kujabi will be away when his deal runs out at the end of this season and Claros will be away in January. ROD scored us crucial goals against Killie and in the SC quarter final and Soares also gave us some much needed height in midfield and scored us a couple of good goals against Killie. Francomb and Doherty were okay players, better than anything we had in there at the time.

Compare with signings this season.

Clancy - Comes with a good reputation from a club who finished above us last season
Cairney - Again comes with a good reputation and looked one of our only bright spots yesterday, when he gets fit.
Williams - Shown up well so far
Mcpake - Nuff said
Griffiths - Will get us goals
Deegan - Apparently the nasty midfield player we've been crying out for, Fenlon rates him.

A goalie, 2 defenders, 2 midfielders and a striker. Right down the spine of the team basically, It's going to take us a wee while for that to gel and come together and paddy is still looking for more.

He also rated Claros etc:rolleyes:

The_Horde
06-08-2012, 12:49 PM
He also rated Claros etc:rolleyes:

He took a gamble with Claros, remember how excited this place was when he signed? We had the chance to get a player of his reputation and Fenlon snapped at it, probably the wrong move now but I think I'd have taken the same gamble tbh.

frazeHFC
06-08-2012, 12:52 PM
Fenlon rates every player, or he wouldn't be signing them.

R'Albin
06-08-2012, 12:54 PM
;3316115']He took a gamble with Claros, remember how excited this place was when he signed? We had the chance to get a player of his reputation and Fenlon snapped at it, probably the wrong move now but I think I'd have taken the same gamble tbh.

Exactly. He signed 10 guys or something, he hardly had time to sit and watch them all before going back to discuss with his fellow coaches over it, he had to find guys that he knew very little about and take a gamble on them. I would put Soares in that category as well.

SteveHFC
06-08-2012, 12:56 PM
Doyle - :grr:
Francomb - :grr:
Soares - :fuming:
McPake - :thumbsup:
Kujabi and Claros - :confused:
O'Donovan - :grr:
Doherty - :giruy:
Clancy - :confused:
Cairney - :agree:
Williams - :aok:

Treadstone
06-08-2012, 01:00 PM
Slenj.=]

You are definitely a glass half full person . I wish I had your confidence . As it stands bottom three awaits methinks.

Treadstone
06-08-2012, 01:03 PM
;3316115']He took a gamble with Claros, remember how excited this place was when he signed? We had the chance to get a player of his reputation and Fenlon snapped at it, probably the wrong move now but I think I'd have taken the same gamble tbh.

We were suckered by a shrewd agent , nothing to do with any ability that anyone had seen except the manager.

joebakerforever
06-08-2012, 01:21 PM
Perhaps Fenlon should follow the path that McGlynn at Tynecastle is taking, namely introducing promising youngsters now, rather bringing in more dross from outside.

According to reports, the two Jambos yougsters (one aged 17) fitted in seamlessly, and will probably only get better.

Compare that to how Feckless Fenlon has treated Calum Booth since he took over from Calderwood.

Andy74
06-08-2012, 01:28 PM
Perhaps Fenlon should follow the path that McGlynn at Tynecastle is taking, namely introducing promising youngsters now, rather bringing in more dross from outside.

According to reports, the two Jambos yougsters (one aged 17) fitted in seamlessly, and will probably only get better.

Compare that to how Feckless Fenlon has treated Calum Booth since he took over from Calderwood.

So Calum Booth deserves to be in the team on form does he?

The Hearts players have had one game, Booth looked good in several before he lost form and failed to progress - but no, you've already decided their players will be better.

Comparing McGlynn favourably to Fenlon after a game is quite pathetic and is quite obviously an agenda because there is no evidence that McGlyyn is doing anyhting successfully at this stage.

I'd also add that it's a fait bit easier to add a couple of kids to an established, experienced and confident team.

There's been some rubbish written the last 24 hours but this takes some beating for talking up others whilst putting down what you are supposed to be supporting.

bingo70
06-08-2012, 01:33 PM
Perhaps Fenlon should follow the path that McGlynn at Tynecastle is taking, namely introducing promising youngsters now, rather bringing in more dross from outside.

According to reports, the two Jambos yougsters (one aged 17) fitted in seamlessly, and will probably only get better.

Compare that to how Feckless Fenlon has treated Calum Booth since he took over from Calderwood.

I thought Handling and Caldwell looked way out there depth when they came on yesterday so i wouldn't be too quick to just chuck any youngster in.

If Callum Booth wants to get back in the first team he needs to prove to Fenlon in training why he deserves it and not just because he was good for a few games once and was a promising youngster. The fact he's not had a chance yet suggests to me he's not doing enough in training to convince Fenlon he's worthy of a first team spot.

joebakerforever
06-08-2012, 01:38 PM
So Calum Booth deserves to be in the team on form does he?

The Hearts players have had one game, Booth looked good in several before he lost form and failed to progress - but no, you've already decided their players will be better.

Comparing McGlynn favourably to Fenlon after a game is quite pathetic and is quite obviously an agenda because there is no evidence that McGlyyn is doing anyhting successfully at this stage.

I'd also add that it's a fait bit easier to add a couple of kids to an established, experienced and confident team.

There's been some rubbish written the last 24 hours but this takes some beating for talking up others whilst putting down what you are supposed to be supporting.

Typical tripe from a Petrie brown noser.

The_Horde
06-08-2012, 01:39 PM
Perhaps Fenlon should follow the path that McGlynn at Tynecastle is taking, namely introducing promising youngsters now, rather bringing in more dross from outside.

According to reports, the two Jambos yougsters (one aged 17) fitted in seamlessly, and will probably only get better.

Compare that to how Feckless Fenlon has treated Calum Booth since he took over from Calderwood.

Hearts are absolutely brimming with confidence, coming off the back of that game and a decent season. It's really easy to throw a youngster into a team with the attitude the hearts team have at the moment and with the buzz around the place.

Compare that with hibs: off the back of that final and an 11th placed finish, confidence at an all time low and in the middle of another transition with the supporters frustrated, restless and unhappy. Hardly a great environment to learn your trade, especially when the majority of the tradesmen they look up to are piss poor.

Stevie Reid
06-08-2012, 01:52 PM
I thought Handling and Caldwell looked way out there depth when they came on yesterday so i wouldn't be too quick to just chuck any youngster in.

If Callum Booth wants to get back in the first team he needs to prove to Fenlon in training why he deserves it and not just because he was good for a few games once and was a promising youngster. The fact he's not had a chance yet suggests to me he's not doing enough in training to convince Fenlon he's worthy of a first team spot.

:agree:

The idea that Fenlon isn't including Booth for ANY other reason than that he was playing very poorly in a struggling Hibs team prior to being dropped, is ridiculous.

Stevie Reid
06-08-2012, 01:53 PM
;3316221']Hearts are absolutely brimming with confidence, coming off the back of that game and a decent season. It's really easy to throw a youngster into a team with the attitude the hearts team have at the moment and with the buzz around the place.

Compare that with hibs: off the back of that final and an 11th placed finish, confidence at an all time low and in the middle of another transition with the supporters frustrated, restless and unhappy. Hardly a great environment to learn your trade, especially when the majority of the tradesmen they look up to are piss poor.

Agree with most of that, with Webster and Zaliukus as a CH pairing with Barr in front of them Hearts will always be solid - though FWIW, St. Johnstone still created numerous scoring chances at Tynie on Sat, even with ten men.

GreenOnions
06-08-2012, 01:57 PM
I think we need to separate the short term emergency signings made in January from those that PF has made since then. The signings of Williams, Clancy, McPake, Cairney and Griffiths (if we can get him on board on a permanent basis at some point) are the ones i am most interested in. Clearly it is early to judge these guys but all look as if they have the ability required IMHO.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 02:18 PM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough .

Miiiillllleeessss off the mark.

The problem with the squad is the players he couldn't get rid of but still make the team as he couldn't bring in enough players.

McPake,Williams, Doyle, Cairney, Clancy and Deegan are all the types of attitudes we need to change the culture in the dressing room away from the half hearted drunks we had before.

bingo70
06-08-2012, 02:22 PM
Miiiillllleeessss off the mark.

The problem with the squad is the players he couldn't get rid of but still make the team as he couldn't bring in enough players.

McPake,Williams, Doyle, Cairney, Clancy and Deegan are all the types of attitudes we need to change the culture in the dressing room away from the half hearted drunks we had before.

It's not all about attitude, our players just aren't as good as the opposition which is why i think it was a mistake to renew stevensons contract. Great attitude but just not as good as the midfielders he's coming up against. He had the chance to get him off the wage bill and bring in a better footballer but chose the easy option and renewed his contract.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 02:34 PM
It's not all about attitude, our players just aren't as good as the opposition which is why i think it was a mistake to renew stevensons contract. Great attitude but just not as good as the midfielders he's coming up against. He had the chance to get him off the wage bill and bring in a better footballer but chose the easy option and renewed his contract.

I'd have kept him too. He gives everything in every game and whilst technically limited, I'd rather have that than a good player who doesn't try and has a stinking attitude. Believe me, bad attitudes in a team are poisonous, I've had a similar task to what PF faces in a sales environment - awful team with bad attitudes, horrific results, unhelpful line manager. It's a long, long process and there's no quick fix.

bingo70
06-08-2012, 02:43 PM
I'd have kept him too. He gives everything in every game and whilst technically limited, I'd rather have that than a good player who doesn't try and has a stinking attitude. Believe me, bad attitudes in a team are poisonous, I've had a similar task to what PF faces in a sales environment - awful team with bad attitudes, horrific results, unhelpful line manager. It's a long, long process and there's no quick fix.

I agree, i've been in numerous sales teams like the one you described and i compared the two situations in a different thread earlier.

To continue with the analogy though if you're managing a sales team and you've got a guy with a great attitude, turns up for work on time every day, never sick, really popular and never moans but ultimately cannae sell anything so hinders the team from hitting it's targets which then aids to the bad atmosphere within the team, you spend years coaching him but he's still just not good enough would you continue with him or would you cut your losses and make the difficuilt decision to let him go? I know what i'd do and i know what i think fenlon should have done as well.

The reason we got pumped yesterday wasn't to do with attitude we were just weaker in every department.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 02:48 PM
I agree, i've been in numerous sales teams like the one you described and i compared the two situations in a different thread earlier.

To continue with the analogy though if you're managing a sales team and you've got a guy with a great attitude, turns up for work on time every day, never sick, really popular and never moans but ultimately cannae sell anything so hinders the team from hitting it's targets which then aids to the bad atmosphere within the team, you spend years coaching him but he's still just not good enough would you continue with him or would you cut your losses and make the difficuilt decision to let him go? I know what i'd do and i know what i think fenlon should have done as well.

The reason we got pumped yesterday wasn't to do with attitude we were just weaker in every department.

Rest of the team couldn't sell either, and their attitudes stunk too. Kept that person for continuity and to see if she could sell in a team with the right attitude and who could sell - think she stayed with the company for a while after I left.

In the football sense, I think that Fenlon is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. The quality of player that Mixu, Yogi and CC brought in were shocking and we need to raise the barrier way, way higher. That takes time. We were never going to do that in one, or even two transfer windows this season so Stevenson is a reasonable choice to keep on.

bingo70
06-08-2012, 03:00 PM
Rest of the team couldn't sell either, and their attitudes stunk too. Kept that person for continuity and to see if she could sell in a team with the right attitude and who could sell - think she stayed with the company for a while after I left.

In the football sense, I think that Fenlon is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. The quality of player that Mixu, Yogi and CC brought in were shocking and we need to raise the barrier way, way higher. That takes time. We were never going to do that in one, or even two transfer windows this season so Stevenson is a reasonable choice to keep on.

I think if Stevenson was being kept on it had to be as a squad player so i'm concerned he started yesterday, i really hope this new boy takes his place or if he doesn't then we've got someone else lined up but i think he might continue to start him unfortunately. IMO as long as he does we'll continue to get over run in midfield, regardless of how good his attitude is so i struggle to see any benefit of him being kept on.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 03:02 PM
I think if Stevenson was being kept on it had to be as a squad player so i'm concerned he started yesterday, i really hope this new boy takes his place or if he doesn't then we've got someone else lined up but i think he might continue to start him unfortunately. IMO as long as he does we'll continue to get over run in midfield, regardless of how good his attitude is so i struggle to see any benefit of him being kept on.

I see Claros and Deegan being a good combination - the physical presence of Deegan offering Claros a bit more time to spray out the killer passes he's good at.

The_Horde
06-08-2012, 03:09 PM
I see Claros and Deegan being a good combination - the physical presence of Deegan offering Claros a bit more time to spray out the killer passes he's good at.

What killer passes have you seen?

green glory
06-08-2012, 03:16 PM
At least we should see Deegan playing on Sunday, might be decent with Cairney.

Any news on Maybury and Kerr? We're supposed to be talking to Sheridan too, who I'd take in a heartbeat.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 03:18 PM
;3316333']What killer passes have you seen?

When he has time on the ball, his passing is very good. We've just had such a weak midfield he's never had time.

I mind he set up Griffiths for a goal and a near miss with two fantastic passes in a game not long after he joined the club. Final aside, he's always impressed me when he has had a bit of time.

LancsHibs
06-08-2012, 03:18 PM
I see Claros and Deegan being a good combination - the physical presence of Deegan offering Claros a bit more time to spray out the killer passes he's good at.

Could be good, unfortunately, according to Ian Murray PF rates Lewis Stevenson "very highly"! Expect Deegan to start with Stevenson on Sunday!

goosefat
06-08-2012, 03:18 PM
;3316333']What killer passes have you seen?

Killer? hmm.

He has been murder, I'll give him that.

:greengrin

heidtheba
06-08-2012, 03:50 PM
Perhaps Fenlon should follow the path that McGlynn at Tynecastle is taking, namely introducing promising youngsters now, rather bringing in more dross from outside.

According to reports, the two Jambos yougsters (one aged 17) fitted in seamlessly, and will probably only get better.

Compare that to how Feckless Fenlon has treated Calum Booth since he took over from Calderwood.


I haven't been to the games, only followed on TV and on here, but I'd hazard a guess that bringing in any youngsters right now is far more tricky than just giving a young guy his chance. In the past few years we've been so abysmal that there is such a grey cloud over us its just not funny. The Hearts youngsters are coming in to a team that can play well, that has played well and that is coming off the back of their best ever result. They have other players to help them and fans to give them a proper chance. These players can come in and play reasonably well, letting the others around them do the 'confidence' stuff OR if they make a mistake there is more of a chance that it will be less costly. Compare that with us right now. In the last few years some fans have (whether rightly or wrongly isn't the point I'm making here) rounded on Chris Hogg, a player who was a former POTY (if I remember rightly) and therefore had a pretty generously sized 'well give him a chance cos hes been good' room for error. Wotherspoon came in and did well at first but is now getting pelters. Our player of the year last year (OK not up against stiff competition) is also in the firing line. Booth and Hanlon have also had a lot of grief from some fans.

I'm not saying that any of this isn't deserved, God knows we've cocked up against 'lower' opponents over the last few years but there is absolutely no room for error from the new guys. Added to this that it seems as if we need them to come in and improve the side, not simply get their bearings and get a few games under their belt. Chucking the youngsters on in this environment would be a huge decision IMHO and one which could kill their potential so quickly. Can we afford that?

Hibs have been guff since the Rangers game back in December 09, each week it gets worse and each week we say it can't get any worse...only for yet another kick in the stones to come along. We're in a huge hole just now and even new players are, I believe, being saddled with the disappointment of the last few years. Yesterday was the first proper game for us for many of these players but the loss, and the manner, brought back all the baggage hibs fans have been saddled with recently. I can't remember the last time I watched a hibs game and didn't feel anything other than sheer terror at kick off. Bringing in young players is a huge risk and we have to use them carefully and at a time which will see them become useful additions to the squad, not haunted players who are terrified of the ball and who just won't try to pull anything decent off.

Huge credit to all those who bought season tickets and esp to those who traveled yesterday.

Tyler Durden
06-08-2012, 06:30 PM
:agree:

I like him, but i bet even in Ireland he had wingers and centre mids giving him the chance to score goals. We signed a midfielder who had 15 odd goals last season, and he was positioned like a holding midfielder yesterday.

I've seen a few people refer to this re Cairney and I have to disagree. He was positioned in centre midfield. He managed to get into the box just fine making late runs. He also showed he's not shy of a tackle which suggested he was positioned just fine.

One of the few positives yesterday. If Deegans a player then hopefully one more signing in there would give us a much more promising central 3. And we'd only need a centre back, target man.....

Treadstone
06-08-2012, 06:38 PM
Miiiillllleeessss off the mark.

The problem with the squad is the players he couldn't get rid of but still make the team as he couldn't bring in enough players.

McPake,Williams, Doyle, Cairney, Clancy and Deegan are all the types of attitudes we need to change the culture in the dressing room away from the half hearted drunks we had before.

I will file that with your Dundee Utd to win the SPL nonsense . Although I am sure you will come back with the disclaimer if they lose anyone in the transfer windows.

Northernhibee
06-08-2012, 07:29 PM
I will file that with your Dundee Utd to win the SPL nonsense . Although I am sure you will come back with the disclaimer if they lose anyone in the transfer windows.

Please do. Will look forward to you coming back to me in a few months time so I can say "I told you so". :agree:

Jim44
06-08-2012, 07:47 PM
;3316221']Hearts are absolutely brimming with confidence, coming off the back of that game and a decent season. It's really easy to throw a youngster into a team with the attitude the hearts team have at the moment and with the buzz around the place.

Compare that with hibs: off the back of that final and an 11th placed finish, confidence at an all time low and in the middle of another transition with the supporters frustrated, restless and unhappy. Hardly a great environment to learn your trade, especially when the majority of the tradesmen they look up to are piss poor.

This could oddly enough work in our favour in the Derby (probably won't tho'). The Jambos go into every match against us, ostensibly and with good reason, brimful of confidence. However, Derbies being what they are, this confidence up till now was always tempered by that unknow factor which always made the result uncertain. Their quality and and our total lack of it means that they know they are going to win at the weekend and their confidence will be absolute. A giant-killing result might just happen. I won't hold my breath tho'.

staunchhibby
06-08-2012, 07:56 PM
Certainlywill not be holding my breath either

shetlandhibee
06-08-2012, 10:46 PM
----------------------------------------Deeko----------------------Sparky--------------------------------

Kerr-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Riga

----------------------------------------Deegan---------------------Claros--------------------------------

--------Maybury-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Clancy

----------------------------------------Hanlon---------------------McPake (C)-------------------------------

---------------------------------------------------Williams-----------------------------------------------

Dunbar Hibee
06-08-2012, 11:39 PM
I thought Handling and Caldwell looked way out there depth when they came on yesterday so i wouldn't be too quick to just chuck any youngster in.

If Callum Booth wants to get back in the first team he needs to prove to Fenlon in training why he deserves it and not just because he was good for a few games once and was a promising youngster. The fact he's not had a chance yet suggests to me he's not doing enough in training to convince Fenlon he's worthy of a first team spot.

Or maybe PF's mind is already made up.

Emerald
06-08-2012, 11:48 PM
Or maybe PF's mind is already made up.
CB is THE only one in our squad that could go further. Pat Fenlon and his number 2 can get back to part time LOI pish and leave this proud football club alone!

Stevie Reid
07-08-2012, 10:01 AM
I was surprised to see that we had paid a fee for Deegan - whilst I have no issue with that, it does make the fact that he has only signed for a year a wee bit strange.

JimBHibees
07-08-2012, 01:04 PM
I was surprised to see that we had paid a fee for Deegan - whilst I have no issue with that, it does make the fact that he has only signed for a year a wee bit strange.

It sounded like the contract had some options with the possibility of extension though.

marinello59
07-08-2012, 01:54 PM
It sounded like the contract had some options with the possibility of extension though.

That was my understanding.

sesoim
08-08-2012, 02:20 AM
So Calum Booth deserves to be in the team on form does he?

The Hearts players have had one game, Booth looked good in several before he lost form and failed to progress - but no, you've already decided their players will be better.
.



Booth started to struggle at LB, probably as a result of being surrounded by a complete shambles of a team. But he should be given a run on the left wing - he surely couldn't be any worse than Doyle, Stevenson, Sproule, Wotherspoon or Galbraith, who have been hopeless when played there. Also, Booth got dropped by Fenlon last season straight after scoring a goal, which I thought was strange timing considering nobody else other than the strikers were scoring for us at the time.

If Fenlon is to prove he is any good, he needs to start getting the best out of players like Booth.

sesoim
08-08-2012, 02:30 AM
Could be good, unfortunately, according to Ian Murray PF rates Lewis Stevenson "very highly"! Expect Deegan to start with Stevenson on Sunday!



Yeah, I'm sure Stevenson could do a job for Fenlon..........in the Irish League

Hermit Crab
08-08-2012, 04:14 AM
CB is THE only one in our squad that could go further. Pat Fenlon and his number 2 can get back to part time LOI pish and leave this proud football club alone!

The bit about Fenlon and LoB is a wind right??

Cropley10
08-08-2012, 05:48 AM
CB is THE only one in our squad that could go further. Pat Fenlon and his number 2 can get back to part time LOI pish and leave this proud football club alone!

I wonder whether Pat Fenlon will manage a bigger Club than Hibernian. If it was solely on talking the talk then the possibilities are endless.

J-C
08-08-2012, 08:57 AM
----------------------------------------Deeko----------------------Sparky--------------------------------

Kerr-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Riga

----------------------------------------Deegan---------------------Claros--------------------------------

--------Maybury-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Clancy

----------------------------------------Hanlon---------------------McPake (C)-------------------------------

---------------------------------------------------Williams-----------------------------------------------



Did you have a nice sleep when you were dreaming this team up. :greengrin

JimBHibees
08-08-2012, 09:00 AM
Could be good, unfortunately, according to Ian Murray PF rates Lewis Stevenson "very highly"! Expect Deegan to start with Stevenson on Sunday!

So he should he was a clear player of the year last season, that doesnt say that he isnt replaceable though. Probably liked his attitude most of all.

JimBHibees
08-08-2012, 09:01 AM
The bit about Fenlon and LoB is a wind right??

A yam one I think it is like lifting an large stone in the garden and seeing all the bugs scuttling about. :greengrin

ahibby
08-08-2012, 09:03 AM
I wonder whether Pat Fenlon will manage a bigger Club than Hibernian. If it was solely on talking the talk then the possibilities are endless.

PF has to show that he can get the best out of the players he has brought in and the others inherited that he wants to keep. It's a bit concerning that he says they didn't do what he told them, (I hope he just didn't tell them to keep a clean sheet). That could be because they forgot, coudln't do it anyway, didn't want to do it, didn't understand what he wanted and the list of possibilities go on.

The players he brought in last season were apparently told their remit was to keep us up, which they did. No wonder they didn't win the Scottish Cup; that wasn't part of their remit:rolleyes:, or was it. I thought we were poorly organised on Sunday and in the Final, with out much of a clue what to do. There are also some players in the team who belong in at best a bottom six team, they must either improve or be shipped. PF has to ensure that his instructions are carryoutable, understood and followed.

NorthNorfolkHFC
08-08-2012, 09:04 AM
So he should he was a clear player of the year last season, that doesnt say that he isnt replaceable though. Probably liked his attitude most of all.

This worries me the most, that PF can't see how poor a player Lewis is. Great attitude isn't worth much when you can't shoot or score, pass (very well) or impose yourself in a game.

Its wee things like this that bothers me about PF, its not hard to spot that Lewis doesnt offer the team anything.

J-C
08-08-2012, 09:08 AM
PF has to show that he can get the best out of the players he has brought in and the others inherited that he wants to keep. It's a bit concerning that he says they didn't do what he told them, (I hope he just didn't tell them to keep a clean sheet). That could be because they forgot, coudln't do it anyway, didn't want to do it, didn't understand what he wanted and the list of possibilities go on.

The players he brought in last season were apparently told their remit was to keep us up, which they did. No wonder they didn't win the Scottish Cup; that wasn't part of their remit:rolleyes:, or was it. I thought we were poorly organised on Sunday and in the Final, with out much of a clue what to do. There are also some players in the team who belong in at best a bottom six team, they must either improve or be shipped. PF has to ensure that his instructions are carryoutable, understood and followed.

There have been a few rumours that PF's training style is very very basic and some players are not enjoying it, maybe this is the problem, all too basic and not enough about positioning, marking etc.

IFONLY
08-08-2012, 09:09 AM
this could oddly enough work in our favour in the derby (probably won't tho'). The jambos go into every match against us, ostensibly and with good reason, brimful of confidence. However, derbies being what they are, this confidence up till now was always tempered by that unknow factor which always made the result uncertain. Their quality and and our total lack of it means that they know they are going to win at the weekend and their confidence will be absolute. A giant-killing result might just happen. I won't hold my breath tho'.



when!!!!!!!!!

J-C
08-08-2012, 09:10 AM
This worries me the most, that PF can't see how poor a player Lewis is. Great attitude isn't worth much when you can't shoot or score, pass (very well) or impose yourself in a game.

Its wee things like this that bothers me about PF, its not hard to spot that Lewis doesnt offer the team anything.


He played 2 players in holding midfield out of position, Cairney an attacking mid and Lewis a left mid/left back.

ahibby
08-08-2012, 09:12 AM
This worries me the most, that PF can't see how poor a player Lewis is. Great attitude isn't worth much when you can't shoot or score, pass (very well) or impose yourself in a game.

Its wee things like this that bothers me about PF, its not hard to spot that Lewis doesnt offer the team anything.

He has heart and offers unflagging effort at least and when things go wrong he will continue to try, not feign injury to get off the park. He was awarded man of the match in the league cup final we won. Under John Collins the training/fitness regime improved Lewis, it was other players and not Lewis who complained about the toughness of it. We should avoid players who think that because they aren't on top SPL wages don't have to give their all in training and in games, we have had some in that category. As far as creativity goes well he might not offer a lot but he is not the only one.

Edited to say that Rob Jones was reportedly one who complained so my theory about avoiding players like that might not always hold up.

ahibby
08-08-2012, 09:14 AM
He played 2 players in holding midfield out of position, Cairney an attacking mid and Lewis a left mid/left back.

With hindsight we could say he shouldn't have played Stephens at CB as well. When I saw him in that position I thought PF must have seen something in pre season to lead him to think it's worth a pop. He was wrong about that too. I think he got the whole thing badly wrong.

J-C
08-08-2012, 09:20 AM
With hindsight we could say he shouldn't have played Stephens at CB as well. When I saw him in that position I thought PF must have seen something in pre season to lead him to think it's worth a pop. He was wrong about that too. I think he got the whole thing badly wrong.

Huge difference in training and games, once the game pressure comes into it, some players just haven't got it, they crumble.

Hermit Crab
08-08-2012, 09:26 AM
a yam one i think it is like lifting an large stone in the garden and seeing all the bugs scuttling about. :greengrin

l t y f ;)

JimBHibees
08-08-2012, 09:27 AM
This worries me the most, that PF can't see how poor a player Lewis is. Great attitude isn't worth much when you can't shoot or score, pass (very well) or impose yourself in a game.

Its wee things like this that bothers me about PF, its not hard to spot that Lewis doesnt offer the team anything.


Did you not go to any Hibs games last season?

shetlandhibee
08-08-2012, 09:32 AM
:agree: I also think Riordan and Griffiths would make a good combination up-front with riodans shots and freekicks and sparkys pace.

GGTTH !!

ahibby
08-08-2012, 09:40 AM
Huge difference in training and games, once the game pressure comes into it, some players just haven't got it, they crumble.

Fenlon should know that though and should know what his players bring to the table, no? He had him last season and wasn't playing him towards the end so you wonder with only a pre season between then and now what has changed Fenlon's mind if not the pre season.

J-C
08-08-2012, 12:29 PM
Fenlon should know that though and should know what his players bring to the table, no? He had him last season and wasn't playing him towards the end so you wonder with only a pre season between then and now what has changed Fenlon's mind if not the pre season.

Ye he might have had a great pre season but if he's the type of player who's head goes blank and his wee ersy tightens up and bottles it game time, then he's no use to us,

NorthNorfolkHFC
08-08-2012, 12:43 PM
Did you not go to any Hibs games last season?

Yeah, I went home and away. I remember it fondly as the one we almost got relegated.

Like i have said previously, he tries his heart out and that is admirable but offers absolutely nothing. He was unable to take control of any midfield and got bullied in almost every game. His scoring record was exemplary as well!!!!

NorthNorfolkHFC
08-08-2012, 12:44 PM
:agree: I also think Riordan and Griffiths would make a good combination up-front with riodans shots and freekicks and sparkys pace.

GGTTH !!

How are they going to get the ball in order to do all this? We can't buy a shot of the ball at the moment!!

LancsHibs
08-08-2012, 01:08 PM
Yeah, I went home and away. I remember it fondly as the one we almost got relegated.

Like i have said previously, he tries his heart out and that is admirable but offers absolutely nothing. He was unable to take control of any midfield and got bullied in almost every game. His scoring record was exemplary as well!!!!

Yes a tryer, good attitude but just not good enough as the past 6 seasons have proven!

lucky
08-08-2012, 01:20 PM
Felons signing have been decent but the real problem is the lack of them. I don't buy the argument he has poor contacts. No one said that last year when he brought all the loan signings in. I think it's probably harder to sign soon on loan than it is permanently

whiskyhibby
08-08-2012, 10:55 PM
So wanted Pat to be the appointment the fans deserved . Inherited a total shambles in between transfer windows to boot . However the actual standard of players signed by him is well below what is required , the worrying point being he thought they were good enough . Off the top of my head his signings :

McPake - If they had all been this standard things would be OK.
Claros - 'Rangers' dodged a bullet here . Terrible .
Kujabi - Such a liability especially when faced with even mediocre pace .
Doyle - Unlikely to score ten all season never mind 20.
Doherty - Patchy at best , some disastrous perfomances (M'well and that game)
Francomb - Couldn't displace Doherty says it all . Though terrific delivery from dead ball .
O'Donovan - Scored less than Doyle .
Soares - Non tackling midfielder .
Clancy - To early to judge . Poor debut .
Cairney - Outnumbered in debut . May be a few months before he settles from SFL fitba .

Half this lot have moved on......so should you